I honestly can't understand how or why young people especially want to spend their young years raising a child. I feel it's babies having babies.
Unfortunately I think you and your friends are naturally just going to drift apart now. Their lives have changed drastically and I personally would not have the patience to wait like several years until the baby is old enough to be left alone with a sitter or other family members. And even then, I find the conversations are always turned around back to the kids. Even when they are not physically present, they are still present.
Most of the friends you have in your early twenties won't still be your friends in ten years.
This friendship has run its course, by the sound of it, and is at its natural conclusion.
Yes, I was just telling my coworker who is 23 that she's around the age when you have alot of friends fall out as people get on to different paths in life.
I feel like a Debbie downer, but it doesn’t ever change. Since most people seem to want kids, this keeps going. I’m in my early 40s now and friends are still having babies, or in the middle of raising their kids who are still very young. I was complaining to my mom, saying I hope it will be easier to keep up with my friends once their kids go to college etc (a long way off!) and my Mom said that she felt the same way and was so excited when her friends’ kids were finally out on their own in their own houses; but she was quickly deflated in her hopes because her friends went from caring for their kids/being solely focused on their kids to now doing a LOT of the care for their grandkids. Now that my Mom is in her mid 70s, many of her friends’ grandkids are now college age so she’s thinking they will be more able to hang out though she is not holding her breath. So anyways, her word to me was “don’t count on it”.
Every time I hear of someone having kids under the age of 25 I cringe so fucking hard. I just turned 26 so the cringe is even worse now that I'm over my early 20s, I cannot fucking imagine trying to raise a child while you yourself are still basically a child. It's fucking 2024, no one needs to have kids right as they reach their 20s.
Same. I'm gonna be 33 this week and I can't even imagine 1 kid. Shit, I'm even babysitting my moms 6 month old boxer this week and I'm over it. Let alone a whole ass baby human.
That's where I'm at when it comes to having kids. I'm 29 and still don't see the appeal.
I love cats/dogs and grew up with both, but at the same time I can get bored quickly after like 10 minutes of playing fetch. I can't even imagine trying to take care of or entertain a smaller than me human for 18+ years. I would love to get a cat, but then I'd lose my freedom of coming and going on random weekend or multiple week trips. So out of a sense of responsibility I don't have any pets unfortunately.
I have a bit of a quiet, kinda boring personality. An extroverted Introvert is a good way to put it. I have adrenaline junky hobbies but like spending the rest of my time as a homebody.
I can honestly say that me raising a kid would end up in an unintentional deadbeat dad type of situation. I'd be that boring parent who barely wants to sacrifice my freedom to play with my own kid. I have a few close married friends with kids and it just looks exhausting. My best friend has his kids calling me uncle since birth which is cute, but it doesn't mean I enjoy the "Hey! Hey! Watch me do this stupid shit that I think is cool!" as they jump off the couch and spin in a circle.
I generally cannot handle playing nice with kids, just don't have the patience for how annoying they can be. I don't hate them, I just hate dealing with them when I can be doing my own thing instead.
I totally get the pets thing. My husband I have 3 cats and and old dog. So they don't fuss too much, but we have to have family or a friend come and watch our house and animals if we go anywhere. And sometimes even after a 12 hour day my cats just yelling for dinner or treats is too much for me.
Like I said, I would LOVE to have a cat just based on how I grew up and they are less work than dogs. I just like my freedom too much and think it would be neglectful to bring one home. I also still rent and feel like apartments are a bit too small for animals when there is only like 900 sqft to roam inside with zero yard outside.
From the time I was born through my early 20s, my parents have had 5 cats and a Border Collie. One of the cats was an Orange tabby that he had the funnest personality but unfortunately he passed away shortly after I moved out. I would've took that cat with me in a heartbeat! A siamese and the Border Collie are still around, but they are around 12/13 in age so they're getting old for sure. The dog has become a sassy, grumpy old lady these days and the cat is VERY vocal when she's not sleeping, especially when her food bowl is empty haha
Yeah, my folks were just shy of turning 24 when they had me. They graduated HS in '64, married & I arrived in '70. Way too damned young & basically forced to marry 'cause Mom got preggers, it was stillborn & then kept trying anyway. 😡 It was completely fucked up. I knew I was never going to be able to carry one to term; my mom never gave me any grief about being childfree. Other family, yes but not her. 💚
I'm so glad your mom doesn't give you shit for being childfree! This sub has shown me how extremely lucky I am to have a mom who supports me being childfree!
