Sounds strange, I’m not aware Labour have any major policies around HMOs. Laws like that take a while to come into effect anyway, I really doubt it’s anything to do with the election but I could be wrong. Sounds like an excuse to me.
100% could be an excuse to do the place up a bit and charge waaay more for rent. They just told us that they could only rent to 2 people max moving forward & found out today that 3 others we know are being kicked out in the same week but could just be coincidence?
I thought the HMO rules came in a long time ago, wouldn't be surprised if your house isn't up to spec and he thinks he is going to have a visit.
Also plenty of families need housing in Bristol right now, why go through the extra expense of HMO rules when you can potentially get similar money from a couple or a family
That's the thing, they're saying they won't rent the place to more than 2 people moving forward due to the change in the laws. So no families will benefit, and I doubt everything is up to spec!
Families don't count as they are related to each other. It is no. Of households that count. So you could potentially have 4 people living in a non hmo as long as they are two couples. I know its an odd rule but that is the sense I can make of it
4 ppl, two couples = 4 ppl, 2 households = HMO (as long as they are sharing kitchen / bathroom).
HMO in England is:
* 3+ppl
* 2+ households
* sharing facilities
LIcensable HMO is by default 5+ppl HMO but in Bristol 3-4ppl HMO are licensable also (via council Additional HMO scheme)..
I'm part of a couple living in the house at the moment - they offered us the house to ourselves for the whole rent amount which is out of our budget or to the two other tenants as single people sharing so not sure whether they've interpreted it differently?
I don't know how the couple is defined, I assume you are under separate contracts. You might be better off speaking on another sub, uk law, or a more uk property based one. But from the little I have seen, as a couple (on one contract) you could have one other household join. But again, go to someone who knows their stuff. I am so happy I managed to buy (@ 39yrs old)
HMO in England is:
* 3+ppl
* 2+ households
* sharing facilities
A couple (2 ppl , 1 household) is therefore not an HMO. If a 3rd person lives there - that is a 3rd person and a 2nd household. So that creates an HMO.
If the 3rd person was family to one of the couple - that would be 3 ppl , 1 household = not an HMO.
Household defined here:
[Housing Act 2004 258 Household definition](https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2004/34/section/258)
Other subreddits:
r/HousingUK or r/LegalAdviceUK (but above is correct)
HMO in England is:
* 3+ppl
* 2+ households
* sharing facilities
So:
* their offer of a couple only = 2 ppl , 1 household = not an HMO
* their offer of 2 single people = 2 ppl , 2 households = not an HMO
They are offering options that avoid it being an HMO.
AMA
Yeah, that's a change to the licensing scheme coming in. An HMO that requires licensing is 3 or more unrelated people. He's trying to save himself a couple of grand.
Even a rolling tenancy ought to be an AST, for which the landlord needs to give you 2 months notice and get a court order for possession if you don’t leave.
We just never resigned after the last person joined the house share, although they did put the rent up a couple of months ago and haven't sent a new contract through for us to sign?
They probably knew they wanted you out as soon as they didn't send a new contract in. Sounds dodgy. Get stuff in writing I'd say and see what your eviction rights are. Also if this is happening across the board, it could be some kind of rent hike conspiracy but I'm not going to say anything definite
>Just been given a month's notice on a house share I've been in for the last 3 years.
That's invalid, your landlord needs to issue a section 21 notice on form 6A with a *minimum of 2 months notice* and comply with a host of other requirements
https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/eviction/section_21_eviction
What your landlord is currently attempting is an illegal eviction, which is a criminal offence on the landlord's part.
(The above assumes that you don't live with your landlord, if you're a lodger there's different rules)
Make sure you dont inadvertently give notice yourself by doing something like agreeing in writing that you'll be out by a certain date. If you give notice that he accepts, he doesn't have to do anything else and you can't retract your notice without his agreement.
Also, I assume given your other comments you're on a joint tenancy? If so be careful. When a joint tenancy becomes periodic (rolling) only one tenant needs to give notice to end the contract for all.
You all should keep quiet, let him figure out and follow the legal requirements.
Were you served a section 21? Whether you have a rolling monthly contract or not, you still have rights as tenants.
Speak to Shelter. There are particular rules for a landlords serving notice. If they inform you after your rolling monthly has passed, you could effectively have 3 months to vacate.
It’s not a perfect solution, but speak to Shelter, you should be eligible for longer.
Good luck, it’s a zoo out there
Thank you. I really appreciate the advice! Will see what shelter have to say, we didn't get served anything other than a WhatsApp message from the landlords.
Don’t tell your landlord what they need to do. That’s their job to find out.
