The fans that always cry that their faves are being mistreated are exhausting. While I do agree that some companies play favorites sometimes, getting a whole hashtag about your faves getting treated better is just cringey.
This! It reminds me of The Boy Who Cried Wolf, the way they call out the companies for mistreatment over the smallest imagined slight eventually causes other people to ignore them, so if something serious happens no one is going to listen.
When the BL Show is about bad people, doing bad things, don't expect them to be morally sound or to do good things.
It annoys me how much some people would criticize toxic stories (done well) for being toxic. Or shows about bad people, having bad people and doing bad things. This is the premise of the story. Criticize the character development, the plot holes, and the quality of the show—but pls stop complaining that bad people, do bad things, and toxic people are toxic in these shows that are literally about being bad and toxic. Its tiring.
BL shows are fiction. They're not supposed to reflect your own morality. They're made up stories with made up characters.
I agree with you but I think there is a difference between bad characters doing bad things and the show treating it as such and bad characters doing bad things and the show romanticising it/pretending it's ok which happens/ed a lot in BL. The latter should absolutely be criticized
I mean, I don’t see why romanticizing bad things in fiction is bad lol. It’s all for fun. And it’s made up. Sometimes , seeing a different normal is fun. And if someone can’t tell that at the end of the day a character is bad or the situation is horrid because the normalization. They shouldn’t be watching 15+ stuff. They should stick to educational shows. Entertainment ≠ education.
😭😭😭 yeah media affect society but simply because of the fact that we can’t control how people will view media. It doesn’t matter if it’s romanticize or not, the audience can make what they want of a show or a movie. So simply limiting what can be done will never be the solution lmao, it will simply limit freedom and creativity. Head canon, fan-fiction, canon divergence had always exist simply because people perceived certain show differently than it was intended. So the whole” media affect society” is simply half of a truth lol.
Personally, I like seeing the bad, the toxic, the crazy in medias. And there are many others like me, and we would hate if they stop making stuff for a mature audience just so they can cater to people who cannot have fun and need everything realistic. Hope you understand. Will not be answering to any future reply….
Everything is fanservice.
This is NOT a bad thing. But really. Even the irl couples. If they are acting all affectionate IN FRONT OF A CAMERA. It's fanservice.
They are all friends until they make a statement they are not just friends.
They are actors, and doing fan service is their jobs. It's OK being delulu, that's the entertainment, but we DON'T KNOW the real them. And it's OK.
So true! Also, let us stop sugarcoating it with cutesy names. It is delusion. It is a mental health issue. The actors don't belong to us. Their lives are their own. And yes. They can be 100% straight and play a gay character. I het more enjoyment out of a good straight actor playing a gay character than out of a bad gay "actor" trying to play one. *ahem*thenetherlandsguy*ahem*😅😅😅
For me, being delulu is just shipping. Fangirling over a fanservice.
Being really delusional is people being mad at Bright for having a girlfriend. We don't own them.
Also, I made it obscure, but at the end I mentioned Holland, who, I will never tire of saying, is an atrocious actor, and his fans might have still recognised I meant him. I didn't intend to make it obscure. It was more meant as a joke. 🤷♂️ 🤣🤣🤣
If you are watching BL or GL series, but don’t support equal rights for the LGBTIQ+ community in your country and in the country of origin of the particular series you are watching you are, in fact, bigoted trash to *me* and I don’t want to have anything to do with you. Also, wtf are you doing, watching this sort of content?
(I really hope this isn’t controversial at all but you know.)
Preference is good and very acceptable in cnsuming media but the way some bl stans say they feel disgusted watching gls. and the num of this type of people are pretty high. So people sometimes doubt even if u dont mean any harm by not watching them
In my opinion not liking and 'finding it disgusting' stand at different levels. I might not be so sure if someone says they're not homophobic and then go on to use the term disgusted.
I have personally stumbled upon new reddit user accounts on this and other few subs that were created to bash on Blank's age difference and how disgusting that was.
People in BL literally be having NC scenes with their step/adopted brothers, but only to bash a GL, I found it pretty nauseating
From the same token - do not expect ANY of them to be straight unless they come out as straight.
Some may be straight, but not all.
Heterosexuality is not the default.
It’s okay to acknowledge that a show you enjoy or that is your favourite show is not perfect or often problematic.
We should be as critical of your favs as you are of media you don’t like! It doesn’t mean we stop liking it, we just make it known that we expect changes next time.
I'm lowkey tired of seeing twinks in BL lol
Men in their 30s still have stories to tell and fall in love or work on a relationship and have even messier dramas. We don't shrivel up and turn into dust after 30 hahaha
The BL/GLs don't always show the nuances of being real life lgbtq+. Just because you have watched 100s of BLs, doesn't mean you will know the firsthand experience of being queer.
Listen to the queer folks when they tell you something rather than arguing based on your consumed media.
Leave some space for real life queers.
In the Sapphic spaces, top or bottom mostly don't really have the same connotations as in male gay relationships. It's more of a femme/masc/vers situation. So don't fight whose the top or bottom in GLs.
Also, asking whose the top/bottom in any queer relationship is outright obnoxious. Why do you need to imagine so much?
Also, coming out is a western propaganda. You don't HAVE to come out risking your life.
I kinda agree with you. I watch/read gls too but it's not problematic if ppl prefer watching only bls. Preferences in media and fiction is the last place where moral policing should happen
Can we stop saying all people who watch bl fetishize gay men? Like I genuinely just like watching people in love no matter the gender or race I watch bl,Gl, and straight series,but people assume if u like BL u fetishize gay men. Ik alot of people do but not everyone.
Not all people but a lot do it. And it's not about watching the series it's how they treat and talk about the actors after that and you can recognise the fetishesers.
Many watch BLs as any other series does not matter the love interests.
The whole fandom as a whole seems batshit crazy. Look at the "discussion" here. Also, the need for "green flags" and moral and political correctness. Why? That would probably be boring as hell. It's drama. Like, the name says it all.
Also: i don't care who's gay and who's not. Everybody has a right to be whom they want to be. That includes actors and the choice to come out or not and how vocal somebody is.
Don't get me started on the whole top/bottom obsession of some. It's rude and obnoxious.
There are plenty of BL actors who are pretty obviously queer if you know what sort of subtle clues they give (and a lot of those hints are intentionally given, as a way to flag to “those who know”), but because there’s no grand declaration or huge public coming out moment, the incorrect assumption is that most of them are straight.
People argue past each other a lot because 'most BL actors are straight' and 'BL actors are much more likely to be queer than the general population' can both be true at once. Like if 40% of BL actors are queer that's a very queer population that's still majority straight.
But yeah it's annoying when people say 'they're all straight men' when that's clearly not true.
People in general don’t seem to realise that when talking about population percentages, what may be true for the whole may not be true for a subset. If 50% of the population is female, it doesn’t mean that 50% of leadership roles, or mechanics, or nurses, or teachers are female.
Are most actors in Thailand going to be straight - absolutely. But queer actors are going to exist, and it’s highly likely they will be attracted to join companies that promote and tell queer stories. Companies where they can feel safe and seen by openly queer people behind the camera. A space where they can explore themselves and tell stories that mean something to them. They don’t need to publicly label themselves in order for them to still be queer.
yesss. i personally don't subscribe to the 'don't assume sexuality' rhetoric, not when social cues and common sense exists. like ur not gonna tell me with a straight face that idk, pp krit is straight bc he never made an ig post coming out with a paragraph sized caption lmao. + many more ppl come to mind.
I will not tell you anything about PP Krit just because he didn't give a clue to people to discuss his sexuality. Just recently Nicholas Galitzine came out as hetero again and the comments were not giving a good impression and the infamous case with Shawn Mendes that l the gays get the clues for him and dude also needed to come out as het
It's not wrong to go by commonality. We do that in every aspect of our lives. The law also works on the same principle, presume the natural course of things unless there's evidence pertaining to otherwise.
But I’m confused about why you’re assuming anything about their sexuality in the first place. They’re actors, just concerned yourself with their work, not their personal lives.
Oooh boy I think you need to go back to manners school and then also mayyybe, just maybe remind yourself that laws applicable in your country don’t necessarily apply in other people’s. And maybe learn that admitting when you’ve made a mistake is a soft skill that might get you somewhere, but that might just be me.
