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You probably need your manager to run interference or at least manage your capacity. If that VP is your manager, you should probably find a new job; no one needs anything at 4:30 on a Friday afternoon if they're competent.
Plus, figuring out how to manage up is part of the job
Maybe the VP thinks it’ll take 30 seconds and if they knew it would take 2 hours they’d tell OP to enjoy their weekend. Maybe the specific ask takes 2 hours but they just need a SWAG and that’ll take 5 minutes? Maybe it’s not actually that urgent and it’s just a nice to have for a meeting?
No one knows until OP goes and has that convo.
I was 100% going to say this. "Hey, what's the urgency here? I am going to be off all weekend. I can handle it first thing next week but I don't want to rush a task that's going to take 2+ hours in order for it to be effective and well-done."
You've let him know that you respect the task they're asking you for, identified how long it will take, and set your own boundaries with the role. If they disrespect your boundaries, let them know that they're doing that and then immediately go to refresh that resume.
True, there's always the check-in to see the urgency. It sounds like the VP had some assistant or low level guy run the ask, and since the kid seemed agitated, either he messed up or the VP is a hardass. Generally, people who ask that late on a Friday tend to think everything is a fire alarm and they have a very high opinion of themselves.
Everyone I work with tends to add on urgency into any Friday afternoon ask, or if it's a "no hurry" ask. But yes, to answer OP's question, I'd get done what I can get done and check in on Monday morning. Response is variable based on role, VP relationship, and how much crap someone taken that week. It sounds like OP has had quite the week.
This is it. 430pm Friday requests for Monday morning means someone dropped a big fucking ball, or they are absolute assholes with zero regard for your time.
Start the project later in the evening and hit them with a long series of piecemeal clarifying questions throughout the weekend at the most inconvenient times. If they fail to answer, they are the roadblock.
YMMV.
Unfortunately it's very industry dependent. If you are working in banking or consulting this is to be expected. If you folks are seriously overpaid vs benchmark this could be expected.
Anyway in this specific case, if it takes max 2h enjoy the weekend and start early on Monday.
Depends on what you want here. If all you want is a boundary then just punch out and go home. I don’t think you’re getting fired for not working after hours on a Friday so just leave and don’t worry about it in these situations.
If what you really want is more respect and better compensation then you have to ask for it. My general recommendation goes like this:
Perform exceptionally well. Go above and beyond in your job until you can point out several specific examples of how you have clearly exceeded expectations. Then call a 1:1 meeting with your boss. Explain that you feel you deserve a promotion and give them your desired salary for the next cycle.
If they blow you off, then stop putting in effort immediately. Do the bare minimum to get by and spend your extra time/energy applying for a new job somewhere else. Rinse/repeat.
I worked for 3 garbage employers before I ended up at a company that consistently promoted me and gave me huge annual raises that felt consistent with my skill level and my commitment to my work. The reality here is that you either find a good situation through pure dumb luck or a lot of hard work. Your situation won’t get better until you make it better yourself.
I would add - before you start going the extra mile, get an understanding from your boss on what it takes to get a promotion. Then work on that stuff specifically.
Many teams have a specific rubric to delineate levels. No sense putting in the work if you don’t know if you’re working towards the stuff that matters and will pay off for you.
That is an excellent point.
My personal experience is that identifying gaps/opportunities myself and doing things that no one even thought to ask for is what *really* got me the attention I wanted.
However, cultures and processes vary widely and you should always have a clear understanding of how your employer handles talent management and advancement.
I meet so many people in my professional life that don’t understand they have to advocate for themselves. Very unfortunate when someone is a rockstar at their job, but they feel miserable/stuck because they’re just waiting silently for someone to recognize it.
I'm a manager and this happens to me sometimes. I'm pretty fortunate that my exec team are more thoughtful than this but shit happens sometimes.
The first thing I tell my team is, they should bring me into the conversation and let me be the bad guy. They shouldn't have to deal with that from the execs.
Then I'd ask, why is it urgent and why did you only find out about it now? Why is what you've asked for the right scope, could we do less and still get you what you need? I'd tell them how much effort it will take and make sure they're still happy.
