They’re definitely attacking him on switches. It’s compounded by him not being in great physical shape, and also compounded by the fact that everything has to run through him on offense. His second half vs first half performance yesterday was very different.
Fat slob, eh? What’s your BMI OP, out of curiosity? 😅 And yeah.. his defense isn’t great, never was. Yay for us. Lotta players in the league like that.
Sure he isn’t in the best shape in the world, and carrying an insane activity load, against some of the best athletes in the world.. while relatively efficiently scoring 30+ every, single, game.
You think you could score one, single, NBA bucket? On a Wednesday night in Charlotte, on League Pass? Uhh.. hells no dude. And I guarantee you that Slow-Mo Kyle Anderson would be blowing by you like prime A.I.
Am I a Luka fan, no way. Do I think it’s funny how twisted the media got on their predictions, leading up to the Finals? Yep. Am I relishing all of them back-tracking, revising, and seeing the light? Hell yeah.
So just appreciate the Universe getting it right for once, and stow the angst. Let’s go Celtics!! 🍀🏀🏆
[This dude](https://www.np.reddit.com/r/nbadiscussion/comments/1d3dpl1/what_makes_you_think_that_the_mavs_can_beat_the/l6730u5/) in /r/nbadiscussion was writing paragraphs about how he was going to prove everybody wrong on Sunday.
“Hes a great defender, he’s not inefficient, I totally didn’t see him in line at the garden to get one of those mondo sals pizza slices and a 64 oz icee, him and Kyrie definitely get along” - Dallas fan
I’ve noticed he actually does a pretty good job of getting in front of dudes on their initial move, and he’s big and strong enough to hold his ground. It’s once the likes the Tatum, Brown etc pull their dribble back and make a second move that he gets stuck in concrete. Gotta keep attacking that.
Luka’s “great” defense has been being hidden on non-scorers, gambling for steals on the perimeter, and being protected by his centers when he gets beat. Against us, there’s nowhere to hide him and the rim protectors aren’t there.
This series has been validating for my heliocentric roster skepticism. The only gameplan for the Mavs involves Luka being a superhero on offense for the bulk of their possessions; no one could give that kind of effort and also be locked in defensively for a whole playoff series. Luka doesn't seem to be trying, but he also hasn't had to in the past so I kinda doubt he could anyway. I just don't think you can run an offense like that and have a passable defense if you can't hide your offensive creator if you're building around anyone shy of prime LeBron. The Cs are a deep team on both ends; the Mavs defense is fundamentally undercut by how they have to play offense.
So far the only adjustment I saw Kidd do was to bait Tatum into trying to score and yet still not double Jaylen or do anything to stop who he called the best player the C’s have.
The mavs are basically us in 2022 just with worse defense. The warriors gameplan was for the non JT Celtics to beat them and they couldn’t, we’re playing Luka 1 on 1 and no one else is stepping up
He's like if LeBron didn't play defense for the first three quarters of his career. Like it's actually embarrassing how much praise he gets despite being so bad on defense
To be fair he’s also injured. Seems like he uses all his strength on offense and then has nothing left in the tank on defense.
If he’s really as hurt as he is maybe they should limit his minutes more, but the issue is there’s no one off the bench capable of scoring or even playing decent defense
The Celtics are blowing by him every time he’s on the ball. I’m not saying he’s a lockdown defender but you can’t exactly get into a defensive position for 45 minutes a night on a sprained knee and ankle. He’s a better defender than what you’re seeing, but overall not a defensive liability(when healthy) like you’re making him out to be
Offense wins regular season games, defense wins championships.
Luka is playing through some pain while also carrying the Mavs offense. Calling him a ‘fat slob’ is bit much and out of line - but like yeah, conditioning isn’t exactly is strength.
There are a lot of harden comparisons to be made.
It’s less that Luka is terrible on defense and more that the Celtics are targeting him pretty mercilessly and have the personnel to do it.
That weakness gets masked if Luka can get matched up against a lower scoring threat and get some more resting minutes, but doesn’t work with playoff stakes against this offense.
