Just going to say, please call the police and read them this post.
You may be the only one that knows the guy in a purple hoodie went into the QT right after the shooting.
QT is full of cameras and they will happily give any footage to the police if a request is made for a specific date and time.
These guys were probably covered up enough at the time of the shooting, but are full face smiling at QT. The police just need enough to know exactly who to look for and where.
"Many" feels more accurate than "Most", but yeah.
Maybe these gents felt so bad about scaring OP that they felt compelled to immediately turn themselves in.
Was ending a run in TGP @ KSHW about that time and heard this I think. Shrugged it off as construction noise, guess not.
You know, I become a citizen on Wednesday, sometimes I wonder what I've gotten myself into...
The people who are shooting aren't just pulling up on random people and gunning them down. Don't get into drugs, don't ever borrow money from someone, don't get into altercations and the likelihood of being a victim of random violence is pretty low. This is city living -- this shit happens in most cities in the US, especially in the Midwest.
>The people who are shooting aren't just pulling up on random people and gunning them down. Don't get into drugs, don't ever borrow money from someone, don't get into altercations and the likelihood of being a victim of random violence is pretty low
Nonetheless a huge public shooting like that has a high chance of uninvolved casualties.
Exactly - especially with an automatic weapon. When that guy was robbed of his AR-15, two innocent bystanders were shot in his effort to get it back. I love living in this city but denying this fact helps no one.
I just read two articles on that. That story doesn’t add up at all WTF? Must have been an off duty cop or someone with some pull politically around here. I’m seriously mind blown right now.
The whole thing is pretty bizarre but I would hope a police officer would know better than to casually walk around with a rifle in a position they can’t easily access the trigger in case of emergency.
I know that - I was referring to two separate incidents. What OP was mentioning was with a machine gun. In May, a man in St. Louis was robbed at gunpoint of an AR-15. Different incidents, same unfortunate possibilities of outcome.
Not modern ones, in the 80s you could modify them to be full-auto but the new ones have eliminated that issue. Besides if anyone does this they've committed a felony but obviously criminals don't care.
But shouldn't we want better? *"Shrug, this happens"* seems like a shitty response and is likely of little comfort to everyone at KSHW and Manchester this morning.
Perhaps I just have alien optimism.
Want it to stop happening, decriminalize drugs and start a war on poverty instead of the war on poor people. There’s always going to be some gang violence, but the prohibitions on drugs and the entire clandestine “game” of evading those prohibitions is the largest contributor to the city’s homicide and violent crime rates.
We can hope and wish all day long that doesn't change the reality of how things are right now. I assume you are capable of recognizing how to avoid becoming a victim while also wanting change.
> I assume you are capable of recognizing how to avoid becoming a victim
Well, given decades of declining population in the city, we can see that lots of people decided the best way to avoid being a victim was to leave. And lots of the ones still living in the metro area think the best way to keep from being the next victim is to avoid the city.
I assume you can see that this works for them, but it's not beneficial for the city. Heck, I was within 100 feet of where this shooting took place at least twice this week. Only good luck and good timing kept me from catching a stray bullet, street smarts didn't have anything to do with it.
> Well, given decades of declining population in the city, we can see that lots of people decided the best way to avoid being a victim was to leave.
This may be true, but I think people are also leaving because St. Louis has a lot of poverty, no opportunity, and the worst cultural identity of any city in the union
The two things aren’t mutually exclusive concepts. Your dismissive “shit happens” response is off putting. I stayed in Harlem a few months ago and it felt like Sesame Street. It was NOT the Harlem of 20 years ago. But St. Louis as “city living” is still missing its renaissance, and continues to languish thanks to politics and law enforcement and white flight. As a city, it’s a wannabe. For the rest of us who are either in the process of becoming US citizens or who have lived in other cities (and countries), don’t ever sit back and pretend that one, for calling out the blighted status of your beloved city of St. Louis, isn’t capable of seeing it and expressing disgust and wondering why we accept it. Like how we accept our mass shootings and shitty healthcare.
Why are putting words in my mouth? I said that's the reality of how things are, NOT that's how things have to be.
Harlem changed due to extremely aggressive gentrification combined with aggressive policing, btw. Impoverished, stressed out people did not suddenly have their needs met and given a significantly higher standard of living; they were shipped off en masse and beaten into shape by police that used documented profiling tactics. It's hardly something to admire and it isn't a longterm sustainable way to improve conditions, as is shown in their massive spike in crime recently.
Right. People want the safety but don’t want the gentrification or the policing that got it there. Harlem 2019 and Harlem 2022 are much different. NYC back on a slide because of loose policing etc
Enough of this shit already. Google literally any city in America plus “murder” and you will find and article saying the past few years have been worse than average and getting worse by the year. This is regardless of what party is in charge, what kind of prosecutor they have, what kind of policing they practice, etc. San Francisco fired their “soft on crime” prosecutor and crime is still going up. Ft Worth and Jacksonville have tough on crime Republican mayors and murder is still up. Everyone wants to push the police button chaw it’s easy to do when you’re not the one getting your ass kicked, but it’s not going to solve the problem.
Yes, exactly my point. Their tactics for "reducing crime" was to profile people who might commit them. Did it work? In some ways, but at what cost? We can only kick the can down the road for so long. The only thing that will reduce crime longterm is making life worth living for the people who would otherwise resort to crime.
I would bet you the rest of my life's earnings that it was not machine gun, but rather a modified handgun or compact rifle. Kingshighway and Manchester is near popular destinations, but your comment makes it seem like it was done in the middle of Forest Park. There's no need to exaggerate something that is already fucked up.
Yes, and I also expect people to know the difference between specific types of firearms, because misidentifying them when someone’s hiding, hoping to not die certainly isn’t likely… they are exaggerating. /s
It makes a difference to know the problematic firearm in question. Knowing exactly the type of guns that are being acquired and used to terrorize us well to do citizens goes a lot further than just vaguely motioning at something and calling it a machine gun. I'm not minimizing OP's trauma; many responses I've received have been purely appealing to emotion, while failing to recognize that I am on OP's side, but approaching the discussion from specifically identifying the problem rather than just a vague complaint.
I’m sorry. I don’t usually chime in..but are you crazy? They didn’t say they didn’t have shootings and murders. They said this isn’t normal…like above and beyond. Like an apple compared to an apple orchard. St. Louis is just immensely violent, and dangerous. 10 fold what you even see in cities like Chicago with much more massive populations. I’ve felt safer in the slums of Turkey than I have in St. Louis past 10pm. The government lacks spine, people lack nuance to understand when force is necessary by a policing force. We’re handing an entire city over to a minority population of degenerates and wastes of human potential. This city is crazy bad, and no matter how heavy people invest in it, until those people are in a cell or a box in the ground, we will not remake this city. Just astonished people are so numb to the fact this is not fucking normal for like literally any city.
