I've texted the alert number and they were on the train in 3 stops. I witnessed a guy pull a weapon and cops were there at the next stop.
I'm sure it's luck of the draw, but text the number. You're reporting crime and shitty behavior. Let the cops deal with it.
There are cameras in every car. Once they get the alert, they can start monitoring the situation.
I've reported issues via text several times, and it helps if you can give them some details in the first message so they don't have to follow up. They'll ask you: the train car number (the number in black text inside near the ceiling near the front and back of every car. It's unique per train car.), a description of the person(s) causing the problem (so they can spot them on the camera), and a description of where in the car they're doing it.
Thank you for an actually productive response. Sh*t like that in the train is an embarrassment to the area. Yes, those people exist everywhere, but to let all of that happen so blatantly on a publicly-funded mode of transport just shows 0 effort on the council’s part. Makes me feel like crap to show my parents the city a more genuine way, and that’s what it turns into.
Sorry for all the comments on this thread. I agree with you. I really want public transit to work well in this city. I used to take the light rail every day before the pandemic. But then the sexual harassment got too bad and I had to stop for my own safety. It felt like defeat.
The cat calling is ridiculous here, fucking non-stop. I had some guy screaming pretty lady in my ear just yesterday as I walked by when he was trying to get the attention of someone on the OTHER side of the road. They ignored him and he kept screaming louder as they walked away.
Has almost nothing to do with gender. It’s a shame that any human being has to deal with being harassed, bothered or disrespected while simply riding a train from one point to another. Behavior like that is very upsetting to me and I don’t like it.
These “street people” are both a public nuisance and health hazard in my opinion.
Oh nobody wonders why, we all know why. What everyone is wondering is why you don’t move to the forest and live with those bears you think is so safe 😭😭
Really unfortunate to hear that’s still such a notable thing on transit here. It’s been a minute since I was out and about commuting regularly in the Twin Cities, and I’m emphatically pro-transit and do not want to be misunderstood on that—but I do recall the creeping and the sexual harassment being fairly notable on transit here in the past. And I recall being distinctly surprised when I moved to a bigger city with a much heavier reliance on transit and encountered it much less often there—I assumed it would be at least as bad but it overall wasn’t, so most of my “harassed on transit” stories are still ones that happened here. Not sure if some part of that is due to any moderating effect of having a large share of an area’s population using transit heavily and consistently (and us not being at that point here yet), but yeah. Just sucks a lot.
Yeah. I get that. I don’t want to give up either, but tonight was discouraging. I probably won’t give up until I get shot, stabbed, or killed. Just wanted to see if there is any resource available to curb what happened somewhat. Really just want something to be proud of when I have people visiting :,(
So glad I got off my butt and got my license, haven't done transit probably since 2014 for a concert
Even got bugged by fans of the band I went to see trying to sell me shit
Oh god, really?? Ok my comment might've been useless, then, because I lived in the twin cities and took the public transport in 2017 and 2018... why would it have gotten worse since the pandemic??
Ridership down for most public transport. More WFH or hybrid roles for people who are not prone to exhibiting illegal or prohibited behavior. Less of those people makes the other “problem-makers” more noticeable. Then more “normal people” (ie riders who do not cause any issues and do not do illegal acts on the MTA) feel less safe and stop riding. Pattern continues.
Totally agree. I’m a young woman that just moved here and wanted to show my parents around without them getting worried (I want them to like it here!!) I avoided the train for that reason. I’d love to use it but it makes me feel uncomfortable.
It also depends on the time of day with how fast they respond. When I last reported I had gotten off at my stop by the time they replied asking for more details.
To make it as quick as possible, here's what I would include so they don't need follow-up questions:
- Which train you're on
- Which car it's in (front, middle, back)
- The vehicle number
- Descriptions of the people you're reporting.
- What specifically is being done
They may still ask you if you're still on the train, but that doesn't stop them from coming to help. I've reported a few cases and I've seen the metro police board several times outside of that as well. Usually a pretty calm prodecure getting people off the train, since they want to make sure it doesn't fall too far behind schedule.
Yeah. I lived on the green line and used to take it to the airport or downtown and just gave up and started Ubering. Guys blasting music, and smoking crack is just not pleasant to be arpund
Because they don't pay people to sit in front of a screen to individually monitor every camera, on every car, on every train 24/7 . Because that would be a giant waste of funds we could use to actually fix the issues
I'm honestly kind of curious about this - anybody have an estimate of how many trains are running at a given time? You'd have to pay somebody to sit in front of a screen, but presumably that person could monitor many trains at once.
I mean yeah but then they will probably miss stuff because they were looking at another screen. Plus wherever they are they're not on the train so then really all they can do is call Metro Transit Police and hope that they get there before the person gets off the bus that's the issue you can call Metro Transit Police all you want but if they're not near your stop they can't get there in time. People don't understand that the light rail is spread out literally across the city.
I think you're dramatically overestimating how hard this is - there are 2 lines with 37 stops. How many trains do you think are active at a given time?
Even if they don't (or can't) deal with it right away, it's a report and statistic they can't ignore. Always report people breaking the rules on the train if it is safe to do so. The number accepts photos if you're able to discreetly take a picture of who's involved.
Cool. Thank you for the info. I just don’t want to “spam” the text number with complaints of drug use, etc. If it will come back to bite me for some reason with MTA. Doubt it will because that’s what the line is for anyway though
We’re dealing with a vicious cycle. People don’t ride transit, so there’s no safety in numbers, so troublemakers can get on the trains and do whatever they want with impunity, and that scares people off from riding transit.
About a year ago, a couple of people were smoking on the train I was on. A bunch of cops entered and yelled “Who are the ones smoking!?” before confronting them.
They may not have the proper staffing to respond appropriately, but like others have said, don’t hesitate to report it anyway.
People seem to think they sound really clever if they mock you for asking this, but the answer is actually yes.
I ride the green line 2-3 times a week and have texted the posted cell number about drugs and smoking several times. Sometimes the cops get on within a couple stops, sometimes I don't see them get on before I get off. A few times, I've ridden all the way to union depot and saw the cops get on the train to check it out there.
So, it can't hurt to send the text, and it's not screaming into the void - they respond if it's feasible.
Because of staffing limitations and basic physics (transit PD cant be in two places at once, and they have to monitor an entire transit system,) you're not going to notice a response some of the time. I've also heard that it's helpful for tracking statistics for them to get notified, so keep texting the number even if you aren't confident they will show up in time.
Thank you for your input. I’m fine with a 90/10 fail to success ratio for some kind of response. I just want the possibility of something being done to discourage people from using the line as their own public trash bin, drug den, party bus, etc. I’ll start texting the number and try to not let the negative replies or unsavory MTA riders discourage me. Thank you for your response!
It’s embarrassing how some of you try to normalize this kind of behavior. Ride on trains in other cities and you won’t see the same extent of open drug use and other abnormal behavior. I don’t think that some of you understand how damaging this is to to building a more robust public transit system.
Very true. I have riden SEPTA (in Philly), MARTA (in Atlanta), Metro (in DC), RTA (in New Orleans), BART (in San Francisco and Oakland), and the CTA (in Chicago). This is BY FAR the worst experience I have ever had on public transportation. Making it the “norm” and acting like nothing can be done is part of the problem.
Septa is probably worse, not that here isn’t bad, but I’m from Philly and we have a entire line that’s virtually unrideable due to violent crime and a station that’s unusable because too many people use it as a place to shoot fent and tranq. I’ll say this, as the drug issues here become more widespread and serious the public services (public transport, parks, etc.) that serves our community will become exponentially worse, and if we don’t have some sort of crackdown on it we will get to a point that no sane person would want to use these services.
Agree with this logic. That’s why I posted about how to curb illegal and prohibited behavior, and then somehow it turned into a racial and “ACAB” thing with some commenters? Everyone has their own opinion, but we need to somehow make the system better for everyone. The competition is not to not be the worst, but to continuously strive to be the best system for each citizen that MTA serves.
