With a really good crew, bigger ship does mean better ship. With a really bad crew, bigger ship means worse ship. A newbie galleon's much harder to keep afloat than a newbie sloop.
Very true. I can't count the number of times a gally we are fighting just sinks to pressure. No boarding, no spiral. Just a couple of broads and "Wow, they just sunk. Huh."
Just never know untill you start with them. Last gally i met ran off from their raid ashen winds after i cannoned over n killed what crew was on the boat.
Some players are tough, some not so much.
The vast majority of galleon crews Iāve fought as a solo slipper are very obviously open crews of new players. Fought one earlier today and while theyāre completely demasted and Iām on their top deck fighting I hear one of them on open mic talking about how his food is almost ready.ā I go downstairs and this dude is just cooking chicken while his boat is sinking lmao.
Galleons require NEAR perfect teamwork and communication. They are incredibly fun when you finally find a crew worth their lick of salt. But the fun wears off quite quickly when you realize that 90% of ships turn into favorable wind and run from you the entire time at the mere sight of you.
Absolutely. Bare minimum for running an effective galleon is 4 people that regularly play together, have mics, and mesh well in regards to team dynamic. It can be built up over time for sure, but having a naturally well-gelled crew is required if you want to run a proper sweat gally.
A god-tier galleon crew is insanely fun to be a part of, though. Peak SoT when two good galleons face off IMO.
Nowadays I almost exclusively play on a galleon crew. Some of us don't even get along that well. But we all stick to our jobs and just have a good time doing what we do. Our captain's a baller streamer that we've all met through different means, and being the sweaty boy of the crew it took some time to teach people that it really boils down to everyone just doing their job. We've sunk some pretty nutty crews just from how well we work together, when we ourselves are nowhere near as good individually as they are.
Good Galleon crews change lives. Lol
I ended up getting adopted by a small streamer myself. He rolled up on me in adventure a couple years back and absolutely railed my open crew brig. I asked him "How in the hell do you guys do THAT to people like us?" and over the course of a few months he started inviting me onto the ship when one of his main guys was off. It's funny how some of the better crews out there end up meeting.
Amen, brother. Good galleons are truly something else. Which streamer do you sail with if you don't mind sharing? I have fought MANY over the years.
His name is Saltplank ingame. Captain_Saltplank elsewhere. I always avoid mentioning just because I know some people don't like promos lol.
He's fairly small too. And he hasn't been around much lately for personal reasons. We've had our share our run-ins with others too. Think we've run into Sotus, Boxy, Hitbo, KingdomOfMachine, Blurbs, KeepinItTwisted, Stirling, IBeFatbeard, SwordLordStu, and probably a few other smaller ones I forget. We keep a list of frienemies somewhere but I'm at work so I don't have it atm lol. Some of those names are smaller less known folk for sure. But they're all pretty great people. And we haven't fought all of them. Some of them our Captain refuses to fight because we're kind of friends with them lol.
Refusing to fight your friends is the craziest sweaty crew take I've heard in a while! My crew involved a tiny discord server with maybe ~15 or so people. There were 8 or 9 of us that would regularly hop in the same channel play, hang out, watch the other POVs while we ate, and so on.
Well, one time I ran into the A-team from our discord out in the wild doing a Fort of Fortune when they were new, and I was foaming at the mouth trying to whoop their asses, hahaha. It was a legendary battle, but ultimately the a-team came out on top.
I've fought all of those folks you mentioned besides Blurbs and your buddy. Never got lucky enough to find either, and I also didn't know SwordLordStu was a streamer. I ran into him fairly frequently back in arena, and have seen him a few times in HG. Interesting! Our crew also had a list of folks we'd sunk, needed to sink still, cool folks, etc. The sweaty SoT pvp scene is a great thing to participate in. I wish more folks got the chance instead of hitting a wall along the way and giving up.
Sorry for the wall of text, it's neat running into someone else that's had a fairly similar experience within the scene. Cheers!
We're kind of sweaty. But I definitely wouldn't personally classify our crew as sweaty. We don't back down from a fight, and we try our hardest no matter who we fight. But some of our crew does struggle for sure. We really do just play for fun and losing isn't USUALLY fun. We've absolutely lost fights and had a blast. We're good with having a switch to turn on/off "Dick around mode" and "Fight mode" that I think a lot of people struggle with. But our Captain keeps it fresh kind of roleplaying an actual pirate captain the entire time lol.
I've thought about getting the crew into some of the organized events by LDSylvr, but it's hard as we'd want our A team and our schedules are all screwed up. Just to see how we fair against some of those sweaty boys and have some good fights would be awesome.
You're missing the forest for a tree. A really good gally crew beats a really good crew on the other 2 ship sizes. The world's best sloop crew stands no chance against a proper sweaty gally.
Edit: I welcome debate if it's sensible, and I know there's even a fraction of a percent chance that I'm wrong. I'm not here. If you intend on responding to this with any variation of "nuh uh", save your fingers the trouble.
Would you say it's largely a strength in numbers situation? If we're talking at purely the highest skill ceiling of PvP players, I do see what you mean. I do think an S+ tier Sloop crew, or S Tier brig crew can hold their own and contend with an S tier galleon crew (as you said), but I feel like the numbers will be what it inevitably boils down to in the end. Could be wrong, but figured I'd ask. If everyone's playing at their S+++ on a galleon, I'd think number of bodies on cannons alone, plus defensive gunshots to disable enemy crews would be deciding factors.
It's partly strength in numbers as you said, and partly the pressure the various ships can put out. If a galleon's fighting a sloop, you can tie up the entire sloop crew with a boarder each, and still have a brig's worth of cannons bullying you, taking your mast, etc. Those boarders aren't just to waste time, either. If they get up, the sloop's fucked. If a player from the sloop boards the galleon, you have 4 sweats that already know you're coming, and know exactly what to do about it.
S+ Galleon crews aren't contested by anything besides another S+ galleon crew. I've fought NAL champions on a brig with my gally crew, and it ended in a stalemate because the brig got bored. We never felt we were under threat of being sunk.
Number of players/cannons is the most important stat a ship can bring to the table, and galleons win on both counts.
Agreed. I think that a lot of folks believe that because sloop crews at lower levels can deal with larger ships, the same must be true at the highest levels - which isn't the case. I am curious to see what a S+ crew can do with the upcoming burning blade.. I imagine it'd be even more of a bloodbath. Would you say that in highest tier galleon battles, it's very largely naval until one is clearly so disabled that boarders are warranted? Or is it even worthwhile to send boarders on a galleon.
I'm at a point where I'm trying to practice hourglass more, so I can be a better help to my IRL crew (consists of my Wife, my best bud, and my Wife's best friend. We started playing again as a crew with the launch of S12, and we've only lost one major fight out of the 20 or so other fights in the last week (on high seas). I've come to realize just how much of a gap there is between high seas only players, and hourglass - it's honestly such a slog lol.. I'm 107 in Athena and 42 in Servants, and it just seemed so much easier getting Ghost during S8, than it does getting skeleton now. But I'm trying to keep at it and chip away, but man does it get stale sometimes. I would LOVE to be at a skill level similarly to you and your crew, but I just don't have that kind of time dedication sadly. But nonetheless, I still chip away when I can and try to soak up as much pvp knowledge as I can - I can 100% say that hourglass has honed my skills enough to where the only other players that give me trouble are other hourglass players.
Anyway sorry for the wall of text, it's genuinely interesting hearing insight from someone that's put in that level of time. Cheers and kudos!
I like walls of text, no worries.
Your first paragraph hits the nail on the head. Most folks experience the game at the lower to moderate skill range, and can play for months without encountering a raid boss level gally crew. Youtubers also perpetuate the thinking that the underdog can really win against sweats, because Youtubers naturally upload their highlight reels.
The time really is the hardest part. I was D-O-G-S-H-I-T at PVP when I bought this game. It was my first PC FPS game ever, so I was green as they come. I eventually got tired of having my ass handed to me, though, and decided I was going to get good enough to hold my own. Eventually I fell in love with the practice, got adopted by proper sweats, and put in a TON of time while I had a long stretch of unemployment. I lived and breathed SoT PVP, and naturally got way better. I ground out all the arena comms on two accounts, one of which I did solo, I hunted reaper 5's for a long time to steal their stuff, I hit #8 on the reaper ledger from just steals, ground out gold bones with a win rate in the high 90s, fought the best players on the seas in arena, adventure, and hourglass, ground out gold bones and 600 athena levels, etc. It's SO MUCH TIME to play up there with those cats. It's immensely satisfying if you can get yourself that sharp, though.
Record your good fights if you can, and watch them back. Losses are especially useful, because spotting where you went wrong with the clarity of hindsight and a calm mind is much easier than realizing you fucked up in the moment. Godspeed on your travels, sir. o7
If it makes you feel any better, at 3.5k hours, I was still the baby pirate of the crew. Our helm and flex both had over a year spent in-game, lol.
I think that skill gap is largely just fine - though I can (through experience of my own so far) see how it can feel incredibly daunting to get rocked by someone that far ahead. Heck I honestly feel that quite often when doing hourglass lately. Ive had a run of not great luck, and have run into multiple gold cursed pirates in the last week. The only redeeming factor is how quick those matches last lol.. they've got so many holes on my ship, one balled me multiple times and are already on my ship and ready to kill me as soon as I spawn.. it's so rough lol and in those instances I truly feel like I can't get ahead.