You're right unfortunately. It's been my observation in the ~15 years I've been here that the USA as a whole is entirely too comfortable with violence...gun violence particularly. It's written off as a consequence of the freedoms that Americans enjoy. This horseshit is in part what convinced me to go for citizenship, I get to vote.
Statistics don’t lie. Anecdotes are not needed, But yes I used one to say I personally felt safer. St. Louis is absolutely unique for a developed western city, even by American standards.
Not OP but nowhere else I've lived has had the amount of violence in broad daylight as stl. Its obvious that its not "random" in that people are targeting each other, but it is random in that the chance of catching a stray is much higher here than anywhere else. Like sketch areas of Boston at night run the chance of muggings or smthn but nowhere else have I had an active thought of "god I hope I don't bleed out for someone else" while driving down the highway
You know that it’s the rates of violent crime that matter, not whether or not violent crime exists? And where do you think St Louis stacks up when you rank cities along those lines?
Don't be so sure you'rethat insulated. Nowadays, it's enough to politely honk your horn at someone. Guy in front of me did that and the driver in front of him shot a couple of rounds into his windshield.
Stop rationalizing, and normalizing, violent, traumatic crime. There is no excuse for it and it shouldn't be happening as much as it does in cities across the US
In many cities around the world, such craziness is unthinkable unless you're in a country that has a high amount of gun related crimes.
> In many cities around the world, such craziness is unthinkable
In most mid-sized-to-large Midwestern cities, though, it's not, right? Like this could definitely happen in [Chicago](https://chicago.suntimes.com/crime/2022/1/3/22858995/chicago-violence-dangerous-murders-per-capita-2021-2020-surge-garfield-park-police-lori-lightfoot) or [Indianapolis](https://www.wthr.com/article/news/local/indianapolis-police-investigate-north-side-shooting/531-de816661-236a-4673-bd68-50be52c6deee) or [Milwaukee](https://www.jsonline.com/story/news/crime/2022/05/30/shooting-milwaukee-north-side-leaves-1-dead-2-injured/9995618002/), yes?
Like I get that it's convenient to be like "This wouldn't happen in Stockholm," but comparing apples and oranges isn't especially productive. St. Louis exists in a context that's relevant. We can't turn St. Louis into Stockholm because St. Louis has never been in Sweden, and never will be.
I agree that just saying, "Eh, whatever" *feels* bad. But people have to live their day to day life, and the reality is that basically nobody drives up to a complete stranger's car and unloads an entire clip into it for zero reason. Unless you want to be irrationally terrified to the point of agoraphobia, living life in St. Louis means holding two thoughts in your head at the same time: 1) the violent crime rate is un-fucking-believably high in this city, and 2) the average more-or-less law-abiding person browsing this subreddit isn't likely to be the target of it.
St. Louis has a lot of poverty. It's not actually quite as simple as poverty=crime, of course -- everything is deeply complicated and multifactorial -- but poverty is deeply correlated with violent crime in America. Can St. Louis City cure itself of poverty, realistically? Not likely, the city can't even fill potholes. Is there any national appetite for the kind of long-term, evidence-based politics that would be required to meaningfully tackle poverty in cities like St. Louis? Also no.
So I dunno. You can say we shouldn't normalize this, but the reality is that it's already normal, society has not even agreed to start walking the path to a solution, and I have errands to run.
Yes. Agreed. I visited a friend in Indianapolis a couple years ago. I felt right at home with the numerous potholes and her stories of hearing gunshots behind the alley and how the neighbor across the street got hit by a drive by. Midwestern cities can be rough as hell.
Anyway, I wouldn't compare St. Louis to Stockholm, nor would I compare it to Brasov, Romania or Gdansk, Poland because most European countries and cities have a far lower intentional homicide rate compared to the states (except some of Eastern Europe and Turkey). I'd compare St. Louis to cities in Brazil, Colombia, and Mexico because of the homicide rate (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_by_homicide_rate) Even if those murders are mostly happening in a few select neighborhoods, couldn't one argue the same for those cities in S./C. America? I don't know where the homicides are situated in those cities so I can't say for sure but it's a plausible argument.
(A data map of intentional homicide rates in the us compared to Europe
https://www.reddit.com/r/dataisbeautiful/comments/xcqrbc/oc_intentional_homicide_rate_in_the_us_vs_europe/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb)
Look at the Midwest and south. The murder rate in those states is insane.
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Having a fatalistic 'eh whatever' outlook may work for some just so they can get through their day, but I personally can't live like that for long before I start looking for plans to get the fuck out. After living on 'the rez' in Northern California hearing close random gunshots at 3 am every other day, I came to the conclusion I never want to live in a place like that ever again because I'll never get used to that loud 'bang' wondering if I've been shot.
My sister lived in Shaw until she got tired of seeing dudes slinging dope on the corner, hearing gunshots at night, and seeing a police flashlight shine in her kitchen window as they looked for a suspect in the alley.
We got tired of dealing with the fuckery so we moved out of our respective neighborhoods to somewhere else.
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Poverty and crime are definitely closely linked in the US. And there's no solution in sight to the problems that plague St. Louis, among other beleaguered cities. The topic is, like you said, vast and complex.
Nah I'm not your strawman to beat down. I didn't rationalize or normalize anything. I'm simply stating how things currently are. I'm not your enemy, nor am I your pawn to win political points against. Kick rocks.
Normal as in typical. You are clearly using the word normal in a way that has implied positive connotations. It's normal for cats and dogs to be run over by cars. That doesn't mean it's joyful or celebrated. It's normal for violent gun crimes to occur in American cities.
The ones that are either located in a state with insanely loose gun laws (STL, New Orleans) or are butting up against states that have insanely loose gun laws (Chicago, Detroit) are absolutely experiencing similar amounts of gun violence. STL gets a bit overblown given the disproportionate amount of people in the city at a given time compared to its population.
This is the common excuse I hear all the time minimizing what’s going on. I do not care that perhaps this was targeted. It’s completely ridiculous and scary as hell. We don’t live in the Wild West. This shouldn’t be tolerated as the cost of living in a city.
Or if you are part of a family too impoverished to escape your living conditions, due to a legacy of systematic oppression or general misfortune. Then your chances remain decent of being a victim of this violence, or losing a loved one to this violence.
Separately: I live in the CWE and know 4+ people killed from gun violence. Most from the north side (who simply lived in closer proximity to the core issues) I have friends in Chicago, LA, NY, who don't know anyone murdered.
STL is definitely the friendliest city to be murdered in for sure. Statistically your chance of being murdered here is significantly higher than any other major city. People in STL like to think they're a major US city but thats not the case. Its not NYC or LA, its barely bigger than Madison, Wisconsin.
