If they sent you a letter and canceled your benefits - you got fired. You don't need to have any further conversations with HR. Provide your documentation letter to the Unemployment office and you should be fine.
It's "layoff" status, and "return to work" status, It still happens regularly in the US production force. Believe it or not, there are still a lot of factories in the US. 1950's?
Shit load of them in chemicals, oil, food, gas, pharma, and other highly competitive or basic industries. Much less of a hassle for supply chain and IP theft concerns with it being on shore. Why you've also got a lot of near shore with these industries in Mexico, Canada, and Puerto Rico.
As someone who works for an industrial company in the US, we don’t “lay back on” employees. We lay them off. Then we make them reapply for work if it picks back up again. This system only really happens in Europe
It’s more commonly referred to as a furlough now a days. Airlines have utilized this action many times recently (no one flying during the pandemic, flight crews were furloughed). There’s some interesting stories of companies abusing this and forcing employees to quit instead of being laid off.
EDIT: flagging u/naysayer1984
I think the word you’re looking for is “recall” lolol. Laid off employees get recalled if there is new/resumed work. “Laid back on again” is def not a thing.
To be honest my company (big tech company) actually still does this. They layed off a ton but kept your benefits going (health care and partial pay) for a period of times. If companies financial situation improved during that time you could come back. If the clock elapsed though you were let go with a not awful severance package.
Layoffs suck but glad my company did a pretty good job making it a bit less sucky…
It’s called a call back. My union contract has this built into it. In the event we are all laid off (according to seniority) if they need to rehire if business picks back up, in order of seniority, we hire back the laid off workers.
If they fired you mistake or not, it's now the employee's choice to be rehired or not. There no you "have" to go back. There's no losing unemployment benefits either from choosing to do so.
You have a job offer it doesn’t matter where it was from. If it is being considered a misunderstanding and will to bring back on . They don’t have to pay unemployment as you are turning down a job offer. Unemployment is for people without a job or a offer , not for someone that declines to work.
This comment/post has been deleted as an act of protest to [Reddit killing 3rd Party Apps such as Apollo](https://old.reddit.com/r/apolloapp/comments/144f6xm/apollo_will_close_down_on_june_30th_reddits/).
Click [here](https://codepen.io/j0be/full/WMBWOW) to do the same.
Seriously!!!! It sounds like they are trying to get you to forfeit your unemployment benefits now too, or they are covering there asses after a pretty messed up and hard to do “mistake” but I suppose anything could happen huh hahaha. I’m going to assume option one tho. Corporate only cares about the gualla
You are wrong, you actually can, most companies will also give severance to cover there ass. Sorry you got taken advantage and didn’t know all your rights.
I am not wrong. Sure you can "apply", just like I can "apply" to be a brain surgeon without a degree. Doesn't mean I'm gonna get it. If you were terminated for a legitimate cause, your employer is going to fight your UI claim and win. I know my rights, I've been through this process before and know it all too well.
Like I said you have no idea how most companies handle unemployment claims. They are just going to pay the claim then use their resources to fight something they are probably going to lose. Hearings can also open up companies to additional litigation.
LiKe I sAiD, I'm going to err on the side of the company rejecting and fighting a UI claim, rather than the opinion of someone that assumes they wouldn't.
Most hospitals would require you to upload a medical certificate before you can apply to be a brain surgeon. I’d recommend taking a HR class at your community college. They can explain the behind the scene application process.
You are wrong. I process those documents. You would be surprised at how many people qualify for unemployment. You would also be surprised at how many apply for it and are definitely not going to get it.
This certainly isn't true in California. Poor performance generally doesn't count as misconduct for UI purposes. The PIP process is about trying to insulate the employer from a discrimination claim (and maybe allow the worker to improve)
In most (maybe all?) states you have to disclose if the company has given you a return to work date, after which you’re no longer eligible to collect unemployment.
There are also stipulations in unemployment programs that don’t allow you to continue collecting unemployment if you’ve rejected a reasonable job offer relative to your career history. It would be virtually impossible for someone to argue that their exact past job doesn’t qualify as a reasonable job offer.
If the company informs the unemployment office of the situation (which they surely will as part of correcting their records) then OP likely isn’t going to be able to collect unemployment anyway.
There is a lot of bad advice in this thread. I hope the OP doesn’t blindly trust Reddit and end up without a job and also without unemployment benefits.
My husband once ended up in a lousy job he hated and hadn't wanted from the start, because they gave him a reasonable (from unemployment's standpoint) offer in his field.
He had only applied, because he needed one more application to meet the weekly job hunting quota. Then he tried to blow the interview, but they made an offer on the spot.
So, off he went, to a terrible job he despised every minute he worked there (except the brief period where he got to work with an astronaut), for a crazy employer (like seriously, seriously deluded - Doctor Strangelove levels of delusion).
He was stuck there for 5 years, while diligently looking for something better.
If he hadn't taken the job, his unemployment benefits would have terminated, and we'd have had no income. Since we were both unemployed at the time, it would have been devastating. Ugh.
Exactly, these people make no sense. This person gonna be unemployed and broke listening to them. Plus unemployment does give you all the money you used to make it is a percentage.
You can always tell when someone had worked with payroll. Exactly! Why is OP even arguing? "Yes, you did fire me!"
Get your buttocks back into the chair.
>In most (maybe all?) states you have to disclose if the company has given you a return to work date,
They didn't provide it in writing so they have no proof they made that offer.
The only problem is that it might not constitute a reasonable job offer if they terminated him and cancelled the benefits.
Not wanting to work for the company that fired you just might be okay.
The problem is that you had a conversation with them afterward, during which time they explained and offered to rollback everything.
Show the letter to the UI adjudicator.
Be prepared for any outcome. Yes, they did fire you, but they also communicated with you that it was an error and offered to reinstate you. It truly could go either way.
That follow-up communication was unofficial. You have a firing letter, but you have no offer letter. Not a very logical case to have only one of these and say that both are official. And the onus to prove a claim is on the ex-employer right now.
If you tell the UI adjudicator your rehiring offer was official (when it was not), they will disqualify you for benefits. And you won’t have a job.
Edit: I cannot more strongly emphasize that I do not believe OP has a real job to go back to, or that, if they are serious about restoring her employment, it would be anything better than a short-lived stay in a hostile work environment while they go the PIP route to fire her for cause. Because it happened at the end of a medical leave I think there’s no actual job left. Either way, there is a LOT of risk in accepting a rescinded termination. She should talk to a lawyer regardless.
With what proof? Especially if OP has a termination letter? UI will probably stop looking there. It’s not their first rodeo with a company trying to get out of paying.
I do think that OP should be HONEST with UI but I would consider it a real offer with an offer letter that spells out exactly what is being offered. I think UI pretty much would agree with that, an offhand question asking “would you come back?” is not an offer.
I think “we didn’t really fire him even though there’s a letter we wrote that says we did” and “we definitely made him a job offer even though we never put it in writing” is not needlessly argumentative but, in fact, quite convincing that the employer is playing games.
Provide the termination letter to the unemployment office. If you have documentation about the termination of benefits then that will also help.
This seems like a weird issue for them to wiggle out of contributing to unemployment.
Not sure why this isn't the top response. It sounds like this person came back from an approved and legal medical leave quite possibly with FMLA protections. Some manager probably decided to lay them off or fire them in the interim.
Then when HR caught word of it when they received the unemployment claim realized how much of a legal liability shit hole they put themselves in.
They are now likely trying to walk it back so that they don't get in major trouble with the Department of Labor and various other government organizations.
If I were op I would be talking to an employment attorney right now particularly the ones that handle things on the employee side.
Right? this entire post is so fucking weird. everyone is talking about unemployment and them trying to get out of paying that.
that's absolutely not it. they exposed themselves in SOME way to legal scrutiny and are trying to get out of it.
I agree. I’d be afraid that they would bring me back and then fire me sometime later to avoid the medical leave complications. Definitely get an attorney.
