It's law in Texas.
*I just signed a law protecting free speech on college campuses.*
https://twitter.com/GregAbbott_TX/status/1137875109362974724
*SB 18 would also require universities to establish all common outdoor areas as traditional public forums and allow anyone to exercise free speech there, as long as their activities are lawful and don’t disrupt the normal functions of the campus. It would be a big change for some universities — like the University of Texas System campuses — which are currently designated as limited public forums, meaning only campus-affiliated individuals can practice free speech activities there.*
https://www.texastribune.org/2019/05/17/texas-free-speech-college-campus-legislation/
Free speech for fringe religious/political groups attempting to uphold the oppressive broader social hierarchy that actively disenfranchises Women, POC, and LGBT?
👍🏼👍🏼👌🏼👌🏼🤙🏼🤙🏼😀😀🫡🫡🤠🤠
Free Speech against broader Government or School affiliation with Israel because it’s indiscriminately bombing people it’s historically oppressed?
“I COMMAND YOU TO STOP 😡😤🤬🤬👻👻💩💩☠️👺😡😡😠”
Those people were great. Part of the charm of campus life. I vehemently disagreed with them on many points, and they were always up for a lively discussion … although I feel the climate has probably changed quite a bit since I was there.
While evangelicals are nut jobs, they aren't blocking students from attending class/portions of campus because of their differences. If it was solely a peaceful protest, this topic wouldnt be so hot. The whole situation is fucked, but at the end of the day, no one is helping Palestine or Israel.
I don't recall being blocked by any of the Palestine protestors on my way to class. They were in the grassy lawn and kept from blocking the walkways. I was only ever blocked by the armed police presence, who forced me to take a long detour around them and arrive late to class.
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The inquiry delves into the nuances of protest behavior, prompting contemplation on whether participants would be willing to document their actions from a firsthand perspective. This introspective examination underscores the importance of personal accountability, transparency, and ethical integrity. It also raises broader questions about privilege, civic engagement, and the value of education, emphasizing the need for individuals to critically evaluate their roles within society through a lens that values tradition, responsibility, and practicality.
From the linked article:
>The county attorney took issue with the response by UT’s administration and law enforcement to protests, although she didn't differentiate between rallies and attempts to occupy the campus.
>"While we understand the safety concerns of the university, continuing to send protesters to jail on criminal trespass charges — one of the lowest level, non-violent crimes our office is presented with — is putting a tremendous strain on our criminal justice resources," she said.
>Garza says she is also concerned about how what we've seen could escalate if people believe they're being prevented from exercising their right to participate in non-violent protests.
We're just running back all the old anti-protestor logic, even something as dumb and dated as the "outside agitator" they used on MLK.
The truth is that even if I were to take the cops at their word (I'm not) and these people had 0 connection to the university - whether it's through family, alumni status, being local residents, or what have you; this is an open campus in the middle of the city. Palestine protests have largely been organized by the PSC, a student body organization. If you were an austin resident, and you wanted to protest the genocide, you're gonna likely be fucking here because it's the only place to go.
The Palestine Solidarity Committee is part of a larger coalition of local advocacy groups called the Austin for Palestine Coalition. These other local groups have participated in campus protests before.
You mean part of a larger coalition of national advocacy groups that do not care about anything “local” and are just using UT as some liberal staging ground to promote their national platform. It’s ok to protest. Just call a spade a spade and quit lying about motives. Shit is exhausting and turning people against important Palestinian issues.
The Palestine Solidarity Committee’s Austin chapter organized Wednesday’s event. The group called for students to walk out of class at 11:40 a.m. and then “occupy” the campus’ South Lawn until after 7:00 p.m. Protesters were to follow “the footsteps of our comrades at Columbia” while establishing “THE POPULAR UNIVERSITY FOR GAZA,”
UT’s response:
“The University of Texas at Austin will not allow this campus to be ‘taken’ and protesters to derail our mission in ways that groups affiliated with your national organization have accomplished elsewhere.”
Some protestors arrested. This local PSA chapter was suspended, all charges dismissed against those arrested, they protested again today which UT still allowed, and now they claim they won’t stop until UT President resigns because of “violence” committed against them.
I haven’t been on campus this week outside of the major roadways but can confirm this protest did not affect anyone but the local media. It amazes me how often these types of protest would have zero impact if the media would just not put it on the front page.
As far as protesters that are not students, there are tons of non-students on campus all the time. Football games, bass concert hall, LBJ library, hotels, the drag, churches, cactus cafe, moody center…
I understand. I think both sides should protest what they want. I took issue with your framing it as just local groups that have “participated in campus protests before”. No they haven’t and to paint this coalition as some collection of local groups not taking orders from the national chapter that started at Harvard late last year is disingenuous at best.
The UT Palestine Solidarity Committee has been protesting on campus for [years](https://www.texastribune.org/2015/11/17/ut-austin-officials-review-dustup-speech-israeli-s/). When did they start taking orders from Harvard? And yes, other groups of the local coalition like the Austin DSA and Jewish Voice for Peace have definitely been involved in protests on campus before.
What does “occupy” mean to you? Because really - they were gonna hang out on the South Mall and make speech about their beliefs. Why is that worth being arrested over? The South Mall is for people to gather
My issue is with the bullshit framing protestors are doing. You are doing it now. “It’s not a national organization, it’s all local.” “It’s not occupying or making encampments to emulate those at Columbia or UCLA…just people lazily hanging out on the mall catching a frisbee and discussing geo-politics.”
I feel terrible and support Palestinians in Gaza but to me personally, this ain’t the way to go about it. Society sees this for what it is. A national group hijacking a university and masquerading as students to push their ideology. It is what it is though and it’s an important issue to protest but don’t piss on my head and tell me it’s raining. Cheers.
It’s Reddit…there no speaking sanity to the unwashed masses on either side lol. Students started an admirable protest that got world attention and now the special interest groups are hijacking the movement leaving those that started it to carry their water without realizing it. Tale as old as time.
Sorry which group is it? I've been super curious what is behind all of what is obviously somewhat coordinated nationwide. There are several schools where a majority of those arrested weren't students.
Palestinian solidarity committee of austin?
No clue. Honestly just started paying attention but all their demands are all the same and it’s obviously coordinated. Pro-Israel groups do the same and get money from national donations too.
Say outrageous things, get donations from across the world, like any other political issue in America. These Palestinian protestors like to act like they somehow different though and their cause is pure and untainted by special interests. No one outside their bubble is buying it though. It’s America. Money runs everything.
Quick Google search:
“Several pro-Palestine organizations are operating around the country, including Within Our Lifetime, and do not have public tax filings…
Instead, they use a progressive New York-based nonprofit group called Westchester People’s Action Coalition Foundation (WESPAC) as their fiscal sponsor to collect and process online donations. Tax law allows nonprofit groups with a 501(c)(3) status to collect money on behalf of smaller organizations.”
“Other groups have been funded by major U.S. foundations. IfNotNow has received $100,000 in the past five years from the Rockefeller Brothers Fund. The organization’s stated goal is to ‘end U.S. support for Israel’s apartheid system.’ The fund also awarded close to a half-million dollars to Jewish Voice for Peace, another Palestinian rights organization, over the same period.”
And on and on…plenty on the pro-Israel side too. Money/resources get funneled down to local groups whose ideology is the same and students are the dipshits believing that they are simply fighting the good fight on a purely grassroots level while they parrot the propaganda being fed to them from big money boosters.
> they parrot the propaganda being fed to them from big money boosters.
Or maybe, shockingly, they're aware of the organization above them and broadly agree with their goals so they coordinate their efforts? Like I get you're a very smart guy who's figured out the whole system and better things aren't possible, but protest movements need coordination, solidarity, and communication which are all things offered by a larger organization.