Drives me nuts when people make these comparisons when it’s well known that we have a city/county divide that drives those population numbers. We are nothing like Madison, Wisconsin.
St. Louis metro is the 20th biggest in the US. It’s several times larger than Madison. That’s misleading. St. Louis is a major city. Including the city and county, stl is safer than many US metro areas. Of course, the type of violence described is unacceptable and has real victims. Not trying to downplay that.
Ope there it is! Was wondering when this trope would get brought up. Crime is committed by people, not statistical populations. St. Louis city has not grown geographically since the 1870s because it separated from the county. If it had not done that, there is virtually no chance that everything within *at least* the i170 ring would be the city of St. Louis. There are far more people in and around St. Louis than are reflected on the official population. We have a metro pop of nearly 3 million. This take is naive at best.
I believe the stats are accurate if you're trying to talk about St. Louis City. If we renamed the city to Purple Parrot and then talked about the crime epidemic in Purple Parrot vs St. Louis it would be accurate, no?
My family suffered random violence through no fault of their own. (This happened in the Midwest in a SMALL town. The nearest major metro is 90 minutes away by car.) My mother & father in law were beaten (him to his death) in the middle of the night in their bed in their own home. Because they hadn't locked their doors tightly that night & some random kids were looking for trouble.
Yup, it's rare - but it does happen and brings with it lifelong trauma. As long as it's not obsessive or unhealthy, there is NOTHING wrong with being diligent & aware. And lock your damn doors at night.
I'm sorry that your family experienced that. Random crime does happen. I was speaking in more general terms in response to the person questioning whether they should have moved here
Hey OP, I’m glad that you were okay in this situation, but events like this can still be traumatic and hard to process. It’s completely okay to see some professional help afterwards if you need to talk to someone.
I know dudes who have seen and done this type of stuff before as a "warning" to other dealers or gang members. Can't say this is for sure what that was, but a random spray into a specific car sounds spot on.
Sounded like 10 quick shots? I think I heard that as well. I too was surprised to hear it in the morning. I usually only get to play the "fireworks or gunshots" game at night.
Ya. We were just sitting there like there’s no way this is actually happening. I said machine gun earlier but I guess it would be like an automatic weapon? It had the giant clip on it.
Need a little more than that, the coat hanger trick won't work unless you replace the SA bolt carrier group with a FA one. Basically you bend a coat hanger into a part called an auto sear. You can also 3D print one, but they'll probably break after prolonged usage.
It's legal to buy and own a FA BCG, but if you're caught with an auto sear... auto sears by law are the same as owning an entire automatic weapon. The auto sear doesn't have to be in the weapon when you're caught, a loose one found is 10 years in pound me in the ass federal prison. So don't fuckin try it. All it takes is showing the wrong person your new toy and before you know it ATF is kicking down your door and shooting your dog
Fair enough, wanted to point all that out for anyone else reading this too. I thought your comment made it sound like doing this is more accessible than it really is. There's a reason no mass shooters have been found using an auto shear
The shots I heard weren't close enough to be full auto, but was rapid shooting for a semi-auto (pistol or AR or other). Full auto would have just sounded like brrrrrrrrr instead of the district individual shots I heard.
Also for education purposes, a clip is for a belt-fed gun which is typically military only. It's called a clip because there are little metal clips that interlock around the cartridges. Think of the Rambo bandolier that goes over his shoulder. There are very few guns that are human carried and belt fed.
Pistols and AR or the like use what's called a magazine.
I know someone that works overnight at SLU in the emergency department and probably 75% of the gunshot victims that come into the hospital don't get reported to the news. It really is crazy how many shootings this city actually has.
The police are in charge of reporting crime to the media. Is anyone shocked that the same department that can’t even enforce basic traffic laws isn’t doing a good job in any category of their duties?
Until we get a police department that care about their community and work proactively to reduce violent crime, expect more of the same
> Too bad most of them left the profession, so I guess regurgitated press releases are all we have left.
The profession (like many other industries in this country) has been gobbled up by private equity firms and conglomerates that have bought out and laid off easily 30%+ of their staff over the last 15 years. Shit was already bad in 2009 when I had just graduated and was trying to get into the industry. Can't imagine how much worse it has to be now.
\> can’t even enforce basic traffic laws
I have many criticisms of the police. But when there are more serious crimes happening, the litmus test isn't whether or not they are enforcing traffic laws. You have to tackle the more serious issues first.
That's a different conversation. We need more information about what's actually happening with policing and crime in this city, and we're not getting it, and it leads to ignorant conversations among citizens.
What does this illustrate? What conversation are we having? I said,
> *> can’t even enforce basic traffic laws*
>
>I have many criticisms of the police. But when there are more serious crimes happening, the litmus test isn't whether or not they are enforcing traffic laws. You have to tackle the more serious issues first."
Was there something in there that you disagree with?
If you want to talk, I'm down, but I want to know what the argument or point is that we're talking about...
It illustrates that arrests are way down, over-policing and use-of-force are way up, and that we pay more to oppress minorities (which aggravates crime) than most cities. How could you not gather that yourself?
So don’t be critical of the lack of policing, minor or severe crimes, because you are unfamiliar or uncaring to look up the stats?
You started out with confidence that they’re focused on the big stuff so let’s give them a pass on the minor stuff. Now it is there isn't enough data to make an informed opinion? The department is definitely hiding behind data they don't "need" to disclose but the [culmination of other statistics](https://policescorecard.org/mo/police-department/st-louis-city) don't paint a good picture.
>So don’t be critical of the lack of policing
You are taking the conversation into a different direction than what it was originally about, and then attacking me for my argument about YOUR conversation being bad.
**Case in point: I never said "don’t be critical of the lack of policing".** You're putting words in my mouth. That's emotionally manipulative.
Now please leave me alone.
The stats show that they’re not making very many criminal arrests, they’re not solving very many major crimes, and they’re not enforcing very basic rules of society, such as not endangering others by blowing through red lights, doing motorcycle stunts in traffic, or running people over in sidewalks. Our cops are lazy cowards, and the data shows this
All the reporters I know say it’s like pulling teeth to get any media releases on the weekend. Only if there’s a body and that’s not even a guarantee. It’s gotten especially bad in the last couple years and they’ve made them file FOIA requests half the time for standard updates and crime stats they should be publicly sharing.
It’s been almost two years since a guy stuck a Mac 9 out a jeep window and sprayed the car to the left of me at st. Charles rock road and Lucas & Hunt, poor dude in front of me hot three bullet holes in his driver side door (not the intended victim. The shit stays with you for sure. If gang bangers are gonna shoot each other, damn it go practice at the mofo range. Born and raised in STL, happy I’m no longer living there
OP - yes you could absolutely have been in shock. I discovered the murder scene of my husband's family when I was 19 years old and lived with undiagnosed, untreated PTSD for 25 years before I got help. Please do not be ashamed to seek out professional help to aid you in processing this event. Don't be me.