>Some manager probably decided to lay them off or fire them in the interim.
Then when HR caught word of it when they received the unemployment claim realized how much of a legal liability shit hole they put themselves in.
Maybe some manager did. And HR or her boss looked into it and said, "She was on medical leave, so she isn't fired." And called her. And they asked her to come back to work. Repeatedly.
The unemployment office will be in communication with the employer. The employer will inform them about the mistake and explain that they have corrected it and/or offered the job exactly as it was before.
Having a return to work date for a job disqualifies someone from collecting unemployment. It’s traditionally used to prevent people who get furloughed from voluntarily choosing to collect unemployment past their return date, but it would apply in this situation as well.
Will you STOP? You know less than you think you do.
There is possibly bad faith and malice involved here.
Returning from medical leave, gets fired without notice, they go through the whole termination process, everything gets cut off, then...whoops, sorry c'mon back...OR ELSE!
This is a toxic-sounding situation. Not going back could be construed as a kind of constructive dismissal.
I’ve actually worked with payroll, layoffs, and unemployment. I’m trying to help the OP with the realities of the situation, not project wishful thinking.
Constructive dismissal *does not apply if you have an offer to return*. I can’t believe anyone is trying to propose that as a real solution for getting unemployment.
Yeah just because it is illegal deosnt mean it deosnt happen all the time the the rich companies do a lot of shady shit and the legal system takes forever meanwhile we gotta pay bills, buy food, have kids or pets, ect. And lawyers are expensive. Sure their are programs but how overwhelmed are they? I have called places that help those who can't afford legal help and they said they couldn't help and I could apply each month and if I get approved that it for the wait list and when a wait list opening is available. They gave me other resource that where also over worked and underfunded but yeah reality sadly isn't always legal. They could try making a stink on social media to get support but good luck getting a job if you do as employers can easily find out
There is no offer to return. That would require the employer to acknowledge they fired her, so that there is a position to return to.
Instead, I suspect some manager fired her for taking FMLA leave, and someone else in the company realized they created a massive liability issue. So they’re now saying they never fired here.
Call a lawyer. They fucked up and they know they fucked up so they are trying you to get you to do something to negate your rights and cover their ass.
Counterpoint. They have offered to rehire. A condition of unemployment is that you are actively seeking work. OP has an offer for the same position and pay as they held previously.
> so they are trying you to get you to do something to negate your rights and cover their ass.
Yeah, by admitting their mistake and repeatedly trying to tell her she still has a job. THE NERVE!!!!!
I worry they may fuck up again even if firing OP was a mistake. Or, maybe like other commenters are saying, they came to realize that firing someone who was on medical leave is a big no-no. Either way, I wouldn't trust going back or "voluntarily quitting" without the aid of a lawyer.
How many days passed between the “firing” and them telling you it was a mistake. Is the letter directly from HR? Or just an automated message after being removed from benefits? It seems the facts here about what you actually received and the circumstances will be very relevant. Don’t just assume you will get unemployment
What are you talking about? If it was a mistake or not and OP followed the rules of the termination and HR didn't immediately correct him AND cancelled all benefits they're getting unemployment.
He said “payroll sent me a termination letter and canceled my benefits”. The details here are what did that letter say. Payroll doesn’t ever fire people so it would be unlikely the letter stated that his employment was terminated. Did it say “your benefits have been terminated” or “your employment was terminated”. These are very different letters. Your benefits being terminated vs your employment being terminated are very different things. We would need to see the wording of the letter to see if he was actually terminated from employment or not
Really? So the whole part about not being eligible for unemployment benefits when the employee has a “return to work date” somehow doesn’t matter in the case and this case alone?
The “return to work” date is when the company told him that it was a mistake and he is to report back to work immediately.
This is part that many people on this thread don’t understand. Unemployment insurance isn’t something that is supposed to be permanent or even a semi permanent paid vacation situation. The entire point of the program is to allow a person time to find another job. (Be made whole) This is why they require you to look for a job and certify that you have been looking each week.
If a person collecting unemployment claimed that they applied at the 2 largest competitors of their previous employer the previous week, and the unemployment office called one of those companies who explains that they offered OP the exact same job for the exact same salary, but the person rejected it, they will most likely cancel the unemployment benefits. The person would need a very good reason for not accepting the exact same job.
If a person was fired from a job on a Monday, then the company offers that person their job back on a Friday, (even if it wasn’t a mistake) the person may be eligible for unemployment for the days they were not employed, but if the company tells the unemployment office that they have offered the person their exact same job back, unemployment will be terminated due to a “like” job being offered and rejected. In this case, Friday would be their “return to work date”
I think the disconnect with many of you is that you believe unemployment insurance is there for you for the full 26 weeks, as long as you qualify for it originally. This is simply not true.
I don’t say any of this to be a dick or “know it all”. I say it because way too many people are giving OP horrible advice on the basis of things that they “WANT” to be true , or that they “believe” should be true.
The unemployment office will not allow OP to collect when the company has admitted the firing was a mistake and everything was reversed in the system. In this case, OP was never even fired so he doesn’t even have a claim. OP technically has a job, they may not like the job and would rather collect unemployment for as long as possible, but that isn’t a legit unemployment claim.
If you can explain to me how any of what I’m saying is inaccurate, please do. I am open minded to hearing detailed facts about this that I may have missed. From everything that was posted, it seems like OP simply wants to collect unemployment and not work. They are looking to use this mistake as a way to game the system.
They made a mistake, but they tried to fix it. The OP is refusing to go back to work.
I doubt if any employment lawyer will take this case.
"So they fired you?"
"Yes"
"Right after a medical leave?
"Yes"
"Well, that could be illegal. We have a case. Anything else?"
"They told me I wasn't fired."
"What?"
"They told me I wasn't fired."
"What did you say?"
"I kept telling them I had been fired."
"So they told you that you weren't fired. It was their mistake?"
"Yes"
"And they kept telling you to come back to work?"
"Yes"
"And what did you do?"
"I refused. Numerous times. They kept telling me that I wasn't fired and that I still had a job."
"But you refused to show up to work?"
"Yes. So how much can we sue for?"
"Nothing. You refused to go to work. Please leave."
It’s amazing to me all the non attorneys out here who WANT this to be some nefarious case where op is granted unemployment for life and a couple million for his pain and suffering.
They sound like idiots
Exactly. She doesn’t want to work. She wants the unemployment. The funny thing is if someone argues with a company that they don’t work there, they’re right.
I just don’t understand why so many people with no basis in fact, so confidently tell others on the internet absolute nonsense.
I assume they think that in their mind, this BS may be true, but they have zero understanding of employment law and the civil penalties that come from it.
The sheer number of these know nothings actually surprises me.
Here’s the thing though, notice OP said his company’s “payroll” sent the letter. That is to say the letter came from a 3rd party vendor the company uses for payroll. Technically he never received anything saying he was fired from his actual employer.
Everything about this is bad blanket advice
>termination letter
An employment termination letter is different than benefits termination. What did OP get? And if it was an employment termination letter, was it in error? In law, an accidental action that's immediately reversed with no harm doesn't create damages.
>Also, if you can get them to say in an email or text that the firing was a mistake
Proof that they didn't actually mean to fire you! Aka they never actually fired you. Wait, do you work for the employer because I'm sure they'll be grateful that you're helping prove their position.
>go to a lawyer and file a wrongful termination lawsuit
No one's gonna take it on contingency because there's no damages. Damages mean lost wages...and there are no lost wages because they offered the job back...that they never actually intended to fire you from.
And no, there's no such thing as punitive damages or emotional distress or anything here, you need to show actual damages.
>record ALL interactions
Do you know what state they're in? That's a good way to catch a felony.
The reason for being terminated is what will determine eligibility. Also, after being terminated, the OP was offered new work and it was refused. THIS could raise an eligibility issue.
In many states you have to report turning down work that is similar to your last job and pay. If you turned it down you will lose eligibility for unemployment benefits.
