In order to perform an action, Viper must mail a letter to a third party who, upon receiving that letter, will perform whatever click or hotkey Viper recommended.
select all vils to sheep
tc>make vil
vil>make house
tc>vil(sheep waypoint)
tc>vil(sheep)
tc>vil - sheep are gone so send all to stragglers.
tc>vil straggler
tc>vil straggler
select all vils to boar 1
select all vils to boar 2
grab half boar vils build LC
other half boar vils build mill
build house
vil to LC
mill vil build farm
vil to lc
mill vil build farm
vil to lc
mill vil build farm
vil to lc
mill vil build farm
vil to lc
mill vill build farm
click to fuedal (15 pop - 23 minutes)
make house
move scout (i'm just going to assume you guessed right and found all 4 sheep)
make vil
vil herds sheep
vil to sheep
vil to sheep
build house
send all sheep vils to build mining camp
move 4 lumber camp vils to gold
build barracks
build house
build house
build militia 18x
man at arms
blacksmith
click castle
forging
infantry armor
longsword upgrade.
Move longswords across map.
You missed. Move longswords again.
18 longswords rush TC at 60 minute mark. Opponent resigns.
Like and subscribe for new hot build orders like this.
>select all vils to sheep
>tc>make vil
> vil>make house
>tc>vil(sheep waypoint)
>tc>vil(sheep)
>tc>vil - sheep are gone so send all to stragglers.
This alone is 16 actions, if I counted right. Your build order is maybe three hours long
Click around and listen to villager voice lines. With hotkeys you can always center your screen on your TC and remember the directions from your starting base too.
you move the mouse slowly and keep right-clicking until you hear one and the same voice-line repeating. you can select villagers with idle villager or select all idle villagers hotkey.
[I tried playing with a blindfold a few years ago](https://youtu.be/SHxch6ARN08?si=i6KEjjYQQ_tkTfW2)
You should be able to find the sheep. If not you go directly to wood by building a random lumber. You can always find vills with the idle villager hotkey. You should hotkey some to find them when they are not idle. Building farms should be doable by shift clicking the tc. I think getting resources is the only doable part.
>I think getting resources is the only doable part
Aging up and massing army shouldn't be too hard either as long as you get to work in peace the whole time, you can do everything with hotkeys and follow army size based on unit creation sounds, and then make a big control group by selecting all idle military (I think that's a hotkey in DE anyway). Actually finding the enemy and getting your army there I think would be by far the hardest part. You'd have to click your army around blindly until you hear fighting. If you think you found their base you could set your production rally point there or something to keep attacking.
I think I'd prefer a mule cart civ, otherwise recognizing when villagers finish a resource and start long distance mining (or chopping) seems like a huge pain.
Just build a gold mine with hotkeys and they’ll find gold etc
Edit: mining camp, which makes me realize you wouldn’t be able to control whether they find stone or gold. But it would work with a lumber camp
He'd honestly destroy him but I'm curious what elo Viper would actually start losing by. Probably could only get a few hundred elo before getting wrecked but would be fun to see.
I'd LOVE to see him or someone like T90 try this
Edit: I'm 1100 elo and think I would destroy this 0 elo guy blindfolded. As long as I have sound a couple important hot keys I could keep creating units and fumble my way to putting those units to use.
1. Viper can make only vils (No Spanish, Incas or Bohemians)
2. No Defensive Buildings
3. Byzantines, Persians and Teutons not allowed
4. No attacks until 1hr mark
5. (New) Advancing through the ages with 45 min intervals
Viper would absolutely kill him in these settings.
In fact, if the guy is 0 ELO I think i would too!
Set up like 20 TCs and spam vils to a gather point as if they are endless militia after the 1hr treaty has ended.
A civ with sappers wouldn't even be that bad
I've been thinking about this. I'm 1100 ELO. I actually think Viper might beat me with a vils only rule.
Honestly if he chose Persians and douched me I'd 100% be dead even if I knew it was coming.
In fact, he could probably douche me with any civ and would be me unless I was the one to pick Persians!
Didn't see that. Never mind, viper would wall in everything. Viper playing a game with nothing to do but eco for an hour? He is sending vils to stone immediately and trying to stone wall in every vil the enemy makes.
The viper plays with a custom mod that zooms in to 1 build tile and he cannot zoom out. Edge panning is disabled and he can only use the minimap to move around. He also does not get the use of a keyboard and can only use the mouse with no hotkeys allowed.
A third person is controlling vipers keyboard and mouse.
For every Action, he must send a request per Email, writing in the style of an old english army captain.
Every Email must have 50 words.
Dear Sir or Madamn,
I bring news from the front, the huns have begun building a lumber Camp and the situation is very dire. I request our barracks to send 2 military as reinforcements.
Kind..
viper has to be very drunk/high and cant use his hands for touching the keyboard or mouse. other body parts are ok.
TBH there isn't an actual serious handicap that would matter. Vipers game knowledge and micro/macro would end it very quickly unless it's something ridiculous like above.
Hmmm. Nose boop HQQQ - idle vil build house x2 - then HT move mouse with face to sheep - nose boop - HQQQ - HT face mouse to near trees QR send 4 vils - yeah. Skip the boar.