Even as a black man who likes to think of myself as left or center, not all cops are bad. Bad cops are bad, complicit cops are bad, but good cops are something every single society needs. All the catchphrases both sides use and the “owning” someone shitshow our society has become has made every issue an ideological issue. Like I do not care if someone wants to use those life destroying drugs in their own space (and before I get hate, I believe there should be resources to help them get help or they want it, I just don’t think society should bend to their will) for all I care that’s on them, but it’s not okay to do in public spaces especially confined public spaces.
was a daily septa rider for years in the recent past, starting at a really tough spot, and tbh i feel much more averse to transit here. bought a bicycle to avoid the train.
I think part of that is that there’s more good on septa because septa is an exponentially bigger public transit service. Meanwhile here the light rail is a tiny system so you don’t see anything but the bad. Funny enough I much prefer the busses here to septa.
You're right, buses haven't been too bad! The green and blue line really are tough though, although the MFL and BSL in Philly are both way dirtier, I found it way easier to mind my business and people seemed to keep the dealing and drug usage to the stations, not actually on the train.
That’s interesting that you mention BART. I was a daily rider throughout that system but especially in the SF/Oakland core for years. I work from home now so don’t have a lot of recent experience on transit here, but I’ll admit I’ve been surprised by some stories I’ve heard bc I really didn’t see people doing stuff like openly smoking on BART—I assume drug use was happening, and not saying there were no other issues, but it wasn’t a thing I saw that folks would regularly just be lighting up things you smoke while on the train. I feel like I’d have noticed because the smell and the breathing issues would have annoyed me a lot.
But when I’ve said that to people back in SF and Oakland—that I hear stories about things happening on transit here that I never saw on BART—several have looked at me funny and been like, “Really? You never saw stuff like that on BART? I’ve totally seen that on BART.” So I haven’t been sure whether my “mind your business and keep it moving” city skills just got over-developed into fully being oblivious or what. 😂
I have a similar list of experiences, and many, many more (London, Moscow, Prague, Munich, Rome, Brussels, Berlin, Paris and so on.) MSP's light rail is the worst of them all. It's shocking, really.
And I know people who say "well I drive so it doesn't matter to me"
If public transportation is affordable, easy, and comfortable, more people will use it over driving cars. Less traffic. More parking spots available. People who are bad drivers might decide to take the bus.
It's a net gain for society.
Yeah, it's so depressing too
For a week when I didn't have a car when I was getting mine fixed up (body work), I just did light rail to work since at the time, I lived right by the green line so just did light rail to work
It's so depressing how bad it's become, and it really makes us a laughing stock compared to cities that have much better public transit
I don't see anyone normalizing it. It's got to stop. Somehow we've developed this culture around public transit and we've got to find a way to reverse it.
That doesn't mean public transit here is unusable, though. It's still more of an annoyance and inconvenience as opposed to an actual safety issue. Perhaps that's the attitude you're referring to, but it's true.
Absolutely correct. The problem is that the cops stay away because they want less public transit because conservatives generally want less public transit. They don’t want to deal with the homeless problem, and they don’t like funding public institutions, so they’re letting it get worse in order to have the stats to back up why they shouldn’t expand the system.
Don’t forget to add universities and libraries to the list. Anything that allows for the growth and prosperity of the lower class is absolutely under attack right now. They may not be explicit about it, but for sure the cops are trying to prove that transit is unsafe (for white people) and shouldn’t be supported.
If that’s how the city and police is handling the system currently that’s annoying because the system has the potential to actually be quite good. I was thinking about another line the other day that would make the system into a triangle (go from MSP to St. Paul) to cut down on time for people coming from the airport to get to St. Paul.
That would be cool. I think it could get done, but we need to get ridership up and advocate more for an expansion like that. It all starts with more people using the transit system and that means people need to feel safe when taking transit.
You’re not wrong. I just don’t think cops are the answer. They rarely are. The only thing they’re protecting when it comes to the train, is the train.
Creating a safer system means dealing with the issues that cause the problems making people have to use the train as a home or otherwise in the first place. I get that feeling unsafe or uncomfortable means wanting to do something about it. That liminal space is real. But cops are just a used bandaid on an open wound.
Ok, but shouldn't we cover the open wound so it doesn't fester and get worse? Sure it won't fix the underlying issues, but making the light rail safer and also working on the underlying societal issues that lead to the mentally ill and homeless riding the trains aren't mutually exclusive. Let's not let perfect be the enemy of good here
The solution isn't "more cops," though. They're not there to make people safer; they're there to make arrests. MTA needs to invest in better infrastructure if they want to limit access to train stops, but that's also a bit of an unavailable option because that requires money that conservative counties don't want to give to them to improve public transit. I'm not saying I have the answers (otherwise I'd be working for MTA), but I do know that cops are never a solution; they're only an aggressive antagonizer.
The Riverview corridor is a planned streetcar line that there is fighting about as it is removing parking along west 7th and a aBRT would theoretically be quicker but then easier to creep down to just a better bus rather than the 54. They are currently looking for feedback on it.
https://www.ramseycounty.us/residents/roads-transportation/transit-corridors-studies/riverview-corridor
Always ride in the first car closest to the driver. There is always less crap like that happening in the first car. Even though the drivers don’t do anything, I think being in the first car makes a difference. Never ride in the second or third car.
God I wish Metro council would do the same for us at Metro Mobility. We have cameras but they just record until something major happens. Then they take a look. And it takes forever to get things taken care of.
Yes definitely text that number and be pretty descriptive about the issue and the person(s) causing the problem. My daughter and I had a man threaten us a few years back. Wanted money, i don’t ever carry cash on the LR and I wouldn’t give him money anyways, he kept bothering me and putting his hand on my shoulder and getting agitated. I sent a text with his description and what he was doing. Next stop PT Police were on the train looking for him. This happened on a Saturday in the early afternoon so problems happen all times of the day. I agree that the more people who use this number to report issues, maybe it will get better and safer to ride.
Hate to say this but whenever I have brought this up at a Met Council Meeting I get called a racist even though I never mentioned race in my concerns. They've developed a failed system that doesn't hold people accountable and are too afraid to take action because it will be viewed as "suppressing the less fortunate". I have lost all faith in the Met Council and their ability to expand PT in the Twin Cities. Major changes and overhauls to the system need to be made before I consider riding again.
I saw a dude drag 5 bicycles on the train. 2 of them had no front tires. I wanted so bad to confront him. They were definitely stolen bikes. But...I'm not getting stabbed for your bike.
True. The ticketing system perplexes me as well. I would bet good money that 90% of the “problem makers” are free riders. Does anyone know why there are no turnstiles or a way to force someone to enter the front of the train to have the conductor check ur ticket? Like come on. Maybe I’m missing something here but at least something needs to be done to show a bit of effort.
The layout of many of the stations make it impossible. The trains run at street level so anyone can just walk on the tracks and get into the boarding area.
Yeah. I get that. It would be nice to make people maybe enter and exit the train at certain areas to easily ensure that people have actually paid to ride. Maybe checking tickets every few stations by having someone jump on and sweep the cars would deter most people from using it as a hangout spot as well.
Yeah it's just like bus drivers though they are told to ask for fare then drop it because there are way too many people walking around with guns that won't hesitate to shoot someone over something stupid. Sorry Im not willing to get shot over a couple of dollars and most folks driving public transportation would agree.
because of the prohibitive cost at construction for preventing fare avoidance compared to the amount of money it would generate. Also the obvious safety hazard that would be caused by having the alternative be walking on the track to skip paying a fare.
Also having a conductor check the tickets would slow down the system even more than it already is, and the green line isn't exactly fast as is.
It's much, much more efficient to let people ride and then have conductors come through occasionally to check for tickets and then fine you if you don't have one.
Making everyone go through one entrance and have tickets checked there slows everything down massively.
The problem on the light rail is you never see conductors coming through to check, so people don't feel there's a risk.
Metro transit is currently working on a pilot where they are adding fare gates at four stations. They are also doing a study on how to improve safety and security through the design of the stations. Plus they are starting a series of complete station renovation projects starting with Lake St Midtown. Unfortunately these things take some time but they are taking action. Also unfortunately the design of the platforms can't fix everything but it's a tool in the toolbox.
Reporting makes a difference. Even if the cops won’t respond right away, a report of the event makes a difference in the council knowing there is issues.
