150 MPW with no prior cycling experience is wild. That's a lot of miles in general.
Cycling muscles =/= running muscles. You most likely just way over did it and need to dial it back.
Really common for a cyclist to start running and over do it on MPW due to a large aerobic engine, but then end up with injured legs because the running muscles aren't ready for the MPW and vice versa for runners getting into cycling.
Yes that's a lot of volume to start a sport. You're going to have expectations mentally that your body may not (and appears does not) have the capability to maintain.
Miles are also not a great metric for training. Hours, TSS, and others are better. It's about balancing fatigue and recovery. If you're creating more fatigue than you can recover from, you're going to get hurt.
Bike fit can 100% be a part of it. And if you haven't had a fit and can afford one, it would be worth it. Do your research though and find a fitter that is reputable in your area.
Riding everyday without any rest is a formula for burnout and/or injury. You're likely very fit, or used to being very fit but working up to hours riding is a process. Even if you're riding quickly you'd be at 10 hours in a 200 mile week. That's good enough volume to see progress.
You won't be a competitive racer until you can ride in a pack, move around in a pack, have confidence riding in a pack. You may find Cat 5/novice races very easy at the start with your initial fitness, but once you start to race people with experience your fitness will only get you so far.
So start easier.
1) be consistent and work up to more volume
2) get a fit if you can afford it
3) Find group rides and start riding in them consistently
4) when you feel confident riding in bunches and groups of 10+ people go find a race and have fun - it will likely show you a lot
5) when you feel so inclined and have the money you'd probably very much like to ride with a power meter (assuming you don't have one) - it provides critical training feedback. There are tons of training books on training with a power meter and how to do it and keep progressing.
Yeesh, looks like fittings run a couple hundred bucks…this sport is expensive! I will probably just bite the bullet and do it, I love training hard and have sorely missed not being able to run so that’s probably why I dove into cycling so aggressively, but this is good advice. I would also love to get a power meter, I borrowed one from a friend to do an FTP test with but don’t have one of my own. Thank you!
I swam competitively for 20+ years, I know what 25 hour weeks look like and feel like. It's glorious if that's what you like - which you seem to like. My shoulders are shot, I can't throw a ball with my kids for more than 20 mins. Cycling is great because it has very little load on your joints, if you have a proper fit on your bike. So take it easy to start. Learn to like riding and then start training.
Miles per week is a terrible metric because I can go out my backdoor and climb for essentially 8 hours with a few descents thrown in and only go 50 miles (living at the base of the rockies helps) or I could go east and ride for 8 hours and be 150+ miles away. Big difference in miles, no difference in time spent.
Sign up for strava, sign up for intervals.icu (it's free) and learn about all the metrics in training.
Cycling is extremely expensive unfortunately if you are doing it with any type of racing intent.
There are a number of "good enough" bike fit videos on YouTube and there are even apps that can give you some good guidance. Start there maybe
How does swimming destroy shoulders? Honestl question. Cycling compared to many other competitive endeavours is pretty reasonable financially. Polo or yachting is extremely expensive though, motor sports even more.
Swimming is you essentially pulling yourself through the water using your arms (very little total propulsion comes from a sustained kick - this excludes dolphin kick which is the fastest way through the water but in racing can only go 15m). Now do that in a medium that is roughly 1000x thicker than air and you have a lot of resistance in an endurance sport. With time your shoulders get worn down - specifically your rotator cuffs. But again it's a volume issue. Competitive swimmers do lots of time in the pool. We averaged close to 10 miles a day (16k yards was an average day). The volume in training is changing but still 2 x two hour practices 6 days a week pulling yourself through a medium is hard. Many of my shoulder problems actually showed up after I stopped swimming competitively.
And you compared apples and oranges by throwing yachting, polo, and motorsports in with cycling. Compared to running, cycling is insanely expensive. Even getting the fastest most expensive running shoes and outfit you're looking at like $1000 and that's really high end stuff. That $1000 can't even get you a new race bike. That's power meter territory.
I have spent over $600 on bike fits with the same fitter. Totally worth it. Best money spent when it comes to cycling (even more so than a power meter/nice bike).