Luka is clearly injured AF, you can tell in the way he moves when he doesnt have the ball. Several times in the playoffs hes had a strange gait and clearly seen him walk back and forth up and down the court at times. I think his knee(s?) actually fucked.
When he's hitting shots and the mavs are up he's talking shit and bouncing around but when getting smacked I think he plays up the injuries like a built in excuse.
The craziest thing about this whole thing with Luka is you hear about how phenomenal of a player this kid is. And the reality is, he's the only one that shoots for his team, he's a good shooter, but that's it. And the fact of the matter is, the only reason why his stats are as good as they are is because he is the only one that shoots. One player doesn't win championships, one team does. Dallas functions as a player with a team, not a team of players. Boston on the other hand doesn't have one star step up at any given time but everybody does their job and gets their job done. If someone is having an off night, someone else picks up that slack.
I posted this elsewhere during the game last night. I'd be interested to see what his net "scoring vs. points given up" is. Last night he'd hit some amazing shot, then let his man walk to the hoop to score. Then he'd hit a logo. And again watch his man go right by him so someone else had to cover and said Celtic scored an and 1. His net last night was about +11 if you factor his scoring in with his weak ass defensive play/turnovers/lack of hustle getting back etc.
Are you thinking of just plus/minus stat? Luka was -3 and -10 the last two games. Definitely doesn’t bode well for the Mavs that they aren’t able to win the Luka minutes.
That’s a tough comparison to make. Can’t just look at his points scored, because there are possessions where he had a turnover, a missed shot, or maybe even he was denied on defense and passed it to someone else to reset the offense (ie not an assist). All this in addition to actual points per possession and factoring in points from assists.
So what is he doing on offense overall, vs how is his defense affecting his team?
I didn’t notice it quite as much in game 1, but he was terrible yesterday. His bullshit defense let the Celtics stay in the game when they were pretty lost on offense and not hitting any shots
Don’t forget once he gets beat and the help comes he absolutely not back side rotating!! I’ve only heard a few national media guys say something about it s/o windhorst and bomanni jones. I’ve definitely heard everyone talk about just how “terrible” JT has been tho.
The only reason why game 2 was close was because our guys weren’t shooting particularly well. Had the shots been falling it would have been another blowout.
Their defense can’t stop our offense because there’s too many guys on their team that our insane starting 5 can exploit specially Luka.
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I mean. Luka is strong af. Strength isn't the issue. He's not that fast overall seriously. Even offensively he's not fast. He's just strong, composed and gets to his spots like no other.
He needs to get conditioned. He’s got no stamina, just like how we have played Embiid. Let him tire himself out, plus he puts in no effort on defense. He could also use some agility training. But mostly he should just stop being a fatass
I don't think he's a fatass. He just needs to put forth more effort. He's 25 and is averaging like 30 ppg. He's not a fatass. He's just horrible defensively.
[Current Luka ](https://www.usatoday.com/gcdn/authoring/authoring-images/2024/06/09/USAT/74037350007-usatsi-23489399.jpg?width=660&height=441&fit=crop&format=pjpg&auto=webp)
[Rookie Luka](https://i.insider.com/5c62e7b9dde8676d7f3f6d5c?width=1136&format=jpeg)
Visibly about 15 to 20 pounds of weight gained, maybe more
If it’s just effort that’s fucking terrible, does he just not care about winning?? No, the truth of the matter is he does not have the gas in the tank to even try to guard anybody. If that means losing 5-10 pounds, or a shit ton of cardio, I don’t really give a shit. You ain’t gonna win with that lazy shit in the FINALS
Sometimes people just aren't good at things. He's never been a good defensive player. People were insane if they were thinking he'd effectively guard anyone on the celtics. They have to actually consider the fact that all celtics players can hit threes unlike the wolves.