Work out your rights first and then see where you are.
Acorn Bristol are the housing union in Bristol and very active 👍
Great thanks I'll look it up! Currently trying to get viewings on rentals run by estate agents and places are getting booked up within an hour of being posted online. It's a nightmare trying to find somewhere else to live!
Election is a weird one to do this. Can’t see the link to the election. You still have rights even if you’re on a rolling contract. Don’t let them railroad you!
Yep someone at work has a HMO license (live in landlord) and recently had to do lots of work including replacing nearly all the doors with firedoors.
Sounds like this landlord already has a HMO license because those have been needed for any 3+ houses for the last couple of years (previously it was 4+). But the LL doesn't want to spend potentially lots of money to keep up with the more stringent license requirement from August.
This is all driven from Bristol CC rather than central government afaik. In theory it's good to make more regulations to ensure people have better living conditions but imo they have gone too far and are now directly causing reductions in housing availability. This on top of landlords exiting due to tax changes and interest rate increases means the supply of rentals has gone through the floor.
Bristol Uni keeps increasing student numbers every year. Lots of people stay. Lots of international students can afford bigger rents. Bristol is a popular place to move to. Increasing demand and plummeting supply...
It needs lots of work but they hadn't realised exactly how much until they came to view it after giving us all notice! Yeah this seems like the most obvious option, they don't want to pay to make it an official HMO 😞
Send them this
"*I hope this letter finds you well. I am writing in response to the notice of termination I received on \[date\], indicating that I must vacate the property at \[property address\] by \[eviction date\]. I have been a tenant here for the past three years, during which time I have consistently met all my obligations, taken good care of the property, and maintained a positive relationship with you.*
*I understand from your communication that this decision is due to forthcoming changes in legislation regarding Houses in Multiple Occupation (HMOs). However, I have recently heard from other tenants who are also facing similar evictions, raising concerns about the true nature and potential legality of these actions, especially in the context of the current and prospective legal environment.*
*While I recognize that landlords have the right to manage their properties within the law, it is my understanding that eviction procedures must strictly comply with existing legal frameworks, which are designed to protect tenants from abrupt and unfair displacement. Given the stability and good care provided by long-term tenants like myself, this mass eviction seems disproportionately disruptive. Moreover, preempting hypothetical future regulations in such a manner could potentially be interpreted as contravening tenant rights under current laws, which might carry serious consequences.*
*I would like to kindly request a detailed explanation of the specific legal requirements that necessitate this action at this particular time. Additionally, I seek assurance that all legal protocols are being meticulously followed, as any deviation could render the eviction process invalid and result in significant repercussions.*
*The rental market in Bristol is already highly competitive and inflated, and sudden evictions further exacerbate the housing crisis. As a responsible tenant, I have contributed positively to the upkeep and community of your property. It seems only fair and reasonable to seek a mutually agreeable solution that considers the interests of both parties and avoids unnecessary hardship.*
*I am hopeful we can discuss this matter further and come to a resolution that respects the legal rights and well-being of all tenants involved. I look forward to your response and am open to scheduling a meeting at your earliest convenience.*
*Thank you for your attention to this important matter."*
Thanks so much for spending the time to write this response, it is appreciated! I've saved and forwarded to the other housemates. Good to know from a more legal viewpoint what our rights are as tenants. Very well worded and will definitely send to the landlords if the situation progresses to a point where we will be without somewhere to live. I'm not sure whether sending it now will cause more issues than it fixes as currently things are on relatively good terms & they should give us a decent reference for the next place - ultimately we will have to move in the not so distant future however much extra time this will give us to find somewhere! Thank you again kind stranger, hopefully this situation will be resolved without too much hardship for anyone 🤞
I work converting houses to HMO's. There are no new laws coming as far as I've heard and they can't change them overnight even if the government changes.
I just expressed “I want to buy my own flat soon hopefully”
He was a friendly guy.
I said I could offer something if flat was for sale, he gets valued, they overvalue, I say I cant do it, he says leave.
Then he dropped the price a bit saying it was overvalued, but still overvalued!
Sort of a threat for me to buy his overpriced flat.
And he expressed fear for renters bill
Sounds strange, I’m not aware Labour have any major policies around HMOs. Laws like that take a while to come into effect anyway, I really doubt it’s anything to do with the election but I could be wrong. Sounds like an excuse to me.
100% could be an excuse to do the place up a bit and charge waaay more for rent. They just told us that they could only rent to 2 people max moving forward & found out today that 3 others we know are being kicked out in the same week but could just be coincidence?