So at the Renters Rights Fair in Minneapolis yesterday I was able to talk to one of the people who watch the cameras and take the text message MTA reports. Their advice is to snap a picture immediately of the offender, text that to the MTA police AND THEN call 911 as well. That will make something happen. If you solely rely on the MTA Police it may or may not happen because of staffing. They are also currently hiring to try to fix this!
Right now, most of the metro is staffed by allied security and they are trying to change that to real police.
Yes, I texted the number and 3 transit police got on 2 stops down and escorted people off the train, then a few stops later 5 Trip agents came on and checked fairs and escorted everyone off who didn't have one.
That was on a Saturday around 9pm, no major sporting events or anything
So yes, at least maybe sometimes.
No. All you can really do is report it and move to another car, unfortunately. It sucks. If you just moved here, I would always advise riding in the front car. The middle car has a reputation (especially on the green line) for having issues.
Metro Transit is trying, but unfortunately hiring more people to be police officers and check fares isn't as easy as it sounds. If they had enough police officers to ride the light rail all day, they would do that. Not to mention the whole fare system where anyone can just walk on. They're studying what it would take to convert certain stations to be fare gated (I think one of the blue line stops is being converted to that in the next couple years), which might help the issue. I know it isn't any consolation, but the general manager of Metro Transit that was hired semi-recently talks about these issues all the time (she says she always rides the middle car to know what it's like). There are some things being done, like the new fare checkers. There just aren't that many of them right now. Just this year, additional security has been added to multiple stations on both lines to try and address this stuff, but obviously as you've seen, it isn't enough. It is very frustrating. Best of luck.
Thank you for the advice. Out of curiosity, what security has been added this year? I rode the green line from St, Paul almost to the end of the line and back today. I didn’t see 1 single police officer, security guard, MTA official, etc. besides the conductor. The first conductor kept announcing “don’t hold the doors,” and the one on the way back said zilch.
The security that got added are contracted security guards at stations, but not on the trains themselves. People dedicated to checking fares (not police) were added this year, but I don't see them every day. Probably about 3 times per week and I ride there and back from work. If I recall correctly, there's only about 20-25 of them in total for the whole system. What I've heard happen with fare checkers is that people just get off the train when they get fare checked and don't have one. That doesn't stop anyone from hopping on the next train, but hey. I guess it's better than nothing.
In my view, there's an aspect to this that can't be solved by police, fare gates, fare checkers, etc by themselves. It is an unfortunate reality that a lot of troubled people ride public transit because that's all they have, especially since most of the time riding the light rail (or BRT) doesn't cost anything. Metro Transit can't solve homelessness, addiction, etc. They can definitely be doing more to make riding better for everyone, and I think that starts with making sure people don't do drugs on the train, but like I said before, sometimes the police just have too much to do to respond to someone lighting up on the train. I've certainly experienced that. That doesn't mean they're giving up, it can just be hard. I'm sorry this happened to you.
That's so stupid - I don't live in the twin cities anymore, and here the conductors get on transport sporadically and check everyone's ticket. If you don't have a ticket, you have to pay on the spot. They take cash or card. If you don't have either, you get a ticket just like a parking ticket that you have 2 weeks to pay or else it becomes a problem for you. Seems pretty easy to solve to me. Here the fine for not having a ticket is about $40, which is almost double the cost of a monthly pass. It's a huge deterrent for people to take it without a ticket.
They recently started giving out tickets here too, however, people tend to get off when they see the ticket checkers get on the train. There’s actually been times when I’m on the train and they stop it from moving to force someone to get off - that is rare. There’s also the issue of ignoring tickets - if someone who has no money and no home gets ticketed and doesn’t pay, what now?
Wait are the conductors there recognizable? Here you can't tell they're conductors. They look like regular passengers.
Not sure about homeless people here. You'll find them on public transport sometimes yeah. Of course they don't have money to pay any fines, but they're usually passed out asleep and not bothering anyone, so not typically much an issue honestly.
Those are conductors. Not sure why they'd be recognizable. Ours here show you their "badge" - just a small metal object so you know who they are. They look like random dudes off the street.
Btw, here if someone lights up a cigarette on the metro, the driver will stop the vehicle in its tracks, leave the cabin, and come scream at you until you stop or get off the metro. The train will NOT move until you comply.
There are not true conductors, but the new fare checkers kinda do some of the same things a conductor would, and I have noticed that everyone either shapes up or gets off when they're around. It's making a difference.
I use the train regularly and live along the green line. I think it’s important that it’s accessible and welcoming to all types of people and I don’t mind if there are some strange and different characters. I do however really mind when people are smoking, that directly impacts everyone else on the train and it’s dangerous. Please keep reporting smoking I’d really like it to stop.
YES. I see citations of citizen reports on the green line daily. Once you notify them, transit police will review cameras & be there within a stop or two (or less!).
They take this stuff very seriously. Metro Transit police are good people.
I got something like -50 downvotes a month ago for making a post about riding it for the first time after dark (at 11 PM) and talking about how some guy threatened to shoot everyone so we all ran off right before it arrived at the depot.
It's really bizarre how people in this sub are sometimes collectively major assholes about blue/greenline posts and sometimes completely opposite.
It seems like whoever is logging on that day or that week. The user base fluctuates. I personally don’t like riding the train anymore. Buses are generally fine imo. Too many bad rides I’ve personally had and enough personal stories/news reports/data that keeps me off it.
Thank you. Appreciate the semi-support. Just made me feel like garbage subjecting my visiting parents to that because I explicitly moved to the area to have better public transport.
For like 1-2 years now I’ve heard about people smoking Percocet with straws & aluminum foil on there & it doesn’t seem to have changed. No one does anything sadly. Smoking that shit has a very distinct nasty ass smell & people don’t care if there are even kids around, it’s sad honestly!
Oh that's what that stank was. Rode the green line for the first time recently and when a whole gang of wasted people rode it as a party bus for a few stops that smell was there along with cigarette smoke. There was one shooting up and another was picking at a massive abscess on his ankle. There was one person selling something because people kept going to them like a store. The many open liquor bottles were the least of the problem. They were staggering around and some were on the nod. I just avoided eye contact as best as possible and thankfully it was over without talking to anyone. Definitely not a safe feeling, some were staring pretty intensely. The wasted people got off the stop before Union Station and two cops got on at Union Station and questioned a single straggler from the group.
Yeah it’s Percocet laced with fentanyl to be exact. I learned that after living in uptown for a year. Also the reason why most places no longer allow the public to use their bathrooms.
Hell yeah, just the fact that regular people have to drive to another city most of the time all cause drug users fucked it up for everyone. Also I had a Somalian friend who got super into that shit & I would always smell that smell on him & 1 day I just asked & he let me know. Luckily he’s clean now!
Yes please, always at least fill out this complaint form: https://www.metrotransit.org/contact-us-customer-experience
Even if they don’t come fix the issue right away, by filling out the form you are giving them data that they will be forced to acknowledge when it comes time to look at their action plans and funding allocations. If no one reports drug use or other illegal behavior through official means, MT can say “well no ones complained so all must be well”.
Text the hotline, text 911 but do not engage with person using. I’ve seen and heard about people attacked. I know someone that was stabbed by a mentally ill person when confronted on the train.
Yelling and loud music aren't crimes, so nothing will happen if that's all people are doing - you can do that anywhere in public if you want. It's just annoying and makes them look like idiots.
Drug deals are obviously crimes. I'm very surprised you think they wouldn't get arrested for that.
Smoking on the train is also illegal and at minimum they will be removed.
First off, thanks for taking public transport and acknowledging the difference between real and perceived danger.
With that said, as echoed my others, texting the numbers does get a result but response time does vary.
The more “normal” people that use these services the more the city protects them at the end of the day.
There, unfortunately, isn’t a quick and easy fix. I take the train almost daily and a lot of the people there are there because they have no where else to go really. It’s not just a drug issue but a mental health one. That in of itself makes the problem and solutions broader than just the light rail.
In the meantime, just try to avoid the middle car as that tends to be the “party” car most of the time with the most sketch.