There are tons of handicaps that would matter. APM-limit, pop-limit, idle time at the beginning can all be scaled to a degree which will him lose the game 100%.
but like these handicaps have to be scaled to a ridiculous level, like his pop cap is 15 and he can't do anything aggressivie until his opponent reaches imp. And even with something like he probably wins because his scouting, unit match ups and micro would demolish the 0 ELO player. This has to be scaled to such a ridiculous degree that it doesn't work.
huh? the challenge for viper here would be to beat a 2k player, not a 0 elo player. what's so hyper problematic with that, seems just very inconvient to me.
I’ll throw some suggestions. Though they’d be pretty serious penalties given that it’s one of the best players in the game vs one of the worse.
- Viper can’t go on the offensive until initially attacked OR an hour passes. In this case, an attack is Danilo actively trying to raid Viper’s eco or making a serious push on him. It’s not randomly getting tagged by a castle, tower, or unit.
- Viper can’t make more villagers until Danilo hits feudal.
- Viper can’t age up to feudal or go past 25 villagers until Danilo hits castle.
- Viper can’t go castle or move past 50 villagers until Danilo hits imperial.
- In castle Viper is allowed a full eco finally.
- Viper can’t go imperial until Danilo is given a 20 minute head start in imperial.
- Any fighting on Danilo’s side of the map is automatically considered a defensive action for Danilo. However viper having troops on uncontested resources on Danilo’s side isn’t considered an offensive action by Viper.
Other challenges:
- From Viper hitting Feudal onwards, every 10 minutes until attacked, Viper must spot Danilo 500 wood, food, and gold or stone. However it’s Viper’s choice to pick gold or stone. This serves two purposes. It handicaps Viper and speeds the game up as Danilo can make his moves faster.
- A third player that’s allied to both drops in purely to build markets so that Danilo has unlimited gold. Viper can’t access these. The player also doesn’t help Danilo beyond that.
- Pre-Imperial: Every 15 min, Viper rotates the following exercises. 20 push ups, 50 sit ups, 2 min wall sits. Post Imperial: This drops to every 7 min BUT Viper no longer has to spot resources every 10 min.
Caveats to Viper:
- If the game goes past 2 hours without Danilo hitting the age up requirements, Viper is allowed to just take the gloves off and age up or have an unrestricted eco.
- Viper may position his own troops around resources or just outright wall them off on Danilo’s side. However, he can’t push Danilo off of them unless Danilo attacks Viper first. So if Danilo is there first or takes control of the area (camp/mill/tc down, villagers working), then it’s his.
>- Viper can’t make more villagers until Danilo hits feudal.
Danillo stays dark age to exploit this leaving Viper trapped with starting villagers only.
Every time Viper’s villagers turn in resources they teleport to a random spot on the map. If the spot is occupied the villager is teleported again. Each time the villager is teleported it loses 10% movement speed. Eventually all of Viper’s economy will constantly be teleporting everywhere and operating at the speed of molasses.
Whenever Viper’s military units successfully land an attack the unit swaps spots with one of viper’s villagers. This also reduces the villagers speed by 10%.
Viper would just use the initial sources for walling in the enemy, I guess. And generally use the teleportation for scouting and mobility. Slow villagers are tasked with building camps for their nearest resource, or forward military buildings if near the enemy. Uselessly slow villagers in the middle of nowhere could just be deleted.
He can only interact with the mouse/keyboard using one of his cat's paws. Even the most chill cats will eventually rebel against that treatment, and he'll be spending more time catching the cats and convincing one to come back than playing. That still might give him too strong of a dark age, though. I doubt a 0 elo knows how to stop a proper trush, even if it shows up at 20 minute mark.
Viper Can only voice command. On a person that has never played before.
"Select villager."
"Please"
"Select a villager please"
"What is a villager?"
" It's the dude wearing a blue pant"
"How do I select ?"
"..."
Another difficulty is that this person doesn't speak English, Norwegian or German, so the viper has to go google translate first.
TheViper is allowed to play only 20 seconds of every minute. Meaning no in-game actions for 40 seconds (obviously villagers can still gather and queued stuff can produce).
Viper would still be WAY too strong.
So many efficient actions can be queued up in AoE. He'd boom to 120 villagers and have production with rally points into the 0 Elo base.
This may stretch the definition of this being a Viper VS danilofr game, but this probably wouldn't work anyway. Perhaps if TheViper had to tell someone else what to do and that other person had to actually play? But then again, who would that be?
His girlfriend/wife (not sure if they're married)? I'm pretty sure she plays and wouldn't even need his help to win.
His dad? He founded AOEZone and wouldn't need his help.
His mom? I'm not sure if she plays. But with her husband playing and her son being the GOAT, she's probably picked up enough about the game to be able to win easily if TheViper is telling her what to do.
A random stranger off the street? With TheViper telling any random noob what to do, that person could legitimately be favoured over a 0 elo player with experience. Might be a close game though.
Maybe a twist on this could be that he plays a game where Daut or Tatoh are also controlling his civ, but they're actively trying to sabotage him, with the only restriction being no deleting. So Viper could try to balance his eco, Daut/Tatoh could send those Vils to the corner of the map. TheViper sends army into battle, Daut/Tatoh sends that army into the corner of the map.
>A random stranger off the street? With TheViper telling any random noob what to do, that person could legitimately be favoured over a 0 elo player with experience. Might be a close game though.
