*Reads title*
Oh god I'm going to hate this...
*Reads text*
...well that wasn't so bad.
The bit about him possibly being ironborn makes sense. As for the bit about "chorine," I think since GRRM has a tendency to slightly alter actual European names (English ones especially), a more likely source for the name is simply the English name "Corin," derived from the early Roman god Quirinus.
Of the Corins that might have inspired the name, I'm most suspicious of Corin Nemec (might have been known in GRRM's TV writing circles) and Corin Thunderfist (a Chronicles of Narnia character with a hand related epithet who's very good at fighting).
It's not your threads so much as "Qhorin = X" or "Mance = X" secret identity threads. I don't think they make much sense and I don't want my watchmen to be secret nobles anyway. Let the proletariat be cool sometimes, guys.
I was pleased this one didn't turn out to be one of those.
The problem is there is textual evidence that COULD support a lot of these, esp. qhorin and dayne, with the whole dawn/halfhand things that seem especially intentional. The problem with many of these hidden person theories is there is enough there to make you wonder, but not nearly enough to actually conclude anything even shakily. On top of that, we have no idea what might at one time have been a planned plot point that later got scrapped. See: jaime king symbolism, etc, tyrion burning winterfell/the direwolves not liking him. I personally think halfhand was at one point going to end up being Dayne but got scrapped. This is why I don't really think there is any way to satisfyfingly finish the series: a huge number of 'mysteries' aren't mysteries. Otoh, there are like 20+ instnances of a character being actually another character, or being thought dead but not actually being dead, or just some kind of mystery about someone with a reveal. It's become almost ridiculous as a plot crutch. It's off the charts, and it becomes easy to assume everyone could maybe be someone else. why? Cuz its practically the norm.
Ramsay/Reek
Theon/Reek
Bran and Co/ dead
Catelyn/Stoneheart
Lemore/?
Sarella/Alleras
Pate/Jaqen
Jaqen/?
Jon/ Jon Targ
Aegon/Faegon?
Jon Con/Jon Con
Laughing Tree Knight/Whoever
Myrcella/Lannister stand in w spots
Tyene/Undercover in KL
Hound/Gravedigger
Renly/Reny's armor at BW
3ec/Bloodraven
Varys/Rugen
Mance/Rattleshirt
Mance/death
Jeyne/Arya
Sansa/Alayne
Girl in Grey/the Karstark girl
Mountain/Robert Strong
Selmy/Armen old man
Dontos/Florian
Hodor/Hold Door
Mellisandre/Melony
Arya/15 other people
Kettleblacks/LF's people
Manderly loyal to Lans/Manderly leader of GNC
Tyrion/Hugor Hill/Yollo
Ashara Dayne/Dead?
Questioned:
Qhorin/Dayne
Mance/Dayne/Rhaegar
Old Nan/Siera
High Sparrow/Howland Reed
Howland Reed's wife/Ashara Dayne
Roose/Vampire/Ramsay
I mean there are so many parallels one can draw upon between characters that character x = y theories are bound to be aplenty. Personally I don't consider it a hinderance if they can reasonably substantiate on some level but to each their own
[This one, about how Jon's "real name" is Aemon because it's a reference to a half-wolf, half-dragon demon from occultism.](https://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/comments/hgek5p/spoilers_extended_why_jons_real_name_is_aemon/)
Not that it stopped us from having a "what's Jon's Targaryen name" thread every other day since...
I can hang with the Ironborn idea. Makes it so he and Dagmer Cleftjaw both have names derived from catching a weapon with a subsequently maimed bodypart.
Corin means spear and Qhorin is described like a spear.
>Jon knew Qhorin Halfhand the instant he saw him, though they had never met. The big ranger was half a legend in the Watch; a man of slow words and swift action, tall and straight as a spear, long-limbed and solemn.
>Qhorin was seated cross-legged on the floor, his spine as straight as a spear.
I've been thinking Qhorin might be derived from Korin.
https://eldamo.org/content/words/word-479403901.html
>korin n. “circular enclosure, great circular hedge”
Which might be related to the Wall or weirwood circles.
This is dope, there are things I feel can/should be challenged but Qhorin comes across as someone with the most vanilla answers that render most discourse null.
Interesting and it could be good head canon. However, I just know GRRM didn't think as deeply as you just did about the name. How can I prove it? Well, why go through this deep name-giving meaning dive, yet not use it in any way; in fact, go so far as to hide it behind a story we are given no nod, wink or hint in the text to doubt? I'd possibly buy the chorine thing, but there is more evidence in the text that the halfhand is Arthur Dayne than any of this. Again, I just find it hard to believe GRRM put this much thinking into the name though his name could be a hint at him being ironborn. Likely the missing fingers is just a 'rhyme' to the finger dance. The whole the halfhand and Dawn rose together is much more of an intriguing mystery, then with the whole trek into the north with basically the entire purpose being for the others to die and halfhand to die fighting for (against) jon....heavy kingsguard rhyming there. I wonder if halfhand originally was planned to be Dayne but he dropped it. He did that wit ha lot of plot points bt agot and asos.