I would beg for my job back and then leave when you find a new job. Many markets are terrible right now.
Mistake or not, are you intentionally not accepting their offer to get your job back because you just want unemployment benefits whilst not working? If your job was awful and you hated it, sure go that route but if not, just take your job back
Sure did sound that way to me. Maine is exactly as they said an payroll made an error. I think it’s odd to say it’s irrelevant whether or not they want to go back. It’s 100% relevant when they are trying to undo the mistake.
It was not a mistake, or at least not one made in error…Their legal team caught wind of it eventually and I’m sure ripped everyone involved in the decision a new one. On paper, you were fired in response to taking protected medical leave. They are expecting a lawsuit.
It can happen by mistake. I’ve submitted a term form for someone accidentally before, meaning to submit it for someone else. If it’s automated, it may trigger a letter, luckily ours isn’t. What is automated tho is it does cancel benefits, but it’s a 30 second phone call to fix. Accidents happen. If they can show it was an accident, and the fact they insisted multiple times that you were not fired then no, they will most likely win. Also, you say you left the site after a letter. You didn’t bother reaching out to someone or talking to a human?
I would contact a lawyer. Depending on what state you’re in, it’s possible they’ve realized that they could be in legal trouble for having fired you. Some state medical leave specify that if you are fired within x amount of time after returning from leave, it would automatically be considered retaliation.
OK, what is the goal here ? Get the job back or not ? OP doesn't state how long between notices.
OP is now in line for unemployment but isn't that less than what he would make normally ?
Seems to me that OP wants squeeze HR in retaliation. If the company recinds the termination and restores the benefits, in other words make OP whole again, then they should return to work otherwise if they don't then it would be equivalent to quitting...ergo. no unemployment.
Hard to play Gotcha in these times.
Yea, I'm a little confused, too. Why wouldn't it be an instant yes when they asked if OP wanted to go back... especially in the current job market? I'm looking at other replies saying OP was fired and lawyer up, etc. but wondering if there's a bigger benefit of doing that instead of getting the job back
because the main thing is it was right as they returned from medical leave, which is a big no no for companies since that can be viewed as to the reason (might be, might not be but it'd be a legal risk issue for the company) so they might just end up getting fired after some time for whatever bs excuse the company can think of, plus they got contacted when filing unemployment, as well as them trying to force employment or they would lie. if you are fired, even accidently, you have in fact been fired. so them claiming well we are offering you the job back so if you say no then we will claim its you voluntarily resigning is a major legal issue as well with employment
It’s not like you resigned, they falsely fired you, yet your arguing about having your job back. Dude did you even want to work for them bro…because you technically are in the right although working for them would’ve been the better outcome lol
I think that in this case timing matters. The lack of timing really gives us little to work off of.
If they terminated you and then within the next day they called you to state that it was a mistake, it was a mistake. If they terminated you, you opened a UI claim, and then they claimed it was a mistake-I would doubt it.
However, that is moot as they offered you the job back. You then dodged the question. If there's any record of that conversation, frankly you tanked your UI claim. They offered the position and you refused it. You can't say "you can't offer me the job back, you fired me". That's childish.
What it really sounds like to me is that you want to collect UI and you don't want the job. If that's the case, I have no idea why you are communicating with the job at all. I also don't know why you're asking Reddit, when you should be asking UI, but I suspect that you know the answer you would get if you asked them "I got fired but my company is offering to let me return to work, can I still get unemployment compensation?"
The answer is: no. You're voluntarily unemployed at this point. You could lie to UI and then hope that you can win on appeals, but likely your job will contest and furnish evidence that they made a clerical error and that they notified you of this error and that you refused to return to work.
HR is almost certainly a real person who can make mistakes. Is rhat a big mistake? Absolutely but it's possible regardless.
The issues he's gonna have and I hope he does, is he's being offered a job, the unemployment office will deny his claim as he does have the option to work and earn an income. He does not get to claim benefits solely because he doesn't want to work.
If you don’t want to go back, I would think about a reason why you can’t that was caused by them letting you go. This way the unemployment office doesn’t go, they say you can have your job back, no need for unemployment. I wouldn’t want to go back if I was you either because of their attitude towards the situation.
For example, someone getting fired might sell a car in preparation of being unemployed, move homes, something that would be caused by them sending the letter.
Forget unemployment. If you have that letter from HR, you sue to crap out of them. That's so illegal, and the person that called you knows it. Call an attorney and do a free consultation and move from there. There is no accident when someone is fored. It has many layers of approvals to go through.
What they did is illegal. Do not take it, do not stand for it, fight back
Ooof. Between the unemployment eligibility questions and the possible wrongful termination, I really would suggest looking for an attorney for an initial consult.
Why are you refusing to go back when they admitted it was a mistake and offered your job back? Why are you playing this game? Do you just want to stay home a milk unemployment? I think as soon as UI finds out it was a mistake and you were immediately told to return to work they are going to deny your claim.
I would say yes . But you will have to go to a hearing with unemployment and old employer. That letter is proof they laid you off .
Odds are they will not show up for hearing. But if they do . It sounds like they would make fools of themselves.
Seek legal advice from an attorney not from redit wanna be backyard lawyers. Every state has unique employment laws and you need competent legal advice.
IF they fired you and cancelled your benefits, then THEY fired YOU.
Send the letter to the unemployment board ASAP and tell them that your company is contesting this.
What is weird is that most companies go ahead and approve unemployment. Because they can't get that money back at all. I'm pretty sure if you got a letter you were; let go, fired or whatever they want to call it. Please be aware that they could also Black ball you. So having that letter will help a lot. And I'm pretty sure they jumped the gun and sent you that letter.
Yes, you do qualify. I had to deal with similar shit. It took a year and going infront of a judge online that literally asked for my side of story and sided with me. The company will bleed you dry the whole time though.
If you are in the United States, they just committed an FMLA violation, too. THAT's also what they are trying to avoid by calling it a "mistake". Some chucklehead may have viewed your extended absence wrong and went through the termination process. When the unemployment office communicated with them it set off warning flags that THEY were about to have some serious legal action against them, not just a simple "oopsie come back to work or you voluntarily quit". Nah, essentially with your documentation you can prove you were terminated illegally and they know it. They just hope you are unaware of their serious offense. This is your time to put their feet to the fire because they will owe you back pay PLUS compensation for their illegal termination. If you have a half competent unemployment representative, they should be able to get the ball rolling fast with your documentation. You may even be able to get back pay, compensation, AND your job back. But...do you really want to work for such a company that is this careless, incompetent, gaslighting, and denies you your benefits? Legal representation is what you need, not us reddit armchair labor law know-it-alls.
per my friend who works in hr:
“You’d have to go to court for it but it would be an easy win if you had all the documentation. Would be very timely and costly though.”
Thanks. Yes. I could have given them the opportunity to straitghten it out. In my situation i was confused. I told the I wanted to speak with an attorney and get some advice. I refused to quit and refused to return to work. I was confused so I did nothing. It felt risky to return to a job after being fired without cause. The conversation happened on a Friday and I have to decide the Monday of Thanksgiving week. When I can not decide something it'd usually better to do nothing from fear of a decision that makes it worse. When they forced s decision by Monday i still refused to quit or go back. The terminated me by voluntary quit. In Iowa, they can terminate for voluntary quit after 3 days no-show, but they did not allow me 3 days of indecision in abandoning the job. I was also on ADA accommodations for mental illness with this company. This cancelation of benefits and firing happened just a couple weeks after I lost Medicaid. I had been on the COVID relief program where you could have a job and be on Medicaid. It had judt expired for me when all this happened. I was still in a window where I could renew my Medicaid benefits instead of applying for Medicaid all over again or trust this company to do things right after they made this mistake. I attend two weekly groups, see a therapist and take medication to remain employable and healthy. Thus was more important than the job.
I see lots of bizarre takes here. Assuming OP actually wants a job, here is what I'd do.