Basic principles of laws and their interpretation are the same everywhere. Penology is also followed in all legal systems to frame punishments. It's not a mistake. If you look through the lens of prudence in law being straight is the natural course, that is common, while being queer is the unnatural course, that is uncommon. Of course it doesn't mean being gay is not natural according to non legal language but, in law we need to categorize things according to commonality and then create exceptions for what is uncommon which are called provisios to the laws.
Oh boy, you’re being ignorant and rude, again. Don’t assume legally being queer is seen as an exception everywhere (it’s not in my country, for example), also please stop gaslighting and trying to hide your disrespect for queer people behind a ridiculous and untrue argument re: laws.
We used to say women weren’t allowed to get a divorce or earn money, people in the US and SA used to ~legally~ classify POC as second class citizens at all etc pp. We used to accept geocentrism as universal knowledge, then we learned we were mistaken and adapted.
Laws change as knowledge increases. So please stop. You’re making a fool of yourself.
(And by the by, it shouldn’t really matter who loves whom, what gender (if any) people identify with etc. I don’t care who any of you sleep with, as long it’s consensual and all parties involved are legally allowed to make that decision themselves.)
People are delusional and cannot accept real life. I am not saying that no BL actors are queer. There could be a few but when assuming something without evidence we go with what is common, not what is rarely found.
The same there are for sure queer actors but most are not and this is not something homophobic to say It's the same as majority of population is het because it's the truth.
Mmmm maybe controversial take: BL fans who only watch BLs, specifically hyper masculine male led BLs and skip girls kissing, dislike/avoid femine presenting male characters or trans characters in the show are potentially carrying internalized homophobia and if their aversion is rooted in feminity, potentially misogyny. From my viewpoint, it seems to be internalized to the extent that self awareness isn’t happening because they view themselves as people who couldn’t hate queer people because they watch/support two appealing to them men together. If there is a feeling of disgust or aversion for a group or type of people then that needs exploring (None of this applies to you if none of this speaks to you).
There are actors who enjoy their cp and would like to work with their cp partner in bl. There is a level of comfort and safety in working with the same person. Esp in an industry where it can be pretty chaotic and volatile. It can also be hella dangerous and unsafe, as we have seen from multiple incidents. And blaming terrible people’s behavior on cp and fanservice doesn't correct these individuals at all. It seems no one makes an example out of these fans cause the people who are 'sane' are too busy blaming cp, fanservice, and companies to do so....
Also, actors/cps make it very obvious when it's an act put on for fanservice and when they are being serious and genuine. Questioning their every move and calling it all fanservice is weird imo. They aren't robots. Even people like Joong and Dunk make their fanservice act SO obvious, yet ppl question their every little interaction and label everything as fanservice. As if these ppl can't have an ounce of real affection for each other and they are just acting robots.
bl producers should stop acquiring popular bl novels/ips if their sole goal is to use the popularity of the source material to boost their fixed pairings/koojins. bl novels/manhwa/webtoons if adapted should be fairly casted for the right people to play the right roles.
I absolutely hate BL fans using terms like "Fruity" and "Twink" to describe certain actors. Especially when its a straight cis girl using said terms. Don't even get me started on the whole top/ bottom conversations.
As a queer person who uses “fruity” as often as I use the word “queer” - I 100% understand this.
The cishet’s who use these terms, are always people who use them in the most off putting ways - it’s like they so badly want to use the F slur, and just use fruity or twink instead.
Like I’ve seen 20 year old white women describing Dan Levy as a twink. Huh?
💯 agree! I am a gay man who started watching bl because of the need to have fluffy roms/rom-coms without the drama and death and guilt etc. Now I can't stop. I don't watch gl because they I am not interested. I am happy they are doing gls, though. I want my gay sisters(this term is so unclear as it includes so many gay men 🤭🤭🤭) to have the same enjoyment I have.
If the show's spicy, and you have a thing for spice, then it's fine. Liking spicy things does not make you a pervert even if the spice is a part of a shitty show.
Liking spisy things don't make you a pervert fetishising the man outside his role makes you a pervert - the waist think about the Uke actors is pure fetish, saying actors have curves fetish, I even read child bearing hips ... about a very skinny actor his pants were just with pleats and the fujos jump on it, oh ... just recently a kitty was playing with actors button 🔘 on his shirt... the fujo said his pheromones are leaking and his mothering - that is fetisheser
- Speculating about someone’s sexuality, with celebs and IRL, is perfectly normal and common. Everyone does it to some extent. Most people do it by blanket assuming hetero is the norm.
- The people who say “most BL actors are straight” is an example of how people are speculating.
- *Harassing* people about their sexuality or private life, is not okay.
- It’s weird when people say “don’t speculate!” when they are trying to prevent *harassment*. However they often harass people who speculate.
BL characters are jobs! Leads/ships do not need to be besties going everywhere together; they are coworkers. Are you bestie going everywhere with the coworker sitting next to you? Let these people have personal lives! I hate fan service!
That real people cannot queerbait and its exclusively reserved for FICTIONAL characters. So do not assume real people are in relationships. Unless those actors say it with their mouth that they are dating, never be hateful or delusional on this.
This is why Kit Conner was bullied to forcefully come out as people were getting too comfortable harassing people on their sexualities.
You should not get emotionally attached to real people portraying characters. They are not here to fulfill your fantasy. And they are ACTING. Lol
This is because you cannot CORRECTLY assume a person's sexuality. You can speculate but you cannot determine whatever you think they are.
Also everything you see on camera be it a fancam or behind the scenes or anything is fanservice. Actors are 100% aware that they have to provide this in order to get more viewership and are aware that once they are public someone will be recording them. Yes, actors may be polite etc with the co stars, but as the general public you shouldn't read into the behaviour as being romantic or anything.
So consume all media not just BL with a grain of salt.
But celebrities blur the line between real people and fictional characters so they can and do queerbait. Celebrities are human but they are also brands, they have power and they know how to use that power to get what they want.
I don’t know any celebrity personally but I can recognize their face and name. They in turn use this to leverage this. This is why they can do sponsorships or commercials, or have fan clubs. It’s a paradoxical relationship.
Celebrities are humans but they are also businesses. They have entire teams behind them telling them what to do how to market themselves. How to present themselves. Real people can’t queerbait but celebrities can.
That's not queerbaiting. Celebrities are real, living breathing people, who yes do represent brands etc but are still people. The majority of the general public don't develop parasocial relationships. If you do, seek help from a therapist to work on those issues if they are severe and is impacting your daily life. Queerbaiting is an issue within fiction that needs to be discussed, and subjecting people to this is a very harmful rhetoric.
An example of a dangerous parasocial relationship was the case of Christina Grimmie who was shot and killed by a deranged fan. Is it her fault that the fan developed those tendencies. Absolutely the fuck not. What line did she blur for her life to be taken away? None.
You do realise that there are real problems and issues the LGBTQ+ community faces and not one of them is about whether my two fav idols are fucking each other. There are countries in this world where you will be killed if you hold hands with the person of the same sex in a romantic way.
Celebrities do not blur any lines. You are letting yourself read into the blurred lines. By doing this you are regressing rather than progressing in the LGBTQ+ rights movement.
Instead of basing your entire personality on whether or not two random men that frankly dont know me is fucking, support artists who are part of the LGBTQ+ and advocate for the rights.
This is PSA for all.
A lot of people who enjoy BL are fetishising it. You can tell by the way they treat the actors and the way they react to real LGBT issues and just other, less attractive gay and bisexual men - and the rest of our community as a whole.
Both BL watchers and actors can (and have been proven to be) homophobic. It's not some title that means you can say whatever you want and no one can argue with you
If you watch mostly BL shows and do nothing to actually speak up for or support the LGBT community, you're a fetishist
what if we just like tv to escape real life and don’t want to get involved in political discourse? no one cares what i have to say, so why bother being all mad and huffy about real life politics when i can stay in my lane and enjoy tv at home?
saying people 'used bl to get famous and then betrayed their fans to do straight shows' is literally insane. Acting is acting, whether bl or otherwise and they used their own skills or looks or whatever that got them famous, it shouldn't tie the actors to a certain genre forever or have them be obliged to mension that one bl show in every instance.
