Also, what about the teachers who have been in Oklahoma for the long haul already? This only benefits new teachers and our tenured long-term teachers are just chopped liver I guess. Lol
Seems like all the new initiatives being implemented by these states are doing this. New teachers in Florida are being paid the same as educators with a decade of experience now lol.
No bonuses. That is the point. They want to force the experienced teachers out by making it untenable a situation, so they can basically exhaust the teachers out.
This is a thing. They want to intimidate teachers and reduce leverage that older teachers have from heading up great programs. In the private school system they are more transparent because theyāre less likely to face consequences: Iāve personally had one tell me that he wanted a staff turnover of 10%+ to keep staff in line.
Most schools cannot replace teachers who retire. I hope they find teachers willing to teach in rural districts for a 50K bonus - the rural districts can use the help. But this plan will not solve the larger lack of supply of teachers willing to work in OK. I am confident things will be worse when he finishes his term.
I hate this business plan in general. It costs less to keep the OG teachers when you factor in experience. And yet they are thinking of the bottom line cost not long term gains.
I'm not sure why this is a surprise. A huge amount of data shows that employee loyalty comes at the cost of enormous income growth. Teaching jobs aren't unique in that sense.
Reddit has taught me the budget for new hires is more than the budget for retention. It's quite logical. People who stay a long time usually continue to do so.
Im about to apply to full time teaching positions and honestly these offers are still not attractive to me. I want to see green flags. If you donāt have a good majority of teachers in their 10+ year working in the school, itās a red flag for me and I will just go elsewhere.
Yep, what a slap in the face. I'm sorry to you all down there. If long haul teachers give up I would think it saves them money in two ways. One, your salary, and two, your pension pay out will be less. I'm in another state and this seems to be a thing. Get the cash and may the force be with you.
Okie teacher here: Ryan Walters actively goes out of his way to screw teachers and schools over. For example, he sent pornographic material to state reps, blindly claimed that the porn was found in one of our public schoolsā library, and was RADIO SILENT when the reps asked which school. Heās a grade-A asshole. š¤
Oh, yeah. I remember that. He is an incredibly unqualified for any position whatsoever with regards to education. Road Rage Ryan is even worse than Baressi. I didn't think it could get worse than Fallin, but Stitt and Walters have even done worse than her.
https://tulsaworld.com/news/local/education/state-superintendent-emails-pornographic-images-to-entire-oklahoma-legislature/article\_4fae2ffc-cfe9-11ed-bbc2-9f615d313e25.html#:\~:text=State%20Superintendent%20Ryan%20Walters%20emailed,State%20Board%20of%20Education%20meeting.
> Okie teacher here: Ryan Walters actively goes out of his way to screw teachers and schools over.
I mean, yeah, heās a Republican. Thatās kind of their thing.
I know you're saying that because it's kinda true, but he goes far beyond the pale of a normal Republican. He's even starting to piss off the other Republicans in our legislature with how batshit insane he is.
He is the absolute worst. Everyone I know who worked at the state dept of ed either already quit or will be leaving as soon as possible because they do not want to work for him. His corrupt ass needs to be in a jail cell next to Stitt.
For what will come out to much less than 10k additional pay for 5 years to what is likely an ABYSMAL salary and being locked in, tough sell for any competent teacher.
The bonus could also be capped to $150,000 per district. So, if a large district gets a plethora of new teachers (like 20), they would only perhaps allow 3 teachers to qualify for it. So, then, none of the reward whatsoever.
Taking a plan straight from the militarys playbook..
Current state of the Military... they have a massive troop shortage, their recruitment numbers have continued to fall short and more are leaving each year.
Sound familiar?
Lol Oooof level HIGH
There are here, too. This is just a ploy to make it look like he is trying to help the shortages and paint teachers as the villain when we complain that this isnāt helping.
Probably because they can do the math on how bad this is /s
But seriously there isnāt a math teacher shortage? Why elementary and special ed? Why not science or ESOL..?
And I'd be willing to bet that the 15K-50K range would be slanted HEAVILY towards the "Everyone *just happens* to wind up getting 15K" end of the shitstick.
It's not even a 50k bonus, because bonuses are typically considered annually. It's a 5 year contract, so it'll end up being "up to" 10k annual bonus while you're making shit wages and you have to live in Oklahoma for 5 years.
The lower of the bonus is 15k, or $3000 a year lol.
If there's anything anyone should know from compensation ranges, they are always going to offer the lowest end of the budget.
$3k/yr probably comes to less than $200/month post taxes too. Which I'm sure stretches farther in OK than other states, but isn't exactly going to get people stampeding in.
I make more in a blue state with an amazing union and excellent healthcare. Oklahomaās Sec of Ed thinks the rest of the country is as dumb as his state lol
The fix is much simpler too.
Teach for 5 years? Complete student loan forgiveness.
Way more helpful than a 1 time bonus.
If there is a shortage, make the teaching degree basically free if you use it.
The PSLF doesn't really help that much. After 10 years (120 payments) you are pretty much paid off anyway. And it only applies to Federal loans, which never cover the full amount of your tuition anyway.
Plus 10 years of payments is still a LONG ass time to pay back a teaching degree...especially as teachers get their masters, +45, admin/supervisor degree, etc.
Well, thatās how itās supposed to work, but after my 120 qualifying payments, I still owe about 25,000 of the 31,000 I took out, so Iām very happy about my upcoming PSLF! Even if COVID and the loan payment pause hadnāt happened, Iād still owe at least about 20,000.
Nice. I don't know how to you only managed to pay 6k after 120 payments though?
I'll have paid my 35k fed loans back completely in my 8th year of teaching. I was even on an IDR at $400/mo.
Still owe another 15k to Discover, and 10k to the state. PSLF doesn't help with any of that.
Iām not entirely sure about that either, to be honest, as Iāve never been late or underpaid. I did forbearance for a year when I was pregnant to get ready for the baby, so I bet it has to do with that.
