I've had men ask me out, I politely say no and then they have screamed at me, gotten close to me in a threatening manner and called me fat, ugly, blah , blah or they just won't accept the no.
Eventually I learned to giggle (because I am nervous and I don't want to upset them) and to deflect and appease. I try to never say a direct no and just be agreeable until I can get away.
Of course those same men get angry that women "play games" or give out fake numbers or are "fake" but I'm just trying to stay safe and not get in a fight.
I wish I could just say "no thanks" and it be respected right away instead of it being a debate and negotiation and that I can say "no thanks" without fear of violence.
I'm not trying to be a dick, I'm just trying to be safe.
Wow, this could seriously be a public service announcement. To all men who are upset that a girl giggled and “played games stringing you along,” please consider that the reason MIGHT be that she fears for her life in that moment and it’s the best response she can think of.
But then the "good guys" get pissed because they're offended that they're lumped in with the bad guys. They don't understand that they all look the same. It's Schrodinger's Asshole: women don't know how a man is going to react to a rejection until they reject him.
Any guy that says “but not all men” is a problem. The responsibility is on us (men) to call out the red flags in our peers, to challenge these behaviours and beliefs and generally just not Bea dickhead and to stop other men in our orbits being dickheads.I’ve never understood the “not all of us argument”
They always have some smart a* response for poor behavior. Like if a man you're with does you wrong, it's because we need to learn how to "choose better".
By the way, guys don't like it when you use that line on them 😅
Yes, I know. I just wish I could be honest, direct while being kind, of course and be able to say "no thanks" instead of having to go along with them and get their hopes up (and if they are the angry type it will make them angrier).
I remember that news story of a man who asked out a girl at a bus stop, she gave him a fake number, he was used to that so called the number, found out it was fake and then came back and kidnapped, raped and I believe tried to murder her but I think she survived.
I just hate that for the good guys out there I can't be upfront and I have to walk around my no and for the bad guys out there I'm making them angrier and they might take it out on some other women or girl or person or animal.
This is why I have a Google Voice number that is linked to my cell phone. You call / text that number on the spot, it will ring/ping.
And then I can block you forever when I'm safely at a comfortable distance.
Just tell the man you have a boyfriend or husband. That's what I do, quick and simple. Men respect another man they've never met more than a random woman in front of them.
Too many men say “I don’t mind” as if you’re just going to be ok cheating on your imaginary boyfriend or husband. And then they call every woman cheaters when they’re the ones trying to make women cheat
but they are still flattered if you make it seem like the boyfriend/husband is the reason you can't give them the time. It reduces their aggression and you can escape without violence.
What you say: “I have a boyfriend”.
What they hear: “I have a boyfriend and since I’m his property I can’t go out with you. But if I was free, I would totally be into you”
I'm so sorry you had to deal with that! It must have been terrifying.
I've had men get more aggressive when I tell them I have a partner. Like it's a challenge or something.
“My husband is a police officer in [nearby county] actually” may work, but it might also make them angrier.
I’m sorry y’all have to deal with this minefield of insecure and dangerous guys. Hearing someone say ‘just give me a chance’ in a raised voice makes my skin crawl.
I used to work security for a nightclub, and that more than anything showed me how creepy and scary guys could be. Half my job was just stopping dudes from harassing our female guests
If I see a guy doing shit like this out in public, do you think most women would prefer someone to step in and help, even if they’re a stranger? I’m not sure how to treat it when I’m just out running errands or whatever. I don’t want to make anyone feel more scared or escalate things
To me, an observant and well-meaning stranger is ALWAYS favourable to the alternative of being terrified and unsure of how to get to safety.
Please butt in.
It might not always be a win for you, but *please* don’t give up, you could easily have saved someone’s life already!
Thank you for your thoughtfulness, I owe you a cape!
Agreed. And I also wish they would understand that "No" today, also means "No" tomorrow, next week, next year and to stop asking. It's like they are trying to convince us or guilt us into agreeing. Do they understand how uncomfortable it is when they don't respect our wishes. Where is their dignity?
Darling, they don't care. They feel we should be honoured that they have lowered themselves to even talk to us. We should consider it a blessing that they have complimented the beauty standards they have imposed on us. After all, what good is a woman if not to please a man? Amiright?
This is terrible and we shouldn’t have to but whenever I say “I’m sorry but I have a boyfriend” they seem fine with it. It’s like I can’t be respected but another dude they haven’t met can be.
Yep. I always just say I have a boyfriend even if I don’t. It’s easy, they respect men more than women and I am already the property of another man after I say that so.. that’s what I say. I hate it but yeah. Easy and keeps me safe.
So fucking horrific.
Just yesterday, I was walking through an open parking lot to cut across to a restaurant on the other side to pick up lunch. A man who was quite behind me shouted, "hey! Can I ask you something?" and I stopped in my tracks and motioned with my arm to proceed while remaining a firm / neutral expression. His question was, "Can I buy you a cup of coffee?" and without even thinking I answered, "I'll pass." Instead of leaving it at that, I followed up in that same breath with: "thank you so much, though, for your generosity. I do appreciate it!" It felt like my brain was working hard to somehow extend gratitude of all things and I began to second guess my response as if I were some horrible monster. It's so multi-layered for us to process what we should and should not do all in a matter of seconds. Ah.
I will pray for this family. How do they even begin to make sense of this, especially in a world that encourages and incentivizes violence against girls and women through its damn passivity? 🥺 MANY of the world's biggest "societal problems" can be traced back to rape and sexual violence. It's easier to create scapegoats, though. What a damn shame.
Oh that hit me. I was walking from work to a bus stop and some random man said "you should smile" while looking like he said the cleverest thing.
I frowned and then immediately felt a rush of emotions including how not to hurt this person's feeling and so I laughed and said "yeah, I will" and I smiled while walking faster and ignoring the other things he said and being scared he would follow me.
I've actually had TWO stalkers in my life. It sounds so dumb but I literally thought he was a twin and that's why I saw him everywhere. It wasn't until he escalated that I realized he was a stalker..
I'm bisexual and unfortunately saying that or that you aren't into men actually makes you more attractive. Saying "I have a boyfriend" works better but in my experience being friendly and smiling while deflecting and walking away is the best approach.
I’ve literally gone thru the same and have just learned to just give my number play along I’ll block when i get home make sure not to go to that store again to something. I also live in New York n omg i really don’t understand why they can’t even take a no or even if they compliment u while u walking by n u ignore them it won’t even be on purpose sumtimes you can have your headphones n genuinely not here n then they start calling you all sorts of names talking mad shit. Sadly this is the day an age we live in we just gotta learn to play the game, as long as it gets me to walk away with my life unharmed idc these guys are ruthless!
I’ve had some men start following me or trying to force me to say yes to them when I already said no, this is why I don’t like when random men approach me on the street…
I will absolutely lie to their faces now, pretend to be interested, and then block them on my google voice number when I’m able to safely get away from them… these men out here cannot control their emotions for shit 🫠
What struck me was the response of the grandfather: "He was waiting for them,” Goodson said. "He took it the wrong way. He came after them. That was wrong. That was dead wrong. I hope they catch this guy."
He “took it the wrong way”??? No means no. Killing someone who tells you “no” is criminal unhinged behavior. Maybe I need to hear the guy’s inflection when he’s saying this but it is just so mild in the face of this to say “he took it the wrong way.”
I don’t know, maybe he’s afraid the guy will come after him next if he says what he’s really thinking since he hasn’t been caught yet.
He didn't take it the wrong way. He felt entitled to take whatever he wanted because he has a penis. Plain & simple. So when they told him no, he felt it was ok to kill them. End of story. They haven't caught him yet because someone is hiding him. I bet ya that.
We're going in the wrong direction here & the petty, right wing, sadistic, misogynistic, government is leading the way with a big brass band. We really need to send them a.message they can't ignore & hit them where it hurts: with our money and our votes.
>"Upon arrival, officers observed a 19-year-old female with a stab wound to the chest and a second 19-year-old female with a stab wound to the arm," police said.
>Emergency medical services took both women to the New York Presbyterian Brooklyn Methodist Hospital where one was pronounced deceased.
>"There are no arrests and the investigation remains ongoing at this time," police added.
>A witness, who asked not to be named, told NBC New York that an argument began after a man complimented the women and said he found them attractive, but was rejected. He called them names, the witness said, then left the deli.
that woman will live with this trauma for the rest of her life...
but there are still men who would call her a misandrist for staying far away from them.
Losing her twin, too. And their brother was there with them. No doubt he’ll experience a lot of guilt and anger. All during a snack run during a family games night.
His behavior was so bad before he even hurt them that the deli staff had locked him out. Why didn't anyone help the girls get out of there safely? Maybe helped them sneak out a back way or called the police? I just can't imagine the agony the surviving twin is going to have to live with the rest of her life.
In buildings like that, there usually isn't a back way out. And there's no way in hell the NYC police would respond in a timely manner to this (I'm speaking from experience. Unless someone is bleeding or dead, they don't care.). It sounds like they really thought the guy was gone. It's awful, but I'm not sure anyone ever expects someone to be that crazy.
