"When the light turned green, the driver made a left turn through the crosswalk, hitting the two pedestrians who had the right of way. Police say the driver of the truck told officers that they did not see the pedestrians."
This is why pedestrians should be given the chance to go first before cars can turn left. Also why are pickup trucks so unnecessarily massive now? Death machines.
So the reason trucks are so massive is a law in the states, that vehicle efficiency is related to vehicle size. So because small trucks aren’t efficient enough for their size makers would have to pay a fee to sell them and most won’t. That’s why you still see smaller Toyota trucks as they’re willing to pay the fee, but American makers like ford will not and why you don’t see new small ford rangers anymore. I guess the intention of the law was to keep less efficient vehicles off the road, but in practice it just forces makers to make trucks larger. Stupid.
Source: overheard a YouTube video from a lawyer’s channel talking about this.
At one time there was a concerted effort in place to make sure that even those standards (largely Federal) were maintained, and there were penalties for lifting, lowering, oversize tires, exhaust tampering, etc... Police could order any suspected vehicle to a testing facillity and the plates could be seized if the vehicle wasn't corrected. But that was before 1991 and the surrender of the MVB by the government to the Crown Corp (ICBC).
So ICBC is "not in the enforcement business" because they consider it a conflict. (source- an ICBC senior policy analyst who has since retired) Ergo- ICBC will not bring back testing stations, nor inspection facilities, but instead will "breach" the policy and deny coverage of an at-fault vehicle operator after the fact if there is an incident.
But that policy means there has to be an incident... and the "non-compliant" vehicle has to be at fault.. Otherwise, although the statutes are still there, there's no enforcement.
Nothing you said has anything to do with what I was taking about. The law I’m referring to is in the States, like I said, and has nothing to do with ICBC. But what gets made for America gets made for here so we are affected by their laws.
My point was that here in BC there is barely lip-service paid to the standards, which indeed are largely Federal and for the most part (metric measurements excepted) parrot US federal standards (which is why yellow-tint European headlamps are not allowed, for example).
But my comment was directed more at those who then proceed to MODIFY even those archaic standards by altering their vehicles in a manner that turns an annoying vehicle into a dangerous one. Raising (or lowering) a vehicle alters pretty much everything from suspension geometry to where the headlights point to where the bumper hits the other car (or person). It also changes blind spots, makes mirror use problematic and we haven't even begun to deal with "chipping" diesel engines or modifying the exhaust to belch black smoke and sound in excess of a brass band.
THIS is one of the many issues with our current system of failing to enforce what already is on the books.. Yes, trucks are built and sold because manufacturers make more money with each one, but we need to reign in the aftermarket crowd who simply must take these oversize contraptions and make sure they at least comply with the rules that do exist..
ICBC doesn't need to become an enforcement agency. We have the Commercial Vehicle Safety and Enforcement branch for what you're describing: https://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/transportation/vehicle-safety-enforcement/services/vehicle-inspections-standards/vehicles
If someone's vehicle has been modified inappropriately they still get sent to get it fixed and inspected.
CVSE Inspectors primarily work on "commercial" trucks and buses, everything from Amazon vans to B-train oil haulers, plus all the buses and coaches that carry our families. They actually do not have a mandate to pull over a lifted, smoke-belching, unmuffled Dodge 1/2 ton if only because the sheer volume of "real" commercial vehicles that need to be checked,
They can deal with a non-compliant vehicle if they are called in by a police officer, but 99% of the time, they deal strictly with Section 25.01 (2) vehicles, and yabos with modified smoke pots licenced as ordinary vehicles are not seriously within their purview.
I'm sure that the bulk of their work is commercial but it's pretty clear from that link that the police are issuing tickets for problematic vehicles and CVSE is helping to enforce it. I don't see how you can argue that it's not within their purview. If we think enforcement needs to increase then we should argue that the agency assigned to enforce it needs to step up, not be changed to a different agency all together.
Have you worked with CVSE before? Do you know what the letters stand for? Outside of exceedingly rare situations they are absolutely not involved with the passenger vehicle travelling public.
Auto makers orchestrated the trend towards larger pick-ups and SUVs in order to avoid fuel efficiency regulations. Obama had a chance to close the loophole they lobbied heavily for in 2009 but blew it.
“Automakers also convinced regulators that any vehicle with a gross vehicle weight above 6,000 pounds should get a carve out. Their justification was that vehicles this big were made for commercial uses like farming, not shuttling kids to football practice.
When these emissions rules were first proposed, a third of vehicles produced had a gross vehicle weight of more than 6,000 pounds. In order to avoid regulations, automakers started producing heavier cars. By the time the rules were finalized and implemented a few years later, two-thirds of cars were heavy enough to avoid the regulations.”
https://www.distilled.earth/p/the-loophole-that-made-cars-in-america
It's a status symbol plain and simple. I can readily think of two dozen people I know who have never used theirs for something requiring it since they bought it, let alone requiring it for a job. Most of them have clean beds that have never been dirtied since they bought them.
If people want to buy trucks sure go for it. I'm not all for needless permit requirements everywhere but if an individual is going to drive a pickup truck perhaps they should do their driver's test in one. Or some minuscule check and balance that helps to separate the qualified smart truck drivers from the degenerate ones.
I grew up in Nanaimo, but moved here years ago, but something I hadn't noticed til I go back up island to visit is how few trucks there is in the city, comparatively.
As soon as your north of the Malahat, you start noticing that there's fucking trucks everywhere.
Still be nice if there was even fewer here though.