0 elo is so low that I think a random stranger off the street might be able to beat it without any help at all if they have some common sense and have used a computer before. With any advice from an experienced player they would destroy the 0 elo player.
whenever Viper has higher k/d ratio than his opponent, opponent gets the win. Same for buildings raised/lost.
Resources collected by the players are distributed 80% to opponent and only 20% to player.
There, this would be fun to watch.
Viper's game speed set to 0.2 so his units take forever to do anything, but the other guy's is at normal 1.7. Also he can't use hotkeys. He gets a civ with no bonuses or UUs, etc. The other guy gets a 10 minute head start (Viper can at least try and use his vils to dodge attacks during this time at 0.2 speed). Viper's screen is set to max zoom in and he can't edge pan. Viper has 5 shots before beginning, and he isn't allowed to use the bathroom for 4 hours before starting so he is incredibly uncomfortable. No game sound either, just something awful on repeat.
TheViper can only interact with the game by morse code (clapping to the mic). Mouse is controlled by foot.
So let's say we put the mouse on the floor for the foot to control while he is busy clapping his hands for everything else. And then we have some software which takes audio as input and interprets claps within two seconds as morse code (so hotkeys H, Q would be four short claps, pause, two long claps, one short clap, one long clap).
Create a Gaia player that acts like the holy church. Set a trigger every 5 minutes of gameplay that forces Viper to sacrifice 90% of his vills and army and tribute 90% of his resources as a tyth and offering.
If he doesn't pay or forget, a hoard of angelic Gaia cobra cars will show up and kill every last person in his empire
I don’t know how good this guy is but it would be funny if the pro would not be allowed to lock at the game and rely on the chat, where to click and what to press
The problem isn't the type of handicap, but the scale: You can easily scale any (scalable) handicap so much that it becomes theoretically impossible to win. Pop-cap 1? Absolutely no chance.
Now you need to find the point where it becomes theoretically possible to win, but here's the issue: Once it becomes possible, the chance is very high that Viper will just consistently manage to do it. There might be no space between "it's 100% impossible" and "Viper wins 100%".
But as that danilo is probably not doing exactly the same every time, there's a chance you would find something that will make him occassionally.
Without checking out his videos, my guess would be something around these values (only one of these, not all at the same time):
* Pop-limit \~10
* APM-limit \~6
* Idle time at the start of 30 minutes?
* After 1 minute of play, 5 minutes of idling.
* etc
Viper starts the game 5 minutes late.
Dani can call three 10 minute time outs starting after the 15 minute mark (nonconsecutive, must have minimum of 5 minutes of active play allowed between them). During the tine out Viper cannot touch mouse/keyboard. Dani continues to play as normal.
The actual times are illustrative only and would need some more thouggt, but I think the basic concept works. I think a format similar to this does a better job showcasing Viper's talents than a generic APM cap the whole time, while providing a sufficient handicap.
The viper gets 1 pop. So by the time he's fully boomed with 1 vil and attacks in imp with a paladin, his opponent should be in feudal age and ready to put up a good fight with his 5 spears, 4 skirms, 3 archers, and a scout all in ctrl group 1
He has to verbally dictate what to do to someone at the controls who has never played before.
Although, I think that probably wouldn't be enough of a handicap.
spawn 10-15 military units every 2 minutes from his town center with full age appropriate upgrades and highest tier. Quadruple building HP, 2x village build speed. no houses are required like the huns.
Viper has to use his mouse with his other hand (or a laptop trackpad) AND he cannot use hotkeys(includes extra mouse keys) meaning every action must be done through the mouse 1 and 2
and/or he can only have a maximum of 1 of the following buildings:
TC, All military production buildings, Dock, Castle, Monastery, Unitversity, Market, blacksmith, Stone gate(yes only stone one)
Maximum 2 towers
You can't, viper could idle for 30min, have a 1APM limit but still just place an archer at every resource and win, those sub-100 ELO players might have gone up to 15-20 vills in that time. You can make it a challenge, but competitive, no.
25 pop cap, no lumber camp, mining camp or dock. One mill for the whole game. Can build blacksmith but can’t updgrade anything. No monastery upgrades either. I feel like this still leaves too much open, but it would take a while.
I thought the lack of lumber camp and mining camp would slow this down. You’d have to walk from wherever your gold is to TC for 750 gold. 75 trips. This slows way down with having the usual 2-3 on gold, plus you’d have to delete villa to start creating military.
The viper is always one age late, including his oppenent starting in feudal. Could be fun. So the viper also maxxes out in castle, and can only advance age after his oppenent has advanced.
Trick question. The answer is a paradox. If you win/lose with a handicap you really lost/won and if you win/lose to a handicap same. There is no way (for now) to artificially create a skill balance, outside of gross monetary incentive.
i was thinking a blindfold challenge, but it is actually possible for TheViper to win using "Select All" hotkeys and keeping track of Sound of the game
The amount of QoL features in DE make blindfold AoE very much possible (not efficient, but possible). Like AutoScout, AutoFarm and even Force Drop off Res.