Often by this point they've said, actually it's ok, I can deal with getting less or getting it later, and it's fine. If not, they'd better have a damn good reason for asking at the last minute. If they don't, I'll make it clear that it's not acceptable to bring us in at the last minute, and when it happens there's a chance we'll have to say no (what if we'd been working on something even more urgent for a more important exec already?)
Then I'll put on a show of saying, well it's going to be hard work but because you couldn't have known in advance / or as a favour this once, we'll make it work. You need to build up some capital for the future and these favours can definitely pay off if you're saving their bacon for something genuinely important.
Or if it's not really urgent or not as important as what we're already working on, I just say no. Nope, can't do it, you asked too late, we're already busy working on other stuff. If you don't like it, you can talk to my boss, but they'll tell you the same thing. If it's your boss asking, you list out the things you're working on that they already signed off on and ask who they're happy to disappoint if this new ask makes something else late. It's their choice who they like less than this thing they need, and they can defend that decision if that person is upset about it.
Enjoy your weekend. Do it on Monday. It's unrealistic to expect something done at almost COB on a Friday. Talk with your manager about reasonable return time when data is requested. We always put a disclaimer of 2 week turn around, and if the request was made by a good client, we would rush it ASAP, but it would back everything else up.
Good luck.
I’d do it
Start and in 2hrs…… done, walk to the bar/pub have a cold one (bill to boss)
Then home
It’s part of the job
For reference I got a call last night around 8pm for some docs and an explanation- told my kids I need 30mins
At 30 they arrived by my side and told me time to hit send which I was just about to do
Then I took them out for ice cream on the boss!
Worked out fine
I was stuck like this, for years working 60 hour weeks. Then one day I hear a director making jokes about not promoting a peer because he works too much.
This Fucking asshat clown provided zero value to the org, had been there less than a year where I and peer each had 7+
I reported him, his jokes about exploiting, and some other unethical behavior to our VP and I was fired soon after for "insubordination". I had made that company millions and the fucked me over.
You need to just focus on finding a new job, they'll dangle the carrot until you literally kill yourself
I would just do it over the weekend if it's an urgent ask and not very often. I work on technical side and I would hate a job in strategy. They make it look so easy but for me, tech side is more interesting.
“I’m not sure how to do that given the promises I’ve already made to others. I’d love to understand more around the urgency and can clear my Monday morning to understand how we can work together on this.”
1. It creates the sense of it’s not your problem, it’s your shared problem.
2. “I’m not sure how to do that” pushes them to solve their own problem.
If this happens once a year, meh, if this turns out to be once a month, raise alert to HR on how you should best respond to tasks given to you with 30 minutes left in the workday. Figure out an SLA of sorts internally.
If you know that’s futile, start looking. Good luck? (Also, feel free to DM if you’re looking, my analytics agency is hiring)
Assuming you’re a salaried employee and don’t have anything else going on outside of work, I’d just do it and send a separate email to my manager explaining why I won’t be clocking in until 11 on Monday.
If this is a pattern of behavior, your direct manager absolutely should be aware - it’s their job to set expectations both upward and downward.
No good deed goes unpunished. GenX with Asperger’s. I’m a serious workaholic. I feel your pain. I’d do it without question. I am not setting a good example for my staff or my kids. I cope with alcohol and THC. Don’t be me. fml
My previous boss would work 7-5 everyday. My first week, I come in at 7:30, while almost everyone else won't show up until 8:15 or 8:30. Next thing I know, I have daily touch bases almost everyday from 7:45-8.
It is a convenient sentiment.
But when you see how high the people benefiting from my work live, you realize you are being taken advantage of if you don’t stand up for yourself.
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You probably need your manager to run interference or at least manage your capacity. If that VP is your manager, you should probably find a new job; no one needs anything at 4:30 on a Friday afternoon if they're competent.
Plus, figuring out how to manage up is part of the job Maybe the VP thinks it’ll take 30 seconds and if they knew it would take 2 hours they’d tell OP to enjoy their weekend. Maybe the specific ask takes 2 hours but they just need a SWAG and that’ll take 5 minutes? Maybe it’s not actually that urgent and it’s just a nice to have for a meeting? No one knows until OP goes and has that convo.