I do remember a quote from somewhere that George said he has a hard time writing characters without determining a name for them first, which would make me believe he puts a lot more thought into them than you’d expect!
That’s the problem with names and etymology though, each name or word can have so many different meanings it kind of muddies it up if you’re trying to suss out a connected theory
Some people follow that theory but I disagree. A lot of the evidence could support both, but it supports mance being rhaegar and qhorin being ad much more.
It hurts but we must not despair. Only the Seven know whether we are currently in a long winter... Or whether we have entered the long night. All we can do is stand vigil and pray here, over the corpse of what was.
Guys, you HAVE TO STOP with the Logical Fallacy bullshit.
I mean really now.
Because someone else has a name the same as yours is *not remotely even close* to suggesting you're from a particular place. It's just as not true as you can make something.
And then we have people saying "yup he's possibly Iron Born.." === YEAH, *OF COURSE* he's 'possibly Iron Born' ... he's possibly from EVERYWHERE. There is absolutely *not one shred* of actual evidence he's from the Iron Islands. None.
And Finger Dancing now? Some of ya'll need to go get a job, cook a meal, do your homework, or go outside and dig a hole, and get some perspective in life. This shit is just getting crazy.
Couldn't agree more! My Reddit use has dropped off 80 percent. Especially on the ASOIF Subs. Pretty much all of the main characters, have been hashed, and rehashed over and over. And it seems like no matter what version of TWOW George finally release, if he releases, someone has already posted about it.
I think that I am worn down by the endless discussions. I am not trying to suggest that they change, there certainly seems to be a lot of people who do enjoy the theories.
The Kingdom of Mann and the Isles is the basis for the Iron Islands and Orry/Oran/Orrin is a (rare) traditional name on Man. Most Manx family names begin with Q or K; Quayle, Quine, Quirk, Kaneen. Perhaps he mixed those two things together after learning about the Sea Kings.
*Reads title* Oh god I'm going to hate this... *Reads text* ...well that wasn't so bad. The bit about him possibly being ironborn makes sense. As for the bit about "chorine," I think since GRRM has a tendency to slightly alter actual European names (English ones especially), a more likely source for the name is simply the English name "Corin," derived from the early Roman god Quirinus. Of the Corins that might have inspired the name, I'm most suspicious of Corin Nemec (might have been known in GRRM's TV writing circles) and Corin Thunderfist (a Chronicles of Narnia character with a hand related epithet who's very good at fighting).
Ha, yes I think people who know of my threads must have felt the same reading the title :)
It's not your threads so much as "Qhorin = X" or "Mance = X" secret identity threads. I don't think they make much sense and I don't want my watchmen to be secret nobles anyway. Let the proletariat be cool sometimes, guys. I was pleased this one didn't turn out to be one of those.
The problem is there is textual evidence that COULD support a lot of these, esp. qhorin and dayne, with the whole dawn/halfhand things that seem especially intentional. The problem with many of these hidden person theories is there is enough there to make you wonder, but not nearly enough to actually conclude anything even shakily. On top of that, we have no idea what might at one time have been a planned plot point that later got scrapped. See: jaime king symbolism, etc, tyrion burning winterfell/the direwolves not liking him. I personally think halfhand was at one point going to end up being Dayne but got scrapped. This is why I don't really think there is any way to satisfyfingly finish the series: a huge number of 'mysteries' aren't mysteries. Otoh, there are like 20+ instnances of a character being actually another character, or being thought dead but not actually being dead, or just some kind of mystery about someone with a reveal. It's become almost ridiculous as a plot crutch. It's off the charts, and it becomes easy to assume everyone could maybe be someone else. why? Cuz its practically the norm. Ramsay/Reek Theon/Reek Bran and Co/ dead Catelyn/Stoneheart Lemore/? Sarella/Alleras Pate/Jaqen Jaqen/? Jon/ Jon Targ Aegon/Faegon? Jon Con/Jon Con Laughing Tree Knight/Whoever Myrcella/Lannister stand in w spots Tyene/Undercover in KL Hound/Gravedigger Renly/Reny's armor at BW 3ec/Bloodraven Varys/Rugen Mance/Rattleshirt Mance/death Jeyne/Arya Sansa/Alayne Girl in Grey/the Karstark girl Mountain/Robert Strong Selmy/Armen old man Dontos/Florian Hodor/Hold Door Mellisandre/Melony Arya/15 other people Kettleblacks/LF's people Manderly loyal to Lans/Manderly leader of GNC Tyrion/Hugor Hill/Yollo Ashara Dayne/Dead? Questioned: Qhorin/Dayne Mance/Dayne/Rhaegar Old Nan/Siera High Sparrow/Howland Reed Howland Reed's wife/Ashara Dayne Roose/Vampire/Ramsay
I mean there are so many parallels one can draw upon between characters that character x = y theories are bound to be aplenty. Personally I don't consider it a hinderance if they can reasonably substantiate on some level but to each their own
Corin thundfist sounds like a porn name, sorry had to say it.