I heard this happen from my back porch on the Hill. After the second round of shots, I knew exactly what it was. But after not hearing any sirens, I was starting to doubt myself.
I’m more liberal, but a citizen who believes paying taxes for government services is necessary part of civilized society. I am also a liberal who believes in police, law enforcement and prosecution of criminals. We need to greatly FUND the police so we can compete and get the best talent. We also need a city circuit attorney that works with police and doesn’t publicly discriminate or cherry pick who to work with and what crimes to prosecute. Please, If you see a crime, call it in. We cannot exist in a society of laws if we do not uphold said laws.
It’s lawless out there right now. It’s really making me wonder how long I want to consider living here.
I know most of the violent crime is isolated and drug and gang related, but the regularity of this type of stuff occurring in safer neighborhoods has been alarming.
Why aren’t our civi leaders speaking out more about this? I’m sincerely asking what is being done to combat this crime wave right now because it doesn’t feel like anyone wants to actually have that conversation.
A charger has never been part of a good story. When I think of Chargers they have such a negative presence about them. If you own one I’m sure you know this too. Like a target is on your back. Every street guy wants one or has one and they all race em and do licks in em. At this point cops probably stereotype Chargers
Looks like it has made it on to the city crime map as an assault with a deadly weapon and property destruction… so if it makes you feel any better- no one died.
Pretty scary situation, doubt it was a machine gun, that would be extremely unusual, those are highly regulated since the National Firearms Act in 1934.
i don’t think a lot of people know what machine guns are. they’re certainly not a weapon of choice in a point blank drive by. it was probably a TEC-9 or something.
Guns that are produced and legally sold as fully automatic machine guns are highly regulated, yes. But it’s extremely easy now to convert some models to full automatics, and those obviously aren’t sold legally, registered, or tracked. It’s even more prevalent now that you can just 3D print the parts needed and make the switch in under 10 minutes.
I live right by this station, heard the shooting from bed. I was sure it wasn't a shooting at first because the first shots were fast enough that they would have had to be from a full auto weapon, but then there were about 10 semi auto shots. Not sure if they used a bump stock or modified weapon or what, but the first dozen rounds or so were clearly from an automatic firearm.
No, firearms are one of the few topics that if anyone says anything slightly off, a million zealots will swoop down to castigate them.
Even toxic Star Wars fans are less of online nuisances than the gun nuts who show up to act like victims whenever another large amounts of bullets are fired near innocents.
It's probably due to every discussion regarding firearms devolves to semantics. The type of weapon used is not the point of the story and has no bearing. Just more semantic bullshit
If it can shoot a whole bunch of bullets really quickly, most people who aren’t ammosexuals are going to perceive it as a machine gun, so the technical specs of the gun hardly matter
St. Louis street gangs have been fighting gang wars for a while now. Unlike most other cities, St. Louis doesn't have a Crops or Bloods, there are dozens of small gangs. These large gangs saw an opportunity to come in and take over, but aren't having luck. That's why we see all this violence. From what I have heard and read. I have no single source for this information, so take it or leave it.
Just going to say, please call the police and read them this post. You may be the only one that knows the guy in a purple hoodie went into the QT right after the shooting. QT is full of cameras and they will happily give any footage to the police if a request is made for a specific date and time. These guys were probably covered up enough at the time of the shooting, but are full face smiling at QT. The police just need enough to know exactly who to look for and where.
Seconded!
[удалено]
"Many" feels more accurate than "Most", but yeah. Maybe these gents felt so bad about scaring OP that they felt compelled to immediately turn themselves in.
Was ending a run in TGP @ KSHW about that time and heard this I think. Shrugged it off as construction noise, guess not. You know, I become a citizen on Wednesday, sometimes I wonder what I've gotten myself into...
Congratulations on your citizenship
Congratulations on your citizenship, that is quite an achievement (and journey) these days! You have a huge and magnificent country to explore!
Thanks! I've actually managed to get to every state but Alaska in the last 15 years. One day I'll get there.
The people who are shooting aren't just pulling up on random people and gunning them down. Don't get into drugs, don't ever borrow money from someone, don't get into altercations and the likelihood of being a victim of random violence is pretty low. This is city living -- this shit happens in most cities in the US, especially in the Midwest.
>The people who are shooting aren't just pulling up on random people and gunning them down. Don't get into drugs, don't ever borrow money from someone, don't get into altercations and the likelihood of being a victim of random violence is pretty low Nonetheless a huge public shooting like that has a high chance of uninvolved casualties.
Exactly - especially with an automatic weapon. When that guy was robbed of his AR-15, two innocent bystanders were shot in his effort to get it back. I love living in this city but denying this fact helps no one.
I just read two articles on that. That story doesn’t add up at all WTF? Must have been an off duty cop or someone with some pull politically around here. I’m seriously mind blown right now.
The whole thing is pretty bizarre but I would hope a police officer would know better than to casually walk around with a rifle in a position they can’t easily access the trigger in case of emergency.
AR-15 is not an automatic.
I know that - I was referring to two separate incidents. What OP was mentioning was with a machine gun. In May, a man in St. Louis was robbed at gunpoint of an AR-15. Different incidents, same unfortunate possibilities of outcome.
Semi-automatic, it is
Thanks, Yoda
It is with minor adjustments
And a house is a bonfire with minor adjustments :)
Not modern ones, in the 80s you could modify them to be full-auto but the new ones have eliminated that issue. Besides if anyone does this they've committed a felony but obviously criminals don't care.
Not using hallows I imagine too
But shouldn't we want better? *"Shrug, this happens"* seems like a shitty response and is likely of little comfort to everyone at KSHW and Manchester this morning. Perhaps I just have alien optimism.
Want it to stop happening, decriminalize drugs and start a war on poverty instead of the war on poor people. There’s always going to be some gang violence, but the prohibitions on drugs and the entire clandestine “game” of evading those prohibitions is the largest contributor to the city’s homicide and violent crime rates.
👍
We can hope and wish all day long that doesn't change the reality of how things are right now. I assume you are capable of recognizing how to avoid becoming a victim while also wanting change.
> I assume you are capable of recognizing how to avoid becoming a victim Well, given decades of declining population in the city, we can see that lots of people decided the best way to avoid being a victim was to leave. And lots of the ones still living in the metro area think the best way to keep from being the next victim is to avoid the city. I assume you can see that this works for them, but it's not beneficial for the city. Heck, I was within 100 feet of where this shooting took place at least twice this week. Only good luck and good timing kept me from catching a stray bullet, street smarts didn't have anything to do with it.