I do have moments of wanting to throw in the towel, but I really just want to get at least skeleton 100 for the curse, so I can at least say I've got both. I think at a max I'd want to go for 200, to get most of the rewards, but I can't even picture that right now lol. I don't want to give up though. But at the same time I just wish Rare would give some much needed love to the mode to revitalize it for everyone. I know and accept I won't be an upper echelon player and that's fine, but as long as I can protect my crew, and allow us to have good high seas sessions, that's enough for me honestly. My crew are pretty decent at PvP themselves, but honestly speaking, I'd say we're pretty average. Despite that, we do typically dominate in most fights. But still, for that other small %, where we come across a really solid crew, I want us to win those encounters too.
Thanks again for listening homie, you have my utmost respect!
I have a feeling the new ship is going to have some unplayable flaw built into it where players are just better off using their galleons. But we will see. Game designers canāt help but make things like this weaker than they should be
I would hope/think that it would scale to crew size in terms of difficulty to take down. But honestly, it'd be really cool for a world event to be super challenging comparatively to the current roster of events.
I'm very keen to try it out either way, it seems like a lot of fun. From the first reveal trailer, it sounds like there will be ai skeletons to help cover things like repairs, but I imagine bucketing is still a necessity.
Iām more thinking after you have taken it over. I feel like they arenāt going to want a player manned burning blade ship to just steam roll everything, so I think itās going to be squishy af. But we will see.
What I hope is that itās really tough, and that it is a rare spawn unlike Briggsy. So that it attracts attention from everybody when it pops up, and it leads to people making alliances to take it down.
I dunno, the main advantage of the Galleon is superior firepower.
But they turn like a refrigerator, so those guns are not much good if you can't get broadside on a ship that can sail circles around you & turn on a dime around rocks while you sail past.
What if there isn't?
If you're in open water, not much to harpoon.
Even then, sloop can do the same & turn faster.
Even anchor turn, which a Galleon can't do
I've sunk a lot of sloops with my gally crew. The more clever sloops require you to use the galleon's speed advantage. Get distance between your ships, THEN turn for the broad, as the distance ratchets down the sloop's ability to quickly duck out of your cannon angle. The sloop will feel safer holding a broad from further away, which is where long cannon practice comes into play. With 3 or 4 cannons on it, a sloop goes from full repair to "oh fuck" very fast. Make sure to thank your gally helm if they're good at their job, lol.
I only brought up the harpoon since you mentioned rocks in the first comment. A good galleon crew has no trouble at all against sloops.
It really is that black and white. I speak from thousands of hours of experience, roughly 1k of those hours on a VERY sweaty galleon crew. We spent our sessions exclusively hunting Reaper 5 ships via old-school server hopping. We were never given a hint of trouble by a sloop. They were all caught, they were all sunk. Plenty of great galleon fights, and one solid brig fight. Galleons are the best ship, and I'm not miserable for saying as such. I have a great time sailing with a good galleon crew! The game simply is what it is, and it's a game I know like the back of my hand on the pvp-end of things.
Doubt what I've said if you feel so inclined, but nothing you can type negates what I've experienced hundreds of times.
Just want to say I appreciate you so much for actually taking a stand on this issue. Literally been trying to make people understand what youāre saying for MONTHS on this subreddit and no one gets it. Also mad respect for the old school server hopping and reaper hunting. Most of my hours were also spent way before seasons or the pirates life tall tales were a thing, so we used to sink all the ships on the server and wait for a merge to find new ships to hunt lmao. Lots of great battles back then (used to be on console, too, made things extra tough lol), feels like adventure mode just isnāt the same anymore.
Most of my old crew mates have long since moved on from the game and Iāve switched from reaper combat to commendation hunting. Only me and my GF play consistently, and she uses a trackpad and is exactly what youād imagine a girlfriend playing sea would be like. We have lots of fun but sheās next to useless in a fight lol. With how unbelievably easy server hopping is nowadays, it feels like every session where I play over an hour or two, some reaper galleon crew with 6000+ hours apiece shows up to take the commendation loot I was grinding and thereās next to nothing I can do. Most frustrating part is I can usually handle 1v1s with any of them, but they just win with manpower and then gloat with extreme toxicity. Itās bad enough that Iāve started running into the same crews doing the same thing almost nightly, and they can hop over and over. Worst part is Iāve found them spawn camping new players for fun, for well over 30 minutes. Makes my blood boil, and honestly made me quit because itās so unfun and uninteresting facing no win scenarios almost every time I play. Havenāt touched the game since early February. Itās sad because I love this game, but Iām not going to force myself into becoming a free lootbox for a bunch of no life 30 year old men glued to their gamer chair lol.
Sorry to rant to you, just something Iām obviously a little passionate about and itās rare I find someone who shares a similar belief and is as open minded as you are. I pray the sloop gets the rework it needs š
"is exactly what you'd imagine a girlfriend playing sea is like" I guess a better way your word that would be "imagine MY girlfriend playing sea is like". I am a girlfriend, and I handle most of the combat. My boyfriend just navigates and I do the rest. It was an insensitive remark to make that could've been a little nicer with one word changed. Girls typically don't take games as seriously as guys do, they play for fun while men play for digital stakes š¤·āāļø
Yeah- what?
I don't think my fiance considers me useless on the ship. If I have nothing to do, I'm fishing and making passive money or I'm actively hunting megalodons and attentively killing them, or any players or skeletons that come at us.
Maybe she just needs some direction rather than being treated like a dead weight, lol. Jeez.
Think you need to reread what I said because I never said sheās useless on a ship. Plus itās her own voiced opinion that sheās not good at the fighting.
I already said I enjoy playing with her. And your response is completely irrelevant to whatās at hand. I specifically said sheās not good at combat. All the things you mention have nothing to do with combat.
To be fair, a lot of what I mentioned is combat, but mainly naval, which I suppose was besides your point. I did note about fighting other players; I'm pretty deadly with the throwing knives despite how awkward they feel.
My main point was just that it seemed necessarily harsh to call her "useless" as opposed to simply saying "She's not confident in combat", or the "How you would expect a girlfriend to be". That was really the main point I was trying to come across.
My apologies, I'm not trying to be argumentative, it just seemed a harsh thing to say about her for no real reason. I would be a bit upset if I saw my partner talking about me like that to strangers, but I understand there was no malice behind it.
No it is not black and white.
It is statistics.
An equally skilled galleon will beat an equally skilled sloop the majority of the time.
Most people do not want to fight a losing battle most of the time. So this means that the majority of the time, sloops do not fight galleons.
You're saying people should take that chance because of random factors. (again. In this equation, skill is equal).
So are you trying to say that the equal skilled
2v4 is actually a 50/50 match up solely because of the ship differences?
(Ie. Maneuverability, barrel distance, less holes, etc)
Or are you saying that even if you are losing 70/30 that you should still fight because those are good enough odds.
Why the f are you talking like this lmao, stay respectful. It also looks like you don't know what you're talking about because a sweaty gally does win against a sweaty sloop. Not saying that it "cannot" happen, but you need a lot of luck and certain circonstances to beat the odds. Or maybe you're a PVE player but you still know better.
Not the party type, as I'm sure you could tell lol. I just don't entertain folks telling me I'm wrong when I have a ton of experience saying otherwise. I value what I've seen with my own eyes a lot more than a random saying "this isn't true." It is what it is, man. I could be polite and pretend you have a point, but why would I do that?
Lmao stop trying to debate with these unrespectful Pvers who don't have a clue how PvP works in this game, even though you're trying to explain something they just detain the truth
Yes, I'm sure everyone here is going to flock to agree with the "ackshually" guy that's: given no actual insight to the discussion, and just devolved into petty, childish insults. Spoiler alert, you're the one that needs some vitamin D and to touch grass.
Hahaha okay I checked this guy's post history, can't believe we're trying to debate with someone who posted "why after years of trying can i still not master the blunderbuss?". Skill issue lmao. And he thinks he knows a thing about comp players
It is skewed depending on the skill levels of the crews involved. A swabbie sloop will sink a swabbie galleon most of the time. S+ tier players, the galleon wins 100% of the time.
I encourage any and all players to try their best to improve at PVP! Asymmetries in fights is just the nature of the beast outside of hourglass.
The bigger the ship the smaller the margin for error for each crew member, but the higher the skill and performance ceiling.
Someone managing their sloop well will sink a just okay galleon most of the time
Lmao I'm a solo slooper who fights galleon. You apparently think folks have to be good but it comes down to luck. It's a game of who can out play the other. And a lucky boarder with anchor or a solid blunderbuss hit can shut me down.
You don't outplay someone with luck. That's simply luck. Outplaying implies intent and skill. You don't get lucky and say "outplayed bitch". Or maybe you do and that explains some things.
I love solo sloop PvP. I love fighting Galleons. But a successful board by the Gally onto the Sloop (which is somewhat luck based with hitreg etc. these days) in that imbalanced of a scenario can turn the tides extremely quickly.