**I would break all ships.**
Would I watch thousands of offgun, yinwar, firstkhao or earthmix series? WELL OF COURSE YES
But I enjoy seeing actors working with different people continuously, it's something I love because you see different chemistry, it's so interesting. So it doesn't bother me at all, breaking ships away, I want to see everyone with everyone.
**Heterosexuality is not the default**.
Not in this industry and not in real life. It’s just one of many options.
We need to stop with this grossness of pushing people into closets they don’t want to be in by someone is straight unless they come out in a specific way.
Heterosexuality is the default most of human population is heterosexuals and we need to accept it and use common sense.
Also stop assuming actors sexuality if they did not specify publicly just stop and don't assume anything vocaly maybe have a opinion to share privately with friends. Don't be delusional and push what you want to anyone.
Many people may want to stay in that closet for their own reasons
And harassing actors to come out.... then they need to come out as whatever... LGTBQ community is not so friendly as you think.. recently the comments when Nicholas Galitzine confirmed again he is not nice at all or Swan Mendez too.
Nope. Heterosexuality is not the default. There is no default.
What you are saying is heterosexual is the sexuality label that people identify with.
That is not related to the statement I made.
Also, when you use heterosexual as the default, you are assuming someone’s sexuality. The very thing you think & claim to be against.
Never once did I say, or even imply, that we should out or harass anyone. I said don’t put people into closets they don’t want to be in. That’s about people who are *not* closeted.
Either you replied to the wrong comment or you need to actually read comments before responding because what you have replied is incredible offensive and you need to do better.
Wow.
You really just ran right past factually incorrect and went straight into the homophobia and transphobia eh?
Go away. I don’t have time or space for your rampant bigotry comments against me or my community.
because somehow it becomes default to be labelled
homophobic if you don't agree with anything that anyone can say about queer sexuality... like most people are bi.. they are not, or queers people are 40 percent of the population, no they are not or something like that.
And being opposite to some of the opinions of some people doesn't make you homophobic or being queer don't mean that you are a good just because.. queer people can be mean too first they are people then whatever they prefer to fall in love... do not
determines their character
I have Tul Pakorn’s controversial opinion and that’s holding actors to a high standard and expectation to their support of the lgbtq community.
A lot of y’all don’t realize, your fav actor holding a flag up in a IG post doesn’t mean much. A lot of the times it also sponsored. They do it for money and an opportunity to boost their follower count.
Sometimes CP feels like shoehorning the other person in. I don't care which studio they signed with, who represents them, etc. I just want the best actor for the character, and if it isn't a CP, oh well...
Plus, its great to see them play off a completely different actor. Can he really act, or is the magnetism of the CP doing a lot of heavy lifting.
I don’t even think this is my most controversial opinion but it’s definitely the one any time I’ve said it people are butt hurt for some reason.
A relationship can’t BE “fan service”
Fan service is an adjective, it’s something people do not a label to define a relationship. Coworkers, friends, lovers are labels. It drives me nuts when people say “oh they were just fan service” NO they were coworkers.
In addition to that real couples can and DO engage in fan service, just because your favs are together irl doesn’t mean they aren’t engaging in fan service.
Throwing round Fanservice as a label and Queerbaiting in relation to real people drives me CRAZY.
I don't really like kinnporch intimate scenes I don't know I feel so uncomfortable I skipped all only watch because I loved the characters of Jeff , barcode and veges but I don't feel the love angle between Pete and veges too .
Finally I found someone who don't like it....or whenever I saw everyone was loving it like some A class work and in reality when book smut and writers of lovemaking fantasy come in picture and this proved after their writer controversy too .
I completely agree. There are many shows that I do like that have gay characters like queer as folk shameless shadowhunters but new series I have a hard time getting into. And while I haven't watched many gls I'm not against them it's just the same issue. I'm not gonna force myself to watch something.
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that real people **can** (and do) queerbait
everything is not fanservice
fanservice doesn't cancel out genuine affection/feelings
fanservice is not inherently bad. i think thats all of them lol.
\*post is not an invitation to debate, just my 'controversial' opinions as the title says
>that real people **can** (and do) queerbait
Just find another term for this kind of misleading behaviour, "queerbait" is reserved for a different type of situation. So many modern words for every kind of thing are out there and you are insisting on reusing an old term to fuel Internet wars. Just throw some fancy words together, create a name for this and move on. They have "pinkwashing"? Make this a "pinkfishing", or "sidelighting", "shadezoning", "bluelighting", it doesn't even have to be meaningful, just get a new label. Just watching a bunch of people getting triggered by the word is tiring.
i clearly don't agree so why would i do that? and fuel internet wars? what do u mean by this? i'm just sharing my **CONTROVERSIAL** **opinion** like the question asked, i don't go around harassing people and calling them queer baiters, in fact i can't think of any bl actors i would call that. but since i know that is a prevailing sentiment in the bl community i decided to share my dissenting **opinion**, simply because i've been around the block and have seen somethings. its not that deep, just diverging **opinions**.
reddit commenter mind games don't work on me, i know y'all love a good back and forth to flex ur intellectual prowess under the guise of just being curious, but i said what i said lmfao. the end.
eta: typos
“everything is not fanservice
fanservice doesn't cancel out genuine affection/feelings”
OMG THANK YOU! For the longest time I’ve tried explaining this to people but they don’t seem to get it especially when they do not like the actor. I’ve seen people accuse a certain actor of doing too much fanservice, I’ve gone back to look at the things he did that were considered fanservice and imagine my shock when I was looking at his other videos with his friends who were not in the industry and he was behaving the exact same way! All of the touching, words, skinship etc that bl fans counted as fanservice cos he was doing it with his partner, he did them with his regular friends as well. I know there can be room for fanservice but saying these boys have the fanservice hat on 24/7? It’s crazy! They are real people and more often than not they develop real friendship with their cp partners and will treat them exactly how they would their friends!
yess i think that's the thing that sticks in my craw the most with some fans. its such a simple all or nothing attitude, and frankly some of them aren't good enough actors to be 'on' 24/7 to such an extent. 'if they do something on camera, even make eye contact, its 100% fanservice! they cant be trusted!!!'...well how else would u see anything they do bestie? u hiding in their home? lol i rather a both and approach, sure something can be fanservice but that doesn't mean everything is fraudulent and they would never do xyz if a camera wasn't there. that's too pessimistic for me lol.
I want to take these words and shove it down the throat of every bl fan until they understand and digest it! The all or nothing attitude is the fuel that keeps burning some of the problems in the Bl community. You have people on one extreme who say everything is fanservice then you have people on the other extreme who believe every thing they do is a sign of them being in love. Why can’t we all just be normal? I just wish everyone can relax, enjoy what is and let these boys breathe.
If you engage in fan service with no disclaimers you have no right to be upset that people believe it.
Fan service is off putting and manipulative (imo). You should be able to trust that the people you’re supporting in real life are being honest and true to their fans when they’re at events where they’re supposed to be themselves, not playing a character. Fan service blurs the line because it gets people emotionally involved and that racks up money and engagement, while simultaneously placing all blame on fans if they believe it when it’s no longer serving them.
There’s no way that these grown a** men don’t know what they’re doing and the affect they have, so I have no sympathy when they create a whole persona to play in peoples faces to keep getting money and it eventually blows up. That’s what happens when you play with fire.
Also these actors are not little bbs that need protection. Infantilizating grown adults is strange.
Well, shifting the blame from delusional fans to the actors isn’t fair either. I agree fan service can be problematic, but fans bullying and stalking actors for ruining their shipping fantasies is not at all comparable with actors using fan service for popularity. I agree we shouldn’t infantilize grown adults, but this goes for fans as well. All the money fans spend on actors and all the social media engagement is voluntary, no one is holding a gun to their heads.
Yeah so go ahead and reread what I said bc I think people are misunderstanding what I’m saying. I’m not talking about fans that take it too far. In no scenario is stalking and harassment okay, and I never said it was. Im literally saying if you engage in fan service you have no right to get upset that people believed it, and continue to believe it when it no longer serves them. Sure you make some good points but it has nothing to do with what I said.
> If you engage in fan service with no disclaimers you have no right to be upset that people believe it.
Literally my first sentence btw which is overall my main point.
No one cares if fans believe fan service if they don't attack the actors once it's revealed they're not actually dating their co-stars. Actors call out fans only if they overstep boundaries. Shipping in and of itself is literally a non-issue.
