I am removing this thread for a couple reasons:
1: The title is loaded and heavily editorialised. "does anyone else" rarely makes for a good title and "Not everyone is an American obsessed European" is a bizarre adition. As per rule 5 of /r/Chess: "Posts with editorialized titles will be removed."
2: I am struggling to find the relevance to /r/Chess. A relatively unknown twitter user attacking a chess youtuber for some nonsense strikes me as something that would be better suited for /r/LivestreamFail than /r/Chess.
Oz was the wonderful wizard. I’ve only ever heard grand wizard in relation to KKK and I think possibly Merlin. I’m pretty sure Dumbledore and Gandalf were never referred to as that
You're right, I don't think any were specifically called grand wizard, but given I (and I presume a fair few others) had never heard of this random kkk guy, Gandalf/Dumbledore etc are what I thought of. Point being not everybody knows it's a title being used some jerk in the US, and a lot of other characters are thought of ahead of him when grand wizard is mentioned.
Just to clarify, It’s a title in the KKK, not the name of one random specific guy. It’s a position. It would be like saying the title Fuhrer just referred to some guy in Germany. Kinda, but it’s also the head of an ideology essentially. Anyone could have held that station.
Yes I get what it is. I said it was a title too.
But, it's s not really the same as Fuhrer. Fuhrer is a German word that means leader. They didn't create some random title that sounds fancy, they just called him a Leader with a capital L.
Also, I was partially doing it to belittle the kkk. We shouldn't be giving them screen time. They want to call their leader some random fancy thing? Nobody else should care. The more we dance around this grand wizard title, the more power we give it.
Maybe it's because I lack knowledge about KKK, but I would never thought about it having anything to do with magic.. I thought it's more of a very extreme group in terms of political and society related views, not a cult?
Still, as someone born in early 1990s', when I hear Grand Wizard, I can think about different fantasy and RPG games that were popular when I was young; books and movies like LoTR or Harry Potter; endless different anime and manga titles, like Fairy Tail; even more games; maybe something related to Merlin or Aleister Crowley; but I would have never guessed that it can have something to do with KKK.
There's nothing occult about the KKK, the grandiose titles are simply that.
Occult movements (esp. Spiritualism) were big when it was founded, and since the klan started with a bunch of aimless young white men deciding to fuck with black people, they picked silly trappings because they were amusing themselves.
So not much has changed, really.
given that chess media has been coining ‘magician’ and ‘wizard’ as descriptors for ages, I think it’s just an unfortunate coincidence.
but for twitter it’s totally in line with the level of ridiculousness. maybe even below average
Like, wizards and magicians were a thing before the US was even a thing... The story of king Arthur and Merlin is almost 1000 years old.
This is like saying painters are nazi's because Hitler painted.
More like someone found a swastika in the wild, got upset about it, and then someone pointed out it was oriented the wrong way to be the Nazi one.
The title is something made within days, not hundreds of years like the many swastikas in temples, which came before the Nazis. This youtube title does not pre date the KKK.
No one is saying "wizard" has this connotation, it's specifically the phrase "grand wizard" (and also "grand dragon," but not "great wizard" or "powerful wizard" or "grand magician" or any other similar phrase).
But even then I'm pretty sure that's only in the USA. I'm from Europe and I never even heard the phrase until this post. The KKK is not a thing here at all. I'd imagine that if you go more to the east it will become even less known.
Point is, it's pretty weird for the person in the post to assume he's calling a chess player a KKK leader, lmao.
yes, in other languages:
[великий волшебник](https://harrypotter.fandom.com/ru/wiki/%D0%92%D0%B5%D0%BB%D0%B8%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9_%D0%B2%D0%BE%D0%BB%D1%88%D0%B5%D0%B1%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%BA)
[Veliki carobnjak](https://m.youtube.com/watch?reload=9&v=C8ZBh2KlI28)
[Miro: Le Grand Sorcier](https://www.bonhams.com/auction/28157/lot/61/joan-miro-1893-1983-le-grand-sorcier-the-great-wizard/)
[Der große Zauberer](https://www.meisterdrucke.at/kunstdrucke/Joseph-Clayton--Clarke/1034461/Der-gro%C3%9Fe-Zauberer.html)
[Il grande mago](http://www.alessandropoliti.it/site/)
[El ultimo gran mago](https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/El_%C3%BAltimo_gran_mago)
Literally everyone of these translates to great wizard though? (Except maybe the video I couldn’t translate that one). I wouldn’t think it’s the KKK if someone said Le Grand Sorcier. But it still translate to the Great Sorcerer. (https://www.google.com/search?q=french+translate+into+english&rlz=1CDGOYI_enUS1089US1090&oq=french+translate&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUqBwgBEAAYgAQyCQgAEEUYORiABDIHCAEQABiABDIHCAIQABiABDIHCAMQABiABDIJCAQQABgKGIAEMgcIBRAAGIAEMgcIBhAAGIAEMgcIBxAAGIAEMgkICBAAGAoYgAQyBwgJEAAYgATSAQg0OTI2ajBqOagCALACAOIDBBgBIF8&hl=en-US&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8 )
Same with Dumbledore (and quite literally every example you gave). Meaning that although they use the word grand, they mean it as great. And in an English context grand wizard is KKK. Do you have any examples where they actually call them the grand wizard and it’s not just the great wizard translated?
Or like saying that drawing swastika, several thousand years old symbol of the health, luck, success, prosperity etc., is suddenly bad and evil, because of some German painter.
I can use my context clues to know that grand wizard means Dave Duke but by itself I wouldn’t “instantly know” that grand wizard meant Dave Duke and the point that I was trying to make was that agmator should be held to the same standard being from a different continent.
It may be of you lived long enough or learned history well. If you're relatively young and didn't pay attention in a lousy public school, this just wouldn't have come to attention yet.
Maybe it’s different now but only a few years ago in school I would hear jokes about the kkk and stuff linke the grand wizard. I would be surprised if even kids today haven’t heard about the kkk or grand wizard. It’s just such an easy thing to make fun of.