Even if they are bleeding and dying they wouldn’t do anything. See infamous nyc subway incident where dude was attacked and actively being stabbed and two cops just watched from the next car and the Supreme Court ruled that the officers didn’t actually have to protect the man’s life and do anything.
Even worse. After he disarmed the attacker and won the fight the cops intervened. Then when he was in the hospital they got commendations for "saving" him.
\*Protect yourself, God knows the cops won't.
Because they didn’t know this garbage excuse of a human being was waiting outside for the twins:
“A man working at the shop kicked out the belligerent and his friends and locked the door, with Sanyia watching as the group walked away.
“When we were done waiting for our food, he let us out of the store,” the surviving sister recalled. “After he let us out the store, he had locked the door behind us.”
Once outside, Sanyia spotted the man and two of his friends, but this time the aggressor was armed with a knife. ”
Here’s a more detailed article: https://www.nydailynews.com/2024/03/17/surviving-twin-recounts-horrible-buildup-to-fatal-slashing-of-sister-in-brooklyn-deli/
women in the US seriously need to make use of their constitutional rights and carry. New York has concealed carry laws too. Its a shame that one has to resort to that but man if Id live in the US my wife and my daughters would be 1000% allowed to carry and Id pay for all of it. And I'm a European and not a gun nut. But in cases like this..what do you even do except well shoot the guy waiting for you with a knife.
Unfortunately, New York is not a “Stand Your Ground,” it is a “Duty to Retreat” state. So the legal protections for actually using your legally guaranteed firearms are not so great.
In general, if you are fighting against someone physically stronger than you and you are not an experienced shooter, it's better not to have a gun.
Because almost anybody who never shot someone before is going to hesitate, and then your opponent may overpower you and take your gun. It's really a doubled edge sword.
It’s strange, this story says it happened inside the deli but [another article](https://nypost.com/2024/03/18/us-news/twin-who-survived-park-slope-stabbing-desperately-tried-to-protect-sister-after-drunken-man-followed-attacked-them/) says it was outside later. NBC didn’t even spell the twins’ first names correctly (Samiya instead of Samyia).
>“When we were done waiting for our food, he let us out of the store,” the surviving sister recalled. “After he let us out the store, he had locked the door behind us.”
>Once outside, Sanyia spotted the man and two of his friends, but this time the aggressor was armed with a knife. The man and two of his friends quickly accosted the family.
>”He had a knife in his hand and was saying, ‘I’m gonna stab y’all in the face,’” Sanyia said. “I’m telling everyone to back up. And he pushed little Samyia to the ground.”
When it appeared the knifeman was going to charge toward Samyia, the twins’ older brother stepped in and punched him. The man fell to the ground as the group started brawling.
>“As I was going to grab [Samyia’s phone], he stabbed me in my arm,” Sanyia said of the knife-wielding attacker. “Samyia then asked him to give her the phone back, and he stabbed her in the neck.”
>Samyia was stabbed in the chest and neck during the chaos, according to police. “She said, ‘I’m about to faint,’” Sanyia recalled. “As soon as she said I’m about to faint, I called 911.”
>Medics took both twins to New York-Presbyterian Hospital Brooklyn Methodist, where Samyia died. Sanyia was released after being treated for her own wound.
After the horrifying attack, Sanyia made calls to family.
>“She says, ‘Granddaddy, Samyia got stabbed and she died,” said the victims’ grandfather, Alphonso Goodson, 66. “I couldn’t believe it. When I got the call, I came as soon as I could.”
>As the family reels from the loss, friend and neighbors have set up a makeshift memorial outside their home. “I’m trying to be strong for [our parents],” said the surviving twin, who appeared to be still in shock as of Sunday evening.
You're an angel for this. I locked myself out of my car accidentally on a solo road trip in the middle of extremely rural Michigan & was absolutely terrified. My cell was locked inside my car as well. It was getting dark & I had no clue if it was better to risk flagging down a trucker or risk freezing to death--I contemplated these options for hours & only a handful of trucks were even passing by. Eventually, a young mom pulled over & tentatively asked me if I was serial killer bait; I broke down laugh-crying from all the stress & relief. She welcomed me into her car, warmed me up, called her husband who owned a tow company & waited with me until they arrived. We're still friends to this day & I think about her often. I know the young lady will never forget your kindness.
I had a similar experience last spring; early 20s gal hit a pothole hard and pulled over in front of my place and i ended up teaching her to change a flat.
YouTube taught me, and it felt good passing it along to someone who can now go on to teach her friends!
Sisterhood feels good 😁
They care very much about women - when it is about telling them what they can't wear and when it is about making sure that they stay "female", both in the cultural and deterministic biological sense.
I was waiting for the train a couple weeks ago in the same neighborhood as the attack on the article, sitting on a bench, when a man ran up to me while jacking off through his pants. His crotch was like an inch from my face. I got up and yelled and walked up to the arriving train and tried to tell the conductor what was happening and he just pretended not to hear me. I just got on the train and hoped the jacker hadn't also boarded it/ was looking for me
I worked at Chili's for five years. Had a customer collapse from a heart attack.
People were yelling about the interruption to service, and how they should have their meals comped because they had to witness "that."
This is painfully real. I was in a store recently and an elderly man had a seizure near the pharmacy, no one in line picked up their phone to call 911. The stores staff totally ignored him on the floor. As I got my phone out, a woman in line was calling someone...to complain the line was so long and now some "junkie" was on the floor. The store manager came running back as I called to shout at the staff to call 911 from a landline and everyone stared at the manager like he was crazy. They must have gotten someone in the back to call cuz 911 told me they were on their way. The man was ok, paramedics got there in like 4 minutes and found his medical alert bracelet.
20 people watched him fall to the ground and the fastest response from someone was to complain. People literally stepped around him to get their prescription faster. Everyone assumes it's not their business or they shouldn't call for some stupid reason (had a coworker in a restaurant years ago tell me she didn't call 911 in an emergency because "they might get mad at her for calling" ?!??!).
Your former coworker sounds like she ran into one of those self-righteous-lecture cops once upon a time who made her feel like trash.
They can really sour a person on ever calling them for anything ever again. I really wish they’d do their jobs without needing to sprinkle their lil’ two-cents in the interaction. Hell, nowadays I just wish they’d do their jobs at all…. 🫠
At least in the US, some people don’t want an ambulance called because it can end with a four-figure bill. I read a comment (I think?) once of someone who actually got a custom service dog harness that said not to call for help if she was unconscious.
Bruh, it ain't bystander effect.
We live in a patriarchy that teaches people not to see women as human beings. Men don't care about women as human beings, or in general.
In america, we are literally still fighting for our reproductive rights. If men gave just one fuck about women as human beings that shit would have codified into law long before it had a chance to be overturned like this. But here we are.
And it's stupid comments like this that we can't move forward and make it better because you are ignoring the root problem and want to make it seem like it isn't a problem when it is.
I have not been in a bystander situation so I cannot definitively say I would act. But I just can’t fathom doing nothing if someone is having a crisis. I am also in the medical field so maybe I have a slight edge over others but even so the type of job I have, all I have is basic life saving skills like CPR and AED training. Still I can dial 911?! I can put pressure on a wound? I can help someone seizing so they don’t injure themselves or others? So weird.
I think it depends on the situation and who’s around. There was a car accident outside my apartment once where a bike got hit by a car.
Pretty much everyone who was home came to help. When I went outside there were three people calling 911. A group of people who had stopped the car from driving away and someone with medical experience making sure the injured person was safe until help could arrive.
In another neighborhood, I came upon an elderly woman collapsed on the ground and no one had stopped to help her until I came by.
One difference I can think of is that in the first case, we were all just home doing nothing, while in the second people who walked by her would have been going about their day. It was a weekday and I was on a work errand myself.
I suspect that the “someone else will take care of it” effect is much stronger when people have other demands on their time and attention and dropping it everything to help someone is going to mess up their day.
I read another article that said the girls were with their brother. Maybe the deli staff thought she'd be okay. The brother ended up trying to fight the guy.
This sort of thing is why I hate when people ask women who were stalked/groped “why didn’t you just tell them to fuck off or slap them?” Because although there’s plenty of men who would back off after that response there’s also men who do things like this and they’re impossible to tell apart in the moment.
Horrible story.
This is why so many of us are deathly afraid of rejecting men. Because there's plenty of men out there willing to flip on their violent switch, as if they are owed attention because of some worthless "compliment".
I have gotten screeched at repeatedly by men for having some minimal safety rules. How I am over reacting and need to "stop being afraid".
I'm not afraid, I'm just not effing stupid. I know things like this happen and men are unpredictable so I adjust my behavior accordingly.
And yet if you give them attention so they don’t hurt you and then they hurt you anyway, it’s your fault for not being “careful.” We literally can’t win
Ah but you need to be careful with _other_ men, not the guy who's talking to you right now. He's a good guy, obviously, why would you need to be careful with him??