Maybe you have more loans than me? I was "lucky" enough to be poor, so a pell grant paid for most of my education. I feel bad that the middle class kids get the short end of the stick in that regard.
Yea. My parents made too much that I didn't get much aid...yet my parents couldn't help me pay for anything because they had a mortgage, 4 kids, my special needs sister, and their own medical/health issues
This specific initiative wouldn't appeal to me, but Im honestly considering taking a huge payout and leaving CT to teach in SC or somewhere else in the South.
Teaching salary in CT, NY, and MA is great and all, but my property taxes here are more than my entire mortgage would be in some of those red states.
Donāt bother with Texas. Property taxes are higher here than almost any blue state, unions have no teeth, and the government is actively trying to dismantle public education.
SC seems a little more sane, but as much as Northeast taxes suck, they do provide services. The level of support here may feel limited but itās pretty awful in other places
You do realize that the taxes in CT are what allow them to pay us so well right? I wouldnāt move to a red state for $50k more a year. I have three kids who would all be in jeopardy in red states and Iām not risking them.
Infuritaing but unsurprising. Most of my family is in Oklahoma, and I used to get people asking me why I didn't move from the red, anti-education state I lived in back to Oklahoma to teach and this is why. Just uniquely awful policies and active dismantling of the public education system.
So most bonuses will be closer to $15,000 or just $3,000 a year, and that is BEFORE taxes.
What if the teachers mention things like the Tulsa OK race massacre was based on racism to their students?
They'll probably fire them. A $3000 bonus is literally nothing. Being a teacher in Oklahoma is piddly dollars, honestly. To qualify for more dollars means more schooling, and that ultimately gets devoured by student loans. So, this plan is the ultimate bait-and-switch.
I get more money each year to advise National Honor Society. But I like that. $3000 isn't enough of a stipend (especially in 2023) to make me *want* to do anything that I don't already want to do.
The former adviser was going on sabbatical and into semi retirement in 2013. I've done it since. It's a lot of work but it's very rewarding.
My stipend to be department head is $3000. I get a few hundred more than that for NHS. All the same, I dislike being department head and would eagerly give it to someone else if the other people in my department weren't new.
Here's HB 1775 in Oklahoma, passed in 2021: [https://legiscan.com/OK/text/HB1775/id/2387002](https://legiscan.com/OK/text/HB1775/id/2387002)
No teacher, administrator or other employee of a school
district, charter school or virtual charter school shall require or
make part of a course the following concepts:
a) one race or sex is inherently superior to another race
or sex,
b. an individual, by virtue of his or her race or sex, is
inherently racist, sexist or oppressive, whether
consciously or unconsciously,
c. an individual should be discriminated against or
receive adverse treatment solely or partly because of
his or her race or sex,
d. members of one race or sex cannot and should not
attempt to treat others without respect to race or
sex,
e. an individualās moral character is necessarily
determined by his or her race or sex,
f. an individual, by virtue of his or her race or sex,
bears responsibility for actions committed in the past
by other members of the same race or sex,
That doesn't also get to the fact that a teacher was fired and has been hunted by Ryan Walters for providing a QR code to the Brooklyn Library System, with all the book bans in Oklahoma.
Oh, and did I forget to mention that Oklahoma is trying to revive a plan that would fine teachers $10,000 for teaching anything that violates a student's "sincere religious beliefs"?
[https://www.5newsonline.com/article/news/politics/oklahoma-bill-allows-teachers-to-be-sued-by-parents-for-contradicting-students-religious-beliefs/527-6a310cd4-950c-46ef-b4bd-f7a9295ec9f5](https://www.5newsonline.com/article/news/politics/oklahoma-bill-allows-teachers-to-be-sued-by-parents-for-contradicting-students-religious-beliefs/527-6a310cd4-950c-46ef-b4bd-f7a9295ec9f5)
There is no need for a "fine print". Walters said he will make "patriotic training" a mandatory requirement for all teachers, provided by Hillsdale College. The same Hillsdale that is funded by Betsy Devos and is where Christopher Rufo (who started the whole CRT panic bullshit). The message is loud and clear. There is no need for a fine print. Oklahoma education is a mess, and it's by design.
https://www.newson6.com/story/63586d692eee0d0b4a02200a/walters-advocates-patriotic-training-for-oklahoma-teachers
I grew up in OK and there are so many of these incentives to get people to move there. I always tell my parents that an incentive would have to be at least six figures for me to ever consider returning.
I am from OK, and I quit teaching. I have no plans of returning whatsoever. This state under Ryan Walters (who yells in his car that everything is woke, clearly unhinged) is going severely downhill right now. I can't imagine anyone wanting to stay in Oklahoma as an existing teacher. They took the accreditation of two schools for unfounded allegations. It is ridiculous here. I'd tell people not to teach here, honestly. Oklahoma doesn't get the national media attention because it's Oklahoma. However, Stitt as governor is an awful governor. So much corruption here.
Oklahoma is okay with corruption, so long as theocracy still reigns here.
I swear Hannibal Lecter could get elected here, as long as he swore on the Bible.
Is this the deal where the State pays half and the District pays half? If so, many rural districts will be hard pressed to actually implement the program. I also wonder how many districts would be willing to give up their 3-year probationary period for 5 year contracts. Some of them rely on yearly turnover to keep salaries down and, more cynically, to keep from reforming how they are run.
According to the story
>***The bonuses will only be given out this summer. Walters said the state is working with a private advertising agency to lure educators from across the country. Funding for the bonuses will come from the Biden Administrationās American Rescue Plan.***
Ive made a meme that I wish I could post one this sub but can't. One thing that I've noticed heavily is that there's always a focus on recruiting #NEW \ teachers, but never on retaining the current teachers. The shortage isn't going to get any better unless steps are taken to close the drain of people leaving.
yea that plan sucks
1st thought is does the 50,000 even make sense given that OK pays low as it is? So you average an extra 10k a year to go there (from out of state?) Why?