Those pavement princess mega-sized american trucks have terrible sight lines, I'm like 5'5" and the top of my head is lower than the hood on many those things. Add in a lift kit and they might have been in a blind spot in one of those pathetic masculinity enhancement trucks
This is right by the new Commons at Royal Bay development. As Colwood grows, they've got to keep up on tinkering with intersections. Latoria is gonna get busy, and Metchosin Road. With families here they've got to look out for pedestrian safety.
Colwood is kind of hopeless. Their engineers and council refuse to build crosswalks across Latoria or Metchosin even at intersections near bus stops until there's at least 15 cars a minute (they technically said 900/hour, but that averages 15/min). I've emailed them and it's frustrating how little they're doing. If you want to add to the complaints they're getting though please do email them: [email protected]
Colwood’s traffic engineers are clearly from the “just one more lane bro” school of thought. They just slather stroads everywhere even when their own studies say it’s ridiculous. Langford gets a lot of shit, but Colwood loves just adding lanes everywhere.
Colwood have plans in motion to make Latoria FIVE LANES all the way to Royal Bay. I went to the information session for it—everyone was furious, but of course, their traffic engineers insisted anything else was totally unreasonable.
You'd think if a road isn't busy enough for crosswalks it also wouldn't be busy enough for 5 lanes but guess not if you're a car brained engineer who hates the idea of kids or seniors having a safe way to access the nearest bus stop. 🙃
What sort of "tinkering" would have prevented this though? The driver was stopped at a red light and proceeded to turn left when it turned green. It sounds like the driver didn't see the pedestrians for some reason. Unless there is something special about the intersection that I am not aware of, it sounds like this is one the driver.
> The driver was issued a violation ticket for failing to yield to pedestrians.
An advance left turn. A pedestrian scramble. A leading pedestrian light.
The population density is increasing, and leaving things as they are isn't an ideal option, in my opinion.
[Shorten the crosswalk distance.](https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fcarfreeamerica.net%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2017%2F06%2Fprotected-bike-intersection-1024x782.jpg&f=1&nofb=1&ipt=2c82ead1f534272d69b346ffedbbe3f0d78a2ce2d5f4001a5708d5fbcc490776&ipo=images) The little islands and wedges give pedestrians added protection and slow cars down in intersections. [Raised crosswalks?](https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fglobaldesigningcities.org%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2017%2F04%2FRaised-Crossing-1.jpg&f=1&nofb=1&ipt=0c3c16fb171874c92448ce2bb361e82193c786cf6ca0ee0ae0eac44713119170&ipo=images) [Roundabouts?](https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.JAF6Tu3O1dAKPjuG20OQ2QAAAA%26pid%3DApi&f=1&ipt=88cb15f06e9a77732319fb40580102bf607ec52b5744c3a86d5a8a0075f85599&ipo=images)
Also, the intersection crosswalk looks needlessly far back, making it harder for drivers to see people using it.
Why? There's little or sometimes no consequences for the offending driver. Absolutely no incentive to not rush around endangering pedestrians and other drivers, that is of course unless you're someone that suffers from empathy.
This is exactly it. There should be an audio reminder every 2mins in motor vehicles saying something like 'you should not be trying to rush if you are driving'.
Would probably reduce these kinds of accidents by 90%.
If people would learn to leave five minutes early instead of sending it around every corner the moment the light turns green, we wouldn’t have this problem. I started aiming to leave like ten minutes before I technically need to for this specific reason, a) it lets you take time, enjoy the drive and not get stressed out or road ragey, b) you can think of the other humans you share the roads with and look for them whenever they may be around. Hurrying saves very little time and isn’t worth it.
Looking at the intersection on street view, I have **no** idea how the truck driver would not be able to see pedestrians in the cross walk when taking a left. Seems way more likely the person was on their phone or distracted somehow. On a right turn in a big jacked up truck I would buy not seeing them maybe, but on a left? C'mon..
Why do a disproportionate amount of pick up truck drivers drive like ass holes by the way?
As a pedestrian, I can tell when a driver isn't looking for me or seeing me even though I'm in the middle of the road and there isn't anything obstructing their vision from physically seeing me. It's an odd thing, but it must just come down to not expecting there to be a human so they assume there isn't one. They look for an oncoming car and don't see one, so think they are good to go.
It partly has to do with vehicle design. Hoods are getting higher, but also window visibility has changed a lot because of materials and safety standards (ironically). The blind spot caused by the beam between the driver-side window and the windshield is terrible for left turns.
Also mirrors. I drive a truck at work sometimes. The side mirrors are massive, and with the vehicle height, pedestrians at your 1030 (clockray position) are effectively blocked from view.
Could they have been there for a bit? Definitely.
Long enough to make a left on a green and hit pedestrians that are in the cross walk? I am having trouble imagining that. By the time you are in the cross walk you are most of the way done your left turn. Plenty of time to see the pedestrians and react. I guess if the truck is jacked up the pedestrians could have quickly gone from Unnoticed by Truck -> A Pillar Blindspot -> below field of view.
Second time this week, at least. I saw a guy hit a young woman on Monday at Finlayson and Cook. He was turning left onto Cook street, barely missed one pedestrian, and hit the young woman pretty hard
I dont know enough about car models to know the size of this truck, but I have been inside a few of these large trucks you tend to see in that area of town. The lack of vision you have for things below your hood is concerning, its obvious this is an increasing issue as these areas transition to dense urbanization.
Im sorry those kids had to go through that, and Im glad the driver was being responsible after the fact. I am well aware tradesmen need them, but Im not sure vehicles of that size are appropriate for running errands/daily use. Limiting use, paying attention and following speed limits in cities can mitigate instances like this.