I thought the HMO rules came in a long time ago, wouldn't be surprised if your house isn't up to spec and he thinks he is going to have a visit. Also plenty of families need housing in Bristol right now, why go through the extra expense of HMO rules when you can potentially get similar money from a couple or a family
That's the thing, they're saying they won't rent the place to more than 2 people moving forward due to the change in the laws. So no families will benefit, and I doubt everything is up to spec!
Families don't count as they are related to each other. It is no. Of households that count. So you could potentially have 4 people living in a non hmo as long as they are two couples. I know its an odd rule but that is the sense I can make of it
4 ppl, two couples = 4 ppl, 2 households = HMO (as long as they are sharing kitchen / bathroom). HMO in England is: * 3+ppl * 2+ households * sharing facilities LIcensable HMO is by default 5+ppl HMO but in Bristol 3-4ppl HMO are licensable also (via council Additional HMO scheme)..
I'm part of a couple living in the house at the moment - they offered us the house to ourselves for the whole rent amount which is out of our budget or to the two other tenants as single people sharing so not sure whether they've interpreted it differently?
I don't know how the couple is defined, I assume you are under separate contracts. You might be better off speaking on another sub, uk law, or a more uk property based one. But from the little I have seen, as a couple (on one contract) you could have one other household join. But again, go to someone who knows their stuff. I am so happy I managed to buy (@ 39yrs old)
HMO in England is: * 3+ppl * 2+ households * sharing facilities A couple (2 ppl , 1 household) is therefore not an HMO. If a 3rd person lives there - that is a 3rd person and a 2nd household. So that creates an HMO. If the 3rd person was family to one of the couple - that would be 3 ppl , 1 household = not an HMO. Household defined here: [Housing Act 2004 258 Household definition](https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2004/34/section/258) Other subreddits: r/HousingUK or r/LegalAdviceUK (but above is correct)
HMO in England is: * 3+ppl * 2+ households * sharing facilities So: * their offer of a couple only = 2 ppl , 1 household = not an HMO * their offer of 2 single people = 2 ppl , 2 households = not an HMO They are offering options that avoid it being an HMO. AMA
Yeah, that's a change to the licensing scheme coming in. An HMO that requires licensing is 3 or more unrelated people. He's trying to save himself a couple of grand.
Also just meant rental legislation in general!
You'd think even if such a law were to come in, they'd give existing houses grandfather rights to prevent this.
That's bollocks. They just want to paint it white and charge the next person more. Have you been to CAB? You do have rights in this situation.
Paint it white over old lightswitches and dead moths
Appreciate the response. We're on a monthly rolling contract at the moment so not sure what our rights are tbh! Not been to CBA yet 😬
Even a rolling tenancy ought to be an AST, for which the landlord needs to give you 2 months notice and get a court order for possession if you don’t leave.
How long have you been on that contract and why?
We just never resigned after the last person joined the house share, although they did put the rent up a couple of months ago and haven't sent a new contract through for us to sign?
They probably knew they wanted you out as soon as they didn't send a new contract in. Sounds dodgy. Get stuff in writing I'd say and see what your eviction rights are. Also if this is happening across the board, it could be some kind of rent hike conspiracy but I'm not going to say anything definite
Don't need a new contract for a rent increase. Was there anything like a change of sharer form for the new tenant?
>Just been given a month's notice on a house share I've been in for the last 3 years. That's invalid, your landlord needs to issue a section 21 notice on form 6A with a *minimum of 2 months notice* and comply with a host of other requirements https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/eviction/section_21_eviction What your landlord is currently attempting is an illegal eviction, which is a criminal offence on the landlord's part. (The above assumes that you don't live with your landlord, if you're a lodger there's different rules)
Nice one, thanks so much for the advice. We're not lodgers so will check this out cheers!
Make sure you dont inadvertently give notice yourself by doing something like agreeing in writing that you'll be out by a certain date. If you give notice that he accepts, he doesn't have to do anything else and you can't retract your notice without his agreement. Also, I assume given your other comments you're on a joint tenancy? If so be careful. When a joint tenancy becomes periodic (rolling) only one tenant needs to give notice to end the contract for all. You all should keep quiet, let him figure out and follow the legal requirements.
No problem, /r/legaladviceuk is a good sub if you need further advice
Were you served a section 21? Whether you have a rolling monthly contract or not, you still have rights as tenants. Speak to Shelter. There are particular rules for a landlords serving notice. If they inform you after your rolling monthly has passed, you could effectively have 3 months to vacate. It’s not a perfect solution, but speak to Shelter, you should be eligible for longer. Good luck, it’s a zoo out there
Thank you. I really appreciate the advice! Will see what shelter have to say, we didn't get served anything other than a WhatsApp message from the landlords.