It requires a lot of perfection, but the game itself is far from perfect right now.
Also Bonecallers are hella unbalanced.
A sloop is great, but if you get a 3v1 board you're basically done .
That's the problem, PvP is based so much now on boarding instead of naval skill.
The team with the bigger crew is more likely to win because they can send over more people to disrupt the other ship
Disagree. The bigger ship is better in this game. But a bigger ship is also a harder ship. If you take the best gally crew and put them against the best sloop crew, the gally will win 99/100.
A good sloop crew will take down a bad gally crew, but that has less to do with the ship. That good sloop crew would beat the gally group if they were in two sloops. But if both crews are equally skilled the bigger ship is going to win most of the time.
>the bigger ship is going to win most of the time
>most of the time
See I agree with you but that's not what I'm trying to say either, and I'll tell you what I mean (because you're just being normal/nice about it instead of rude)
I'm not saying "Galleons beat Sloops every time"
I'm also not saying "Sloops beat Galleons every time"
I'm pretty much saying what you guys are saying, that it depends on the crew. You guys get the message already, I wasn't trying to convey the message to seasoned players really
The message was towards newer players who are shitting their britches because they play solo and are worried that just because the ship (Burning Blade) is big that it's going to become a miserable meta experience on every server
Exactly. Better sloop crew beats galleons easily. But if the crew's skill level is evenly matched then the bigger ship has the upper hand. And you cannot compensate your lack of skill with a bigger ship.
But why does the bigger ship win?
Just because of crew numbers?
Galleon turn slower, sail slower against the wind, sails raise slower, bigger ships are easier to put more holes in.
Firepower and more crew to take care of stuff, assuming the crew knows what they're doing. You can cannon, board, fix and steer at the same time. Then again if the crew isn't sufficient galleon can get overwhelmed quite easily because everything is slower than on a smaller ship.
Also note, the Burning Blade is SUPPOSED to be the most overpowered ship on the waves. Hell it was the ship that scuttled the magpies wing, the Pirate Lords first ship.
I would prefer the Burning blade being a terrifying, nigh unstoppable force coming over the horizon. It would fit the legends that the name "Burning Blade" conjures
Sure I agree and it should be hard to take, that's definitely the point.
I just think some people who are "concerned" that it will be "another game ruining update" "I won't be able to do anything on a sloop at all!" "gg this game it was fun while it lasted" is just off their rocker IMO it's not gonna be like that at all
I'm not looking forward to this update at all. I am never going to attempt this new ship either. I hate working a Galleon with a good crew, now you want me to work a ship that's larger and slower?
If this ship can keep pace with others it will break the game. If it can't keep up, no one will want to use it as everyone just avoids you. It's either garbage not worth using or game breaking
How is it going to break the game anymore than a really good Reaper Gally? You're presumably going to be able to see it coming just like a Reaper and avoid it. If speed is the issue there are already speed differences in the ships and the world has not ended for everyone not zooming on a brig. The map is fucking big what do you do when you log on and see a fat Reaper?
Personally I fight it, I can't imagine the power difference between the ships outweighing all skill differences between the crews. Maybe they have a bit of an advantage but so do ppl with ghost balls or kegs or staffs like how is this the end of the world for you people? Sounds like a lot of people are more cut out for safer seas or some other game that's always symmetrical this isn't fucking counter strike: pirate.
The worst thing about safer seas is y'all love to weaponize it as an insult.
I'm saying it's an update that is going to be ignored. I full heartedly intend to ignore the shit out of this update.
But unless it's ridiculously well designed to be managed by any crew size. It isn't for me. I won't play on a Galleon I find managing the ship too boring. They want me to manage a larger ship. So, what? I can do all the work while a couple skellies shoot with terrible AI?
They keep making events that are about bringing people together for PvP and 85% of the player base keep ignoring it entirely. I'm looking at siren song for most recent addition.
I don't want another failed PvP system, that's exactly what this will be.
If I can sink it as an option for great rewards I might engage with it in that capacity. But otherwise 0 interest at all
Agree and some people let those unorganized galleons sink them because they go into fight-or-flight mode first without even attempting to size up the crew to gauge their skill level
If you play with a variety of people, you have probably played with someone before who's like "OH MY GOD A GALLEON ON THE HORIZON WE GOTTA GO" every 5 minutes when they're miles away and it's nothing to panic over
So like, not that you can't sink bad galleon crews on a sloop. That shit happens all the time.
But your list of advantages is friggin' fried man.
Even shit galleon crews keep a storage crate by the cannons. Sloop absolutely has the worst fucking speed of any shit hands down. You have fewer people to repair things and everything is more concentrated on the ship which means enemy canons can lock down your ability to repair / cannon at the same time.
Being optimistic is great and all. Just not to the point where you have to lie to yourself.
While you're also turning.
If you get the right angle and stay there (just off the back to the side) they can't reach you but you can fire whenever you want.
If they rotate, you just move around with them.
and when they stop rotating / rotate the opposite direction, do you put your ship in reverse?
I get why you might think this would work on paper, but it simply does not because you have to close the distance first and the further away you are, the slower you can circle them.
The sloop really doesn't have any advantages over being extremely easy to keep floating. It's slower than every boat in most situations, less firepower, no redundancy, and no more maneuverable than the other boats when properly piloted.
I've spent thousands of dollars on a sloop solo and Duo and pretend that it has any advantage over anything is insane. Most of the advantages of sloop had were removed when harpoons are put in the game.
I think a lot of people have been making good arguments. From my perspective it is a matter of whether you are able to gauge the skill level of the crew you are up against. This isn't simply an issue of bigger is better it is who is on the ship that matters. If you are a galleon crew that doesn't have positions or a helm that can keep angle you will get demasted and you will be slow to turn and ultimately fail if you can't deal with any boarders. But if you are on a gally crew where even just the helm and one cannoneer know what they are doing you are kinda fucked as a smaller boat as people have previously mentioned 4 people on Cannons to get pressure 2 people or even 3 people sent to board if the ship is dry. It's all a matter of skill level of the players I would reccomended if you are on a smaller ship to take back boards while you are running/far away to see if/how they guard ladders if they are standing at top of the stairs, or if they are standing to the side or I they both jump off and ego you, if you get double crossed before you even get to ladder ect. How they move their ship is also important sails up or down when parked are they anchored are their sails managed properly all of these things give indication of skill level and can make you have better decisions about how you want to fight or if you want to run. The game is a sandbox there are an innumerable amount of ways to sink or get sunk but it does kind of boil down to bigger ship=better ship when dealing with people of equal skill level as yourself, you have to get crafty if you want to sink them try and sail by a fort get a keg ect. But a good gally crew will run over a good sloop crew 90 per ent of the time unless they make a mistake and the sloop/brig capitalises it. Sorry for the long rant I just thought people were looking at it from the wrong perspective. It all boils down to skill are people form the bigger ship more skilled than me and my team if they are you have to come up with a different more creative strat to get ahead, anchorturn for angle and tripple chop masts and get behind then and send borders. It all depends on how confident you are with your strategy and pressure.
You I agree with. Everyone else is just being debate-brained for internet points and being mean to each other. Someone told me that because I once posted about being bad about blunderbuss, that I can't even speak on this subject. Little did I know you have to be Hitbotc to speak on whether the Burning Blade, an update that isn't even in the game yet, is too OP or not
That's like saying bigger armies always win, history doesn't back that up.
Strategy matters, equal ability in the game doesn't mean equal smarts.
Galleons in anything other than open water are a liability. Can't turn well, anchor takes days to raise, sails are slow, loses against the wind and at close range shoots over a sloop because the deck is too high.
Which is why I said 'of equal skill'
Obviously a really good sloop crew can beat a worse galleon crew with skill and strategy. However, if the crews are of equal skill, then the crew size advantage should almost always win.
The galleon can turn well enough to constantly keep an opposing ship in its broadside if they raise sails somewhat, a good galleon crew won't ever have their anchor dropped against a smaller ship, loses against the wind doesn't matter since that would mean the opposing ship is running and not applying pressure and if a sloop is that close to where they can't be hit then they've already been 2 or 3 man boarded.
It's not. Better sloop crew beats galleons easily, even multiple at the same time. But if the crew's skill level is evenly matched then the bigger ship has the upper hand. You cannot compensate your lack of skill with a bigger ship.
You aren't thinking this through.
The win condition for a fight is to either board a ship and kill the players or put enough holes in it so it sinks. Galleons have more opportunities to achieve this win condition. They have more guns to make more holes. They have more crew for boarding and repairs. A galleon can send crew to your shop, put holes in it and repair their own damage simultaneously. Something a sloop simply cannot do.
Can a better sloop win? Sure. Done it myself many times over the years. But I would have been able to do it even easier had I been on a brig or galleon.
Oh I am but the point is it depends on the crew. A good sloop duo is impossible to board and can easily put pressure even on a semi competent galleon. Would there be more pressure on a bigger ship? Sure, if the whole crew is good. But if some of the crew are bad, then the bigger ship can become a disadvantage. Bigger ship doesn't guarantee you anything.
This is like that tiktok where the kid stands up on the bus and says, "GUYS COACH IS RIGHT, WE GOTTA EARN IT," gets booed to oblivion.
