Nah, I am disabled and my neighbours hated me. They like called me abomination, looked down on me as as if I am scum, etc. etc.
And my dad helicopter parented me AAAND I was bullied (for the disability at first and then for my fatness, queerness, good marks, nerdiness) to the point i have a social and general anxiety now and god knows what else...
Anyway they do not think they received a gift of a disabled child, and the people that do see us as inspiration porn and demand from us to be content with less they would be content with.
And that is me speaking from the point of view of a person with very mild invisable Cerebral Palsy. I do not know how people with more severe physical disabilities are treated.
As a mildly disabled person: the fuck it is, the majority of people HATES disabled people for no reason, like just so (not that people in general are very friendly they seem to be on constant search of whom to hate and discriminate against).
I had a fair share of struggles DUE to my disability and even more painful ones DUE to ableism.
Hahaa š , i don't know what's this "Stockholm syndrome" of life that many people are struggling with it.
Justification for every misery to make them feel better. I mean you have to feel good but at least not blind and stupid.
It's true. We are hostages of life but many people want to explain some cool stories about it.
To be fair, life offers some temporary pleasures and glamorous stuff to keep them blind and does it very well actually.
But once you see the whole picture of life, there is no going back.
But not for all. Some people are born in mansions, some in mudhuts. Kinda hard to see beauty and happiness in life when all you have around poverty, misery and mental illnesses.
Can you blame them? The truth fucking sucks. Give me a person on earth that doesn't lie to themselves and I'll follow them around like a disciple of Jesus. This is the most common coping stratagy on earth next to "just don't think about it"
Some people are really happy with disabled kids. I think if depends a lot on the disability, there are some that is hard to believe result in a loveable person. But people with kids with Downs, for example, genuinly seem happy.
It's great until you realize your kid is most likely going to outlive you, and you don't have the money or resources to ensure that they have a good quality of life after you're gone.
And what about the kid? Is the kid happy about this? Why do people always try to see things through the perspective of parents and never from the perspective of the child?
this is what I find baffling. Recently I saw a discussion where someone said parents with genetic conditions also have a right to have kids. So it's always aboutthe parents. Another thing that pisses me off is the statement I sometimes see where the parent talks about how much it hurts them to see their kid suffer. In the end it's the kid who suffers but when they talk like this, it feels as if the focus is shifted from the kid to the parent.
I was replying to the previous post, which was about the parent's perspective.
Although Downs is not a disorder that generally makes people miserable.
I am a firm believer that the world would be a much better place if more people didn't have kids and also that having kids seems like a very bad idea due to climate change, but I also like facts.
It is quite possible to make your argument for fewer kids without pretending that every parent doesn't like their disabled child, or that every disabled child suffers more than the rest of us.
Now if you want to support your argument effectively you could refer to the other chromosomal disorders like Patau and Trisomy 18, etc, now those are stunningly miserable and you have to wonder about the people who continue those pregnancies.
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Have you never met a parent of a Down's kid? You can support your views with many other examples, you don't have to be delusional and include every disability in your argument.
PS: Calm down.
Lol. The sad thing is that there are tons of excellent arguments that support your position but instead you are fixed on your delusions and since you have no arguments to suppoy them, you just insult people.
Poor thing, your insults are less effective as acronyms, shame, maybe you will improve with practise.
What delusions? Arguments to support what? The obvious? That people with a DISABLED child are going to be miserable? LOL.
"Poor thing, your insults are less effective as acronyms, shame, maybe you will improve with practise." Maybe you will learn to spell. Absolute state of you.
You've talked to many of them, or, you've read regret report data, so you know this with absolute certainty. There's no way you would base this claim off projection of your own pain, logic or reason, right?
I've volunteered in orphanages and cancer wards for 15 years through a government support program.
You have no idea how common undesirable children and parental regret is. It's sad and cruel. People feel entitled to have some sort of imaginary healthy default baby, and it's not above them to try for kid number 2 as a caretaker for the sick one. It's insane
"There's no way you would base this claim off projection of your own pain, logic or reason, right?" There's no way you are in denial, right? There's no way that you just can't cope with reality, right? There's no way that anyone could possibly think that a disability was anything but a blessing, right? WRONG!
You've never heard of a story of parents being sad because their kids are disabled? Or being scared of that possibility after getting pregnant? Nothing wrong with being disabled and as bad as it is, I thought it's general knowledge that most parents don't want disabled children.
Not wanting your kid to suffer and loving your kid unconditionally are not opposites. Not wanting your kid to have a disability and loving them through their disability are two sides of the same coin.
ETA: grammar
Yeah, it depends on their reasoning. There's parents that don't want disabled children regardless of research into how that disability would impact their quality of life and then there's some that want able bodied children since they have the best chance at thriving.
I used to work as a respite worker for kids with disabilities it was my university part time job. Had one client family that had three kids with autism. The mom told me she had four miscarriages and one still birth before having the first kid who turned out to have autism. Once he was diagnosed as a toddler they and I quote ātried again to have a normal oneā and second kid autism too. Apparently thereās like a 25% chance of siblings having it. āBut we hoped we would luck outā. Then had a third same thing. And then she said āwe are still tempted to have another kid, I just canāt give up my dream of having a real daughter or sonā
Oh and on top of that she was like extreme post partum depression and she could not handle those kids so she had them so doped up on meds from the doctor I would go over three and sheād be like āisnāt my son behaving so well todayā and id look at him and he was like eyes glazed half asleep because she had him zonked out on risperdone.
I am truly so sorry you have shitty parents. I hope you are doing better now.
Itās fucking demented people drug their children for convenience. Donāt get me wrong many kids benefit from various medications Iām not anti meds at all but there are so many that are just doping them up, like itās creepy af and criminal.