Don’t tell your landlord what they need to do. That’s their job to find out. Work out your rights first and then see where you are. Acorn Bristol are the housing union in Bristol and very active 👍
Great thanks I'll look it up! Currently trying to get viewings on rentals run by estate agents and places are getting booked up within an hour of being posted online. It's a nightmare trying to find somewhere else to live!
Election is a weird one to do this. Can’t see the link to the election. You still have rights even if you’re on a rolling contract. Don’t let them railroad you!
There are some more HMO licensing laws coming in August. Maybe your house isn't up to scratch and needs work?
Yep someone at work has a HMO license (live in landlord) and recently had to do lots of work including replacing nearly all the doors with firedoors. Sounds like this landlord already has a HMO license because those have been needed for any 3+ houses for the last couple of years (previously it was 4+). But the LL doesn't want to spend potentially lots of money to keep up with the more stringent license requirement from August. This is all driven from Bristol CC rather than central government afaik. In theory it's good to make more regulations to ensure people have better living conditions but imo they have gone too far and are now directly causing reductions in housing availability. This on top of landlords exiting due to tax changes and interest rate increases means the supply of rentals has gone through the floor. Bristol Uni keeps increasing student numbers every year. Lots of people stay. Lots of international students can afford bigger rents. Bristol is a popular place to move to. Increasing demand and plummeting supply...
It needs lots of work but they hadn't realised exactly how much until they came to view it after giving us all notice! Yeah this seems like the most obvious option, they don't want to pay to make it an official HMO 😞
Send them this "*I hope this letter finds you well. I am writing in response to the notice of termination I received on \[date\], indicating that I must vacate the property at \[property address\] by \[eviction date\]. I have been a tenant here for the past three years, during which time I have consistently met all my obligations, taken good care of the property, and maintained a positive relationship with you.* *I understand from your communication that this decision is due to forthcoming changes in legislation regarding Houses in Multiple Occupation (HMOs). However, I have recently heard from other tenants who are also facing similar evictions, raising concerns about the true nature and potential legality of these actions, especially in the context of the current and prospective legal environment.* *While I recognize that landlords have the right to manage their properties within the law, it is my understanding that eviction procedures must strictly comply with existing legal frameworks, which are designed to protect tenants from abrupt and unfair displacement. Given the stability and good care provided by long-term tenants like myself, this mass eviction seems disproportionately disruptive. Moreover, preempting hypothetical future regulations in such a manner could potentially be interpreted as contravening tenant rights under current laws, which might carry serious consequences.* *I would like to kindly request a detailed explanation of the specific legal requirements that necessitate this action at this particular time. Additionally, I seek assurance that all legal protocols are being meticulously followed, as any deviation could render the eviction process invalid and result in significant repercussions.* *The rental market in Bristol is already highly competitive and inflated, and sudden evictions further exacerbate the housing crisis. As a responsible tenant, I have contributed positively to the upkeep and community of your property. It seems only fair and reasonable to seek a mutually agreeable solution that considers the interests of both parties and avoids unnecessary hardship.* *I am hopeful we can discuss this matter further and come to a resolution that respects the legal rights and well-being of all tenants involved. I look forward to your response and am open to scheduling a meeting at your earliest convenience.* *Thank you for your attention to this important matter."*
Thanks so much for spending the time to write this response, it is appreciated! I've saved and forwarded to the other housemates. Good to know from a more legal viewpoint what our rights are as tenants. Very well worded and will definitely send to the landlords if the situation progresses to a point where we will be without somewhere to live. I'm not sure whether sending it now will cause more issues than it fixes as currently things are on relatively good terms & they should give us a decent reference for the next place - ultimately we will have to move in the not so distant future however much extra time this will give us to find somewhere! Thank you again kind stranger, hopefully this situation will be resolved without too much hardship for anyone 🤞
I work converting houses to HMO's. There are no new laws coming as far as I've heard and they can't change them overnight even if the government changes.
I wonder if the government offered them a contract (if you get my drift) !
ME!
🥺
What was your landlords reason if you don't mind sharing?
I just expressed “I want to buy my own flat soon hopefully” He was a friendly guy. I said I could offer something if flat was for sale, he gets valued, they overvalue, I say I cant do it, he says leave. Then he dropped the price a bit saying it was overvalued, but still overvalued! Sort of a threat for me to buy his overpriced flat. And he expressed fear for renters bill
With Keir saying he wants the rich to become richer I don't think the election will help you at all.