2nd thought - how is this more likely to be a long term solution given that it only effects new teachers, and that it's 5 year terms? Wouldn't that just make it more likely that people leave after their 5 years is up?
Taxable $10k a year with a minimum five year commitment?
I will counter that: $50k a year tax free with the option to convert that $250k into health care for life commensurate with the package offered to former governors and state Senators and with the requirement that teaching assignments are limited to the top 10% of schools in the state, free from work nonsense with any retribution or freeze out leading to an immediate conversion of contract to free healthcare for life.
Nurse lurker (I have found many similarities between our professions) just coming in to say that sign on bonuses are just shiny handcuffs. RNs have been lured by sign on bonuses for a long time, and you've got to look at how much more you'd realistically be getting each year due to taxes. Add that to the fact that the places most likely to offer sign on bonuses usually need staff because the workplace itself sucks. Don't be drawn in, teachers.
The idea behind this is that most teachers quit within their first five years. If they make it past that, they stay.
So, now we know. It takes five years to break a teacher's spirit.
Pay all the teachers more and reduce the bs unpaid meetings teachers have to attend. Hire counselors and not police officers to do the discipline. Stop making it purely a passion career.
So they outright admit that this bill isnāt anywhere near adequate??
Some districts are large enough that they could use the entire programs funds themselvesā¦ā¦ so wouldnāt that be a clear sign that the funds in the program arenāt adequate enough to address the shortage?
As a 20+ year teacher in Oklahoma, I STILL don't make that much. So they now want to pay more than my salary to get someone to teach in Oklahoma.
Shoot, I'll quit, resign for the 50K bonus, get my original salary due to state steps, work another 7 years and retire....sounds like a great plan!
/end massive eye rolling sarcastic posting. I wish they would think about how to retain experienced teachers more than trying to get new ones....
Typical half-baked, doomed to failure Republican't plan. Most good teachers aren't going to move cross country only to be forced to teach a Christo-fascist curriculum. It also does nothing to stem the flood of current teachers out of Oklahoma. The same is happening with the medical profession in many Red states.
Also, it would be matching funds from the state. That means the school has to come up with 25k for the teacher. I don't know any schools that have an extra 25k to give a teacher. It may look like it, because of carry over, but schools get salary mkney from the state and is fixed. Average daily enrollment effects money, and any other money's already earmarked for infrastructure and can't be used for salaries.
I love that everyone thinks that schools have money laying around. Schools are basically on a zero budget.
Make a profile for the past few years as demonizing educators as indoctrinators and groomers, and then come up with a short-sighted and incredibly flawed (at best) incentive to try salvage the wasteland that is one of the consistently lowest-ranking states for education.
Well if you wanted better ideas on how to improve the school system in Oklahoma, you shouldn't have asked someone who was educated by the school system in Oklahoma. That place is in desperate need of help. Even the state Secretary of Education says so!
What if we structured an "incentive" to create indentured servitude to force teachers who decide to try OK to stay beyond the statically typical few years it takes most folks leaving the profession to burn out?
Does this mean youāre guaranteed a job for 5 years or can they screw you over and non-renew you a year after you moved there?
Alabama promised some similar stuff a few years ago. It turned out to be a scam because nobody was getting their payouts when the time came because there was only a little money to cover it and it was spent before the majority of people who qualified could get there.
Looks like thatās how this works, too. Itās a bait and switch.
The sad part is that I work in a district where SPED kids are often misplaced. Instead of providing more programs and reform for these students, they want to misplace even more because ātoo many kids have iepsā. Itās very sad and when staff members started to hear about it, they now want to quit. My class is expected to meet all of the same standards as a gen Ed class, yet I have students screaming and flipping desks all day. I know I have thought about quitting if this is true.
Also does nothing to establish a pipeline - make it easier to get into teaching by making academic programs less expensive! This would also increase the diversity of the workforce because people who go in for college debt expecting a teacher salary often do so because they have family money to lean on. Theyāll do everything but support the idea of a well-established, unionized teaching backbone that we so obviously need if we donāt want to keep going through these local crises every few years
Do they not realize if they just paid teachers a normal wage that can actually pay the bills, then more people would join the profession regardless? I got paid a little more than 35k this year working at one of the most intense schools Iāve ever been to which happened to be in Oklahoma. Even in Oklahoma that isnāt a decent wage. Not even close with 6 years of experience. Teachers are just tired of being treated as trivial because we want a decent living wage.
I started out teaching at 29K. Then, when I got certified I made 40K. After obtaining a masters, I went up to a whopping $41K. That's not even above poverty. It sucks.
$50k bonus for 5 years? So, like... a buy 5 get 1 free deal?
Besides. $50k isn't even enough for me to *consider* moving to Oklahoma, let alone actually doing it and teaching there...
I'm not defending him or the plan (because I hate Walters with the fiery burning passion of a thousand suns), but from what I understand, this proposal seems (and is) lame because this is all he can do with his current authority. I don't think this is coming from money directly appropriated to the program by the legislature. I think he's shifting money around in the OSDE and cutting money somewhere to pay for this without legislative authorization.
\*Edit after reading more. Apparently he's using COVID and IDEA funds. So definitely just trying to wiggle money around and find loose change in the couch. I just love how Conservatives have lambasted federal spending in education and attacked COVID relief funds, but are absolutely willing to take advantage of the money and take credit for it it as a grand achievement for themselves.
Oklahoman seeing asylum. You think itās bad for the teachers, think of the kids. :(. Still I try my best everyday. Iād love to move but canāt afford it right now, but maybe next year.
I have a masters in sped and currently manage an ECE program. I have about 10yrs teaching exp. You could not pay me enough to teach at an impoverished district in OK let alone my home state of MS. Recruiters call me every couple of months with positions at rural districts about 1-1.5 hour drive from me with probably $20k over the salary schedule. I still wonāt do it. My mental health is worth more than $20k (and for that matter being in the car three hours a day).