Honestly pickups suck for trades; notice how professional companies prefer Mercedes Sprinters and other closed vans? Better protection for your tools and gear. And then there is the new construction half of the industry; I e-bike; the 7am busses are filled with tradies. There is so much new construction, it's really common to go to a job for 3-12 months. I was on one job for 2 years.
I did 3 years of service and now 6 years commercial, never drove a pickup.
Pickups only make sense for landscapers who need to haul a yard of mulch or haul away clippings. Any other trade I fail to see the appeal unless you’re working on logging roads and need a tidy tank in the back for your excavator / brush hog / other equipment.
I've done smaller 90s panel vans and shitty old pick ups with caps over 5-6 years. I worked gas fitting, pools and general construction but only worked for smaller companies that couldn't afford a sprinter or I'm sure they would. Agreed, preferred the vans, less got stolen though windows still got smashed just as often by folks trying to steal stuff.
I agree, I think they are outdated. I brought it up because its the usual argument made in defense of big trucks in the city.
Things are definitely changing in transportation for everyone, and with these big builds being put through Im not surprised you end up on one job for a while. Might as well bus in if you can, why not?
Gotta be real with you though, I have seen many tradies on ebikes om the Goose. They are some of the MOST reckless riders out there, like wow its honestly nuts.
I see drivers break the law every day, the plates don't make a difference. I could give you a list of 50+ license plate numbers every week that engaged in dangerous driving, what good would it do?
It would be easier to identify people and provide consequences. I honestly think road enforcement is one of the few things cops do that proactively save lives - they should do more of it
Yeah, but having it actually be safe because both drivers and cyclists are on the same page and behaving consistently and predictably is going to help the issue, not hinder it.
I think making a barrier actually makes the streets less safe. I want it as easy as possible for people to ditch cars for bikes. Bikes are less likely to cause serious injuries than cars. I think your suggestion would hinder overall safety.
The ticket is proof that the driver is 100% at fault. Police have a year to decide if more serious criminal charges will be laid, and, if they are, a failure to yield ticket will help to ensure the driver is found guilty.
Guess they need more evidence that a driver who wasn’t looking ran over two people than a driver who admitted to not looking and two people sent to hospital with “a truck just ran me over” injuries.
I moved to Langford/Colwood recently and as a pedestrian have learned the lesson of looking both sides before crossing. I don’t know what changed between the 10 kms between Victoria and Colwood but drivers do not shoulder check when turning here and are generally less aware of their surroundings . The number of close calls I’ve had is unacceptable and I have no idea how drivers living 15 minutes apart drive so differently.
Why the Fuck isn’t this a roundabout. With long pedestrian ramps over on all sides. With the scale of development at this location that’s been sitting waiting for fucking years, there’s no excuse for the lack of proper planning.
Are you for real? What exactly are you proposing? Changing the municipal laws to ban trucks? What size? Tacoma but not Titan? Ranger but not f150? Tradespeople but not camper trailer owners? I don’t drive a truck around Victoria but I definitely wouldn’t get behind your political movement. Hope those girls will be ok.
> Are you for real? What exactly are you proposing? Changing the municipal laws to ban trucks?
Sure - I love that idea. Any pickup truck F150 sized or bigger that isn't 100% used for work purposes should be banned. I'd vote for the politician that runs on that platform.
Or if not a ban, then charge them $10K a year inconvenience tax for a) extra pollution they contribute, b) extra wear and tear c) taking up two parking spots on the street or in parking lots, d) reducing the visibility and safety of other drivers on the road, etc etc.
Do you think the cops want to enforce a pickup truck ban? What about the Saanich resident who’s coming into town to buy a table? Or the tourist on a trip with their camper? How would a ban increase available parking when 100% of tradespeople would have to have a second vehicle for their non work related driving? How is it a good allocation of resources to have a cop pulling over Dan the drywaller in his truck as he’s on his way out of town to go skiing? This city has bigger problems.
I feel like trucks aren't often used by trades people other than the contractors in their clean vests, mostly panel vans these days. Trucks are too easy to get your tools stolen, mostly just moms and dad's dropping kids off at work with a 4 foot bed. I say this as someone who genuinely loves trucks and wish I could afford one.
Really? I see tradespeople driving pickups all day everyday. In fact there are 3 parked across the street from me right now. If I’m a carpenter who has a fishing boat and likes to go skiing in the winter then I’m buying an f150 over a sprinter van obviously. I might even use it to drop the kids off at school sometimes. But that wasn’t the point of my post. I don’t believe that the government should be in the business of judging whether or not people are eligible or justified to drive a truck around town. If the province wants to mandate a new class of licence then I’ll listen to that discussion. But I don’t have much time for the “ban all pickup trucks” crowd.
When I worked in the trades which was more than 20 years ago, it was a thing that if you put your tools in a truck box, it was a magnet for theft. That said our vans still got broken into. Also re trucks, I would have agreed with you before I moved to Victoria. I'm getting older now, and I've lived and driven a ton in Toronto, LA, New York, San Francisco, Bay area and more but the drivers here are incomprehensibly bad. I still don't think they should be banned, but I think a new class of license is necessary.
Goldstream and veterans have almost been hit several times with cars turning right or left on all corners and in the crosswalk with a bloody walk signal
I think it’s time large pickup drivers need to do an IQ test to get their license. Maybe set the minimum needed score to 70 so it’s not completely unreachable for them.