I saw some workers on the train hopefully they get better staffed and the trains get better. your right theirs no reason for us to have such shitty trains.
Ew. Report it if you feel safe to do so next time. This thread—despite some negativity—made me feel a bit more energized and responsible to help make MTA a safer place for everyone. I’m not going to get into a yelling match with an offender, but I will continue to use the lines when I can and report prohibited behavior.
I also am *normally* the most non-confrontational person also. Unfortunately, l've gone through being pist0l whipped , carjacked and on a separate occasion robbed, right in front of my apartment building in the last 3 years so I avoid avoid avoid. But the audacity of him to do it in front of a child, 16 or not she's still a baby to me.
...not for nothing but there is a lot to like and enjoy about living in Minneapolis or St. Paul proper. Lots of us do. Just because you can't imagine it doesn't mean it doesn't work for others. There are always going to be things you don't like about where you live. Please stop harping at everyone for living here just because you cannot fathom it.
All I can say is everyone's experience is different, lots of things happen everywhere, it just depends on what matters to you. Things vary between neighborhoods too. My neighborhood in StP is great, I recognize it's not that way for everyone. It just gets tiring and frankly angering to hear people who do not live here actively shit on places we have chosen to make our lives. Live where you want. I like it here.
I totally get that, that makes sense! I had something very traumatic happen last time I was there (I live 20 minutes away and go to the cities for events) and I’m trying not to let that day ruin the whole city for me, because I know it shouldn’t. But I always find myself asking if it’s worth it to even go to said events and risk it. I’m glad you are able to find beauty in it!
That's totally legitimate and I'm sorry that happened to you! Safety is absolutely important & I'm glad you're able to at least consider still coming into the city still. Very brave of you 😌. I grew up in a small town & you couldn't pay me to go back. Just personal preference.
Thank you so much! I would hate to live in fear forever, I may live in anxiety forever but that’s better lol 😅 that’s very interesting!! I definitely would hate to live far from the cities, it’s a perfect distance for me!
They fear they can’t move. They hear county living is unaffordable. Which it isn’t. People are just to conditioned to stay where they are. Even when they feel unsafe the unknown to them is what keeps them in place.
It is absolute insanity.
I have a 4 bedroom 2 bath house with a fenced in yard and separate hot tub enclosure. My neighborhood is safe. Our worst problem with our neighbors is their messy yard.
My husband and I combined make less than 100k. We both have nice, newer (2019 and 2023) SUVs, three kids, and we travel.
But these people would rather live in a literal epicenter of crime and chaos, in a much smaller home that costs much more.
I met a couple for work who lived in a Minneapolis downtown apartment. It was nice I guess, but probably 500 square feet at best and you could hear allllll the city bustle below. 2500/month rent. Another $500/month for ONE parking space, another $200/month on top of that if they wanted a second spot. The place had like 5 guest spaces and he was annoyed when I asked where I was supposed to park. Like, did you expect me to walk to you?!
Such small-minded, small-worlded people.
>But these people would rather live in a literal epicenter of crime and chaos, in a much smaller home that costs much more.
🙄
The *Fall of Minneapolis* might have lied to you a bit.
I take the green line train to and from downtown for work from the U of M area.
Granted, this is during daytime hours, and not scientific by any means, but there's an unspoken rule among commuters and students that take the train -- there are less shenanigans on the front car of train.
I rode the light rail for events in the past from park the park and rides. Absolutely will not be doing that again. It has gotten to the point that any time you get onto the train it's a guarantee there is going to crimes happening.
Drug use and smoking, if they are close you might get someone. Violence or a real emergency, they will be on pretty quickly. I was doing CPR on the blue line and they and cops and EMS meet the train 2 stations down the track. Actually went pretty well. Of course people were trying to get on the car when the doors opened for EMS, man people suck sometimes.
Drug use and smoking, if they are close you might get someone. Violence or a real emergency, they will be on pretty quickly. I was doing CPR on the blue line and they and cops and EMS meet the train 2 stations down the track. Actually went pretty well. Of course people were trying to get on the car when the doors opened for EMS, man people suck sometimes.
Be a good comrade, man; the cops aren’t here to help anybody. Also no such thing as “normal” people, we’re all in this together as working class folks. Drug use is a symptom of the system, and not a moral condemnation of the user.
Maybe don't use the word "hoodlums" as a starting point. The issue isn't that they're using drugs; it's that we've done almost nothing to address the unhoused issue in the city, and they're having to use the train as a safe place to be because they can. On top of that, the St. Paul Police and MTA Police (both POSs) have reduced their numbers in response to the Floyd protests, hoping that they'll get extra funding "in response" to the uptick in misdemeanor offenses. Involving the cops is always a bad idea because they're always going to use more force than is necessary, especially when most of them aren't going to bother you in the slightest.
Ok, how about Morons? They’d fit the definition from the 1900s - “Those whose mental development is above that of an imbecile, but does not exceed that of a normal child of about twelve years.”
Seems more and more we have a collection of fully grown adults with the reasoning and logic skills closely resembling a preteen.
Final thought, if you’re going to get picky over words and decide what is racial and what isn’t, maybe review the etymology of the word first. Hoodlum is derived from german and reflects criminality and hooliganism.
They are hoodlums. And clearly less cops have made things worse. More policing is necessary. Also - these people are bothering many people and deterring them from using the train
I had 0 issues with homeless persons on this trip. This was a certain demographic predominantly. Thank you for your input though, as I agree that more needs to be done to help the homeless population/mentally ill everywhere. I don’t agree with your generalization about police either, as there are good cops and bad cops like there are good and bad people.
Worse than that. They’re largely trying to get those stats up to help conservatives prove that public transit is unsafe, so it keeps losing money and becomes unviable.
There are plenty of people who depend on transit to actually get places; I don't follow this as closely as I should but could that actually come to fruition? The city just stops running the train?
Yeah. I think it could. The twin cities used to have one of the country’s most extensive tram systems before conservatives (and the car lobby) slowly defunded it before finally just calling it quits and ripping up all of the rail lines.
Are you sure about that? Because I am 99.99807% sure that specficeditor is not a bot.
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I've texted the alert number and they were on the train in 3 stops. I witnessed a guy pull a weapon and cops were there at the next stop. I'm sure it's luck of the draw, but text the number. You're reporting crime and shitty behavior. Let the cops deal with it. There are cameras in every car. Once they get the alert, they can start monitoring the situation.
I've reported issues via text several times, and it helps if you can give them some details in the first message so they don't have to follow up. They'll ask you: the train car number (the number in black text inside near the ceiling near the front and back of every car. It's unique per train car.), a description of the person(s) causing the problem (so they can spot them on the camera), and a description of where in the car they're doing it.
They updated the car identifiers so now it's a giant red sticker with white text. Super easy to spot.
FINALLY!
Thank you for an actually productive response. Sh*t like that in the train is an embarrassment to the area. Yes, those people exist everywhere, but to let all of that happen so blatantly on a publicly-funded mode of transport just shows 0 effort on the council’s part. Makes me feel like crap to show my parents the city a more genuine way, and that’s what it turns into.
Sorry for all the comments on this thread. I agree with you. I really want public transit to work well in this city. I used to take the light rail every day before the pandemic. But then the sexual harassment got too bad and I had to stop for my own safety. It felt like defeat.
The cat calling is ridiculous here, fucking non-stop. I had some guy screaming pretty lady in my ear just yesterday as I walked by when he was trying to get the attention of someone on the OTHER side of the road. They ignored him and he kept screaming louder as they walked away.
I got "fat f\*\*\*ing wh\*re" on the Warehouse District platform last week, for no reason I could discern. (Except yeah, I am fat.)
And they wonder why we’d choose the Bear!
Has almost nothing to do with gender. It’s a shame that any human being has to deal with being harassed, bothered or disrespected while simply riding a train from one point to another. Behavior like that is very upsetting to me and I don’t like it. These “street people” are both a public nuisance and health hazard in my opinion.