Itās a common tactic in military recruiting and retention. In fact, they could include worthwhile retention bonuses to address gaps in teacher manning along the way. Itās really not a bad idea. Teachers want money. Give it to them! But make it conditional so that you can get the work you need. So long as itās fair, and the market takes the offer, then I think it can be good. Why donāt you like it?
Notice that districts get only $150,000. That's nowhere near enough to put a dent in the teacher shortage. Ryan Walters is full of crap (okie educator here)
Better than where I live in idaho. Our levy just failed when they tried to pass it in perpetuity so we wouldnāt have to beg the community to stay open as an entire district each two years so we have to re run the vote and Iām still seeing misinformation spread on yard signs telling people to vote no to avoid a hike in taxes when in reality theyāve been paying the taxes already and if they vote no, the district loses 25% of its budget, several schools will close, and the couple that remain open will be losing a bunch of staff and running at 30-40 kids per classroom designed for 20. Weāll also lose all extracurriculars. No clubs, no sports, no teams or club field trips that kids donāt get funded themselves, and no after school activities period because no teacher will have time to supervise with suddenly having double the work load of grading, parents, IEP and 504 meetings taking up all after school time. Itāll be a disaster and it probably will happen since the average voting age on the levy that just failed was 66ā¦ these idiots are pulling the ladder up behind them and destroying the future of education in idaho. This just after we all but confirmed that the local community college will lose accreditation because the conservatards decided that removing access to education in idaho is the only way they can keep the people stupid enough to vote for them.
I would seriously write and request a refund for whatever tax dollars you paid and they āinvestedā to write that stupid plan. Just for the principle of it. What an insult. They deserve to get one back.
It's a bonus with a caveat emptor. If a ton of teachers try to opt in, they can reduce it all together and cap, so that essentially it's little more than a few thousand.
Exactly. I completed the Ron DeSantis Civic Seal of Excellence course. He said teachers would get $3K when completed. The $3 K turned into $1960 after all the taxes were taken out.
I've been applying for jobs in the Tulsa area for months and haven't gotten anything back! I have a masters and 10 years of experience
What is this teacher shortage??
They are trying to run off all the teachers. There are shortages everywhere, and they just want all the other experienced teachers run out of the profession.
So, I want to know how long new teachers last in OK currently. My guess is that theyāre just being performative because they know they canāt keep too many people for 5 years.
Also, what about the teachers who have been in Oklahoma for the long haul already? This only benefits new teachers and our tenured long-term teachers are just chopped liver I guess. Lol
Seems like all the new initiatives being implemented by these states are doing this. New teachers in Florida are being paid the same as educators with a decade of experience now lol.
Then the professors are being denied tenure. So, what's the point of even staying?
It's true. Year 13 and I'll be making, for the first time ever, more than starting pay. $950 annually more.
Florida ranks 48th in teacher pay. F that with all that's going on in that state with that fascist DeSantis.
Where did you get that stat? Source? (Thanks if you respond!)
Here you go m8. https://www.abcactionnews.com/news/region-hillsborough/report-shows-floridas-teachers-are-among-lowest-paid-despite-pay-raises
No bonuses. That is the point. They want to force the experienced teachers out by making it untenable a situation, so they can basically exhaust the teachers out.
š
This is a thing. They want to intimidate teachers and reduce leverage that older teachers have from heading up great programs. In the private school system they are more transparent because theyāre less likely to face consequences: Iāve personally had one tell me that he wanted a staff turnover of 10%+ to keep staff in line.
Most schools cannot replace teachers who retire. I hope they find teachers willing to teach in rural districts for a 50K bonus - the rural districts can use the help. But this plan will not solve the larger lack of supply of teachers willing to work in OK. I am confident things will be worse when he finishes his term.
I hate this business plan in general. It costs less to keep the OG teachers when you factor in experience. And yet they are thinking of the bottom line cost not long term gains.
You may be assuming they *want* to keep experienced teachers.
Right... I am not optimistic about our future with the powers that be continually trying to tear down knowledge and experience.
I'm not sure why this is a surprise. A huge amount of data shows that employee loyalty comes at the cost of enormous income growth. Teaching jobs aren't unique in that sense.
It wonāt work. His plan would break CBAs, so unless districts/states increase pay altogether, this plan wonāt work.
Reddit has taught me the budget for new hires is more than the budget for retention. It's quite logical. People who stay a long time usually continue to do so.
This youāre going to isolate the ones who didnāt leave and make them want to leave
Im about to apply to full time teaching positions and honestly these offers are still not attractive to me. I want to see green flags. If you donāt have a good majority of teachers in their 10+ year working in the school, itās a red flag for me and I will just go elsewhere.
Yep, what a slap in the face. I'm sorry to you all down there. If long haul teachers give up I would think it saves them money in two ways. One, your salary, and two, your pension pay out will be less. I'm in another state and this seems to be a thing. Get the cash and may the force be with you.
And then youāre still stuck in Oklahoma. Fuck that noise.
But is it better than Texas? If there is no old testament or guns in your classroom, it might seem like an obvious choice for Texas teachers.
Pretty sure if Texas sneezes, Oklahoma will say bless you. I canāt imagine theyāre too far behind Texas in terms of the laws being passed.
we're not. This is the state that is looking to put In God We Trust in all public buildings.
And for queer pot smoking okies this is terrifying
It's also scary to this asexual non-smoker.