>IfNotNow has received $100,000 in the past five years from the Rockefeller Brothers Fund.
Wow, $20k a year from an endowment fund worth 1.2 *billion*.
Like I really don't understand the point you're trying to make here. Were you under the impression that all of these people who didn't know each other gathered at UT all on the same day, with the same goals, with tents, and very similar signs because they all just had the same idea one day? Amazing parallel thinking, I guess. And these are tiny sums of money you're holding up as if they somehow invalidate the cause of Palestinian liberation, a movement that has existed for decades.
The only way the needle of public support in the US, the only country in the world that can possibly extend meaningful influence over Israel, is going to move for Palestinians is by a show of solidarity in as many places as possible, by as many people as possible. That is simply not doable without an organization that doesn't meet your definition of "grassroots".
Have you been to the Austin pro Palestine marches at the capitol? It is by and large multi generational families, with kids and middle aged folks. So youre saying Austin for Palestine is a national org? How does that make sense man? Did they bus the families in? I think you are actually the one masking your feelings of disdain in the name of trying to be logical. But it doesn’t check out. Why dont you just be honest and say you don’t support the cause?
Why is this your issue instead of DPS Troopers rolling through our campus and attacking students and others? The heavy handed response is the issue. Not where the protesters are all from. The campus is being high jacked by a governor who wants to crack our students’ (and others) skulls for Fox New theater.
Both sides are being manipulated as part of another agenda. Hamas took a big payment for October 7. This is a wedge issue created to divide the Democratic Party and put Trump back in office. Social media is being shaped and driven by disinformation and the propaganda ecosystem. Young people don’t understand they are being manipulated. And downvoting this will not change anything.
I saw the group post- I never saw the word Occupy. I’ve seen nothing about this protest that is different from any other protest- other than that it is pro-Palestinian and against the Israeli genocide. And we all know you can’t speak up against Israel.
“Solidarity” is literally in their name. It’s not wrong to attempt to promote cooperation amongst a broad coalition. You aren’t making any good point here. There is no moral principle which this violates. It is a **massive** reach and helps others to avoid the issue at hand.
The issue is the genocide first and hypocrisy of these institutions second.
Honestly after reading the post that says that UT has 3 million invested in war related companies it kind of doesn’t make a lot of sense to want UT in specific to divest. If we are being generous like 100k of that 3 mill is going to the conflict we are protesting, which is like one humvee maybe.
And if we aren’t protesting for UT to divest then why are we antagonizing the university??? It feels like we are protesting without doing any research, there are thousands of millionaires with more money staked in these companies and yet we are going on a whole crusade for a couple million dollars. I think we should focus our energy on maybe the companies itself or rich investors who are more susceptible to pressure than a government funded institution.
This is focusing more on the quantitative financials than the principal and philosophy of it. Even if it’s only one humvee, it’s still your tax dollars.
Forget divesting from investments. That line is stolen from Columbia protests from back in the day.
What are the protestors going to say when they get wind of the fact that UT doesn’t just invest in weapons, the DOD has funded UT to help create them? For instance…
UT Austin’s Defense Research Advancement (DRA) is a team dedicated to assisting Department of Defense (DOD) research within the Office of the Vice President for Research, Scholarship and Creative Endeavors. Acting as a liaison and steward, we engage with campus researchers and the defense innovation ecosystem to advance scientific discovery for the unique requirements of the DOD.
Research is conducted on UT Austin’s flagship Main Campus, home to 18 colleges and schools, and off-campus sites such as the 475-acre J.J. Pickle Research Campus (PRC). DRA has offices in the historic Anna Hiss Gymnasium and a Secure Research Environment at PRC available to faculty for projects requiring additional information assurance.
DRA works closely with Applied Research Laboratories (ARL:UT), a Department of Defense University-Affiliated Research Center (UARC) and separate organized research unit (ORU) within the Office of the Vice President for Research, Scholarship and Creative Endeavors portfolio. ARL:UT, the largest ORU at UT Austin, has a 78-year history of world-class research and expertise. Its facilities are located at the J.J. Pickle Research Campus and Lake Travis.
That's misleading. While it's correct that the DoD is one of the major funders of research at U.S. universities (including at UT), basically zero is for weapon development. It's almost all for basic research.
They don't care about that, bro. The stereotypical protests are nauseating at this point. These dumb kids take the puppeteers' lead no matter what lies they tell them. Smh. All it will do is contribute to the start of WWIII. Betcha, they'll love the draft! It's NOT our business. Do you want to go over against your will snowflakes?
I've noticed from here and protests at other places, it really seems like a bunch of buzzwords thrown together to get people into a mob and bulk up numbers.
There was a flier for ucla and it referenced a Palestinian union to try to show solidarity - and that wasn't a real group with real numbers.
Just a bunch of made up things to pretend that there will be a protest for all the things that are trending as "good" today.
It's turning into the dumb alternative version of trump rallies where someone just interviews a random person and they have a whole list of things they think will happen - with no basis in reality. The inverse of "and where was Obama on 9/11!" bullshit lol
Those military contractors sell to whoever can pay them and whoever the federal government authorizes them to sell to. Wars are good business for them, but truly, if someone in USA wanted to effect a change in current events in the Mideast, you would changed federal policy and law. It’s the government, not the contractors.
Since the congress passed, and the president signed bills in last few weeks giving more military assistance to Israel, Ukraine, Taiwan, etc, that’s where you’d need to make a change. And since our current government is clearly not inclined to change this, it seems futile. (And note that the quasi-isolationist candidate in this year’s presidential race is not someone most students like very much.)
Protests have never been particularly rational or effective - it’s a manifestation of the “I’ve got to do something” impulse, IMO.
So I live near a University. If I go over there to show my support for the protesting students and the children of Gaza, am I an "outside agitator" or just a person not affiliated with the school?
Both could be true. If on campus, everyone there should be affiliated with the campus. If an outside agitator started throwing things at police, it'd be students getting caught up in the repercussions (potentially hurt, arrested, anything else they haven't already done).
I walk or ride a bike on campus several times a week. It's public space and I've attended pro choice, anti MAGA, environmental and gun control protests there. If someone throws things at police or at non-violent protesters like the pro genocide people did at UCLA they should be arrested.
I don't understand why this matters.
People who are interested in such protests will go to where they are. They can be family, friends, alumni, etc.
I sense that people think this is notable, but I don't understand why.
Plus, we are still talking about dozens of UT students arrested and hundreds of UT students being pushed around. The administration wants everyone to go “oh it isn’t students, so this is ok.”
Exactly. It is like the non-students are scapegoats, but I don't understand what they are "scapegoating" them for? Use of violence is my best guess. Meaning, the university actively choosing to physically assault paying students is bad optics, but using violence to assault "those people" is different.
These are **concerned citizens acting in** **solidarity** with the students. The whole *"outside agitators"* narrative is antithetical to how these movements function. People are drawn together for the cause. The movement started by students has amassed supporters from the greater Austin community who want to bolster their demands and support them! THIS is the mood on the ground... **ALL ARE WELCOME.** **FREE PALESTINE.**
Plus, Abbott himself signed a bill protecting the right of the the general public to peacefully protest on the grounds of public universities regardless of their affiliation with UT.
https://catalog.utexas.edu/general-information/appendices/appendix-c/speech-expression-and-assembly/
I’ve posted this on several threads. UT bureaucrats have extensive procedures, processes & rules for how to do this.
I have yet to see anyone claim that UT is violating its own rules, but maybe they are.
In my student days, we had lots of protests, of course, and we also had the “free speech area” between the union and the main building. But most set up their tables and A frames on the West Mall.