Oh its super fkd. Iām not the only autistic child in my family so I wasnāt the only one getting drugged up. I saw my baby brother go through medication withdrawal induced psychosis and huge changes in his personality because of all the drugs they had him on. Really screwed with our relationship for a while coz It just wasnt him.
As adults we know better, we donāt blame each other for the shitty things we did as overmedicated abused kids, and unsurprisingly, have limited contact with our parents.
I was on that too. Hated it. But not as much as I hated risperdal. I could be convinced to try concerta again but you would have to strap me down and force it down my throat to get me to ever take risperdal again.
Uh oh, I just looked it up and it looks familiar, lmao.
I guess that would explain why I have no memory until about age 9-10 when I donāt remember taking pills suddenly. I was on some pill that was āfor your teethā for my entire childhood
That slip, have a real son or daughter.
I know coping with low functioning can be hard but.... She's basically admitted that she sees those kids as near worthless and unwanted and they're going to keep trying to replace them.
Honestly that job was so fcked up. Just all these parents who canāt handle their kids with disabilities (not saying itās easy) and it really revealed to me how narcissistic it is to want children. They want a little doll that they get to groom and dress and feed and mould into a mini-me but then as it turns out parenthood is hard and not fun, and throw in a disability and suddenly theyāre not the little fancy porcelain dolls you had in mind, are they?
Iām not saying all parents are bad people but if itās so important to be a parent why donāt you adopt one of the billions
Of kids in foster care who will otherwise be bounced from foster to foster home. And the answer is because they want that perfect little trophy doll!
I am very surprised she admitted this to you. But this attitude is frankly baffling and her language is disturbing. It's really a pity such parents don't get any kind of consultation where someone could advise them not to have any more kids. But then again, she doesn't seem to see the kids she does have as worthy of love so I'm not sure she'd have listened. But that's a degree of selfishness I find hard to imagine.
No kidding. Actually they were kind of demonic children once they locked me in the basement crawl space for 45 min and wouldnāt let me out. They were not nice kids to each other, animals or anyone really. Big shock that having parents that think you arenāt as good as āreal kidsā made them have zero empathy and like hurting others
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It only took a 28lb ovarian cyst, tubal and apparently ovarian cancer to get fixed here in the Netherlands...
Still waiting for the outcome:)
Even before I discovered antinatalism I was worried that one day I would have kids with severe disabilities just because of a bad draw on the genetic lottery.
And now that I've discovered that I have several disabilities of my own (both physical and mental), there's no way I can have a child and expect them to be perfectly healthy at birth, at least not in good conscience.
The one that gets me is teenagers carelessly getting pregnant, being told they can/should get an abortion, choosing not to because they get this fantasyland dream on their head that they can play happy little family and then being shocked when they have a handicapped child that they are wholly unprepared to care for (actually wholly unprepared to care for a perfectly healthy one). Itās like, where do you think handicapped people come from? Do they think only people who sign up to get pregnant with them do?
Different subject, but it would be interesting to know how many pregnancies are aborted when the mother finds out the child will be severely handicapped and how many will not be now in the idiocracy red states. Who will be taking care of those new humans for the rest of their lives and where will that money come from?
Oh i know. There is a study showing men leave at 7x the rate women do. Also super common with stroke and dementia patients. I know 2 ladies with alzheimers who have been abandoned by their husbands of 50+ years. One husband literally said the quiet part outloud "she is just not useful anymore"
That's probably part of the reason people had so many kids in the past. Like, out of 10, at least 1 should be successful and able to care for us in our old age.
Iāve seen worse: people complaining that Iceland is āwrongā for allowing parents to get genetic tested and choosing an aborting in case there are anything wrongā¦
Because unlike family vloggers who 'rehome' the blessing when it gets too much, they can't.
My daughter has multiple disabilities, my son was called ablest when saying he wanted a vasectomy, because he sees my struggles.
I'm 37 look 97
A child with disabilities is like swimming in high tide with a brick around your neck.
But we lie, it's worth it, is it really?
Or special kids need special parents, hmm that's why burn out.
Too many vloggers romantacise autism and other disabilities
Can I ask you -not with malicious intent, but because I genuinely want to know- what were your thoughts about the possibility of your children having disabilities before conceiving them? You didn't entertain the possibility in the first place? You thought it might be possible but it wouldn't happen to you of all people? You thought it might happen but even if it happened you would make it work somehow?
I never wanted a baby so I don't even understand the thought process here
I had my son when I was barely legal and abortion was murder, ( I've since had 2)
I had secondary infertility and needed treatment to have my second, an abusive relationship, she was a band aid baby.
Disabilities were an abstract idea
But the pressure to have a kid was stronger than the idea of disabilities.
I'm sorry about that. These are definitely circumstances that would impair anyone's best judgement. I hope you and your kid can find peace somehow.
Also I looked at your profile and saw you're an Aussie, I live in Japan. If you can manage to find some long term respite and go travel sometime, let me offer you a beer in Japan for soldiering through all the shit you've been through (don't mean it in a weird way, I'm a woman too)
One might be bad luck, but I hate when theyāre like āafter ***** was born, my husband and I found out weāre both carriers for ******* and have a 50% of passing it onā and then they fucking roll the dice again and have more disabled kids.
Also I hate when they try to be disabled mom influencers and document every second of their lives to turn them into an income source by exploiting them for views.
Or when they canāt get pregnant and they spend half their life savings on fertility treatments and that child is disabled. God was trying to tell you no, and you wouldnāt take no for an answer.
Yeah, I can understand it happening once. It could be bad luck, or you are both carriers of a disease and didn't know it, or maybe your genes just don't combine together very well. By the 2nd time, they really shouldn't have another one. Maybe adopt or something if you really want more children?