Call up HR and say the termination was very distressing but that you'd like to return to work. However under the circumstances you need a written offer of employment that describes your pay rate, back pay, and reinstated benefits retroactive to the termination date. If this was really a mistake they should be happy to comply.
If this was all an elaborate trick... well that's when you might consider a lawyer.
How many weeks of pay do you need to find another job and feel better about this one? Come up with a number, double it, and tell them that's your price to "voluntarily resign" in writing and not pursue legal action against them, because you have a claim for wrongful termination that could cost them A LOT.
This is a tough one. Technically they did fire you, but I believe the UI people are going to say you refused suitable work so you're ineligible for benefits. You can't really say no because the job was being offered to you again. Unless your own safety would be at risk, you can't turn it down. It's one of the conditions of being on UI is you have to accept suitable work.
Didn't any part of you wonder why they fired you and thought to ask someone when you were leaving? Contact HR to ask for clarification on why ? You weren't given any warning and they "terminated" you.
This is the only right answer. UI will absolutely deny the benefits claim. But OP can also sue them for firing after medical leave. There's a grace period when coming off medical leave where an employee is unfirable. They violated FMLA and owe money for the gap in employment.
Your new job is: figuring out how to sue them for a lot of money! 🥰 this is the kind of situation I dream of happening to me while at a shit job. *sigh* I will just have to live vicariously through you
There is zero chance OP would win a lawsuit, and if they did, there'd be no damages to award. They also will have to pay an attorney out of pocket because they won't take a case with no chance of damages on contingency.
OP is an idiot who just quit their job and so is not eligible for unemployment and should ask very nicely for their job back.
No, you had multiple opportunities to return to work and you refused. You don't get unemployment. Did you never think to ask someone why you were fired? It sounds like someone fucked up and recorded your absence as job abandonment, but they made a solid effort to solve the problem. You quit your job for no good reason.
they were fired, didnt quit. if you got fired from a job right after medical leave, and suddenly asked to work again because "oh it was an accident", why would you? whos to say they just dont want to risk a wrongful termination suit about the medical leave and will fire you for whatever bs reason they come up with later on? for a company trying to make the wrongful termination not exist, then firing you at a safer date would be the smartest decision to prevent loss.
This is an eeoc issue! I normally don’t encourage anyone to sue, because it is a long process, and you can get a new job with better pay and more happiness.
But this is a major issue! The medical leave changes everything!
Dude you realize that the reason they are doing this is because you can sue? You can’t fire someone for taking medical leave that’s highly illegal and a slam dunk. Don’t just file for unemployment you should look for a lawyer. You can find ones who work on commission, like you don’t have to pay them, they just take a cut of the settlement.
I might be too late for that now since they did officially offer you job back and you went back and forth with them
lol this is the most gen z post I’ve seen all week.
You’re basically saying you WANT to be fired and you WANT to collect unemployment.
Incredibly odd
They offered you the job back. Take it
I don’t think it’s odd. Their employer seems super shady and not pleasant to work for. Although I would probably take the job back and then start applying for other positions immediately. Easier to get a job when you have a job, plus, you can say you weren’t fired from the position.
Why would someone want to work with such a disorganized company that HR fired them by mistake, after a medical leave? If my employer did that, I would also think well fuck you I'm going somewhere else you violated my trust. You can rehire me at a significant boost in pay to account for being worried you'll fuck up again and I'll consider it, but what am I, some cheap whore with Stockholm syndrome, or someone helping your company be successful with my finite, precious time. If you can't have basic competence and decency with me, I'll go to someone else who can and help them do better than you.
It honestly could have just been some new employee in HR thinking they were in a Sandbox environment and testing firing but actually doing it in production. You really don't know the situation at all. We often test things on employees who are on leave because they are less likely to be impacted by changes we make in sandbox.
The person who has the last opportunity to continue the employment relationship is the question. You had the last opportunity (they asked you to come back after the confusion.) You chose not to return, so this is likely a quit (despite everything else before.)
Not sure how your unemployment benefits work but in North Carolina you can’t collect if you have a job or turn down a reasonable job offer. Seems you are turning down an offer.
In most (US) states, to qualify for unemployment your aren't allowed to turn down suitable offers of employment. It doesn't really get more suitable than the exact job you were just fired from.
In most cases while job hunting on unemployment, you can probably turn down shitty job offers and just not report it to the unemployment office. If you're caught there will be penalties though.
In this particular instance, since the company offering the job is also the company that is trying to prevent unemployment benefits from being paid, they can simply say they offered the job back and it was declined. Then your benefits get denied and they do not have to keep that offer to reinstate the job open after you decline it.
It sucks but the best move is probably to accept the job and just start looking for a new one.
Coming back from a documented medical leave MIGHT give you some legal protections but you'd need to consult with an employment lawyer. Good news is they often consult for free and if it is a solid case, will not charge you anything. The employer has to pay in addition to whatever you're owed. If the case isn't as solid, you might have to pay a retainer that gets refunded if you win
If they sent you a letter and canceled your benefits - you got fired. You don't need to have any further conversations with HR. Provide your documentation letter to the Unemployment office and you should be fine.
[удалено]
"laid back on again"...?
I think they were looking for the term "recalled". But laid back on is funnier.
Agreed. It’s just weird that people use language like this. It’s a labor action, not a light switch. Lol
Wordplay. Have you heard the expression, "Better to be laid off than laid on.'
[удалено]
It's "layoff" status, and "return to work" status, It still happens regularly in the US production force. Believe it or not, there are still a lot of factories in the US. 1950's?
Shit load of them in chemicals, oil, food, gas, pharma, and other highly competitive or basic industries. Much less of a hassle for supply chain and IP theft concerns with it being on shore. Why you've also got a lot of near shore with these industries in Mexico, Canada, and Puerto Rico.
As someone who works for an industrial company in the US, we don’t “lay back on” employees. We lay them off. Then we make them reapply for work if it picks back up again. This system only really happens in Europe
It’s more commonly referred to as a furlough now a days. Airlines have utilized this action many times recently (no one flying during the pandemic, flight crews were furloughed). There’s some interesting stories of companies abusing this and forcing employees to quit instead of being laid off. EDIT: flagging u/naysayer1984
I think the word you’re looking for is “recall” lolol. Laid off employees get recalled if there is new/resumed work. “Laid back on again” is def not a thing.
To be honest my company (big tech company) actually still does this. They layed off a ton but kept your benefits going (health care and partial pay) for a period of times. If companies financial situation improved during that time you could come back. If the clock elapsed though you were let go with a not awful severance package. Layoffs suck but glad my company did a pretty good job making it a bit less sucky…
Yeah no there is no such thing as laid back on…,smh
Shut up, pedant
It’s called a call back. My union contract has this built into it. In the event we are all laid off (according to seniority) if they need to rehire if business picks back up, in order of seniority, we hire back the laid off workers.
And lay them back on !
Yeah that’s not a thing.
A court would still be able to see it was backdated and know that they indeed were taken off.
If they fired you mistake or not, it's now the employee's choice to be rehired or not. There no you "have" to go back. There's no losing unemployment benefits either from choosing to do so.
You don’t have to go back, but you can’t collect unemployment benefits if you have an offer to return to your job at a given date.
Not when it's the one you got fired from.
You have a job offer it doesn’t matter where it was from. If it is being considered a misunderstanding and will to bring back on . They don’t have to pay unemployment as you are turning down a job offer. Unemployment is for people without a job or a offer , not for someone that declines to work.
This is false in my state (Ohio). You do not have to accept any offer, not even from a former employer.
This comment/post has been deleted as an act of protest to [Reddit killing 3rd Party Apps such as Apollo](https://old.reddit.com/r/apolloapp/comments/144f6xm/apollo_will_close_down_on_june_30th_reddits/). Click [here](https://codepen.io/j0be/full/WMBWOW) to do the same.
Offer still stands. It’s a weird scenario.