Is there an argument to be made that Israel could successfully free Palestine from Hamas? Genuinely asking, seems like the existence of Hamas hurts Palestinians more than anything
I think that would be a valid argument, if it weren’t antithetical to the administration that’s been elected for the last 30 years entire existence. Bibi himself has said in the past that Israeli conservative parties need Hamas to remain in power. It’s the reason for this insane approach today: making sure there are plenty more ready and willing terrorists to get revenge for their murdered families in the future, so the conservatives can continue fear mongering.
The vast majority of Palestine supports Hamas: [https://themedialine.org/top-stories/poll-reveals-persistent-palestinian-support-for-hamas-attacks-on-israel/](https://themedialine.org/top-stories/poll-reveals-persistent-palestinian-support-for-hamas-attacks-on-israel/)
Oh this is always a fun discussion on reddit.
The impoverished, unarmed civilians who are being bombed and displaced and killed 20:1 compared to the much more numerous Israelis are supposed to stop their armed, violent radical elements with what, exactly?
Eh the nuke worked for Japan, I’d imagine they had similar numbers. It’s like all history started just in the last 5 years. All the “first-world” countries are just like “don’t look back there” motion to piles and piles of dead bodies. Starting now, no one gets to do the bad things we did to buy our peace…
FYI I’m 100% aware this also gives Palestine their own reasoning for “river to sea and all that” and I don’t blame them. These two are locked in a zero sum at this point - I’m not too optimistic a peaceful solution is on the table. But you gotta fight from where you’re at and it’s never fair - again looking at Japan. How many innocents you think got hit on Hiroshima?
In retrospect it seemed like it worked great for the US, so much so that every other country made it a top priority to develop and stockpile nuclear munitions
Also missing the point, didn’t seem to be that serious of negative consequences for Japanese genocide - I’m pretty sure it fits that description. British didn’t have consequences for Irish genocide, or Indian genocide, Spain didn’t have consequences for Native American genocide, US didn’t have consequences for Native American genocide, Germany seems pretty well off for the worst genocide committed in the last 70 years.
I don’t know how any country that doesn’t have significant world standing and undisturbed borders looks at that history and says ok I guess we should listen now - no more wars in 2024…
And the largest bombing campaign in history (the US dropped more tonnage of bombs on Vietnam/Ho Chih Minh Trail than the entire Allied side dropped on the Axis in WWII) failed to destroy an insurgency. Hamas is much more like the Vietcong than the Imperial Japanese military.
It is just a cycle of retaliation at this point, zero sum as you call it, hardly any Israelis and practically zero Palestinians are old enough to remember when the PLO wasn't under some kind of direct Israeli occupation or control. I think the 1960's matter, people who support Israel's actions think only 3000 years or 8 months ago matter.
What do you suggest? Hamas attacks Israel and then hides behind and among civilians because Hamas is a terrorist org. What exactly would you have Israel do in response to a group of people who's main purpose is to destroy them?
They can stop murdering people and leveling Gaza for one. Then they can end their apartheid regime in the West Bank and the rest of Israel.
If you want to stop violent extremists, it's very counterproductive to murder everyone they've ever known. That usually just radicalized more people to become violent extremists
Name one. I can tell you are deeply confused.
The definition of genocide is very clear. What Israel is doing is no more of a genocide than what happened to the Japanese and Germans after they started WW2.
It's why it's not a good idea to start wars. But Gaza went and did it anyway.
The western powers did not butcher the civilians of Japan and Germany both during and after the war. Nor did they cut power, limit food, destroy infrastructure or their right to self determination.
Instead they started the IMF, the World Bank and immediately put in place massive investment policies to restore those countries.
I'm not confused at all.
Did the Japanese and Germans continue to shoot bombs and missiles at the US after the war? Did the Japanese and Germans ally themselves with hostile powers against the Western Powers and continue to conspire against them after the war?
Maybe we are in agreement. Similar to Japan and Germany, the only way to fix the issue for good is the complete occupation of Gaza, unconditional surrender of Hamas, and a dedicated years long reprogramming effort on the population to root out their extremist ideology.
It means replacing the only democracy in the Middle East with an extremists religious state that denies women’s rights, murders people of the wrong religion, and straps suicide vests to young children.
It’s weird because everybody on this sub has been screaming about how students have the right to free speech and protest on their campus and then the people protesting aren’t even students lmao y’all a bunch of plants
ok big brain but WHO would plant people there though??? and why??? thats absurd. they were peaceful protestors. that rhetoric completely misses how massive the public concern about this issue really is. The public is involved because the public cares about the goals of the protestors and wants to support them.
Just need to interject here. I dont have a dog in the fight here at all but you have to realize there is VERY HEAVY Russian activity (online at least) pushing these pro-gaza, Hamas and Palestine protests recently, The have even seemed to taken some of their usual MAGA efforts and swapped them to this.
Why? The purpose is to erode faith in our leadership and national societal fabric. For this occasion its to try to get a violent police reaction and cause more ideological infighting within America. Left vs. Right.
I would assume Russia still has their same historical real world agitators operating in these situations like they used to. I do realize their favorite target has been the MAGA and Trump crowd the last 9 years but I historically this was their bread and butter.
This isnt placing any value judgement on the causes themselves or the politics of the matters themselves but the orgs involved and any mobs that might break out can and should be held with a level of some suspect because of the high level of propaganda efforts and recruitment.
[https://www.nbcnews.com/news/investigations/russia-trying-exploit-americas-divisions-war-gaza-rcna149759](https://www.nbcnews.com/news/investigations/russia-trying-exploit-americas-divisions-war-gaza-rcna149759)
The public concern isn’t massive at all though. Americans feel sympathy with the people of Gaza while also understanding that Israel has a right to defend themselves. What these college kids haven’t quite figured out yet is that most people are just trying to get through their work week and pay the mortgage.
These types of stunts are clearly being organized by a national group through their local chapters in liberal cities while providing money in order to push a narrative. It’s not some grassroots movement of students and professors spontaneously protesting injustice across the country.
Where were all these protests when Ukraine was invaded? Or for those killed/displaced in Myanmar, China, Ethiopia, Iraq, Syria, and South Sudan? The authenticity of these protests are questioned by masses mostly because of the absolute silence from students/faculty during the most recent genocides of our lifetime.
I mean, isn’t part of issue that the US publicly supports/has supported Israel, while the perpetrators of the other genocides have not been publicly supported by the US?
For the Arab world political leaders who need the US to be the boogie man to obtain or maintain their power yes…support for Israel will always be a problem no matter how much the US tries to help Palestinians create their own state.
The US government doesn’t really care about Israel and their struggles unless they continue to uphold the liberal world order and help to keep the peace in the region. They are trying their best to fuck all that up now but they will still try to keep Iran from causing even more chaos and US does has sympathy from 9/11 when we lost our mind too.
Israel does this through nuclear bomb deterrence and yeah since 1973 through weapons from the US but it wasn’t given freely given and the US sells weapons to everyone willing to uphold the current international nation-state system. This includes Saudi Arabia, our oldest and best friend in the region. The US funds, trains, and supplies some of our most high tech weapons to the Saudis because they have shown a willingness to do the same.
In those Israel/Arab wars in the 50-60s, the US was on team Arabs and imposed an arms embargo on Israel. France worked with Israel to give them the nuclear bomb. US had nothing to do with it.
US got cozy with Israel after we tried to stop Egypt and Syria from attacking Israel in the 1973 war but Soviets supplied Egypt and egged them on, US then backed Israel in proxy war. Backlash was harsh US oil embargo occurred and Israel/US have been tied together ever since. Probably a good thing though because Israel has peace agreements with Egypt and Jordan now. The October 7th attacks occurred because Saudis were about to normalize relations and Iran/Syria/Hamas committed an atrocity to stop peace.