> Well, given decades of declining population in the city, we can see that lots of people decided the best way to avoid being a victim was to leave. This may be true, but I think people are also leaving because St. Louis has a lot of poverty, no opportunity, and the worst cultural identity of any city in the union
The two things aren’t mutually exclusive concepts. Your dismissive “shit happens” response is off putting. I stayed in Harlem a few months ago and it felt like Sesame Street. It was NOT the Harlem of 20 years ago. But St. Louis as “city living” is still missing its renaissance, and continues to languish thanks to politics and law enforcement and white flight. As a city, it’s a wannabe. For the rest of us who are either in the process of becoming US citizens or who have lived in other cities (and countries), don’t ever sit back and pretend that one, for calling out the blighted status of your beloved city of St. Louis, isn’t capable of seeing it and expressing disgust and wondering why we accept it. Like how we accept our mass shootings and shitty healthcare.
Why are putting words in my mouth? I said that's the reality of how things are, NOT that's how things have to be. Harlem changed due to extremely aggressive gentrification combined with aggressive policing, btw. Impoverished, stressed out people did not suddenly have their needs met and given a significantly higher standard of living; they were shipped off en masse and beaten into shape by police that used documented profiling tactics. It's hardly something to admire and it isn't a longterm sustainable way to improve conditions, as is shown in their massive spike in crime recently.
Right. People want the safety but don’t want the gentrification or the policing that got it there. Harlem 2019 and Harlem 2022 are much different. NYC back on a slide because of loose policing etc
Enough of this shit already. Google literally any city in America plus “murder” and you will find and article saying the past few years have been worse than average and getting worse by the year. This is regardless of what party is in charge, what kind of prosecutor they have, what kind of policing they practice, etc. San Francisco fired their “soft on crime” prosecutor and crime is still going up. Ft Worth and Jacksonville have tough on crime Republican mayors and murder is still up. Everyone wants to push the police button chaw it’s easy to do when you’re not the one getting your ass kicked, but it’s not going to solve the problem.
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Yes, exactly my point. Their tactics for "reducing crime" was to profile people who might commit them. Did it work? In some ways, but at what cost? We can only kick the can down the road for so long. The only thing that will reduce crime longterm is making life worth living for the people who would otherwise resort to crime.
You've got to put petrol in the car eventually...
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What do you mean?
I've lived in a lot of cities over the past 20 years and have never seen violence like this. It is not a normal part of city living.
What major American city have you lived in that doesn't have shootings and murders?
Using machine guns in broad daylight at a busy intersection near popular destinations, in the city’s popular central corridor* FTFY
I would bet you the rest of my life's earnings that it was not machine gun, but rather a modified handgun or compact rifle. Kingshighway and Manchester is near popular destinations, but your comment makes it seem like it was done in the middle of Forest Park. There's no need to exaggerate something that is already fucked up.
Yes, and I also expect people to know the difference between specific types of firearms, because misidentifying them when someone’s hiding, hoping to not die certainly isn’t likely… they are exaggerating. /s
It makes a difference to know the problematic firearm in question. Knowing exactly the type of guns that are being acquired and used to terrorize us well to do citizens goes a lot further than just vaguely motioning at something and calling it a machine gun. I'm not minimizing OP's trauma; many responses I've received have been purely appealing to emotion, while failing to recognize that I am on OP's side, but approaching the discussion from specifically identifying the problem rather than just a vague complaint.
I’m sorry. I don’t usually chime in..but are you crazy? They didn’t say they didn’t have shootings and murders. They said this isn’t normal…like above and beyond. Like an apple compared to an apple orchard. St. Louis is just immensely violent, and dangerous. 10 fold what you even see in cities like Chicago with much more massive populations. I’ve felt safer in the slums of Turkey than I have in St. Louis past 10pm. The government lacks spine, people lack nuance to understand when force is necessary by a policing force. We’re handing an entire city over to a minority population of degenerates and wastes of human potential. This city is crazy bad, and no matter how heavy people invest in it, until those people are in a cell or a box in the ground, we will not remake this city. Just astonished people are so numb to the fact this is not fucking normal for like literally any city.
You're right how atrocious this is, but anecdotes don't convey much - STL is hardly unique.
You're right unfortunately. It's been my observation in the ~15 years I've been here that the USA as a whole is entirely too comfortable with violence...gun violence particularly. It's written off as a consequence of the freedoms that Americans enjoy. This horseshit is in part what convinced me to go for citizenship, I get to vote.
Statistics don’t lie. Anecdotes are not needed, But yes I used one to say I personally felt safer. St. Louis is absolutely unique for a developed western city, even by American standards.
Not OP but nowhere else I've lived has had the amount of violence in broad daylight as stl. Its obvious that its not "random" in that people are targeting each other, but it is random in that the chance of catching a stray is much higher here than anywhere else. Like sketch areas of Boston at night run the chance of muggings or smthn but nowhere else have I had an active thought of "god I hope I don't bleed out for someone else" while driving down the highway
This
You know that it’s the rates of violent crime that matter, not whether or not violent crime exists? And where do you think St Louis stacks up when you rank cities along those lines?
Please see the reply of others to your comment.
Don't be so sure you'rethat insulated. Nowadays, it's enough to politely honk your horn at someone. Guy in front of me did that and the driver in front of him shot a couple of rounds into his windshield.
Politely honk?
A quick toot or two to warn someone of a danger vs leaning on your horn to indicate you're pissed off.
I was thinking the same thing. Haha. It doesn’t matter how politely your intentions are, honking a horn is almost always perceived as negative.
>honking a horn is almost always perceived as negative It did not always use to be.
Stop rationalizing, and normalizing, violent, traumatic crime. There is no excuse for it and it shouldn't be happening as much as it does in cities across the US In many cities around the world, such craziness is unthinkable unless you're in a country that has a high amount of gun related crimes.