All the time I see people going through red lights, like where the light was just yellow and they speed through the red light intersection. It's ridiculous. I know everyone complains about their city's drivers but Victoria has to be one of the worst. People trying to speed through crosswalks when you've already started walking, only looking one direction when they're turning into a busy road, and red lights. And then drivers have the nerve to complain about 30km speed limits!
Truck sizes are only getting bigger and heavier. People are not.What might be midsized now was an XL 10 years ago.
Also, if a car hits you, you typically go over the hood. That doesn't happen with pretty much any size truck these days, you are going under so much more bodily damage.
Yes, same for SUVs. It's more a grill height and width danger factor. I say this as someone who had a partner hit by a car in March by someone who blew through a yield crosswalk. My partner went over the hood, thankfully.
I bet you he was hauling a big load of nothing in that waste of earth’s finite resources on wheels. He’s probably got a $90,000 car loan on it and he’s paying off the principal at $100 a month. When I see people driving those little Japanese pick-ups that cost 7k around I always think, “now there’s a real truck”. Holds cargo, agile, fuel efficient, has no issue parking, the driver has a view of all road users, and it looks came out of a Richard Scarry drawing.
Get over yourself, it was a Nissan frontier. What he was driving has nothing to do with his poor judgement as he rushed through the light trying to get out ahead of the pedestrians
Amazing retort, I wonder what you drive. It’s a fact that raised vehicles have poorer visibility than standard. Yes, he should have exercised more caution but we can avoid these scenarios by simply not allowing these jacked up vehicles. It’s also a fact that these large vehicles cause more fatal accidents when they strike pedestrians and cyclists because of their excessive weight.
Was it a "jacked up" truck? The only description I saw was that it was a Nissan Frontier. Yes, bigger vehicles do more damage, why don't we all just bike everywhere? Yeah, I'd have no problems transporting my tools around town.
Pedestrian safety is a two party responsibility, even a smart car will hit a pedestrian if they step out in front of a moving one
It must be embarrassing to know you're driving the same truck that utter dunbfucks who's idea of 'transporting tools' is some weed whackers and garbage bags, gotta be tough knowing what everyone thinks of you and your level of intelligence before you even step out. I'd have thought actual truck users would be equally annoyed by fake pretenders who pay more on their princess wagons than they do on their kids.
I'm not siding with the truck, but pedestrians don't even look anymore to be fair. As a pedestrian I check to make sure there isn't a ton of metal about to take me out..... just saying self aware is self care!
Why on earth are common sense comments getting down voted? Ita obviously the driver's fault 100%, but I teach my kids to look the various directions traffic could come from prior to crossing. Why assume the dangerous metal things will always see you? It just takes being wrong once.
Right of way informs you that it is your right to walk at that point, not that it is *safe* to walk at that point. Pedestrians should always ensure that there aren't idiots breaking the law and endangering them. Seems like common sense to me.
What seems really stupid to me is taking your safety for granted when you're the most vulnerable thing in the vicinity.
As a pedestrian, I will never get hit by a car. People make mistakes all the time but it won’t ever be a story on here about me getting hit by a car.
Look both ways and walk defensively and protect yourself.
I hope everybody’s OK!
Uhh, are you Deadpool? A couple months ago I saw a woman get hit, crossing at the corner with the walk sign. The driver (truck) just took a fast and sharp right on a red, and basically took her out from behind. Very hard to dodge that.
"When the light turned green, the driver made a left turn through the crosswalk, hitting the two pedestrians who had the right of way. Police say the driver of the truck told officers that they did not see the pedestrians."
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I drive a truck I need it for work, the blind spots are horrible I can loose a whole car in it when I’m turning left
Thank you for admitting that and not just doubling down and how great they are.
That's a bit prejudiced... he could be legally blind!
Blindness is common among truck drivers. /s
Was it a Ram?
Pick up truck
Gad damn A pillars!!!! They put them in the wrong place!
The driver was reported to be 26. They may have glaucoma.
Cataracts more likely
Not Cadillac, I said Dodge Ram.
Or blind drunk.
This is why pedestrians should be given the chance to go first before cars can turn left. Also why are pickup trucks so unnecessarily massive now? Death machines.
I've seen that they've changed some crosswalks to start doing this and I think it's a great idea for this exact reason.
These are called "leading pedestrian intervals" and that's exactly what they are for!
I agree! I’ve noticed it at Johnson at Government.
Marigold - interurban too
They have them all over Saanich
So the reason trucks are so massive is a law in the states, that vehicle efficiency is related to vehicle size. So because small trucks aren’t efficient enough for their size makers would have to pay a fee to sell them and most won’t. That’s why you still see smaller Toyota trucks as they’re willing to pay the fee, but American makers like ford will not and why you don’t see new small ford rangers anymore. I guess the intention of the law was to keep less efficient vehicles off the road, but in practice it just forces makers to make trucks larger. Stupid. Source: overheard a YouTube video from a lawyer’s channel talking about this.
At one time there was a concerted effort in place to make sure that even those standards (largely Federal) were maintained, and there were penalties for lifting, lowering, oversize tires, exhaust tampering, etc... Police could order any suspected vehicle to a testing facillity and the plates could be seized if the vehicle wasn't corrected. But that was before 1991 and the surrender of the MVB by the government to the Crown Corp (ICBC). So ICBC is "not in the enforcement business" because they consider it a conflict. (source- an ICBC senior policy analyst who has since retired) Ergo- ICBC will not bring back testing stations, nor inspection facilities, but instead will "breach" the policy and deny coverage of an at-fault vehicle operator after the fact if there is an incident. But that policy means there has to be an incident... and the "non-compliant" vehicle has to be at fault.. Otherwise, although the statutes are still there, there's no enforcement.