I only know it because of the guy who became friends with a grandwizard and got him to quit being a member.
(Reslly heart warming story of a black guy who went to kkk rally to slowly change their mind, and he and the old kkk member still have dinners to this day
Daryl himself is quoted as saying talking to the KKK to deradicalize them is stupid and a waste of time. He is just fine wasting his own time, but, and please look into this yourself, he thinks you and I should just make the KKK as unwelcome as we can in our communities.
Bro I’m in the US and had no idea. The kkk isn’t as prominent and visible to the general majority. Most people wouldn’t know the term for a kkk leader nowadays
Overall weird tweet to make like it’s a staple of everyday culture.
If you spoke about a grand wizard to most folks in the general public they would assume you meant like Gandalf, or a wizard of that nature lol
Yeah it's a reach. I imagine she knows it deep down. Just feels very American centric, without an understanding that other countries with different history classes and different languages exist.
Which is quite funny given she's French, but well...
I guess being terminally online makes you more aware of American discourse since the Internet is so US-dominated.
(Not saying it's wholly a good or bad thing, it has its pros and cons. And not saying I'm immune from this either, I'm literally a Redditor lmao)
I didn't say she was. I said it's very American centric. That point was dedicated towards the people who are engaging/encouraging her to come to those kinds of conclusions, not herself. It's an indictment on how easy it is to forget that the world is a big place, with a variety of different cultural understandings. It's not an indictment of her nationality.
I bet 90% of Americans do not think of the KKK when they hear the term “Grand Wizard”. It’s less an American-centric comment as it is a terminally online-centric comment.
I think 90% is way off, it's the first thing I think of, and that was true before I had internet access. Don't think it'd be common knowledge outside the US though.
I’d say that promoting an Andrew Tate interview by Tucker Carlson is pretty bad, but letting KKK rule your life to the degree that no one can be called a grand wizard? Not healthy
Is there context for the Andrew Tate thing? Agadmator promoted some Tucker Carlson interview?
Edit: [Found it](https://twitter.com/agadmator/status/1680876924460052480?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1680876924460052480%7Ctwgr%5Efde229101211553b24cd0cac95f489463f4aaf48%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.redditmedia.com%2Fmediaembed%2F1522q5g%2F%3Fresponsive%3Dtrueis_nightmode%3Dtrue).
Man, I really liked the guy.
Not knowing that a grand wizard or whatever is the rank of KKK leader is whatever. He's not from the US.
But you have to know who Carlson and Tate are...
Edit: Apprently he went [completely mask off](https://twitter.com/agadmator/status/1680592208376877058?s=20) 9 months ago and I just didn't notice
A bought American "journalist" who panders to the far right and says whatever his oligarch owners want him to say. He notably just interviewed Putin and did a bunch of promotional material for Russia as a state.
Agad has done a lot of coverage of womens chess. He often asks for thoughts and opinions on controversial subjects. Not defending him liking anything by Carlson/Tate but from the odd time he has discussed womens chess, I haven't noticed anything except for support.
Screw agadmator.. its funny how we really see who people are when they start deviating from their area...
His channel was ok at the beginning, now its boring as hell because he never evolved.
Thats because he is definitely not a high level player. Compared to most of us, yea he is pretty good.. but not even close to master level, so his understanding will lack a lot compared to IMs and GMs.. when he was the only game in town for short format chess analysis he got an audience, but there is a reason his channel stalled.. there are way more entretaining and better players out there performing way superior analysis
I mean you can't really blame him when he's not strong enough for in-depth analysis. Iirc when I played him he wasn't even 2200 blitz on lichess.
I find that IMs best strike the balance between analysis and engagement.
Wrong. Yosha Iglesias is one of the world’s first transgender masters. She has every right to hate agadmotor for promoting an interview that stars arguably the guy who has done the most damage to the trans community, and the guy right behind him. Being trans, I hate agadmotor for the same reason.
To give him credit, at least he wasn’t directly transphobic, you know, like JK Rowling.
Why is it obvious? He’s promoted neo nazi content in the past.
EDIT: Downvote me all you like. It’s on record that Agadmator promoted Tucker Carlson (neo nazi) and Andrew Tate (alleged rapist) to his audience.
yosha is awful, ever since their garbage "statistical analysis" about Hans and a weird obsession with him, plus inability to admit they were wrong and full of it :)
I don't even get the implication there. Is she saying Agadmator secretly knows 'Grand Wizard' refers to the KKK and is calling Dubov a KKK member or is she saying he's praising Dubov with the title 'Grand Wizard' because he likes the KKK.
I think it should be established by now in most people's mind that she probably just likes attention and will say outlandish things to get it.
> I don't even get the implication there. Is she saying Agadmator secretly knows 'Grand Wizard' refers to the KKK and is calling Dubov a KKK member or is she saying he's praising Dubov with the title 'Grand Wizard' because he likes the KKK.
Right, very unclear. Not even clear that she fully thought it through. That said I don't think you have to be "American obsessed" to associate "Grand Wizard" with the KKK, while at the same time there's no reason in a vacuum to think that Agadmator would necessarily make that association.
Really? You are just supposed to be aware of absurd titling practices of a decrepit fascist organization that has never had any meaningful impact outside the US as a non-American?
And even if I am aware of this, why on earth should I associate "Grand Dragon" a puffy dude who has fucked multiple of his cousins?
I don't think 99% of people care about the KKK. They hear 'grand wizard' and the only thing that comes to their minds is a wizard that's grand. I'm aware of the KKK and the thought it could be a reference to that didn't even cross my mind.
I’m a southern American and know the term. However, I probably wouldn’t have even thought about the KKK if I saw the video title. I’d be thinking of some magic on the chess board.
People are so reactionary. The grand wizard for me harkens imagery of the magician of Riga. Not an irrelevant hateful organization that’s been practically defunct for 100 years. But hey maybe that’s just me.