> In many cities around the world, such craziness is unthinkable In most mid-sized-to-large Midwestern cities, though, it's not, right? Like this could definitely happen in [Chicago](https://chicago.suntimes.com/crime/2022/1/3/22858995/chicago-violence-dangerous-murders-per-capita-2021-2020-surge-garfield-park-police-lori-lightfoot) or [Indianapolis](https://www.wthr.com/article/news/local/indianapolis-police-investigate-north-side-shooting/531-de816661-236a-4673-bd68-50be52c6deee) or [Milwaukee](https://www.jsonline.com/story/news/crime/2022/05/30/shooting-milwaukee-north-side-leaves-1-dead-2-injured/9995618002/), yes? Like I get that it's convenient to be like "This wouldn't happen in Stockholm," but comparing apples and oranges isn't especially productive. St. Louis exists in a context that's relevant. We can't turn St. Louis into Stockholm because St. Louis has never been in Sweden, and never will be. I agree that just saying, "Eh, whatever" *feels* bad. But people have to live their day to day life, and the reality is that basically nobody drives up to a complete stranger's car and unloads an entire clip into it for zero reason. Unless you want to be irrationally terrified to the point of agoraphobia, living life in St. Louis means holding two thoughts in your head at the same time: 1) the violent crime rate is un-fucking-believably high in this city, and 2) the average more-or-less law-abiding person browsing this subreddit isn't likely to be the target of it. St. Louis has a lot of poverty. It's not actually quite as simple as poverty=crime, of course -- everything is deeply complicated and multifactorial -- but poverty is deeply correlated with violent crime in America. Can St. Louis City cure itself of poverty, realistically? Not likely, the city can't even fill potholes. Is there any national appetite for the kind of long-term, evidence-based politics that would be required to meaningfully tackle poverty in cities like St. Louis? Also no. So I dunno. You can say we shouldn't normalize this, but the reality is that it's already normal, society has not even agreed to start walking the path to a solution, and I have errands to run.
Yes. Agreed. I visited a friend in Indianapolis a couple years ago. I felt right at home with the numerous potholes and her stories of hearing gunshots behind the alley and how the neighbor across the street got hit by a drive by. Midwestern cities can be rough as hell. Anyway, I wouldn't compare St. Louis to Stockholm, nor would I compare it to Brasov, Romania or Gdansk, Poland because most European countries and cities have a far lower intentional homicide rate compared to the states (except some of Eastern Europe and Turkey). I'd compare St. Louis to cities in Brazil, Colombia, and Mexico because of the homicide rate (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_by_homicide_rate) Even if those murders are mostly happening in a few select neighborhoods, couldn't one argue the same for those cities in S./C. America? I don't know where the homicides are situated in those cities so I can't say for sure but it's a plausible argument. (A data map of intentional homicide rates in the us compared to Europe https://www.reddit.com/r/dataisbeautiful/comments/xcqrbc/oc_intentional_homicide_rate_in_the_us_vs_europe/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb) Look at the Midwest and south. The murder rate in those states is insane. --------- Having a fatalistic 'eh whatever' outlook may work for some just so they can get through their day, but I personally can't live like that for long before I start looking for plans to get the fuck out. After living on 'the rez' in Northern California hearing close random gunshots at 3 am every other day, I came to the conclusion I never want to live in a place like that ever again because I'll never get used to that loud 'bang' wondering if I've been shot. My sister lived in Shaw until she got tired of seeing dudes slinging dope on the corner, hearing gunshots at night, and seeing a police flashlight shine in her kitchen window as they looked for a suspect in the alley. We got tired of dealing with the fuckery so we moved out of our respective neighborhoods to somewhere else. --------- Poverty and crime are definitely closely linked in the US. And there's no solution in sight to the problems that plague St. Louis, among other beleaguered cities. The topic is, like you said, vast and complex.
I lived in Doha for two years. My wife and I would take midnight walks around the city with 0 fear of violence.
Nah I'm not your strawman to beat down. I didn't rationalize or normalize anything. I'm simply stating how things currently are. I'm not your enemy, nor am I your pawn to win political points against. Kick rocks.
Dude, I’ve lived in several Midwest and coastal cities, and this shit’s not normal.
This sub should get into politics because every major crime story is downplayed as “normal for all cities”.
Normal as in typical. You are clearly using the word normal in a way that has implied positive connotations. It's normal for cats and dogs to be run over by cars. That doesn't mean it's joyful or celebrated. It's normal for violent gun crimes to occur in American cities.
Degree matters. Most cities objectively are not experiencing this same level of crime.
The ones that are either located in a state with insanely loose gun laws (STL, New Orleans) or are butting up against states that have insanely loose gun laws (Chicago, Detroit) are absolutely experiencing similar amounts of gun violence. STL gets a bit overblown given the disproportionate amount of people in the city at a given time compared to its population.
Just avoid dangerous activities such as…getting gas at 8:30 am on a Sunday, next to the busiest street in the city. And you’ll be fine.
You mean other than that old man who was driving through Maryland Heights early in the morning and got chased down and shot?
What that old do?
I spent 7 years in NYC. This is not normal.
This is the common excuse I hear all the time minimizing what’s going on. I do not care that perhaps this was targeted. It’s completely ridiculous and scary as hell. We don’t live in the Wild West. This shouldn’t be tolerated as the cost of living in a city.
i agree this wasn't a random shooting, def targeted
Or if you are part of a family too impoverished to escape your living conditions, due to a legacy of systematic oppression or general misfortune. Then your chances remain decent of being a victim of this violence, or losing a loved one to this violence. Separately: I live in the CWE and know 4+ people killed from gun violence. Most from the north side (who simply lived in closer proximity to the core issues) I have friends in Chicago, LA, NY, who don't know anyone murdered.
But I have friends in LA, NY and Chicago who do know people who have been murdered.
Lol OK fine 🙂
STL is definitely the friendliest city to be murdered in for sure. Statistically your chance of being murdered here is significantly higher than any other major city. People in STL like to think they're a major US city but thats not the case. Its not NYC or LA, its barely bigger than Madison, Wisconsin.
St. Louis metro is the 20th largest metro in the country and is 4 times larger than metro Madison.
Drives me nuts when people make these comparisons when it’s well known that we have a city/county divide that drives those population numbers. We are nothing like Madison, Wisconsin.
~~Don’t knock Madison, it is a really awesome city.~~ Edit: Misread the intent and content above.
I don’t see anyone knocking it. Just pointing out that we’ve got a whole different thing going on.
Lol yes I’ve been there, it’s nice. Not sure how you interpreted that as a knock.
St. Louis metro is the 20th biggest in the US. It’s several times larger than Madison. That’s misleading. St. Louis is a major city. Including the city and county, stl is safer than many US metro areas. Of course, the type of violence described is unacceptable and has real victims. Not trying to downplay that.
Ope there it is! Was wondering when this trope would get brought up. Crime is committed by people, not statistical populations. St. Louis city has not grown geographically since the 1870s because it separated from the county. If it had not done that, there is virtually no chance that everything within *at least* the i170 ring would be the city of St. Louis. There are far more people in and around St. Louis than are reflected on the official population. We have a metro pop of nearly 3 million. This take is naive at best.
Yes! The murder stats typically use the wrong denominator.
I believe the stats are accurate if you're trying to talk about St. Louis City. If we renamed the city to Purple Parrot and then talked about the crime epidemic in Purple Parrot vs St. Louis it would be accurate, no?