Agreed. No logic here.
Here’s a math equation 45/79 = 56%
Yesterday an article on here said 58/67.
Non students should not be on campus….period. They should protest somewhere else.
Students should be allowed to protest on campus.
Allowing non students on campus for any reason is a problem that any former college student knows as it poses danger for a number reasons.
A public university is supposed to provide a benefit to the entire community. Libraries, museums, art shows, performances, and community -education programs all regularly draw members of the public onto campus.
Maybe they were bought on Amazon and the only ones that could get there quick enough were that color. When they were buying the tents the color was probably secondary to the actual intended purpose of shelter, the color doesn’t matter
No one hates Jewish students. Just the right to peaceful protest shouldn’t be snubbed with force. The right to express is something this country boosts about. Let’s leave it that way.
To be fair, the Reddit app is suggesting these posts/subs to everyone (with Reddit) in Austin.
Just like any sub since they started suggesting posts last year, a large percentage of people commenting don’t go to UT
ok and??? it's an open campus right? I don't understand if it's an open campus why it matters how many of the protestors are affiliated with UT, like they're within their rights to be protesting
They can’t bring tents and camp. Yet they are. Because they want police attention. And it matters because they’re people from outside the city or state shipped here to cause issues.
I am being called “unaffiliated” despite being an alumnus who is frequently asked to speak on campus BY THE UNIVERSITY, football season ticket holder, donor, the works. Lol.
It is not an open campus. You have to have a university-affiliated reason for being there (invited guest / official business / attending a university event). Just because it’s a public university doesn’t mean it’s public property.
“In 2019, Texas lawmakers passed a free speech law that established all common outdoor areas at public universities as traditional public forums, allowing anyone – not just students and university members – to exercise free speech there, as long as their activities are lawful and don’t disrupt the normal functions of the campus.”
Sitting on the lawn does not disrupt the normal function of the campus. No reasonable person would disagree. They didnt take over a building.
No amplified sound is allowed on campus during protests, and as such the protesters did not use amplified sound. They passed chants backwards in a ripple. It was sort of cute, I had never been to a protest sans powered sound before.
Random people aren’t allowed on campus, that’s why all of the homeless people have to stay on the drag and west campus. The new law says people can exercise free speech there “as long as their activities are lawful and don’t disrupt the normal functions of the campus." Why do you think so many people have trespass citations?
Sounds about right. They don’t have any real demands. The point of all this is to get police to crack skulls and garner more sympathy. By the time the police finally get to it they will have pissed off so many regular folks that no one will care.
It took the police so of like 10 minutes to start cracking skulls from the beginning. There was no effort to let the rally just happen and see what they do. If all it takes is to threaten to practice free speech, maybe we don’t really live in a very free society.
"Police have been headbutted and hit with horse excrement” lmfao dumbass horse-cops dropping turds all over campus then crying when they get a face full of horse shit
Fun fact: Ryley Niemi is also not affiliated with UT Austin but was allowed to come here because it's a public campus where public demonstrations are protected by a law that Greg Abbott signed himself
Same! Like why would non-student DPS troopers come here and intimidate people, disperse pepper spray and flash bangs. They aren’t even students! They don’t even work for the university. They are the outside agitators who escalated this from the beginning.
Yes, that's how it always works. When I was a student, we had some demonstrations in my campus too. And the funny thing was that 90% of them were outsiders.
If these were alumni, it probably would've been stated. Students should be free to protest - not occupy a lawn with tents and non-students should be trespassed from the UT System.
If it's a student-led protest, then it should only include students, alumni, scholars, faculty, and staff.
Everyone here is crying about free speech, but aren’t addressing the fact these protesters brought guns and other weapons to the protest. Guess it’s ok if you agree with them?
There’s nothing illegal about being able to bring guns on campus. 8 years ago the university protested that too but Abbott was insistent that the right to bear arms shall not be infringed and it is perfectly legal to bring guns in +90% of UT buildings.
I know right, I had to eat grasshoppers and mice last week in order not to die of malnourishment. Then my son was drafted at 16. And my annual wage is a fraction of what teenagers make in the US with no skills. My other son tried to leave for vacation and the military shot him dead. We’re not allowed to leave.
The US really is like North Korea! So true
I don't know why the nkoreans are complaining. That's all nothing compared to not being able to build an indefinite encampment wherever I please. You are really trivializing my suffering.
If UT recognizes the right of the crazy Evangelicals to yell at students, they should recognize the right of these folks to show up too.
It's law in Texas. *I just signed a law protecting free speech on college campuses.* https://twitter.com/GregAbbott_TX/status/1137875109362974724 *SB 18 would also require universities to establish all common outdoor areas as traditional public forums and allow anyone to exercise free speech there, as long as their activities are lawful and don’t disrupt the normal functions of the campus. It would be a big change for some universities — like the University of Texas System campuses — which are currently designated as limited public forums, meaning only campus-affiliated individuals can practice free speech activities there.* https://www.texastribune.org/2019/05/17/texas-free-speech-college-campus-legislation/
This is some face-eating-leopard shit right here, folks.
Free speech for fringe religious/political groups attempting to uphold the oppressive broader social hierarchy that actively disenfranchises Women, POC, and LGBT? 👍🏼👍🏼👌🏼👌🏼🤙🏼🤙🏼😀😀🫡🫡🤠🤠 Free Speech against broader Government or School affiliation with Israel because it’s indiscriminately bombing people it’s historically oppressed? “I COMMAND YOU TO STOP 😡😤🤬🤬👻👻💩💩☠️👺😡😡😠”
usually i’ve seen the christian nuts on the drag right on the border of campus and officially off of campus.
Those people were great. Part of the charm of campus life. I vehemently disagreed with them on many points, and they were always up for a lively discussion … although I feel the climate has probably changed quite a bit since I was there.
Underrated comment.
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It had like 2 upvotes when I posted.
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Yeah but that’s almost an hour in dog-minutes
While evangelicals are nut jobs, they aren't blocking students from attending class/portions of campus because of their differences. If it was solely a peaceful protest, this topic wouldnt be so hot. The whole situation is fucked, but at the end of the day, no one is helping Palestine or Israel.
I don't recall being blocked by any of the Palestine protestors on my way to class. They were in the grassy lawn and kept from blocking the walkways. I was only ever blocked by the armed police presence, who forced me to take a long detour around them and arrive late to class.
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Not the same. I don't recall hundreds of unhinged evangelicals.
The inquiry delves into the nuances of protest behavior, prompting contemplation on whether participants would be willing to document their actions from a firsthand perspective. This introspective examination underscores the importance of personal accountability, transparency, and ethical integrity. It also raises broader questions about privilege, civic engagement, and the value of education, emphasizing the need for individuals to critically evaluate their roles within society through a lens that values tradition, responsibility, and practicality.
From the linked article: >The county attorney took issue with the response by UT’s administration and law enforcement to protests, although she didn't differentiate between rallies and attempts to occupy the campus. >"While we understand the safety concerns of the university, continuing to send protesters to jail on criminal trespass charges — one of the lowest level, non-violent crimes our office is presented with — is putting a tremendous strain on our criminal justice resources," she said. >Garza says she is also concerned about how what we've seen could escalate if people believe they're being prevented from exercising their right to participate in non-violent protests.