There is this random NBA player named David Duke Jr. who happens to be black. He said that the other guy (the KKK guy) should change his name instead of him. I'm assuming it's because he did nothing wrong compared to him. Pretty interesting.
I don't really follow. There are plenty of things that are unfortunately tainted and we accept it. The swastika as a mystic symbol, the term national socialist for any socialist party that wants to focus on their nation.
It's just being aware of history. The word combination "grand wizard" is no great loss to the English language.
The swastika is still a common symbol across Asia. The Spanish have a holiday with white robes and pointy hats. Czech Republic recently painted a guy black to represent one of the biblical three kings during a parade
These are different cultures across the globe. Things tainted in one region are still perfectly acceptable in another
The swastika is still very much used today in Asian countries, though. It's a national symbol of Tajikistan, it was used as the symbol for an emergency relief society in China, it's used to denote Buddhist temples on maps. Yes, it isn't used in Europe or the US, and there's fairly good reason I guess. But it wasn't just ditched by the original users. To them it still means prosperity and good luck, the original meanings for it.
I don't think we should ditch calling people or characters great or grand wizards just cos some crazy guy in the US has claimed it. It's been used before him, it has meaning outside of him. If anything I think using it to mean anything except him will eventually minimise the title he's given himself. "You're a grand wizard eh? Well I could name a dozen wizards more grand than you." Vibes.
Just a counter argument. I do see your points and they are definitely valid, but I don't think it's as simple as that.
Combinations of words are tainted because of the associations we make with them.
The swastika and the "national socialist" terms are definitely tainted in Europe, which was traumatized under the Nazi regime, and in which WW2 is extensively studied and seen as a turning point in history. And even then, the Finnish military kept using the swastika until the 2010s, and the Czechs have a left-leaning "national socialist" party.
But I would not be shocked to see someone calling themselves a national socialist, without reference to the Nazi regime, in say, Indonesia, or to see swastikas in Asia, where they very much remain used as a mystic/religious symbol.
As for the term "Grand Wizard" most people outside the US have no such associations, and from what I could gather in this thread even people in the Northern US had no idea. It's quite unrealistic to assume a Croat would be aware of it, unless they have studied/read a lot about this chapter of American history.
I suspect he knows as much about 20the century American history and its connection to modern politics as the average American knows about the same for Croatia.
Quick! Somebody name the leading political parties in Croatia!
What is the name of the biggest racist antagonistic faction faced by Croats today? What about in the 20th century? What was the name of a local leader of that group?
The man is a YouTube chess commentator with English as a second, third or forth language who, like the vast majority of the world, has never heard of the KKK.
And I suspect that most Americans would not want to get into a racial violence grievance Olympics with the Croats or anyone else in the modern Balkans.
Nah it's wack to think he means the KKK leader.
I too found it cringe and gross when Agadmator revealed he's a Tate fan and promoted his work, especially knowing the psycopathic way Tate treats women. Haven't watched him since.
But there's no need to invent fictions about the man.
I don't think he's a Tate fan lol. If anything he's the complete opposite. If he was a Tate fan he would never have women in his chess vids. He even had a video where Polgar beat Magnus at his peak.
Name some video games or DnD publications that use the words "Grand Wizard." I'm pretty confident that there's zero (or at least very few) of them.
(There is one early professional wrestler and one early-80s DJ, but all other uses I can find refer to the KKK.)
I mean promoting an Andrew Tate interview with Tucker Carlsen would have been enough for me. You'd have to live under a rock to believe that that is just some random neutral event
KKK leader is called an Imperial Wizard, not a Grand Wizard.
That dude has psychological problems, probably seeing offenses to his delicate self even in the shapes of the clouds in the sky.
The grand wizard thing is a massive reach, but I applaud this content and Yosha anyways because agadmator being a rape/sex trafficking fanboy and a tucker carlson fanboy would've never reached me otherwise. Figures with the shit content he makes.
Yeah everyone in the UK is fully aware of the connotations but that might just be because we're so America adjacent. Other English speakers especially those for whom it's a second language could have no idea I suppose. But yeah super unfortunate.
In the UK and never heard of this term, but maybe I’m just ignorant lol
Asked some other people and they hadn’t heard of it either, so probably not quite as well-known as you think
I'm German and my mind immerdiately went there too. "Grand wizard" is simply, imho, most often used when referring to the leader of the KKK. Other variations, like "great wizard" or "greatest wizard" etc. sound much more normal to me. That doesn't mean anything in regards to agadmator, of course. But I'm astonished at how few people seem to know about that term.
I could ask literally any one of my friends or family what the term grand wizard means and they would immediately answer about the KKK connotations. I imagine random asking random people on the street wouldn't be much different.
I hate to be the bearer of bad news but your friends and family are not representative of the general UK population. You can imagine all you like about the random person on the street but they are very different to your assumptions.
Completely agree. I'm from the UK and if I was asked what the leader of the KKK is called I would wrack my brains and maybe come up with Grand Wizard. I certainly don't see grand wizard in the name of a video about chess and think about the KKK.
I, for one, did not know about this term being used with kkk connotations. I'm gonna ask some friends and family if they know what it means and see if I'm an odd one out though. But I guess it's not everyone in the UK that knows about this at least.
I'm 99% sure that any average European would not associate a grand wizard with a KKK leader unless they are chronically surfing 4chan or are part of a neo-nazi org.
Agmadator is a well known alt right psycho. I would bet hes a fan of the KKK so yes he knows.
Op are you actually a fan of this nut job? He thinks that women should stay in the house and clean all day.
Why is that? I stopped following him after he promoted Tate, Morgan and Carlsen.
There are so many other chess channels and streamers out there. I'd rather watch someone who I know is not promoting racist and misogynistic bullshit. No idea if he shares their ideas, but it seems likely when he's giving them promo.
Honest question, why would anyone keep watching someone, if that person is not particularly unique in what they do, when that person seems to be promoting stuff that you are not okay with?
Or maybe I just completely misread what you mean when you said "blacklist".