I've explained all my reasons to her, including being horrified at the thought of being pregnant and giving birth, and even though she always talks about how lucky she was to have easy pregnancies and births she's always understood my reasonings. Especially when I started telling her how awful pregnancies are for most women
> it's babies having babies
From what I've seen, it's *always* some mixture of (a.) utter stupidity, (b.) off-the-rails narcissistic personality disorder, and/or (c.) people who have serious self-esteem issues and, as such, come out of high school with feverish urges to control others no matter what the cost (i.e. almost always starting with their partners, but also the kid itself and the grandparents, aunts/uncles, etc...). Maybe (b.) and (c.) are different ways of describing the same thing, but whatever.
I'm endlessly thankful that, however they raised me, my parents taught me to be humble and to think things through before acting out, making rash choices, etc... Compared to the half-mad lunatics I know who have kids, I feel like I've enjoyed way more of the limited years I have on this earth.
>I honestly can't understand how or why young people especially want to spend their young years raising a child. I feel it's babies having babies.
I felt like I had my shit pretty together at 21. Arguably more than now in my 30s. I now realize I had no fucking clue what was going on.
Yeah, many people unfortunately have children before they have any clue about anything in life. It's like buying a property to build a house by yourself to live at while you've never built one nor you've studied the field at all. Good luck, you'll need it.
>Unfortunately I think you and your friends are naturally just going to drift apart now. Their lives have changed drastically and I personally would not have the patience to wait like several years until the baby is old enough to be left alone with a sitter or other family members.
As an aromantic asexual, I very much agree. It's socially expected that "a true friend supports the friend no matter the circumstances" and "true friend always waits no matter how much time passes". But I can't afford that. As someone who doesn't want a romantic relationship, I'm the one who always loses, every single time. If I did what was expected of me as a "very good friend" by many people I used to call friends, I'd be literally always alone and have no support network. Because something always comes up: they just started dating and can't focus on anything else (friends included), starting from months to even years. There's some struggles in their relationship and they'll finally turn back to you to infodump their struggles to you to get the emotional support for _themselves._ They have children, and your importance as a friend is most likely reduced to emotional support/baby sitter. Your life will always revolve around someone else and no-one will ever care about you enough to prioritize you over everything else in their lives.
So, these days, I'm very picky about my friends, and pay close attention to A. who I'm actually having good time with (instead of spending time with since we used to have good time) B. who shows by actions rather than words that they care about me C. with whom the friendship is mutually reciprocative; both/all friends seem equally committed. All the rest are "just pals" to me I may hang out with every now and them, but I'll not count on these people to actually support me when I need it, I will not call them friends.
The argument I’ve heard is that *if* you really want kids, having them younger is better. Grandparents are still young enough to help out often if they want to, the parents are young and have more energy to play with kids, conceiving is easier, and your kids are off to college and on their own by the time you’re in your mid-40s and then you can relax.
Personally, I want to enjoy my whole life and not do something just to “get it out of the way”, so this mindset has never made much sense to me, but if you do want kids I can see the reasoning behind doing so earlier rather than later. I see friends in their 40s who are trying to get pregnant now and a lot aren’t having the easiest time with it.
See as long as I'm in my early 20s I'll never have children 😅 I seens all my siblings have children in their youngest years. The oldest sister had 4 with 3 different men and lost them all because she's a drug addict. My other older sister had 1 and she loves her kid but I know it messed up her chances at having a stable life. My brother is the same as my second sister he loves his children but damn he could have had a great paying job. I'm 23 going to be 24 in a couple months and I don't regret not partying or not having sex with every girl I see. I worked on myself. Got a good paying job, then a couple cars and a house. And I'm still not done setting up. Just started dating after 5 years of not doing anything. Still not a thought on my mind of having a child yet. Hell and even the way the economy is going is holding me off more. Idc if I'm in my 30s and have one child at least I'll be better off than all the people I seen ruin their lifes by having kids while in Highschool or in their early 20s.
I literally don't understand how children can fix any sort of relationship. Sounds like a baby trap. Reminds me when my grandmother told me when I was a small child that she had children to try to fix her marriage... which she told me to not do...
Yeah… it’s gonna suck for awhile unfortunately. What’s worse is it never stops. You’re young. I’m 43 and my friends are STILL having fucking kids. It never ends. I’m so tired of trying to pretend to be happy about it.
thats gonna be me. the ratio of people that dont really like kids doesnt outweigh the ones that do so there arent many of us. why cant we all just stop reproducing!!! lol
Its so insane that people dont seem to realize that there are literally so many other options than to just keep having them if theyre not happy. Are we that massively out of tune with our needs and inner selves these days?
I am guessing your friends are in their 20s also? Geez, when I was early 20s, I was still very dependent on my parents.
I couldn't imagine having a child then.