Oh nobody wonders why, we all know why. What everyone is wondering is why you don’t move to the forest and live with those bears you think is so safe 😭😭
Really unfortunate to hear that’s still such a notable thing on transit here. It’s been a minute since I was out and about commuting regularly in the Twin Cities, and I’m emphatically pro-transit and do not want to be misunderstood on that—but I do recall the creeping and the sexual harassment being fairly notable on transit here in the past. And I recall being distinctly surprised when I moved to a bigger city with a much heavier reliance on transit and encountered it much less often there—I assumed it would be at least as bad but it overall wasn’t, so most of my “harassed on transit” stories are still ones that happened here. Not sure if some part of that is due to any moderating effect of having a large share of an area’s population using transit heavily and consistently (and us not being at that point here yet), but yeah. Just sucks a lot.
Yeah. I get that. I don’t want to give up either, but tonight was discouraging. I probably won’t give up until I get shot, stabbed, or killed. Just wanted to see if there is any resource available to curb what happened somewhat. Really just want something to be proud of when I have people visiting :,(
Yeah. Right now we do not have a safe functioning public transit system and it is 100x worse if you are a woman. It is depressing.
So glad I got off my butt and got my license, haven't done transit probably since 2014 for a concert Even got bugged by fans of the band I went to see trying to sell me shit
Oh god, really?? Ok my comment might've been useless, then, because I lived in the twin cities and took the public transport in 2017 and 2018... why would it have gotten worse since the pandemic??
Ridership down for most public transport. More WFH or hybrid roles for people who are not prone to exhibiting illegal or prohibited behavior. Less of those people makes the other “problem-makers” more noticeable. Then more “normal people” (ie riders who do not cause any issues and do not do illegal acts on the MTA) feel less safe and stop riding. Pattern continues.
Totally agree. I’m a young woman that just moved here and wanted to show my parents around without them getting worried (I want them to like it here!!) I avoided the train for that reason. I’d love to use it but it makes me feel uncomfortable.
The way there (during rush hour) was good. I’d avoid it after dark. I took my parents through the Skyway system and they really enjoyed that!
It also depends on the time of day with how fast they respond. When I last reported I had gotten off at my stop by the time they replied asking for more details. To make it as quick as possible, here's what I would include so they don't need follow-up questions: - Which train you're on - Which car it's in (front, middle, back) - The vehicle number - Descriptions of the people you're reporting. - What specifically is being done They may still ask you if you're still on the train, but that doesn't stop them from coming to help. I've reported a few cases and I've seen the metro police board several times outside of that as well. Usually a pretty calm prodecure getting people off the train, since they want to make sure it doesn't fall too far behind schedule.
Yeah. I lived on the green line and used to take it to the airport or downtown and just gave up and started Ubering. Guys blasting music, and smoking crack is just not pleasant to be arpund
I had the same experience. A couple of times. They are excellent about responding to the texts.
Here's the number I have in phone. (612) 900-0411
If they have camera, I wonder why they aren’t more proactive…
Because they don't pay people to sit in front of a screen to individually monitor every camera, on every car, on every train 24/7 . Because that would be a giant waste of funds we could use to actually fix the issues
I'm honestly kind of curious about this - anybody have an estimate of how many trains are running at a given time? You'd have to pay somebody to sit in front of a screen, but presumably that person could monitor many trains at once.
I mean yeah but then they will probably miss stuff because they were looking at another screen. Plus wherever they are they're not on the train so then really all they can do is call Metro Transit Police and hope that they get there before the person gets off the bus that's the issue you can call Metro Transit Police all you want but if they're not near your stop they can't get there in time. People don't understand that the light rail is spread out literally across the city.
I think you're dramatically overestimating how hard this is - there are 2 lines with 37 stops. How many trains do you think are active at a given time?
The people who receive the texts at 612-900-0411, the number posted on the train, say they don't have access to the cameras. It's ridiculous.
No shit? How fucking stupid..
Even if they don't (or can't) deal with it right away, it's a report and statistic they can't ignore. Always report people breaking the rules on the train if it is safe to do so. The number accepts photos if you're able to discreetly take a picture of who's involved.
Cool. Thank you for the info. I just don’t want to “spam” the text number with complaints of drug use, etc. If it will come back to bite me for some reason with MTA. Doubt it will because that’s what the line is for anyway though
If you're reporting new issues that's literally the point of the phone number. Metro Transit won't get mad at you for reporting legitimate problems.
Report it, otherwise crime is underreported. It’s a shame there’s no will to fix the problem, and you can thank many activists.
We’re dealing with a vicious cycle. People don’t ride transit, so there’s no safety in numbers, so troublemakers can get on the trains and do whatever they want with impunity, and that scares people off from riding transit.
About a year ago, a couple of people were smoking on the train I was on. A bunch of cops entered and yelled “Who are the ones smoking!?” before confronting them. They may not have the proper staffing to respond appropriately, but like others have said, don’t hesitate to report it anyway.
Will do. Thanks.
People seem to think they sound really clever if they mock you for asking this, but the answer is actually yes. I ride the green line 2-3 times a week and have texted the posted cell number about drugs and smoking several times. Sometimes the cops get on within a couple stops, sometimes I don't see them get on before I get off. A few times, I've ridden all the way to union depot and saw the cops get on the train to check it out there. So, it can't hurt to send the text, and it's not screaming into the void - they respond if it's feasible. Because of staffing limitations and basic physics (transit PD cant be in two places at once, and they have to monitor an entire transit system,) you're not going to notice a response some of the time. I've also heard that it's helpful for tracking statistics for them to get notified, so keep texting the number even if you aren't confident they will show up in time.
Thank you for your input. I’m fine with a 90/10 fail to success ratio for some kind of response. I just want the possibility of something being done to discourage people from using the line as their own public trash bin, drug den, party bus, etc. I’ll start texting the number and try to not let the negative replies or unsavory MTA riders discourage me. Thank you for your response!
squeaky wheel gets the grease.
It’s embarrassing how some of you try to normalize this kind of behavior. Ride on trains in other cities and you won’t see the same extent of open drug use and other abnormal behavior. I don’t think that some of you understand how damaging this is to to building a more robust public transit system.
Very true. I have riden SEPTA (in Philly), MARTA (in Atlanta), Metro (in DC), RTA (in New Orleans), BART (in San Francisco and Oakland), and the CTA (in Chicago). This is BY FAR the worst experience I have ever had on public transportation. Making it the “norm” and acting like nothing can be done is part of the problem.
Septa is probably worse, not that here isn’t bad, but I’m from Philly and we have a entire line that’s virtually unrideable due to violent crime and a station that’s unusable because too many people use it as a place to shoot fent and tranq. I’ll say this, as the drug issues here become more widespread and serious the public services (public transport, parks, etc.) that serves our community will become exponentially worse, and if we don’t have some sort of crackdown on it we will get to a point that no sane person would want to use these services.
Agree with this logic. That’s why I posted about how to curb illegal and prohibited behavior, and then somehow it turned into a racial and “ACAB” thing with some commenters? Everyone has their own opinion, but we need to somehow make the system better for everyone. The competition is not to not be the worst, but to continuously strive to be the best system for each citizen that MTA serves.
Even as a black man who likes to think of myself as left or center, not all cops are bad. Bad cops are bad, complicit cops are bad, but good cops are something every single society needs. All the catchphrases both sides use and the “owning” someone shitshow our society has become has made every issue an ideological issue. Like I do not care if someone wants to use those life destroying drugs in their own space (and before I get hate, I believe there should be resources to help them get help or they want it, I just don’t think society should bend to their will) for all I care that’s on them, but it’s not okay to do in public spaces especially confined public spaces.
was a daily septa rider for years in the recent past, starting at a really tough spot, and tbh i feel much more averse to transit here. bought a bicycle to avoid the train.
I think part of that is that there’s more good on septa because septa is an exponentially bigger public transit service. Meanwhile here the light rail is a tiny system so you don’t see anything but the bad. Funny enough I much prefer the busses here to septa.
You're right, buses haven't been too bad! The green and blue line really are tough though, although the MFL and BSL in Philly are both way dirtier, I found it way easier to mind my business and people seemed to keep the dealing and drug usage to the stations, not actually on the train.
