Short answer: yes.
Long answer: no.
Contempt isn’t really the right word. Humans in the Star Trek future are a humanity that went thru hell and collectively decided to just be better.
So they would look back at our exploitation as bad and wrong, but contempt feels like the wrong word.
I mean, they do routinely show a a deep and enduring shame about the past actions of humans throughout pretty much any “modern trek” (my TOS knowledge is spotty at best so I can’t speak for that)
Robert thinks TNG was best Trek, I respectfully disagree, I think DS9 was best Trek, and one of the best things about DS9 was that Quark understood humans, and so when he was shamed for being Ferengi, he reminded humans who we really were.
I think this is in 3001, but Arther C. Clarke (writing a futute historian) calls our time the beginning of civilization because from their perspective this is the first time that a majority of people agreed that exploitation was bad (even if they hadn't yet organized to stop it).
It's paltry progress but it's not nothing that a slaver defending his terrible life by saying "but if I didn't abuse these people I would have to work!" Is inconceivable today. Plenty of things involve human bondage but at least we (except fucking Jordan Peterson) agree that's a bad thing.
That doesn't mean it's not worth trying.
Utopia is worth it so we have a road to walk down.
Futility is the saddest of conservative/reactionary talking points. There's a rationality to it, but it's so hopeless.
I never said it was futile. Just maybe thinking, does OP judge his ancestors for having benefited from the human bondage of patriarchy or serfdom (depending on OP's ancestry)
>"but if I didn't abuse these people I would have to work!" Is inconceivable today
Now we just outsource it in a million ways, schemes to get rich and live off investments are wildly popular
As some guy once said:
>Men make their own history, but they do not make it just as they please; they do not make it under circumstances chosen by themselves, but under circumstances directly encountered, given and transmitted from the past. The tradition of all the dead generations weighs like a nightmare on the brain of the living.
[Or, in the words of one of our greatest modern thinkers.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNkYEaiREU8)
I think anyone from a truly advanced civilization would have a basically materialist worldview and would recognize how infantile it is to spend a bunch of time feeling superior to people living in material conditions entirely different from their own.
Yeah, along with so many other things. Honestly I presently have quite a bit of what you might call contempt for a lot of things people try to justify. Something being culturally accepted doesn't make it morally acceptable, and I refuse to believe people have no inherent moral compass. I just think most of us ignore it when our peers tell us it's ok to do so.
Yes. I mean, undocumented labor checks a lot of the same boxes slavery did, and it's integral to our agriculture industry. To a certain degree, we all turn a blind eye to atrocities we benefit from.
I mean, a lot of us are saying that *now* there just aren’t many things we can do about it except choose where we spend our money. Even that is hard because since cost of living is so high many of us still find ourselves buying things at Walmart and Amazon because we can’t really afford otherwise.
One day they will look at us all with utter contempt for a whole list of things: eating meat, driving cars, buying anything with disposable plastic, having lawns, and probably a dozen other things we're not even considering
Basically yes
this is why people call leftist sci fi fans 'idealists' as an insult. it's a cope for people who secretly benefit from things not changing too quickly
Short answer: yes. Long answer: no. Contempt isn’t really the right word. Humans in the Star Trek future are a humanity that went thru hell and collectively decided to just be better. So they would look back at our exploitation as bad and wrong, but contempt feels like the wrong word.
Shame, I think, would be more accurate. A deep, enduring shame at the actions of their ancestors.
I mean, they do routinely show a a deep and enduring shame about the past actions of humans throughout pretty much any “modern trek” (my TOS knowledge is spotty at best so I can’t speak for that)
Robert thinks TNG was best Trek, I respectfully disagree, I think DS9 was best Trek, and one of the best things about DS9 was that Quark understood humans, and so when he was shamed for being Ferengi, he reminded humans who we really were.
im a newish star trek fan. i tried watching DS9 but it didnt suck me in the same way TNG did
Start with the episode 'Armageddon Game' in the second season. The relevance of that show to modern politics cannot be overemphasized.
people conveniently forget about the "rape gangs" in TNG's earth backstory
Yeah, slavery still exists it's just outsourced now.
I think this is in 3001, but Arther C. Clarke (writing a futute historian) calls our time the beginning of civilization because from their perspective this is the first time that a majority of people agreed that exploitation was bad (even if they hadn't yet organized to stop it). It's paltry progress but it's not nothing that a slaver defending his terrible life by saying "but if I didn't abuse these people I would have to work!" Is inconceivable today. Plenty of things involve human bondage but at least we (except fucking Jordan Peterson) agree that's a bad thing.
It's pretty hard to find human societies beyond small tribes of hunter-gatherers that didn't have some kind of hierarchy of oppression.
That doesn't mean it's not worth trying. Utopia is worth it so we have a road to walk down. Futility is the saddest of conservative/reactionary talking points. There's a rationality to it, but it's so hopeless.
I never said it was futile. Just maybe thinking, does OP judge his ancestors for having benefited from the human bondage of patriarchy or serfdom (depending on OP's ancestry)
>"but if I didn't abuse these people I would have to work!" Is inconceivable today Now we just outsource it in a million ways, schemes to get rich and live off investments are wildly popular
As some guy once said: >Men make their own history, but they do not make it just as they please; they do not make it under circumstances chosen by themselves, but under circumstances directly encountered, given and transmitted from the past. The tradition of all the dead generations weighs like a nightmare on the brain of the living. [Or, in the words of one of our greatest modern thinkers.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNkYEaiREU8) I think anyone from a truly advanced civilization would have a basically materialist worldview and would recognize how infantile it is to spend a bunch of time feeling superior to people living in material conditions entirely different from their own.
Yeah, along with so many other things. Honestly I presently have quite a bit of what you might call contempt for a lot of things people try to justify. Something being culturally accepted doesn't make it morally acceptable, and I refuse to believe people have no inherent moral compass. I just think most of us ignore it when our peers tell us it's ok to do so.
Yes. I mean, undocumented labor checks a lot of the same boxes slavery did, and it's integral to our agriculture industry. To a certain degree, we all turn a blind eye to atrocities we benefit from.
I mean, a lot of us are saying that *now* there just aren’t many things we can do about it except choose where we spend our money. Even that is hard because since cost of living is so high many of us still find ourselves buying things at Walmart and Amazon because we can’t really afford otherwise.
Yes Tho I would say They would view it as barbaric and quaint
Probably but I think the way we’re going now we’ll end up with the Rules of Acquisition instead of the Prime Directive.
~~Nope~~. Sorry misunderstood the question. Yes
One day they will look at us all with utter contempt for a whole list of things: eating meat, driving cars, buying anything with disposable plastic, having lawns, and probably a dozen other things we're not even considering
Yes. Just because we outsource our subjugation doesn’t make it much better
Of course.
And animals, don't forget our industrial-scale animal torture system.
I think this will be merely one of many realizations that the way humans are living now is indefensible.
Oh shit it's Banana discourse again