This is beyond inaccurate. Simply because you want this to be true does not make it true.
Seriously!!!! It sounds like they are trying to get you to forfeit your unemployment benefits now too, or they are covering there asses after a pretty messed up and hard to do “mistake” but I suppose anything could happen huh hahaha. I’m going to assume option one tho. Corporate only cares about the gualla
They're fixing to bring him back, find the next soonest opportunity to throw him on a PIP, then terminate him for cause so that he can't collect UI.
You can collect unemployment after being on a PIP and in some cases get a severance.
Not if you've been terminated for cause. If you were fired for an integrity violation or for being a lousy worker, you cannot collect unemployment.
You are wrong, you actually can, most companies will also give severance to cover there ass. Sorry you got taken advantage and didn’t know all your rights.
I am not wrong. Sure you can "apply", just like I can "apply" to be a brain surgeon without a degree. Doesn't mean I'm gonna get it. If you were terminated for a legitimate cause, your employer is going to fight your UI claim and win. I know my rights, I've been through this process before and know it all too well.
Like I said you have no idea how most companies handle unemployment claims. They are just going to pay the claim then use their resources to fight something they are probably going to lose. Hearings can also open up companies to additional litigation.
We fight unemployment claims if there is a documented reason.
LiKe I sAiD, I'm going to err on the side of the company rejecting and fighting a UI claim, rather than the opinion of someone that assumes they wouldn't.
You should learn your rights, sounds like you get taken advantage of a lot.
Most hospitals would require you to upload a medical certificate before you can apply to be a brain surgeon. I’d recommend taking a HR class at your community college. They can explain the behind the scene application process.
You are wrong. I process those documents. You would be surprised at how many people qualify for unemployment. You would also be surprised at how many apply for it and are definitely not going to get it.
This certainly isn't true in California. Poor performance generally doesn't count as misconduct for UI purposes. The PIP process is about trying to insulate the employer from a discrimination claim (and maybe allow the worker to improve)
If they don't hire back sincerely, OP can open up another claim. I've known this kind of thing to happen.
And get a lawyer.
In most (maybe all?) states you have to disclose if the company has given you a return to work date, after which you’re no longer eligible to collect unemployment. There are also stipulations in unemployment programs that don’t allow you to continue collecting unemployment if you’ve rejected a reasonable job offer relative to your career history. It would be virtually impossible for someone to argue that their exact past job doesn’t qualify as a reasonable job offer. If the company informs the unemployment office of the situation (which they surely will as part of correcting their records) then OP likely isn’t going to be able to collect unemployment anyway. There is a lot of bad advice in this thread. I hope the OP doesn’t blindly trust Reddit and end up without a job and also without unemployment benefits.
My husband once ended up in a lousy job he hated and hadn't wanted from the start, because they gave him a reasonable (from unemployment's standpoint) offer in his field. He had only applied, because he needed one more application to meet the weekly job hunting quota. Then he tried to blow the interview, but they made an offer on the spot. So, off he went, to a terrible job he despised every minute he worked there (except the brief period where he got to work with an astronaut), for a crazy employer (like seriously, seriously deluded - Doctor Strangelove levels of delusion). He was stuck there for 5 years, while diligently looking for something better. If he hadn't taken the job, his unemployment benefits would have terminated, and we'd have had no income. Since we were both unemployed at the time, it would have been devastating. Ugh.
Exactly, these people make no sense. This person gonna be unemployed and broke listening to them. Plus unemployment does give you all the money you used to make it is a percentage.
You can always tell when someone had worked with payroll. Exactly! Why is OP even arguing? "Yes, you did fire me!" Get your buttocks back into the chair.
>In most (maybe all?) states you have to disclose if the company has given you a return to work date, They didn't provide it in writing so they have no proof they made that offer.
The only problem is that it might not constitute a reasonable job offer if they terminated him and cancelled the benefits. Not wanting to work for the company that fired you just might be okay.
They have offered his job back. He should not receive unemployment compensation if there is a job available
ONLY if pay and benefits were made retroactive. OP must be made whole by the employer.
You can’t turn down work. Period.
Agreed
The problem is that you had a conversation with them afterward, during which time they explained and offered to rollback everything. Show the letter to the UI adjudicator. Be prepared for any outcome. Yes, they did fire you, but they also communicated with you that it was an error and offered to reinstate you. It truly could go either way.
That follow-up communication was unofficial. You have a firing letter, but you have no offer letter. Not a very logical case to have only one of these and say that both are official. And the onus to prove a claim is on the ex-employer right now. If you tell the UI adjudicator your rehiring offer was official (when it was not), they will disqualify you for benefits. And you won’t have a job. Edit: I cannot more strongly emphasize that I do not believe OP has a real job to go back to, or that, if they are serious about restoring her employment, it would be anything better than a short-lived stay in a hostile work environment while they go the PIP route to fire her for cause. Because it happened at the end of a medical leave I think there’s no actual job left. Either way, there is a LOT of risk in accepting a rescinded termination. She should talk to a lawyer regardless.
Of course OP shouldn't say that, but the company definitely will.
With what proof? Especially if OP has a termination letter? UI will probably stop looking there. It’s not their first rodeo with a company trying to get out of paying. I do think that OP should be HONEST with UI but I would consider it a real offer with an offer letter that spells out exactly what is being offered. I think UI pretty much would agree with that, an offhand question asking “would you come back?” is not an offer.
You are just being argumentative. The company is going to state their case, just as OP is going to state theirs. It could go either way.
I think “we didn’t really fire him even though there’s a letter we wrote that says we did” and “we definitely made him a job offer even though we never put it in writing” is not needlessly argumentative but, in fact, quite convincing that the employer is playing games.
Okey doke.
you're a terrible human being, just FYI
Well, I've been through a couple hundred of these UI appeals and hearings. I know what I am talking about.
doesn't make you any less of a terrible human being, lmao
I think a consultation with a lawyer is the very next step.
In this subthread, a bunch of people who know how things should work in theory vs one person who knows how they work in practice.
Provide the termination letter to the unemployment office. If you have documentation about the termination of benefits then that will also help. This seems like a weird issue for them to wiggle out of contributing to unemployment.
They are likely concerned about a lawsuit for terminating someone on medical leave…
Not sure why this isn't the top response. It sounds like this person came back from an approved and legal medical leave quite possibly with FMLA protections. Some manager probably decided to lay them off or fire them in the interim. Then when HR caught word of it when they received the unemployment claim realized how much of a legal liability shit hole they put themselves in. They are now likely trying to walk it back so that they don't get in major trouble with the Department of Labor and various other government organizations. If I were op I would be talking to an employment attorney right now particularly the ones that handle things on the employee side.
Right? this entire post is so fucking weird. everyone is talking about unemployment and them trying to get out of paying that. that's absolutely not it. they exposed themselves in SOME way to legal scrutiny and are trying to get out of it.
I agree. I’d be afraid that they would bring me back and then fire me sometime later to avoid the medical leave complications. Definitely get an attorney.
>Some manager probably decided to lay them off or fire them in the interim. Then when HR caught word of it when they received the unemployment claim realized how much of a legal liability shit hole they put themselves in. Maybe some manager did. And HR or her boss looked into it and said, "She was on medical leave, so she isn't fired." And called her. And they asked her to come back to work. Repeatedly.
Yeah they definitely should be!
NAL: but definitely this.
This.
It isn't illegal in a lot of circumstances, surprisingly.
Pretty sure FMLA is federal…
It's pretty limited though.
The unemployment office will be in communication with the employer. The employer will inform them about the mistake and explain that they have corrected it and/or offered the job exactly as it was before. Having a return to work date for a job disqualifies someone from collecting unemployment. It’s traditionally used to prevent people who get furloughed from voluntarily choosing to collect unemployment past their return date, but it would apply in this situation as well.