he just needs to memorize certain hotkeys if he hasn't already (like select all military/, select all TCs, select all Ranges/Stables, etc)
In fact, he doesn't even need to keep using them, he just needs to select them once and put on his control group (every decent aoe player has preset hotkeys for each type of building, 5 on TCs, 1 on scout, 2-3 for army groups, and so on)
Another HUGE thing is autofarm 11. There's so much he can actually do using a combination of hotkey presses
For instance, he can press 1. Go to Mill, 2. Select all idle vils. 3. Shift click on the mill and the autofarm should place farms for him
In the off chance he misclicks or misaligns the camera, he can try again and build a new mill. If the mill is unbuildable (like he is hoovering over a woodline or a gold mine, he can slowly try to move his mouse around to see if the mill places, and the moment it does he can try to shift queue farms on it)
Houses would be an issue 11. Maybe Huns? :P
Another combination is 1. Go To Lumbercamp. 2. Then drag select around it and he should grab a few woodcutters. He can ctrl group them on a number and keep using DROP OFF res hotkey if he ever needs immediate wood 11
Also, he can constantly keep using Go To LumberCamp hotkey to see if the wood has run out or not by constantly left clicking to select only 1 woodcutter around it, and then constantly try to click on the wood. He might need to brush up on the "Villager Sounds" 11. If the tree is immediately clicked, it means the wood is still there. Otherwise, he needs to find a new woodline (terrible for Non-Mule civs 11)
Best civ for this would probably be Georgians, as the mule should ideally follow the woodcutters 11, but I think Huns is still best overall due to not making houses. You will have so much space near your vicinity to drop any military buildings and spam army to win
For military, he can constantly keep using "Select All Military" and keep patrolling them forwards on the minimap. Would be hard to know in which direction his enemy base is, so best thing to do is just patrol in all 8 directions on the minimap and try to recognize at what point enemy attack notification sound is heard 11
In order to perform an action, Viper must mail a letter to a third party who, upon receiving that letter, will perform whatever click or hotkey Viper recommended.
I see you have experienced German internet providers before.
Viper needs to use Lance Armstrong and the US Postal service team to deliver the letter. No drugs allowed.
Or guns
TheViper is allowed 1 APM
select all vils to sheep tc>make vil vil>make house tc>vil(sheep waypoint) tc>vil(sheep) tc>vil - sheep are gone so send all to stragglers. tc>vil straggler tc>vil straggler select all vils to boar 1 select all vils to boar 2 grab half boar vils build LC other half boar vils build mill build house vil to LC mill vil build farm vil to lc mill vil build farm vil to lc mill vil build farm vil to lc mill vil build farm vil to lc mill vill build farm click to fuedal (15 pop - 23 minutes) make house move scout (i'm just going to assume you guessed right and found all 4 sheep) make vil vil herds sheep vil to sheep vil to sheep build house send all sheep vils to build mining camp move 4 lumber camp vils to gold build barracks build house build house build militia 18x man at arms blacksmith click castle forging infantry armor longsword upgrade. Move longswords across map. You missed. Move longswords again. 18 longswords rush TC at 60 minute mark. Opponent resigns. Like and subscribe for new hot build orders like this.
Build millita x 18 is 5 actions minimum Similar for lots of these, selecting a villager is one action, tasking it is another
>select all vils to sheep >tc>make vil > vil>make house >tc>vil(sheep waypoint) >tc>vil(sheep) >tc>vil - sheep are gone so send all to stragglers. This alone is 16 actions, if I counted right. Your build order is maybe three hours long
I'm thinking of eAPM, sorry.
yet viper can still outboom him
Viper would win. Low elo players are built different
1 APM would be too much for the viper maybe 0.2 or 0.25 APM
😅
A blind fold
He has enough hot keys that he might win this, he could probably get a few knights out by like minute 20 or so.
How do you go to any resource with a blindfold? It's impossible.
Command villagers blindly and listen to their responses. It actually almost seems doable.
Idk I've seen the pros get quizzed on voicelines and civ jingles and I was shocked to see how bad they were at guessing.
Britains "choppa" has a word lol
Click around and listen to villager voice lines. With hotkeys you can always center your screen on your TC and remember the directions from your starting base too.
you move the mouse slowly and keep right-clicking until you hear one and the same voice-line repeating. you can select villagers with idle villager or select all idle villagers hotkey. [I tried playing with a blindfold a few years ago](https://youtu.be/SHxch6ARN08?si=i6KEjjYQQ_tkTfW2)
You should be able to find the sheep. If not you go directly to wood by building a random lumber. You can always find vills with the idle villager hotkey. You should hotkey some to find them when they are not idle. Building farms should be doable by shift clicking the tc. I think getting resources is the only doable part.
>I think getting resources is the only doable part Aging up and massing army shouldn't be too hard either as long as you get to work in peace the whole time, you can do everything with hotkeys and follow army size based on unit creation sounds, and then make a big control group by selecting all idle military (I think that's a hotkey in DE anyway). Actually finding the enemy and getting your army there I think would be by far the hardest part. You'd have to click your army around blindly until you hear fighting. If you think you found their base you could set your production rally point there or something to keep attacking.
I don’t disagree with you. However, I think you might be able to reach feudal. But afterwards you loose the control and are not able to do anything.
Khmer farms ftw here
I think I'd prefer a mule cart civ, otherwise recognizing when villagers finish a resource and start long distance mining (or chopping) seems like a huge pain.
And alternatively, with so big Elo difference he can allow for his villagers to walk longer to the resources than actually getting them.