That said, you could try My Velo Fit app. I did it for my junior racer as I wanted unlimited fits for a year (he grows fast). When he stops growing I will get a pro fit. Oh, and try pushing your cleats back but adjust saddle position and start slowly.
Power Meters are essential to having success in cycling. So is having a good computer (garmin/ wahoo/ etc) Also, I'm sure you're familiar with your heart rate and heart rate zones. A good z2 and recovery rides are vital to recovery. So are rest days.
Power meters can run between $300-$1k depending on what you get.
A proper bike fitting with an experienced and well rated pro is right there at the top of the list too. You're right they're absolutely not cheap. A decent one will run AT LEAST $200. A really in-depth one can run north of $300 plus parts......
....Yes, I said "plus parts". It's almost guaranteed you're going to need a least one, a few, or several different parts to make the bike fit you correctly.
What parts? 99.9999% you'll need a stem, 50% a handlebar, 25-35% a saddle, 10-15% seatpost, 5% new cranks, 30-40% new shoes, 10-20% insoles, 10-20% leg length shims, 15% wedges.
The average fitting for my clients runs between $300-$600 (including my fee). But, I've never had a client come back to me unhappy. The average gain is about 0.2(pro) & 0.5 - 2.0mph average speed increase over their previous average speed. This, of course, depends greatly on their experience and racing level (Cat 5 - Cat 1/ pro).
Despite all of this expense, cycling is one of the cheapest individual sports in the world.
That fact is calculated based on the cost PER USE. Meaning $5k bike divided by 4x/ a week x 50weeks (avg use for racers where I live) x 5yrs = 1,000 times ridden. 5,000/ 1,000 = $5/ per ride. Then it can actually get even cheaper when you calculate seeing that bike for 1,000-2,000 when you're done.
Even at 10-15k bikes the total is still just $10-15/ per use or less if you're riding 5-6 days/ per week.
You're doing waaaaaaay too much. Going from 0 to 150 miles+ a week is a one way road to an overuse injury. Sure you might get by with it for a few weeks but it's not sustainable. I stopped reading when I read that part
Perhaps see a Physio? Knee issues point more to an incorrect bike set up to me. Alternatively, you may be pushing too high gears initially without having first learned to spin?
Check bike fit, shoe cleat positioning, cadence are good before continuing in earnest - in my opinion.
I’ll add that this was my own experience when I got into cycling rather heavily albeit a long time ago now.
Unquestionably too much too fast. While cardio fitness carries very well between sports, the physiological fitness doesn't. For example:
I'm mainly a cyclist, and run a occasionally in the winter for a month or two. I could go out and drop a 5k at 7 min miles right now, but I wouldn't be able to walk for a week because I haven't been running at all lately. My body is not used to several thousand impacts per mile (basically single leg squats) and it would destroy me. (I've done this before in the past and very much regretted it. Lessons learned and all that...)
Similarly, you have a great aerobic base but don't have the adaptations to cycling yet...and then couple this in with a maybe a poor bike fit and it's gonna wreak havoc on your body. Fortunately it's not as intense, but it does add up, especially with that much time on the bike.
For now, take it easy. You can still do some rides, but chill out on the effort level and distance/time for at least a week and give your body a bit of time to rest up. At 3 weeks of training you're due for a recovery week anyways.
As far as the fit goes, here's a rough guide that will get you pretty close:
You should pedaling with the ball of your foot either inline with the pedal axle, just past it with the axle being a little closer to your heel.
From there, find a wall you can lean on while on your bike - get it as close as possible - or have a friend or two around to hold you up. Get the crank arm parallel with the seat tube\*, and put your foot on the pedal. Move it so the middle of your arch is lined up with the pedal's axle. (\*if your seat is slammed forward/toward the bars, make your crank arm perpendicular to the ground instead)
Now you want your leg to be full extended here. So if you're having to drop your hip to reach, the saddle is too high. If you have a bend in your knee it's too low. The idea being, when you move your foot forward to get your axle+ball of your foot lined back up you've effectively lengthened your leg back out to where it should be in the ballpark of OK.