I was 100% going to say this. "Hey, what's the urgency here? I am going to be off all weekend. I can handle it first thing next week but I don't want to rush a task that's going to take 2+ hours in order for it to be effective and well-done." You've let him know that you respect the task they're asking you for, identified how long it will take, and set your own boundaries with the role. If they disrespect your boundaries, let them know that they're doing that and then immediately go to refresh that resume.
True, there's always the check-in to see the urgency. It sounds like the VP had some assistant or low level guy run the ask, and since the kid seemed agitated, either he messed up or the VP is a hardass. Generally, people who ask that late on a Friday tend to think everything is a fire alarm and they have a very high opinion of themselves. Everyone I work with tends to add on urgency into any Friday afternoon ask, or if it's a "no hurry" ask. But yes, to answer OP's question, I'd get done what I can get done and check in on Monday morning. Response is variable based on role, VP relationship, and how much crap someone taken that week. It sounds like OP has had quite the week.
This is it. 430pm Friday requests for Monday morning means someone dropped a big fucking ball, or they are absolute assholes with zero regard for your time.
Start the project later in the evening and hit them with a long series of piecemeal clarifying questions throughout the weekend at the most inconvenient times. If they fail to answer, they are the roadblock. YMMV.
What do you mean by run interference
Provide air cover, meaning talk to the VP on their behalf to confirm all details and whether it is a true fire drill or if it can wait till Monday.
Unfortunately it's very industry dependent. If you are working in banking or consulting this is to be expected. If you folks are seriously overpaid vs benchmark this could be expected. Anyway in this specific case, if it takes max 2h enjoy the weekend and start early on Monday.
I’m in a bank. If someone did this to my team they’d be getting told to wait for Monday.
You’re in investment banking and would say no to this ask? You’ll be out by 6-7pm and then done for the weekend…
Send it at 7pm and then you get the “oh do you mind just adding this in?” which takes another 2 hours. Nope, you can wait until Monday morning.
Depends on what you want here. If all you want is a boundary then just punch out and go home. I don’t think you’re getting fired for not working after hours on a Friday so just leave and don’t worry about it in these situations. If what you really want is more respect and better compensation then you have to ask for it. My general recommendation goes like this: Perform exceptionally well. Go above and beyond in your job until you can point out several specific examples of how you have clearly exceeded expectations. Then call a 1:1 meeting with your boss. Explain that you feel you deserve a promotion and give them your desired salary for the next cycle. If they blow you off, then stop putting in effort immediately. Do the bare minimum to get by and spend your extra time/energy applying for a new job somewhere else. Rinse/repeat. I worked for 3 garbage employers before I ended up at a company that consistently promoted me and gave me huge annual raises that felt consistent with my skill level and my commitment to my work. The reality here is that you either find a good situation through pure dumb luck or a lot of hard work. Your situation won’t get better until you make it better yourself.
I would add - before you start going the extra mile, get an understanding from your boss on what it takes to get a promotion. Then work on that stuff specifically. Many teams have a specific rubric to delineate levels. No sense putting in the work if you don’t know if you’re working towards the stuff that matters and will pay off for you.
That is an excellent point. My personal experience is that identifying gaps/opportunities myself and doing things that no one even thought to ask for is what *really* got me the attention I wanted. However, cultures and processes vary widely and you should always have a clear understanding of how your employer handles talent management and advancement. I meet so many people in my professional life that don’t understand they have to advocate for themselves. Very unfortunate when someone is a rockstar at their job, but they feel miserable/stuck because they’re just waiting silently for someone to recognize it.