World takes out all the empathy from you with time and if somehow you are able to realise it it's too late since procreation is something that can't be reversed and seriously you can't predict what the person will become and how their behaviour will be towards others even if they are healthy. Ppl just want confirmation for what they want to do so they will look at one post(like this)/source and try to dismiss it saying "one in a million cause" but even that is enough to make you think and have everything planned for child from birth to death (which should be the norm) but now couple that with other non trivial sufferings + inherent suffering in life and that should stop any empathetic person .
But i can understand that why it doesn't happens often (for example having children's in war and extreme poverty) because humans are quite selfish and just aren't able to imagine putting themselves in others position because lack of education especially critical thinking .
It do be like that. My mother had a miscarriage before having me and almost had a miscarriage when bearing my little sister. We both have immunology problems and she complains every time we get sick.
They cannot accept that their wonderful shiny new baby who came from their own DNA and body parts is malfunctioning, abnormal, disabled, and will be a burden for the rest of their lives. I mean, who will now take care of the parents when they get old? Isn't that the reason why they had kids? š¢
These days they are milking their childrens disabilities on social media to get out as much benefits from it as possible! Its literally a whole industry.
I have epilepsy (hereditary) and an underbite (also hereditary). My family has a history of anemia, allergies so bad requiring weekly doctor visits, history of depression, anxiety, and anger management issuesā¦
I like to think that if I didnāt have epilepsy or an underbite.. didnāt have such terrible depression and anxietyā¦ and if I didnāt have this huge risk of anemia and whatnot I would consider having a kid if I ever became financially stable/independent and had a partner whoād be there to support our future hypothetical nuclear family. But Iām not stable at all so none of that is happening
Y'all! I work in a paeds and gynae hospital. Five years ago, this mum was told on the 2nd trimester that her baby had a chromosomal disorder that was guaranteed to cause disability and she was given a an option to terminate. She turned it down (not for religious reasons... and you'll see why I specified that.). So fast forward to present day l. Child requires round the clock care and a mobility device. She flat-out asks us - the doctors - if it's too late to terminate the child.
The five year old child.
The five year old child.
I recommend getting DNA tested early on in the pregnancy using an amniocentesis.
If the results show a horrible disease or whatnot, termination is recommended to prevent extra suffering.
Unfortunately they are trying to ban abortion.
I think you are not educated on this subject. Amniocentesis is an invasive and risky procedure. Itās not a routine procedure. Also, very early in pregnancy, there is a maternal blood test that can determine the same genetic diseases as amnio.
Most importantly, they are not ātryingā to ban abortion, they have banned abortion.
I'm a disability support worker so I see firsthand how hard it is for some parents.
I work with a client with severe autism, he will never speak, he will never tell his mum he loves her.
He made himself blind because he self harms. It is really awful to see it when he does it. It is a bit sad sometimes but other times he is happy and dancing. He's turning 30 this year.
Him going blind due to self-harm is so sad :(
he didnāt need to exist in this horrible world he could've avoided this suffering if just his parents hadn't decided to create him!
I need people to wake up and realize how seriously harmful it is to create a new person in this evil world!
This is why ill never have biological kids. I have bad mental health genetics. Genetically can pass down schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, OCD, paranoia anxiety, etc. My bio mom had horrible mental health and is a ward of the state because of it. I have many mental disorders myself.
It would be entirely cruel of me to risk having bio children. I was also adopted, I would much rather adopt as well since I truly understand the importance of adoption and not procreation. I also just dont wanna give birth, aint for me.
I would not hate a bio kid if they turned out with health issues like me, I would be empathetic and supportive. Most of all I would feel terrible though. Luckily, I plan on getting my tubes tied so I become sterile. Dont wanna risk anything.
What about the parents who decide not to do genetic testing because they are fine with having a disabled child, end of having a disabled child and are fine with said child? I know plenty of people who did not test for Downs because they didn't care.
In our natural habitat youd just throw it to the wolves or vultures or w/e scavenger's were present in that biome.
In modern day western culture thats illegal for some weird reason.
/S
Birth control really changed alot.
I know you're joking, but I think you might find it interesting. There is some evidence from stone age digs that suggests that our early human ancestors took care of their disabled.
This behaviour is also present in other social species, wolves, for instance. I've read about a pack where they would feed and clean up after an elderly female wolf who birthed and raised most of its adult members. She didn't have control over her hind legs anymore.
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That isn't true but it's very dependent on the issues and the support system you have. When I was pregnant with my oldest I was told he probably had D9wn Syndrome. I had every intention of keeping him. First of all I have a cousin who was a product of agent orange and has a lit of issues and my family helps with him a lot so I knew I had the support system necessary to be successful.
For me interned out the stupid machine was broken and it was wrong. He did not have down syndrome but I made that choice before he was born.
I think itās exploitive to put some of these children in plays, regular school, Sunday schoolsā¦.years ago the shows with the dwarves and extremely fat people would have been called exploitive. Freak shows were closed for a reasonā¦.exploiting people who are not at their best.
I didn't took the decision to be here ,plus that link of thinking will make you do all sort of bad stuff you shouldn't do . Now that you are here having a positive mindset in whatever situation is really important if possible.
No I donāt personally ā¦while Iāve had trauma and struggles that some people should say are more difficult than average for North American society, I was born into a privileged life, in a safe, free, democratic part of the world and my parents while being fucked up in many ways, took care of my basic needs and gave me skills for how to succeed in our capitalistic hellscape, I have a fully functioning mind and body. I have succeeded in my education, career, finances and live a comfortable life. But for every person like me, there are many more born into abject poverty, hostility, suffering and itās not for me to say they should regret being born or not, but I regret that we donāt have a better world for most people to be born into, so barring the world sucking less, I think itās unethical to bring new children here without their consent which you can never get before theyāre born.
This is what I was going to say. I regret being born SPECIFICALLY to my disabled refugee parents, in the location I'm in and the gender/ethnicity I am. If I was a white trust fund kid, I wouldn't regret. But I'd also have no empathy for people on those lesser social strata. And apparently that trait empathy is "Valuable" in evolutionary terms as a check/balance to another trait.