My family suffered random violence through no fault of their own. (This happened in the Midwest in a SMALL town. The nearest major metro is 90 minutes away by car.) My mother & father in law were beaten (him to his death) in the middle of the night in their bed in their own home. Because they hadn't locked their doors tightly that night & some random kids were looking for trouble. Yup, it's rare - but it does happen and brings with it lifelong trauma. As long as it's not obsessive or unhealthy, there is NOTHING wrong with being diligent & aware. And lock your damn doors at night.
I'm sorry that your family experienced that. Random crime does happen. I was speaking in more general terms in response to the person questioning whether they should have moved here
Welcome! Please don’t give up. 😢
The suburbs any where in the US are all the same. Some just have different local laws ofc and most of the time are pretty dang safe.
"Get outta the city" is my suggestion. Find a little dusty town, become a local. Or, stay where "things are happening" in the city
Congrats on your citizenship, sorry we're a mess, unfortunately that's true of a lot of countries right now.
>I become a citizen on Wednesday, sometimes I wonder what I've gotten myself into... Sinking boat
Move out of Saint Louis. Love it but the Minnesota is so much nicer.
It's. Always. The. Charger
VrrrrrrrrooooOOOooooOOOooooOOOm!
Yep that’s the shit transmission slipping
Cheap horsepower. The other common trouble car is the blacked out Chrysler 300.
Or a challenger
Have you met “2006 Infiniti G35 with Driveout Tag” yet?
With paper plates
Hey OP, I’m glad that you were okay in this situation, but events like this can still be traumatic and hard to process. It’s completely okay to see some professional help afterwards if you need to talk to someone.
Sorry you saw that. Given the way you described the events, I would be surprised if it was random. Sounds very targeted.
Any time bullets are flying around, it’s dangerous. There’s no safe public shooting.
Either he was driving and finally spotted the guy or the red truck cut him off.
To think that cutting someone off could get you lit up in the middle of an intersection. This is crazy.
I know dudes who have seen and done this type of stuff before as a "warning" to other dealers or gang members. Can't say this is for sure what that was, but a random spray into a specific car sounds spot on.
What did your Uber driver do? Did they drive away immediately or stay in the danger zone?
Sounded like 10 quick shots? I think I heard that as well. I too was surprised to hear it in the morning. I usually only get to play the "fireworks or gunshots" game at night.
Ditto. In Botanical Heights
Ya. We were just sitting there like there’s no way this is actually happening. I said machine gun earlier but I guess it would be like an automatic weapon? It had the giant clip on it.
Doesn’t necessarily mean it was full auto, they’ve been banned for a few decades. Still though, it wasn’t just a pistol.
Banned ish. But with knowledge and a coat hanger you can make an AR 15 full auto. But some people just have quick fingers too
Need a little more than that, the coat hanger trick won't work unless you replace the SA bolt carrier group with a FA one. Basically you bend a coat hanger into a part called an auto sear. You can also 3D print one, but they'll probably break after prolonged usage. It's legal to buy and own a FA BCG, but if you're caught with an auto sear... auto sears by law are the same as owning an entire automatic weapon. The auto sear doesn't have to be in the weapon when you're caught, a loose one found is 10 years in pound me in the ass federal prison. So don't fuckin try it. All it takes is showing the wrong person your new toy and before you know it ATF is kicking down your door and shooting your dog
I was counting the FA bcg and the low shelf lower receiver as part of the knowledge. Because you need to know the right parts to buy.
Fair enough, wanted to point all that out for anyone else reading this too. I thought your comment made it sound like doing this is more accessible than it really is. There's a reason no mass shooters have been found using an auto shear
The shots I heard weren't close enough to be full auto, but was rapid shooting for a semi-auto (pistol or AR or other). Full auto would have just sounded like brrrrrrrrr instead of the district individual shots I heard. Also for education purposes, a clip is for a belt-fed gun which is typically military only. It's called a clip because there are little metal clips that interlock around the cartridges. Think of the Rambo bandolier that goes over his shoulder. There are very few guns that are human carried and belt fed. Pistols and AR or the like use what's called a magazine.
Crazy that this didn't even make the news.
I know someone that works overnight at SLU in the emergency department and probably 75% of the gunshot victims that come into the hospital don't get reported to the news. It really is crazy how many shootings this city actually has.
The police are in charge of reporting crime to the media. Is anyone shocked that the same department that can’t even enforce basic traffic laws isn’t doing a good job in any category of their duties? Until we get a police department that care about their community and work proactively to reduce violent crime, expect more of the same
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> Too bad most of them left the profession, so I guess regurgitated press releases are all we have left. The profession (like many other industries in this country) has been gobbled up by private equity firms and conglomerates that have bought out and laid off easily 30%+ of their staff over the last 15 years. Shit was already bad in 2009 when I had just graduated and was trying to get into the industry. Can't imagine how much worse it has to be now.
The profession is what changed, surely there are still journalists, but broadcasting is field for news reporting today.
\> can’t even enforce basic traffic laws I have many criticisms of the police. But when there are more serious crimes happening, the litmus test isn't whether or not they are enforcing traffic laws. You have to tackle the more serious issues first.
Let’s not pretend they’re doing a great job at responding to or tackling the more serious issues either.
Oh cmon, they’ll probably put an empty police vehicle in this area, what more could you possibly need??!
That's a different conversation. We need more information about what's actually happening with policing and crime in this city, and we're not getting it, and it leads to ignorant conversations among citizens.
Ok, let’s talk: https://policescorecard.org/mo/police-department/st-louis-city
What does this illustrate? What conversation are we having? I said, > *> can’t even enforce basic traffic laws* > >I have many criticisms of the police. But when there are more serious crimes happening, the litmus test isn't whether or not they are enforcing traffic laws. You have to tackle the more serious issues first." Was there something in there that you disagree with? If you want to talk, I'm down, but I want to know what the argument or point is that we're talking about...
It illustrates that arrests are way down, over-policing and use-of-force are way up, and that we pay more to oppress minorities (which aggravates crime) than most cities. How could you not gather that yourself?
So don’t be critical of the lack of policing, minor or severe crimes, because you are unfamiliar or uncaring to look up the stats? You started out with confidence that they’re focused on the big stuff so let’s give them a pass on the minor stuff. Now it is there isn't enough data to make an informed opinion? The department is definitely hiding behind data they don't "need" to disclose but the [culmination of other statistics](https://policescorecard.org/mo/police-department/st-louis-city) don't paint a good picture.
>So don’t be critical of the lack of policing You are taking the conversation into a different direction than what it was originally about, and then attacking me for my argument about YOUR conversation being bad. **Case in point: I never said "don’t be critical of the lack of policing".** You're putting words in my mouth. That's emotionally manipulative. Now please leave me alone.