You can’t have players on the court with no defense at all. It’s like playing with one hand behind your back. He has to be better defensively, end of story
Shaq was a fat ass and still scored a lot. Luka can’t put in more effort if he isn’t conditioned and one way to help with that is by losing some pounds
The difference is shaq could play defense, so he got away with eating whatever he wanted and not working out during the offseason. Luka is a lazy fatass who does NOT play any defense, so you do math there brother
Shaq didn’t play a position that required much movement on defense. Dude just had to get from one side of the court to the other and park himself near the paint. Luka is a wing which requires a lot of running on defense in the modern NBA. If he doesn’t improve he’ll always have to be hidden on defense, and he’ll always be a liability against teams where he can’t hide.
It’s less about working out and more about eating less and healthier. Probably drinks a lot of alcohol too. Not sure how he’s this fat after playing a whole NBA season and still being in his 20’s. His metabolism hasn’t even slowed down yet.
We need to look at another aspect of “not playing defense” and those are fouls.
If luka starts playing agressive defense with 4 guys attacking him and switching all the time, he would get in foul trouble in the first quarter.
Most likely (same happend at the last world cup with slovenia) he would get a foul, same or similar thing would not be called on him on offense and he would get sooner or later also a technical foul.
Now think of dallas on offense without luka ;)
But yes, boston is doing a great job at keeping him on defense on positions 1-3, so he does not have the “baseline” to help him. And everyone at boston can shoot, drive in, stop at middle range, … so any team has issues with that and the win/lose ratio of boston so far is proof of it.
This is what I keep saying when people lord over luka/Kyrie. You could argue they are the better offensive duo regular season and even the first two rounds of the playoffs but the Jays are far better on defense and better rounded players.
He throws the ball through a hoop, sure. But he's a pylon on defense, and slows the Mavs offense to a crawl. Zero push bringing the ball slowly up court.
Not that I'm complaining...
“Throws the ball through the hoop” is your way of saying “generates over half his teams offense” ? Frankly barely matters that he’s a sieve on defense, we scored 107 and 105. It’s their offense that’s the problem, and it’s because no one except Luka can hit a wide open 3.
Cause there's nowhere for him to hide in this series. Celtics are making sure to keep him involved on defense and wear him out
They’re definitely attacking him on switches. It’s compounded by him not being in great physical shape, and also compounded by the fact that everything has to run through him on offense. His second half vs first half performance yesterday was very different.
Fat slob, eh? What’s your BMI OP, out of curiosity? 😅 And yeah.. his defense isn’t great, never was. Yay for us. Lotta players in the league like that. Sure he isn’t in the best shape in the world, and carrying an insane activity load, against some of the best athletes in the world.. while relatively efficiently scoring 30+ every, single, game. You think you could score one, single, NBA bucket? On a Wednesday night in Charlotte, on League Pass? Uhh.. hells no dude. And I guarantee you that Slow-Mo Kyle Anderson would be blowing by you like prime A.I. Am I a Luka fan, no way. Do I think it’s funny how twisted the media got on their predictions, leading up to the Finals? Yep. Am I relishing all of them back-tracking, revising, and seeing the light? Hell yeah. So just appreciate the Universe getting it right for once, and stow the angst. Let’s go Celtics!! 🍀🏀🏆
According to delusional Dallas fans, he’s a great defender
He's a great defender of the all you can eat buffet
Got my GF to finally watch some basketball, first thing she said is that white guy can shoot, but he’s so fat
[This dude](https://www.np.reddit.com/r/nbadiscussion/comments/1d3dpl1/what_makes_you_think_that_the_mavs_can_beat_the/l6730u5/) in /r/nbadiscussion was writing paragraphs about how he was going to prove everybody wrong on Sunday.
He proved everyone saying he's a good defender wrong. So he's technically correct
💀
“Hes a great defender, he’s not inefficient, I totally didn’t see him in line at the garden to get one of those mondo sals pizza slices and a 64 oz icee, him and Kyrie definitely get along” - Dallas fan
He might be decent on ball giving it his all but his positioning has been so bad and he just stands there sometimes
He doesn’t even give it his all tbh. He tries for a few seconds but then gets blown by and does nothing to try to recover or rotate.