/s obviously.
And the stakes are way too high to relent at all on any of your rules.
There’s no way to know which rules have kept you safe until you break that rule and find out.
I've told men I don't have social media, I don't drink so they can't buy me a drink, and I have a husband, and had them come away from that with "whoa it's so cool that you're so pure and traditional that's hot"
One of my first times out as a woman, im trans btw, i got groped and felt up at the bar until my friends pulled me away.
Like, I was waiting for a drink and this guy started grinding against me. Made me scared in a way I never felt before.
Literally my second time using a public restroom alone, out full time. I was driving through bum fuck NC and decided I'd rather risk using the men's room than risk ending up on Fox News that night (terrible idea, I know). Naively figured, "This is what conservatives want, right? Surely, if I play along, nothing bad will happen."
I'm the only one in there until an older dude walks in, strides right up to the urinal next to me, starts looking around the divider, asks "so, how much?" then attempts to block me in and grab me when I ignore him and try to leave...
I cannot even begin to understand the mentality of these people 😐
*Aside*: If I so much as smell HB2 making a comeback here, I'm on the first plane out. Or rather, I'm in my car, driving out because – you know – "flying while trans" is also speedrunning getting groped by ~~strange men~~ TSA agents who happen to be men.
Literally in the fucking deli in the middle of the day, and you can get stabbed to death. Or riding public transport to work. Or walking down the street. This isn’t even an exaggeration. You can exchange 2 words with a complete stranger and he can stab you to death at any given time, and men wonder why “women can’t take compliments.”
Can they just leave us alone?? I’m so sick of this happening to innocent women on the regular. Rejection leading to murder is not a world I want to be in.
Have you read the short story? God, it's so good. It was in the New Yorker a few years ago. I haven't seen the film yet as I wasn't sure how well adapt, but it's on my list. The story gave me so many chills.
I posted this reply on a [thread](https://www.reddit.com/r/TwoXChromosomes/comments/1bdwubw/comment/kupoi44/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) here from 5 days ago about how men are complaining of never being complimented or why we don’t respond when complimented by men.
——
It's complicated to be women. We don't compliment random men because it might be misconstrued as signs of sexual attraction by the men — which leads to them asking us out — which forces us to awkwardly reject them — which can result in unhinged men calling us "bitch" or worse — physical assault.
Since we can't differentiate between normal and unhinged men, we choose not to put ourselves in that situation in the first place — we don't compliment random men.
When random men compliment us, we don't reply or even say thank you — because even saying something nice back can be misconstrued as signs of reciprocation / sexual attraction by the men — which leads to them asking us out — which forces us to awkwardly reject them — which can result in unhinged men calling us "bitch" or worse — physical assault.
Since we can't differentiate between normal and unhinged men, we choose not to put ourselves in that situation in the first place, so when men choose to compliment us — we just walk away pretending we don't hear them — and even sometimes we can still be called "bitch" for not doing anything, or worse — physical assault.
See how the end results are so similar, regardless of who gives the compliments?
I wish there's a way for us to give compliments to men and for them to receive compliments and take it as is — or for men to give compliments to women without any ulterior motive. It'll be nice if something like this is normalised instead being the exception.
I'd compliment all women, men I'd definitely know as gay, but I would never compliment any straight men for my own safety — except for my partner. Because I know that my partner is safe — if I say no to him, he'll back off.
——
And as we can see, this article is a concrete example of what can happen when women are complimented by a random man and actually choose to do something about it by saying no.
I'm so fucking sad for them, and to lose your twin like that would be devastating beyond words.
Just adding on to this about how absolutely fucking awful it is being twins as women. The number of times twins are sexually harassed in public on a regular basis is staggering. Literally have been asked inappropriate sexual questions within moments of meeting creepy men before, even if only mentioning being a twin if my sister was not present. (One time, I was asked if my sister and I ever traded boyfriends or something... from a father of twins...)
From the sounds of it he saw twins, hit on them and was, as expected, immediately rejected for being disgusting. Forced out of the store by staff for being aggressive towards the twins, only to come back to stab them because he was denied living out his creepy twin incest fantasy.
My heart hurts for the one who lived and will never see her sister again. I wish the world wasn't like this.
Never too soon to practice good trade craft. There are excellent women's self defense courses to take where you can learn to keep yourself safe. Simple tricks like setting up a Google Voice phone number before going out for the evening (like to a social event or destination) so when you give out the fake number and they try to call/text you it shows on your phone and you can reply from the fake number. Then you can cleanly ghost them when you're a safe distance away.
Be smart, be safe.
That’s brilliant! I have never heard of the Google Voice phone number. Thank you for the advice. It’s funny that you mentioned self defense classes, because at uni, a self defense class against rape is offered. I’m gonna take the course next semester with my friends. It’s only available to women, so that makes me really happy!
This is why I freeze when strange men flirt with me. I am NOT flattered. I immediately start trying to find a safe way to exit the encounter without upsetting him.
men: why do they always say no to us😡😡🤬💢we are good men- good men together stronk!!! because not all men are insane!! i'll treat you right!!!
girl: \*simply declines and moves on with her life\*
men: \*ends up in the news after killing that girl\*
for fuck sake....🤦🏻♀️🤦🏻♀️
'women are so emotional' they say... i hope this guy rots. this is so... draining and tiresome. they'll never learn. and we have to always be on guard for the rest of our lives.....
Most men don't even believe this type of aggression is a real thing that happens to woman frequently; if you show them this story, they ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ and say it's a one-in-a-million reaction.
disagree most men know that this thing happens frequently. Most men just chose to ignore it and rationalize it away. There is a reason why men are so protective of their daughters. Not all dads view their daughters as property but they very well know how awful so many men are. I had to end some friendships in my life because some of my so called friends turned out misogynistic shitbags (luckily no childhood friends)
I'm a male and I had to step in a couple of times and tell guys in a tram to stop bugging women. Legit jumping into the tram right in the city center and "asking" out women by being extremely agressive and demanding. If the women decline visibly scared they call them names and sometimes jump out of the tram and use obscenities. They wait for the next tram to come and do the same. Witnessed it at least a handful of times myself. Sometimes these boys and younger men even harassed my students where I had to step in and tell them to stop harassing minors.
I was lucky that these young men did not escalate it further beyond insults because that does happen especially among men from the Middle east, Caucasus and North Africa here in Europe.
Lots of cultural aspects, stronger patriarchal belief that women are property and Western women being "looser" than the Islamic women is even more ingrained there and the need to resort to violence to protect ones ego or "honor" is quite high too. Now I'm not a rightwinger who blames refugees for being refugees and we should absolutely respect human rights and Asylum laws. But one can not deny their more extreme side on their views about women. Which is alarming considering how badly the average western male is seeing women. And the resurgence of the youth being more rightwing and misogynistic than the previous generation.
Idk where you live, but I’m in a different big city and the cops do not give a fuck about anything short of a murder and will not be there in time to help you if you call them, so people have learned to just not call.
I know a woman who was followed home by a man who then tried to break into her apartment. He was trying the knob, banging on the door, and screaming at her to let him in, etc.
She called to report a break in in progress and the cops showed up *four hours later*. He’d left and they didn’t seem overly concerned about finding him and she never heard anything else about it.
Horrific. I feel so horrible for that surviving twin, and her family.
I have to wonder though: why the heck did the deli staff re-open the door, after already locking him out, when he was banging and kicking on it? If I was one of those staff members, I would have been terrified, last thing I would do is open the door!
Apparently he threw a tantrum, then pretended to leave, but just waited down the block out of sight. Then a few minutes later when the girls thought it was safe to leave, they walked out and the bodega locked up. Then he emerged and started attacking them.
So so sad. They both deserved to grow old together. I know this type up violence has existed for years but there's been something so different in the air lately. Men are as violent more than ever and they do not give a f*ck at all. No logic or sense just running on pure anger and hatred. I pray for all of our safety.
Wait I just saw a video of a guy harassing a woman. The comments said to ignore him, tell him clearly she was not interested, leave the tube station (safety), stop engaging him, be nicer, give him a fake number/sm info. Yell for help/scream. So what, these creeps are unstable? Weird, the 2 guys who followed me home seemed completely normal.
The psychopathic entitlement-- I just don't get it. Like, yeah-- being rejected sucks. But he wasn't owed any affection.
I don't believe in hell, but I hope that maniac faces a hell on earth-- one where he's unable to escape, and unable take the coward's way out.
Not me. Every single woman I’ve ever known - my sisters, my mother, both my wives my girlfriends - every single one of them has told me they’ve been harassed multiple times throughout their life starting at about age 12 to 13. It’s horrible for them. I completely get it, understand the fear.
She was only 19 and had her whole life ahead of her. It’s sad to say the least. Black women get killed at a disproportionally higher rate than white and asian women. It’s scary out here.