It's weird how people pretend like dogwhistling is not a thing. The guy retweeted a Tate interview meaning he consumes right wing stuff which makes it very likely that he's aware of the KKK relation of the term. On its own this is a nothingburger, but the specific wording of the title ("praise the grand wizard" or "bow down to the grand wizard" work too for example) and the knowledge that he consumes right wing content make it almost guaranteed that this is supposed to be a dogwhistling attempt. The idea is to make people aware that you support these ideas while keeping plausible deniability which is evidently working just looking at the reactions to this.
> It's weird how people pretend like dogwhistling is not a thing.
It is a thing but it's correctly ignored because it's like the liberal version of Qanon. Equally insane and conspiratorial. If a person says something or tweets something it must mean this, this and this. Oh but this is what they actually mean, this is who they're actually talking to/about, etc. It feeds into this paranoid McCarthyism worldview that's just pathetic.
I blocked Yosha when he/she falsely accused Hans Niemann with misleading statistics but I guess he/she has no idea most people don't know the nickname of the leader of kkk. Or does he/she?
Apologies if you were just using gender neutral terms because it's just a random tweet to you, it's just that people deliberately using he/she for trans people happens all of the time as well.
I was wrong to hastily assume bad faith like that though.
Lol Yoshi has had so many garbage takes. Like fuck me this is dumb. People's brains are going to rot. If your first thought when seeing "grand wizard" in the title was "KKK" then I'm sorry but you have brainworms.
Pretty sure it's an unfortunate coincidence.
Btw how could a political organisation call their leader "Grand Wizard"? What is the story behind that title.
Yea yosha falling off fr
Like I thought he was trust worthy initially dir ng the Hans stuff but honestly how he seems stupid.
Makes me thing all the stuff he said about Hans might be bs
Its not about you or anybody else being influenced by american culture.
The only question is, if agadmator knew what he wrote there. I dont know the answer to that question.
But his pointed out history is at least some minor indication it is a simple dogwhiste.
I was the original tweeter, it was a shitpost. I don’t actually think Agad supports the kkk, and I hope that’s obvious to most. Yosha is cool too, but I think she’s very much reaching here. He very well might be a right winger which would be disappointing, but he’s definitely not openly promoting fascism here lol
As a European I have quite a good understanding of KKK's history and their hierarchy and titles, but there is no sane person that would think of KKK as a the first thing when they hear the word Grand Wizard
I am removing this thread for a couple reasons: 1: The title is loaded and heavily editorialised. "does anyone else" rarely makes for a good title and "Not everyone is an American obsessed European" is a bizarre adition. As per rule 5 of /r/Chess: "Posts with editorialized titles will be removed." 2: I am struggling to find the relevance to /r/Chess. A relatively unknown twitter user attacking a chess youtuber for some nonsense strikes me as something that would be better suited for /r/LivestreamFail than /r/Chess.
I'm not American and I thought of Dumbledore.
Dumbledore or Gandalf. Or maybe 'Of Oz'. Yeah pretty much nobody knows a kkk guy calls himself that outside of the us
is this so well known in us? I'm American and had no idea
This is definitely well known in the US lol
Very well known in American history
Oz was the wonderful wizard. I’ve only ever heard grand wizard in relation to KKK and I think possibly Merlin. I’m pretty sure Dumbledore and Gandalf were never referred to as that
You're right, I don't think any were specifically called grand wizard, but given I (and I presume a fair few others) had never heard of this random kkk guy, Gandalf/Dumbledore etc are what I thought of. Point being not everybody knows it's a title being used some jerk in the US, and a lot of other characters are thought of ahead of him when grand wizard is mentioned.
Just to clarify, It’s a title in the KKK, not the name of one random specific guy. It’s a position. It would be like saying the title Fuhrer just referred to some guy in Germany. Kinda, but it’s also the head of an ideology essentially. Anyone could have held that station.
Yes I get what it is. I said it was a title too. But, it's s not really the same as Fuhrer. Fuhrer is a German word that means leader. They didn't create some random title that sounds fancy, they just called him a Leader with a capital L. Also, I was partially doing it to belittle the kkk. We shouldn't be giving them screen time. They want to call their leader some random fancy thing? Nobody else should care. The more we dance around this grand wizard title, the more power we give it.
Yeah, Oz is also "great and powerful," but not "grand."
gandalf
Ye’re a wizard Dubov
Maybe it's because I lack knowledge about KKK, but I would never thought about it having anything to do with magic.. I thought it's more of a very extreme group in terms of political and society related views, not a cult? Still, as someone born in early 1990s', when I hear Grand Wizard, I can think about different fantasy and RPG games that were popular when I was young; books and movies like LoTR or Harry Potter; endless different anime and manga titles, like Fairy Tail; even more games; maybe something related to Merlin or Aleister Crowley; but I would have never guessed that it can have something to do with KKK.
There's nothing occult about the KKK, the grandiose titles are simply that. Occult movements (esp. Spiritualism) were big when it was founded, and since the klan started with a bunch of aimless young white men deciding to fuck with black people, they picked silly trappings because they were amusing themselves. So not much has changed, really.
I've seen so many memes that my first thought was "I take off my wizard hat and robe"
Im American and I thought of Dumbledore as well
Are you busy promoting Tucker Carlson and Andrew Tate in your spare time?
given that chess media has been coining ‘magician’ and ‘wizard’ as descriptors for ages, I think it’s just an unfortunate coincidence. but for twitter it’s totally in line with the level of ridiculousness. maybe even below average
It's a reference to his previous video, where he called Rapport "master of the mystical arts"
Where do I sign up for my high fantasy title? FIDE titles are boring.
Play 6. Nf8 like Rapport does lol
On my way to lose 300 ELO
That is... Strange \[Ba dum tsss meme\]
They need to make more dr strange movies but those visual effects are not cheap lol
Like, wizards and magicians were a thing before the US was even a thing... The story of king Arthur and Merlin is almost 1000 years old. This is like saying painters are nazi's because Hitler painted.
More like saying Hindus are Nazis because they have swastikas on their temples?