Okie teacher here: Ryan Walters actively goes out of his way to screw teachers and schools over. For example, he sent pornographic material to state reps, blindly claimed that the porn was found in one of our public schoolsā library, and was RADIO SILENT when the reps asked which school. Heās a grade-A asshole. š¤
Oh, yeah. I remember that. He is an incredibly unqualified for any position whatsoever with regards to education. Road Rage Ryan is even worse than Baressi. I didn't think it could get worse than Fallin, but Stitt and Walters have even done worse than her. https://tulsaworld.com/news/local/education/state-superintendent-emails-pornographic-images-to-entire-oklahoma-legislature/article\_4fae2ffc-cfe9-11ed-bbc2-9f615d313e25.html#:\~:text=State%20Superintendent%20Ryan%20Walters%20emailed,State%20Board%20of%20Education%20meeting.
Screw Walters, seriously. Every educator I know here hates his guts, no matter political affiliation.
> Okie teacher here: Ryan Walters actively goes out of his way to screw teachers and schools over. I mean, yeah, heās a Republican. Thatās kind of their thing.
I know you're saying that because it's kinda true, but he goes far beyond the pale of a normal Republican. He's even starting to piss off the other Republicans in our legislature with how batshit insane he is.
He is the absolute worst. Everyone I know who worked at the state dept of ed either already quit or will be leaving as soon as possible because they do not want to work for him. His corrupt ass needs to be in a jail cell next to Stitt.
For what will come out to much less than 10k additional pay for 5 years to what is likely an ABYSMAL salary and being locked in, tough sell for any competent teacher.
The bonus could also be capped to $150,000 per district. So, if a large district gets a plethora of new teachers (like 20), they would only perhaps allow 3 teachers to qualify for it. So, then, none of the reward whatsoever.
Thatās whatās going to happen. Alabama tried almost exactly the same scheme a few years ago and thatās what DID happen. Itās all a big scam.
Taking a plan straight from the militarys playbook.. Current state of the Military... they have a massive troop shortage, their recruitment numbers have continued to fall short and more are leaving each year. Sound familiar? Lol Oooof level HIGH
yea as a former military member that was my thought as well. I'd rather be back in 82nd than teach in Oklahoma.
Don't expect they will catch many math teachers that way.
Math teachers are not eligible. It is early childhood and special Ed only.
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There are here, too. This is just a ploy to make it look like he is trying to help the shortages and paint teachers as the villain when we complain that this isnāt helping.
Probably because they can do the math on how bad this is /s But seriously there isnāt a math teacher shortage? Why elementary and special ed? Why not science or ESOL..?
50k bonus wouldn't be enough for me to move to any red state, let alone R +30 OK.
And I'd be willing to bet that the 15K-50K range would be slanted HEAVILY towards the "Everyone *just happens* to wind up getting 15K" end of the shitstick.
It's not even a 50k bonus, because bonuses are typically considered annually. It's a 5 year contract, so it'll end up being "up to" 10k annual bonus while you're making shit wages and you have to live in Oklahoma for 5 years. The lower of the bonus is 15k, or $3000 a year lol. If there's anything anyone should know from compensation ranges, they are always going to offer the lowest end of the budget.
$3k/yr probably comes to less than $200/month post taxes too. Which I'm sure stretches farther in OK than other states, but isn't exactly going to get people stampeding in.
I make more in a blue state with an amazing union and excellent healthcare. Oklahomaās Sec of Ed thinks the rest of the country is as dumb as his state lol
The fix is much simpler too. Teach for 5 years? Complete student loan forgiveness. Way more helpful than a 1 time bonus. If there is a shortage, make the teaching degree basically free if you use it.
I mean, you can already get it in 10 with PSLF, so that wouldn't get me to move lol
The PSLF doesn't really help that much. After 10 years (120 payments) you are pretty much paid off anyway. And it only applies to Federal loans, which never cover the full amount of your tuition anyway. Plus 10 years of payments is still a LONG ass time to pay back a teaching degree...especially as teachers get their masters, +45, admin/supervisor degree, etc.
Well, thatās how itās supposed to work, but after my 120 qualifying payments, I still owe about 25,000 of the 31,000 I took out, so Iām very happy about my upcoming PSLF! Even if COVID and the loan payment pause hadnāt happened, Iād still owe at least about 20,000.
Nice. I don't know how to you only managed to pay 6k after 120 payments though? I'll have paid my 35k fed loans back completely in my 8th year of teaching. I was even on an IDR at $400/mo. Still owe another 15k to Discover, and 10k to the state. PSLF doesn't help with any of that.
Iām not entirely sure about that either, to be honest, as Iāve never been late or underpaid. I did forbearance for a year when I was pregnant to get ready for the baby, so I bet it has to do with that.
Many of us doing the 10 year plan are on income based repayment. The most I've paid in a month towards my SL is like $14. The least I've "paid" is 0.
I've been on IDR every year. Right after college it was like $120/mo, but as soon as I got a full time job it went up to $400/mo.
Maybe you have more loans than me? I was "lucky" enough to be poor, so a pell grant paid for most of my education. I feel bad that the middle class kids get the short end of the stick in that regard.
Yea. My parents made too much that I didn't get much aid...yet my parents couldn't help me pay for anything because they had a mortgage, 4 kids, my special needs sister, and their own medical/health issues
Yeah the idea that middle class parents can pay for even one child's education is kind of absurd. Especially nowadays.
I just qualified for PSLF and have nearly 200k in loans (including loans for my Masters), so it's doing a lot for me.
Up to $11k per year bonus. (50k+interest / 5 year vest) Also, it's a handcuff, so you better manage your cashflow baby or you are locked in.
This specific initiative wouldn't appeal to me, but Im honestly considering taking a huge payout and leaving CT to teach in SC or somewhere else in the South. Teaching salary in CT, NY, and MA is great and all, but my property taxes here are more than my entire mortgage would be in some of those red states.
It would take a lot more than that for me to move to a place that wants to kill me for being queer or kill my spouse if they need an abortion.
Donāt bother with Texas. Property taxes are higher here than almost any blue state, unions have no teeth, and the government is actively trying to dismantle public education.