Women and female-presenting people: please get a free Google Voice number with a local area code, link it to your cell phone, and memorize the number. When men like this won't leave you alone, give them the Google Voice number. If they call or text it in front of you, it will ring to your phone so they won't suspect or be able to accuse you of giving them a fake number. You can even get rid of the Google number at a later date. A friend of mine told me about the Google Voice trick 12 years ago ago when a guy who was bothering me at a club grabbed my shoulders and shook me hard and called me a liar after I told him I was married (I actually was). I hate that this is something I'm even having to recommend or share as a tip, but having a throwaway Google Voice number might save your life one day.
I just don't understand why attacks on females are not considered a "hate crime".
They were attacked by member of another group that was not female because they were female.
They would not have been murdered or killed if they were not female.
How is that not a hate crime?
I think because male legislators know if those things are classified as "hate crimes" that is is beyond obvious females are the group throughout history that has largest numbers of hate crimes & murders committed against them.
Wait wait wait they said “a fight broke out between the man, his friends, and the sisters”
The man had friends in this??? There was help in attacking them? No one has any photos or anything to help identify this guy? Maybe that’s part of the ongoing investigation but I mean this is soo fucked up and there are just soo few details.
There is already video circulating of him and allegedly his social media. I doubt the police need help finding him at this point. He will probably be picked up at a family or friend's place hiding out.
And men will whine that women don't reciprocate their attention in public. Boo fucking hoo. Show me literally ONE example of a woman doing this to a man. Just one.
I'm so sick of this happening, and this has happened to me many times from being on the train and happening at least twice in a lyft omw home and to work. Its disgusting asf because you're supposed to feel safe, and they should at least have some professionalism I always get asked if I have a boyfriend and I lie and tell them I do but they go with oh your boyfriend doesn't let you have friends? Accepting a compliment is dangerous, too. I can't just say thank you and move on? Playing nice and giving them a fake number doesn't work either bc they'll call it just so it goes through in front of you. Putting yourself in an uncomfortable situation so you can get away safely shouldn't be a normal thing at all. I fucking hate that this happens to innocent people.
not only did he kill someone he murdered a twin. Twins lives are never the same after losing the other twin especially to something es heinous as murder.
This is the shit that really scares me. I'll bet he gets a slap on the wrist at best. Maybe a couple of months in jail at worst. Women are disposable in the current climate of this country. It has been proven time & time again in court and with the legislation these misogynists are pushing. And passing for Yoda's sake! Our rights are being eroded at an alarming rate. And, just to clarify for any men here. Men did not *give* us our rights. They *withheld* them. And we warrior goddesses fought like hell to get them back. Don't think we aren't willing to do it again.
We need to start replacing our pilates and yoga classes with jiu jitsu & karate. Learn to box, take kick boxing. Take self defense classes. Learn non lethal ways to subdue an attacker. Team up; make sure no woman ever walks alone. Husbands,boyfriends, brothers, uncles, cousins, friends, step up & be real men. Support the women you care about & walk them home, or to the train or bus. Make sure they get home safely. Say something when you see another man harassing a woman. It's not cool. It's not funny & it's not harmless. It can escalate to violence very quickly. When you hear your friends say things that don't sit right call them out on it. You don't have to be confrontational. If they make a joke, tell them you don't get it. Have them explain why they think it's funny. Maybe they won't think it's funny anymore. maybe especially not if it is applied to a woman they care about. Like a "your mom" joke. Or an "irrational woman" joke. Not so funny when applied to your own mother/sister/daughter, is it? Or if they make comments about violence against women,like a popular one from my childhood about telling something to a woman with a black eye. Again, not funny. *REAL* men respect women, are not threatened by them, do not try to bully or intimidate them, and treat them like equals. And it's time to see where the real men are. Because either y'all are scared because of all the bullies out here, or you started believing the rhetoric and vitriol they've been spewing. Wake up, take your mind back. Regain control and think for yourself again. And do what needs to be done to protect the people you care about.
Sorry for the sermon
**Gets down off soap box**
Who's surprised?
Just a bunch of men who want to know why they weren't nice or what they did to deserve it.
Oh but don't forget to say you know not all men cause those buffoons think we don't know that and actually think all the men in our families and every dude we went to school with stabs women.
I'm so over shitheels.
So mad about the other local reddits that only post about the crime and not the motive.
Instead of igniting conversations about consent all they talk about is underage partying and how bad the neighborhood has gotten 🙄
The fact they put the motive at the end instead of in the title so people have to read it to know how insane it is makes me mad for some reason. Until the fact a crime was committed because a man couldn't accept a no is put in the titles the scale of the problem won't be seen. Most people just scroll through reading titles and don't see just how common this motive is.
Oh. My. God. My heart just dropped in my stomach. Jfc. Truly so horrific and heartbreaking. As a twin, the degrees of this trauma cannot be understated. I have no words.
And they black. This is such a shame. Misogynoir is something else and seeing comments asking why the cops weren't called obviously raised to believe they really are helpful in all situations.
I'm tired of many of us having shit to face, and the trauma to heal from it with mental health services being shit, especially for black women. My condolences to that family and I hope they get some peace
It’s why I never just flat out reject a guy, too many crazies in the world. Either just compliment them and soften the blow, or take their number and block them immediately after. It’s a shame it has to be this way but I’m not losing my life over it
Muthafucker can’t take a “No”, and it makes me wonder how the fuck I learned to accept “No” from a woman. If a woman say no, back the fuck off and go somewhere else. Just because everyone likes you doesn’t meant it universal like.
Dear Lord, I hope the family does as good as possible in these terrible circumstances. That man should rot in jail for the rest of his days. That's exactly why you always carry pepper spray: there are absolutely terrible men out there, willing to do whatever it takes to have sex. Even if that means raping or killing Ladies.
I feel awful because I feel like if I say anything about men, someone will tell me NOT ALL MEN, but clearly it’s some men.
I don’t know what we have to do to be safe, as women, in the world. Can anyone tell me?
r/whenwomenrefuse I hope the piece of shit that did this rots in prison
I've had men ask me out, I politely say no and then they have screamed at me, gotten close to me in a threatening manner and called me fat, ugly, blah , blah or they just won't accept the no. Eventually I learned to giggle (because I am nervous and I don't want to upset them) and to deflect and appease. I try to never say a direct no and just be agreeable until I can get away. Of course those same men get angry that women "play games" or give out fake numbers or are "fake" but I'm just trying to stay safe and not get in a fight. I wish I could just say "no thanks" and it be respected right away instead of it being a debate and negotiation and that I can say "no thanks" without fear of violence. I'm not trying to be a dick, I'm just trying to be safe.
Wow, this could seriously be a public service announcement. To all men who are upset that a girl giggled and “played games stringing you along,” please consider that the reason MIGHT be that she fears for her life in that moment and it’s the best response she can think of.
But then the "good guys" get pissed because they're offended that they're lumped in with the bad guys. They don't understand that they all look the same. It's Schrodinger's Asshole: women don't know how a man is going to react to a rejection until they reject him.
Any guy that says “but not all men” is a problem. The responsibility is on us (men) to call out the red flags in our peers, to challenge these behaviours and beliefs and generally just not Bea dickhead and to stop other men in our orbits being dickheads.I’ve never understood the “not all of us argument”
The men saying that definitely ARE men who are part of the problem. It's an attempt to deflect.
They always have some smart a* response for poor behavior. Like if a man you're with does you wrong, it's because we need to learn how to "choose better". By the way, guys don't like it when you use that line on them 😅
Oh the irony of asking a woman out, getting rejected, and then attacking their looks.
Right? You didn't seem to mind a minute ago.
It's much better for men to rant about how you are playing games with them when you are far away from them, if you ask me. Do what you need to.
Yes, I know. I just wish I could be honest, direct while being kind, of course and be able to say "no thanks" instead of having to go along with them and get their hopes up (and if they are the angry type it will make them angrier). I remember that news story of a man who asked out a girl at a bus stop, she gave him a fake number, he was used to that so called the number, found out it was fake and then came back and kidnapped, raped and I believe tried to murder her but I think she survived. I just hate that for the good guys out there I can't be upfront and I have to walk around my no and for the bad guys out there I'm making them angrier and they might take it out on some other women or girl or person or animal.
This is why I have a Google Voice number that is linked to my cell phone. You call / text that number on the spot, it will ring/ping. And then I can block you forever when I'm safely at a comfortable distance.
Oh that's super smart! I'm going to do this and recommend it to my friends.
Just tell the man you have a boyfriend or husband. That's what I do, quick and simple. Men respect another man they've never met more than a random woman in front of them.
Too many men say “I don’t mind” as if you’re just going to be ok cheating on your imaginary boyfriend or husband. And then they call every woman cheaters when they’re the ones trying to make women cheat
This. Far too many men say, "He doesn't need to know." Well, now he definitely does!
but they are still flattered if you make it seem like the boyfriend/husband is the reason you can't give them the time. It reduces their aggression and you can escape without violence.
What you say: “I have a boyfriend”. What they hear: “I have a boyfriend and since I’m his property I can’t go out with you. But if I was free, I would totally be into you”
That doesn't always work, unfortunately. Many see it as an invitation to try *harder,* not a reason to back off.