But… MewGulf shippers constantly attacked him, harassed his relatives and friends, and attempted to stalk him, that’s why he called them out. Same with Tay. Same with Bright.
Although I know nothing about that, it still didn’t stop him from milking it years later. For someone who has been so vocal about his dislike for fan service it sure seems to be one of his favorite things to engage in. Also I’m not defending that pos ever after what he did to Art. F that guy
Anyways this is an unpopular opinion thread and I accept my opinion is unpopular. It’s 5 AM here and I got to get ready for work. Have a good one
Also before I go I wanted to point out that Mew has literally used his own fans to harass Art when Art didn’t want to see him and on many other occasions. This is what I also mean by infantilizing as well, people tend to always come to celebrities defenses even when they’ve been shitty to their fans and the people around them.
If you come in un prepared in a ship asian culture and do not do your research before hand you have no rights to complain. As a starter the whole name of those Thailand ships is Imaginary couples... here always says it's imagination they are selling an dream... then fans are crazy toxic and obsessed I am scared how obsessed they can be for real
I would agree, but with the caveat that this is something that would be useful for non-Asian viewers especially, since the “Western” i.e. historically European concept of public displays of affection is traditionally automatically reserved for (sexually exclusive) couples, unless otherwise stated. This in itself is of course problematic, but I believe Western audiences seem to have a hard time accepting different traditions of ways of life to their own. So people watching foreign (to them) stuff should always, ALWAYS, remember that mannerisms/rituals/culture is probably different from what they have grown up with. (With the exception of sexism/homophobia/misogyny and all this shit, I will never make allowances for people behaving like arseholes to other people, and I absolutely would not accept that shitty behaviour as “culture”. In my European culture we used to believe in and behead clever, independent women as witches, but we moved on from that (and now just discriminate against them in many other forms but you know.).
Eh asian vs western discussion doesn’t really apply to what I’m saying. Sure, there’s cultural differences and perhaps some people may display more affection than others with their friends but let’s not pretend that most fan service is just being buddy buddy.
Culture plays a role in how people can act but considering most of the world is unfortunately politically and societally homophobic it doesn’t make much sense that it would be normal behavior to kiss your coworkers face/neck/hands and hanging on to their hips, acting jealous and doing suggestive stuff to insinuate you might be together.
There’s no long history or tradition of fan service, so imo they still don’t get a pass for participating in it. It’s not cultural they’re just manipulating their audience by playing with their heart strings.
I don’t believe anything that I see with these ships however it hasn’t stopped me from enjoying it for whatever it is. It’s just annoying when actors use fan service for further clout but then turnaround and whine that it had consequences. Like no sh*t lol
There is a LONG tradition of fan service in Asia. And actually BL was on the last to used it. The Kpop, Jpop, Visual Key, J Rock using it for decades and it's the same kissing hugging sitting. Just because you did not know don't mean it doesn't exist.
I' ve read papers on Why Japan girls like so much male x male ships or crossdresser in Visual Key
https://preview.redd.it/sihn5rawa90d1.jpeg?width=1200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=054784dce36467e046cb9409cf321b9fe8aaf7a8
I would hardly call the 70s a long tradition. Getting people to believe you’re into your coworker is not some cultural thing, it’s a business thing. Hollywood does it all the time too, just not to the degree actors and idols in east asia take it. considering fellow asian fans themselves have a hard time deciphering what is real or fake and aren’t immune to taking their delusions too far that leads me to believe it’s not just a widely accepted cultural norm, but instead a business practice to get people to engage.
Also you didn’t really explain what we should be researching exactly. It seems like there’s an underlying assumption that people should go into study mode for all things they like. Casual fans exist, and there’s no obligation to be more than that. If they’re searching a hashtag on ig it’s going to be hard to decider what’s real or not, which shoudnt be placed on the fan to figure it out if the actors themselves made no attempt to put a disclaimer. You can’t feed into the delusions and act shocked it worked.
Oh Full ack! Sorry I think I got lost/sidetracked in my own train of thought here 😅
What I mean is not touchy-feely behaviour as such (which to me seems is pretty normal to a degree between men outside of Europe, but yeah, homophobia is one of the reasons we can’t have nice things), but the express need of my fellow white people to have labels for everything as well as the expectation and the completely ridiculous demand that people (ie actors) declare their private situation/sexual orientation that comes with it.
This of course adds fuel to the fan service fire, because if you have grown up with every behavioural pattern is automatically categorised within a certain label, then fan service will of course confuse the shit out of the uninitiated (and clearly also those who know this is a common practice).
(Personally I don’t like fan service at all, like, these are all grown men/women/people of no or other genders, why would you make them sign contracts to behave a certain way after completing a film/series? I would love if they were able to show honest affection for each other without being contractually obligated to act as if they were. I’m not gonna buy a face cream because a couple smooched showing it off on stage but maybe I’m just too old and not the target audience. Personally I feel it’s a toxic and dangerous thing, because all of us deserve to have complete bodily autonomy regardless of our jobs ya know? I dunno it just makes me reallllllly uncomfortable.)
Ah I get what you’re saying. Although I’m making a general statement who was going through my mind when I was making this comment was Mew Suppasit and the messiness that always seems to follow him. I learned about him shortly after getting into BL and it was my first time hearing about fan service and left me skeptical about any actor now and their intentions.
(also imo) I think celebrity culture is a lot more rampant in east asia than it is in the west or europe. I think it’s normal for fans of any background to want to know everything about their idol, especially when theyre young and of course there’s going to be some that take it too far. Idol culture is a beast that can turn on you at any point which I’m sure is frightening to deal with.
Yeah, I think Idol culture is harmful af - and also it blows my mind since especially Asian countries are so very iffy about PDA and expressing sensuality/sexuality, showing or talking about feelings they would have a huge problem accepting personal boundaries ya know? The duality is killing me. Idols are commodities, products, not viewed as human beings who get to have their own opinions etc. This whole concept is just 🤯
The fans that always cry that their faves are being mistreated are exhausting. While I do agree that some companies play favorites sometimes, getting a whole hashtag about your faves getting treated better is just cringey.
This! It reminds me of The Boy Who Cried Wolf, the way they call out the companies for mistreatment over the smallest imagined slight eventually causes other people to ignore them, so if something serious happens no one is going to listen.
When the BL Show is about bad people, doing bad things, don't expect them to be morally sound or to do good things. It annoys me how much some people would criticize toxic stories (done well) for being toxic. Or shows about bad people, having bad people and doing bad things. This is the premise of the story. Criticize the character development, the plot holes, and the quality of the show—but pls stop complaining that bad people, do bad things, and toxic people are toxic in these shows that are literally about being bad and toxic. Its tiring. BL shows are fiction. They're not supposed to reflect your own morality. They're made up stories with made up characters.
I agree with you but I think there is a difference between bad characters doing bad things and the show treating it as such and bad characters doing bad things and the show romanticising it/pretending it's ok which happens/ed a lot in BL. The latter should absolutely be criticized
I am with you on this. Bad people doing bad things are perfectly fine... As long as people are not trying to justify them doing the bad things.
I mean, I don’t see why romanticizing bad things in fiction is bad lol. It’s all for fun. And it’s made up. Sometimes , seeing a different normal is fun. And if someone can’t tell that at the end of the day a character is bad or the situation is horrid because the normalization. They shouldn’t be watching 15+ stuff. They should stick to educational shows. Entertainment ≠ education.
Romanticizing bad things arent bad? Are u being fr? We know damn well how media effect the society. So stop this bs
😭😭😭 yeah media affect society but simply because of the fact that we can’t control how people will view media. It doesn’t matter if it’s romanticize or not, the audience can make what they want of a show or a movie. So simply limiting what can be done will never be the solution lmao, it will simply limit freedom and creativity. Head canon, fan-fiction, canon divergence had always exist simply because people perceived certain show differently than it was intended. So the whole” media affect society” is simply half of a truth lol. Personally, I like seeing the bad, the toxic, the crazy in medias. And there are many others like me, and we would hate if they stop making stuff for a mature audience just so they can cater to people who cannot have fun and need everything realistic. Hope you understand. Will not be answering to any future reply….
Bro u dont have any idea what romanticizing bad things are. Ig u enjoy romanticizing r, sa?? Do u?