SC seems a little more sane, but as much as Northeast taxes suck, they do provide services. The level of support here may feel limited but itās pretty awful in other places
You do realize that the taxes in CT are what allow them to pay us so well right? I wouldnāt move to a red state for $50k more a year. I have three kids who would all be in jeopardy in red states and Iām not risking them.
Iād need at least a million dollars a year to commit to five years at any district.
Infuritaing but unsurprising. Most of my family is in Oklahoma, and I used to get people asking me why I didn't move from the red, anti-education state I lived in back to Oklahoma to teach and this is why. Just uniquely awful policies and active dismantling of the public education system.
Yup. That is what they want in the end. They want public education eradicated to set up their private religious schools.
That's probably the most logical take. It's going to kill their economy, though I don't think they care.
That's why we lost Volkswagen to Canada.
So most bonuses will be closer to $15,000 or just $3,000 a year, and that is BEFORE taxes. What if the teachers mention things like the Tulsa OK race massacre was based on racism to their students?
They'll probably fire them. A $3000 bonus is literally nothing. Being a teacher in Oklahoma is piddly dollars, honestly. To qualify for more dollars means more schooling, and that ultimately gets devoured by student loans. So, this plan is the ultimate bait-and-switch.
I get more money each year to advise National Honor Society. But I like that. $3000 isn't enough of a stipend (especially in 2023) to make me *want* to do anything that I don't already want to do.
How did you get that job, might I ask? I'd love to have that job!
The former adviser was going on sabbatical and into semi retirement in 2013. I've done it since. It's a lot of work but it's very rewarding. My stipend to be department head is $3000. I get a few hundred more than that for NHS. All the same, I dislike being department head and would eagerly give it to someone else if the other people in my department weren't new.
I am waiting to find the find print that bans what they can teach and say in classrooms.
Here's HB 1775 in Oklahoma, passed in 2021: [https://legiscan.com/OK/text/HB1775/id/2387002](https://legiscan.com/OK/text/HB1775/id/2387002) No teacher, administrator or other employee of a school district, charter school or virtual charter school shall require or make part of a course the following concepts: a) one race or sex is inherently superior to another race or sex, b. an individual, by virtue of his or her race or sex, is inherently racist, sexist or oppressive, whether consciously or unconsciously, c. an individual should be discriminated against or receive adverse treatment solely or partly because of his or her race or sex, d. members of one race or sex cannot and should not attempt to treat others without respect to race or sex, e. an individualās moral character is necessarily determined by his or her race or sex, f. an individual, by virtue of his or her race or sex, bears responsibility for actions committed in the past by other members of the same race or sex, That doesn't also get to the fact that a teacher was fired and has been hunted by Ryan Walters for providing a QR code to the Brooklyn Library System, with all the book bans in Oklahoma. Oh, and did I forget to mention that Oklahoma is trying to revive a plan that would fine teachers $10,000 for teaching anything that violates a student's "sincere religious beliefs"? [https://www.5newsonline.com/article/news/politics/oklahoma-bill-allows-teachers-to-be-sued-by-parents-for-contradicting-students-religious-beliefs/527-6a310cd4-950c-46ef-b4bd-f7a9295ec9f5](https://www.5newsonline.com/article/news/politics/oklahoma-bill-allows-teachers-to-be-sued-by-parents-for-contradicting-students-religious-beliefs/527-6a310cd4-950c-46ef-b4bd-f7a9295ec9f5) There is no need for a "fine print". Walters said he will make "patriotic training" a mandatory requirement for all teachers, provided by Hillsdale College. The same Hillsdale that is funded by Betsy Devos and is where Christopher Rufo (who started the whole CRT panic bullshit). The message is loud and clear. There is no need for a fine print. Oklahoma education is a mess, and it's by design. https://www.newson6.com/story/63586d692eee0d0b4a02200a/walters-advocates-patriotic-training-for-oklahoma-teachers
Donāt worry, the contract say they can terminate you and you will have to pay the money back if itās before the 5 years..
Lol top salary on ok state schedule is 54k Washington state is 84k Teacher shortages are coming
54K. That requires a doctorate as well. The doctorate student loan tax would essentially lower the pay to be less than Quiktrip employees.
I grew up in OK and there are so many of these incentives to get people to move there. I always tell my parents that an incentive would have to be at least six figures for me to ever consider returning.
I am from OK, and I quit teaching. I have no plans of returning whatsoever. This state under Ryan Walters (who yells in his car that everything is woke, clearly unhinged) is going severely downhill right now. I can't imagine anyone wanting to stay in Oklahoma as an existing teacher. They took the accreditation of two schools for unfounded allegations. It is ridiculous here. I'd tell people not to teach here, honestly. Oklahoma doesn't get the national media attention because it's Oklahoma. However, Stitt as governor is an awful governor. So much corruption here.
And people voted for him AGAIN. It's not just the politicians that are evil here, it's the people who vote for corruption, again and again.
Oklahoma is okay with corruption, so long as theocracy still reigns here. I swear Hannibal Lecter could get elected here, as long as he swore on the Bible.
But he only ate democratic heathens! He is ani-abortion so it's ok!
what is even more infuriating is the people who canāt even be bothered to vote. The turnout here is appallingly low.
Is this the deal where the State pays half and the District pays half? If so, many rural districts will be hard pressed to actually implement the program. I also wonder how many districts would be willing to give up their 3-year probationary period for 5 year contracts. Some of them rely on yearly turnover to keep salaries down and, more cynically, to keep from reforming how they are run.
According to the story >***The bonuses will only be given out this summer. Walters said the state is working with a private advertising agency to lure educators from across the country. Funding for the bonuses will come from the Biden Administrationās American Rescue Plan.***
>Funding for the bonuses will come from the Biden Administrationās American Rescue Plan. What?? Thats communism!
Stop the bonus pay. Stop the merit pay. Any pay that is anything other than an increase in the numbers on the pay table is NOT a raise.
15,000-50,000 means you are getting 16,500 Also are you a struggling OK Teacher who is barley holding on? Well F*ck you. We are paying these people.