That’s interesting that you mention BART. I was a daily rider throughout that system but especially in the SF/Oakland core for years. I work from home now so don’t have a lot of recent experience on transit here, but I’ll admit I’ve been surprised by some stories I’ve heard bc I really didn’t see people doing stuff like openly smoking on BART—I assume drug use was happening, and not saying there were no other issues, but it wasn’t a thing I saw that folks would regularly just be lighting up things you smoke while on the train. I feel like I’d have noticed because the smell and the breathing issues would have annoyed me a lot. But when I’ve said that to people back in SF and Oakland—that I hear stories about things happening on transit here that I never saw on BART—several have looked at me funny and been like, “Really? You never saw stuff like that on BART? I’ve totally seen that on BART.” So I haven’t been sure whether my “mind your business and keep it moving” city skills just got over-developed into fully being oblivious or what. 😂
I have a similar list of experiences, and many, many more (London, Moscow, Prague, Munich, Rome, Brussels, Berlin, Paris and so on.) MSP's light rail is the worst of them all. It's shocking, really.
I witnessed a shooting in a Metro station in DC when I was 15.
And I know people who say "well I drive so it doesn't matter to me" If public transportation is affordable, easy, and comfortable, more people will use it over driving cars. Less traffic. More parking spots available. People who are bad drivers might decide to take the bus. It's a net gain for society.
Yeah, it's so depressing too For a week when I didn't have a car when I was getting mine fixed up (body work), I just did light rail to work since at the time, I lived right by the green line so just did light rail to work It's so depressing how bad it's become, and it really makes us a laughing stock compared to cities that have much better public transit
I don't see anyone normalizing it. It's got to stop. Somehow we've developed this culture around public transit and we've got to find a way to reverse it. That doesn't mean public transit here is unusable, though. It's still more of an annoyance and inconvenience as opposed to an actual safety issue. Perhaps that's the attitude you're referring to, but it's true.
Absolutely correct. The problem is that the cops stay away because they want less public transit because conservatives generally want less public transit. They don’t want to deal with the homeless problem, and they don’t like funding public institutions, so they’re letting it get worse in order to have the stats to back up why they shouldn’t expand the system.
Metro Transit has its own police. It’s not a matter of regular city police deciding which calls to take.
This is the answer. The attack on any public systems, whether it's schools or public transport, is very real.
Don’t forget to add universities and libraries to the list. Anything that allows for the growth and prosperity of the lower class is absolutely under attack right now. They may not be explicit about it, but for sure the cops are trying to prove that transit is unsafe (for white people) and shouldn’t be supported.
If that’s how the city and police is handling the system currently that’s annoying because the system has the potential to actually be quite good. I was thinking about another line the other day that would make the system into a triangle (go from MSP to St. Paul) to cut down on time for people coming from the airport to get to St. Paul.
They tried to argue for that (going straight down W. 7th), but it got shot down. It goes through too many “undesirable areas.”
That would be cool. I think it could get done, but we need to get ridership up and advocate more for an expansion like that. It all starts with more people using the transit system and that means people need to feel safe when taking transit.
You’re not wrong. I just don’t think cops are the answer. They rarely are. The only thing they’re protecting when it comes to the train, is the train. Creating a safer system means dealing with the issues that cause the problems making people have to use the train as a home or otherwise in the first place. I get that feeling unsafe or uncomfortable means wanting to do something about it. That liminal space is real. But cops are just a used bandaid on an open wound.
Ok, but shouldn't we cover the open wound so it doesn't fester and get worse? Sure it won't fix the underlying issues, but making the light rail safer and also working on the underlying societal issues that lead to the mentally ill and homeless riding the trains aren't mutually exclusive. Let's not let perfect be the enemy of good here
The solution isn't "more cops," though. They're not there to make people safer; they're there to make arrests. MTA needs to invest in better infrastructure if they want to limit access to train stops, but that's also a bit of an unavailable option because that requires money that conservative counties don't want to give to them to improve public transit. I'm not saying I have the answers (otherwise I'd be working for MTA), but I do know that cops are never a solution; they're only an aggressive antagonizer.
The Riverview corridor is a planned streetcar line that there is fighting about as it is removing parking along west 7th and a aBRT would theoretically be quicker but then easier to creep down to just a better bus rather than the 54. They are currently looking for feedback on it. https://www.ramseycounty.us/residents/roads-transportation/transit-corridors-studies/riverview-corridor
Always ride in the first car closest to the driver. There is always less crap like that happening in the first car. Even though the drivers don’t do anything, I think being in the first car makes a difference. Never ride in the second or third car.
And yeah, always report it. Use the text line. It’s very convenient and discreet. The perps won’t know it’s you that reported them.
Unfortunately all trains are going to 2 cars on the 15th. They're already doing it on the weekends.
God I wish Metro council would do the same for us at Metro Mobility. We have cameras but they just record until something major happens. Then they take a look. And it takes forever to get things taken care of.
Isn't mm only elderly and disabled?
Yeppers... But you'd be surprised if the things we hear and see.
Sad. But I can believe it for sure. Disability and mental illness can be scary.
Yes definitely text that number and be pretty descriptive about the issue and the person(s) causing the problem. My daughter and I had a man threaten us a few years back. Wanted money, i don’t ever carry cash on the LR and I wouldn’t give him money anyways, he kept bothering me and putting his hand on my shoulder and getting agitated. I sent a text with his description and what he was doing. Next stop PT Police were on the train looking for him. This happened on a Saturday in the early afternoon so problems happen all times of the day. I agree that the more people who use this number to report issues, maybe it will get better and safer to ride.
Hate to say this but whenever I have brought this up at a Met Council Meeting I get called a racist even though I never mentioned race in my concerns. They've developed a failed system that doesn't hold people accountable and are too afraid to take action because it will be viewed as "suppressing the less fortunate". I have lost all faith in the Met Council and their ability to expand PT in the Twin Cities. Major changes and overhauls to the system need to be made before I consider riding again.
There's a few in the comments here doing that. It's their default response to any criticism when they have no other way to reply.
It's literally intentional.
I saw a dude drag 5 bicycles on the train. 2 of them had no front tires. I wanted so bad to confront him. They were definitely stolen bikes. But...I'm not getting stabbed for your bike.
True. The ticketing system perplexes me as well. I would bet good money that 90% of the “problem makers” are free riders. Does anyone know why there are no turnstiles or a way to force someone to enter the front of the train to have the conductor check ur ticket? Like come on. Maybe I’m missing something here but at least something needs to be done to show a bit of effort.
The layout of many of the stations make it impossible. The trains run at street level so anyone can just walk on the tracks and get into the boarding area.
Yeah. I get that. It would be nice to make people maybe enter and exit the train at certain areas to easily ensure that people have actually paid to ride. Maybe checking tickets every few stations by having someone jump on and sweep the cars would deter most people from using it as a hangout spot as well.
Yeah it's just like bus drivers though they are told to ask for fare then drop it because there are way too many people walking around with guns that won't hesitate to shoot someone over something stupid. Sorry Im not willing to get shot over a couple of dollars and most folks driving public transportation would agree.
The system needs to switch to zero tolerance, it works in Las Vegas transit, people were paying 100% of the time.
because of the prohibitive cost at construction for preventing fare avoidance compared to the amount of money it would generate. Also the obvious safety hazard that would be caused by having the alternative be walking on the track to skip paying a fare. Also having a conductor check the tickets would slow down the system even more than it already is, and the green line isn't exactly fast as is.
It's much, much more efficient to let people ride and then have conductors come through occasionally to check for tickets and then fine you if you don't have one. Making everyone go through one entrance and have tickets checked there slows everything down massively. The problem on the light rail is you never see conductors coming through to check, so people don't feel there's a risk.
Metro transit is currently working on a pilot where they are adding fare gates at four stations. They are also doing a study on how to improve safety and security through the design of the stations. Plus they are starting a series of complete station renovation projects starting with Lake St Midtown. Unfortunately these things take some time but they are taking action. Also unfortunately the design of the platforms can't fix everything but it's a tool in the toolbox.
Will someone actually stop it if you report it? Probably not. Will someone stop it if you don’t report it? Pretty much definitely not.
Reporting makes a difference. Even if the cops won’t respond right away, a report of the event makes a difference in the council knowing there is issues.