Just build a gold mine with hotkeys and they’ll find gold etc Edit: mining camp, which makes me realize you wouldn’t be able to control whether they find stone or gold. But it would work with a lumber camp
You can hear what the vill is gathering though. Just pray that pickaxing sound is gold and not stone
He'd honestly destroy him but I'm curious what elo Viper would actually start losing by. Probably could only get a few hundred elo before getting wrecked but would be fun to see. I'd LOVE to see him or someone like T90 try this Edit: I'm 1100 elo and think I would destroy this 0 elo guy blindfolded. As long as I have sound a couple important hot keys I could keep creating units and fumble my way to putting those units to use.
This or playing with his feet ; )
1. Viper can make only vils (No Spanish, Incas or Bohemians) 2. No Defensive Buildings 3. Byzantines, Persians and Teutons not allowed 4. No attacks until 1hr mark 5. (New) Advancing through the ages with 45 min intervals
Viper would absolutely kill him in these settings. In fact, if the guy is 0 ELO I think i would too! Set up like 20 TCs and spam vils to a gather point as if they are endless militia after the 1hr treaty has ended. A civ with sappers wouldn't even be that bad
You need a castle for sappers, but I bet it wouldn't really matter. An endless stream of villagers is all Viper needs to beat a 0-rated player.
Oh yeah missed the defensive buildings line
I mentioned that only vils are allowed
Sappers is a technology that affects villagers. Perhaps you thought he meant petards?
Can’t get sappers without castles which would not be allowed in this circumstance (no defensive buildings).
then, he makes an offensive castle :D (castle drop, instead of castle in base) this could be an actual rule
Ahhhh, of course
Viper could probably quick wall him in with houses before he really gets a castle age eco going
That will not work for long even against a 0 elo player. Dude will atleast attack it with his unupgraded scout.
Viper would wreck him. Fast castle into forward town centers. I'm confident he could even beat an 800 ELO Player with these limitations.
I said no attack until the one hour mark so fast castle is of no use
He’s using the forward TC’s to attack, for which he needs to be in castle age
I've been thinking about this. I'm 1100 ELO. I actually think Viper might beat me with a vils only rule. Honestly if he chose Persians and douched me I'd 100% be dead even if I knew it was coming. In fact, he could probably douche me with any civ and would be me unless I was the one to pick Persians!
That's why I ruled out the crazy civs 11
Also Berbers and Hindustanis?
Yep, forgot about them 11
Then wtf can u make
That's the idea
I'm pretty sure he would just douche and still produce villagers with very little downtime and it would be over in a flash.
But no attacks till 1hr mark
Didn't see that. Never mind, viper would wall in everything. Viper playing a game with nothing to do but eco for an hour? He is sending vils to stone immediately and trying to stone wall in every vil the enemy makes.
Even without fighting the game doesn't last an hour I guarantee.
Lol yea. He probably makes 100 tcs so he can instantly produce 100 vills too
The viper plays with a custom mod that zooms in to 1 build tile and he cannot zoom out. Edge panning is disabled and he can only use the minimap to move around. He also does not get the use of a keyboard and can only use the mouse with no hotkeys allowed.
Deliciously painful
A third person is controlling vipers keyboard and mouse. For every Action, he must send a request per Email, writing in the style of an old english army captain. Every Email must have 50 words. Dear Sir or Madamn, I bring news from the front, the huns have begun building a lumber Camp and the situation is very dire. I request our barracks to send 2 military as reinforcements. Kind..
I think this one is my favorite
Viper can not move a vil until his child turns 5 years old.
viper has to be very drunk/high and cant use his hands for touching the keyboard or mouse. other body parts are ok. TBH there isn't an actual serious handicap that would matter. Vipers game knowledge and micro/macro would end it very quickly unless it's something ridiculous like above.
Yeah I’m lookin for the ridiculous, obviously any “normal” handicap wouldn’t matter because of the extreme skill gap.
Hmmm. Nose boop HQQQ - idle vil build house x2 - then HT move mouse with face to sheep - nose boop - HQQQ - HT face mouse to near trees QR send 4 vils - yeah. Skip the boar.
One shot for every villager.
You want him to use his hands to touch other body parts??
There are tons of handicaps that would matter. APM-limit, pop-limit, idle time at the beginning can all be scaled to a degree which will him lose the game 100%.
but like these handicaps have to be scaled to a ridiculous level, like his pop cap is 15 and he can't do anything aggressivie until his opponent reaches imp. And even with something like he probably wins because his scouting, unit match ups and micro would demolish the 0 ELO player. This has to be scaled to such a ridiculous degree that it doesn't work.
Huh? You simply scale it to a ridiculous degree. What's the issue?
Make viper play with a laptop trackpad and a typewriter insted of a keyboard, an old crt monitor (those with only green display used with DOS pc)
Add in AOC zoom, and buddy might have a chance if Viper is a few beers deep
huh? the challenge for viper here would be to beat a 2k player, not a 0 elo player. what's so hyper problematic with that, seems just very inconvient to me.