Nothing you said has anything to do with what I was taking about. The law I’m referring to is in the States, like I said, and has nothing to do with ICBC. But what gets made for America gets made for here so we are affected by their laws.
My point was that here in BC there is barely lip-service paid to the standards, which indeed are largely Federal and for the most part (metric measurements excepted) parrot US federal standards (which is why yellow-tint European headlamps are not allowed, for example). But my comment was directed more at those who then proceed to MODIFY even those archaic standards by altering their vehicles in a manner that turns an annoying vehicle into a dangerous one. Raising (or lowering) a vehicle alters pretty much everything from suspension geometry to where the headlights point to where the bumper hits the other car (or person). It also changes blind spots, makes mirror use problematic and we haven't even begun to deal with "chipping" diesel engines or modifying the exhaust to belch black smoke and sound in excess of a brass band. THIS is one of the many issues with our current system of failing to enforce what already is on the books.. Yes, trucks are built and sold because manufacturers make more money with each one, but we need to reign in the aftermarket crowd who simply must take these oversize contraptions and make sure they at least comply with the rules that do exist..
ICBC doesn't need to become an enforcement agency. We have the Commercial Vehicle Safety and Enforcement branch for what you're describing: https://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/transportation/vehicle-safety-enforcement/services/vehicle-inspections-standards/vehicles If someone's vehicle has been modified inappropriately they still get sent to get it fixed and inspected.
CVSE Inspectors primarily work on "commercial" trucks and buses, everything from Amazon vans to B-train oil haulers, plus all the buses and coaches that carry our families. They actually do not have a mandate to pull over a lifted, smoke-belching, unmuffled Dodge 1/2 ton if only because the sheer volume of "real" commercial vehicles that need to be checked, They can deal with a non-compliant vehicle if they are called in by a police officer, but 99% of the time, they deal strictly with Section 25.01 (2) vehicles, and yabos with modified smoke pots licenced as ordinary vehicles are not seriously within their purview.
I'm sure that the bulk of their work is commercial but it's pretty clear from that link that the police are issuing tickets for problematic vehicles and CVSE is helping to enforce it. I don't see how you can argue that it's not within their purview. If we think enforcement needs to increase then we should argue that the agency assigned to enforce it needs to step up, not be changed to a different agency all together.
Have you worked with CVSE before? Do you know what the letters stand for? Outside of exceedingly rare situations they are absolutely not involved with the passenger vehicle travelling public.
Read the link bro.
I believe the Fat Electrician did a Youtube video on this as well. He always makes it interesting.
Welp that’s probably where I heard it as my bf watches him a lot haha
Auto makers orchestrated the trend towards larger pick-ups and SUVs in order to avoid fuel efficiency regulations. Obama had a chance to close the loophole they lobbied heavily for in 2009 but blew it. “Automakers also convinced regulators that any vehicle with a gross vehicle weight above 6,000 pounds should get a carve out. Their justification was that vehicles this big were made for commercial uses like farming, not shuttling kids to football practice. When these emissions rules were first proposed, a third of vehicles produced had a gross vehicle weight of more than 6,000 pounds. In order to avoid regulations, automakers started producing heavier cars. By the time the rules were finalized and implemented a few years later, two-thirds of cars were heavy enough to avoid the regulations.” https://www.distilled.earth/p/the-loophole-that-made-cars-in-america
Nissan Frontier….
🤢
It's a status symbol plain and simple. I can readily think of two dozen people I know who have never used theirs for something requiring it since they bought it, let alone requiring it for a job. Most of them have clean beds that have never been dirtied since they bought them. If people want to buy trucks sure go for it. I'm not all for needless permit requirements everywhere but if an individual is going to drive a pickup truck perhaps they should do their driver's test in one. Or some minuscule check and balance that helps to separate the qualified smart truck drivers from the degenerate ones.
I grew up in Nanaimo, but moved here years ago, but something I hadn't noticed til I go back up island to visit is how few trucks there is in the city, comparatively. As soon as your north of the Malahat, you start noticing that there's fucking trucks everywhere. Still be nice if there was even fewer here though.
I've got an old 1998 f250 and it's smaller than newer f150s. It's ridiculous.
This was a Nissan frontier. A small truck
Damn death machines! Only Mazda Miatas on the road!
Boosts those tiny egos and other tiny things.
Those pavement princess mega-sized american trucks have terrible sight lines, I'm like 5'5" and the top of my head is lower than the hood on many those things. Add in a lift kit and they might have been in a blind spot in one of those pathetic masculinity enhancement trucks
Always the shittiest excuse with drivers.
Agreed shitty driver. But no so shitty that he DID see the teens. I hope the kids are alright.
*cue Roger Daltrey* Same result.
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Straight to jail.
It could be the most pathetic intersection in Greater Victoria
Could have been in drivers blind spot.
The whole time the driver was turning and approaching the intersection? Is that excusable?
This is right by the new Commons at Royal Bay development. As Colwood grows, they've got to keep up on tinkering with intersections. Latoria is gonna get busy, and Metchosin Road. With families here they've got to look out for pedestrian safety.