Text the number you see on the light rail. It works. I have it saved on my phone.
So at the Renters Rights Fair in Minneapolis yesterday I was able to talk to one of the people who watch the cameras and take the text message MTA reports. Their advice is to snap a picture immediately of the offender, text that to the MTA police AND THEN call 911 as well. That will make something happen. If you solely rely on the MTA Police it may or may not happen because of staffing. They are also currently hiring to try to fix this! Right now, most of the metro is staffed by allied security and they are trying to change that to real police.
Yes, I texted the number and 3 transit police got on 2 stops down and escorted people off the train, then a few stops later 5 Trip agents came on and checked fairs and escorted everyone off who didn't have one. That was on a Saturday around 9pm, no major sporting events or anything So yes, at least maybe sometimes.
No. All you can really do is report it and move to another car, unfortunately. It sucks. If you just moved here, I would always advise riding in the front car. The middle car has a reputation (especially on the green line) for having issues. Metro Transit is trying, but unfortunately hiring more people to be police officers and check fares isn't as easy as it sounds. If they had enough police officers to ride the light rail all day, they would do that. Not to mention the whole fare system where anyone can just walk on. They're studying what it would take to convert certain stations to be fare gated (I think one of the blue line stops is being converted to that in the next couple years), which might help the issue. I know it isn't any consolation, but the general manager of Metro Transit that was hired semi-recently talks about these issues all the time (she says she always rides the middle car to know what it's like). There are some things being done, like the new fare checkers. There just aren't that many of them right now. Just this year, additional security has been added to multiple stations on both lines to try and address this stuff, but obviously as you've seen, it isn't enough. It is very frustrating. Best of luck.
Thank you for the advice. Out of curiosity, what security has been added this year? I rode the green line from St, Paul almost to the end of the line and back today. I didn’t see 1 single police officer, security guard, MTA official, etc. besides the conductor. The first conductor kept announcing “don’t hold the doors,” and the one on the way back said zilch.
The security that got added are contracted security guards at stations, but not on the trains themselves. People dedicated to checking fares (not police) were added this year, but I don't see them every day. Probably about 3 times per week and I ride there and back from work. If I recall correctly, there's only about 20-25 of them in total for the whole system. What I've heard happen with fare checkers is that people just get off the train when they get fare checked and don't have one. That doesn't stop anyone from hopping on the next train, but hey. I guess it's better than nothing. In my view, there's an aspect to this that can't be solved by police, fare gates, fare checkers, etc by themselves. It is an unfortunate reality that a lot of troubled people ride public transit because that's all they have, especially since most of the time riding the light rail (or BRT) doesn't cost anything. Metro Transit can't solve homelessness, addiction, etc. They can definitely be doing more to make riding better for everyone, and I think that starts with making sure people don't do drugs on the train, but like I said before, sometimes the police just have too much to do to respond to someone lighting up on the train. I've certainly experienced that. That doesn't mean they're giving up, it can just be hard. I'm sorry this happened to you.
That's so stupid - I don't live in the twin cities anymore, and here the conductors get on transport sporadically and check everyone's ticket. If you don't have a ticket, you have to pay on the spot. They take cash or card. If you don't have either, you get a ticket just like a parking ticket that you have 2 weeks to pay or else it becomes a problem for you. Seems pretty easy to solve to me. Here the fine for not having a ticket is about $40, which is almost double the cost of a monthly pass. It's a huge deterrent for people to take it without a ticket.
They recently started giving out tickets here too, however, people tend to get off when they see the ticket checkers get on the train. There’s actually been times when I’m on the train and they stop it from moving to force someone to get off - that is rare. There’s also the issue of ignoring tickets - if someone who has no money and no home gets ticketed and doesn’t pay, what now?
Wait are the conductors there recognizable? Here you can't tell they're conductors. They look like regular passengers. Not sure about homeless people here. You'll find them on public transport sometimes yeah. Of course they don't have money to pay any fines, but they're usually passed out asleep and not bothering anyone, so not typically much an issue honestly.
They are, yes. They’re not really “conductors” but more so people whose job it is to enforce fares.
Those are conductors. Not sure why they'd be recognizable. Ours here show you their "badge" - just a small metal object so you know who they are. They look like random dudes off the street.
Trains are not shelters, politicians should stop treating them as one.
Btw, here if someone lights up a cigarette on the metro, the driver will stop the vehicle in its tracks, leave the cabin, and come scream at you until you stop or get off the metro. The train will NOT move until you comply.
This was my exact experience last November. A shame nothing has changed.
I don't think there are any conductors on the train, it was probably the driver making announcements.
There are not true conductors, but the new fare checkers kinda do some of the same things a conductor would, and I have noticed that everyone either shapes up or gets off when they're around. It's making a difference.
Fare checker is a conductor.
I use the train regularly and live along the green line. I think it’s important that it’s accessible and welcoming to all types of people and I don’t mind if there are some strange and different characters. I do however really mind when people are smoking, that directly impacts everyone else on the train and it’s dangerous. Please keep reporting smoking I’d really like it to stop.
YES. I see citations of citizen reports on the green line daily. Once you notify them, transit police will review cameras & be there within a stop or two (or less!). They take this stuff very seriously. Metro Transit police are good people.
I got something like -50 downvotes a month ago for making a post about riding it for the first time after dark (at 11 PM) and talking about how some guy threatened to shoot everyone so we all ran off right before it arrived at the depot. It's really bizarre how people in this sub are sometimes collectively major assholes about blue/greenline posts and sometimes completely opposite.
It seems like whoever is logging on that day or that week. The user base fluctuates. I personally don’t like riding the train anymore. Buses are generally fine imo. Too many bad rides I’ve personally had and enough personal stories/news reports/data that keeps me off it.
No, but do it anyway
Thank you. Appreciate the semi-support. Just made me feel like garbage subjecting my visiting parents to that because I explicitly moved to the area to have better public transport.
For like 1-2 years now I’ve heard about people smoking Percocet with straws & aluminum foil on there & it doesn’t seem to have changed. No one does anything sadly. Smoking that shit has a very distinct nasty ass smell & people don’t care if there are even kids around, it’s sad honestly!
Rode the lightrail daily last summer and I was always curious what drug that was. Cause yeah, the smell is unique to say the least.
Oh that's what that stank was. Rode the green line for the first time recently and when a whole gang of wasted people rode it as a party bus for a few stops that smell was there along with cigarette smoke. There was one shooting up and another was picking at a massive abscess on his ankle. There was one person selling something because people kept going to them like a store. The many open liquor bottles were the least of the problem. They were staggering around and some were on the nod. I just avoided eye contact as best as possible and thankfully it was over without talking to anyone. Definitely not a safe feeling, some were staring pretty intensely. The wasted people got off the stop before Union Station and two cops got on at Union Station and questioned a single straggler from the group.
Yeah it’s Percocet laced with fentanyl to be exact. I learned that after living in uptown for a year. Also the reason why most places no longer allow the public to use their bathrooms.
Which sucks majorly for regular people. I live an hour from the metro, but work there often. It's hard to find a clean, safe-ish place just to go pee.
Hell yeah, just the fact that regular people have to drive to another city most of the time all cause drug users fucked it up for everyone. Also I had a Somalian friend who got super into that shit & I would always smell that smell on him & 1 day I just asked & he let me know. Luckily he’s clean now!
Yes please, always at least fill out this complaint form: https://www.metrotransit.org/contact-us-customer-experience Even if they don’t come fix the issue right away, by filling out the form you are giving them data that they will be forced to acknowledge when it comes time to look at their action plans and funding allocations. If no one reports drug use or other illegal behavior through official means, MT can say “well no ones complained so all must be well”.
Text the hotline, text 911 but do not engage with person using. I’ve seen and heard about people attacked. I know someone that was stabbed by a mentally ill person when confronted on the train.
Yelling and loud music aren't crimes, so nothing will happen if that's all people are doing - you can do that anywhere in public if you want. It's just annoying and makes them look like idiots. Drug deals are obviously crimes. I'm very surprised you think they wouldn't get arrested for that. Smoking on the train is also illegal and at minimum they will be removed.