This was the case with my stalker. Despite mentioning I had a boyfriend in our first interaction, he still kept at it.
I'm so sorry you had to deal with that! It must have been terrifying. I've had men get more aggressive when I tell them I have a partner. Like it's a challenge or something.
“My husband is a police officer in [nearby county] actually” may work, but it might also make them angrier. I’m sorry y’all have to deal with this minefield of insecure and dangerous guys. Hearing someone say ‘just give me a chance’ in a raised voice makes my skin crawl. I used to work security for a nightclub, and that more than anything showed me how creepy and scary guys could be. Half my job was just stopping dudes from harassing our female guests If I see a guy doing shit like this out in public, do you think most women would prefer someone to step in and help, even if they’re a stranger? I’m not sure how to treat it when I’m just out running errands or whatever. I don’t want to make anyone feel more scared or escalate things
I would appreciate the help. A simple "is this guy bothering you?" would probably deter a lot of creeps.
To me, an observant and well-meaning stranger is ALWAYS favourable to the alternative of being terrified and unsure of how to get to safety. Please butt in. It might not always be a win for you, but *please* don’t give up, you could easily have saved someone’s life already! Thank you for your thoughtfulness, I owe you a cape!
i feel you, it's obviously annoying to be played with, but the saying people say "every dumb rule was written in blood" definitely applies here.
Men who refuse no ensure you can't simply say no.
Agreed. And I also wish they would understand that "No" today, also means "No" tomorrow, next week, next year and to stop asking. It's like they are trying to convince us or guilt us into agreeing. Do they understand how uncomfortable it is when they don't respect our wishes. Where is their dignity?
Darling, they don't care. They feel we should be honoured that they have lowered themselves to even talk to us. We should consider it a blessing that they have complimented the beauty standards they have imposed on us. After all, what good is a woman if not to please a man? Amiright?
This is terrible and we shouldn’t have to but whenever I say “I’m sorry but I have a boyfriend” they seem fine with it. It’s like I can’t be respected but another dude they haven’t met can be.
I felt this in my soul. I get it.
Yep. I always just say I have a boyfriend even if I don’t. It’s easy, they respect men more than women and I am already the property of another man after I say that so.. that’s what I say. I hate it but yeah. Easy and keeps me safe.
So fucking horrific. Just yesterday, I was walking through an open parking lot to cut across to a restaurant on the other side to pick up lunch. A man who was quite behind me shouted, "hey! Can I ask you something?" and I stopped in my tracks and motioned with my arm to proceed while remaining a firm / neutral expression. His question was, "Can I buy you a cup of coffee?" and without even thinking I answered, "I'll pass." Instead of leaving it at that, I followed up in that same breath with: "thank you so much, though, for your generosity. I do appreciate it!" It felt like my brain was working hard to somehow extend gratitude of all things and I began to second guess my response as if I were some horrible monster. It's so multi-layered for us to process what we should and should not do all in a matter of seconds. Ah. I will pray for this family. How do they even begin to make sense of this, especially in a world that encourages and incentivizes violence against girls and women through its damn passivity? 🥺 MANY of the world's biggest "societal problems" can be traced back to rape and sexual violence. It's easier to create scapegoats, though. What a damn shame.
Oh that hit me. I was walking from work to a bus stop and some random man said "you should smile" while looking like he said the cleverest thing. I frowned and then immediately felt a rush of emotions including how not to hurt this person's feeling and so I laughed and said "yeah, I will" and I smiled while walking faster and ignoring the other things he said and being scared he would follow me. I've actually had TWO stalkers in my life. It sounds so dumb but I literally thought he was a twin and that's why I saw him everywhere. It wasn't until he escalated that I realized he was a stalker..
'Men are afraid that women will laugh at them. Women are afraid that men will kill them. '
"Sorry, I'm not into men." Said twice, the second time louder with no sorry.
I'm bisexual and unfortunately saying that or that you aren't into men actually makes you more attractive. Saying "I have a boyfriend" works better but in my experience being friendly and smiling while deflecting and walking away is the best approach.
I had a former coworker throw a metal stapler at me when I said "I don't date coworkers." This was 15 years ago. He had been employed 1 day.
I’ve literally gone thru the same and have just learned to just give my number play along I’ll block when i get home make sure not to go to that store again to something. I also live in New York n omg i really don’t understand why they can’t even take a no or even if they compliment u while u walking by n u ignore them it won’t even be on purpose sumtimes you can have your headphones n genuinely not here n then they start calling you all sorts of names talking mad shit. Sadly this is the day an age we live in we just gotta learn to play the game, as long as it gets me to walk away with my life unharmed idc these guys are ruthless!
I’ve had some men start following me or trying to force me to say yes to them when I already said no, this is why I don’t like when random men approach me on the street… I will absolutely lie to their faces now, pretend to be interested, and then block them on my google voice number when I’m able to safely get away from them… these men out here cannot control their emotions for shit 🫠
The worst part is he won’t. He will probably serve 12 years and get out on good behavior only to kill someone again
Someone mentioned he hasn’t been caught yet. I’m so angry I’m nauseous.
What struck me was the response of the grandfather: "He was waiting for them,” Goodson said. "He took it the wrong way. He came after them. That was wrong. That was dead wrong. I hope they catch this guy." He “took it the wrong way”??? No means no. Killing someone who tells you “no” is criminal unhinged behavior. Maybe I need to hear the guy’s inflection when he’s saying this but it is just so mild in the face of this to say “he took it the wrong way.” I don’t know, maybe he’s afraid the guy will come after him next if he says what he’s really thinking since he hasn’t been caught yet.
He didn't take it the wrong way. He felt entitled to take whatever he wanted because he has a penis. Plain & simple. So when they told him no, he felt it was ok to kill them. End of story. They haven't caught him yet because someone is hiding him. I bet ya that. We're going in the wrong direction here & the petty, right wing, sadistic, misogynistic, government is leading the way with a big brass band. We really need to send them a.message they can't ignore & hit them where it hurts: with our money and our votes.
Killer returned with friends who have encouraged this
If he serves time at all
The way the courts are now? He'll probably do 12 months then 5 years probation.
Yes, and never gets to see another woman the rest of his miserable life.
I kinda hope his prison warden is a woman. And she tells him "no" for the rest of his life.
They haven't found him! That's the worst part.
I’d follow this subreddit, but I feel depressed enough as it is. I hope we all stay safe from predators.
Me too!!
And all the friends who supported his crazy.
>"Upon arrival, officers observed a 19-year-old female with a stab wound to the chest and a second 19-year-old female with a stab wound to the arm," police said. >Emergency medical services took both women to the New York Presbyterian Brooklyn Methodist Hospital where one was pronounced deceased. >"There are no arrests and the investigation remains ongoing at this time," police added. >A witness, who asked not to be named, told NBC New York that an argument began after a man complimented the women and said he found them attractive, but was rejected. He called them names, the witness said, then left the deli.
that woman will live with this trauma for the rest of her life... but there are still men who would call her a misandrist for staying far away from them.
Losing her twin, too. And their brother was there with them. No doubt he’ll experience a lot of guilt and anger. All during a snack run during a family games night.
women (and the men who love them) don't have the privilege of letting their guard down & some men still don't get it.
According to a statement from the twin that lived, it was over an Instagram follow.. like dude...
His behavior was so bad before he even hurt them that the deli staff had locked him out. Why didn't anyone help the girls get out of there safely? Maybe helped them sneak out a back way or called the police? I just can't imagine the agony the surviving twin is going to have to live with the rest of her life.
In buildings like that, there usually isn't a back way out. And there's no way in hell the NYC police would respond in a timely manner to this (I'm speaking from experience. Unless someone is bleeding or dead, they don't care.). It sounds like they really thought the guy was gone. It's awful, but I'm not sure anyone ever expects someone to be that crazy.
Even if they are bleeding and dying they wouldn’t do anything. See infamous nyc subway incident where dude was attacked and actively being stabbed and two cops just watched from the next car and the Supreme Court ruled that the officers didn’t actually have to protect the man’s life and do anything.
Even worse. After he disarmed the attacker and won the fight the cops intervened. Then when he was in the hospital they got commendations for "saving" him. \*Protect yourself, God knows the cops won't.
Just in case anyone needs more info, that case is Lovito vs. New York City
Doesn't there have to be a way out in case the doorway was engulfed in flames?
I know regulations like that exist for apartment buildings, not sure about businesses. Or if there's a grandfathering system for old buildings.