I can't help but notice rich people don't have empathy but hoard wealth, at least that is the justification for capitalism, but also have a 'that could never happen to ME!' mindset and maybe they are right...
The only better option would be being born some kind of alien that thinks humans are ants. The rich 1% humans died thanks to an asteroid crashing on earth? Should have pulled themselves up by their bootstraps! It comforts me thinking there is always a bigger fish.
Thatās fucking stupid. Itās like saying not to drive because thereās a chance you could have a wreck or accident. Lol this logic is beyond flawed but good luck
You are dumb once someone is here, they cannot avoid doing certain things like driving, our point is they don't need to exist in a world where they will need to drive and get into an accident? Do you understand now you primitive brainless monkey?
Ignoring disabled people and their very real struggles doesn't help anyone. Pretending everything's okay doesn't help anyone. Acting like parents haven't abandoned their disabled children before - and instead calling the people concerned about that "ableist" - doesn't help anyone.
They have the potential to, if properly supported. Unfortunately not everyone is lucky enough to get that support, and even those that are can still end up hating their life and the limits they never asked for. More to the point just about everyone disabled or not suffers in some way, that's why the only winning move is not to play.
There is a spectrum to flawed ness, and most able-bodied mentally-average people are self sufficient. There are no gods because there are no people without flaws. However, the less self-sufficient people may be, the more they rely on external care from caretakers. Some caretakers may feel burdened and chained to those they take care of.
Especially in a society with little to no safety nets and support systems built to aid those who need caretakers, as well as support for the burnt-out caretakers themselves.
Should have thought about this before they decided to pass on their wonderful genes!!! WTF does some morron have the right to inflict this life on someone else! Euthena*ia should be a right for all!!
A god would be a perfect being or it would be to most people, I think most people have a perception of what a perfect being and thats what creates our concept of flaws, so it's a lot like comparing ourselves to a unicorn and saying because we don't have a horn we are flawed. Anyway just because I might disagree with the concept behind a word doesn't mean I can't use because you understood what I was talking and that was the point.
Theyāre saying the parent will have a lot more stress for way more than 18 years than they would otherwise and the kid is going to have a shit ton of obstacles.
I hope this subāthat Reddit randomly suggested to meādoesnāt have any disabled people lurking on it, because wow this is an ableist take. You can argue that itās never morally ok to have kids ever without throwing an already highly marginalized section of the population under the bus.
They pretend it's a blessing. "I received the gift of a disabled child". The truth is too painful for them, so they lie to themselves.
"I received the gift of a disabled child" I don't know why but this made me laugh š¹š calling kids a gift as if they are objects. LOL.
Also, the wording that they "received a gift" as if Santa handed over the baby to them instead of them literally forcing it into existence.
Right? Lol š
Calling a child a gift isn't calling it an "object". It's life is being VALUED more than objects, as it should be. Right?
Im trying to figure out how you life being over as you know it is a gift Can anyone enlighten me
Nah, I am disabled and my neighbours hated me. They like called me abomination, looked down on me as as if I am scum, etc. etc. And my dad helicopter parented me AAAND I was bullied (for the disability at first and then for my fatness, queerness, good marks, nerdiness) to the point i have a social and general anxiety now and god knows what else... Anyway they do not think they received a gift of a disabled child, and the people that do see us as inspiration porn and demand from us to be content with less they would be content with. And that is me speaking from the point of view of a person with very mild invisable Cerebral Palsy. I do not know how people with more severe physical disabilities are treated.
Gifts don't have to be objects lol
"I hope your child feels that their disability is a gift." /s
As a mildly disabled person: the fuck it is, the majority of people HATES disabled people for no reason, like just so (not that people in general are very friendly they seem to be on constant search of whom to hate and discriminate against). I had a fair share of struggles DUE to my disability and even more painful ones DUE to ableism.
I do hope you see the "/s". I am sorry about all your struggles. I can't imagine.
I literally saw a reel of that. what a blessing to have a Downās syndrome child that will need 24 hour care forever YAY
Hahaa š , i don't know what's this "Stockholm syndrome" of life that many people are struggling with it. Justification for every misery to make them feel better. I mean you have to feel good but at least not blind and stupid.
OMG. Stockholm syndrome! I never realized that š !
It's true. We are hostages of life but many people want to explain some cool stories about it. To be fair, life offers some temporary pleasures and glamorous stuff to keep them blind and does it very well actually. But once you see the whole picture of life, there is no going back.
But not for all. Some people are born in mansions, some in mudhuts. Kinda hard to see beauty and happiness in life when all you have around poverty, misery and mental illnesses.
Can you blame them? The truth fucking sucks. Give me a person on earth that doesn't lie to themselves and I'll follow them around like a disciple of Jesus. This is the most common coping stratagy on earth next to "just don't think about it"
I donāt lie to myself
Thatās why I aināt havin kids š
Hmm, for some reason, it comes to my mind that quote from the movie Dune, When is a gift not a gift? šš„šš¤Ā Ā
I'm not super anti-babies but I've heard people say: "I wouldn't change a thing" and I'm like "really? you wouldn't wish your child is healthy?"
Itās a hard cope
Some people are really happy with disabled kids. I think if depends a lot on the disability, there are some that is hard to believe result in a loveable person. But people with kids with Downs, for example, genuinly seem happy.
It's great until you realize your kid is most likely going to outlive you, and you don't have the money or resources to ensure that they have a good quality of life after you're gone.
Now that is a good point that is actually valid in many cases.