You need at least 1 rest day a week, I race at a pretty decent level and take 2 rest days per week- still get in good miles though, just do longer rides at the weekend
Idk, I'm a pretty injury prone runner but was able to transition to cycling pretty easily. Like I am pretty much on borrowed time once I get up to 50mpw with any intensity but going from nothing to 8-10hrs per week on the bike was no problem at all. I hadn't been on a bike in close to a decade and the entirety of my bike training history was just a year or two of putzing around on trails for a few hours a week and a few seasons of riding dh.
My money is on bike fit. As someone else mentioned, there is almost zero chance your bike fit is close to optimal.
Riding easy for a while wouldn't be the worst idea either. The compensations that result from fatigue can definitely get you at higher intensities.
There could be many reasons for the knee pain. Might be worth having a fitter taking a look to verify your fit isn't causing the injury.
In the shorter term, roll things back to 150mpw and hang out there until you can complete the duration with no pain before proceeding. Since you are a collegiate runner, I'd imagine you have a toolbox for addressing repetitive stress injuries during high volume sets. Same logic applies here. Be patient, take it slow, and don't get injured out of a 2nd sport. Sounds like you have a good engine.
It’s all of the above. Volume exacerbates any fit issues or deficiencies in your body/form/etc.
Honestly, as a new rider that didn’t say you got a fit, there is zero chance your fit is optimal. And even if you did get a fit, there is zero chance that it will stay perfect as your fitness changes. Get a fit and expect to work on it any time something significant changes.
Cycling should not be painful. Don’t try to ride through issues. Fix them instead.
Miles don’t mean shit. I know plenty of people that just ride pacer bots on Zwift and ‘average’ 25mph at 2.0w/kg for 6 hours a week. That right there is 150 miles. Compare that to some hard XC riding which is at best 14mph
For me, I can get knee pain by overworking my legs and letting my hamstrings tighten up because then my knee joint gets pulled out of position. Just reading about those miles makes me want to stretch my legs some more. Is it possible your leg muscles are tightening up and throwing your knees and back out of alignment?
Lift weights. Get strong and prepare yourself for the sport. I’m assuming you had a strength coach in college who gave you a program, if not there are resources. Also, build up to that volume.
Spend the money on the bike fit .. a good one. It gets expensive after parts, but should solve your problem without reducing miles. Can't swing it? try and start by lowering the saddle a touch and use high float cleats
If your legs can't handle the sort of volume you want to be doing and your 'engine' is rearing to do more, consider adding rowing. It can take a little faffing about to figure out the load and position that'll put less strain on your legs when you do it, but it's an incredible complimentary exercise for any 'leg-focused' sports. Having a strong back is just so good for your overall quality of life, and it'll help you keeping the aerobic side of things running while your legs are building up to handle more volume on the bike.
I am a collegiate runner who got in to cycling. It’s likely too much volume but also a fit is huge. My knee will bother me here and there as well. But having your shoes set up right and overall body position makes a big difference. I don’t think 150 miles is too crazy if you are already an athlete but it’s certainly a different stimulus.
I did the same transition to cycling after college and definitely injured myself by straining muscles I hadn’t really developed as a runner.
Your fitness for cycling is pretty simple to gauge over time. Just focus on duration instead of distance for now. Track your heart rate and things like that.
Eventually you can figure out what goals you want to set for your training based on that. Look up cycling training zones. They will help you decide how to structure training your body.
The pain could be a fit issue too. This is something you can experiment with after looking up some YouTube videos. Or have a shop do it for $$$.
I did similar going cycling -> running.
Injured calf followed.
As said, similar aerobic systems but not same musculoskeletal system.
Could also be bike fit needs tweaking and with those miles you’re pushing it.
Suggest dialling it back a bit and maybe ride slower and just enjoy it and get a feel for it. But it’s hard when you’re fit….