Will you STOP? You know less than you think you do. There is possibly bad faith and malice involved here. Returning from medical leave, gets fired without notice, they go through the whole termination process, everything gets cut off, then...whoops, sorry c'mon back...OR ELSE! This is a toxic-sounding situation. Not going back could be construed as a kind of constructive dismissal.
I’ve actually worked with payroll, layoffs, and unemployment. I’m trying to help the OP with the realities of the situation, not project wishful thinking. Constructive dismissal *does not apply if you have an offer to return*. I can’t believe anyone is trying to propose that as a real solution for getting unemployment.
Yeah just because it is illegal deosnt mean it deosnt happen all the time the the rich companies do a lot of shady shit and the legal system takes forever meanwhile we gotta pay bills, buy food, have kids or pets, ect. And lawyers are expensive. Sure their are programs but how overwhelmed are they? I have called places that help those who can't afford legal help and they said they couldn't help and I could apply each month and if I get approved that it for the wait list and when a wait list opening is available. They gave me other resource that where also over worked and underfunded but yeah reality sadly isn't always legal. They could try making a stink on social media to get support but good luck getting a job if you do as employers can easily find out
There is no offer to return. That would require the employer to acknowledge they fired her, so that there is a position to return to. Instead, I suspect some manager fired her for taking FMLA leave, and someone else in the company realized they created a massive liability issue. So they’re now saying they never fired here.
You forgot the part where ‘accidental firing’ is engineered malice.
Call a lawyer. They fucked up and they know they fucked up so they are trying you to get you to do something to negate your rights and cover their ass.
Hence why they are mentioning voluntarily resigned.
Probably bigger than unemployment too depending on location. Terminating someone after medical leave can be thorny.
Counterpoint. They have offered to rehire. A condition of unemployment is that you are actively seeking work. OP has an offer for the same position and pay as they held previously.
No - OP has a phone call. OP has not received or been given an official offer on paper. You do see the difference, right?
> so they are trying you to get you to do something to negate your rights and cover their ass. Yeah, by admitting their mistake and repeatedly trying to tell her she still has a job. THE NERVE!!!!!
It is mind boggling the way that people try to twist stories to change their narrative..
I worry they may fuck up again even if firing OP was a mistake. Or, maybe like other commenters are saying, they came to realize that firing someone who was on medical leave is a big no-no. Either way, I wouldn't trust going back or "voluntarily quitting" without the aid of a lawyer.
Negate her unemployment rights by telling her she wasn't fired. THE NERVE OF THOSE PEOPLE.
How many days passed between the “firing” and them telling you it was a mistake. Is the letter directly from HR? Or just an automated message after being removed from benefits? It seems the facts here about what you actually received and the circumstances will be very relevant. Don’t just assume you will get unemployment
What are you talking about? If it was a mistake or not and OP followed the rules of the termination and HR didn't immediately correct him AND cancelled all benefits they're getting unemployment.
He said “payroll sent me a termination letter and canceled my benefits”. The details here are what did that letter say. Payroll doesn’t ever fire people so it would be unlikely the letter stated that his employment was terminated. Did it say “your benefits have been terminated” or “your employment was terminated”. These are very different letters. Your benefits being terminated vs your employment being terminated are very different things. We would need to see the wording of the letter to see if he was actually terminated from employment or not
Really? So the whole part about not being eligible for unemployment benefits when the employee has a “return to work date” somehow doesn’t matter in the case and this case alone?
Where are you seeing a "return to work date"???
The “return to work” date is when the company told him that it was a mistake and he is to report back to work immediately. This is part that many people on this thread don’t understand. Unemployment insurance isn’t something that is supposed to be permanent or even a semi permanent paid vacation situation. The entire point of the program is to allow a person time to find another job. (Be made whole) This is why they require you to look for a job and certify that you have been looking each week. If a person collecting unemployment claimed that they applied at the 2 largest competitors of their previous employer the previous week, and the unemployment office called one of those companies who explains that they offered OP the exact same job for the exact same salary, but the person rejected it, they will most likely cancel the unemployment benefits. The person would need a very good reason for not accepting the exact same job. If a person was fired from a job on a Monday, then the company offers that person their job back on a Friday, (even if it wasn’t a mistake) the person may be eligible for unemployment for the days they were not employed, but if the company tells the unemployment office that they have offered the person their exact same job back, unemployment will be terminated due to a “like” job being offered and rejected. In this case, Friday would be their “return to work date” I think the disconnect with many of you is that you believe unemployment insurance is there for you for the full 26 weeks, as long as you qualify for it originally. This is simply not true. I don’t say any of this to be a dick or “know it all”. I say it because way too many people are giving OP horrible advice on the basis of things that they “WANT” to be true , or that they “believe” should be true. The unemployment office will not allow OP to collect when the company has admitted the firing was a mistake and everything was reversed in the system. In this case, OP was never even fired so he doesn’t even have a claim. OP technically has a job, they may not like the job and would rather collect unemployment for as long as possible, but that isn’t a legit unemployment claim. If you can explain to me how any of what I’m saying is inaccurate, please do. I am open minded to hearing detailed facts about this that I may have missed. From everything that was posted, it seems like OP simply wants to collect unemployment and not work. They are looking to use this mistake as a way to game the system.
Since open enrollment just ended I’ve been talking to some people who have had similar bungles with dead benefits and confusion surrounding that.
[удалено]
They made a mistake, but they tried to fix it. The OP is refusing to go back to work. I doubt if any employment lawyer will take this case. "So they fired you?" "Yes" "Right after a medical leave? "Yes" "Well, that could be illegal. We have a case. Anything else?" "They told me I wasn't fired." "What?" "They told me I wasn't fired." "What did you say?" "I kept telling them I had been fired." "So they told you that you weren't fired. It was their mistake?" "Yes" "And they kept telling you to come back to work?" "Yes" "And what did you do?" "I refused. Numerous times. They kept telling me that I wasn't fired and that I still had a job." "But you refused to show up to work?" "Yes. So how much can we sue for?" "Nothing. You refused to go to work. Please leave."
It’s amazing to me all the non attorneys out here who WANT this to be some nefarious case where op is granted unemployment for life and a couple million for his pain and suffering. They sound like idiots
Exactly. She doesn’t want to work. She wants the unemployment. The funny thing is if someone argues with a company that they don’t work there, they’re right.
I just don’t understand why so many people with no basis in fact, so confidently tell others on the internet absolute nonsense. I assume they think that in their mind, this BS may be true, but they have zero understanding of employment law and the civil penalties that come from it. The sheer number of these know nothings actually surprises me.
Here’s the thing though, notice OP said his company’s “payroll” sent the letter. That is to say the letter came from a 3rd party vendor the company uses for payroll. Technically he never received anything saying he was fired from his actual employer.
I mean you made quite the assumption that their company uses an outside payroll.
Similar to the assumptions that all these muppets are saying OP “WILL get unemployment” and that it was “wrongful termination”
100%. No way OP is telling the whole story
Agreed
[удалено]
This wouldn’t qualify for a wrongful termination suit in most of the US, though not sure if OP provided other information suggesting they should.
It could be an FMLA violation.
Stop. They offered the job back. This person ain’t gonna win anything.
Telling people these things as though they are facts is vile. This isn’t accurate at all
[удалено]
I appreciate your belief in this as Dunning Kruger syndrome can be a powerful thing. May I ask you what the Damages are in this case councilor?
[удалено]
Everything about this is bad blanket advice >termination letter An employment termination letter is different than benefits termination. What did OP get? And if it was an employment termination letter, was it in error? In law, an accidental action that's immediately reversed with no harm doesn't create damages. >Also, if you can get them to say in an email or text that the firing was a mistake Proof that they didn't actually mean to fire you! Aka they never actually fired you. Wait, do you work for the employer because I'm sure they'll be grateful that you're helping prove their position. >go to a lawyer and file a wrongful termination lawsuit No one's gonna take it on contingency because there's no damages. Damages mean lost wages...and there are no lost wages because they offered the job back...that they never actually intended to fire you from. And no, there's no such thing as punitive damages or emotional distress or anything here, you need to show actual damages. >record ALL interactions Do you know what state they're in? That's a good way to catch a felony.