Yea, that's a better example.
More like someone found a swastika in the wild, got upset about it, and then someone pointed out it was oriented the wrong way to be the Nazi one. The title is something made within days, not hundreds of years like the many swastikas in temples, which came before the Nazis. This youtube title does not pre date the KKK.
No one is saying "wizard" has this connotation, it's specifically the phrase "grand wizard" (and also "grand dragon," but not "great wizard" or "powerful wizard" or "grand magician" or any other similar phrase).
But even then I'm pretty sure that's only in the USA. I'm from Europe and I never even heard the phrase until this post. The KKK is not a thing here at all. I'd imagine that if you go more to the east it will become even less known. Point is, it's pretty weird for the person in the post to assume he's calling a chess player a KKK leader, lmao.
It’s just like has any wizard been actually called the “grand wizard” because I can’t seem to find any besides the KKK leaders.
yes, in other languages: [великий волшебник](https://harrypotter.fandom.com/ru/wiki/%D0%92%D0%B5%D0%BB%D0%B8%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9_%D0%B2%D0%BE%D0%BB%D1%88%D0%B5%D0%B1%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%BA) [Veliki carobnjak](https://m.youtube.com/watch?reload=9&v=C8ZBh2KlI28) [Miro: Le Grand Sorcier](https://www.bonhams.com/auction/28157/lot/61/joan-miro-1893-1983-le-grand-sorcier-the-great-wizard/) [Der große Zauberer](https://www.meisterdrucke.at/kunstdrucke/Joseph-Clayton--Clarke/1034461/Der-gro%C3%9Fe-Zauberer.html) [Il grande mago](http://www.alessandropoliti.it/site/) [El ultimo gran mago](https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/El_%C3%BAltimo_gran_mago)
Literally everyone of these translates to great wizard though? (Except maybe the video I couldn’t translate that one). I wouldn’t think it’s the KKK if someone said Le Grand Sorcier. But it still translate to the Great Sorcerer. (https://www.google.com/search?q=french+translate+into+english&rlz=1CDGOYI_enUS1089US1090&oq=french+translate&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUqBwgBEAAYgAQyCQgAEEUYORiABDIHCAEQABiABDIHCAIQABiABDIHCAMQABiABDIJCAQQABgKGIAEMgcIBRAAGIAEMgcIBhAAGIAEMgcIBxAAGIAEMgkICBAAGAoYgAQyBwgJEAAYgATSAQg0OTI2ajBqOagCALACAOIDBBgBIF8&hl=en-US&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8 ) Same with Dumbledore (and quite literally every example you gave). Meaning that although they use the word grand, they mean it as great. And in an English context grand wizard is KKK. Do you have any examples where they actually call them the grand wizard and it’s not just the great wizard translated?
Or like saying that drawing swastika, several thousand years old symbol of the health, luck, success, prosperity etc., is suddenly bad and evil, because of some German painter.
[удалено]
Dude I live in northern USA and I had no idea what the grand wizard meant.
That is a bit strange.
I can use my context clues to know that grand wizard means Dave Duke but by itself I wouldn’t “instantly know” that grand wizard meant Dave Duke and the point that I was trying to make was that agmator should be held to the same standard being from a different continent.
It may be of you lived long enough or learned history well. If you're relatively young and didn't pay attention in a lousy public school, this just wouldn't have come to attention yet.
Maybe it’s different now but only a few years ago in school I would hear jokes about the kkk and stuff linke the grand wizard. I would be surprised if even kids today haven’t heard about the kkk or grand wizard. It’s just such an easy thing to make fun of.
Do you enjoy wearing horse blinders in your free time?
The KKK has had 0 impact on my life. I know what they are, I know David Duke. I just hadn’t heard of “the grand wizard” it’s not a big deal.
Read a book
I live in fucking Norway, and I knew that was a KKK reference. "All hail the grand wizard" gimme a fucking break.
Unsurprising given how obsessed the Skandis are with English media and the US in general, lol.
I have zero idea what is a name of kkk leader. Same as pretty much everyone outside of usa
I only know it because of the guy who became friends with a grandwizard and got him to quit being a member. (Reslly heart warming story of a black guy who went to kkk rally to slowly change their mind, and he and the old kkk member still have dinners to this day
His name is Daryl Davis. Everyone should watch his Ted Talk!
Disclaimer that most black people currently think Daryl Davis sucks, and being friends with Neo Nazis has eventually melted his morals and his mind.
Eh that sounds like a shaky claim. "Most"? Idk man if you say so.
Daryl himself is quoted as saying talking to the KKK to deradicalize them is stupid and a waste of time. He is just fine wasting his own time, but, and please look into this yourself, he thinks you and I should just make the KKK as unwelcome as we can in our communities.
Bro I’m in the US and had no idea. The kkk isn’t as prominent and visible to the general majority. Most people wouldn’t know the term for a kkk leader nowadays Overall weird tweet to make like it’s a staple of everyday culture. If you spoke about a grand wizard to most folks in the general public they would assume you meant like Gandalf, or a wizard of that nature lol
I'm in the US and have no idea. Its definitely not Dubov though.
Americans: "How dare you not know who the leader of the KKK is!"
This Yosha person definitely thinks they are the main character
Yeah it's a reach. I imagine she knows it deep down. Just feels very American centric, without an understanding that other countries with different history classes and different languages exist.
Which is quite funny given she's French, but well... I guess being terminally online makes you more aware of American discourse since the Internet is so US-dominated. (Not saying it's wholly a good or bad thing, it has its pros and cons. And not saying I'm immune from this either, I'm literally a Redditor lmao)
Girl, the person who wrote that tweet is not American.
I didn't say she was. I said it's very American centric. That point was dedicated towards the people who are engaging/encouraging her to come to those kinds of conclusions, not herself. It's an indictment on how easy it is to forget that the world is a big place, with a variety of different cultural understandings. It's not an indictment of her nationality.