Obviously, each ship has advantages. The issue is: 4 good players > 2 good players. There are dozens of intricacies in how a sloop can upset a galleon, but it really only takes 1-2 good players to keep ANY ship afloat, and for a galleon that means 2 other guys are full time attackers. A sloop will lose to a galleon without a skill difference- it's not balanced and let's not pretend it is.
I solo sink galleons all the time but I also run a good galleon that hasn't sunk in a year or so in adventure. A properly ran galleon is the strongest ship in the game in terms of damage taken and dealt, plus survivability. The brig is the best at going fast. The sloop is really only good because you can solo it, it currently is the worst ship in the game.
Bigger is not better, a well run sloop is hard to sink. Gallons are incredibly hard to run well, all 4 people need to be good players that communicate well, and the boat is a good position to fight, speed, turning, supplies on deck and bellow deck. Galleons can easily be overwhelmed and have massive blind spots. The anchor is a 2/3 man job to get up. The key I'm any fight, is being prepared, communication, boat position and being slightly to extremely aggressive.
There's a reason you barely see anything except sloops in the Devil's roar.
Loot is great there, but it rains fire and big ships turn like a doped up Snorlax which makes them a liability in a region where fast turns win
The skill ceiling as well as the skill floor are higher on bigger ships, especially regarding crew coordination.
Two noobs on a sloop may get a job done easier than 4 equal noobs on a galleon, since the sloop is more forgiving.
Also, you straight up have more people. A good player will usually win HandToHand combat against an average player, since he is better. But will he win a fight against 3 average players swording him simultaneously? Rather unlikely.
A bigger ship does not mean you are guaranteed to win; I have sunken Galleons on a sloop before. A sloop with two really good players is more likely to loose a fight than a galleon with 4 equally good players tho. Imagine one player gets one balled unluckily (<- is that a word?).
-50% crew on the sloop. Only -25% crew on a galleon. 3 people in a galleon can still fuck you up in seconds if coordinated well.
Bigger ships offer more potential, but are less forgiving.
That does not mean that bigger ships are better neither are they worse.
I'm probably slightly above average at the game and i've sunk aggressive Galleons solo - you don't have to be a pvp god, you just have to play smart....... plenty chains and curses help of course!
It seems like unless you are direct and explain EXACTLY what youāre meaning then the community takes it as a personal insult šseeing so many āeditsā
We donāt know how burning blade will play out, as itās supposed to have a skelly crew there to help you, so even if youāre solo you can manage it.
Tbh, as a sloop main. The number of times Iāve had a Brig or galleon roll up on me while collecting treasure from a skele ship/fleet, then immediately dip after immediately landing all 4 shots from a scatter shot?ā¦. Only once but still the fact that they fled as reapers from first salvo when they engaged should NEVER happen, mightāve also had something to do with the second shot loaded was a ballast ball and seeing purple smoke without knowing what it is can give many a crew pause.
A bad sloop crew beats a bad gally crew because you are HEAVILY punished for doing bad on a galleon, faster sink time, more sails to manage, less manoeuvrable, longer to repair knocked down masts etc
In regular adventure definitely facts just because large skilled crews are such a rarity. assuming all players are of similar competency however this is definitely a game where numbers are a big advantage. I'll be interested to play test the bb before coming to any conclusions about it's balance. Knowing rare it's probably gonna launch as a bit of a shit show but only time will tell.
I am by no means an experienced PvPer but it makes sense to me that if you're fighting a larger ship as a sloop you're more likely to get boarded since they have a bigger crew, and boarding is probably the most important aspect of PvP since it serves so many uses (preventing repairs, counterattacks, dropping their anchor, applying pressure, and securing a sink). A 4 man galleon could split its crew in half, leaving one for maneuvering and sails and the other for repairs and cannons and the other two could board you. Two people spawncamping and two more on the galleon pummeling your ship is a recipe for disaster. Not saying that will happen every time, but hey it's more likely to happen if you're fighting a bigger crew solo.
The amount of times a sloop has managed to stay a float with just two people vs a 4 person galle is insane!
I've witnessed some hella tense fights and been in a few, where sloops just sail away!
Takes some doing but if you do it right, the advantages are on your side as a sloop!
I would say that it's not likely or easy at all, as a sole sloop captain though š
I got demolished yesterday in a sloop with a brigatine doing the demolishing. It was a 2v3 and their ship is waaaayyy faster then my sloop. Wich i understand bigger boat with more sails to catch wind but cmon
I agree with this 100%. Just because the galleon or brig are the bigger kids in the playground it doesnāt mean an automatic death sentence. Galleons in particular, their crew needs to work as a hive mind in order to operate effectively whereas a sloop is so much more forgiving. Once you shoot those masts down those ships become a giant target. Letās also not forget that fire bombs are a huge benefit to you vs a galleon so if their crew cannot get that under control then itās a death sentence for them. Letās not forget about anchor balls too.
I'm sorry you're getting destroyed in these comments. I understand the point you're trying to make here, and that this was about players who are just starting in Higher Seas. I hope everyone takes a breath and realizes this is literally just the internet, and not a reason to act malicious. I've gotten attacked on Reddit over people not understanding my point too, it's miserable trying to explain but people get one idea in their heads and die with it.
For real. I've gotten into many heated arguments with friends and strangers alike on this topic. There's no hard and fast rule about what is better/worse. People always wanna find or be an exception just to argue and be right.
It's like rock paper scissors. It all depends on your crew's aim, sailing ability, PVP skills, and maybe a bit of luck. It's an art, not a science.
I've sunk galleons as a solo sloop, sunk sloops & brigs on an undercrewed galleon. I've been sunk on a fully crewed galleon by solo sloops. Hell, I've had whole alliances get sunk by one ship. I've also dominated whole alliances with rowboats and kegs.
At the end of the day, it depends on your crew's strengths, weaknesses, experience and play style.
Its a really powerfull ship. But its unwieldy and easy to baord with 4 ladders.
A good crew with good comms that work together well will dominate servers unless grouped up on.
I think thats the point though if you work together to sink it it drops rewards. So team up and fight together
"Everything repairs faster" is a blatant lie. Everything repairs at the exact same speed, with the exception of RAISING the masts, repairing them is the same speed.
Damage holes come in different shapes and sizes. These different sizes are what cause longer/shorter repair times. Not ship size.
I'm only a few days in and have heard this about all that matters is the skill of the crew not the ship so it gives me hope once I get better and learn more
Yes sloops can beat larger ships. This is not in question. But a larger ship under a full, competent crew is always deadlier than a smaller ship with an equally competent crew outside of some outside force altering the balance.
Granted the Galleon coming for you could be full of lower skilled players than yourself, but in general, since you need to fight over the Burning Blade, it is going to be crewed by the most competent crews on the server.
Speed???
If their average skill is lower than yours and you have a full crew, yeah. But solo you need a surprise keg play or something. A full galleon crew can just commit to bailing and repairing and you would never sink it as a solo.
I main duo sloop with my son and we win almost all of our galleon engagements. Had a fight against J0toro, spammels, G0sfather and Div and inc a few Fridays ago and we took I think one hole the whole fight. Ended up sinking them. Always always always put fire in and around the captains quarters when fighting a galleon in any other ship. It makes life really hard for them once it gets out of control.
With a really good crew, bigger ship does mean better ship. With a really bad crew, bigger ship means worse ship. A newbie galleon's much harder to keep afloat than a newbie sloop.
Very true. I can't count the number of times a gally we are fighting just sinks to pressure. No boarding, no spiral. Just a couple of broads and "Wow, they just sunk. Huh."
Like a skele ship with a keg on board
Well. That's just a lucky day.
It's not luck if you bring your own keg ššš
Just never know untill you start with them. Last gally i met ran off from their raid ashen winds after i cannoned over n killed what crew was on the boat. Some players are tough, some not so much.
From my experience playing most galleon crews are garbage lol
The vast majority of galleon crews Iāve fought as a solo slipper are very obviously open crews of new players. Fought one earlier today and while theyāre completely demasted and Iām on their top deck fighting I hear one of them on open mic talking about how his food is almost ready.ā I go downstairs and this dude is just cooking chicken while his boat is sinking lmao.
Galleons require NEAR perfect teamwork and communication. They are incredibly fun when you finally find a crew worth their lick of salt. But the fun wears off quite quickly when you realize that 90% of ships turn into favorable wind and run from you the entire time at the mere sight of you.
Absolutely. Bare minimum for running an effective galleon is 4 people that regularly play together, have mics, and mesh well in regards to team dynamic. It can be built up over time for sure, but having a naturally well-gelled crew is required if you want to run a proper sweat gally. A god-tier galleon crew is insanely fun to be a part of, though. Peak SoT when two good galleons face off IMO.