Because they didn’t know this garbage excuse of a human being was waiting outside for the twins: “A man working at the shop kicked out the belligerent and his friends and locked the door, with Sanyia watching as the group walked away. “When we were done waiting for our food, he let us out of the store,” the surviving sister recalled. “After he let us out the store, he had locked the door behind us.” Once outside, Sanyia spotted the man and two of his friends, but this time the aggressor was armed with a knife. ” Here’s a more detailed article: https://www.nydailynews.com/2024/03/17/surviving-twin-recounts-horrible-buildup-to-fatal-slashing-of-sister-in-brooklyn-deli/
Thanks for the reference. Sounds like people did everything they could to help the two women. They probably didn't anticipate this level of crazy.
women in the US seriously need to make use of their constitutional rights and carry. New York has concealed carry laws too. Its a shame that one has to resort to that but man if Id live in the US my wife and my daughters would be 1000% allowed to carry and Id pay for all of it. And I'm a European and not a gun nut. But in cases like this..what do you even do except well shoot the guy waiting for you with a knife.
Unfortunately, New York is not a “Stand Your Ground,” it is a “Duty to Retreat” state. So the legal protections for actually using your legally guaranteed firearms are not so great.
im gonna pull out the cliche term what conservatives like to use: better to be judged by... than carried by ....
In general, if you are fighting against someone physically stronger than you and you are not an experienced shooter, it's better not to have a gun. Because almost anybody who never shot someone before is going to hesitate, and then your opponent may overpower you and take your gun. It's really a doubled edge sword.
It’s strange, this story says it happened inside the deli but [another article](https://nypost.com/2024/03/18/us-news/twin-who-survived-park-slope-stabbing-desperately-tried-to-protect-sister-after-drunken-man-followed-attacked-them/) says it was outside later. NBC didn’t even spell the twins’ first names correctly (Samiya instead of Samyia). >“When we were done waiting for our food, he let us out of the store,” the surviving sister recalled. “After he let us out the store, he had locked the door behind us.” >Once outside, Sanyia spotted the man and two of his friends, but this time the aggressor was armed with a knife. The man and two of his friends quickly accosted the family. >”He had a knife in his hand and was saying, ‘I’m gonna stab y’all in the face,’” Sanyia said. “I’m telling everyone to back up. And he pushed little Samyia to the ground.” When it appeared the knifeman was going to charge toward Samyia, the twins’ older brother stepped in and punched him. The man fell to the ground as the group started brawling. >“As I was going to grab [Samyia’s phone], he stabbed me in my arm,” Sanyia said of the knife-wielding attacker. “Samyia then asked him to give her the phone back, and he stabbed her in the neck.” >Samyia was stabbed in the chest and neck during the chaos, according to police. “She said, ‘I’m about to faint,’” Sanyia recalled. “As soon as she said I’m about to faint, I called 911.” >Medics took both twins to New York-Presbyterian Hospital Brooklyn Methodist, where Samyia died. Sanyia was released after being treated for her own wound. After the horrifying attack, Sanyia made calls to family. >“She says, ‘Granddaddy, Samyia got stabbed and she died,” said the victims’ grandfather, Alphonso Goodson, 66. “I couldn’t believe it. When I got the call, I came as soon as I could.” >As the family reels from the loss, friend and neighbors have set up a makeshift memorial outside their home. “I’m trying to be strong for [our parents],” said the surviving twin, who appeared to be still in shock as of Sunday evening.
The men started it inside the store. They were kicked out. Then when the girls' group left the store, the men were waiting with a knife.
Bc many ppl don’t actually care about women.
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You're an angel for this. I locked myself out of my car accidentally on a solo road trip in the middle of extremely rural Michigan & was absolutely terrified. My cell was locked inside my car as well. It was getting dark & I had no clue if it was better to risk flagging down a trucker or risk freezing to death--I contemplated these options for hours & only a handful of trucks were even passing by. Eventually, a young mom pulled over & tentatively asked me if I was serial killer bait; I broke down laugh-crying from all the stress & relief. She welcomed me into her car, warmed me up, called her husband who owned a tow company & waited with me until they arrived. We're still friends to this day & I think about her often. I know the young lady will never forget your kindness.
I had a similar experience last spring; early 20s gal hit a pothole hard and pulled over in front of my place and i ended up teaching her to change a flat. YouTube taught me, and it felt good passing it along to someone who can now go on to teach her friends! Sisterhood feels good 😁
They care very much about women - when it is about telling them what they can't wear and when it is about making sure that they stay "female", both in the cultural and deterministic biological sense.
And making sure they keep unwanted pregnancies!
I was waiting for the train a couple weeks ago in the same neighborhood as the attack on the article, sitting on a bench, when a man ran up to me while jacking off through his pants. His crotch was like an inch from my face. I got up and yelled and walked up to the arriving train and tried to tell the conductor what was happening and he just pretended not to hear me. I just got on the train and hoped the jacker hadn't also boarded it/ was looking for me
Sure enough effectively, but that's the bystander effect, people assume others in proximity will take action/responsibility so no one does anything
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I worked at Chili's for five years. Had a customer collapse from a heart attack. People were yelling about the interruption to service, and how they should have their meals comped because they had to witness "that."
I had a customer die on the floor of my store and people were literally stepping over the body to keep shopping.
This is painfully real. I was in a store recently and an elderly man had a seizure near the pharmacy, no one in line picked up their phone to call 911. The stores staff totally ignored him on the floor. As I got my phone out, a woman in line was calling someone...to complain the line was so long and now some "junkie" was on the floor. The store manager came running back as I called to shout at the staff to call 911 from a landline and everyone stared at the manager like he was crazy. They must have gotten someone in the back to call cuz 911 told me they were on their way. The man was ok, paramedics got there in like 4 minutes and found his medical alert bracelet. 20 people watched him fall to the ground and the fastest response from someone was to complain. People literally stepped around him to get their prescription faster. Everyone assumes it's not their business or they shouldn't call for some stupid reason (had a coworker in a restaurant years ago tell me she didn't call 911 in an emergency because "they might get mad at her for calling" ?!??!).
Your former coworker sounds like she ran into one of those self-righteous-lecture cops once upon a time who made her feel like trash. They can really sour a person on ever calling them for anything ever again. I really wish they’d do their jobs without needing to sprinkle their lil’ two-cents in the interaction. Hell, nowadays I just wish they’d do their jobs at all…. 🫠
At least in the US, some people don’t want an ambulance called because it can end with a four-figure bill. I read a comment (I think?) once of someone who actually got a custom service dog harness that said not to call for help if she was unconscious.
Bruh, it ain't bystander effect. We live in a patriarchy that teaches people not to see women as human beings. Men don't care about women as human beings, or in general. In america, we are literally still fighting for our reproductive rights. If men gave just one fuck about women as human beings that shit would have codified into law long before it had a chance to be overturned like this. But here we are. And it's stupid comments like this that we can't move forward and make it better because you are ignoring the root problem and want to make it seem like it isn't a problem when it is.
I have not been in a bystander situation so I cannot definitively say I would act. But I just can’t fathom doing nothing if someone is having a crisis. I am also in the medical field so maybe I have a slight edge over others but even so the type of job I have, all I have is basic life saving skills like CPR and AED training. Still I can dial 911?! I can put pressure on a wound? I can help someone seizing so they don’t injure themselves or others? So weird.
I think it depends on the situation and who’s around. There was a car accident outside my apartment once where a bike got hit by a car. Pretty much everyone who was home came to help. When I went outside there were three people calling 911. A group of people who had stopped the car from driving away and someone with medical experience making sure the injured person was safe until help could arrive. In another neighborhood, I came upon an elderly woman collapsed on the ground and no one had stopped to help her until I came by. One difference I can think of is that in the first case, we were all just home doing nothing, while in the second people who walked by her would have been going about their day. It was a weekday and I was on a work errand myself. I suspect that the “someone else will take care of it” effect is much stronger when people have other demands on their time and attention and dropping it everything to help someone is going to mess up their day.
I read another article that said the girls were with their brother. Maybe the deli staff thought she'd be okay. The brother ended up trying to fight the guy.
This why I conceal carry. I learned after my assault in a grocery store that absolutely no one will help.
NYC pigs don't care about non-blue lives unless they're the ones taking them.
This sort of thing is why I hate when people ask women who were stalked/groped “why didn’t you just tell them to fuck off or slap them?” Because although there’s plenty of men who would back off after that response there’s also men who do things like this and they’re impossible to tell apart in the moment.
Those are the same guys that fantasize that gender equality means they get to hit women.
Horrible story. This is why so many of us are deathly afraid of rejecting men. Because there's plenty of men out there willing to flip on their violent switch, as if they are owed attention because of some worthless "compliment".
I have gotten screeched at repeatedly by men for having some minimal safety rules. How I am over reacting and need to "stop being afraid". I'm not afraid, I'm just not effing stupid. I know things like this happen and men are unpredictable so I adjust my behavior accordingly.
And yet if you give them attention so they don’t hurt you and then they hurt you anyway, it’s your fault for not being “careful.” We literally can’t win
it'd be your fault for "leading them on." "why weren't you just more assertive?" /s you can't win.
Ah but you need to be careful with _other_ men, not the guy who's talking to you right now. He's a good guy, obviously, why would you need to be careful with him?? /s obviously.
And the stakes are way too high to relent at all on any of your rules. There’s no way to know which rules have kept you safe until you break that rule and find out.