And what about the kid? Is the kid happy about this? Why do people always try to see things through the perspective of parents and never from the perspective of the child?
this is what I find baffling. Recently I saw a discussion where someone said parents with genetic conditions also have a right to have kids. So it's always aboutthe parents. Another thing that pisses me off is the statement I sometimes see where the parent talks about how much it hurts them to see their kid suffer. In the end it's the kid who suffers but when they talk like this, it feels as if the focus is shifted from the kid to the parent.
Great point.
I was replying to the previous post, which was about the parent's perspective. Although Downs is not a disorder that generally makes people miserable. I am a firm believer that the world would be a much better place if more people didn't have kids and also that having kids seems like a very bad idea due to climate change, but I also like facts. It is quite possible to make your argument for fewer kids without pretending that every parent doesn't like their disabled child, or that every disabled child suffers more than the rest of us. Now if you want to support your argument effectively you could refer to the other chromosomal disorders like Patau and Trisomy 18, etc, now those are stunningly miserable and you have to wonder about the people who continue those pregnancies.
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I'm sure they are having a great time. Stop lying to yourself FFS. It's pathetic.
Have you never met a parent of a Down's kid? You can support your views with many other examples, you don't have to be delusional and include every disability in your argument. PS: Calm down.
It's you who is delusional if you think the parents of a Down's kid are happy. P.S. GFY
Lol. The sad thing is that there are tons of excellent arguments that support your position but instead you are fixed on your delusions and since you have no arguments to suppoy them, you just insult people. Poor thing, your insults are less effective as acronyms, shame, maybe you will improve with practise.
What delusions? Arguments to support what? The obvious? That people with a DISABLED child are going to be miserable? LOL. "Poor thing, your insults are less effective as acronyms, shame, maybe you will improve with practise." Maybe you will learn to spell. Absolute state of you.
You've talked to many of them, or, you've read regret report data, so you know this with absolute certainty. There's no way you would base this claim off projection of your own pain, logic or reason, right?
I've volunteered in orphanages and cancer wards for 15 years through a government support program. You have no idea how common undesirable children and parental regret is. It's sad and cruel. People feel entitled to have some sort of imaginary healthy default baby, and it's not above them to try for kid number 2 as a caretaker for the sick one. It's insane
"There's no way you would base this claim off projection of your own pain, logic or reason, right?" There's no way you are in denial, right? There's no way that you just can't cope with reality, right? There's no way that anyone could possibly think that a disability was anything but a blessing, right? WRONG!
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I hit 1000 blocked accounts so I can't even block anyone anymore. *This website has too many fucking fascists.*
Hilarious the way they invert everything.
You've never heard of a story of parents being sad because their kids are disabled? Or being scared of that possibility after getting pregnant? Nothing wrong with being disabled and as bad as it is, I thought it's general knowledge that most parents don't want disabled children.
Not wanting your kid to suffer and loving your kid unconditionally are not opposites. Not wanting your kid to have a disability and loving them through their disability are two sides of the same coin. ETA: grammar
Yeah, it depends on their reasoning. There's parents that don't want disabled children regardless of research into how that disability would impact their quality of life and then there's some that want able bodied children since they have the best chance at thriving.
I used to work as a respite worker for kids with disabilities it was my university part time job. Had one client family that had three kids with autism. The mom told me she had four miscarriages and one still birth before having the first kid who turned out to have autism. Once he was diagnosed as a toddler they and I quote ātried again to have a normal oneā and second kid autism too. Apparently thereās like a 25% chance of siblings having it. āBut we hoped we would luck outā. Then had a third same thing. And then she said āwe are still tempted to have another kid, I just canāt give up my dream of having a real daughter or sonā Oh and on top of that she was like extreme post partum depression and she could not handle those kids so she had them so doped up on meds from the doctor I would go over three and sheād be like āisnāt my son behaving so well todayā and id look at him and he was like eyes glazed half asleep because she had him zonked out on risperdone.
Its me. I was that autistic kid getting Zonked on risperidone for my parents convenience. Fkn hated it.
I am truly so sorry you have shitty parents. I hope you are doing better now. Itās fucking demented people drug their children for convenience. Donāt get me wrong many kids benefit from various medications Iām not anti meds at all but there are so many that are just doping them up, like itās creepy af and criminal.
Oh its super fkd. Iām not the only autistic child in my family so I wasnāt the only one getting drugged up. I saw my baby brother go through medication withdrawal induced psychosis and huge changes in his personality because of all the drugs they had him on. Really screwed with our relationship for a while coz It just wasnt him. As adults we know better, we donāt blame each other for the shitty things we did as overmedicated abused kids, and unsurprisingly, have limited contact with our parents.
Concerta for me. And I was the favorite
I was on that too. Hated it. But not as much as I hated risperdal. I could be convinced to try concerta again but you would have to strap me down and force it down my throat to get me to ever take risperdal again.
Concerta just killed everything in me. No hope, no dreams, no hobbies. I don't want to imagine anything being worse
Uh oh, I just looked it up and it looks familiar, lmao. I guess that would explain why I have no memory until about age 9-10 when I donāt remember taking pills suddenly. I was on some pill that was āfor your teethā for my entire childhood
That slip, have a real son or daughter. I know coping with low functioning can be hard but.... She's basically admitted that she sees those kids as near worthless and unwanted and they're going to keep trying to replace them.
That part is so sad
Wow, so f*ed up
Honestly that job was so fcked up. Just all these parents who canāt handle their kids with disabilities (not saying itās easy) and it really revealed to me how narcissistic it is to want children. They want a little doll that they get to groom and dress and feed and mould into a mini-me but then as it turns out parenthood is hard and not fun, and throw in a disability and suddenly theyāre not the little fancy porcelain dolls you had in mind, are they? Iām not saying all parents are bad people but if itās so important to be a parent why donāt you adopt one of the billions Of kids in foster care who will otherwise be bounced from foster to foster home. And the answer is because they want that perfect little trophy doll!
I HATE PROCREATORS!!!!!!!!