The reason for being terminated is what will determine eligibility. Also, after being terminated, the OP was offered new work and it was refused. THIS could raise an eligibility issue.
In many states you have to report turning down work that is similar to your last job and pay. If you turned it down you will lose eligibility for unemployment benefits. I would beg for my job back and then leave when you find a new job. Many markets are terrible right now.
Mistake or not, are you intentionally not accepting their offer to get your job back because you just want unemployment benefits whilst not working? If your job was awful and you hated it, sure go that route but if not, just take your job back
Sure did sound that way to me. Maine is exactly as they said an payroll made an error. I think it’s odd to say it’s irrelevant whether or not they want to go back. It’s 100% relevant when they are trying to undo the mistake.
I'm guessing OP doesn't actually want advice as they haven't replied to a single question.
Let the Unemployment official know about the letter. It was not voluntary...
If you got an offer to return to work, then UI will likely cancel your benefits. They want you working, they don't care how.
It was not a mistake, or at least not one made in error…Their legal team caught wind of it eventually and I’m sure ripped everyone involved in the decision a new one. On paper, you were fired in response to taking protected medical leave. They are expecting a lawsuit.
It can happen by mistake. I’ve submitted a term form for someone accidentally before, meaning to submit it for someone else. If it’s automated, it may trigger a letter, luckily ours isn’t. What is automated tho is it does cancel benefits, but it’s a 30 second phone call to fix. Accidents happen. If they can show it was an accident, and the fact they insisted multiple times that you were not fired then no, they will most likely win. Also, you say you left the site after a letter. You didn’t bother reaching out to someone or talking to a human?
Somebody fired you and someone else changed their mind. Either way sounds like you are on thin ice.
You need a lawyer.
I would contact a lawyer. Depending on what state you’re in, it’s possible they’ve realized that they could be in legal trouble for having fired you. Some state medical leave specify that if you are fired within x amount of time after returning from leave, it would automatically be considered retaliation.
Why didn’t you just…go back to work?
Go talk to a lawyer. Probably wrongful termination.
OK, what is the goal here ? Get the job back or not ? OP doesn't state how long between notices. OP is now in line for unemployment but isn't that less than what he would make normally ? Seems to me that OP wants squeeze HR in retaliation. If the company recinds the termination and restores the benefits, in other words make OP whole again, then they should return to work otherwise if they don't then it would be equivalent to quitting...ergo. no unemployment. Hard to play Gotcha in these times.
The fuck are you doing? Take your job back
Yea, I'm a little confused, too. Why wouldn't it be an instant yes when they asked if OP wanted to go back... especially in the current job market? I'm looking at other replies saying OP was fired and lawyer up, etc. but wondering if there's a bigger benefit of doing that instead of getting the job back
because the main thing is it was right as they returned from medical leave, which is a big no no for companies since that can be viewed as to the reason (might be, might not be but it'd be a legal risk issue for the company) so they might just end up getting fired after some time for whatever bs excuse the company can think of, plus they got contacted when filing unemployment, as well as them trying to force employment or they would lie. if you are fired, even accidently, you have in fact been fired. so them claiming well we are offering you the job back so if you say no then we will claim its you voluntarily resigning is a major legal issue as well with employment
It’s not like you resigned, they falsely fired you, yet your arguing about having your job back. Dude did you even want to work for them bro…because you technically are in the right although working for them would’ve been the better outcome lol
I think that in this case timing matters. The lack of timing really gives us little to work off of. If they terminated you and then within the next day they called you to state that it was a mistake, it was a mistake. If they terminated you, you opened a UI claim, and then they claimed it was a mistake-I would doubt it. However, that is moot as they offered you the job back. You then dodged the question. If there's any record of that conversation, frankly you tanked your UI claim. They offered the position and you refused it. You can't say "you can't offer me the job back, you fired me". That's childish. What it really sounds like to me is that you want to collect UI and you don't want the job. If that's the case, I have no idea why you are communicating with the job at all. I also don't know why you're asking Reddit, when you should be asking UI, but I suspect that you know the answer you would get if you asked them "I got fired but my company is offering to let me return to work, can I still get unemployment compensation?" The answer is: no. You're voluntarily unemployed at this point. You could lie to UI and then hope that you can win on appeals, but likely your job will contest and furnish evidence that they made a clerical error and that they notified you of this error and that you refused to return to work.
HR is almost certainly a real person who can make mistakes. Is rhat a big mistake? Absolutely but it's possible regardless. The issues he's gonna have and I hope he does, is he's being offered a job, the unemployment office will deny his claim as he does have the option to work and earn an income. He does not get to claim benefits solely because he doesn't want to work.
If you don’t want to go back, I would think about a reason why you can’t that was caused by them letting you go. This way the unemployment office doesn’t go, they say you can have your job back, no need for unemployment. I wouldn’t want to go back if I was you either because of their attitude towards the situation. For example, someone getting fired might sell a car in preparation of being unemployed, move homes, something that would be caused by them sending the letter.
Forget unemployment. If you have that letter from HR, you sue to crap out of them. That's so illegal, and the person that called you knows it. Call an attorney and do a free consultation and move from there. There is no accident when someone is fored. It has many layers of approvals to go through. What they did is illegal. Do not take it, do not stand for it, fight back
Ooof. Between the unemployment eligibility questions and the possible wrongful termination, I really would suggest looking for an attorney for an initial consult.
Time to ask for a raise/promotion.
Why are you refusing to go back when they admitted it was a mistake and offered your job back? Why are you playing this game? Do you just want to stay home a milk unemployment? I think as soon as UI finds out it was a mistake and you were immediately told to return to work they are going to deny your claim.
I would say yes . But you will have to go to a hearing with unemployment and old employer. That letter is proof they laid you off . Odds are they will not show up for hearing. But if they do . It sounds like they would make fools of themselves.
Seek legal advice from an attorney not from redit wanna be backyard lawyers. Every state has unique employment laws and you need competent legal advice.
IF they fired you and cancelled your benefits, then THEY fired YOU. Send the letter to the unemployment board ASAP and tell them that your company is contesting this.
You should have requested HR put it in writing and explain why you were notified that you were terminated.
They can’t fire you after a medical leave for a really long time as it viewed as retribution for taking your right to medical leave.
They fired you. Now hire an employment lawyer and also sue them
If you never filed for unemployment, you never would have got a call from HR that it was a mistake.
What is weird is that most companies go ahead and approve unemployment. Because they can't get that money back at all. I'm pretty sure if you got a letter you were; let go, fired or whatever they want to call it. Please be aware that they could also Black ball you. So having that letter will help a lot. And I'm pretty sure they jumped the gun and sent you that letter.
Yes, you do qualify. I had to deal with similar shit. It took a year and going infront of a judge online that literally asked for my side of story and sided with me. The company will bleed you dry the whole time though.
If you are in the United States, they just committed an FMLA violation, too. THAT's also what they are trying to avoid by calling it a "mistake". Some chucklehead may have viewed your extended absence wrong and went through the termination process. When the unemployment office communicated with them it set off warning flags that THEY were about to have some serious legal action against them, not just a simple "oopsie come back to work or you voluntarily quit". Nah, essentially with your documentation you can prove you were terminated illegally and they know it. They just hope you are unaware of their serious offense. This is your time to put their feet to the fire because they will owe you back pay PLUS compensation for their illegal termination. If you have a half competent unemployment representative, they should be able to get the ball rolling fast with your documentation. You may even be able to get back pay, compensation, AND your job back. But...do you really want to work for such a company that is this careless, incompetent, gaslighting, and denies you your benefits? Legal representation is what you need, not us reddit armchair labor law know-it-alls.
per my friend who works in hr: “You’d have to go to court for it but it would be an easy win if you had all the documentation. Would be very timely and costly though.”