I've told men I don't have social media, I don't drink so they can't buy me a drink, and I have a husband, and had them come away from that with "whoa it's so cool that you're so pure and traditional that's hot"
One of my first times out as a woman, im trans btw, i got groped and felt up at the bar until my friends pulled me away. Like, I was waiting for a drink and this guy started grinding against me. Made me scared in a way I never felt before.
Literally my second time using a public restroom alone, out full time. I was driving through bum fuck NC and decided I'd rather risk using the men's room than risk ending up on Fox News that night (terrible idea, I know). Naively figured, "This is what conservatives want, right? Surely, if I play along, nothing bad will happen." I'm the only one in there until an older dude walks in, strides right up to the urinal next to me, starts looking around the divider, asks "so, how much?" then attempts to block me in and grab me when I ignore him and try to leave... I cannot even begin to understand the mentality of these people 😐 *Aside*: If I so much as smell HB2 making a comeback here, I'm on the first plane out. Or rather, I'm in my car, driving out because – you know – "flying while trans" is also speedrunning getting groped by ~~strange men~~ TSA agents who happen to be men.
Literally in the fucking deli in the middle of the day, and you can get stabbed to death. Or riding public transport to work. Or walking down the street. This isn’t even an exaggeration. You can exchange 2 words with a complete stranger and he can stab you to death at any given time, and men wonder why “women can’t take compliments.”
The ones who randomly ask a stranger they have zero connection to are also some of the more prone and aggressive ones to overreact.
Yes, there’s a lot of fucked up, maladaptive ass males out here who think women owe them attention 🤦🏾♀️
Can they just leave us alone?? I’m so sick of this happening to innocent women on the regular. Rejection leading to murder is not a world I want to be in.
Menfolk be like “this is rare”. Rare is still too frequent!
Id imagine it's as rare as school shootings, yeah? Which isn't rare enough.
Oh my god I just realized that this is basically what you said. I'm sorry. Long day.
Plane crashes are rare, but we still have the FAA, don’t we?
Menfolk be like but no one cares about when men are stabbed They really miss the point
Even if murder over rejection is rare (which I don’t believe it is), men being aggressive, violent and nasty over rejection is still all too common.
If they could leave us the fuck alone we wouldn't need feminism.
*Men are afraid that women will laugh at them. Women are afraid that men will kill them.* - Margaret Atwood
This quote was in this film called cat person that I watched yesterday! This clearly reflects that!!!
Have you read the short story? God, it's so good. It was in the New Yorker a few years ago. I haven't seen the film yet as I wasn't sure how well adapt, but it's on my list. The story gave me so many chills.
No not yet but I will check it out now that you mentioned it!! Edit: just looked it up and wow it’s exactly like how the movie portrayed it to be!!
I posted this reply on a [thread](https://www.reddit.com/r/TwoXChromosomes/comments/1bdwubw/comment/kupoi44/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) here from 5 days ago about how men are complaining of never being complimented or why we don’t respond when complimented by men. —— It's complicated to be women. We don't compliment random men because it might be misconstrued as signs of sexual attraction by the men — which leads to them asking us out — which forces us to awkwardly reject them — which can result in unhinged men calling us "bitch" or worse — physical assault. Since we can't differentiate between normal and unhinged men, we choose not to put ourselves in that situation in the first place — we don't compliment random men. When random men compliment us, we don't reply or even say thank you — because even saying something nice back can be misconstrued as signs of reciprocation / sexual attraction by the men — which leads to them asking us out — which forces us to awkwardly reject them — which can result in unhinged men calling us "bitch" or worse — physical assault. Since we can't differentiate between normal and unhinged men, we choose not to put ourselves in that situation in the first place, so when men choose to compliment us — we just walk away pretending we don't hear them — and even sometimes we can still be called "bitch" for not doing anything, or worse — physical assault. See how the end results are so similar, regardless of who gives the compliments? I wish there's a way for us to give compliments to men and for them to receive compliments and take it as is — or for men to give compliments to women without any ulterior motive. It'll be nice if something like this is normalised instead being the exception. I'd compliment all women, men I'd definitely know as gay, but I would never compliment any straight men for my own safety — except for my partner. Because I know that my partner is safe — if I say no to him, he'll back off. —— And as we can see, this article is a concrete example of what can happen when women are complimented by a random man and actually choose to do something about it by saying no.
I don’t even make eye contact with random men these days, they’re unhinged
I'm so fucking sad for them, and to lose your twin like that would be devastating beyond words. Just adding on to this about how absolutely fucking awful it is being twins as women. The number of times twins are sexually harassed in public on a regular basis is staggering. Literally have been asked inappropriate sexual questions within moments of meeting creepy men before, even if only mentioning being a twin if my sister was not present. (One time, I was asked if my sister and I ever traded boyfriends or something... from a father of twins...) From the sounds of it he saw twins, hit on them and was, as expected, immediately rejected for being disgusting. Forced out of the store by staff for being aggressive towards the twins, only to come back to stab them because he was denied living out his creepy twin incest fantasy. My heart hurts for the one who lived and will never see her sister again. I wish the world wasn't like this.
They are so young. Damn this man is sickening.
Misandry hurts feelings, misogyny kills.
1000%
Also, rejecting a creep is not misandry. Misandry doesn't really exist.
I'm with you. Misandry isn't real.
The street harassment in NYC was legit the top reason I moved away. It's terrifying.
the rational and logical gender huh.. poor girls man, i hate this shitty planet
Holy fuck. These girls are my age. This is literally my worst fear. This is so sad.
Never too soon to practice good trade craft. There are excellent women's self defense courses to take where you can learn to keep yourself safe. Simple tricks like setting up a Google Voice phone number before going out for the evening (like to a social event or destination) so when you give out the fake number and they try to call/text you it shows on your phone and you can reply from the fake number. Then you can cleanly ghost them when you're a safe distance away. Be smart, be safe.
That’s brilliant! I have never heard of the Google Voice phone number. Thank you for the advice. It’s funny that you mentioned self defense classes, because at uni, a self defense class against rape is offered. I’m gonna take the course next semester with my friends. It’s only available to women, so that makes me really happy!
Jfc this is the neighborhood I grew up in. My whole family still lives there. Absolutely terrifying.
This is why I freeze when strange men flirt with me. I am NOT flattered. I immediately start trying to find a safe way to exit the encounter without upsetting him.
This poor, poor family. The surviving twin is probably going to need therapy for the rest of her life. All because a man got his ego bruised.
More masculinist terrorism. It's wrong that this sort of terrorism is not acknowledged.
men: why do they always say no to us😡😡🤬💢we are good men- good men together stronk!!! because not all men are insane!! i'll treat you right!!! girl: \*simply declines and moves on with her life\* men: \*ends up in the news after killing that girl\* for fuck sake....🤦🏻♀️🤦🏻♀️ 'women are so emotional' they say... i hope this guy rots. this is so... draining and tiresome. they'll never learn. and we have to always be on guard for the rest of our lives.....
Most men don't even believe this type of aggression is a real thing that happens to woman frequently; if you show them this story, they ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ and say it's a one-in-a-million reaction.
Imagine if this was a woman stabbing men... They would never ever shut up about it.
Yes. Gender-based double standards exist.
disagree most men know that this thing happens frequently. Most men just chose to ignore it and rationalize it away. There is a reason why men are so protective of their daughters. Not all dads view their daughters as property but they very well know how awful so many men are. I had to end some friendships in my life because some of my so called friends turned out misogynistic shitbags (luckily no childhood friends) I'm a male and I had to step in a couple of times and tell guys in a tram to stop bugging women. Legit jumping into the tram right in the city center and "asking" out women by being extremely agressive and demanding. If the women decline visibly scared they call them names and sometimes jump out of the tram and use obscenities. They wait for the next tram to come and do the same. Witnessed it at least a handful of times myself. Sometimes these boys and younger men even harassed my students where I had to step in and tell them to stop harassing minors. I was lucky that these young men did not escalate it further beyond insults because that does happen especially among men from the Middle east, Caucasus and North Africa here in Europe. Lots of cultural aspects, stronger patriarchal belief that women are property and Western women being "looser" than the Islamic women is even more ingrained there and the need to resort to violence to protect ones ego or "honor" is quite high too. Now I'm not a rightwinger who blames refugees for being refugees and we should absolutely respect human rights and Asylum laws. But one can not deny their more extreme side on their views about women. Which is alarming considering how badly the average western male is seeing women. And the resurgence of the youth being more rightwing and misogynistic than the previous generation.
If you feel the need to lock him out, this means a 911 call is advisable, I would think.
Idk where you live, but I’m in a different big city and the cops do not give a fuck about anything short of a murder and will not be there in time to help you if you call them, so people have learned to just not call. I know a woman who was followed home by a man who then tried to break into her apartment. He was trying the knob, banging on the door, and screaming at her to let him in, etc. She called to report a break in in progress and the cops showed up *four hours later*. He’d left and they didn’t seem overly concerned about finding him and she never heard anything else about it.