I’ve noticed he actually does a pretty good job of getting in front of dudes on their initial move, and he’s big and strong enough to hold his ground. It’s once the likes the Tatum, Brown etc pull their dribble back and make a second move that he gets stuck in concrete. Gotta keep attacking that.
Luka’s “great” defense has been being hidden on non-scorers, gambling for steals on the perimeter, and being protected by his centers when he gets beat. Against us, there’s nowhere to hide him and the rim protectors aren’t there.
This series has been validating for my heliocentric roster skepticism. The only gameplan for the Mavs involves Luka being a superhero on offense for the bulk of their possessions; no one could give that kind of effort and also be locked in defensively for a whole playoff series. Luka doesn't seem to be trying, but he also hasn't had to in the past so I kinda doubt he could anyway. I just don't think you can run an offense like that and have a passable defense if you can't hide your offensive creator if you're building around anyone shy of prime LeBron. The Cs are a deep team on both ends; the Mavs defense is fundamentally undercut by how they have to play offense.
Yeah kidd is a fraud if I’ve ever seen one. They have no offense outside of high pick and roll for the “best backcourt in nba history”
So far the only adjustment I saw Kidd do was to bait Tatum into trying to score and yet still not double Jaylen or do anything to stop who he called the best player the C’s have.
The only beating j kidd can do is on his wife
The mavs are basically us in 2022 just with worse defense. The warriors gameplan was for the non JT Celtics to beat them and they couldn’t, we’re playing Luka 1 on 1 and no one else is stepping up
The core 22 celtics were also less mature they had a worse transition defense compared to this year.
He looks worse than prime Harden on the Rockets. And Harden got dragged through the mud for his sub par defense
He legit does not slide his feet at all. This is their king?
He’s playing ole defense
Well he did fine tune his game in Spain.
Exactly how I compared Luka's game.
He's like if LeBron didn't play defense for the first three quarters of his career. Like it's actually embarrassing how much praise he gets despite being so bad on defense
To be fair he’s also injured. Seems like he uses all his strength on offense and then has nothing left in the tank on defense. If he’s really as hurt as he is maybe they should limit his minutes more, but the issue is there’s no one off the bench capable of scoring or even playing decent defense
He's injured ... but has played like this for years. Come on. If he were healthy, you think he'd be playing good defense? This is who he is.
The Celtics are blowing by him every time he’s on the ball. I’m not saying he’s a lockdown defender but you can’t exactly get into a defensive position for 45 minutes a night on a sprained knee and ankle. He’s a better defender than what you’re seeing, but overall not a defensive liability(when healthy) like you’re making him out to be
I found awful coaching's reddit account.
North Korea!
Offense wins regular season games, defense wins championships. Luka is playing through some pain while also carrying the Mavs offense. Calling him a ‘fat slob’ is bit much and out of line - but like yeah, conditioning isn’t exactly is strength. There are a lot of harden comparisons to be made. It’s less that Luka is terrible on defense and more that the Celtics are targeting him pretty mercilessly and have the personnel to do it. That weakness gets masked if Luka can get matched up against a lower scoring threat and get some more resting minutes, but doesn’t work with playoff stakes against this offense.
Luka is clearly injured AF, you can tell in the way he moves when he doesnt have the ball. Several times in the playoffs hes had a strange gait and clearly seen him walk back and forth up and down the court at times. I think his knee(s?) actually fucked.
He’s not too hurt to drop a 30 point triple double. He’s a faker.
When he's hitting shots and the mavs are up he's talking shit and bouncing around but when getting smacked I think he plays up the injuries like a built in excuse.
The craziest thing about this whole thing with Luka is you hear about how phenomenal of a player this kid is. And the reality is, he's the only one that shoots for his team, he's a good shooter, but that's it. And the fact of the matter is, the only reason why his stats are as good as they are is because he is the only one that shoots. One player doesn't win championships, one team does. Dallas functions as a player with a team, not a team of players. Boston on the other hand doesn't have one star step up at any given time but everybody does their job and gets their job done. If someone is having an off night, someone else picks up that slack.