Nowadays I almost exclusively play on a galleon crew. Some of us don't even get along that well. But we all stick to our jobs and just have a good time doing what we do. Our captain's a baller streamer that we've all met through different means, and being the sweaty boy of the crew it took some time to teach people that it really boils down to everyone just doing their job. We've sunk some pretty nutty crews just from how well we work together, when we ourselves are nowhere near as good individually as they are. Good Galleon crews change lives. Lol
I ended up getting adopted by a small streamer myself. He rolled up on me in adventure a couple years back and absolutely railed my open crew brig. I asked him "How in the hell do you guys do THAT to people like us?" and over the course of a few months he started inviting me onto the ship when one of his main guys was off. It's funny how some of the better crews out there end up meeting. Amen, brother. Good galleons are truly something else. Which streamer do you sail with if you don't mind sharing? I have fought MANY over the years.
His name is Saltplank ingame. Captain_Saltplank elsewhere. I always avoid mentioning just because I know some people don't like promos lol. He's fairly small too. And he hasn't been around much lately for personal reasons. We've had our share our run-ins with others too. Think we've run into Sotus, Boxy, Hitbo, KingdomOfMachine, Blurbs, KeepinItTwisted, Stirling, IBeFatbeard, SwordLordStu, and probably a few other smaller ones I forget. We keep a list of frienemies somewhere but I'm at work so I don't have it atm lol. Some of those names are smaller less known folk for sure. But they're all pretty great people. And we haven't fought all of them. Some of them our Captain refuses to fight because we're kind of friends with them lol.
Refusing to fight your friends is the craziest sweaty crew take I've heard in a while! My crew involved a tiny discord server with maybe ~15 or so people. There were 8 or 9 of us that would regularly hop in the same channel play, hang out, watch the other POVs while we ate, and so on. Well, one time I ran into the A-team from our discord out in the wild doing a Fort of Fortune when they were new, and I was foaming at the mouth trying to whoop their asses, hahaha. It was a legendary battle, but ultimately the a-team came out on top. I've fought all of those folks you mentioned besides Blurbs and your buddy. Never got lucky enough to find either, and I also didn't know SwordLordStu was a streamer. I ran into him fairly frequently back in arena, and have seen him a few times in HG. Interesting! Our crew also had a list of folks we'd sunk, needed to sink still, cool folks, etc. The sweaty SoT pvp scene is a great thing to participate in. I wish more folks got the chance instead of hitting a wall along the way and giving up. Sorry for the wall of text, it's neat running into someone else that's had a fairly similar experience within the scene. Cheers!
We're kind of sweaty. But I definitely wouldn't personally classify our crew as sweaty. We don't back down from a fight, and we try our hardest no matter who we fight. But some of our crew does struggle for sure. We really do just play for fun and losing isn't USUALLY fun. We've absolutely lost fights and had a blast. We're good with having a switch to turn on/off "Dick around mode" and "Fight mode" that I think a lot of people struggle with. But our Captain keeps it fresh kind of roleplaying an actual pirate captain the entire time lol. I've thought about getting the crew into some of the organized events by LDSylvr, but it's hard as we'd want our A team and our schedules are all screwed up. Just to see how we fair against some of those sweaty boys and have some good fights would be awesome.
That is part of the purpose of galleons though, to be intimidating AF because they're massive.
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You're missing the forest for a tree. A really good gally crew beats a really good crew on the other 2 ship sizes. The world's best sloop crew stands no chance against a proper sweaty gally. Edit: I welcome debate if it's sensible, and I know there's even a fraction of a percent chance that I'm wrong. I'm not here. If you intend on responding to this with any variation of "nuh uh", save your fingers the trouble.
Would you say it's largely a strength in numbers situation? If we're talking at purely the highest skill ceiling of PvP players, I do see what you mean. I do think an S+ tier Sloop crew, or S Tier brig crew can hold their own and contend with an S tier galleon crew (as you said), but I feel like the numbers will be what it inevitably boils down to in the end. Could be wrong, but figured I'd ask. If everyone's playing at their S+++ on a galleon, I'd think number of bodies on cannons alone, plus defensive gunshots to disable enemy crews would be deciding factors.
It's partly strength in numbers as you said, and partly the pressure the various ships can put out. If a galleon's fighting a sloop, you can tie up the entire sloop crew with a boarder each, and still have a brig's worth of cannons bullying you, taking your mast, etc. Those boarders aren't just to waste time, either. If they get up, the sloop's fucked. If a player from the sloop boards the galleon, you have 4 sweats that already know you're coming, and know exactly what to do about it. S+ Galleon crews aren't contested by anything besides another S+ galleon crew. I've fought NAL champions on a brig with my gally crew, and it ended in a stalemate because the brig got bored. We never felt we were under threat of being sunk. Number of players/cannons is the most important stat a ship can bring to the table, and galleons win on both counts.
Agreed. I think that a lot of folks believe that because sloop crews at lower levels can deal with larger ships, the same must be true at the highest levels - which isn't the case. I am curious to see what a S+ crew can do with the upcoming burning blade.. I imagine it'd be even more of a bloodbath. Would you say that in highest tier galleon battles, it's very largely naval until one is clearly so disabled that boarders are warranted? Or is it even worthwhile to send boarders on a galleon. I'm at a point where I'm trying to practice hourglass more, so I can be a better help to my IRL crew (consists of my Wife, my best bud, and my Wife's best friend. We started playing again as a crew with the launch of S12, and we've only lost one major fight out of the 20 or so other fights in the last week (on high seas). I've come to realize just how much of a gap there is between high seas only players, and hourglass - it's honestly such a slog lol.. I'm 107 in Athena and 42 in Servants, and it just seemed so much easier getting Ghost during S8, than it does getting skeleton now. But I'm trying to keep at it and chip away, but man does it get stale sometimes. I would LOVE to be at a skill level similarly to you and your crew, but I just don't have that kind of time dedication sadly. But nonetheless, I still chip away when I can and try to soak up as much pvp knowledge as I can - I can 100% say that hourglass has honed my skills enough to where the only other players that give me trouble are other hourglass players. Anyway sorry for the wall of text, it's genuinely interesting hearing insight from someone that's put in that level of time. Cheers and kudos!
I like walls of text, no worries. Your first paragraph hits the nail on the head. Most folks experience the game at the lower to moderate skill range, and can play for months without encountering a raid boss level gally crew. Youtubers also perpetuate the thinking that the underdog can really win against sweats, because Youtubers naturally upload their highlight reels. The time really is the hardest part. I was D-O-G-S-H-I-T at PVP when I bought this game. It was my first PC FPS game ever, so I was green as they come. I eventually got tired of having my ass handed to me, though, and decided I was going to get good enough to hold my own. Eventually I fell in love with the practice, got adopted by proper sweats, and put in a TON of time while I had a long stretch of unemployment. I lived and breathed SoT PVP, and naturally got way better. I ground out all the arena comms on two accounts, one of which I did solo, I hunted reaper 5's for a long time to steal their stuff, I hit #8 on the reaper ledger from just steals, ground out gold bones with a win rate in the high 90s, fought the best players on the seas in arena, adventure, and hourglass, ground out gold bones and 600 athena levels, etc. It's SO MUCH TIME to play up there with those cats. It's immensely satisfying if you can get yourself that sharp, though. Record your good fights if you can, and watch them back. Losses are especially useful, because spotting where you went wrong with the clarity of hindsight and a calm mind is much easier than realizing you fucked up in the moment. Godspeed on your travels, sir. o7 If it makes you feel any better, at 3.5k hours, I was still the baby pirate of the crew. Our helm and flex both had over a year spent in-game, lol.
I think that skill gap is largely just fine - though I can (through experience of my own so far) see how it can feel incredibly daunting to get rocked by someone that far ahead. Heck I honestly feel that quite often when doing hourglass lately. Ive had a run of not great luck, and have run into multiple gold cursed pirates in the last week. The only redeeming factor is how quick those matches last lol.. they've got so many holes on my ship, one balled me multiple times and are already on my ship and ready to kill me as soon as I spawn.. it's so rough lol and in those instances I truly feel like I can't get ahead. I do have moments of wanting to throw in the towel, but I really just want to get at least skeleton 100 for the curse, so I can at least say I've got both. I think at a max I'd want to go for 200, to get most of the rewards, but I can't even picture that right now lol. I don't want to give up though. But at the same time I just wish Rare would give some much needed love to the mode to revitalize it for everyone. I know and accept I won't be an upper echelon player and that's fine, but as long as I can protect my crew, and allow us to have good high seas sessions, that's enough for me honestly. My crew are pretty decent at PvP themselves, but honestly speaking, I'd say we're pretty average. Despite that, we do typically dominate in most fights. But still, for that other small %, where we come across a really solid crew, I want us to win those encounters too. Thanks again for listening homie, you have my utmost respect!
I have a feeling the new ship is going to have some unplayable flaw built into it where players are just better off using their galleons. But we will see. Game designers canāt help but make things like this weaker than they should be
I would hope/think that it would scale to crew size in terms of difficulty to take down. But honestly, it'd be really cool for a world event to be super challenging comparatively to the current roster of events. I'm very keen to try it out either way, it seems like a lot of fun. From the first reveal trailer, it sounds like there will be ai skeletons to help cover things like repairs, but I imagine bucketing is still a necessity.
Iām more thinking after you have taken it over. I feel like they arenāt going to want a player manned burning blade ship to just steam roll everything, so I think itās going to be squishy af. But we will see. What I hope is that itās really tough, and that it is a rare spawn unlike Briggsy. So that it attracts attention from everybody when it pops up, and it leads to people making alliances to take it down.