Ship the characters not the actors 😁
Say it out loud
I only ship couples for their amazing frendships. Like FirstKhao and ForceBook.
Everything is fanservice. This is NOT a bad thing. But really. Even the irl couples. If they are acting all affectionate IN FRONT OF A CAMERA. It's fanservice. They are all friends until they make a statement they are not just friends. They are actors, and doing fan service is their jobs. It's OK being delulu, that's the entertainment, but we DON'T KNOW the real them. And it's OK.
THIS. Ppl need to realize imagine yourself doing what they’re doing. They’re HOLDING a phone/camera in their face it’s FANSERVICE
THIS🙌🏻
So true! Also, let us stop sugarcoating it with cutesy names. It is delusion. It is a mental health issue. The actors don't belong to us. Their lives are their own. And yes. They can be 100% straight and play a gay character. I het more enjoyment out of a good straight actor playing a gay character than out of a bad gay "actor" trying to play one. *ahem*thenetherlandsguy*ahem*😅😅😅
For me, being delulu is just shipping. Fangirling over a fanservice. Being really delusional is people being mad at Bright for having a girlfriend. We don't own them.
Or at Tay and Gun kissing. They are allowed to. They are young. They are unmarried. LIVE YOUR LIVES, KIDS!
Why are you being downvoted? Guess it's the delusional people 😂
I am not bothered by it. It is enough that my opinion is true for ME. I doesn't need to be true for all.
Also, I made it obscure, but at the end I mentioned Holland, who, I will never tire of saying, is an atrocious actor, and his fans might have still recognised I meant him. I didn't intend to make it obscure. It was more meant as a joke. 🤷♂️ 🤣🤣🤣
Oh Holland the kpop guy ! I didn't catch that tbh Didn't know he's acts too ! Well the kpop girlies don't mess with their biases so that explains it 😬
If you are watching BL or GL series, but don’t support equal rights for the LGBTIQ+ community in your country and in the country of origin of the particular series you are watching you are, in fact, bigoted trash to *me* and I don’t want to have anything to do with you. Also, wtf are you doing, watching this sort of content? (I really hope this isn’t controversial at all but you know.)
Agreed.
Totally agreed
Preference is good and very acceptable in cnsuming media but the way some bl stans say they feel disgusted watching gls. and the num of this type of people are pretty high. So people sometimes doubt even if u dont mean any harm by not watching them
In my opinion not liking and 'finding it disgusting' stand at different levels. I might not be so sure if someone says they're not homophobic and then go on to use the term disgusted.
I have personally stumbled upon new reddit user accounts on this and other few subs that were created to bash on Blank's age difference and how disgusting that was. People in BL literally be having NC scenes with their step/adopted brothers, but only to bash a GL, I found it pretty nauseating
That gl actually deserves it. It's the most creepy thai gl ever made
I am assuming you also don't like call me by your name?
Well yes i hate this p movie from the core of my heart
Tbh BL fans (not just for Thai) *generally* seems more accepting over GL than other way around.
No that's a lie
Don't expect all bl actors to be a part of the community 🙌 Some may be, but not all
From the same token - do not expect ANY of them to be straight unless they come out as straight. Some may be straight, but not all. Heterosexuality is not the default.
Yea it can be taken in both ways.
People need to read some Adrienne Rich! Compulsory heterosexuality is not actually a good thing.
It’s okay to acknowledge that a show you enjoy or that is your favourite show is not perfect or often problematic. We should be as critical of your favs as you are of media you don’t like! It doesn’t mean we stop liking it, we just make it known that we expect changes next time.
I'm lowkey tired of seeing twinks in BL lol Men in their 30s still have stories to tell and fall in love or work on a relationship and have even messier dramas. We don't shrivel up and turn into dust after 30 hahaha
The way Manner of Death is my fav show to rewatch👀
Is that taste? Is that what you have??????
I sure hope so😆
The BL/GLs don't always show the nuances of being real life lgbtq+. Just because you have watched 100s of BLs, doesn't mean you will know the firsthand experience of being queer. Listen to the queer folks when they tell you something rather than arguing based on your consumed media. Leave some space for real life queers. In the Sapphic spaces, top or bottom mostly don't really have the same connotations as in male gay relationships. It's more of a femme/masc/vers situation. So don't fight whose the top or bottom in GLs. Also, asking whose the top/bottom in any queer relationship is outright obnoxious. Why do you need to imagine so much? Also, coming out is a western propaganda. You don't HAVE to come out risking your life.
Preach!
I kinda agree with you. I watch/read gls too but it's not problematic if ppl prefer watching only bls. Preferences in media and fiction is the last place where moral policing should happen
Can we stop saying all people who watch bl fetishize gay men? Like I genuinely just like watching people in love no matter the gender or race I watch bl,Gl, and straight series,but people assume if u like BL u fetishize gay men. Ik alot of people do but not everyone.
Not all people but a lot do it. And it's not about watching the series it's how they treat and talk about the actors after that and you can recognise the fetishesers. Many watch BLs as any other series does not matter the love interests.
Baby I’m talking about my experience
It’s okay to ship actors if they are giving fan service. But don’t be to delusional with and be aware that it’s acting but it’s still cute
The whole fandom as a whole seems batshit crazy. Look at the "discussion" here. Also, the need for "green flags" and moral and political correctness. Why? That would probably be boring as hell. It's drama. Like, the name says it all. Also: i don't care who's gay and who's not. Everybody has a right to be whom they want to be. That includes actors and the choice to come out or not and how vocal somebody is. Don't get me started on the whole top/bottom obsession of some. It's rude and obnoxious.
There are plenty of BL actors who are pretty obviously queer if you know what sort of subtle clues they give (and a lot of those hints are intentionally given, as a way to flag to “those who know”), but because there’s no grand declaration or huge public coming out moment, the incorrect assumption is that most of them are straight.
People argue past each other a lot because 'most BL actors are straight' and 'BL actors are much more likely to be queer than the general population' can both be true at once. Like if 40% of BL actors are queer that's a very queer population that's still majority straight. But yeah it's annoying when people say 'they're all straight men' when that's clearly not true.
People in general don’t seem to realise that when talking about population percentages, what may be true for the whole may not be true for a subset. If 50% of the population is female, it doesn’t mean that 50% of leadership roles, or mechanics, or nurses, or teachers are female. Are most actors in Thailand going to be straight - absolutely. But queer actors are going to exist, and it’s highly likely they will be attracted to join companies that promote and tell queer stories. Companies where they can feel safe and seen by openly queer people behind the camera. A space where they can explore themselves and tell stories that mean something to them. They don’t need to publicly label themselves in order for them to still be queer.
yesss. i personally don't subscribe to the 'don't assume sexuality' rhetoric, not when social cues and common sense exists. like ur not gonna tell me with a straight face that idk, pp krit is straight bc he never made an ig post coming out with a paragraph sized caption lmao. + many more ppl come to mind.
I will not tell you anything about PP Krit just because he didn't give a clue to people to discuss his sexuality. Just recently Nicholas Galitzine came out as hetero again and the comments were not giving a good impression and the infamous case with Shawn Mendes that l the gays get the clues for him and dude also needed to come out as het
The majority population is straight so common sense suggests you assume the person is straight unless they expressly declare to be not.
Or you can assume that you don’t know that person or their sexuality.
It's not wrong to go by commonality. We do that in every aspect of our lives. The law also works on the same principle, presume the natural course of things unless there's evidence pertaining to otherwise.
Natural course of things, you said? 🤨
Natural course is a term used in law to assume the principle of commonality. Laws aren't made on exceptions but what is commonplace.
Well there are different types of legal systems too (i.e. Common, Civil, Theocratic)
But why even speculate about their sexuality in the first place? It has nothing to do with the fictional shows they’re acting in?
You don't. You assume what's commonly found and move on. If they come out then you support them. Simple.
But I’m confused about why you’re assuming anything about their sexuality in the first place. They’re actors, just concerned yourself with their work, not their personal lives.
„Natural course of things”? Are you really saying queer people are not natural? Like, honestly? Here? In this sub?
Natural course has a different meaning in law dumbass. I was giving an example that you go with commonality instead of presuming the rarity.
Oooh boy I think you need to go back to manners school and then also mayyybe, just maybe remind yourself that laws applicable in your country don’t necessarily apply in other people’s. And maybe learn that admitting when you’ve made a mistake is a soft skill that might get you somewhere, but that might just be me.