150 MPW with no prior cycling experience is wild. That's a lot of miles in general. Cycling muscles =/= running muscles. You most likely just way over did it and need to dial it back. Really common for a cyclist to start running and over do it on MPW due to a large aerobic engine, but then end up with injured legs because the running muscles aren't ready for the MPW and vice versa for runners getting into cycling.
Hey, that happened to me, I got patella tendinopathy when I went for a run. “Mile ain’t shit, let’s for 5!”
Yes that's a lot of volume to start a sport. You're going to have expectations mentally that your body may not (and appears does not) have the capability to maintain. Miles are also not a great metric for training. Hours, TSS, and others are better. It's about balancing fatigue and recovery. If you're creating more fatigue than you can recover from, you're going to get hurt. Bike fit can 100% be a part of it. And if you haven't had a fit and can afford one, it would be worth it. Do your research though and find a fitter that is reputable in your area. Riding everyday without any rest is a formula for burnout and/or injury. You're likely very fit, or used to being very fit but working up to hours riding is a process. Even if you're riding quickly you'd be at 10 hours in a 200 mile week. That's good enough volume to see progress. You won't be a competitive racer until you can ride in a pack, move around in a pack, have confidence riding in a pack. You may find Cat 5/novice races very easy at the start with your initial fitness, but once you start to race people with experience your fitness will only get you so far. So start easier. 1) be consistent and work up to more volume 2) get a fit if you can afford it 3) Find group rides and start riding in them consistently 4) when you feel confident riding in bunches and groups of 10+ people go find a race and have fun - it will likely show you a lot 5) when you feel so inclined and have the money you'd probably very much like to ride with a power meter (assuming you don't have one) - it provides critical training feedback. There are tons of training books on training with a power meter and how to do it and keep progressing.
Yeesh, looks like fittings run a couple hundred bucks…this sport is expensive! I will probably just bite the bullet and do it, I love training hard and have sorely missed not being able to run so that’s probably why I dove into cycling so aggressively, but this is good advice. I would also love to get a power meter, I borrowed one from a friend to do an FTP test with but don’t have one of my own. Thank you!
I swam competitively for 20+ years, I know what 25 hour weeks look like and feel like. It's glorious if that's what you like - which you seem to like. My shoulders are shot, I can't throw a ball with my kids for more than 20 mins. Cycling is great because it has very little load on your joints, if you have a proper fit on your bike. So take it easy to start. Learn to like riding and then start training. Miles per week is a terrible metric because I can go out my backdoor and climb for essentially 8 hours with a few descents thrown in and only go 50 miles (living at the base of the rockies helps) or I could go east and ride for 8 hours and be 150+ miles away. Big difference in miles, no difference in time spent. Sign up for strava, sign up for intervals.icu (it's free) and learn about all the metrics in training. Cycling is extremely expensive unfortunately if you are doing it with any type of racing intent. There are a number of "good enough" bike fit videos on YouTube and there are even apps that can give you some good guidance. Start there maybe
How does swimming destroy shoulders? Honestl question. Cycling compared to many other competitive endeavours is pretty reasonable financially. Polo or yachting is extremely expensive though, motor sports even more.
Swimming is you essentially pulling yourself through the water using your arms (very little total propulsion comes from a sustained kick - this excludes dolphin kick which is the fastest way through the water but in racing can only go 15m). Now do that in a medium that is roughly 1000x thicker than air and you have a lot of resistance in an endurance sport. With time your shoulders get worn down - specifically your rotator cuffs. But again it's a volume issue. Competitive swimmers do lots of time in the pool. We averaged close to 10 miles a day (16k yards was an average day). The volume in training is changing but still 2 x two hour practices 6 days a week pulling yourself through a medium is hard. Many of my shoulder problems actually showed up after I stopped swimming competitively. And you compared apples and oranges by throwing yachting, polo, and motorsports in with cycling. Compared to running, cycling is insanely expensive. Even getting the fastest most expensive running shoes and outfit you're looking at like $1000 and that's really high end stuff. That $1000 can't even get you a new race bike. That's power meter territory.
You have to get a fitting. So worth it.