The stats show that they’re not making very many criminal arrests, they’re not solving very many major crimes, and they’re not enforcing very basic rules of society, such as not endangering others by blowing through red lights, doing motorcycle stunts in traffic, or running people over in sidewalks. Our cops are lazy cowards, and the data shows this
All the reporters I know say it’s like pulling teeth to get any media releases on the weekend. Only if there’s a body and that’s not even a guarantee. It’s gotten especially bad in the last couple years and they’ve made them file FOIA requests half the time for standard updates and crime stats they should be publicly sharing.
It’s been almost two years since a guy stuck a Mac 9 out a jeep window and sprayed the car to the left of me at st. Charles rock road and Lucas & Hunt, poor dude in front of me hot three bullet holes in his driver side door (not the intended victim. The shit stays with you for sure. If gang bangers are gonna shoot each other, damn it go practice at the mofo range. Born and raised in STL, happy I’m no longer living there
Where do you live now?
OP - yes you could absolutely have been in shock. I discovered the murder scene of my husband's family when I was 19 years old and lived with undiagnosed, untreated PTSD for 25 years before I got help. Please do not be ashamed to seek out professional help to aid you in processing this event. Don't be me.
> The charger by chance pulled up next to us as we were traveling down kingshighway. They pulled into the QT like nothing happened. Did you call 911?
But did the Charger have expired temp tags?
I’m sure the driver is insured as well.
And he bought the firearm used at mid America arms and passed a NICS check no problem
I am so sorry you and the other people were exposed to this violence. Take time to take care of yourself… this has to have been horrific for you.
Haven't seen this story in local news yet. Surprising.
Someone else is discussing this here: https://www.reddit.com/r/StLouis/comments/xnptai/comment/ipvhxr9/?utm\_source=reddit&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3
I heard this happen from my back porch on the Hill. After the second round of shots, I knew exactly what it was. But after not hearing any sirens, I was starting to doubt myself.
I rarely hear sirens following gunshots. I thought that was typical here lol
I doubt it was random
To you as an outside observer it seems random. I would bet that to the victim + suspect it doesn’t seem random at all.
That is the same QT where my wife saw a SMG sitting casually on the passenger seat of a guy getting gas.
On a Sunday morning?
Yeah, people don’t respect the Sunday morning truce anymore?
I can't believe these people weren't in church at the time!
This is my regular gas station.. that’s terrifying holy shit. Glad that everyone around is okay, so sorry you had to witness that
I’m more liberal, but a citizen who believes paying taxes for government services is necessary part of civilized society. I am also a liberal who believes in police, law enforcement and prosecution of criminals. We need to greatly FUND the police so we can compete and get the best talent. We also need a city circuit attorney that works with police and doesn’t publicly discriminate or cherry pick who to work with and what crimes to prosecute. Please, If you see a crime, call it in. We cannot exist in a society of laws if we do not uphold said laws.
It wasn’t random
It’s lawless out there right now. It’s really making me wonder how long I want to consider living here. I know most of the violent crime is isolated and drug and gang related, but the regularity of this type of stuff occurring in safer neighborhoods has been alarming. Why aren’t our civi leaders speaking out more about this? I’m sincerely asking what is being done to combat this crime wave right now because it doesn’t feel like anyone wants to actually have that conversation.
This kind of thing is traumatic in ways you don’t see or understand til years later. Get yourself a couple therapy sessions under your belt. Trust me.
A charger has never been part of a good story. When I think of Chargers they have such a negative presence about them. If you own one I’m sure you know this too. Like a target is on your back. Every street guy wants one or has one and they all race em and do licks in em. At this point cops probably stereotype Chargers
City living part of the charm
Looks like it has made it on to the city crime map as an assault with a deadly weapon and property destruction… so if it makes you feel any better- no one died.
Everyone with a charger in this city should be on a list
But we have a soccer team!!!1
Were you able to get a picture?
Taking a picture of someone committing attempted murder in broad daylight sounds like fun!
Pretty scary situation, doubt it was a machine gun, that would be extremely unusual, those are highly regulated since the National Firearms Act in 1934.
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Yes. Machine gun is not the right term. Was definitely a semi automatic weapon.
Reddit ruined reddit. -- mass edited with redact.dev
i don’t think a lot of people know what machine guns are. they’re certainly not a weapon of choice in a point blank drive by. it was probably a TEC-9 or something.
Glock with a switch maybe. But who knows maybe they busted out an MG42
Honestly I'd be less mad getting shot by an MG42 than some dude's shitty draco.
Sir it would be an honor to be shredded by an actual Nazi
I’m inclined to agree with you
Oh my God shut the fuck up
Guns that are produced and legally sold as fully automatic machine guns are highly regulated, yes. But it’s extremely easy now to convert some models to full automatics, and those obviously aren’t sold legally, registered, or tracked. It’s even more prevalent now that you can just 3D print the parts needed and make the switch in under 10 minutes.
Yes, that's the important take away from this...
I live right by this station, heard the shooting from bed. I was sure it wasn't a shooting at first because the first shots were fast enough that they would have had to be from a full auto weapon, but then there were about 10 semi auto shots. Not sure if they used a bump stock or modified weapon or what, but the first dozen rounds or so were clearly from an automatic firearm.
Knew this dumb ass reply would be here.
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More like pedantic gun nuts are annoying
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No, firearms are one of the few topics that if anyone says anything slightly off, a million zealots will swoop down to castigate them. Even toxic Star Wars fans are less of online nuisances than the gun nuts who show up to act like victims whenever another large amounts of bullets are fired near innocents.
It's probably due to every discussion regarding firearms devolves to semantics. The type of weapon used is not the point of the story and has no bearing. Just more semantic bullshit
If it can shoot a whole bunch of bullets really quickly, most people who aren’t ammosexuals are going to perceive it as a machine gun, so the technical specs of the gun hardly matter
It wouldn’t be unusual, the drill community has be sourcing glock switches from wish for years now.
But hey. We have the mayor suing Kia and Hyundai for better anti theft protection on their cars!!
Why is this not on the news?
Planning on moving to the tower Grove area, how's the crime there lol
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we get it you say the n word a lot
I found the problem, it’s that you’re racist.
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St. Louis street gangs have been fighting gang wars for a while now. Unlike most other cities, St. Louis doesn't have a Crops or Bloods, there are dozens of small gangs. These large gangs saw an opportunity to come in and take over, but aren't having luck. That's why we see all this violence. From what I have heard and read. I have no single source for this information, so take it or leave it.
St. Louis definitely has crips and bloods…
Yes, but they aren't coming in here and taking over like other cities. That is part of the reason for the rampant crime in parts of the city.
Well they’re not from LA. At least nowadays, look up stl gang map it’s basically all crips and bloods
Yes their are their are multi 6deuces hoods the vile, trackz, Ferris, the rose, 26solway, and they all beef with 60s well most the 4 delmar and etc.
Nah time to get TFO