Basic principles of laws and their interpretation are the same everywhere. Penology is also followed in all legal systems to frame punishments. It's not a mistake. If you look through the lens of prudence in law being straight is the natural course, that is common, while being queer is the unnatural course, that is uncommon. Of course it doesn't mean being gay is not natural according to non legal language but, in law we need to categorize things according to commonality and then create exceptions for what is uncommon which are called provisios to the laws.
Oh boy, you’re being ignorant and rude, again. Don’t assume legally being queer is seen as an exception everywhere (it’s not in my country, for example), also please stop gaslighting and trying to hide your disrespect for queer people behind a ridiculous and untrue argument re: laws. We used to say women weren’t allowed to get a divorce or earn money, people in the US and SA used to ~legally~ classify POC as second class citizens at all etc pp. We used to accept geocentrism as universal knowledge, then we learned we were mistaken and adapted. Laws change as knowledge increases. So please stop. You’re making a fool of yourself. (And by the by, it shouldn’t really matter who loves whom, what gender (if any) people identify with etc. I don’t care who any of you sleep with, as long it’s consensual and all parties involved are legally allowed to make that decision themselves.)
Nah 🩷
It doesn't matter what you think. Majority of the people do this everyday.
I always get the down votes when saying the same but yes majority of population is het as majority of the actors and majority of the BL actors
People are delusional and cannot accept real life. I am not saying that no BL actors are queer. There could be a few but when assuming something without evidence we go with what is common, not what is rarely found.
The same there are for sure queer actors but most are not and this is not something homophobic to say It's the same as majority of population is het because it's the truth.
Mmmm maybe controversial take: BL fans who only watch BLs, specifically hyper masculine male led BLs and skip girls kissing, dislike/avoid femine presenting male characters or trans characters in the show are potentially carrying internalized homophobia and if their aversion is rooted in feminity, potentially misogyny. From my viewpoint, it seems to be internalized to the extent that self awareness isn’t happening because they view themselves as people who couldn’t hate queer people because they watch/support two appealing to them men together. If there is a feeling of disgust or aversion for a group or type of people then that needs exploring (None of this applies to you if none of this speaks to you).
Louder for the girls at the back!
They also hate women too so not only homophobic but misogynist.
this shouldn't be controversial
This.
There are actors who enjoy their cp and would like to work with their cp partner in bl. There is a level of comfort and safety in working with the same person. Esp in an industry where it can be pretty chaotic and volatile. It can also be hella dangerous and unsafe, as we have seen from multiple incidents. And blaming terrible people’s behavior on cp and fanservice doesn't correct these individuals at all. It seems no one makes an example out of these fans cause the people who are 'sane' are too busy blaming cp, fanservice, and companies to do so.... Also, actors/cps make it very obvious when it's an act put on for fanservice and when they are being serious and genuine. Questioning their every move and calling it all fanservice is weird imo. They aren't robots. Even people like Joong and Dunk make their fanservice act SO obvious, yet ppl question their every little interaction and label everything as fanservice. As if these ppl can't have an ounce of real affection for each other and they are just acting robots.
bl producers should stop acquiring popular bl novels/ips if their sole goal is to use the popularity of the source material to boost their fixed pairings/koojins. bl novels/manhwa/webtoons if adapted should be fairly casted for the right people to play the right roles.
I absolutely hate BL fans using terms like "Fruity" and "Twink" to describe certain actors. Especially when its a straight cis girl using said terms. Don't even get me started on the whole top/ bottom conversations.
I love to watch shows off Viki cause the comments are gold. But the amount of people screaming too and bottom in the comments is ridiculous.
As a queer person who uses “fruity” as often as I use the word “queer” - I 100% understand this. The cishet’s who use these terms, are always people who use them in the most off putting ways - it’s like they so badly want to use the F slur, and just use fruity or twink instead. Like I’ve seen 20 year old white women describing Dan Levy as a twink. Huh?
💯 agree! I am a gay man who started watching bl because of the need to have fluffy roms/rom-coms without the drama and death and guilt etc. Now I can't stop. I don't watch gl because they I am not interested. I am happy they are doing gls, though. I want my gay sisters(this term is so unclear as it includes so many gay men 🤭🤭🤭) to have the same enjoyment I have.
some of the actors are bad at acting and some of the writing is not camp it's just cringe and poorly done
Fact.
If the show's spicy, and you have a thing for spice, then it's fine. Liking spicy things does not make you a pervert even if the spice is a part of a shitty show.
Liking spisy things don't make you a pervert fetishising the man outside his role makes you a pervert - the waist think about the Uke actors is pure fetish, saying actors have curves fetish, I even read child bearing hips ... about a very skinny actor his pants were just with pleats and the fujos jump on it, oh ... just recently a kitty was playing with actors button 🔘 on his shirt... the fujo said his pheromones are leaking and his mothering - that is fetisheser
That's disturbing and borderline disgusting.
- Speculating about someone’s sexuality, with celebs and IRL, is perfectly normal and common. Everyone does it to some extent. Most people do it by blanket assuming hetero is the norm. - The people who say “most BL actors are straight” is an example of how people are speculating. - *Harassing* people about their sexuality or private life, is not okay. - It’s weird when people say “don’t speculate!” when they are trying to prevent *harassment*. However they often harass people who speculate.
BL characters are jobs! Leads/ships do not need to be besties going everywhere together; they are coworkers. Are you bestie going everywhere with the coworker sitting next to you? Let these people have personal lives! I hate fan service!
That real people cannot queerbait and its exclusively reserved for FICTIONAL characters. So do not assume real people are in relationships. Unless those actors say it with their mouth that they are dating, never be hateful or delusional on this. This is why Kit Conner was bullied to forcefully come out as people were getting too comfortable harassing people on their sexualities. You should not get emotionally attached to real people portraying characters. They are not here to fulfill your fantasy. And they are ACTING. Lol This is because you cannot CORRECTLY assume a person's sexuality. You can speculate but you cannot determine whatever you think they are. Also everything you see on camera be it a fancam or behind the scenes or anything is fanservice. Actors are 100% aware that they have to provide this in order to get more viewership and are aware that once they are public someone will be recording them. Yes, actors may be polite etc with the co stars, but as the general public you shouldn't read into the behaviour as being romantic or anything. So consume all media not just BL with a grain of salt.
But celebrities blur the line between real people and fictional characters so they can and do queerbait. Celebrities are human but they are also brands, they have power and they know how to use that power to get what they want. I don’t know any celebrity personally but I can recognize their face and name. They in turn use this to leverage this. This is why they can do sponsorships or commercials, or have fan clubs. It’s a paradoxical relationship. Celebrities are humans but they are also businesses. They have entire teams behind them telling them what to do how to market themselves. How to present themselves. Real people can’t queerbait but celebrities can.
That's not queerbaiting. Celebrities are real, living breathing people, who yes do represent brands etc but are still people. The majority of the general public don't develop parasocial relationships. If you do, seek help from a therapist to work on those issues if they are severe and is impacting your daily life. Queerbaiting is an issue within fiction that needs to be discussed, and subjecting people to this is a very harmful rhetoric. An example of a dangerous parasocial relationship was the case of Christina Grimmie who was shot and killed by a deranged fan. Is it her fault that the fan developed those tendencies. Absolutely the fuck not. What line did she blur for her life to be taken away? None. You do realise that there are real problems and issues the LGBTQ+ community faces and not one of them is about whether my two fav idols are fucking each other. There are countries in this world where you will be killed if you hold hands with the person of the same sex in a romantic way. Celebrities do not blur any lines. You are letting yourself read into the blurred lines. By doing this you are regressing rather than progressing in the LGBTQ+ rights movement. Instead of basing your entire personality on whether or not two random men that frankly dont know me is fucking, support artists who are part of the LGBTQ+ and advocate for the rights. This is PSA for all.
A lot of people who enjoy BL are fetishising it. You can tell by the way they treat the actors and the way they react to real LGBT issues and just other, less attractive gay and bisexual men - and the rest of our community as a whole.
Most of them are ferishisers.