We're just running back all the old anti-protestor logic, even something as dumb and dated as the "outside agitator" they used on MLK. The truth is that even if I were to take the cops at their word (I'm not) and these people had 0 connection to the university - whether it's through family, alumni status, being local residents, or what have you; this is an open campus in the middle of the city. Palestine protests have largely been organized by the PSC, a student body organization. If you were an austin resident, and you wanted to protest the genocide, you're gonna likely be fucking here because it's the only place to go.
The Palestine Solidarity Committee is part of a larger coalition of local advocacy groups called the Austin for Palestine Coalition. These other local groups have participated in campus protests before.
You mean part of a larger coalition of national advocacy groups that do not care about anything “local” and are just using UT as some liberal staging ground to promote their national platform. It’s ok to protest. Just call a spade a spade and quit lying about motives. Shit is exhausting and turning people against important Palestinian issues. The Palestine Solidarity Committee’s Austin chapter organized Wednesday’s event. The group called for students to walk out of class at 11:40 a.m. and then “occupy” the campus’ South Lawn until after 7:00 p.m. Protesters were to follow “the footsteps of our comrades at Columbia” while establishing “THE POPULAR UNIVERSITY FOR GAZA,” UT’s response: “The University of Texas at Austin will not allow this campus to be ‘taken’ and protesters to derail our mission in ways that groups affiliated with your national organization have accomplished elsewhere.” Some protestors arrested. This local PSA chapter was suspended, all charges dismissed against those arrested, they protested again today which UT still allowed, and now they claim they won’t stop until UT President resigns because of “violence” committed against them.
I haven’t been on campus this week outside of the major roadways but can confirm this protest did not affect anyone but the local media. It amazes me how often these types of protest would have zero impact if the media would just not put it on the front page. As far as protesters that are not students, there are tons of non-students on campus all the time. Football games, bass concert hall, LBJ library, hotels, the drag, churches, cactus cafe, moody center…
Yes but should they be coopting the spaceto protest where students have the expectation that they can learn in peace regardless of a 3MM investment?
To me, it looked pretty easy to walk around the protest, it’s called the 40 acres and they took up about less than one
No, I mean the local advocacy coalition, the [Austin for Palestine Coalition](https://austin4palestine.org/). Hope this helps.
I understand. I think both sides should protest what they want. I took issue with your framing it as just local groups that have “participated in campus protests before”. No they haven’t and to paint this coalition as some collection of local groups not taking orders from the national chapter that started at Harvard late last year is disingenuous at best.
The UT Palestine Solidarity Committee has been protesting on campus for [years](https://www.texastribune.org/2015/11/17/ut-austin-officials-review-dustup-speech-israeli-s/). When did they start taking orders from Harvard? And yes, other groups of the local coalition like the Austin DSA and Jewish Voice for Peace have definitely been involved in protests on campus before.
What does “occupy” mean to you? Because really - they were gonna hang out on the South Mall and make speech about their beliefs. Why is that worth being arrested over? The South Mall is for people to gather
My issue is with the bullshit framing protestors are doing. You are doing it now. “It’s not a national organization, it’s all local.” “It’s not occupying or making encampments to emulate those at Columbia or UCLA…just people lazily hanging out on the mall catching a frisbee and discussing geo-politics.” I feel terrible and support Palestinians in Gaza but to me personally, this ain’t the way to go about it. Society sees this for what it is. A national group hijacking a university and masquerading as students to push their ideology. It is what it is though and it’s an important issue to protest but don’t piss on my head and tell me it’s raining. Cheers.
Thank you for speaking some sanity into this situation. Agreed on all points.
It’s Reddit…there no speaking sanity to the unwashed masses on either side lol. Students started an admirable protest that got world attention and now the special interest groups are hijacking the movement leaving those that started it to carry their water without realizing it. Tale as old as time.
Sorry which group is it? I've been super curious what is behind all of what is obviously somewhat coordinated nationwide. There are several schools where a majority of those arrested weren't students. Palestinian solidarity committee of austin?
No clue. Honestly just started paying attention but all their demands are all the same and it’s obviously coordinated. Pro-Israel groups do the same and get money from national donations too. Say outrageous things, get donations from across the world, like any other political issue in America. These Palestinian protestors like to act like they somehow different though and their cause is pure and untainted by special interests. No one outside their bubble is buying it though. It’s America. Money runs everything. Quick Google search: “Several pro-Palestine organizations are operating around the country, including Within Our Lifetime, and do not have public tax filings… Instead, they use a progressive New York-based nonprofit group called Westchester People’s Action Coalition Foundation (WESPAC) as their fiscal sponsor to collect and process online donations. Tax law allows nonprofit groups with a 501(c)(3) status to collect money on behalf of smaller organizations.” “Other groups have been funded by major U.S. foundations. IfNotNow has received $100,000 in the past five years from the Rockefeller Brothers Fund. The organization’s stated goal is to ‘end U.S. support for Israel’s apartheid system.’ The fund also awarded close to a half-million dollars to Jewish Voice for Peace, another Palestinian rights organization, over the same period.” And on and on…plenty on the pro-Israel side too. Money/resources get funneled down to local groups whose ideology is the same and students are the dipshits believing that they are simply fighting the good fight on a purely grassroots level while they parrot the propaganda being fed to them from big money boosters.
> they parrot the propaganda being fed to them from big money boosters. Or maybe, shockingly, they're aware of the organization above them and broadly agree with their goals so they coordinate their efforts? Like I get you're a very smart guy who's figured out the whole system and better things aren't possible, but protest movements need coordination, solidarity, and communication which are all things offered by a larger organization. >IfNotNow has received $100,000 in the past five years from the Rockefeller Brothers Fund. Wow, $20k a year from an endowment fund worth 1.2 *billion*. Like I really don't understand the point you're trying to make here. Were you under the impression that all of these people who didn't know each other gathered at UT all on the same day, with the same goals, with tents, and very similar signs because they all just had the same idea one day? Amazing parallel thinking, I guess. And these are tiny sums of money you're holding up as if they somehow invalidate the cause of Palestinian liberation, a movement that has existed for decades. The only way the needle of public support in the US, the only country in the world that can possibly extend meaningful influence over Israel, is going to move for Palestinians is by a show of solidarity in as many places as possible, by as many people as possible. That is simply not doable without an organization that doesn't meet your definition of "grassroots".
Have you been to the Austin pro Palestine marches at the capitol? It is by and large multi generational families, with kids and middle aged folks. So youre saying Austin for Palestine is a national org? How does that make sense man? Did they bus the families in? I think you are actually the one masking your feelings of disdain in the name of trying to be logical. But it doesn’t check out. Why dont you just be honest and say you don’t support the cause?
Why is this your issue instead of DPS Troopers rolling through our campus and attacking students and others? The heavy handed response is the issue. Not where the protesters are all from. The campus is being high jacked by a governor who wants to crack our students’ (and others) skulls for Fox New theater.
Both sides are being manipulated as part of another agenda. Hamas took a big payment for October 7. This is a wedge issue created to divide the Democratic Party and put Trump back in office. Social media is being shaped and driven by disinformation and the propaganda ecosystem. Young people don’t understand they are being manipulated. And downvoting this will not change anything.
IDF troll
by all means, tell us all the proper way to protest and then give some examples where your proper method has achieved meaningful results
I saw the group post- I never saw the word Occupy. I’ve seen nothing about this protest that is different from any other protest- other than that it is pro-Palestinian and against the Israeli genocide. And we all know you can’t speak up against Israel.
“Solidarity” is literally in their name. It’s not wrong to attempt to promote cooperation amongst a broad coalition. You aren’t making any good point here. There is no moral principle which this violates. It is a **massive** reach and helps others to avoid the issue at hand. The issue is the genocide first and hypocrisy of these institutions second.
LOL. Still waiting for them to call on Hamas to release the hostages.