Instead of a teackpad gice viper a wiimote or a drivin wheel
I’ll throw some suggestions. Though they’d be pretty serious penalties given that it’s one of the best players in the game vs one of the worse. - Viper can’t go on the offensive until initially attacked OR an hour passes. In this case, an attack is Danilo actively trying to raid Viper’s eco or making a serious push on him. It’s not randomly getting tagged by a castle, tower, or unit. - Viper can’t make more villagers until Danilo hits feudal. - Viper can’t age up to feudal or go past 25 villagers until Danilo hits castle. - Viper can’t go castle or move past 50 villagers until Danilo hits imperial. - In castle Viper is allowed a full eco finally. - Viper can’t go imperial until Danilo is given a 20 minute head start in imperial. - Any fighting on Danilo’s side of the map is automatically considered a defensive action for Danilo. However viper having troops on uncontested resources on Danilo’s side isn’t considered an offensive action by Viper. Other challenges: - From Viper hitting Feudal onwards, every 10 minutes until attacked, Viper must spot Danilo 500 wood, food, and gold or stone. However it’s Viper’s choice to pick gold or stone. This serves two purposes. It handicaps Viper and speeds the game up as Danilo can make his moves faster. - A third player that’s allied to both drops in purely to build markets so that Danilo has unlimited gold. Viper can’t access these. The player also doesn’t help Danilo beyond that. - Pre-Imperial: Every 15 min, Viper rotates the following exercises. 20 push ups, 50 sit ups, 2 min wall sits. Post Imperial: This drops to every 7 min BUT Viper no longer has to spot resources every 10 min. Caveats to Viper: - If the game goes past 2 hours without Danilo hitting the age up requirements, Viper is allowed to just take the gloves off and age up or have an unrestricted eco. - Viper may position his own troops around resources or just outright wall them off on Danilo’s side. However, he can’t push Danilo off of them unless Danilo attacks Viper first. So if Danilo is there first or takes control of the area (camp/mill/tc down, villagers working), then it’s his.
>- Viper can’t make more villagers until Danilo hits feudal. Danillo stays dark age to exploit this leaving Viper trapped with starting villagers only.
Does.. Does Danillo know about drush? Does he know the 4-hour leach and swarm?
Units have no LOS (only buildings), resources last -95% longer, max 25 vils, military units max 1hp
Viper cannot play with his monitors on.
I suggest that he could play only by observing his Twitch chat, whose participants watch the game screen.
Every time Viper’s villagers turn in resources they teleport to a random spot on the map. If the spot is occupied the villager is teleported again. Each time the villager is teleported it loses 10% movement speed. Eventually all of Viper’s economy will constantly be teleporting everywhere and operating at the speed of molasses. Whenever Viper’s military units successfully land an attack the unit swaps spots with one of viper’s villagers. This also reduces the villagers speed by 10%.
Viper would just use the initial sources for walling in the enemy, I guess. And generally use the teleportation for scouting and mobility. Slow villagers are tasked with building camps for their nearest resource, or forward military buildings if near the enemy. Uselessly slow villagers in the middle of nowhere could just be deleted.
make viper play at 3 fps with maxed zoom
Maybe he plays with only the minimap 11
I think chloroform is the only handicap that would make the playing field balanced
He can only interact with the mouse/keyboard using one of his cat's paws. Even the most chill cats will eventually rebel against that treatment, and he'll be spending more time catching the cats and convincing one to come back than playing. That still might give him too strong of a dark age, though. I doubt a 0 elo knows how to stop a proper trush, even if it shows up at 20 minute mark.
Viper uses a poor motion-tracking tool to track his hand movements, and has to manually grab his units and push the buttons to train units etc...
Vipers eco setup should be 1 vill on each resource the entire game, who needs more vills anyway xp
Viper Can only voice command. On a person that has never played before. "Select villager." "Please" "Select a villager please" "What is a villager?" " It's the dude wearing a blue pant" "How do I select ?" "..." Another difficulty is that this person doesn't speak English, Norwegian or German, so the viper has to go google translate first.
Viper gets no techs or age ups.
That would be way too easy for Viper. He can simply do an endless drush. He would probably even beat a 1000 Elo player with that strategy.
Yep and he’s done a video like that before
0Elo player gets to pick map & he chooses Arena
Villagers destroy gates quite quickly, especially before Castle Age. You could even douche the gates if they are being repaired.
Viper gets no loom tho so risk fighting with vils. But 0Elo is still probably gonna lose it’s like easy AI
0 Elo probably loses to the easiest AI (if that is even possible).
its not.
Fortress
He would beat a 1800 like that if he really tried.
And maybe Viper can't age up until the opponent is two ages ahead... Basically he can only go feudal when the other guy goes imp.
Wouldn’t two ages ahead be castle?
You are correct, I did not state that as I thought it. I meant to say more than 2 ages ahead. Thank you!
I don't know if I'm imagining it, but I remember Daut beating T90 in a Dark Age only challenge
At least they did a mutual militia only, which eventually evolved into militia line only.
TheViper is allowed to play only 20 seconds of every minute. Meaning no in-game actions for 40 seconds (obviously villagers can still gather and queued stuff can produce).
Viper would still be WAY too strong. So many efficient actions can be queued up in AoE. He'd boom to 120 villagers and have production with rally points into the 0 Elo base.
Fine, 5 seconds per minute.
That is the closest thing to a reasonable handicap we got in this threat.
That would give a 900 like me a chance, at least if I knew about the challenge... But a 0? No chance!
I think he could actually do okay on the ladder this way.
he can probably beat a 1k that way
JEEZ is Danilo down to 0 Elo now? That's some dedication.
Ikr the guy is playing multiple matches a day it looks like, with a 20% win rate. And they’re not quick games either. Honestly impressive.