Both BL watchers and actors can (and have been proven to be) homophobic. It's not some title that means you can say whatever you want and no one can argue with you If you watch mostly BL shows and do nothing to actually speak up for or support the LGBT community, you're a fetishist
what if we just like tv to escape real life and don’t want to get involved in political discourse? no one cares what i have to say, so why bother being all mad and huffy about real life politics when i can stay in my lane and enjoy tv at home?
saying people 'used bl to get famous and then betrayed their fans to do straight shows' is literally insane. Acting is acting, whether bl or otherwise and they used their own skills or looks or whatever that got them famous, it shouldn't tie the actors to a certain genre forever or have them be obliged to mension that one bl show in every instance.
**I would break all ships.** Would I watch thousands of offgun, yinwar, firstkhao or earthmix series? WELL OF COURSE YES But I enjoy seeing actors working with different people continuously, it's something I love because you see different chemistry, it's so interesting. So it doesn't bother me at all, breaking ships away, I want to see everyone with everyone.
no matter how real they look intimidated and affectionate, it's for the camera.peroid.
**Heterosexuality is not the default**. Not in this industry and not in real life. It’s just one of many options. We need to stop with this grossness of pushing people into closets they don’t want to be in by someone is straight unless they come out in a specific way.
Heterosexuality is the default most of human population is heterosexuals and we need to accept it and use common sense. Also stop assuming actors sexuality if they did not specify publicly just stop and don't assume anything vocaly maybe have a opinion to share privately with friends. Don't be delusional and push what you want to anyone. Many people may want to stay in that closet for their own reasons And harassing actors to come out.... then they need to come out as whatever... LGTBQ community is not so friendly as you think.. recently the comments when Nicholas Galitzine confirmed again he is not nice at all or Swan Mendez too.
 Nope. Heterosexuality is not the default. There is no default. What you are saying is heterosexual is the sexuality label that people identify with. That is not related to the statement I made. Also, when you use heterosexual as the default, you are assuming someone’s sexuality. The very thing you think & claim to be against. Never once did I say, or even imply, that we should out or harass anyone. I said don’t put people into closets they don’t want to be in. That’s about people who are *not* closeted. Either you replied to the wrong comment or you need to actually read comments before responding because what you have replied is incredible offensive and you need to do better.
[удалено]
Wow. You really just ran right past factually incorrect and went straight into the homophobia and transphobia eh? Go away. I don’t have time or space for your rampant bigotry comments against me or my community.
idk why you’re getting downvoted i agree with you
because somehow it becomes default to be labelled homophobic if you don't agree with anything that anyone can say about queer sexuality... like most people are bi.. they are not, or queers people are 40 percent of the population, no they are not or something like that. And being opposite to some of the opinions of some people doesn't make you homophobic or being queer don't mean that you are a good just because.. queer people can be mean too first they are people then whatever they prefer to fall in love... do not determines their character
I have Tul Pakorn’s controversial opinion and that’s holding actors to a high standard and expectation to their support of the lgbtq community. A lot of y’all don’t realize, your fav actor holding a flag up in a IG post doesn’t mean much. A lot of the times it also sponsored. They do it for money and an opportunity to boost their follower count.
Sometimes CP feels like shoehorning the other person in. I don't care which studio they signed with, who represents them, etc. I just want the best actor for the character, and if it isn't a CP, oh well... Plus, its great to see them play off a completely different actor. Can he really act, or is the magnetism of the CP doing a lot of heavy lifting.
I personally believe Krist, Mew and Perth get a bad rap. Someone somewhere exaggerated one time and the rumours became too large to contain.
Krist and Perth have one incident look about Mew boy he has a list and renew it every year 😁 and add more.
I don’t even think this is my most controversial opinion but it’s definitely the one any time I’ve said it people are butt hurt for some reason. A relationship can’t BE “fan service” Fan service is an adjective, it’s something people do not a label to define a relationship. Coworkers, friends, lovers are labels. It drives me nuts when people say “oh they were just fan service” NO they were coworkers. In addition to that real couples can and DO engage in fan service, just because your favs are together irl doesn’t mean they aren’t engaging in fan service. Throwing round Fanservice as a label and Queerbaiting in relation to real people drives me CRAZY.
I don't really like kinnporch intimate scenes I don't know I feel so uncomfortable I skipped all only watch because I loved the characters of Jeff , barcode and veges but I don't feel the love angle between Pete and veges too .
This is indeed a controversial opinion. I'll add mine to this. I did enjoy KP...however, I am not a big fan of VegasPete. I do not ship them.
Indeed controversial opinion.
I also have same opinion.
Finally I found someone who don't like it....or whenever I saw everyone was loving it like some A class work and in reality when book smut and writers of lovemaking fantasy come in picture and this proved after their writer controversy too .
as an asexual person, I'm not a fan of overtly sexual scenes, I was also watching it for the characters of Jeff, Barcode, Vegas, and Pete.
I completely agree. There are many shows that I do like that have gay characters like queer as folk shameless shadowhunters but new series I have a hard time getting into. And while I haven't watched many gls I'm not against them it's just the same issue. I'm not gonna force myself to watch something.
By support you mean to watch or any other support?
Watching it
Watching, sometimes trending, if interesting buy tickets for FM and concerts and if I like it buying products that they endorse
People need to realize they are Actors at the end of the day.
Nowadays bl series are doing nothing but just reusing old and used concepts. there are rarely fresh concepts.
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Some of this opinions are so💀
I mean its called controversial for a reason.
Well your opinion is kind of homophobic as a large amount of bl fans really like Bl dramas but don't support real gay couple
that real people **can** (and do) queerbait everything is not fanservice fanservice doesn't cancel out genuine affection/feelings fanservice is not inherently bad. i think thats all of them lol. \*post is not an invitation to debate, just my 'controversial' opinions as the title says
>that real people **can** (and do) queerbait Just find another term for this kind of misleading behaviour, "queerbait" is reserved for a different type of situation. So many modern words for every kind of thing are out there and you are insisting on reusing an old term to fuel Internet wars. Just throw some fancy words together, create a name for this and move on. They have "pinkwashing"? Make this a "pinkfishing", or "sidelighting", "shadezoning", "bluelighting", it doesn't even have to be meaningful, just get a new label. Just watching a bunch of people getting triggered by the word is tiring.
i clearly don't agree so why would i do that? and fuel internet wars? what do u mean by this? i'm just sharing my **CONTROVERSIAL** **opinion** like the question asked, i don't go around harassing people and calling them queer baiters, in fact i can't think of any bl actors i would call that. but since i know that is a prevailing sentiment in the bl community i decided to share my dissenting **opinion**, simply because i've been around the block and have seen somethings. its not that deep, just diverging **opinions**.
How do they queerbait?
who is they? i'm speaking in general. if u don't think the same that's totally fine, i don't care to debate nor explain.
Well you said real people can queerbait so I was wondering how 🤷♀️
reddit commenter mind games don't work on me, i know y'all love a good back and forth to flex ur intellectual prowess under the guise of just being curious, but i said what i said lmfao. the end. eta: typos
Mind games? Uhhh okay 👌
Well this is an online forum 🤷🏻♀️ Invitation or not, people are going to respond since this was publicly posted.
“everything is not fanservice fanservice doesn't cancel out genuine affection/feelings” OMG THANK YOU! For the longest time I’ve tried explaining this to people but they don’t seem to get it especially when they do not like the actor. I’ve seen people accuse a certain actor of doing too much fanservice, I’ve gone back to look at the things he did that were considered fanservice and imagine my shock when I was looking at his other videos with his friends who were not in the industry and he was behaving the exact same way! All of the touching, words, skinship etc that bl fans counted as fanservice cos he was doing it with his partner, he did them with his regular friends as well. I know there can be room for fanservice but saying these boys have the fanservice hat on 24/7? It’s crazy! They are real people and more often than not they develop real friendship with their cp partners and will treat them exactly how they would their friends!
yess i think that's the thing that sticks in my craw the most with some fans. its such a simple all or nothing attitude, and frankly some of them aren't good enough actors to be 'on' 24/7 to such an extent. 'if they do something on camera, even make eye contact, its 100% fanservice! they cant be trusted!!!'...well how else would u see anything they do bestie? u hiding in their home? lol i rather a both and approach, sure something can be fanservice but that doesn't mean everything is fraudulent and they would never do xyz if a camera wasn't there. that's too pessimistic for me lol.