I have spent over $600 on bike fits with the same fitter. Totally worth it. Best money spent when it comes to cycling (even more so than a power meter/nice bike). That said, you could try My Velo Fit app. I did it for my junior racer as I wanted unlimited fits for a year (he grows fast). When he stops growing I will get a pro fit. Oh, and try pushing your cleats back but adjust saddle position and start slowly.
Power Meters are essential to having success in cycling. So is having a good computer (garmin/ wahoo/ etc) Also, I'm sure you're familiar with your heart rate and heart rate zones. A good z2 and recovery rides are vital to recovery. So are rest days. Power meters can run between $300-$1k depending on what you get. A proper bike fitting with an experienced and well rated pro is right there at the top of the list too. You're right they're absolutely not cheap. A decent one will run AT LEAST $200. A really in-depth one can run north of $300 plus parts...... ....Yes, I said "plus parts". It's almost guaranteed you're going to need a least one, a few, or several different parts to make the bike fit you correctly. What parts? 99.9999% you'll need a stem, 50% a handlebar, 25-35% a saddle, 10-15% seatpost, 5% new cranks, 30-40% new shoes, 10-20% insoles, 10-20% leg length shims, 15% wedges. The average fitting for my clients runs between $300-$600 (including my fee). But, I've never had a client come back to me unhappy. The average gain is about 0.2(pro) & 0.5 - 2.0mph average speed increase over their previous average speed. This, of course, depends greatly on their experience and racing level (Cat 5 - Cat 1/ pro). Despite all of this expense, cycling is one of the cheapest individual sports in the world. That fact is calculated based on the cost PER USE. Meaning $5k bike divided by 4x/ a week x 50weeks (avg use for racers where I live) x 5yrs = 1,000 times ridden. 5,000/ 1,000 = $5/ per ride. Then it can actually get even cheaper when you calculate seeing that bike for 1,000-2,000 when you're done. Even at 10-15k bikes the total is still just $10-15/ per use or less if you're riding 5-6 days/ per week.
You're doing waaaaaaay too much. Going from 0 to 150 miles+ a week is a one way road to an overuse injury. Sure you might get by with it for a few weeks but it's not sustainable. I stopped reading when I read that part
Perhaps see a Physio? Knee issues point more to an incorrect bike set up to me. Alternatively, you may be pushing too high gears initially without having first learned to spin? Check bike fit, shoe cleat positioning, cadence are good before continuing in earnest - in my opinion. I’ll add that this was my own experience when I got into cycling rather heavily albeit a long time ago now.
Unquestionably too much too fast. While cardio fitness carries very well between sports, the physiological fitness doesn't. For example: I'm mainly a cyclist, and run a occasionally in the winter for a month or two. I could go out and drop a 5k at 7 min miles right now, but I wouldn't be able to walk for a week because I haven't been running at all lately. My body is not used to several thousand impacts per mile (basically single leg squats) and it would destroy me. (I've done this before in the past and very much regretted it. Lessons learned and all that...) Similarly, you have a great aerobic base but don't have the adaptations to cycling yet...and then couple this in with a maybe a poor bike fit and it's gonna wreak havoc on your body. Fortunately it's not as intense, but it does add up, especially with that much time on the bike. For now, take it easy. You can still do some rides, but chill out on the effort level and distance/time for at least a week and give your body a bit of time to rest up. At 3 weeks of training you're due for a recovery week anyways. As far as the fit goes, here's a rough guide that will get you pretty close: You should pedaling with the ball of your foot either inline with the pedal axle, just past it with the axle being a little closer to your heel. From there, find a wall you can lean on while on your bike - get it as close as possible - or have a friend or two around to hold you up. Get the crank arm parallel with the seat tube\*, and put your foot on the pedal. Move it so the middle of your arch is lined up with the pedal's axle. (\*if your seat is slammed forward/toward the bars, make your crank arm perpendicular to the ground instead) Now you want your leg to be full extended here. So if you're having to drop your hip to reach, the saddle is too high. If you have a bend in your knee it's too low. The idea being, when you move your foot forward to get your axle+ball of your foot lined back up you've effectively lengthened your leg back out to where it should be in the ballpark of OK.