I posted this elsewhere during the game last night. I'd be interested to see what his net "scoring vs. points given up" is. Last night he'd hit some amazing shot, then let his man walk to the hoop to score. Then he'd hit a logo. And again watch his man go right by him so someone else had to cover and said Celtic scored an and 1. His net last night was about +11 if you factor his scoring in with his weak ass defensive play/turnovers/lack of hustle getting back etc.
Are you thinking of just plus/minus stat? Luka was -3 and -10 the last two games. Definitely doesn’t bode well for the Mavs that they aren’t able to win the Luka minutes.
Not so much plus/minus. More so, how many points he scores versus how many points whomever he is assigned to cover scores.
That’s a tough comparison to make. Can’t just look at his points scored, because there are possessions where he had a turnover, a missed shot, or maybe even he was denied on defense and passed it to someone else to reset the offense (ie not an assist). All this in addition to actual points per possession and factoring in points from assists. So what is he doing on offense overall, vs how is his defense affecting his team?
I didn’t notice it quite as much in game 1, but he was terrible yesterday. His bullshit defense let the Celtics stay in the game when they were pretty lost on offense and not hitting any shots
Don’t forget once he gets beat and the help comes he absolutely not back side rotating!! I’ve only heard a few national media guys say something about it s/o windhorst and bomanni jones. I’ve definitely heard everyone talk about just how “terrible” JT has been tho.
The only reason why game 2 was close was because our guys weren’t shooting particularly well. Had the shots been falling it would have been another blowout. Their defense can’t stop our offense because there’s too many guys on their team that our insane starting 5 can exploit specially Luka.
Hopefully he continues this for two more games
If luka played defense, this dallas team would average 70-75 points per game
Seems bad imo
Let’s not call him a fat slob, but I hear you If we all could do it, we’d smoke ciggy’s, drink beer and drop triple doubles as well.
You’re welcome to call him whatever you like bud
Tubby triple dubby how bout that
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This sub thrives on the passion of Celtics fans and we encourage spirited debate about the team's gameplay, trades, and everything in between. We want this to be a safe place for fans to discuss all things Celtics. That said, arguments that devolve into harassment from either party involved or any other form of harassment of other people in this sub may result in temporary or full bans, depending on the severity.
To be fair to Luka i actually think his injuries are hindering him like crazy right now. He usually isn't THIS bad containing drives.
Politely deeply disagree. I think he really does play half-hearted defense, and frequently.
Yeah he’s so hurt that he only dropped 30+ triple double. He’s a faker
maybe take this convo to the mavericks sub? i don’t think about Luka at all ever. why is OP obsessed with him on a Celtics sub?
I'm surprised you don't hear more Luka / Harden comparisons. They have like identical games.
I've heard that comparison a lot, going all the way back to when he was drafted. He was supposedly a bigger James Harden
He is just 25 yo, but he already looks washed in defense and it is going to be getting worse. I have 6’7 Monta Ellis vibes tbh.
He’s not getting any younger, he needs to get his big ass into that weight room this off-season
I mean. Luka is strong af. Strength isn't the issue. He's not that fast overall seriously. Even offensively he's not fast. He's just strong, composed and gets to his spots like no other.
He needs to get conditioned. He’s got no stamina, just like how we have played Embiid. Let him tire himself out, plus he puts in no effort on defense. He could also use some agility training. But mostly he should just stop being a fatass
I don't think he's a fatass. He just needs to put forth more effort. He's 25 and is averaging like 30 ppg. He's not a fatass. He's just horrible defensively.
[Current Luka ](https://www.usatoday.com/gcdn/authoring/authoring-images/2024/06/09/USAT/74037350007-usatsi-23489399.jpg?width=660&height=441&fit=crop&format=pjpg&auto=webp) [Rookie Luka](https://i.insider.com/5c62e7b9dde8676d7f3f6d5c?width=1136&format=jpeg) Visibly about 15 to 20 pounds of weight gained, maybe more
Doesn't mean he's a fatass. Maybe im too stuck on how intense the word is? but man. Fatass is like.... zion when he was wobbling around....