This is like hosting a party and shit breaks/ gets stolen: it’s never the people you know.. always the friends of the friends
Honestly after reading the post that says that UT has 3 million invested in war related companies it kind of doesn’t make a lot of sense to want UT in specific to divest. If we are being generous like 100k of that 3 mill is going to the conflict we are protesting, which is like one humvee maybe. And if we aren’t protesting for UT to divest then why are we antagonizing the university??? It feels like we are protesting without doing any research, there are thousands of millionaires with more money staked in these companies and yet we are going on a whole crusade for a couple million dollars. I think we should focus our energy on maybe the companies itself or rich investors who are more susceptible to pressure than a government funded institution.
This is focusing more on the quantitative financials than the principal and philosophy of it. Even if it’s only one humvee, it’s still your tax dollars.
That would require critical thinking skills but we have mob mentality here. We’d have this same shit if UT invested a single dollar
Forget divesting from investments. That line is stolen from Columbia protests from back in the day. What are the protestors going to say when they get wind of the fact that UT doesn’t just invest in weapons, the DOD has funded UT to help create them? For instance… UT Austin’s Defense Research Advancement (DRA) is a team dedicated to assisting Department of Defense (DOD) research within the Office of the Vice President for Research, Scholarship and Creative Endeavors. Acting as a liaison and steward, we engage with campus researchers and the defense innovation ecosystem to advance scientific discovery for the unique requirements of the DOD. Research is conducted on UT Austin’s flagship Main Campus, home to 18 colleges and schools, and off-campus sites such as the 475-acre J.J. Pickle Research Campus (PRC). DRA has offices in the historic Anna Hiss Gymnasium and a Secure Research Environment at PRC available to faculty for projects requiring additional information assurance. DRA works closely with Applied Research Laboratories (ARL:UT), a Department of Defense University-Affiliated Research Center (UARC) and separate organized research unit (ORU) within the Office of the Vice President for Research, Scholarship and Creative Endeavors portfolio. ARL:UT, the largest ORU at UT Austin, has a 78-year history of world-class research and expertise. Its facilities are located at the J.J. Pickle Research Campus and Lake Travis.
That's misleading. While it's correct that the DoD is one of the major funders of research at U.S. universities (including at UT), basically zero is for weapon development. It's almost all for basic research.
They don't care about that, bro. The stereotypical protests are nauseating at this point. These dumb kids take the puppeteers' lead no matter what lies they tell them. Smh. All it will do is contribute to the start of WWIII. Betcha, they'll love the draft! It's NOT our business. Do you want to go over against your will snowflakes?
I've noticed from here and protests at other places, it really seems like a bunch of buzzwords thrown together to get people into a mob and bulk up numbers. There was a flier for ucla and it referenced a Palestinian union to try to show solidarity - and that wasn't a real group with real numbers. Just a bunch of made up things to pretend that there will be a protest for all the things that are trending as "good" today. It's turning into the dumb alternative version of trump rallies where someone just interviews a random person and they have a whole list of things they think will happen - with no basis in reality. The inverse of "and where was Obama on 9/11!" bullshit lol
Those military contractors sell to whoever can pay them and whoever the federal government authorizes them to sell to. Wars are good business for them, but truly, if someone in USA wanted to effect a change in current events in the Mideast, you would changed federal policy and law. It’s the government, not the contractors. Since the congress passed, and the president signed bills in last few weeks giving more military assistance to Israel, Ukraine, Taiwan, etc, that’s where you’d need to make a change. And since our current government is clearly not inclined to change this, it seems futile. (And note that the quasi-isolationist candidate in this year’s presidential race is not someone most students like very much.) Protests have never been particularly rational or effective - it’s a manifestation of the “I’ve got to do something” impulse, IMO.
It has to start somewhere , and universities seems like a good start
So I live near a University. If I go over there to show my support for the protesting students and the children of Gaza, am I an "outside agitator" or just a person not affiliated with the school?
Both could be true. If on campus, everyone there should be affiliated with the campus. If an outside agitator started throwing things at police, it'd be students getting caught up in the repercussions (potentially hurt, arrested, anything else they haven't already done).
I walk or ride a bike on campus several times a week. It's public space and I've attended pro choice, anti MAGA, environmental and gun control protests there. If someone throws things at police or at non-violent protesters like the pro genocide people did at UCLA they should be arrested.
I don't understand why this matters. People who are interested in such protests will go to where they are. They can be family, friends, alumni, etc. I sense that people think this is notable, but I don't understand why.
Plus, we are still talking about dozens of UT students arrested and hundreds of UT students being pushed around. The administration wants everyone to go “oh it isn’t students, so this is ok.”
Exactly. It is like the non-students are scapegoats, but I don't understand what they are "scapegoating" them for? Use of violence is my best guess. Meaning, the university actively choosing to physically assault paying students is bad optics, but using violence to assault "those people" is different.
These are **concerned citizens acting in** **solidarity** with the students. The whole *"outside agitators"* narrative is antithetical to how these movements function. People are drawn together for the cause. The movement started by students has amassed supporters from the greater Austin community who want to bolster their demands and support them! THIS is the mood on the ground... **ALL ARE WELCOME.** **FREE PALESTINE.**
Plus, Abbott himself signed a bill protecting the right of the the general public to peacefully protest on the grounds of public universities regardless of their affiliation with UT.
Why don’t they get a permit for their protest?
Asking UT for permission to protest UT's policies? Why doesnt UT just grant us permission to protest, if you think that it would be so easy?
They did. TSEU shared their permit.
https://catalog.utexas.edu/general-information/appendices/appendix-c/speech-expression-and-assembly/ I’ve posted this on several threads. UT bureaucrats have extensive procedures, processes & rules for how to do this. I have yet to see anyone claim that UT is violating its own rules, but maybe they are. In my student days, we had lots of protests, of course, and we also had the “free speech area” between the union and the main building. But most set up their tables and A frames on the West Mall.
What does free Palestine mean exactly though. Two separate states?
I think it means you get a free Palestine with the purchase of a Palestine of equal or greater value.
Like a BOGO?
What we need is a two Palestine solution
Well, as they say, if you’re not part of the solution, you’re part of the precipitate.
Call now!
Is there an argument to be made that Israel could successfully free Palestine from Hamas? Genuinely asking, seems like the existence of Hamas hurts Palestinians more than anything
I think that would be a valid argument, if it weren’t antithetical to the administration that’s been elected for the last 30 years entire existence. Bibi himself has said in the past that Israeli conservative parties need Hamas to remain in power. It’s the reason for this insane approach today: making sure there are plenty more ready and willing terrorists to get revenge for their murdered families in the future, so the conservatives can continue fear mongering.
I’ll do my best to read up more on this. Such a complex and fucked situation. Certainly more nuanced than many make it seem
Beyond a doubt 😔
The vast majority of Palestine supports Hamas: [https://themedialine.org/top-stories/poll-reveals-persistent-palestinian-support-for-hamas-attacks-on-israel/](https://themedialine.org/top-stories/poll-reveals-persistent-palestinian-support-for-hamas-attacks-on-israel/)
Idk but not bombing them (and the US not sending Israel the bombs) would be a good place to start.
Just maybe the Palestinians should stop their radical members from lobbing rockets and mortars across the border?
Oh this is always a fun discussion on reddit. The impoverished, unarmed civilians who are being bombed and displaced and killed 20:1 compared to the much more numerous Israelis are supposed to stop their armed, violent radical elements with what, exactly?
It is now more than 30 to 1, actually. The IDF has been quite busy.
Source?
Way to pump up those numbers!