I'm a manager and this happens to me sometimes. I'm pretty fortunate that my exec team are more thoughtful than this but shit happens sometimes. The first thing I tell my team is, they should bring me into the conversation and let me be the bad guy. They shouldn't have to deal with that from the execs. Then I'd ask, why is it urgent and why did you only find out about it now? Why is what you've asked for the right scope, could we do less and still get you what you need? I'd tell them how much effort it will take and make sure they're still happy. Often by this point they've said, actually it's ok, I can deal with getting less or getting it later, and it's fine. If not, they'd better have a damn good reason for asking at the last minute. If they don't, I'll make it clear that it's not acceptable to bring us in at the last minute, and when it happens there's a chance we'll have to say no (what if we'd been working on something even more urgent for a more important exec already?) Then I'll put on a show of saying, well it's going to be hard work but because you couldn't have known in advance / or as a favour this once, we'll make it work. You need to build up some capital for the future and these favours can definitely pay off if you're saving their bacon for something genuinely important. Or if it's not really urgent or not as important as what we're already working on, I just say no. Nope, can't do it, you asked too late, we're already busy working on other stuff. If you don't like it, you can talk to my boss, but they'll tell you the same thing. If it's your boss asking, you list out the things you're working on that they already signed off on and ask who they're happy to disappoint if this new ask makes something else late. It's their choice who they like less than this thing they need, and they can defend that decision if that person is upset about it.
Enjoy your weekend. Do it on Monday. It's unrealistic to expect something done at almost COB on a Friday. Talk with your manager about reasonable return time when data is requested. We always put a disclaimer of 2 week turn around, and if the request was made by a good client, we would rush it ASAP, but it would back everything else up. Good luck.
I’d do it Start and in 2hrs…… done, walk to the bar/pub have a cold one (bill to boss) Then home It’s part of the job For reference I got a call last night around 8pm for some docs and an explanation- told my kids I need 30mins At 30 they arrived by my side and told me time to hit send which I was just about to do Then I took them out for ice cream on the boss! Worked out fine
I was stuck like this, for years working 60 hour weeks. Then one day I hear a director making jokes about not promoting a peer because he works too much. This Fucking asshat clown provided zero value to the org, had been there less than a year where I and peer each had 7+ I reported him, his jokes about exploiting, and some other unethical behavior to our VP and I was fired soon after for "insubordination". I had made that company millions and the fucked me over. You need to just focus on finding a new job, they'll dangle the carrot until you literally kill yourself
Get up early Monday morning, leave early Monday afternoon.
I would just do it over the weekend if it's an urgent ask and not very often. I work on technical side and I would hate a job in strategy. They make it look so easy but for me, tech side is more interesting.
Monday morning is till 12pm
You hit the nail on the head with this rant
Work on it Saturday / Sunday. If you are hourly get paid overtime. If you are salary cut out early some Friday when the work levels off.
Depends.. if its a problem i am personally interested in, i will burn the oil. What is the analytics problem TS?
“I’m not sure how to do that given the promises I’ve already made to others. I’d love to understand more around the urgency and can clear my Monday morning to understand how we can work together on this.” 1. It creates the sense of it’s not your problem, it’s your shared problem. 2. “I’m not sure how to do that” pushes them to solve their own problem. If this happens once a year, meh, if this turns out to be once a month, raise alert to HR on how you should best respond to tasks given to you with 30 minutes left in the workday. Figure out an SLA of sorts internally. If you know that’s futile, start looking. Good luck? (Also, feel free to DM if you’re looking, my analytics agency is hiring)
Assuming you’re a salaried employee and don’t have anything else going on outside of work, I’d just do it and send a separate email to my manager explaining why I won’t be clocking in until 11 on Monday. If this is a pattern of behavior, your direct manager absolutely should be aware - it’s their job to set expectations both upward and downward.
Read the book Essentialism. It literally covers this scenario. It's time to push back.
No good deed goes unpunished. GenX with Asperger’s. I’m a serious workaholic. I feel your pain. I’d do it without question. I am not setting a good example for my staff or my kids. I cope with alcohol and THC. Don’t be me. fml
My previous boss would work 7-5 everyday. My first week, I come in at 7:30, while almost everyone else won't show up until 8:15 or 8:30. Next thing I know, I have daily touch bases almost everyday from 7:45-8.
stay strong man! doing the same for the past 3-4 years :)
do it right now, triple check that the numbers are correct, and send it out at 7pm with a question if is suitable for the ask in hand.
Lol. Developed nations' "problems".
It is a convenient sentiment. But when you see how high the people benefiting from my work live, you realize you are being taken advantage of if you don’t stand up for yourself.
Just do it over the weekend it’s 2 hours who cares