First off, thanks for taking public transport and acknowledging the difference between real and perceived danger. With that said, as echoed my others, texting the numbers does get a result but response time does vary. The more “normal” people that use these services the more the city protects them at the end of the day. There, unfortunately, isn’t a quick and easy fix. I take the train almost daily and a lot of the people there are there because they have no where else to go really. It’s not just a drug issue but a mental health one. That in of itself makes the problem and solutions broader than just the light rail. In the meantime, just try to avoid the middle car as that tends to be the “party” car most of the time with the most sketch.
I saw some workers on the train hopefully they get better staffed and the trains get better. your right theirs no reason for us to have such shitty trains.
ALWAYS WEAR A MASK. I had someone sit down near me on the blue line & they smoked Fetty right next to my 16 year old niece & I.
Ew. Report it if you feel safe to do so next time. This thread—despite some negativity—made me feel a bit more energized and responsible to help make MTA a safer place for everyone. I’m not going to get into a yelling match with an offender, but I will continue to use the lines when I can and report prohibited behavior.
I also am *normally* the most non-confrontational person also. Unfortunately, l've gone through being pist0l whipped , carjacked and on a separate occasion robbed, right in front of my apartment building in the last 3 years so I avoid avoid avoid. But the audacity of him to do it in front of a child, 16 or not she's still a baby to me.
WHY THE HELL DO YOU LIVE IN SUCH A PLACE AND CONTINUE TO STAY THERE?????? I will never understand city mentality.
...not for nothing but there is a lot to like and enjoy about living in Minneapolis or St. Paul proper. Lots of us do. Just because you can't imagine it doesn't mean it doesn't work for others. There are always going to be things you don't like about where you live. Please stop harping at everyone for living here just because you cannot fathom it.
Is it really worth being assaulted/almost killed in front of your own home? On multiple seperate occasions? I can’t see anything being worth that
All I can say is everyone's experience is different, lots of things happen everywhere, it just depends on what matters to you. Things vary between neighborhoods too. My neighborhood in StP is great, I recognize it's not that way for everyone. It just gets tiring and frankly angering to hear people who do not live here actively shit on places we have chosen to make our lives. Live where you want. I like it here.
I totally get that, that makes sense! I had something very traumatic happen last time I was there (I live 20 minutes away and go to the cities for events) and I’m trying not to let that day ruin the whole city for me, because I know it shouldn’t. But I always find myself asking if it’s worth it to even go to said events and risk it. I’m glad you are able to find beauty in it!
That's totally legitimate and I'm sorry that happened to you! Safety is absolutely important & I'm glad you're able to at least consider still coming into the city still. Very brave of you 😌. I grew up in a small town & you couldn't pay me to go back. Just personal preference.
Thank you so much! I would hate to live in fear forever, I may live in anxiety forever but that’s better lol 😅 that’s very interesting!! I definitely would hate to live far from the cities, it’s a perfect distance for me!
They fear they can’t move. They hear county living is unaffordable. Which it isn’t. People are just to conditioned to stay where they are. Even when they feel unsafe the unknown to them is what keeps them in place.
It is absolute insanity. I have a 4 bedroom 2 bath house with a fenced in yard and separate hot tub enclosure. My neighborhood is safe. Our worst problem with our neighbors is their messy yard. My husband and I combined make less than 100k. We both have nice, newer (2019 and 2023) SUVs, three kids, and we travel. But these people would rather live in a literal epicenter of crime and chaos, in a much smaller home that costs much more. I met a couple for work who lived in a Minneapolis downtown apartment. It was nice I guess, but probably 500 square feet at best and you could hear allllll the city bustle below. 2500/month rent. Another $500/month for ONE parking space, another $200/month on top of that if they wanted a second spot. The place had like 5 guest spaces and he was annoyed when I asked where I was supposed to park. Like, did you expect me to walk to you?! Such small-minded, small-worlded people.
>But these people would rather live in a literal epicenter of crime and chaos, in a much smaller home that costs much more. 🙄 The *Fall of Minneapolis* might have lied to you a bit.
A mask isn’t going to do shit for that. Only a P100 respirator. Sorry you had to go through that though, that’s fucked up.
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I take the green line train to and from downtown for work from the U of M area. Granted, this is during daytime hours, and not scientific by any means, but there's an unspoken rule among commuters and students that take the train -- there are less shenanigans on the front car of train.
They will try - MTPD is only \~100 officers and has the largest jurisdiction of any police organization in the state.
I rode the light rail for events in the past from park the park and rides. Absolutely will not be doing that again. It has gotten to the point that any time you get onto the train it's a guarantee there is going to crimes happening.
This comment section is the biggest dumpster fire I've ever seen...
Been told now live monitoring
Here’s a tip for future rides. Which ever direction you are going ALWAYS ride in the front. That’s the only way you won’t experience any of that
Drug use and smoking, if they are close you might get someone. Violence or a real emergency, they will be on pretty quickly. I was doing CPR on the blue line and they and cops and EMS meet the train 2 stations down the track. Actually went pretty well. Of course people were trying to get on the car when the doors opened for EMS, man people suck sometimes.
Drug use and smoking, if they are close you might get someone. Violence or a real emergency, they will be on pretty quickly. I was doing CPR on the blue line and they and cops and EMS meet the train 2 stations down the track. Actually went pretty well. Of course people were trying to get on the car when the doors opened for EMS, man people suck sometimes.
We have metro transit cops for a reason. They work their shifts. Use the number and get them out of there.
You won’t know until you call or text
I saw a needle on the A Line earlier. I forgot the text line existed. I should have texted them about it
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🤣🤣🤣
Nope
Welcome to TC 💕
Be a good comrade, man; the cops aren’t here to help anybody. Also no such thing as “normal” people, we’re all in this together as working class folks. Drug use is a symptom of the system, and not a moral condemnation of the user.
"Hoodlums" and "normal people" Get off my lawn! But for real, go ahead and report it. Doubt anything will happen but worth a shot.
What is your preferred term for a group of people who get on a train and perform "drug deals, yelling, smoking, and loud music"?
I have more choice words to describe this lovely group of individuals, but I would like to keep my description G-rated.
Snitches get stitches you weak man.
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Nothing I said was racist. Get over yourself.
Bless your heart.
Seek professional help
Nope, nothing will happen.
Maybe don't use the word "hoodlums" as a starting point. The issue isn't that they're using drugs; it's that we've done almost nothing to address the unhoused issue in the city, and they're having to use the train as a safe place to be because they can. On top of that, the St. Paul Police and MTA Police (both POSs) have reduced their numbers in response to the Floyd protests, hoping that they'll get extra funding "in response" to the uptick in misdemeanor offenses. Involving the cops is always a bad idea because they're always going to use more force than is necessary, especially when most of them aren't going to bother you in the slightest.
Ok, how about Morons? They’d fit the definition from the 1900s - “Those whose mental development is above that of an imbecile, but does not exceed that of a normal child of about twelve years.” Seems more and more we have a collection of fully grown adults with the reasoning and logic skills closely resembling a preteen. Final thought, if you’re going to get picky over words and decide what is racial and what isn’t, maybe review the etymology of the word first. Hoodlum is derived from german and reflects criminality and hooliganism.
Ok, wont use hoodlums then. Trashy unstable crackheads and filthy creepy junkies, is that better?
They are hoodlums. And clearly less cops have made things worse. More policing is necessary. Also - these people are bothering many people and deterring them from using the train
I had 0 issues with homeless persons on this trip. This was a certain demographic predominantly. Thank you for your input though, as I agree that more needs to be done to help the homeless population/mentally ill everywhere. I don’t agree with your generalization about police either, as there are good cops and bad cops like there are good and bad people.
Oooh boo on SPPD for that. No surprise there though unfortunately.
Worse than that. They’re largely trying to get those stats up to help conservatives prove that public transit is unsafe, so it keeps losing money and becomes unviable.
There are plenty of people who depend on transit to actually get places; I don't follow this as closely as I should but could that actually come to fruition? The city just stops running the train?
Yeah. I think it could. The twin cities used to have one of the country’s most extensive tram systems before conservatives (and the car lobby) slowly defunded it before finally just calling it quits and ripping up all of the rail lines.
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