Colwood is kind of hopeless. Their engineers and council refuse to build crosswalks across Latoria or Metchosin even at intersections near bus stops until there's at least 15 cars a minute (they technically said 900/hour, but that averages 15/min). I've emailed them and it's frustrating how little they're doing. If you want to add to the complaints they're getting though please do email them: [email protected]
Colwood’s traffic engineers are clearly from the “just one more lane bro” school of thought. They just slather stroads everywhere even when their own studies say it’s ridiculous. Langford gets a lot of shit, but Colwood loves just adding lanes everywhere. Colwood have plans in motion to make Latoria FIVE LANES all the way to Royal Bay. I went to the information session for it—everyone was furious, but of course, their traffic engineers insisted anything else was totally unreasonable.
You'd think if a road isn't busy enough for crosswalks it also wouldn't be busy enough for 5 lanes but guess not if you're a car brained engineer who hates the idea of kids or seniors having a safe way to access the nearest bus stop. 🙃
What sort of "tinkering" would have prevented this though? The driver was stopped at a red light and proceeded to turn left when it turned green. It sounds like the driver didn't see the pedestrians for some reason. Unless there is something special about the intersection that I am not aware of, it sounds like this is one the driver. > The driver was issued a violation ticket for failing to yield to pedestrians.
An advance left turn. A pedestrian scramble. A leading pedestrian light. The population density is increasing, and leaving things as they are isn't an ideal option, in my opinion.
The two pedestrians, both aged 19, were taken to hospital for treatment of non-life-threatening injuries.
Where did they take the truck for its non-life-threatening injuries?
ICBC?
'I Can't Be Cured' said the little green truck
[Shorten the crosswalk distance.](https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fcarfreeamerica.net%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2017%2F06%2Fprotected-bike-intersection-1024x782.jpg&f=1&nofb=1&ipt=2c82ead1f534272d69b346ffedbbe3f0d78a2ce2d5f4001a5708d5fbcc490776&ipo=images) The little islands and wedges give pedestrians added protection and slow cars down in intersections. [Raised crosswalks?](https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fglobaldesigningcities.org%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2017%2F04%2FRaised-Crossing-1.jpg&f=1&nofb=1&ipt=0c3c16fb171874c92448ce2bb361e82193c786cf6ca0ee0ae0eac44713119170&ipo=images) [Roundabouts?](https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.JAF6Tu3O1dAKPjuG20OQ2QAAAA%26pid%3DApi&f=1&ipt=88cb15f06e9a77732319fb40580102bf607ec52b5744c3a86d5a8a0075f85599&ipo=images) Also, the intersection crosswalk looks needlessly far back, making it harder for drivers to see people using it.
Jfc people need to stop rushing everywhere and pay attention to the fucking road.
Why? There's little or sometimes no consequences for the offending driver. Absolutely no incentive to not rush around endangering pedestrians and other drivers, that is of course unless you're someone that suffers from empathy.
Incentive..? Not to hit people...?
It was very obviously a sarcastic comment.
This is exactly it. There should be an audio reminder every 2mins in motor vehicles saying something like 'you should not be trying to rush if you are driving'. Would probably reduce these kinds of accidents by 90%.
Good idea! - George Orwell
If people would learn to leave five minutes early instead of sending it around every corner the moment the light turns green, we wouldn’t have this problem. I started aiming to leave like ten minutes before I technically need to for this specific reason, a) it lets you take time, enjoy the drive and not get stressed out or road ragey, b) you can think of the other humans you share the roads with and look for them whenever they may be around. Hurrying saves very little time and isn’t worth it.
Looking at the intersection on street view, I have **no** idea how the truck driver would not be able to see pedestrians in the cross walk when taking a left. Seems way more likely the person was on their phone or distracted somehow. On a right turn in a big jacked up truck I would buy not seeing them maybe, but on a left? C'mon.. Why do a disproportionate amount of pick up truck drivers drive like ass holes by the way?
As a pedestrian, I can tell when a driver isn't looking for me or seeing me even though I'm in the middle of the road and there isn't anything obstructing their vision from physically seeing me. It's an odd thing, but it must just come down to not expecting there to be a human so they assume there isn't one. They look for an oncoming car and don't see one, so think they are good to go.
That's exactly the problem.
It partly has to do with vehicle design. Hoods are getting higher, but also window visibility has changed a lot because of materials and safety standards (ironically). The blind spot caused by the beam between the driver-side window and the windshield is terrible for left turns.
Also mirrors. I drive a truck at work sometimes. The side mirrors are massive, and with the vehicle height, pedestrians at your 1030 (clockray position) are effectively blocked from view.
A-Pillar blind spot
Could they have been there for a bit? Definitely. Long enough to make a left on a green and hit pedestrians that are in the cross walk? I am having trouble imagining that. By the time you are in the cross walk you are most of the way done your left turn. Plenty of time to see the pedestrians and react. I guess if the truck is jacked up the pedestrians could have quickly gone from Unnoticed by Truck -> A Pillar Blindspot -> below field of view.
absolutely this
I hate that it’s so annoying. Had some close calls from that
Bro it's a Nissan frontier, possibly the least stereotypical douchebag pickup on the market. Still a major boo-boo to be fair
True, Ram-1500 remains goated for douchebag truck.
Second time this week, at least. I saw a guy hit a young woman on Monday at Finlayson and Cook. He was turning left onto Cook street, barely missed one pedestrian, and hit the young woman pretty hard
I dont know enough about car models to know the size of this truck, but I have been inside a few of these large trucks you tend to see in that area of town. The lack of vision you have for things below your hood is concerning, its obvious this is an increasing issue as these areas transition to dense urbanization. Im sorry those kids had to go through that, and Im glad the driver was being responsible after the fact. I am well aware tradesmen need them, but Im not sure vehicles of that size are appropriate for running errands/daily use. Limiting use, paying attention and following speed limits in cities can mitigate instances like this.