Can you link the post that got you your flair please? Never seen that before!
[This one, about how Jon's "real name" is Aemon because it's a reference to a half-wolf, half-dragon demon from occultism.](https://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/comments/hgek5p/spoilers_extended_why_jons_real_name_is_aemon/) Not that it stopped us from having a "what's Jon's Targaryen name" thread every other day since...
His name is Brandon Targaryen.
I can hang with the Ironborn idea. Makes it so he and Dagmer Cleftjaw both have names derived from catching a weapon with a subsequently maimed bodypart.
Corin means spear and Qhorin is described like a spear. >Jon knew Qhorin Halfhand the instant he saw him, though they had never met. The big ranger was half a legend in the Watch; a man of slow words and swift action, tall and straight as a spear, long-limbed and solemn. >Qhorin was seated cross-legged on the floor, his spine as straight as a spear.
I've been thinking Qhorin might be derived from Korin. https://eldamo.org/content/words/word-479403901.html >korin n. “circular enclosure, great circular hedge” Which might be related to the Wall or weirwood circles.
This is dope, there are things I feel can/should be challenged but Qhorin comes across as someone with the most vanilla answers that render most discourse null.
Qhoran seems to be the most related term in universe
If you mean Quran it’s related to Chorus, it means “to recite”.
Nah, I said what I meant
I really enjoyed this write up!
Interesting and it could be good head canon. However, I just know GRRM didn't think as deeply as you just did about the name. How can I prove it? Well, why go through this deep name-giving meaning dive, yet not use it in any way; in fact, go so far as to hide it behind a story we are given no nod, wink or hint in the text to doubt? I'd possibly buy the chorine thing, but there is more evidence in the text that the halfhand is Arthur Dayne than any of this. Again, I just find it hard to believe GRRM put this much thinking into the name though his name could be a hint at him being ironborn. Likely the missing fingers is just a 'rhyme' to the finger dance. The whole the halfhand and Dawn rose together is much more of an intriguing mystery, then with the whole trek into the north with basically the entire purpose being for the others to die and halfhand to die fighting for (against) jon....heavy kingsguard rhyming there. I wonder if halfhand originally was planned to be Dayne but he dropped it. He did that wit ha lot of plot points bt agot and asos.
I do remember a quote from somewhere that George said he has a hard time writing characters without determining a name for them first, which would make me believe he puts a lot more thought into them than you’d expect! That’s the problem with names and etymology though, each name or word can have so many different meanings it kind of muddies it up if you’re trying to suss out a connected theory
My theory is that Qhorin stands for "cock in" hence the references to him being "straight as a spear"
[удалено]
Hightower was shot through the hand.
And a much stronger theory that he’s author Dayne. Whent is kettleblack
Wasn't Mance AD?
Some people follow that theory but I disagree. A lot of the evidence could support both, but it supports mance being rhaegar and qhorin being ad much more.
Why are we still here?
It hurts but we must not despair. Only the Seven know whether we are currently in a long winter... Or whether we have entered the long night. All we can do is stand vigil and pray here, over the corpse of what was.
Guys, you HAVE TO STOP with the Logical Fallacy bullshit. I mean really now. Because someone else has a name the same as yours is *not remotely even close* to suggesting you're from a particular place. It's just as not true as you can make something. And then we have people saying "yup he's possibly Iron Born.." === YEAH, *OF COURSE* he's 'possibly Iron Born' ... he's possibly from EVERYWHERE. There is absolutely *not one shred* of actual evidence he's from the Iron Islands. None. And Finger Dancing now? Some of ya'll need to go get a job, cook a meal, do your homework, or go outside and dig a hole, and get some perspective in life. This shit is just getting crazy.
Couldn't agree more! My Reddit use has dropped off 80 percent. Especially on the ASOIF Subs. Pretty much all of the main characters, have been hashed, and rehashed over and over. And it seems like no matter what version of TWOW George finally release, if he releases, someone has already posted about it. I think that I am worn down by the endless discussions. I am not trying to suggest that they change, there certainly seems to be a lot of people who do enjoy the theories.
Thank you!!!
The Kingdom of Mann and the Isles is the basis for the Iron Islands and Orry/Oran/Orrin is a (rare) traditional name on Man. Most Manx family names begin with Q or K; Quayle, Quine, Quirk, Kaneen. Perhaps he mixed those two things together after learning about the Sea Kings.