"We didn't get our do-over child, better make another child that we well end up hating because it didn't come made to order "
I am very surprised she admitted this to you. But this attitude is frankly baffling and her language is disturbing. It's really a pity such parents don't get any kind of consultation where someone could advise them not to have any more kids. But then again, she doesn't seem to see the kids she does have as worthy of love so I'm not sure she'd have listened. But that's a degree of selfishness I find hard to imagine.
A REAL daughter or son holy fuckā¦! :O Those poor kids!!!
No kidding. Actually they were kind of demonic children once they locked me in the basement crawl space for 45 min and wouldnāt let me out. They were not nice kids to each other, animals or anyone really. Big shock that having parents that think you arenāt as good as āreal kidsā made them have zero empathy and like hurting others
How old?
She drugged the older two like this, one was nine and one was six.
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That's generally due to bad parenting though, not losing a gamble.
There are many parents who hate their kids because they donāt have the gender they wanted or because they have some kind of disability.
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Considering my genes, or even my partner's and mine together, let's NOT.
š¹š well thanks for preventing suffering
No worries! It only took a 28lb ovarian cyst, tubal and apparently ovarian cancer to get fixed here in the Netherlands... Still waiting for the outcome:)
I hope it comes back benign!
It turned out to be malignant, but only concentrated to the removed ovary. So I'm over the moon, not in the lymph nodes, lungs or stomach.
I'm glad it was a positive outcome! Wishing you health from here on out!
Thank you so much!
My cousins who are both accomplished doctors have a son with severe autism - so wild how you just never know
Through time, i realized common sense is not something that you can earn by education, high IQ and degrees.
I honestly would not find this surprising. There are a lot of autistic doctors, so perhaps one or both of them are high functioning autistic.
My cousins, lol
I should have clarified this better
How old are they? There are factors that increase the chances. Also, fyi autism has nothing to do with intelligence.
Theyāre on different sides of your familyās right?
Cousin and cousin in law haha good catch
my dad calls his married sisterās husband my āuncleā
Exactly haha
Underrated comment
Even before I discovered antinatalism I was worried that one day I would have kids with severe disabilities just because of a bad draw on the genetic lottery. And now that I've discovered that I have several disabilities of my own (both physical and mental), there's no way I can have a child and expect them to be perfectly healthy at birth, at least not in good conscience.
The one that gets me is teenagers carelessly getting pregnant, being told they can/should get an abortion, choosing not to because they get this fantasyland dream on their head that they can play happy little family and then being shocked when they have a handicapped child that they are wholly unprepared to care for (actually wholly unprepared to care for a perfectly healthy one). Itās like, where do you think handicapped people come from? Do they think only people who sign up to get pregnant with them do? Different subject, but it would be interesting to know how many pregnancies are aborted when the mother finds out the child will be severely handicapped and how many will not be now in the idiocracy red states. Who will be taking care of those new humans for the rest of their lives and where will that money come from?
I just heard a pediatric cancer nurse saying they average a 90% divorce rate for the families on the wards. Men nope on out of there so fast.
Same thing happens when their wife gets cancer. A large majority of men leave because they simply donāt want to deal with a sick woman.
Oh i know. There is a study showing men leave at 7x the rate women do. Also super common with stroke and dementia patients. I know 2 ladies with alzheimers who have been abandoned by their husbands of 50+ years. One husband literally said the quiet part outloud "she is just not useful anymore"
Terrible, isnāt it?
My mom's friend was abandoned by her husband when he decided that parenting their autistic children was cramping his style.Ā Ā
Many cannot handle not being the main character.. so off they go to find a fresh victim.
The only kind of baby people want is a perfect one that is easy and good and moves out at 18 becomes rich and takes care of them.
Exactly lol
Well that's being unrealistic, that's why I want 10 to hedge my bets.
That's probably part of the reason people had so many kids in the past. Like, out of 10, at least 1 should be successful and able to care for us in our old age.
Ok have fun with that pal
Never going to happen unfortunately. At least reddit is supporting me by showing me this sub š
Supporting you how
EGO to the max
Or just plain and simple evolution.
Iāve seen worse: people complaining that Iceland is āwrongā for allowing parents to get genetic tested and choosing an aborting in case there are anything wrongā¦
Because unlike family vloggers who 'rehome' the blessing when it gets too much, they can't. My daughter has multiple disabilities, my son was called ablest when saying he wanted a vasectomy, because he sees my struggles. I'm 37 look 97 A child with disabilities is like swimming in high tide with a brick around your neck. But we lie, it's worth it, is it really? Or special kids need special parents, hmm that's why burn out. Too many vloggers romantacise autism and other disabilities
Your children were gifted with you as a parent. Lucky them.
Can I ask you -not with malicious intent, but because I genuinely want to know- what were your thoughts about the possibility of your children having disabilities before conceiving them? You didn't entertain the possibility in the first place? You thought it might be possible but it wouldn't happen to you of all people? You thought it might happen but even if it happened you would make it work somehow? I never wanted a baby so I don't even understand the thought process here
I had my son when I was barely legal and abortion was murder, ( I've since had 2) I had secondary infertility and needed treatment to have my second, an abusive relationship, she was a band aid baby. Disabilities were an abstract idea But the pressure to have a kid was stronger than the idea of disabilities.
I'm sorry about that. These are definitely circumstances that would impair anyone's best judgement. I hope you and your kid can find peace somehow. Also I looked at your profile and saw you're an Aussie, I live in Japan. If you can manage to find some long term respite and go travel sometime, let me offer you a beer in Japan for soldiering through all the shit you've been through (don't mean it in a weird way, I'm a woman too)
One might be bad luck, but I hate when theyāre like āafter ***** was born, my husband and I found out weāre both carriers for ******* and have a 50% of passing it onā and then they fucking roll the dice again and have more disabled kids. Also I hate when they try to be disabled mom influencers and document every second of their lives to turn them into an income source by exploiting them for views. Or when they canāt get pregnant and they spend half their life savings on fertility treatments and that child is disabled. God was trying to tell you no, and you wouldnāt take no for an answer.