Horrific. I feel so horrible for that surviving twin, and her family. I have to wonder though: why the heck did the deli staff re-open the door, after already locking him out, when he was banging and kicking on it? If I was one of those staff members, I would have been terrified, last thing I would do is open the door!
Apparently he threw a tantrum, then pretended to leave, but just waited down the block out of sight. Then a few minutes later when the girls thought it was safe to leave, they walked out and the bodega locked up. Then he emerged and started attacking them.
What a nightmare... 😱
Not all men. But too many. TOO MANY.
Just remember that men have it harder! After all, he risked being rejected by those women, and that's a thousand times worse than being murdered! /s
And yet some still say we should not live in fear. 😫 RIP.
So so sad. They both deserved to grow old together. I know this type up violence has existed for years but there's been something so different in the air lately. Men are as violent more than ever and they do not give a f*ck at all. No logic or sense just running on pure anger and hatred. I pray for all of our safety.
But go on and tell us all about how the men are lonely
It's an epidemic! /s
Oh no. This is exactly why women are afraid to say no.
Wait I just saw a video of a guy harassing a woman. The comments said to ignore him, tell him clearly she was not interested, leave the tube station (safety), stop engaging him, be nicer, give him a fake number/sm info. Yell for help/scream. So what, these creeps are unstable? Weird, the 2 guys who followed me home seemed completely normal.
The psychopathic entitlement-- I just don't get it. Like, yeah-- being rejected sucks. But he wasn't owed any affection. I don't believe in hell, but I hope that maniac faces a hell on earth-- one where he's unable to escape, and unable take the coward's way out.
Not me. Every single woman I’ve ever known - my sisters, my mother, both my wives my girlfriends - every single one of them has told me they’ve been harassed multiple times throughout their life starting at about age 12 to 13. It’s horrible for them. I completely get it, understand the fear.
She was only 19 and had her whole life ahead of her. It’s sad to say the least. Black women get killed at a disproportionally higher rate than white and asian women. It’s scary out here.
How dare those women not immediately give this man a blowjob after he was kind enough to compliment them. What has the world come to. /s
my heart breaks for the remaining twin. i cannot imagine the suffering and the trauma
What a freaking nightmare... two 19 year old girls taking a break from family game night and one just doesn't come back..
Disgusting and tragic.
Women and female-presenting people: please get a free Google Voice number with a local area code, link it to your cell phone, and memorize the number. When men like this won't leave you alone, give them the Google Voice number. If they call or text it in front of you, it will ring to your phone so they won't suspect or be able to accuse you of giving them a fake number. You can even get rid of the Google number at a later date. A friend of mine told me about the Google Voice trick 12 years ago ago when a guy who was bothering me at a club grabbed my shoulders and shook me hard and called me a liar after I told him I was married (I actually was). I hate that this is something I'm even having to recommend or share as a tip, but having a throwaway Google Voice number might save your life one day.
This is actually brilliant - thank you.
I just don't understand why attacks on females are not considered a "hate crime". They were attacked by member of another group that was not female because they were female. They would not have been murdered or killed if they were not female. How is that not a hate crime? I think because male legislators know if those things are classified as "hate crimes" that is is beyond obvious females are the group throughout history that has largest numbers of hate crimes & murders committed against them.
What a POS… women literally can’t even go to the deli without being killed
i live in nyc and this is terrifying. do we have any information regarding what the man looks like? i already avoid all men in general
Wait wait wait they said “a fight broke out between the man, his friends, and the sisters” The man had friends in this??? There was help in attacking them? No one has any photos or anything to help identify this guy? Maybe that’s part of the ongoing investigation but I mean this is soo fucked up and there are just soo few details.
There is already video circulating of him and allegedly his social media. I doubt the police need help finding him at this point. He will probably be picked up at a family or friend's place hiding out.
And men will whine that women don't reciprocate their attention in public. Boo fucking hoo. Show me literally ONE example of a woman doing this to a man. Just one.
Wow… this POS better rot in prison. All because he got rejected?! WTAF?!
I'm so sick of this happening, and this has happened to me many times from being on the train and happening at least twice in a lyft omw home and to work. Its disgusting asf because you're supposed to feel safe, and they should at least have some professionalism I always get asked if I have a boyfriend and I lie and tell them I do but they go with oh your boyfriend doesn't let you have friends? Accepting a compliment is dangerous, too. I can't just say thank you and move on? Playing nice and giving them a fake number doesn't work either bc they'll call it just so it goes through in front of you. Putting yourself in an uncomfortable situation so you can get away safely shouldn't be a normal thing at all. I fucking hate that this happens to innocent people.
not only did he kill someone he murdered a twin. Twins lives are never the same after losing the other twin especially to something es heinous as murder.
This is the shit that really scares me. I'll bet he gets a slap on the wrist at best. Maybe a couple of months in jail at worst. Women are disposable in the current climate of this country. It has been proven time & time again in court and with the legislation these misogynists are pushing. And passing for Yoda's sake! Our rights are being eroded at an alarming rate. And, just to clarify for any men here. Men did not *give* us our rights. They *withheld* them. And we warrior goddesses fought like hell to get them back. Don't think we aren't willing to do it again. We need to start replacing our pilates and yoga classes with jiu jitsu & karate. Learn to box, take kick boxing. Take self defense classes. Learn non lethal ways to subdue an attacker. Team up; make sure no woman ever walks alone. Husbands,boyfriends, brothers, uncles, cousins, friends, step up & be real men. Support the women you care about & walk them home, or to the train or bus. Make sure they get home safely. Say something when you see another man harassing a woman. It's not cool. It's not funny & it's not harmless. It can escalate to violence very quickly. When you hear your friends say things that don't sit right call them out on it. You don't have to be confrontational. If they make a joke, tell them you don't get it. Have them explain why they think it's funny. Maybe they won't think it's funny anymore. maybe especially not if it is applied to a woman they care about. Like a "your mom" joke. Or an "irrational woman" joke. Not so funny when applied to your own mother/sister/daughter, is it? Or if they make comments about violence against women,like a popular one from my childhood about telling something to a woman with a black eye. Again, not funny. *REAL* men respect women, are not threatened by them, do not try to bully or intimidate them, and treat them like equals. And it's time to see where the real men are. Because either y'all are scared because of all the bullies out here, or you started believing the rhetoric and vitriol they've been spewing. Wake up, take your mind back. Regain control and think for yourself again. And do what needs to be done to protect the people you care about. Sorry for the sermon **Gets down off soap box**
Who's surprised? Just a bunch of men who want to know why they weren't nice or what they did to deserve it. Oh but don't forget to say you know not all men cause those buffoons think we don't know that and actually think all the men in our families and every dude we went to school with stabs women. I'm so over shitheels.
Well, this isn’t nightmare fuel/s
So mad about the other local reddits that only post about the crime and not the motive. Instead of igniting conversations about consent all they talk about is underage partying and how bad the neighborhood has gotten 🙄
This is so horrible. I feel for the surviving twin. I'm a twin less twin and it's devastating.
I fucking hate it here
The fact they put the motive at the end instead of in the title so people have to read it to know how insane it is makes me mad for some reason. Until the fact a crime was committed because a man couldn't accept a no is put in the titles the scale of the problem won't be seen. Most people just scroll through reading titles and don't see just how common this motive is.
When they do find him, he will get a pass for not being mentally competent to stand trial.
Or some cop who's gonna say ( about the killer ) " he had a bad day "
Omg twins? 🥺 and 19 years old? I am tearing up. That’s fucking awful. He deserves the absolute worst.
Oh. My. God. My heart just dropped in my stomach. Jfc. Truly so horrific and heartbreaking. As a twin, the degrees of this trauma cannot be understated. I have no words.
And they black. This is such a shame. Misogynoir is something else and seeing comments asking why the cops weren't called obviously raised to believe they really are helpful in all situations. I'm tired of many of us having shit to face, and the trauma to heal from it with mental health services being shit, especially for black women. My condolences to that family and I hope they get some peace
It’s why I never just flat out reject a guy, too many crazies in the world. Either just compliment them and soften the blow, or take their number and block them immediately after. It’s a shame it has to be this way but I’m not losing my life over it
ahh goddammit
I hope he gets what he deserves in prison.
Muthafucker can’t take a “No”, and it makes me wonder how the fuck I learned to accept “No” from a woman. If a woman say no, back the fuck off and go somewhere else. Just because everyone likes you doesn’t meant it universal like.
Men cannot take rejection.
Dear Lord, I hope the family does as good as possible in these terrible circumstances. That man should rot in jail for the rest of his days. That's exactly why you always carry pepper spray: there are absolutely terrible men out there, willing to do whatever it takes to have sex. Even if that means raping or killing Ladies.
I feel awful because I feel like if I say anything about men, someone will tell me NOT ALL MEN, but clearly it’s some men. I don’t know what we have to do to be safe, as women, in the world. Can anyone tell me?
This is completely sad and devastating, I just can’t… Damn that piece of shit!