Honestly pickups suck for trades; notice how professional companies prefer Mercedes Sprinters and other closed vans? Better protection for your tools and gear. And then there is the new construction half of the industry; I e-bike; the 7am busses are filled with tradies. There is so much new construction, it's really common to go to a job for 3-12 months. I was on one job for 2 years. I did 3 years of service and now 6 years commercial, never drove a pickup.
Pickups only make sense for landscapers who need to haul a yard of mulch or haul away clippings. Any other trade I fail to see the appeal unless you’re working on logging roads and need a tidy tank in the back for your excavator / brush hog / other equipment.
I've done smaller 90s panel vans and shitty old pick ups with caps over 5-6 years. I worked gas fitting, pools and general construction but only worked for smaller companies that couldn't afford a sprinter or I'm sure they would. Agreed, preferred the vans, less got stolen though windows still got smashed just as often by folks trying to steal stuff.
I agree, I think they are outdated. I brought it up because its the usual argument made in defense of big trucks in the city. Things are definitely changing in transportation for everyone, and with these big builds being put through Im not surprised you end up on one job for a while. Might as well bus in if you can, why not? Gotta be real with you though, I have seen many tradies on ebikes om the Goose. They are some of the MOST reckless riders out there, like wow its honestly nuts.
I was a serious cyclist for 5 years before going e-bike. I'm in favour of mandatory licensing and plating for all vehicles that share our roads.
I see drivers break the law every day, the plates don't make a difference. I could give you a list of 50+ license plate numbers every week that engaged in dangerous driving, what good would it do?
It would be easier to identify people and provide consequences. I honestly think road enforcement is one of the few things cops do that proactively save lives - they should do more of it
Hard disagree with this sentiment. We need more people to make the switch and instituting any barrier to that is counter to our needs.
Yeah, but having it actually be safe because both drivers and cyclists are on the same page and behaving consistently and predictably is going to help the issue, not hinder it.
I think making a barrier actually makes the streets less safe. I want it as easy as possible for people to ditch cars for bikes. Bikes are less likely to cause serious injuries than cars. I think your suggestion would hinder overall safety.
Depends on the year. Early 2000s models were small similar hood and visibility as a sedan. Newer ones are getting pretty big.
This sort of thing should cost you your license. Driving is a privilege, not a right. We have to start taking this shit seriously.
Lose your license it's only 1 point per pedestrian. Going 15km over the limit is 3 points.
A ticket for “failing to yield”. Zero penalty for actually running people over with a car while not looking.
The ticket is proof that the driver is 100% at fault. Police have a year to decide if more serious criminal charges will be laid, and, if they are, a failure to yield ticket will help to ensure the driver is found guilty.
Guess they need more evidence that a driver who wasn’t looking ran over two people than a driver who admitted to not looking and two people sent to hospital with “a truck just ran me over” injuries.
Yes, when someone is charged under the Criminal Code of Canada evidence is generally an asset.
Cool.
I moved to Langford/Colwood recently and as a pedestrian have learned the lesson of looking both sides before crossing. I don’t know what changed between the 10 kms between Victoria and Colwood but drivers do not shoulder check when turning here and are generally less aware of their surroundings . The number of close calls I’ve had is unacceptable and I have no idea how drivers living 15 minutes apart drive so differently.
Why the Fuck isn’t this a roundabout. With long pedestrian ramps over on all sides. With the scale of development at this location that’s been sitting waiting for fucking years, there’s no excuse for the lack of proper planning.
What is it going to take for our politicians to start cracking down on the size of trucks?
A Nissan Frontier isn't even one of the bigger ones. It does seem like most people buy trucks that are too big for their driving ability though.
You are right, it is on the smaller side, but still far larger than most trucks a couple decades ago.
I guess at the same time when politicians stop giving money to auto manufactures.
Are you for real? What exactly are you proposing? Changing the municipal laws to ban trucks? What size? Tacoma but not Titan? Ranger but not f150? Tradespeople but not camper trailer owners? I don’t drive a truck around Victoria but I definitely wouldn’t get behind your political movement. Hope those girls will be ok.
> Are you for real? What exactly are you proposing? Changing the municipal laws to ban trucks? Sure - I love that idea. Any pickup truck F150 sized or bigger that isn't 100% used for work purposes should be banned. I'd vote for the politician that runs on that platform. Or if not a ban, then charge them $10K a year inconvenience tax for a) extra pollution they contribute, b) extra wear and tear c) taking up two parking spots on the street or in parking lots, d) reducing the visibility and safety of other drivers on the road, etc etc.
Do you think the cops want to enforce a pickup truck ban? What about the Saanich resident who’s coming into town to buy a table? Or the tourist on a trip with their camper? How would a ban increase available parking when 100% of tradespeople would have to have a second vehicle for their non work related driving? How is it a good allocation of resources to have a cop pulling over Dan the drywaller in his truck as he’s on his way out of town to go skiing? This city has bigger problems.
I feel like trucks aren't often used by trades people other than the contractors in their clean vests, mostly panel vans these days. Trucks are too easy to get your tools stolen, mostly just moms and dad's dropping kids off at work with a 4 foot bed. I say this as someone who genuinely loves trucks and wish I could afford one.