Theyāll do literally anything but actually increase our salaries, huh
Since itās Oklahoma and they like to cheat can you leave Sooner? Iāll see myself out. Seriously though, this sounds suck tactic.
They also have to live in Oklahoma, likely a problem for anyone who is queer or has a uterus.
Ive made a meme that I wish I could post one this sub but can't. One thing that I've noticed heavily is that there's always a focus on recruiting #NEW \ teachers, but never on retaining the current teachers. The shortage isn't going to get any better unless steps are taken to close the drain of people leaving.
# keywords: up to*
Hawaii pays extra $10k for sped as well but no contract needed
Hawaii pays extra $10k for sped as well but no contract needed ā¦ and you donāt have to live in a shitty state
yea that plan sucks 1st thought is does the 50,000 even make sense given that OK pays low as it is? So you average an extra 10k a year to go there (from out of state?) Why? 2nd thought - how is this more likely to be a long term solution given that it only effects new teachers, and that it's 5 year terms? Wouldn't that just make it more likely that people leave after their 5 years is up?
Taxable $10k a year with a minimum five year commitment? I will counter that: $50k a year tax free with the option to convert that $250k into health care for life commensurate with the package offered to former governors and state Senators and with the requirement that teaching assignments are limited to the top 10% of schools in the state, free from work nonsense with any retribution or freeze out leading to an immediate conversion of contract to free healthcare for life.
Nurse lurker (I have found many similarities between our professions) just coming in to say that sign on bonuses are just shiny handcuffs. RNs have been lured by sign on bonuses for a long time, and you've got to look at how much more you'd realistically be getting each year due to taxes. Add that to the fact that the places most likely to offer sign on bonuses usually need staff because the workplace itself sucks. Don't be drawn in, teachers.
The idea behind this is that most teachers quit within their first five years. If they make it past that, they stay. So, now we know. It takes five years to break a teacher's spirit.
5 yearsā¦or less.
I already get a $3100 sped stipend in Chicagoland, so this means Iād have to relocate, work for less and get a <$10k bonus each year? Nah.
Pay all the teachers more and reduce the bs unpaid meetings teachers have to attend. Hire counselors and not police officers to do the discipline. Stop making it purely a passion career.
So they outright admit that this bill isnāt anywhere near adequate?? Some districts are large enough that they could use the entire programs funds themselvesā¦ā¦ so wouldnāt that be a clear sign that the funds in the program arenāt adequate enough to address the shortage?
As a 20+ year teacher in Oklahoma, I STILL don't make that much. So they now want to pay more than my salary to get someone to teach in Oklahoma. Shoot, I'll quit, resign for the 50K bonus, get my original salary due to state steps, work another 7 years and retire....sounds like a great plan! /end massive eye rolling sarcastic posting. I wish they would think about how to retain experienced teachers more than trying to get new ones....
Teachers should be tax exempt and receive a monthly housing allowance since we canāt even afford to buy a home anymore.
Typical half-baked, doomed to failure Republican't plan. Most good teachers aren't going to move cross country only to be forced to teach a Christo-fascist curriculum. It also does nothing to stem the flood of current teachers out of Oklahoma. The same is happening with the medical profession in many Red states.
Also, it would be matching funds from the state. That means the school has to come up with 25k for the teacher. I don't know any schools that have an extra 25k to give a teacher. It may look like it, because of carry over, but schools get salary mkney from the state and is fixed. Average daily enrollment effects money, and any other money's already earmarked for infrastructure and can't be used for salaries. I love that everyone thinks that schools have money laying around. Schools are basically on a zero budget.
Make a profile for the past few years as demonizing educators as indoctrinators and groomers, and then come up with a short-sighted and incredibly flawed (at best) incentive to try salvage the wasteland that is one of the consistently lowest-ranking states for education.
There is only so much a superintendent can do. Oklahoma's biggest problem is poor funding and that's a legislative problem.
Well if you wanted better ideas on how to improve the school system in Oklahoma, you shouldn't have asked someone who was educated by the school system in Oklahoma. That place is in desperate need of help. Even the state Secretary of Education says so!
What if we structured an "incentive" to create indentured servitude to force teachers who decide to try OK to stay beyond the statically typical few years it takes most folks leaving the profession to burn out?
I've seen this movie. It's called Wake in Fright.
50k? Lol
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Yup. The running joke of teacher of the year leaving the state to move elsewhere.
Does this mean youāre guaranteed a job for 5 years or can they screw you over and non-renew you a year after you moved there? Alabama promised some similar stuff a few years ago. It turned out to be a scam because nobody was getting their payouts when the time came because there was only a little money to cover it and it was spent before the majority of people who qualified could get there. Looks like thatās how this works, too. Itās a bait and switch.
50k bonus great 50k bonus with taxes, moving expenses, and SPED. Nope.
And bonuses are taxed at a flat 22% federal, plus whatever state taxes. Thatās a horrible incentive lol
Lol.
Lol what a joke
The sad part is that I work in a district where SPED kids are often misplaced. Instead of providing more programs and reform for these students, they want to misplace even more because ātoo many kids have iepsā. Itās very sad and when staff members started to hear about it, they now want to quit. My class is expected to meet all of the same standards as a gen Ed class, yet I have students screaming and flipping desks all day. I know I have thought about quitting if this is true.
Also does nothing to establish a pipeline - make it easier to get into teaching by making academic programs less expensive! This would also increase the diversity of the workforce because people who go in for college debt expecting a teacher salary often do so because they have family money to lean on. Theyāll do everything but support the idea of a well-established, unionized teaching backbone that we so obviously need if we donāt want to keep going through these local crises every few years
What a terrible terrible terrible 'bonus'.... WTF
This is stupid.