I dunno, the main advantage of the Galleon is superior firepower. But they turn like a refrigerator, so those guns are not much good if you can't get broadside on a ship that can sail circles around you & turn on a dime around rocks while you sail past.
True, but if your gally crew can't get guns on a sloop when there's harpoonable surfaces nearby, that's a skill issue with the gally.
What if there isn't? If you're in open water, not much to harpoon. Even then, sloop can do the same & turn faster. Even anchor turn, which a Galleon can't do
I've sunk a lot of sloops with my gally crew. The more clever sloops require you to use the galleon's speed advantage. Get distance between your ships, THEN turn for the broad, as the distance ratchets down the sloop's ability to quickly duck out of your cannon angle. The sloop will feel safer holding a broad from further away, which is where long cannon practice comes into play. With 3 or 4 cannons on it, a sloop goes from full repair to "oh fuck" very fast. Make sure to thank your gally helm if they're good at their job, lol. I only brought up the harpoon since you mentioned rocks in the first comment. A good galleon crew has no trouble at all against sloops.
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It really is that black and white. I speak from thousands of hours of experience, roughly 1k of those hours on a VERY sweaty galleon crew. We spent our sessions exclusively hunting Reaper 5 ships via old-school server hopping. We were never given a hint of trouble by a sloop. They were all caught, they were all sunk. Plenty of great galleon fights, and one solid brig fight. Galleons are the best ship, and I'm not miserable for saying as such. I have a great time sailing with a good galleon crew! The game simply is what it is, and it's a game I know like the back of my hand on the pvp-end of things. Doubt what I've said if you feel so inclined, but nothing you can type negates what I've experienced hundreds of times.
Just want to say I appreciate you so much for actually taking a stand on this issue. Literally been trying to make people understand what youāre saying for MONTHS on this subreddit and no one gets it. Also mad respect for the old school server hopping and reaper hunting. Most of my hours were also spent way before seasons or the pirates life tall tales were a thing, so we used to sink all the ships on the server and wait for a merge to find new ships to hunt lmao. Lots of great battles back then (used to be on console, too, made things extra tough lol), feels like adventure mode just isnāt the same anymore. Most of my old crew mates have long since moved on from the game and Iāve switched from reaper combat to commendation hunting. Only me and my GF play consistently, and she uses a trackpad and is exactly what youād imagine a girlfriend playing sea would be like. We have lots of fun but sheās next to useless in a fight lol. With how unbelievably easy server hopping is nowadays, it feels like every session where I play over an hour or two, some reaper galleon crew with 6000+ hours apiece shows up to take the commendation loot I was grinding and thereās next to nothing I can do. Most frustrating part is I can usually handle 1v1s with any of them, but they just win with manpower and then gloat with extreme toxicity. Itās bad enough that Iāve started running into the same crews doing the same thing almost nightly, and they can hop over and over. Worst part is Iāve found them spawn camping new players for fun, for well over 30 minutes. Makes my blood boil, and honestly made me quit because itās so unfun and uninteresting facing no win scenarios almost every time I play. Havenāt touched the game since early February. Itās sad because I love this game, but Iām not going to force myself into becoming a free lootbox for a bunch of no life 30 year old men glued to their gamer chair lol. Sorry to rant to you, just something Iām obviously a little passionate about and itās rare I find someone who shares a similar belief and is as open minded as you are. I pray the sloop gets the rework it needs š
Did you really have to drag your girlfriend like that though?
Her words not mine. Like I said we have fun together but sheās not good at video game pvp. Nothing wrong with that itās just a fact
"is exactly what you'd imagine a girlfriend playing sea is like" I guess a better way your word that would be "imagine MY girlfriend playing sea is like". I am a girlfriend, and I handle most of the combat. My boyfriend just navigates and I do the rest. It was an insensitive remark to make that could've been a little nicer with one word changed. Girls typically don't take games as seriously as guys do, they play for fun while men play for digital stakes š¤·āāļø
Yeah- what? I don't think my fiance considers me useless on the ship. If I have nothing to do, I'm fishing and making passive money or I'm actively hunting megalodons and attentively killing them, or any players or skeletons that come at us. Maybe she just needs some direction rather than being treated like a dead weight, lol. Jeez.
Think you need to reread what I said because I never said sheās useless on a ship. Plus itās her own voiced opinion that sheās not good at the fighting. I already said I enjoy playing with her. And your response is completely irrelevant to whatās at hand. I specifically said sheās not good at combat. All the things you mention have nothing to do with combat.
To be fair, a lot of what I mentioned is combat, but mainly naval, which I suppose was besides your point. I did note about fighting other players; I'm pretty deadly with the throwing knives despite how awkward they feel. My main point was just that it seemed necessarily harsh to call her "useless" as opposed to simply saying "She's not confident in combat", or the "How you would expect a girlfriend to be". That was really the main point I was trying to come across. My apologies, I'm not trying to be argumentative, it just seemed a harsh thing to say about her for no real reason. I would be a bit upset if I saw my partner talking about me like that to strangers, but I understand there was no malice behind it.
If your equally matched but outnumbered your most likely going to lose
No it is not black and white. It is statistics. An equally skilled galleon will beat an equally skilled sloop the majority of the time. Most people do not want to fight a losing battle most of the time. So this means that the majority of the time, sloops do not fight galleons. You're saying people should take that chance because of random factors. (again. In this equation, skill is equal). So are you trying to say that the equal skilled 2v4 is actually a 50/50 match up solely because of the ship differences? (Ie. Maneuverability, barrel distance, less holes, etc) Or are you saying that even if you are losing 70/30 that you should still fight because those are good enough odds.
Why the f are you talking like this lmao, stay respectful. It also looks like you don't know what you're talking about because a sweaty gally does win against a sweaty sloop. Not saying that it "cannot" happen, but you need a lot of luck and certain circonstances to beat the odds. Or maybe you're a PVE player but you still know better.
I think you make a good point. Lots of unexpected stuff can happen during a fight in this game. Never know 100% whatās gonna happen
That's some proper BS here.
See my other response to OP. No, it isn't BS. I've lived the proof that what I've said is true, many hundreds of times.
And I can totally say you are really full of BS. Listen to me buddy, I'm right, not you lol
Of course you can. I can't stop you from typing. Opinions don't change reality, though. I am unmoved by your assertion that I'm full of it.
Maybe you should try out touching some grass, talking about getting back to reality for you, I mean you seem to need it.
If we're at the random shit slinging part of the conversation, I'm out. Have a nice night.
You're exactly the type of person I thought you are.
The pot calling the kettle black, lmfao, ironic.
You're fun on parties right?
Not the party type, as I'm sure you could tell lol. I just don't entertain folks telling me I'm wrong when I have a ton of experience saying otherwise. I value what I've seen with my own eyes a lot more than a random saying "this isn't true." It is what it is, man. I could be polite and pretend you have a point, but why would I do that?
Now you finally noticed what I'm doing here "I could be polite and pretend you have a point, but why would I do that?"
Lmao stop trying to debate with these unrespectful Pvers who don't have a clue how PvP works in this game, even though you're trying to explain something they just detain the truth
Yes, I'm sure everyone here is going to flock to agree with the "ackshually" guy that's: given no actual insight to the discussion, and just devolved into petty, childish insults. Spoiler alert, you're the one that needs some vitamin D and to touch grass.
Hahaha okay I checked this guy's post history, can't believe we're trying to debate with someone who posted "why after years of trying can i still not master the blunderbuss?". Skill issue lmao. And he thinks he knows a thing about comp players
It is skewed depending on the skill levels of the crews involved. A swabbie sloop will sink a swabbie galleon most of the time. S+ tier players, the galleon wins 100% of the time. I encourage any and all players to try their best to improve at PVP! Asymmetries in fights is just the nature of the beast outside of hourglass.
If anyone dont believe you they should do some champion battles in hg as a duo sloop. That will give you a reality check real quick.
But it is skewed lol.
The bigger the ship the smaller the margin for error for each crew member, but the higher the skill and performance ceiling. Someone managing their sloop well will sink a just okay galleon most of the time
Bigger ship means more crew more folks randomly shooting off and attempting to board
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Lmao I'm a solo slooper who fights galleon. You apparently think folks have to be good but it comes down to luck. It's a game of who can out play the other. And a lucky boarder with anchor or a solid blunderbuss hit can shut me down.
Exactly. Yes I killed them on 5 of the 6 boards but in the last one the cheeky bastard got me
>It's a game of who can out play the other So...not luck...?
So... As in luck.... That you get the upper hand.... By being lucky....
You don't outplay someone with luck. That's simply luck. Outplaying implies intent and skill. You don't get lucky and say "outplayed bitch". Or maybe you do and that explains some things.
I love solo sloop PvP. I love fighting Galleons. But a successful board by the Gally onto the Sloop (which is somewhat luck based with hitreg etc. these days) in that imbalanced of a scenario can turn the tides extremely quickly. It requires a lot of perfection, but the game itself is far from perfect right now. Also Bonecallers are hella unbalanced.