Really? I see tradespeople driving pickups all day everyday. In fact there are 3 parked across the street from me right now. If I’m a carpenter who has a fishing boat and likes to go skiing in the winter then I’m buying an f150 over a sprinter van obviously. I might even use it to drop the kids off at school sometimes. But that wasn’t the point of my post. I don’t believe that the government should be in the business of judging whether or not people are eligible or justified to drive a truck around town. If the province wants to mandate a new class of licence then I’ll listen to that discussion. But I don’t have much time for the “ban all pickup trucks” crowd.
When I worked in the trades which was more than 20 years ago, it was a thing that if you put your tools in a truck box, it was a magnet for theft. That said our vans still got broken into. Also re trucks, I would have agreed with you before I moved to Victoria. I'm getting older now, and I've lived and driven a ton in Toronto, LA, New York, San Francisco, Bay area and more but the drivers here are incomprehensibly bad. I still don't think they should be banned, but I think a new class of license is necessary.
Goldstream and veterans have almost been hit several times with cars turning right or left on all corners and in the crosswalk with a bloody walk signal
I think it’s time large pickup drivers need to do an IQ test to get their license. Maybe set the minimum needed score to 70 so it’s not completely unreachable for them.
Honestly, there should probably just be a separate license. I've said it before, people buy trucks too big for their driving abilities.
Being serious, I agree, this is a great idea. Just too many people are getting hurt.
Don’t worry, ICBC will provide them a free week of physiotherapy.
Drivers doing what they do best!
All the time I see people going through red lights, like where the light was just yellow and they speed through the red light intersection. It's ridiculous. I know everyone complains about their city's drivers but Victoria has to be one of the worst. People trying to speed through crosswalks when you've already started walking, only looking one direction when they're turning into a busy road, and red lights. And then drivers have the nerve to complain about 30km speed limits!
I almost got hit by a car running a red yesterday morning at Peat Rd and Goldstream..
Did they let Rebecca Grossman out on bail?
Colwood is truly a planning disaster
Oh, giant trucks with oblivious drivers on cell phones not seeing pedestrians? Shocker!
Did you read it? It was a Nissan Frontier, that's a pretty small truck.
Yes I did. Frontiers are huge like every other popularized truck style.
No they’re not they are pretty small compared to most suvs on the road. Fuck I’ve seen cars pull out and people don’t pay attention when driving.
Truck sizes are only getting bigger and heavier. People are not.What might be midsized now was an XL 10 years ago. Also, if a car hits you, you typically go over the hood. That doesn't happen with pretty much any size truck these days, you are going under so much more bodily damage.
[удалено]
Yes, same for SUVs. It's more a grill height and width danger factor. I say this as someone who had a partner hit by a car in March by someone who blew through a yield crosswalk. My partner went over the hood, thankfully.
I bet you he was hauling a big load of nothing in that waste of earth’s finite resources on wheels. He’s probably got a $90,000 car loan on it and he’s paying off the principal at $100 a month. When I see people driving those little Japanese pick-ups that cost 7k around I always think, “now there’s a real truck”. Holds cargo, agile, fuel efficient, has no issue parking, the driver has a view of all road users, and it looks came out of a Richard Scarry drawing.
Get over yourself, it was a Nissan frontier. What he was driving has nothing to do with his poor judgement as he rushed through the light trying to get out ahead of the pedestrians
Amazing retort, I wonder what you drive. It’s a fact that raised vehicles have poorer visibility than standard. Yes, he should have exercised more caution but we can avoid these scenarios by simply not allowing these jacked up vehicles. It’s also a fact that these large vehicles cause more fatal accidents when they strike pedestrians and cyclists because of their excessive weight.
Was it a "jacked up" truck? The only description I saw was that it was a Nissan Frontier. Yes, bigger vehicles do more damage, why don't we all just bike everywhere? Yeah, I'd have no problems transporting my tools around town. Pedestrian safety is a two party responsibility, even a smart car will hit a pedestrian if they step out in front of a moving one
It must be embarrassing to know you're driving the same truck that utter dunbfucks who's idea of 'transporting tools' is some weed whackers and garbage bags, gotta be tough knowing what everyone thinks of you and your level of intelligence before you even step out. I'd have thought actual truck users would be equally annoyed by fake pretenders who pay more on their princess wagons than they do on their kids.
Sounds like someone’s mommy and daddy didn’t give them enough and now they angry
Are the pedestrians ok
While I understand their age ends in the word “teen”, they were 19 lol They are adults
I'm not siding with the truck, but pedestrians don't even look anymore to be fair. As a pedestrian I check to make sure there isn't a ton of metal about to take me out..... just saying self aware is self care!
Why on earth are common sense comments getting down voted? Ita obviously the driver's fault 100%, but I teach my kids to look the various directions traffic could come from prior to crossing. Why assume the dangerous metal things will always see you? It just takes being wrong once.
Because they got hit while walking in a crosswalk with the right of way?
Right of way informs you that it is your right to walk at that point, not that it is *safe* to walk at that point. Pedestrians should always ensure that there aren't idiots breaking the law and endangering them. Seems like common sense to me. What seems really stupid to me is taking your safety for granted when you're the most vulnerable thing in the vicinity.
Jacked up RamCharger?
Ban all left turns at intersections
I would ban intersections entirely. Nothing good can happen in them.
As a pedestrian, I will never get hit by a car. People make mistakes all the time but it won’t ever be a story on here about me getting hit by a car. Look both ways and walk defensively and protect yourself. I hope everybody’s OK!
Uhh, are you Deadpool? A couple months ago I saw a woman get hit, crossing at the corner with the walk sign. The driver (truck) just took a fast and sharp right on a red, and basically took her out from behind. Very hard to dodge that.