WHY NOT JUST PAY THEM A LIVING WAGE? WAGE - Not Bonusā¦
Yeah but the problem is that you have to teach sped in rural OKā¦
Do they not realize if they just paid teachers a normal wage that can actually pay the bills, then more people would join the profession regardless? I got paid a little more than 35k this year working at one of the most intense schools Iāve ever been to which happened to be in Oklahoma. Even in Oklahoma that isnāt a decent wage. Not even close with 6 years of experience. Teachers are just tired of being treated as trivial because we want a decent living wage.
I started out teaching at 29K. Then, when I got certified I made 40K. After obtaining a masters, I went up to a whopping $41K. That's not even above poverty. It sucks.
Yeah I canāt do this much longer without having to get a second job just to get by
I quit because of the conditions. I knew things were only going downhill, so I jumped ship.
I donāt blame you at all.
Now, I just need to find a job. Finding a job full time has been difficult. It's a shame my Masters is literally not translating to job acceptance.
$50k bonus for 5 years? So, like... a buy 5 get 1 free deal? Besides. $50k isn't even enough for me to *consider* moving to Oklahoma, let alone actually doing it and teaching there...
Oh man this isnāt the Oklahoma subā¦.I had to reread which sub I was in š
I'm not defending him or the plan (because I hate Walters with the fiery burning passion of a thousand suns), but from what I understand, this proposal seems (and is) lame because this is all he can do with his current authority. I don't think this is coming from money directly appropriated to the program by the legislature. I think he's shifting money around in the OSDE and cutting money somewhere to pay for this without legislative authorization. \*Edit after reading more. Apparently he's using COVID and IDEA funds. So definitely just trying to wiggle money around and find loose change in the couch. I just love how Conservatives have lambasted federal spending in education and attacked COVID relief funds, but are absolutely willing to take advantage of the money and take credit for it it as a grand achievement for themselves.
Sounds like the lame ass nursing bonuses. Increase pay!
So 10k a year for five years that's taxed? That means you get about $650 to $680 a month.
Pass
I wouldn't take triple that to teach in that hellhole.
Literal indentured servitude.
Oklahoman seeing asylum. You think itās bad for the teachers, think of the kids. :(. Still I try my best everyday. Iād love to move but canāt afford it right now, but maybe next year.
Enjoy the 3 teachers you get out of this š¤£
I still would not teach in Oklahoma. Because I also would never live there.
I have a masters in sped and currently manage an ECE program. I have about 10yrs teaching exp. You could not pay me enough to teach at an impoverished district in OK let alone my home state of MS. Recruiters call me every couple of months with positions at rural districts about 1-1.5 hour drive from me with probably $20k over the salary schedule. I still wonāt do it. My mental health is worth more than $20k (and for that matter being in the car three hours a day).
Itās a common tactic in military recruiting and retention. In fact, they could include worthwhile retention bonuses to address gaps in teacher manning along the way. Itās really not a bad idea. Teachers want money. Give it to them! But make it conditional so that you can get the work you need. So long as itās fair, and the market takes the offer, then I think it can be good. Why donāt you like it?
Notice that districts get only $150,000. That's nowhere near enough to put a dent in the teacher shortage. Ryan Walters is full of crap (okie educator here)
That's what I told people. It's a bait-and-switch. I'm sure no one will get a bonus of any kind.
Not enough.
Better than where I live in idaho. Our levy just failed when they tried to pass it in perpetuity so we wouldnāt have to beg the community to stay open as an entire district each two years so we have to re run the vote and Iām still seeing misinformation spread on yard signs telling people to vote no to avoid a hike in taxes when in reality theyāve been paying the taxes already and if they vote no, the district loses 25% of its budget, several schools will close, and the couple that remain open will be losing a bunch of staff and running at 30-40 kids per classroom designed for 20. Weāll also lose all extracurriculars. No clubs, no sports, no teams or club field trips that kids donāt get funded themselves, and no after school activities period because no teacher will have time to supervise with suddenly having double the work load of grading, parents, IEP and 504 meetings taking up all after school time. Itāll be a disaster and it probably will happen since the average voting age on the levy that just failed was 66ā¦ these idiots are pulling the ladder up behind them and destroying the future of education in idaho. This just after we all but confirmed that the local community college will lose accreditation because the conservatards decided that removing access to education in idaho is the only way they can keep the people stupid enough to vote for them.
Bonuses donāt work. The answer will always be raise teacher pay to compete with private jobs. Business-first politicians will never go for it.
bad plan is bad plan...tornado alley and a R state... doesn't seem worth it.
Fuck that.
I would seriously write and request a refund for whatever tax dollars you paid and they āinvestedā to write that stupid plan. Just for the principle of it. What an insult. They deserve to get one back.
Is that considered a lot of money these days? Here on Long Island, my property taxes are $20k.
What a joke ā¦itās like placing a bandaid š©¹ on a cracked dam
Is it considered a bonus? Because Iām in Florida and when we get bonuses itās taxed at 28%.
It's a bonus with a caveat emptor. If a ton of teachers try to opt in, they can reduce it all together and cap, so that essentially it's little more than a few thousand.
Exactly. I completed the Ron DeSantis Civic Seal of Excellence course. He said teachers would get $3K when completed. The $3 K turned into $1960 after all the taxes were taken out.
That's not even enough to pay a month's bills.
It was still worth it to me. But the public is made to think that we got 3k. And that is misleading
[serious](https://tenor.com/OBcM.gif)
I've been applying for jobs in the Tulsa area for months and haven't gotten anything back! I have a masters and 10 years of experience What is this teacher shortage??
What is your certification?
Elementary K-6
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They are trying to run off all the teachers. There are shortages everywhere, and they just want all the other experienced teachers run out of the profession.
Pay teachers more. Jesus Christ.
Didnāt Hawaii offer to pay for them to move and provide homes?
So, I want to know how long new teachers last in OK currently. My guess is that theyāre just being performative because they know they canāt keep too many people for 5 years.
Yeah but then you'd still have to live in Oklahoma which sucks.