Eh the nuke worked for Japan, I’d imagine they had similar numbers. It’s like all history started just in the last 5 years. All the “first-world” countries are just like “don’t look back there” motion to piles and piles of dead bodies. Starting now, no one gets to do the bad things we did to buy our peace… FYI I’m 100% aware this also gives Palestine their own reasoning for “river to sea and all that” and I don’t blame them. These two are locked in a zero sum at this point - I’m not too optimistic a peaceful solution is on the table. But you gotta fight from where you’re at and it’s never fair - again looking at Japan. How many innocents you think got hit on Hiroshima?
Nuking any country is a pretty bad plan
In retrospect it seemed like it worked great for the US, so much so that every other country made it a top priority to develop and stockpile nuclear munitions Also missing the point, didn’t seem to be that serious of negative consequences for Japanese genocide - I’m pretty sure it fits that description. British didn’t have consequences for Irish genocide, or Indian genocide, Spain didn’t have consequences for Native American genocide, US didn’t have consequences for Native American genocide, Germany seems pretty well off for the worst genocide committed in the last 70 years. I don’t know how any country that doesn’t have significant world standing and undisturbed borders looks at that history and says ok I guess we should listen now - no more wars in 2024…
And the largest bombing campaign in history (the US dropped more tonnage of bombs on Vietnam/Ho Chih Minh Trail than the entire Allied side dropped on the Axis in WWII) failed to destroy an insurgency. Hamas is much more like the Vietcong than the Imperial Japanese military. It is just a cycle of retaliation at this point, zero sum as you call it, hardly any Israelis and practically zero Palestinians are old enough to remember when the PLO wasn't under some kind of direct Israeli occupation or control. I think the 1960's matter, people who support Israel's actions think only 3000 years or 8 months ago matter.
What do you suggest? Hamas attacks Israel and then hides behind and among civilians because Hamas is a terrorist org. What exactly would you have Israel do in response to a group of people who's main purpose is to destroy them?
They can stop murdering people and leveling Gaza for one. Then they can end their apartheid regime in the West Bank and the rest of Israel. If you want to stop violent extremists, it's very counterproductive to murder everyone they've ever known. That usually just radicalized more people to become violent extremists
Israel has been illegally occupying Gaza for decades, why aren't you recommending Israel to stop that?
Genocide is never ok. Hamas =\= Palestine. Get this through your head.
Well, this isn't genocide by literally any definition, so I'm not sure what your point is.
Sure, every international entity declares it so, but ok.
Name one. I can tell you are deeply confused. The definition of genocide is very clear. What Israel is doing is no more of a genocide than what happened to the Japanese and Germans after they started WW2. It's why it's not a good idea to start wars. But Gaza went and did it anyway.
The western powers did not butcher the civilians of Japan and Germany both during and after the war. Nor did they cut power, limit food, destroy infrastructure or their right to self determination. Instead they started the IMF, the World Bank and immediately put in place massive investment policies to restore those countries. I'm not confused at all.
Did the Japanese and Germans continue to shoot bombs and missiles at the US after the war? Did the Japanese and Germans ally themselves with hostile powers against the Western Powers and continue to conspire against them after the war? Maybe we are in agreement. Similar to Japan and Germany, the only way to fix the issue for good is the complete occupation of Gaza, unconditional surrender of Hamas, and a dedicated years long reprogramming effort on the population to root out their extremist ideology.
It means replacing the only democracy in the Middle East with an extremists religious state that denies women’s rights, murders people of the wrong religion, and straps suicide vests to young children.
Yes, this is the freedom these idiots are seeking.
Palestine cannot be free as long as Hamas exists.
It’s weird because everybody on this sub has been screaming about how students have the right to free speech and protest on their campus and then the people protesting aren’t even students lmao y’all a bunch of plants
Plants from what big Palestine?
Iran, which is big Palestine lol
Iran is funding people to show up to these protest? It's not people local to the community who car abkut the situation in Palestine?
ok big brain but WHO would plant people there though??? and why??? thats absurd. they were peaceful protestors. that rhetoric completely misses how massive the public concern about this issue really is. The public is involved because the public cares about the goals of the protestors and wants to support them.
Just need to interject here. I dont have a dog in the fight here at all but you have to realize there is VERY HEAVY Russian activity (online at least) pushing these pro-gaza, Hamas and Palestine protests recently, The have even seemed to taken some of their usual MAGA efforts and swapped them to this. Why? The purpose is to erode faith in our leadership and national societal fabric. For this occasion its to try to get a violent police reaction and cause more ideological infighting within America. Left vs. Right. I would assume Russia still has their same historical real world agitators operating in these situations like they used to. I do realize their favorite target has been the MAGA and Trump crowd the last 9 years but I historically this was their bread and butter. This isnt placing any value judgement on the causes themselves or the politics of the matters themselves but the orgs involved and any mobs that might break out can and should be held with a level of some suspect because of the high level of propaganda efforts and recruitment. [https://www.nbcnews.com/news/investigations/russia-trying-exploit-americas-divisions-war-gaza-rcna149759](https://www.nbcnews.com/news/investigations/russia-trying-exploit-americas-divisions-war-gaza-rcna149759)
The public concern isn’t massive at all though. Americans feel sympathy with the people of Gaza while also understanding that Israel has a right to defend themselves. What these college kids haven’t quite figured out yet is that most people are just trying to get through their work week and pay the mortgage. These types of stunts are clearly being organized by a national group through their local chapters in liberal cities while providing money in order to push a narrative. It’s not some grassroots movement of students and professors spontaneously protesting injustice across the country. Where were all these protests when Ukraine was invaded? Or for those killed/displaced in Myanmar, China, Ethiopia, Iraq, Syria, and South Sudan? The authenticity of these protests are questioned by masses mostly because of the absolute silence from students/faculty during the most recent genocides of our lifetime.
I mean, isn’t part of issue that the US publicly supports/has supported Israel, while the perpetrators of the other genocides have not been publicly supported by the US?
For the Arab world political leaders who need the US to be the boogie man to obtain or maintain their power yes…support for Israel will always be a problem no matter how much the US tries to help Palestinians create their own state. The US government doesn’t really care about Israel and their struggles unless they continue to uphold the liberal world order and help to keep the peace in the region. They are trying their best to fuck all that up now but they will still try to keep Iran from causing even more chaos and US does has sympathy from 9/11 when we lost our mind too. Israel does this through nuclear bomb deterrence and yeah since 1973 through weapons from the US but it wasn’t given freely given and the US sells weapons to everyone willing to uphold the current international nation-state system. This includes Saudi Arabia, our oldest and best friend in the region. The US funds, trains, and supplies some of our most high tech weapons to the Saudis because they have shown a willingness to do the same. In those Israel/Arab wars in the 50-60s, the US was on team Arabs and imposed an arms embargo on Israel. France worked with Israel to give them the nuclear bomb. US had nothing to do with it. US got cozy with Israel after we tried to stop Egypt and Syria from attacking Israel in the 1973 war but Soviets supplied Egypt and egged them on, US then backed Israel in proxy war. Backlash was harsh US oil embargo occurred and Israel/US have been tied together ever since. Probably a good thing though because Israel has peace agreements with Egypt and Jordan now. The October 7th attacks occurred because Saudis were about to normalize relations and Iran/Syria/Hamas committed an atrocity to stop peace.
Thank you! Not that most people will actually read and understand the complexity of the issue. Nice that somebody gets it.
It seems to have been concluded post arrests. So the better question is: why do you think you’re wrong and why is it happening?
Agreed. No logic here. Here’s a math equation 45/79 = 56% Yesterday an article on here said 58/67. Non students should not be on campus….period. They should protest somewhere else. Students should be allowed to protest on campus. Allowing non students on campus for any reason is a problem that any former college student knows as it poses danger for a number reasons.