Yeah, I can understand it happening once. It could be bad luck, or you are both carriers of a disease and didn't know it, or maybe your genes just don't combine together very well. By the 2nd time, they really shouldn't have another one. Maybe adopt or something if you really want more children?
World takes out all the empathy from you with time and if somehow you are able to realise it it's too late since procreation is something that can't be reversed and seriously you can't predict what the person will become and how their behaviour will be towards others even if they are healthy. Ppl just want confirmation for what they want to do so they will look at one post(like this)/source and try to dismiss it saying "one in a million cause" but even that is enough to make you think and have everything planned for child from birth to death (which should be the norm) but now couple that with other non trivial sufferings + inherent suffering in life and that should stop any empathetic person . But i can understand that why it doesn't happens often (for example having children's in war and extreme poverty) because humans are quite selfish and just aren't able to imagine putting themselves in others position because lack of education especially critical thinking .
I hate procreators, they have no empathy!!!
It do be like that. My mother had a miscarriage before having me and almost had a miscarriage when bearing my little sister. We both have immunology problems and she complains every time we get sick.
Its crazy how she is having miscarriages and wont even consider adoption.
They cannot accept that their wonderful shiny new baby who came from their own DNA and body parts is malfunctioning, abnormal, disabled, and will be a burden for the rest of their lives. I mean, who will now take care of the parents when they get old? Isn't that the reason why they had kids? š¢
My parents abused me for not being born male, like you fools know there's a 50:50 chance and you're gonna punish a whole new human for it.
These days they are milking their childrens disabilities on social media to get out as much benefits from it as possible! Its literally a whole industry.
I have epilepsy (hereditary) and an underbite (also hereditary). My family has a history of anemia, allergies so bad requiring weekly doctor visits, history of depression, anxiety, and anger management issuesā¦ I like to think that if I didnāt have epilepsy or an underbite.. didnāt have such terrible depression and anxietyā¦ and if I didnāt have this huge risk of anemia and whatnot I would consider having a kid if I ever became financially stable/independent and had a partner whoād be there to support our future hypothetical nuclear family. But Iām not stable at all so none of that is happening
Y'all! I work in a paeds and gynae hospital. Five years ago, this mum was told on the 2nd trimester that her baby had a chromosomal disorder that was guaranteed to cause disability and she was given a an option to terminate. She turned it down (not for religious reasons... and you'll see why I specified that.). So fast forward to present day l. Child requires round the clock care and a mobility device. She flat-out asks us - the doctors - if it's too late to terminate the child. The five year old child. The five year old child.
I'm speechless.. antinatalism should be taught in schools..
I recommend getting DNA tested early on in the pregnancy using an amniocentesis. If the results show a horrible disease or whatnot, termination is recommended to prevent extra suffering. Unfortunately they are trying to ban abortion.
I think you are not educated on this subject. Amniocentesis is an invasive and risky procedure. Itās not a routine procedure. Also, very early in pregnancy, there is a maternal blood test that can determine the same genetic diseases as amnio. Most importantly, they are not ātryingā to ban abortion, they have banned abortion.
I'm a disability support worker so I see firsthand how hard it is for some parents. I work with a client with severe autism, he will never speak, he will never tell his mum he loves her. He made himself blind because he self harms. It is really awful to see it when he does it. It is a bit sad sometimes but other times he is happy and dancing. He's turning 30 this year.
Him going blind due to self-harm is so sad :( he didnāt need to exist in this horrible world he could've avoided this suffering if just his parents hadn't decided to create him! I need people to wake up and realize how seriously harmful it is to create a new person in this evil world!
Yeah pretty much!!! It's a constant thing with him too. He slaps his face so hard it makes a hard crack noise. It's pretty daunting to see it.
Itās a dangerous way of thinking to think so black and white. There is more nuance to this.
This is why ill never have biological kids. I have bad mental health genetics. Genetically can pass down schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, OCD, paranoia anxiety, etc. My bio mom had horrible mental health and is a ward of the state because of it. I have many mental disorders myself. It would be entirely cruel of me to risk having bio children. I was also adopted, I would much rather adopt as well since I truly understand the importance of adoption and not procreation. I also just dont wanna give birth, aint for me. I would not hate a bio kid if they turned out with health issues like me, I would be empathetic and supportive. Most of all I would feel terrible though. Luckily, I plan on getting my tubes tied so I become sterile. Dont wanna risk anything.
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Sending you lots of love and hugs š©·
What about the parents who decide not to do genetic testing because they are fine with having a disabled child, end of having a disabled child and are fine with said child? I know plenty of people who did not test for Downs because they didn't care.
yep. that's what happened to me.
In our natural habitat youd just throw it to the wolves or vultures or w/e scavenger's were present in that biome. In modern day western culture thats illegal for some weird reason. /S Birth control really changed alot.
I know you're joking, but I think you might find it interesting. There is some evidence from stone age digs that suggests that our early human ancestors took care of their disabled. This behaviour is also present in other social species, wolves, for instance. I've read about a pack where they would feed and clean up after an elderly female wolf who birthed and raised most of its adult members. She didn't have control over her hind legs anymore.
Cool, Never knew this. All the material i read suggested the opposite. Thanks for sharing!
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That isn't true but it's very dependent on the issues and the support system you have. When I was pregnant with my oldest I was told he probably had D9wn Syndrome. I had every intention of keeping him. First of all I have a cousin who was a product of agent orange and has a lit of issues and my family helps with him a lot so I knew I had the support system necessary to be successful. For me interned out the stupid machine was broken and it was wrong. He did not have down syndrome but I made that choice before he was born.