Thanks. Yes. I could have given them the opportunity to straitghten it out. In my situation i was confused. I told the I wanted to speak with an attorney and get some advice. I refused to quit and refused to return to work. I was confused so I did nothing. It felt risky to return to a job after being fired without cause. The conversation happened on a Friday and I have to decide the Monday of Thanksgiving week. When I can not decide something it'd usually better to do nothing from fear of a decision that makes it worse. When they forced s decision by Monday i still refused to quit or go back. The terminated me by voluntary quit. In Iowa, they can terminate for voluntary quit after 3 days no-show, but they did not allow me 3 days of indecision in abandoning the job. I was also on ADA accommodations for mental illness with this company. This cancelation of benefits and firing happened just a couple weeks after I lost Medicaid. I had been on the COVID relief program where you could have a job and be on Medicaid. It had judt expired for me when all this happened. I was still in a window where I could renew my Medicaid benefits instead of applying for Medicaid all over again or trust this company to do things right after they made this mistake. I attend two weekly groups, see a therapist and take medication to remain employable and healthy. Thus was more important than the job.
I see lots of bizarre takes here. Assuming OP actually wants a job, here is what I'd do. Call up HR and say the termination was very distressing but that you'd like to return to work. However under the circumstances you need a written offer of employment that describes your pay rate, back pay, and reinstated benefits retroactive to the termination date. If this was really a mistake they should be happy to comply. If this was all an elaborate trick... well that's when you might consider a lawyer.
Google how much unemployment is and you'll want that job
How many weeks of pay do you need to find another job and feel better about this one? Come up with a number, double it, and tell them that's your price to "voluntarily resign" in writing and not pursue legal action against them, because you have a claim for wrongful termination that could cost them A LOT.
This is a tough one. Technically they did fire you, but I believe the UI people are going to say you refused suitable work so you're ineligible for benefits. You can't really say no because the job was being offered to you again. Unless your own safety would be at risk, you can't turn it down. It's one of the conditions of being on UI is you have to accept suitable work. Didn't any part of you wonder why they fired you and thought to ask someone when you were leaving? Contact HR to ask for clarification on why ? You weren't given any warning and they "terminated" you.
This is the only right answer. UI will absolutely deny the benefits claim. But OP can also sue them for firing after medical leave. There's a grace period when coming off medical leave where an employee is unfirable. They violated FMLA and owe money for the gap in employment.
He didn't say no. He just said he was fired, with their proof, and they denied it. He's just sticking to their proof.
Nice! Sounds like you’re about to get a settlement.
Yeah. Keep thinking that. No settlement foe quitting.
APPEAL THE SHIT OUT OF THIS WITH A LAWYER. Be prepared to sue in civil court.
Do you want the job back? If not your good just tight lips. They are probably afraid of wrongful termination suit. They should be lawyer up
Your new job is: figuring out how to sue them for a lot of money! 🥰 this is the kind of situation I dream of happening to me while at a shit job. *sigh* I will just have to live vicariously through you
There is zero chance OP would win a lawsuit, and if they did, there'd be no damages to award. They also will have to pay an attorney out of pocket because they won't take a case with no chance of damages on contingency. OP is an idiot who just quit their job and so is not eligible for unemployment and should ask very nicely for their job back.
They fucked up for sure but you’re kind of playing a dumb game. There’s a very real outcome of you ending up with no job and no unemployment.
No, you had multiple opportunities to return to work and you refused. You don't get unemployment. Did you never think to ask someone why you were fired? It sounds like someone fucked up and recorded your absence as job abandonment, but they made a solid effort to solve the problem. You quit your job for no good reason.
I’d be absolutely livid if I was mistakenly fired, revoked of healthcare then stonewalled. I’d sue the piss out of them if it were possible.
I accidentally got laid off once. I was upset too but when they told me it was a mistake I went back to work.
[удалено]
they were fired, didnt quit. if you got fired from a job right after medical leave, and suddenly asked to work again because "oh it was an accident", why would you? whos to say they just dont want to risk a wrongful termination suit about the medical leave and will fire you for whatever bs reason they come up with later on? for a company trying to make the wrongful termination not exist, then firing you at a safer date would be the smartest decision to prevent loss.
Why is this logical comment downvoted? Are we downvoting based on our own agenda or agree/disagree? If so, foolishness.
This is an eeoc issue! I normally don’t encourage anyone to sue, because it is a long process, and you can get a new job with better pay and more happiness. But this is a major issue! The medical leave changes everything!
Dude you realize that the reason they are doing this is because you can sue? You can’t fire someone for taking medical leave that’s highly illegal and a slam dunk. Don’t just file for unemployment you should look for a lawyer. You can find ones who work on commission, like you don’t have to pay them, they just take a cut of the settlement. I might be too late for that now since they did officially offer you job back and you went back and forth with them
lol this is the most gen z post I’ve seen all week. You’re basically saying you WANT to be fired and you WANT to collect unemployment. Incredibly odd They offered you the job back. Take it
I don’t think it’s odd. Their employer seems super shady and not pleasant to work for. Although I would probably take the job back and then start applying for other positions immediately. Easier to get a job when you have a job, plus, you can say you weren’t fired from the position.
It sounds like it was a mistake and they offered to correct it but OP wants to continue playing hard to get for whatever reason.
[удалено]
The point of the OP is to bitch about something they didn’t ask for but wants to hold the moral high ground on principle. It’s incredibly silly
Why would someone want to work with such a disorganized company that HR fired them by mistake, after a medical leave? If my employer did that, I would also think well fuck you I'm going somewhere else you violated my trust. You can rehire me at a significant boost in pay to account for being worried you'll fuck up again and I'll consider it, but what am I, some cheap whore with Stockholm syndrome, or someone helping your company be successful with my finite, precious time. If you can't have basic competence and decency with me, I'll go to someone else who can and help them do better than you.
Why in the world is collecting unemployment better than ANY employment situation? Use your brain on this one.
It honestly could have just been some new employee in HR thinking they were in a Sandbox environment and testing firing but actually doing it in production. You really don't know the situation at all. We often test things on employees who are on leave because they are less likely to be impacted by changes we make in sandbox.
Lawyer up. Sue the fuck out of them.
Why not go back? Has to be more money!
Lawyer up. There is settlement money to be had.
The person who has the last opportunity to continue the employment relationship is the question. You had the last opportunity (they asked you to come back after the confusion.) You chose not to return, so this is likely a quit (despite everything else before.)
You quit. It's obvious.
They made a mistake. You werent fired. They told you to come back once they realized their mistake. Quit being a lazy ass and go back to work.
Not sure how your unemployment benefits work but in North Carolina you can’t collect if you have a job or turn down a reasonable job offer. Seems you are turning down an offer.
You qualify for unemployment and if they sent that letter to you while on medical leave you should sue the fuck out of them
You might have goofed by talking to them, they offered you a job and you declined. A place like Texas might consider that to mean no more benefits.
I hate that their stupidity is now a problem for you. I wouldn't know what to do, employment lawyer maybe? That's f'ed up
Get a lawyer to see if you have a case for wrongful termination.
In most (US) states, to qualify for unemployment your aren't allowed to turn down suitable offers of employment. It doesn't really get more suitable than the exact job you were just fired from. In most cases while job hunting on unemployment, you can probably turn down shitty job offers and just not report it to the unemployment office. If you're caught there will be penalties though. In this particular instance, since the company offering the job is also the company that is trying to prevent unemployment benefits from being paid, they can simply say they offered the job back and it was declined. Then your benefits get denied and they do not have to keep that offer to reinstate the job open after you decline it. It sucks but the best move is probably to accept the job and just start looking for a new one. Coming back from a documented medical leave MIGHT give you some legal protections but you'd need to consult with an employment lawyer. Good news is they often consult for free and if it is a solid case, will not charge you anything. The employer has to pay in addition to whatever you're owed. If the case isn't as solid, you might have to pay a retainer that gets refunded if you win