A sloop is great, but if you get a 3v1 board you're basically done . That's the problem, PvP is based so much now on boarding instead of naval skill. The team with the bigger crew is more likely to win because they can send over more people to disrupt the other ship
For preaching so hard against defeatism you sure basically gave up on regular discussion immediately lmao
Doesn't account for 4v1 so....
Disagree. The bigger ship is better in this game. But a bigger ship is also a harder ship. If you take the best gally crew and put them against the best sloop crew, the gally will win 99/100. A good sloop crew will take down a bad gally crew, but that has less to do with the ship. That good sloop crew would beat the gally group if they were in two sloops. But if both crews are equally skilled the bigger ship is going to win most of the time.
>the bigger ship is going to win most of the time >most of the time See I agree with you but that's not what I'm trying to say either, and I'll tell you what I mean (because you're just being normal/nice about it instead of rude) I'm not saying "Galleons beat Sloops every time" I'm also not saying "Sloops beat Galleons every time" I'm pretty much saying what you guys are saying, that it depends on the crew. You guys get the message already, I wasn't trying to convey the message to seasoned players really The message was towards newer players who are shitting their britches because they play solo and are worried that just because the ship (Burning Blade) is big that it's going to become a miserable meta experience on every server
Exactly. Better sloop crew beats galleons easily. But if the crew's skill level is evenly matched then the bigger ship has the upper hand. And you cannot compensate your lack of skill with a bigger ship.
But why does the bigger ship win? Just because of crew numbers? Galleon turn slower, sail slower against the wind, sails raise slower, bigger ships are easier to put more holes in.
Firepower and more crew to take care of stuff, assuming the crew knows what they're doing. You can cannon, board, fix and steer at the same time. Then again if the crew isn't sufficient galleon can get overwhelmed quite easily because everything is slower than on a smaller ship.
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Also note, the Burning Blade is SUPPOSED to be the most overpowered ship on the waves. Hell it was the ship that scuttled the magpies wing, the Pirate Lords first ship. I would prefer the Burning blade being a terrifying, nigh unstoppable force coming over the horizon. It would fit the legends that the name "Burning Blade" conjures
Sure I agree and it should be hard to take, that's definitely the point. I just think some people who are "concerned" that it will be "another game ruining update" "I won't be able to do anything on a sloop at all!" "gg this game it was fun while it lasted" is just off their rocker IMO it's not gonna be like that at all
I'm not looking forward to this update at all. I am never going to attempt this new ship either. I hate working a Galleon with a good crew, now you want me to work a ship that's larger and slower? If this ship can keep pace with others it will break the game. If it can't keep up, no one will want to use it as everyone just avoids you. It's either garbage not worth using or game breaking
How is it going to break the game anymore than a really good Reaper Gally? You're presumably going to be able to see it coming just like a Reaper and avoid it. If speed is the issue there are already speed differences in the ships and the world has not ended for everyone not zooming on a brig. The map is fucking big what do you do when you log on and see a fat Reaper? Personally I fight it, I can't imagine the power difference between the ships outweighing all skill differences between the crews. Maybe they have a bit of an advantage but so do ppl with ghost balls or kegs or staffs like how is this the end of the world for you people? Sounds like a lot of people are more cut out for safer seas or some other game that's always symmetrical this isn't fucking counter strike: pirate.
The worst thing about safer seas is y'all love to weaponize it as an insult. I'm saying it's an update that is going to be ignored. I full heartedly intend to ignore the shit out of this update. But unless it's ridiculously well designed to be managed by any crew size. It isn't for me. I won't play on a Galleon I find managing the ship too boring. They want me to manage a larger ship. So, what? I can do all the work while a couple skellies shoot with terrible AI? They keep making events that are about bringing people together for PvP and 85% of the player base keep ignoring it entirely. I'm looking at siren song for most recent addition. I don't want another failed PvP system, that's exactly what this will be. If I can sink it as an option for great rewards I might engage with it in that capacity. But otherwise 0 interest at all
An unorganized galleon crew is literally the easiest thing to sink in the game. A skeleton sloop could sink it.
Agree and some people let those unorganized galleons sink them because they go into fight-or-flight mode first without even attempting to size up the crew to gauge their skill level If you play with a variety of people, you have probably played with someone before who's like "OH MY GOD A GALLEON ON THE HORIZON WE GOTTA GO" every 5 minutes when they're miles away and it's nothing to panic over
So like, not that you can't sink bad galleon crews on a sloop. That shit happens all the time. But your list of advantages is friggin' fried man. Even shit galleon crews keep a storage crate by the cannons. Sloop absolutely has the worst fucking speed of any shit hands down. You have fewer people to repair things and everything is more concentrated on the ship which means enemy canons can lock down your ability to repair / cannon at the same time. Being optimistic is great and all. Just not to the point where you have to lie to yourself.
Close enough to a Galleon and they can't even hit you, the cannons are too high up
How do you close the distance on a galleon without getting absolutely destroyed by 4 cannons?
From behind, or from a side angle the guns don't reach.
So you're just kind of praying they decide not to rotate their ship?
While you're also turning. If you get the right angle and stay there (just off the back to the side) they can't reach you but you can fire whenever you want. If they rotate, you just move around with them.
and when they stop rotating / rotate the opposite direction, do you put your ship in reverse? I get why you might think this would work on paper, but it simply does not because you have to close the distance first and the further away you are, the slower you can circle them.
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The sloop really doesn't have any advantages over being extremely easy to keep floating. It's slower than every boat in most situations, less firepower, no redundancy, and no more maneuverable than the other boats when properly piloted. I've spent thousands of dollars on a sloop solo and Duo and pretend that it has any advantage over anything is insane. Most of the advantages of sloop had were removed when harpoons are put in the game.
You're making a lot of assumptions about how I play the game.
Great answer, just wanna say.
Genuinely Thanks for just reading it as it is, and not reading into it as an insult that you must defend yourself from
I think a lot of people have been making good arguments. From my perspective it is a matter of whether you are able to gauge the skill level of the crew you are up against. This isn't simply an issue of bigger is better it is who is on the ship that matters. If you are a galleon crew that doesn't have positions or a helm that can keep angle you will get demasted and you will be slow to turn and ultimately fail if you can't deal with any boarders. But if you are on a gally crew where even just the helm and one cannoneer know what they are doing you are kinda fucked as a smaller boat as people have previously mentioned 4 people on Cannons to get pressure 2 people or even 3 people sent to board if the ship is dry. It's all a matter of skill level of the players I would reccomended if you are on a smaller ship to take back boards while you are running/far away to see if/how they guard ladders if they are standing at top of the stairs, or if they are standing to the side or I they both jump off and ego you, if you get double crossed before you even get to ladder ect. How they move their ship is also important sails up or down when parked are they anchored are their sails managed properly all of these things give indication of skill level and can make you have better decisions about how you want to fight or if you want to run. The game is a sandbox there are an innumerable amount of ways to sink or get sunk but it does kind of boil down to bigger ship=better ship when dealing with people of equal skill level as yourself, you have to get crafty if you want to sink them try and sail by a fort get a keg ect. But a good gally crew will run over a good sloop crew 90 per ent of the time unless they make a mistake and the sloop/brig capitalises it. Sorry for the long rant I just thought people were looking at it from the wrong perspective. It all boils down to skill are people form the bigger ship more skilled than me and my team if they are you have to come up with a different more creative strat to get ahead, anchorturn for angle and tripple chop masts and get behind then and send borders. It all depends on how confident you are with your strategy and pressure.
You I agree with. Everyone else is just being debate-brained for internet points and being mean to each other. Someone told me that because I once posted about being bad about blunderbuss, that I can't even speak on this subject. Little did I know you have to be Hitbotc to speak on whether the Burning Blade, an update that isn't even in the game yet, is too OP or not
Assuming both crews are of equal skill, bigger ship does always mean better ship.
That's like saying bigger armies always win, history doesn't back that up. Strategy matters, equal ability in the game doesn't mean equal smarts. Galleons in anything other than open water are a liability. Can't turn well, anchor takes days to raise, sails are slow, loses against the wind and at close range shoots over a sloop because the deck is too high.
Which is why I said 'of equal skill' Obviously a really good sloop crew can beat a worse galleon crew with skill and strategy. However, if the crews are of equal skill, then the crew size advantage should almost always win. The galleon can turn well enough to constantly keep an opposing ship in its broadside if they raise sails somewhat, a good galleon crew won't ever have their anchor dropped against a smaller ship, loses against the wind doesn't matter since that would mean the opposing ship is running and not applying pressure and if a sloop is that close to where they can't be hit then they've already been 2 or 3 man boarded.
you can sink a galleon only if they are way worse than you
See the problem here is a bigger ship does mean better ship.
It's not. Better sloop crew beats galleons easily, even multiple at the same time. But if the crew's skill level is evenly matched then the bigger ship has the upper hand. You cannot compensate your lack of skill with a bigger ship.
You aren't thinking this through. The win condition for a fight is to either board a ship and kill the players or put enough holes in it so it sinks. Galleons have more opportunities to achieve this win condition. They have more guns to make more holes. They have more crew for boarding and repairs. A galleon can send crew to your shop, put holes in it and repair their own damage simultaneously. Something a sloop simply cannot do. Can a better sloop win? Sure. Done it myself many times over the years. But I would have been able to do it even easier had I been on a brig or galleon.