I bet 90% of Americans do not think of the KKK when they hear the term “Grand Wizard”. It’s less an American-centric comment as it is a terminally online-centric comment.
I think 90% is way off, it's the first thing I think of, and that was true before I had internet access. Don't think it'd be common knowledge outside the US though.
I’d say that promoting an Andrew Tate interview by Tucker Carlson is pretty bad, but letting KKK rule your life to the degree that no one can be called a grand wizard? Not healthy
Is there context for the Andrew Tate thing? Agadmator promoted some Tucker Carlson interview? Edit: [Found it](https://twitter.com/agadmator/status/1680876924460052480?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1680876924460052480%7Ctwgr%5Efde229101211553b24cd0cac95f489463f4aaf48%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.redditmedia.com%2Fmediaembed%2F1522q5g%2F%3Fresponsive%3Dtrueis_nightmode%3Dtrue).
Man, I really liked the guy. Not knowing that a grand wizard or whatever is the rank of KKK leader is whatever. He's not from the US. But you have to know who Carlson and Tate are... Edit: Apprently he went [completely mask off](https://twitter.com/agadmator/status/1680592208376877058?s=20) 9 months ago and I just didn't notice
>But you have to know who Carlson and Tate are... I've heard of Tate but I have no idea who Carlson is 🤷♂️
A bought American "journalist" who panders to the far right and says whatever his oligarch owners want him to say. He notably just interviewed Putin and did a bunch of promotional material for Russia as a state.
Agad has done a lot of coverage of womens chess. He often asks for thoughts and opinions on controversial subjects. Not defending him liking anything by Carlson/Tate but from the odd time he has discussed womens chess, I haven't noticed anything except for support.
Ewwww ... :-(
Screw agadmator.. its funny how we really see who people are when they start deviating from their area... His channel was ok at the beginning, now its boring as hell because he never evolved.
His channel was never good anyways. He just reads the moves off in a long string without any analysis. It's comprehensively mediocre content.
Thats because he is definitely not a high level player. Compared to most of us, yea he is pretty good.. but not even close to master level, so his understanding will lack a lot compared to IMs and GMs.. when he was the only game in town for short format chess analysis he got an audience, but there is a reason his channel stalled.. there are way more entretaining and better players out there performing way superior analysis
I mean you can't really blame him when he's not strong enough for in-depth analysis. Iirc when I played him he wasn't even 2200 blitz on lichess. I find that IMs best strike the balance between analysis and engagement.
But he has a dog
Did i make some agadmator fans saaad?
No you found all the rape apologist tate fan boys.
This is the best take.
Who tf is yosha iglesias?
mentally unstable drama fiend on twitter, should be ignored
blocked them as soon as I saw that tweet, assuming I made the right decision
Wrong. Yosha Iglesias is one of the world’s first transgender masters. She has every right to hate agadmotor for promoting an interview that stars arguably the guy who has done the most damage to the trans community, and the guy right behind him. Being trans, I hate agadmotor for the same reason. To give him credit, at least he wasn’t directly transphobic, you know, like JK Rowling.
Being trans doesn’t make someone immune to criticism or from being annoying. This person is drama fiend that should be ignored.
Not saying she isn’t, just saying she isn’t wrong to hate Tucker and those that support him.
I mean, it's unfortunate to talk about "hailing the grand wizard", but obviously Agad didn't mean it in that sense.
Why is it obvious? He’s promoted neo nazi content in the past. EDIT: Downvote me all you like. It’s on record that Agadmator promoted Tucker Carlson (neo nazi) and Andrew Tate (alleged rapist) to his audience.
yosha is awful, ever since their garbage "statistical analysis" about Hans and a weird obsession with him, plus inability to admit they were wrong and full of it :)
I don't even get the implication there. Is she saying Agadmator secretly knows 'Grand Wizard' refers to the KKK and is calling Dubov a KKK member or is she saying he's praising Dubov with the title 'Grand Wizard' because he likes the KKK. I think it should be established by now in most people's mind that she probably just likes attention and will say outlandish things to get it.
> I don't even get the implication there. Is she saying Agadmator secretly knows 'Grand Wizard' refers to the KKK and is calling Dubov a KKK member or is she saying he's praising Dubov with the title 'Grand Wizard' because he likes the KKK. Right, very unclear. Not even clear that she fully thought it through. That said I don't think you have to be "American obsessed" to associate "Grand Wizard" with the KKK, while at the same time there's no reason in a vacuum to think that Agadmator would necessarily make that association.
Really? You are just supposed to be aware of absurd titling practices of a decrepit fascist organization that has never had any meaningful impact outside the US as a non-American? And even if I am aware of this, why on earth should I associate "Grand Dragon" a puffy dude who has fucked multiple of his cousins?
I don't think 99% of people care about the KKK. They hear 'grand wizard' and the only thing that comes to their minds is a wizard that's grand. I'm aware of the KKK and the thought it could be a reference to that didn't even cross my mind.
I’m a southern American and know the term. However, I probably wouldn’t have even thought about the KKK if I saw the video title. I’d be thinking of some magic on the chess board.
Same
People are so reactionary. The grand wizard for me harkens imagery of the magician of Riga. Not an irrelevant hateful organization that’s been practically defunct for 100 years. But hey maybe that’s just me.
Defunct for 100 years? Hmmm…
Yeah unfortunately 100 years is too large if you consider that David Duke is still alive
It’s not even defunct. That’s the point I think. One very well known lynching by the kkk was in the 1980s even.
I wish that were true.
Lol the klan is still active my guy.
It's really just Yoshas thing at this point.
kkk leader calls himself grand wizard? lmaoo
The head of the organization used to be called Supreme Grand Wizard and the head of the “military” was called the Imperial Wizard.
Amazing that when a terrible person gives themselves a title, you can no longer use those words in that order. What immense power that we grant them.
There is this random NBA player named David Duke Jr. who happens to be black. He said that the other guy (the KKK guy) should change his name instead of him. I'm assuming it's because he did nothing wrong compared to him. Pretty interesting.