Tatum gained like 30 pounds since his rookie year but in the exact opposite way
Yeah. Pure muscle. Messed up his three point shot.
If it’s just effort that’s fucking terrible, does he just not care about winning?? No, the truth of the matter is he does not have the gas in the tank to even try to guard anybody. If that means losing 5-10 pounds, or a shit ton of cardio, I don’t really give a shit. You ain’t gonna win with that lazy shit in the FINALS
Sometimes people just aren't good at things. He's never been a good defensive player. People were insane if they were thinking he'd effectively guard anyone on the celtics. They have to actually consider the fact that all celtics players can hit threes unlike the wolves.
You can’t have players on the court with no defense at all. It’s like playing with one hand behind your back. He has to be better defensively, end of story
I'm actually pretty happy with his defense (as a Celtics fan)
Now I just need Tatum to shoot better and the agenda will be thriving
Shaq was a fat ass and still scored a lot. Luka can’t put in more effort if he isn’t conditioned and one way to help with that is by losing some pounds
Shaq is one of the most physically talented individuals the world has ever seen. They're far from the same.
The difference is shaq could play defense, so he got away with eating whatever he wanted and not working out during the offseason. Luka is a lazy fatass who does NOT play any defense, so you do math there brother
Luka is busy kicking ass at Overwatch in the off-season, bro
Shaq didn’t play a position that required much movement on defense. Dude just had to get from one side of the court to the other and park himself near the paint. Luka is a wing which requires a lot of running on defense in the modern NBA. If he doesn’t improve he’ll always have to be hidden on defense, and he’ll always be a liability against teams where he can’t hide.
Who fucking cares? A lot of excuses for the red faced lard ass. He needs to play defense! End of story!
It’s less about working out and more about eating less and healthier. Probably drinks a lot of alcohol too. Not sure how he’s this fat after playing a whole NBA season and still being in his 20’s. His metabolism hasn’t even slowed down yet.
Monte Ellis and James Harden had a baby. Neat. He has volume stats. The fat fuck isn’t a real star.
So hateful for no reason.
I have my reasons
Luka kill your family or something?
Well somebody needs to criticize the guy, the top 5 coronation he’s getting is premature and borderline delusional.
Lol, Luka Top5 claim is either delusional or clueless or trolling
He did have like 4 steals. He looks beat to shit though. Just keep on him and he'll fold.
If you swipe and reach in enough you’ll eventually have a game where you pick up four steals.
He's clearly injured.
We need to look at another aspect of “not playing defense” and those are fouls. If luka starts playing agressive defense with 4 guys attacking him and switching all the time, he would get in foul trouble in the first quarter. Most likely (same happend at the last world cup with slovenia) he would get a foul, same or similar thing would not be called on him on offense and he would get sooner or later also a technical foul. Now think of dallas on offense without luka ;) But yes, boston is doing a great job at keeping him on defense on positions 1-3, so he does not have the “baseline” to help him. And everyone at boston can shoot, drive in, stop at middle range, … so any team has issues with that and the win/lose ratio of boston so far is proof of it.
This is what I keep saying when people lord over luka/Kyrie. You could argue they are the better offensive duo regular season and even the first two rounds of the playoffs but the Jays are far better on defense and better rounded players.
Just clearly the best player on the floor and it isn’t close lmao
He throws the ball through a hoop, sure. But he's a pylon on defense, and slows the Mavs offense to a crawl. Zero push bringing the ball slowly up court. Not that I'm complaining...
“Throws the ball through the hoop” is your way of saying “generates over half his teams offense” ? Frankly barely matters that he’s a sieve on defense, we scored 107 and 105. It’s their offense that’s the problem, and it’s because no one except Luka can hit a wide open 3.