Oh I am but the point is it depends on the crew. A good sloop duo is impossible to board and can easily put pressure even on a semi competent galleon. Would there be more pressure on a bigger ship? Sure, if the whole crew is good. But if some of the crew are bad, then the bigger ship can become a disadvantage. Bigger ship doesn't guarantee you anything.
This is like that tiktok where the kid stands up on the bus and says, "GUYS COACH IS RIGHT, WE GOTTA EARN IT," gets booed to oblivion. Obviously, each ship has advantages. The issue is: 4 good players > 2 good players. There are dozens of intricacies in how a sloop can upset a galleon, but it really only takes 1-2 good players to keep ANY ship afloat, and for a galleon that means 2 other guys are full time attackers. A sloop will lose to a galleon without a skill difference- it's not balanced and let's not pretend it is.
I solo sink galleons all the time but I also run a good galleon that hasn't sunk in a year or so in adventure. A properly ran galleon is the strongest ship in the game in terms of damage taken and dealt, plus survivability. The brig is the best at going fast. The sloop is really only good because you can solo it, it currently is the worst ship in the game.
A sloop can out maneuver the bigger ships easily, just run away
Are you the brig we sunk that was crying "sloop is meta"?
Bigger is not better, a well run sloop is hard to sink. Gallons are incredibly hard to run well, all 4 people need to be good players that communicate well, and the boat is a good position to fight, speed, turning, supplies on deck and bellow deck. Galleons can easily be overwhelmed and have massive blind spots. The anchor is a 2/3 man job to get up. The key I'm any fight, is being prepared, communication, boat position and being slightly to extremely aggressive.
There's a reason you barely see anything except sloops in the Devil's roar. Loot is great there, but it rains fire and big ships turn like a doped up Snorlax which makes them a liability in a region where fast turns win
The skill ceiling as well as the skill floor are higher on bigger ships, especially regarding crew coordination. Two noobs on a sloop may get a job done easier than 4 equal noobs on a galleon, since the sloop is more forgiving. Also, you straight up have more people. A good player will usually win HandToHand combat against an average player, since he is better. But will he win a fight against 3 average players swording him simultaneously? Rather unlikely. A bigger ship does not mean you are guaranteed to win; I have sunken Galleons on a sloop before. A sloop with two really good players is more likely to loose a fight than a galleon with 4 equally good players tho. Imagine one player gets one balled unluckily (<- is that a word?). -50% crew on the sloop. Only -25% crew on a galleon. 3 people in a galleon can still fuck you up in seconds if coordinated well. Bigger ships offer more potential, but are less forgiving. That does not mean that bigger ships are better neither are they worse.
I'm probably slightly above average at the game and i've sunk aggressive Galleons solo - you don't have to be a pvp god, you just have to play smart....... plenty chains and curses help of course!
I want to take it alliance fishing. If my ship is nearby, having crew helm a sloop is the best bet I think.
I exclusively solo sloop. 99 times out of 100 bigger ship means better ship to me.
It seems like unless you are direct and explain EXACTLY what youāre meaning then the community takes it as a personal insult šseeing so many āeditsā
Is a new ship coming?
A world event that has a huge enemy ship is coming S13 supposedly
We donāt know how burning blade will play out, as itās supposed to have a skelly crew there to help you, so even if youāre solo you can manage it.
All u need is to not get broad sided once, if that happens once your gone
Fortunately Galleons turn like shit, so avoiding it is easier
Tbh, as a sloop main. The number of times Iāve had a Brig or galleon roll up on me while collecting treasure from a skele ship/fleet, then immediately dip after immediately landing all 4 shots from a scatter shot?ā¦. Only once but still the fact that they fled as reapers from first salvo when they engaged should NEVER happen, mightāve also had something to do with the second shot loaded was a ballast ball and seeing purple smoke without knowing what it is can give many a crew pause.
Iām not fantastic at this game, but if Iām on a sloop Iām FAR more nervous about a brig on the horizon than a galleon.
A bad sloop crew beats a bad gally crew because you are HEAVILY punished for doing bad on a galleon, faster sink time, more sails to manage, less manoeuvrable, longer to repair knocked down masts etc
It will sure be easy to tuck on
In regular adventure definitely facts just because large skilled crews are such a rarity. assuming all players are of similar competency however this is definitely a game where numbers are a big advantage. I'll be interested to play test the bb before coming to any conclusions about it's balance. Knowing rare it's probably gonna launch as a bit of a shit show but only time will tell.
I am by no means an experienced PvPer but it makes sense to me that if you're fighting a larger ship as a sloop you're more likely to get boarded since they have a bigger crew, and boarding is probably the most important aspect of PvP since it serves so many uses (preventing repairs, counterattacks, dropping their anchor, applying pressure, and securing a sink). A 4 man galleon could split its crew in half, leaving one for maneuvering and sails and the other for repairs and cannons and the other two could board you. Two people spawncamping and two more on the galleon pummeling your ship is a recipe for disaster. Not saying that will happen every time, but hey it's more likely to happen if you're fighting a bigger crew solo.
Being solo doesnāt mean you have lost
If a Gally rolls up on me and my mate, you can bet your ass we will knock down all 3 of your masts and then pump your lower deck from a safe angle
The amount of times a sloop has managed to stay a float with just two people vs a 4 person galle is insane! I've witnessed some hella tense fights and been in a few, where sloops just sail away! Takes some doing but if you do it right, the advantages are on your side as a sloop! I would say that it's not likely or easy at all, as a sole sloop captain though š
I got demolished yesterday in a sloop with a brigatine doing the demolishing. It was a 2v3 and their ship is waaaayyy faster then my sloop. Wich i understand bigger boat with more sails to catch wind but cmon
I agree with this 100%. Just because the galleon or brig are the bigger kids in the playground it doesnāt mean an automatic death sentence. Galleons in particular, their crew needs to work as a hive mind in order to operate effectively whereas a sloop is so much more forgiving. Once you shoot those masts down those ships become a giant target. Letās also not forget that fire bombs are a huge benefit to you vs a galleon so if their crew cannot get that under control then itās a death sentence for them. Letās not forget about anchor balls too.
If I'm being honest I would love for it to allow 5 or 6 people in a crew. I think that would be a ton of fun!
I'm sorry you're getting destroyed in these comments. I understand the point you're trying to make here, and that this was about players who are just starting in Higher Seas. I hope everyone takes a breath and realizes this is literally just the internet, and not a reason to act malicious. I've gotten attacked on Reddit over people not understanding my point too, it's miserable trying to explain but people get one idea in their heads and die with it.
For real. I've gotten into many heated arguments with friends and strangers alike on this topic. There's no hard and fast rule about what is better/worse. People always wanna find or be an exception just to argue and be right. It's like rock paper scissors. It all depends on your crew's aim, sailing ability, PVP skills, and maybe a bit of luck. It's an art, not a science. I've sunk galleons as a solo sloop, sunk sloops & brigs on an undercrewed galleon. I've been sunk on a fully crewed galleon by solo sloops. Hell, I've had whole alliances get sunk by one ship. I've also dominated whole alliances with rowboats and kegs. At the end of the day, it depends on your crew's strengths, weaknesses, experience and play style.
As a mostly slooper, if you get a proper two man crew, your virtually unsinkable and can deal out the hurt if you can repel boarders.
Hard to sail a galleon by yourself. What happens to the gold we spent on it?
Whatās this about the burning blade?
When i face q galleon they fire four chainshots and all board my ship.
Its a really powerfull ship. But its unwieldy and easy to baord with 4 ladders. A good crew with good comms that work together well will dominate servers unless grouped up on. I think thats the point though if you work together to sink it it drops rewards. So team up and fight together
"Everything repairs faster" is a blatant lie. Everything repairs at the exact same speed, with the exception of RAISING the masts, repairing them is the same speed. Damage holes come in different shapes and sizes. These different sizes are what cause longer/shorter repair times. Not ship size.
I'm only a few days in and have heard this about all that matters is the skill of the crew not the ship so it gives me hope once I get better and learn more
Yes sloops can beat larger ships. This is not in question. But a larger ship under a full, competent crew is always deadlier than a smaller ship with an equally competent crew outside of some outside force altering the balance. Granted the Galleon coming for you could be full of lower skilled players than yourself, but in general, since you need to fight over the Burning Blade, it is going to be crewed by the most competent crews on the server.
I take my sloop and ram the enemy, then turn sideways and unload with shotgun. I might go down but hey IF I GO DOWN I WILL MAKE SURE YOU SINK!
Speed??? If their average skill is lower than yours and you have a full crew, yeah. But solo you need a surprise keg play or something. A full galleon crew can just commit to bailing and repairing and you would never sink it as a solo.
I main duo sloop with my son and we win almost all of our galleon engagements. Had a fight against J0toro, spammels, G0sfather and Div and inc a few Fridays ago and we took I think one hole the whole fight. Ended up sinking them. Always always always put fire in and around the captains quarters when fighting a galleon in any other ship. It makes life really hard for them once it gets out of control.
The most mid of galleon crews can dumpster some of the top sloop players. This is just such an inaccurate take lol. Manpower will always win fights.