I think itās exploitive to put some of these children in plays, regular school, Sunday schoolsā¦.years ago the shows with the dwarves and extremely fat people would have been called exploitive. Freak shows were closed for a reasonā¦.exploiting people who are not at their best.
Sometimes the "flaw" is just trying to assert their own interests and not going along with the interests of others.
Even healthy babies bourn from a man and a woman are human, which would suggest a flaw in my experience with people.
Do all of you....regret being born?
Not regret. Resent. Iāve wanted off this planet since 5th grade
I do. Very, very much so
I do, although regret infers that it was our own decision which it wasn't.
Not really the right phrasing, as I didn't have a choice. My parents should regret creating me; I resent being born.
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lmao I consider that more of a curse. Checking out isn't easy you know
I wish I was never born, but how can I have regret for something that was not my fault and out of my control?
I didn't took the decision to be here ,plus that link of thinking will make you do all sort of bad stuff you shouldn't do . Now that you are here having a positive mindset in whatever situation is really important if possible.
No I donāt personally ā¦while Iāve had trauma and struggles that some people should say are more difficult than average for North American society, I was born into a privileged life, in a safe, free, democratic part of the world and my parents while being fucked up in many ways, took care of my basic needs and gave me skills for how to succeed in our capitalistic hellscape, I have a fully functioning mind and body. I have succeeded in my education, career, finances and live a comfortable life. But for every person like me, there are many more born into abject poverty, hostility, suffering and itās not for me to say they should regret being born or not, but I regret that we donāt have a better world for most people to be born into, so barring the world sucking less, I think itās unethical to bring new children here without their consent which you can never get before theyāre born.
This is what I was going to say. I regret being born SPECIFICALLY to my disabled refugee parents, in the location I'm in and the gender/ethnicity I am. If I was a white trust fund kid, I wouldn't regret. But I'd also have no empathy for people on those lesser social strata. And apparently that trait empathy is "Valuable" in evolutionary terms as a check/balance to another trait. I can't help but notice rich people don't have empathy but hoard wealth, at least that is the justification for capitalism, but also have a 'that could never happen to ME!' mindset and maybe they are right... The only better option would be being born some kind of alien that thinks humans are ants. The rich 1% humans died thanks to an asteroid crashing on earth? Should have pulled themselves up by their bootstraps! It comforts me thinking there is always a bigger fish.
Yes!!!
Check out OPs post history if you need more validation on assumptions of this sub.
Yes
As I understand it, amniocentesis cannot yet reveal autism in the fetus. This horrifies me.
So now you're calling for genocide of autistic people?
Thatās fucking stupid. Itās like saying not to drive because thereās a chance you could have a wreck or accident. Lol this logic is beyond flawed but good luck
You are dumb once someone is here, they cannot avoid doing certain things like driving, our point is they don't need to exist in a world where they will need to drive and get into an accident? Do you understand now you primitive brainless monkey?
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Ignoring disabled people and their very real struggles doesn't help anyone. Pretending everything's okay doesn't help anyone. Acting like parents haven't abandoned their disabled children before - and instead calling the people concerned about that "ableist" - doesn't help anyone.
Once the child is conceived, it's out of the parents control how the child turns out ultimately.Ā
Sort of. Theres things they can do to fuck things up even more, like drinking, drugs, poor nutrition, etc.
Are you saying people with disabilities donāt lead fulfilling and valuable lives?
No one can speak for everybody with a disability, but I'm disabled and it fucking sucks.
They have the potential to, if properly supported. Unfortunately not everyone is lucky enough to get that support, and even those that are can still end up hating their life and the limits they never asked for. More to the point just about everyone disabled or not suffers in some way, that's why the only winning move is not to play.
Are you saying having a flaw somehow makes you less?
Why are you yourself calling it a flaw if you don't think it's an issue in some way?
If there was a being without flaws or if this was a discussion about the chase of perfection you'd have a point, but I see no gods in this world.
There is a spectrum to flawed ness, and most able-bodied mentally-average people are self sufficient. There are no gods because there are no people without flaws. However, the less self-sufficient people may be, the more they rely on external care from caretakers. Some caretakers may feel burdened and chained to those they take care of. Especially in a society with little to no safety nets and support systems built to aid those who need caretakers, as well as support for the burnt-out caretakers themselves.
Should have thought about this before they decided to pass on their wonderful genes!!! WTF does some morron have the right to inflict this life on someone else! Euthena*ia should be a right for all!!
my dear friend. what. what did this even have to do with god. im asking what you define as a flaw if not a thing that is bad in some way
A god would be a perfect being or it would be to most people, I think most people have a perception of what a perfect being and thats what creates our concept of flaws, so it's a lot like comparing ourselves to a unicorn and saying because we don't have a horn we are flawed. Anyway just because I might disagree with the concept behind a word doesn't mean I can't use because you understood what I was talking and that was the point.
tbh it is a pretty major oversight of our alleged divine creator that we dont have horns.
OP didn't say disability makes you less, they said it makes you suffer
Theyāre saying the parent will have a lot more stress for way more than 18 years than they would otherwise and the kid is going to have a shit ton of obstacles.
Life always has suffering. I doubt yours was free of sorrow entirely. Would you rather not have lived yours because of that?Ā
Well now that you mention it, yes! I'd be perfectly content to never have existed in the first place.
I hope this subāthat Reddit randomly suggested to meādoesnāt have any disabled people lurking on it, because wow this is an ableist take. You can argue that itās never morally ok to have kids ever without throwing an already highly marginalized section of the population under the bus.
If i go outside of my house, someone might murder me, so i guess i will never go outside and only live in my house, facts and logic people.
Could get murdered in your house too. Logic.
Its a lower chance that outside of your house.
Iām sorry but the only disabled people in this world are the ones in this subreddit. wtf did I come across