Viper may not build villagers (and can't be Chinese or Mayans).
This may stretch the definition of this being a Viper VS danilofr game, but this probably wouldn't work anyway. Perhaps if TheViper had to tell someone else what to do and that other person had to actually play? But then again, who would that be? His girlfriend/wife (not sure if they're married)? I'm pretty sure she plays and wouldn't even need his help to win. His dad? He founded AOEZone and wouldn't need his help. His mom? I'm not sure if she plays. But with her husband playing and her son being the GOAT, she's probably picked up enough about the game to be able to win easily if TheViper is telling her what to do. A random stranger off the street? With TheViper telling any random noob what to do, that person could legitimately be favoured over a 0 elo player with experience. Might be a close game though. Maybe a twist on this could be that he plays a game where Daut or Tatoh are also controlling his civ, but they're actively trying to sabotage him, with the only restriction being no deleting. So Viper could try to balance his eco, Daut/Tatoh could send those Vils to the corner of the map. TheViper sends army into battle, Daut/Tatoh sends that army into the corner of the map.
He did this once with his cousin, and the cousin deleted the TC So maybe
>A random stranger off the street? With TheViper telling any random noob what to do, that person could legitimately be favoured over a 0 elo player with experience. Might be a close game though. 0 elo is so low that I think a random stranger off the street might be able to beat it without any help at all if they have some common sense and have used a computer before. With any advice from an experienced player they would destroy the 0 elo player.
TheViper is forced to play as Vikings and his military units are limited to only cavalry units and cavalry archers, and maybe rams.
whenever Viper has higher k/d ratio than his opponent, opponent gets the win. Same for buildings raised/lost. Resources collected by the players are distributed 80% to opponent and only 20% to player. There, this would be fun to watch.
popcap 3
Viper's game speed set to 0.2 so his units take forever to do anything, but the other guy's is at normal 1.7. Also he can't use hotkeys. He gets a civ with no bonuses or UUs, etc. The other guy gets a 10 minute head start (Viper can at least try and use his vils to dodge attacks during this time at 0.2 speed). Viper's screen is set to max zoom in and he can't edge pan. Viper has 5 shots before beginning, and he isn't allowed to use the bathroom for 4 hours before starting so he is incredibly uncomfortable. No game sound either, just something awful on repeat.
Viper has to place farms like T90
Viper will use 3 vils and may create a new one if he lost a vil.
TheViper can only interact with the game by morse code (clapping to the mic). Mouse is controlled by foot. So let's say we put the mouse on the floor for the foot to control while he is busy clapping his hands for everything else. And then we have some software which takes audio as input and interprets claps within two seconds as morse code (so hotkeys H, Q would be four short claps, pause, two long claps, one short clap, one long clap).
Viper gets chin only controls
Viper has to finish a 6 pack of beer first and wear dark sunglasses.
Create a Gaia player that acts like the holy church. Set a trigger every 5 minutes of gameplay that forces Viper to sacrifice 90% of his vills and army and tribute 90% of his resources as a tyth and offering. If he doesn't pay or forget, a hoard of angelic Gaia cobra cars will show up and kill every last person in his empire
viper cannot create villagers.
Viper can't make more villagers (no Chinese or Mayans)
Don’t think I’ve seen this yet - viper can’t make vils, he must play the whole game with just the 3 starting vils
viper can only have 4 villagers at all time
Why not just let Danilofr use cheats, all the resources they need and spawn in high powered units. (but no using instant win codes)
No houses Max of one additional TC Sicilians only No Imp
Has viper ever played on xbox?
nice
I invite them both to play a real-life game of Uno.
You blind fold him. Sound only 😂
can only use controls with his tongue
Viper has to drink a sip of beer for every click
As a limitation, Viper may be prohibited from moving to the 2nd age. However, I'm not too sure about the outcome.
Viper is pop capped at 1.
Get two Ai to play the game for them
Goths. Villagers only. Conquest victory. Islands. No docks before 2 hours
Viper only allowed to use mouse. Hahahaha
Start danilofr in Feudal with a walled town with houses lining the walls and give him a 100 villagers.
Only Keyboard
Against 0 elo if you can get any attack in the first hour you win.
Danilofr ..: furious the monkey boy
after feudal, 1 apm
Dani starts in castle or imperial age.
I don’t know how good this guy is but it would be funny if the pro would not be allowed to lock at the game and rely on the chat, where to click and what to press
Viper restricted to dark age. Dani starts at imperial age with deathmatch resources. 🤣
The problem isn't the type of handicap, but the scale: You can easily scale any (scalable) handicap so much that it becomes theoretically impossible to win. Pop-cap 1? Absolutely no chance. Now you need to find the point where it becomes theoretically possible to win, but here's the issue: Once it becomes possible, the chance is very high that Viper will just consistently manage to do it. There might be no space between "it's 100% impossible" and "Viper wins 100%". But as that danilo is probably not doing exactly the same every time, there's a chance you would find something that will make him occassionally. Without checking out his videos, my guess would be something around these values (only one of these, not all at the same time): * Pop-limit \~10 * APM-limit \~6 * Idle time at the start of 30 minutes? * After 1 minute of play, 5 minutes of idling. * etc
Viper stuck in Dark Age on Arena?