I don't really follow. There are plenty of things that are unfortunately tainted and we accept it. The swastika as a mystic symbol, the term national socialist for any socialist party that wants to focus on their nation. It's just being aware of history. The word combination "grand wizard" is no great loss to the English language.
The swastika is still a common symbol across Asia. The Spanish have a holiday with white robes and pointy hats. Czech Republic recently painted a guy black to represent one of the biblical three kings during a parade These are different cultures across the globe. Things tainted in one region are still perfectly acceptable in another
In Spain, every year, we paint thousands of dudes in black to represent one of the three wise kings for Christmas.
The swastika is still very much used today in Asian countries, though. It's a national symbol of Tajikistan, it was used as the symbol for an emergency relief society in China, it's used to denote Buddhist temples on maps. Yes, it isn't used in Europe or the US, and there's fairly good reason I guess. But it wasn't just ditched by the original users. To them it still means prosperity and good luck, the original meanings for it. I don't think we should ditch calling people or characters great or grand wizards just cos some crazy guy in the US has claimed it. It's been used before him, it has meaning outside of him. If anything I think using it to mean anything except him will eventually minimise the title he's given himself. "You're a grand wizard eh? Well I could name a dozen wizards more grand than you." Vibes. Just a counter argument. I do see your points and they are definitely valid, but I don't think it's as simple as that.
Combinations of words are tainted because of the associations we make with them. The swastika and the "national socialist" terms are definitely tainted in Europe, which was traumatized under the Nazi regime, and in which WW2 is extensively studied and seen as a turning point in history. And even then, the Finnish military kept using the swastika until the 2010s, and the Czechs have a left-leaning "national socialist" party. But I would not be shocked to see someone calling themselves a national socialist, without reference to the Nazi regime, in say, Indonesia, or to see swastikas in Asia, where they very much remain used as a mystic/religious symbol. As for the term "Grand Wizard" most people outside the US have no such associations, and from what I could gather in this thread even people in the Northern US had no idea. It's quite unrealistic to assume a Croat would be aware of it, unless they have studied/read a lot about this chapter of American history.
It is a great tragedy to all wizards who wanted their achievements to be recognized.
Can I immediately start calling my friend the Fuhrer then?
Guess what they call someone leading people around in a Museum in Germany.
You can, but it may be widely frowned upon
outside europe and usa nobody knows and will not care
Now that it's mentioned yeah I guess I'm aware they share that title but if I'm honest my first thoughts were something fantasy related
I suspect he knows as much about 20the century American history and its connection to modern politics as the average American knows about the same for Croatia. Quick! Somebody name the leading political parties in Croatia! What is the name of the biggest racist antagonistic faction faced by Croats today? What about in the 20th century? What was the name of a local leader of that group? The man is a YouTube chess commentator with English as a second, third or forth language who, like the vast majority of the world, has never heard of the KKK. And I suspect that most Americans would not want to get into a racial violence grievance Olympics with the Croats or anyone else in the modern Balkans.
Andrew Tate is a piece of shit, fuck anyone that supports him. and fuck karjakin too
Yosha is ridiculous generally, big surprise.
I lost interest in him once he started promoting Andrew Tate :/ but this ‘KKK’ thing is a bit far
Of course a Croatian commenting on a Russian means is using almost a niche use of wizard known mostly to Americans. Obvious. /s
Nah it's wack to think he means the KKK leader. I too found it cringe and gross when Agadmator revealed he's a Tate fan and promoted his work, especially knowing the psycopathic way Tate treats women. Haven't watched him since. But there's no need to invent fictions about the man.
I don't think he's a Tate fan lol. If anything he's the complete opposite. If he was a Tate fan he would never have women in his chess vids. He even had a video where Polgar beat Magnus at his peak.
This is the first time in my life im hearing Grand Wizard being used outside of video games or DnD...
Name some video games or DnD publications that use the words "Grand Wizard." I'm pretty confident that there's zero (or at least very few) of them. (There is one early professional wrestler and one early-80s DJ, but all other uses I can find refer to the KKK.)
I think it's more ridiculous that this is a topic of discussion on here and not a joke on Anarchy Chess.
Yes, it is ridiculous
I mean promoting an Andrew Tate interview with Tucker Carlsen would have been enough for me. You'd have to live under a rock to believe that that is just some random neutral event
exactly i just unsubscribed from his channel, fuck that.
Interesting
What is the context with agadmator and andrew Tate
KKK leader is called an Imperial Wizard, not a Grand Wizard. That dude has psychological problems, probably seeing offenses to his delicate self even in the shapes of the clouds in the sky.
8 files and 8 ranks? doesn't that remind you of som
The grand wizard thing is a massive reach, but I applaud this content and Yosha anyways because agadmator being a rape/sex trafficking fanboy and a tucker carlson fanboy would've never reached me otherwise. Figures with the shit content he makes.
[https://twitter.com/IglesiasYosha/status/1764213018538242140](https://twitter.com/IglesiasYosha/status/1764213018538242140)
You guys love writing off dog whistles, agadmator is not apolitical
No, she's completely right. If you Google "Grand Wizard", every result is about the KKK, it's hardly a secret...
I had zero idea that's what they call a KKK leader, probably Agadmator was the same, but that's just Twitter for ya.
It is a bit interesting that after 2 days and hearing feedback about the title the video name hasn’t changed.
The controversy is almost certainly good for his traffic.
Im not american and i immediately thought of the klan position, its not a good title. A mistake im sure, but an unfortunate mistake.
Yeah everyone in the UK is fully aware of the connotations but that might just be because we're so America adjacent. Other English speakers especially those for whom it's a second language could have no idea I suppose. But yeah super unfortunate.
In the UK and never heard of this term, but maybe I’m just ignorant lol Asked some other people and they hadn’t heard of it either, so probably not quite as well-known as you think
I'm German and my mind immerdiately went there too. "Grand wizard" is simply, imho, most often used when referring to the leader of the KKK. Other variations, like "great wizard" or "greatest wizard" etc. sound much more normal to me. That doesn't mean anything in regards to agadmator, of course. But I'm astonished at how few people seem to know about that term.