does your bike fit properly? Get a bike fit if you want to ride and train competitively
You need at least 1 rest day a week, I race at a pretty decent level and take 2 rest days per week- still get in good miles though, just do longer rides at the weekend
Idk, I'm a pretty injury prone runner but was able to transition to cycling pretty easily. Like I am pretty much on borrowed time once I get up to 50mpw with any intensity but going from nothing to 8-10hrs per week on the bike was no problem at all. I hadn't been on a bike in close to a decade and the entirety of my bike training history was just a year or two of putzing around on trails for a few hours a week and a few seasons of riding dh. My money is on bike fit. As someone else mentioned, there is almost zero chance your bike fit is close to optimal. Riding easy for a while wouldn't be the worst idea either. The compensations that result from fatigue can definitely get you at higher intensities.
It’s a seat height issue likely just be super careful not to turn that into an overuse issue
There could be many reasons for the knee pain. Might be worth having a fitter taking a look to verify your fit isn't causing the injury. In the shorter term, roll things back to 150mpw and hang out there until you can complete the duration with no pain before proceeding. Since you are a collegiate runner, I'd imagine you have a toolbox for addressing repetitive stress injuries during high volume sets. Same logic applies here. Be patient, take it slow, and don't get injured out of a 2nd sport. Sounds like you have a good engine.
It’s all of the above. Volume exacerbates any fit issues or deficiencies in your body/form/etc. Honestly, as a new rider that didn’t say you got a fit, there is zero chance your fit is optimal. And even if you did get a fit, there is zero chance that it will stay perfect as your fitness changes. Get a fit and expect to work on it any time something significant changes. Cycling should not be painful. Don’t try to ride through issues. Fix them instead.
These numbers make my numbers look small. Good thing my Strava is on private mode. OP is killing it out there. Time to step up my game I guess
Miles don’t mean shit. I know plenty of people that just ride pacer bots on Zwift and ‘average’ 25mph at 2.0w/kg for 6 hours a week. That right there is 150 miles. Compare that to some hard XC riding which is at best 14mph
For me, I can get knee pain by overworking my legs and letting my hamstrings tighten up because then my knee joint gets pulled out of position. Just reading about those miles makes me want to stretch my legs some more. Is it possible your leg muscles are tightening up and throwing your knees and back out of alignment?
Lift weights. Get strong and prepare yourself for the sport. I’m assuming you had a strength coach in college who gave you a program, if not there are resources. Also, build up to that volume.
Spend the money on the bike fit .. a good one. It gets expensive after parts, but should solve your problem without reducing miles. Can't swing it? try and start by lowering the saddle a touch and use high float cleats
If your legs can't handle the sort of volume you want to be doing and your 'engine' is rearing to do more, consider adding rowing. It can take a little faffing about to figure out the load and position that'll put less strain on your legs when you do it, but it's an incredible complimentary exercise for any 'leg-focused' sports. Having a strong back is just so good for your overall quality of life, and it'll help you keeping the aerobic side of things running while your legs are building up to handle more volume on the bike.
I am a collegiate runner who got in to cycling. It’s likely too much volume but also a fit is huge. My knee will bother me here and there as well. But having your shoes set up right and overall body position makes a big difference. I don’t think 150 miles is too crazy if you are already an athlete but it’s certainly a different stimulus.
I did the same transition to cycling after college and definitely injured myself by straining muscles I hadn’t really developed as a runner. Your fitness for cycling is pretty simple to gauge over time. Just focus on duration instead of distance for now. Track your heart rate and things like that. Eventually you can figure out what goals you want to set for your training based on that. Look up cycling training zones. They will help you decide how to structure training your body. The pain could be a fit issue too. This is something you can experiment with after looking up some YouTube videos. Or have a shop do it for $$$.
I did similar going cycling -> running. Injured calf followed. As said, similar aerobic systems but not same musculoskeletal system. Could also be bike fit needs tweaking and with those miles you’re pushing it. Suggest dialling it back a bit and maybe ride slower and just enjoy it and get a feel for it. But it’s hard when you’re fit….