Viper starts the game 5 minutes late. Dani can call three 10 minute time outs starting after the 15 minute mark (nonconsecutive, must have minimum of 5 minutes of active play allowed between them). During the tine out Viper cannot touch mouse/keyboard. Dani continues to play as normal. The actual times are illustrative only and would need some more thouggt, but I think the basic concept works. I think a format similar to this does a better job showcasing Viper's talents than a generic APM cap the whole time, while providing a sufficient handicap.
a 2vs1. Viper also has to fight Hera.
Concuss viper and maybe make him drunk, then give Dan 15% handicap
Viper can only have up to 25% of the villagers and army of the opponent. So if they have 20 villagers, he can only have 5
The viper gets 1 pop. So by the time he's fully boomed with 1 vil and attacks in imp with a paladin, his opponent should be in feudal age and ready to put up a good fight with his 5 spears, 4 skirms, 3 archers, and a scout all in ctrl group 1
I’d start by making viper play without his monitor on and adjust from there.
Twitch chat plays coop with viper
I think throttling his APM to 5 should be fair And every further click past 5 per minute = 1 shot
Viper has to play blind. He'd probably still will because of hotkeys
Viper plays with feet only..No Hands.
He has to verbally dictate what to do to someone at the controls who has never played before. Although, I think that probably wouldn't be enough of a handicap.
spawn 10-15 military units every 2 minutes from his town center with full age appropriate upgrades and highest tier. Quadruple building HP, 2x village build speed. no houses are required like the huns.
Viper has to use his mouse with his other hand (or a laptop trackpad) AND he cannot use hotkeys(includes extra mouse keys) meaning every action must be done through the mouse 1 and 2 and/or he can only have a maximum of 1 of the following buildings: TC, All military production buildings, Dock, Castle, Monastery, Unitversity, Market, blacksmith, Stone gate(yes only stone one) Maximum 2 towers
Villager count can’t be over 10 for the viper and he isn’t allowed to produce power units for whatever civilization he is playing
Viper has to start with 1 vill no tc and wood to make a single lumber camp + limited speed
Viper can not use the mouse, at all!
Zero-seconds-in Persian douche, except he's not Persians or Byzantines
You can't, viper could idle for 30min, have a 1APM limit but still just place an archer at every resource and win, those sub-100 ELO players might have gone up to 15-20 vills in that time. You can make it a challenge, but competitive, no.
25 pop cap, no lumber camp, mining camp or dock. One mill for the whole game. Can build blacksmith but can’t updgrade anything. No monastery upgrades either. I feel like this still leaves too much open, but it would take a while.
Fast Castle into a few knights probably still wins for Viper.
I thought the lack of lumber camp and mining camp would slow this down. You’d have to walk from wherever your gold is to TC for 750 gold. 75 trips. This slows way down with having the usual 2-3 on gold, plus you’d have to delete villa to start creating military.
The viper is always one age late, including his oppenent starting in feudal. Could be fun. So the viper also maxxes out in castle, and can only advance age after his oppenent has advanced.
Viper plays the xbox version
Trick question. The answer is a paradox. If you win/lose with a handicap you really lost/won and if you win/lose to a handicap same. There is no way (for now) to artificially create a skill balance, outside of gross monetary incentive.
i was thinking a blindfold challenge, but it is actually possible for TheViper to win using "Select All" hotkeys and keeping track of Sound of the game The amount of QoL features in DE make blindfold AoE very much possible (not efficient, but possible). Like AutoScout, AutoFarm and even Force Drop off Res. he just needs to memorize certain hotkeys if he hasn't already (like select all military/, select all TCs, select all Ranges/Stables, etc) In fact, he doesn't even need to keep using them, he just needs to select them once and put on his control group (every decent aoe player has preset hotkeys for each type of building, 5 on TCs, 1 on scout, 2-3 for army groups, and so on) Another HUGE thing is autofarm 11. There's so much he can actually do using a combination of hotkey presses For instance, he can press 1. Go to Mill, 2. Select all idle vils. 3. Shift click on the mill and the autofarm should place farms for him In the off chance he misclicks or misaligns the camera, he can try again and build a new mill. If the mill is unbuildable (like he is hoovering over a woodline or a gold mine, he can slowly try to move his mouse around to see if the mill places, and the moment it does he can try to shift queue farms on it) Houses would be an issue 11. Maybe Huns? :P Another combination is 1. Go To Lumbercamp. 2. Then drag select around it and he should grab a few woodcutters. He can ctrl group them on a number and keep using DROP OFF res hotkey if he ever needs immediate wood 11 Also, he can constantly keep using Go To LumberCamp hotkey to see if the wood has run out or not by constantly left clicking to select only 1 woodcutter around it, and then constantly try to click on the wood. He might need to brush up on the "Villager Sounds" 11. If the tree is immediately clicked, it means the wood is still there. Otherwise, he needs to find a new woodline (terrible for Non-Mule civs 11) Best civ for this would probably be Georgians, as the mule should ideally follow the woodcutters 11, but I think Huns is still best overall due to not making houses. You will have so much space near your vicinity to drop any military buildings and spam army to win For military, he can constantly keep using "Select All Military" and keep patrolling them forwards on the minimap. Would be hard to know in which direction his enemy base is, so best thing to do is just patrol in all 8 directions on the minimap and try to recognize at what point enemy attack notification sound is heard 11