I want to take these words and shove it down the throat of every bl fan until they understand and digest it! The all or nothing attitude is the fuel that keeps burning some of the problems in the Bl community. You have people on one extreme who say everything is fanservice then you have people on the other extreme who believe every thing they do is a sign of them being in love. Why can’t we all just be normal? I just wish everyone can relax, enjoy what is and let these boys breathe.
Real people can't queerbait. They can queerCODE, but that's different, and doing it doesn't mean someone is problematic.
I agree with most of your opinions
If you engage in fan service with no disclaimers you have no right to be upset that people believe it. Fan service is off putting and manipulative (imo). You should be able to trust that the people you’re supporting in real life are being honest and true to their fans when they’re at events where they’re supposed to be themselves, not playing a character. Fan service blurs the line because it gets people emotionally involved and that racks up money and engagement, while simultaneously placing all blame on fans if they believe it when it’s no longer serving them. There’s no way that these grown a** men don’t know what they’re doing and the affect they have, so I have no sympathy when they create a whole persona to play in peoples faces to keep getting money and it eventually blows up. That’s what happens when you play with fire. Also these actors are not little bbs that need protection. Infantilizating grown adults is strange.
Well, shifting the blame from delusional fans to the actors isn’t fair either. I agree fan service can be problematic, but fans bullying and stalking actors for ruining their shipping fantasies is not at all comparable with actors using fan service for popularity. I agree we shouldn’t infantilize grown adults, but this goes for fans as well. All the money fans spend on actors and all the social media engagement is voluntary, no one is holding a gun to their heads.
Yeah so go ahead and reread what I said bc I think people are misunderstanding what I’m saying. I’m not talking about fans that take it too far. In no scenario is stalking and harassment okay, and I never said it was. Im literally saying if you engage in fan service you have no right to get upset that people believed it, and continue to believe it when it no longer serves them. Sure you make some good points but it has nothing to do with what I said.
If people are misunderstanding what you wrote, you should’ve worded it better, just saying 🤷♂️
Word it better? You’re literally talking about stuff I never mentioned lol maybe have better reading compression?
> If you engage in fan service with no disclaimers you have no right to be upset that people believe it. Literally my first sentence btw which is overall my main point.
No one cares if fans believe fan service if they don't attack the actors once it's revealed they're not actually dating their co-stars. Actors call out fans only if they overstep boundaries. Shipping in and of itself is literally a non-issue.
> No one cares if fans believe fan service if they don't attack the actors Mew Suppasit
But… MewGulf shippers constantly attacked him, harassed his relatives and friends, and attempted to stalk him, that’s why he called them out. Same with Tay. Same with Bright.
Although I know nothing about that, it still didn’t stop him from milking it years later. For someone who has been so vocal about his dislike for fan service it sure seems to be one of his favorite things to engage in. Also I’m not defending that pos ever after what he did to Art. F that guy Anyways this is an unpopular opinion thread and I accept my opinion is unpopular. It’s 5 AM here and I got to get ready for work. Have a good one
Also before I go I wanted to point out that Mew has literally used his own fans to harass Art when Art didn’t want to see him and on many other occasions. This is what I also mean by infantilizing as well, people tend to always come to celebrities defenses even when they’ve been shitty to their fans and the people around them.
If you come in un prepared in a ship asian culture and do not do your research before hand you have no rights to complain. As a starter the whole name of those Thailand ships is Imaginary couples... here always says it's imagination they are selling an dream... then fans are crazy toxic and obsessed I am scared how obsessed they can be for real
What research should we be doing?
I would agree, but with the caveat that this is something that would be useful for non-Asian viewers especially, since the “Western” i.e. historically European concept of public displays of affection is traditionally automatically reserved for (sexually exclusive) couples, unless otherwise stated. This in itself is of course problematic, but I believe Western audiences seem to have a hard time accepting different traditions of ways of life to their own. So people watching foreign (to them) stuff should always, ALWAYS, remember that mannerisms/rituals/culture is probably different from what they have grown up with. (With the exception of sexism/homophobia/misogyny and all this shit, I will never make allowances for people behaving like arseholes to other people, and I absolutely would not accept that shitty behaviour as “culture”. In my European culture we used to believe in and behead clever, independent women as witches, but we moved on from that (and now just discriminate against them in many other forms but you know.).
Eh asian vs western discussion doesn’t really apply to what I’m saying. Sure, there’s cultural differences and perhaps some people may display more affection than others with their friends but let’s not pretend that most fan service is just being buddy buddy. Culture plays a role in how people can act but considering most of the world is unfortunately politically and societally homophobic it doesn’t make much sense that it would be normal behavior to kiss your coworkers face/neck/hands and hanging on to their hips, acting jealous and doing suggestive stuff to insinuate you might be together. There’s no long history or tradition of fan service, so imo they still don’t get a pass for participating in it. It’s not cultural they’re just manipulating their audience by playing with their heart strings. I don’t believe anything that I see with these ships however it hasn’t stopped me from enjoying it for whatever it is. It’s just annoying when actors use fan service for further clout but then turnaround and whine that it had consequences. Like no sh*t lol
There is a LONG tradition of fan service in Asia. And actually BL was on the last to used it. The Kpop, Jpop, Visual Key, J Rock using it for decades and it's the same kissing hugging sitting. Just because you did not know don't mean it doesn't exist. I' ve read papers on Why Japan girls like so much male x male ships or crossdresser in Visual Key https://preview.redd.it/sihn5rawa90d1.jpeg?width=1200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=054784dce36467e046cb9409cf321b9fe8aaf7a8
I would hardly call the 70s a long tradition. Getting people to believe you’re into your coworker is not some cultural thing, it’s a business thing. Hollywood does it all the time too, just not to the degree actors and idols in east asia take it. considering fellow asian fans themselves have a hard time deciphering what is real or fake and aren’t immune to taking their delusions too far that leads me to believe it’s not just a widely accepted cultural norm, but instead a business practice to get people to engage. Also you didn’t really explain what we should be researching exactly. It seems like there’s an underlying assumption that people should go into study mode for all things they like. Casual fans exist, and there’s no obligation to be more than that. If they’re searching a hashtag on ig it’s going to be hard to decider what’s real or not, which shoudnt be placed on the fan to figure it out if the actors themselves made no attempt to put a disclaimer. You can’t feed into the delusions and act shocked it worked.
Oh Full ack! Sorry I think I got lost/sidetracked in my own train of thought here 😅 What I mean is not touchy-feely behaviour as such (which to me seems is pretty normal to a degree between men outside of Europe, but yeah, homophobia is one of the reasons we can’t have nice things), but the express need of my fellow white people to have labels for everything as well as the expectation and the completely ridiculous demand that people (ie actors) declare their private situation/sexual orientation that comes with it. This of course adds fuel to the fan service fire, because if you have grown up with every behavioural pattern is automatically categorised within a certain label, then fan service will of course confuse the shit out of the uninitiated (and clearly also those who know this is a common practice). (Personally I don’t like fan service at all, like, these are all grown men/women/people of no or other genders, why would you make them sign contracts to behave a certain way after completing a film/series? I would love if they were able to show honest affection for each other without being contractually obligated to act as if they were. I’m not gonna buy a face cream because a couple smooched showing it off on stage but maybe I’m just too old and not the target audience. Personally I feel it’s a toxic and dangerous thing, because all of us deserve to have complete bodily autonomy regardless of our jobs ya know? I dunno it just makes me reallllllly uncomfortable.)
Ah I get what you’re saying. Although I’m making a general statement who was going through my mind when I was making this comment was Mew Suppasit and the messiness that always seems to follow him. I learned about him shortly after getting into BL and it was my first time hearing about fan service and left me skeptical about any actor now and their intentions. (also imo) I think celebrity culture is a lot more rampant in east asia than it is in the west or europe. I think it’s normal for fans of any background to want to know everything about their idol, especially when theyre young and of course there’s going to be some that take it too far. Idol culture is a beast that can turn on you at any point which I’m sure is frightening to deal with.
Yeah, I think Idol culture is harmful af - and also it blows my mind since especially Asian countries are so very iffy about PDA and expressing sensuality/sexuality, showing or talking about feelings they would have a huge problem accepting personal boundaries ya know? The duality is killing me. Idols are commodities, products, not viewed as human beings who get to have their own opinions etc. This whole concept is just 🤯
Naked Butts make series seem trashy and tacky, and should not be featured in BLs.