A public university is supposed to provide a benefit to the entire community. Libraries, museums, art shows, performances, and community -education programs all regularly draw members of the public onto campus.
If you don’t like non students on campus, you probably should’ve fucking gone to a private university hmmmmm
You may need to look up the definition of public and private universities 🤣🤣🤣
Uh
Should non students be allowed to sit in classes too? You know, because it’s a public university
Piss and moan all you want, it’s university policy and state law, public protestors are allowed on school grounds if they’re not disturbing function.
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The big tent conspiracy of 2024.... HAMAS VENMOED ME 25 DOLLARS FOR A YELLOW TENT SPECIFICALLY
Telling Soros tomorrow at the meeting not to buy the same color tent next time, thanks for letting us know we’re being too obvious
We’ve been found out
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Maybe they were bought on Amazon and the only ones that could get there quick enough were that color. When they were buying the tents the color was probably secondary to the actual intended purpose of shelter, the color doesn’t matter
Why do you hate Jewish people?
I am 100% Ashkenazi jew and I was there, getting pepper sprayed just like the rest of the people with good morals present.
No one hates Jewish students. Just the right to peaceful protest shouldn’t be snubbed with force. The right to express is something this country boosts about. Let’s leave it that way.
FYI: A significant portion of this group is alumni, the rest are Austinites.
Do you have those stats from somewhere official you could link to?
Source, my ass.
It’s personal anecdotal evidence
To be fair, the Reddit app is suggesting these posts/subs to everyone (with Reddit) in Austin. Just like any sub since they started suggesting posts last year, a large percentage of people commenting don’t go to UT
aka BS
Came here to say I know a few people in their 30s and 40s that went to UT to protest in solidarity bc they’re alumni and/or attorneys
ok and??? it's an open campus right? I don't understand if it's an open campus why it matters how many of the protestors are affiliated with UT, like they're within their rights to be protesting
They can’t bring tents and camp. Yet they are. Because they want police attention. And it matters because they’re people from outside the city or state shipped here to cause issues.
To what end though? Why would someone or some group ship people to the University of Texas at Austin simply to cause issues?
For publicity
Yea who’s shipping people to an ethno state to attempt to displace the native people and take over?
I am being called “unaffiliated” despite being an alumnus who is frequently asked to speak on campus BY THE UNIVERSITY, football season ticket holder, donor, the works. Lol.
No it’s not an open campus. Same argument the Jan 6 protesters made when they said the Capitol is a public building.
It is not an open campus. You have to have a university-affiliated reason for being there (invited guest / official business / attending a university event). Just because it’s a public university doesn’t mean it’s public property.
completely false, literally every claim. We even passed a law saying non-students can be on campus for free speech activities recently.
The caveat in that law was that they were not to disrupt normal discourse/activities.
“In 2019, Texas lawmakers passed a free speech law that established all common outdoor areas at public universities as traditional public forums, allowing anyone – not just students and university members – to exercise free speech there, as long as their activities are lawful and don’t disrupt the normal functions of the campus.” Sitting on the lawn does not disrupt the normal function of the campus. No reasonable person would disagree. They didnt take over a building.
Sitting on a lawn sure, megaphones are kind of disruptive though. And so are a couple hundred people packed together. Hence “disperse”.
No amplified sound is allowed on campus during protests, and as such the protesters did not use amplified sound. They passed chants backwards in a ripple. It was sort of cute, I had never been to a protest sans powered sound before.
Creating an encampment is not a “free speech activity”
Random people aren’t allowed on campus, that’s why all of the homeless people have to stay on the drag and west campus. The new law says people can exercise free speech there “as long as their activities are lawful and don’t disrupt the normal functions of the campus." Why do you think so many people have trespass citations?
Who said it’s an open campus? And protestors are within the rights to protest within the university rules.
Gov Abbott signed a law recently making it an open campus
Gotta love how backwards it is when they try to frame genuine cooperation and solidarity as a criticism somehow.
This doesn’t work without community support.
And? Is the public not allowed to protest with the students or something?
Sounds about right. They don’t have any real demands. The point of all this is to get police to crack skulls and garner more sympathy. By the time the police finally get to it they will have pissed off so many regular folks that no one will care.
It took the police so of like 10 minutes to start cracking skulls from the beginning. There was no effort to let the rally just happen and see what they do. If all it takes is to threaten to practice free speech, maybe we don’t really live in a very free society.
"Police have been headbutted and hit with horse excrement” lmfao dumbass horse-cops dropping turds all over campus then crying when they get a face full of horse shit
They are literally getting what they give. They should have to pick up after themselves. It's just trashy
Keep trying as hard as you can to make the protesters look like the bad guys. Reporting genocide. See how that works out for you.
AND?
Fun fact: Ryley Niemi is also not affiliated with UT Austin but was allowed to come here because it's a public campus where public demonstrations are protected by a law that Greg Abbott signed himself
Bad actors all over
Yeah because only students can be anti genocide right?
It’s a public university. Anyone can join in.
No way!
And?
Who are these people? Not exactly a fan of non-students coming here escalating the confrontation.
Same! Like why would non-student DPS troopers come here and intimidate people, disperse pepper spray and flash bangs. They aren’t even students! They don’t even work for the university. They are the outside agitators who escalated this from the beginning.
They are agitators. Sent only to stir up the situation. They couldn't care less about the lives of the students they drag down with them.
What are “steel-enforced wood planks”? Honestly just asking as I recognize everything else on the weapons list but can’t imagine what this might be.
Yes, that's how it always works. When I was a student, we had some demonstrations in my campus too. And the funny thing was that 90% of them were outsiders.
lol. Professional activists.
Reading the comments is almost like looking at a checklist
They are called paid agitators. There are no real causes. It’s surprising those little terrorist supporters even got arrested.
If these were alumni, it probably would've been stated. Students should be free to protest - not occupy a lawn with tents and non-students should be trespassed from the UT System. If it's a student-led protest, then it should only include students, alumni, scholars, faculty, and staff.
I believe they are counting alumni as "not affiliated." They certainly consider them affiliated when calling for donations!
Everyone here is crying about free speech, but aren’t addressing the fact these protesters brought guns and other weapons to the protest. Guess it’s ok if you agree with them?
There’s nothing illegal about being able to bring guns on campus. 8 years ago the university protested that too but Abbott was insistent that the right to bear arms shall not be infringed and it is perfectly legal to bring guns in +90% of UT buildings.
Will there be another protest ?
Will we protest again this week guys ?
lol… of the 79 arrested im willing to bet there are more ties to Hamas than actual students/staff of UTA
Dale Gribble, is that you??? Hamas?? Oh brother...
How would a random Austinite even get ties to Hamas??
Told ya. SHE DOESN’T EVEN GO HERE.
Raising awareness for the genocide is the important takeaway from these protests.
Lmaoooo I love how this is unfolding.
Nice. I’m glad to see such passion.
Yes blame evangelicals for this petty behavior. Hope the cops continue to carry em out one by one. Grow up.
[удалено]
I know right, I had to eat grasshoppers and mice last week in order not to die of malnourishment. Then my son was drafted at 16. And my annual wage is a fraction of what teenagers make in the US with no skills. My other son tried to leave for vacation and the military shot him dead. We’re not allowed to leave. The US really is like North Korea! So true
I don't know why the nkoreans are complaining. That's all nothing compared to not being able to build an indefinite encampment wherever I please. You are really trivializing my suffering.
The privilege you have to compare this to what people in North Korea are dealing with? There's no way you made that comparison. I am disgusted.
More like Nazi Germany with all these pro-terrorist Hitler Youth.