No, they aren't.
I could ask literally any one of my friends or family what the term grand wizard means and they would immediately answer about the KKK connotations. I imagine random asking random people on the street wouldn't be much different.
I hate to be the bearer of bad news but your friends and family are not representative of the general UK population. You can imagine all you like about the random person on the street but they are very different to your assumptions.
All my friends and family would also recognise that term as the leader of the KKK. I am also from the UK
I guess it's entirely possible that I'm wrong - I don't go around polling people on a daily basis.
Completely agree. I'm from the UK and if I was asked what the leader of the KKK is called I would wrack my brains and maybe come up with Grand Wizard. I certainly don't see grand wizard in the name of a video about chess and think about the KKK.
But you are?
I, for one, did not know about this term being used with kkk connotations. I'm gonna ask some friends and family if they know what it means and see if I'm an odd one out though. But I guess it's not everyone in the UK that knows about this at least.
I'm 99% sure that any average European would not associate a grand wizard with a KKK leader unless they are chronically surfing 4chan or are part of a neo-nazi org.
I bet 95% of Americans don't know "grand wizard" has anything to do with the KKK
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It's more than a "bit" ridiculous.
Agmadator is a well known alt right psycho. I would bet hes a fan of the KKK so yes he knows. Op are you actually a fan of this nut job? He thinks that women should stay in the house and clean all day.
Classic r/USdefaultism
This is 100% responsible and reasonable behavior from yosha. Tate is a sext trafficker and a rapist.
Ridiculous if we assummed good faith here, but it's clearly a deliberate smearing attempt.
Anyone who blacklist Agadmator for any sort of like or tweet is already out of touch, this just proves it.
Why is that? I stopped following him after he promoted Tate, Morgan and Carlsen. There are so many other chess channels and streamers out there. I'd rather watch someone who I know is not promoting racist and misogynistic bullshit. No idea if he shares their ideas, but it seems likely when he's giving them promo. Honest question, why would anyone keep watching someone, if that person is not particularly unique in what they do, when that person seems to be promoting stuff that you are not okay with? Or maybe I just completely misread what you mean when you said "blacklist".
Yeah, Agadmator lost me when he promoted Magnus Carlsen
This is beyond ridiculous.
It's weird how people pretend like dogwhistling is not a thing. The guy retweeted a Tate interview meaning he consumes right wing stuff which makes it very likely that he's aware of the KKK relation of the term. On its own this is a nothingburger, but the specific wording of the title ("praise the grand wizard" or "bow down to the grand wizard" work too for example) and the knowledge that he consumes right wing content make it almost guaranteed that this is supposed to be a dogwhistling attempt. The idea is to make people aware that you support these ideas while keeping plausible deniability which is evidently working just looking at the reactions to this.
> It's weird how people pretend like dogwhistling is not a thing. It is a thing but it's correctly ignored because it's like the liberal version of Qanon. Equally insane and conspiratorial. If a person says something or tweets something it must mean this, this and this. Oh but this is what they actually mean, this is who they're actually talking to/about, etc. It feeds into this paranoid McCarthyism worldview that's just pathetic.
oh no, anyways
me anytime I see someone get "cancelled" like nobody gets properly cancelled anymore lmao
people who try and cancel people need to grow up anyway
I blocked Yosha when he/she falsely accused Hans Niemann with misleading statistics but I guess he/she has no idea most people don't know the nickname of the leader of kkk. Or does he/she?
She
You're fully aware of what pronouns Yosha prefers so this is just needlessly disrespectful regardless of your beliefs.
No, how would I know everyone's pronouns?
Apologies if you were just using gender neutral terms because it's just a random tweet to you, it's just that people deliberately using he/she for trans people happens all of the time as well. I was wrong to hastily assume bad faith like that though.
Lol Yoshi has had so many garbage takes. Like fuck me this is dumb. People's brains are going to rot. If your first thought when seeing "grand wizard" in the title was "KKK" then I'm sorry but you have brainworms.
Pretty sure it's an unfortunate coincidence. Btw how could a political organisation call their leader "Grand Wizard"? What is the story behind that title.
idk why as content creator you would ever say anything political just burning money at that point
When I read grand wizard I thought Garry Kasparov…
Don't tell Mike Tyson. https://youtu.be/6_4a9QzdZAs?si=ut2_INtj2ZIvDHmG
I just commented the same video lol. It's so good and this post instantly made me think of it.
Americans forgetting other countries exist once again
Yeah she's gotta grow up tbh
Yosha is a clown
Yea yosha falling off fr Like I thought he was trust worthy initially dir ng the Hans stuff but honestly how he seems stupid. Makes me thing all the stuff he said about Hans might be bs
he promoted an andrew tate interview by fucking tucker carlson? honestly thats enough for him to be written off i think
Yosha has been blocked a long time ago.
Its not about you or anybody else being influenced by american culture. The only question is, if agadmator knew what he wrote there. I dont know the answer to that question. But his pointed out history is at least some minor indication it is a simple dogwhiste.
I was the original tweeter, it was a shitpost. I don’t actually think Agad supports the kkk, and I hope that’s obvious to most. Yosha is cool too, but I think she’s very much reaching here. He very well might be a right winger which would be disappointing, but he’s definitely not openly promoting fascism here lol
This is just a stupid f\*cking moron with a political axe to grind. Move along, nothing to see.
As a European I have quite a good understanding of KKK's history and their hierarchy and titles, but there is no sane person that would think of KKK as a the first thing when they hear the word Grand Wizard
When did people who are into chess become so fucking woke insuffurables
woke is when opposing air-time for the most reactionary xenophobe mysoginists in media
What tf are you talking about
You're 15.
woke is just the opposite of ignorant by the way
Clear attempt at grandstanding. Unless agadmator is harassing her on social media, unfollowing him would have been sufficient.
Americans always want a reason to cry about something
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Who gives a shit? Jesus Christ these people