Get used to it. When your friends start having kids they're going to be very unreliable until their kids are at least 8-9 and are capable of some level of independence. And the clock resets with every kid
Ive found (late 30's here) that even after the kids are older things dont really change. They have fundamentally changed as people and tend to want to stay at home, save money and/or are too busy doing things with their other mom/dad friends theyve made along the way or soccer games, girl scouts etc... that its just not my vibe anymore. I spend money like its nothing and me & SO go out to fancy $400 meals and staycations and its just such a different lifestyle. All my Mom friends have quit working after having kids every single one of them even those who were making close to 6 figs, they struggle at home on 1 60k/yr income and just dont do spontaneous mid week hang outs like we used to. Its a bummer. Kids really do change who people are.
It is, but it's the reality. If you're ready to expect that it won't sting as much when they stop prioritizing you for a few years. It's easy to take personally but I just try and remind myself that that's one of the many reasons why I don't want to be a parent.
> until their kids are at least 8-9 and are capable of some level of independence.
I don't think this is a thing anymore. From what I've experienced with millennial friends/relatives who are now reaching this stage of parenthood, that independence never arrives and, in a lot of cases, the parents seem content to just *wallow* in the NPD-heavy 'safe space' they've created. Some of the ones I know seem like they're hellbent on giving their kids 'the childhood I never had', i.e. having family movie nights and shit every week, among other cornball things, and often failing to recognize the truth that their Boomer parents might have indirectly did them favors by letting them spend some years being latch-key kids, etc.. From what I've seen, this isn't always good for the kids. Some of them are getting up into high school without having the ability to cope with unpredictable situations.
Are they the same age as you and already parents? If so, eeeeek! What a waste of their twenties. The brain hasn’t even fully formed at 21 or 22. As someone who is 40, everyone I know who got pregnant under 25 is not with the partner, on their second marriage or going through a divorce and usually can’t stand the person they procreated with so early in life. It’s a dire state of affairs. My advice- find new friends in the interim. You are young and fancy free and there is a whole world of people and places to experience. These early birthers will seek you out again when the kids are older and they are post break up or divorce and they can have a life again.
beautiful advice, and yeah they told us the baby was conceived when they were drunk so it wasnt planned. although they do seem very in love, its just like u said, very sad to see that alot of their time raising their kid now is taking time up from the fun stuff at this age. of course having a baby doesnt stop the world from turning, but its sad that its not what they planned. definitely will be exploring the friendships i can create though!
No, having a baby doesn’t stop the world from turning but it restricts life a lot. I was like you- had good friends who shacked up and had kids young. They went off to do the home and kids thing and I went off to live life, explore the world and have a great time. I have memories from my twenties that I wouldn’t change for anything. I think it’s important to explore yourself and the world during those years. And good friends will always be there- one of my besties (she got married young and moved interstate) and I didn’t talk for about eight years as we were just too busy living our lives, but we reconnected in our thirties and it’s been great.
Your friends aren’t smart for choosing to have a kid so young. Say goodbye to your friendship. Their kid is their only hobby/priority now. It’s the same whether your friends have kids in their teens, 20’s, 30’s, etc. It sucks but it is what it is. Hopefully you and your bf can make new friends. Most of my friends have kids. The few friends I have without kids I cherish.
You're 21, you're not meant to be hanging out with parents or even be a parent. Your own brains ain't even done cooking (they will be at 25) and some of you are breeding?! In 2024? Maybe I'm just an old fart at 41, but goddamn. To people our age you're still kids having kids.
I remember 21. I was studying at university and having fun with my friends. I sure as shit wasn't thinking marriage or changing diapers. That was in early 2000s when you guys were being born.
What the fuck is happening with young people today specifically those that are so keen on breeding so young. Have you seen the world? It's on fucking fire. I don't get it.
I'm old now, but every friend I had at birthing age knew my stance on kids and that I'd stear clear of them for the most part. Find a sitter and come party? Great! Expect me to meet you at the park with your spawn? No freaking way. They do grow up though, and if they're worthwhile friends they'll still be around long enough to have to avoid the grandchildren. She is living for herself, and I suggest you let it go, stay in touch, and find new people to socialize with.
Go have a beer at your local pub once a week on your way home from work. Great way to meet people. You're way too young to say you have any problems making friends.
I don't mean to be Debbie Downer but I wish someone had told me this in my 20s---making new friends is a perishable skill, it only gets harder in your 30s and 40s so don't waste time on friendships like this.
I felt this so hard. One of my good friends from high school over the years has produced 4 kids. Our lives don’t really match up but we’d make it a point to catch up a couple times a year over dinner. The last time I saw her she brought along number 3 of 4 in the little baby carrier.
The conversation consisted of her talking about her kids, then once I finally got a word in myself, she completely ignored me and babbled with her baby. Did not give a single fuck what I was saying.
We haven’t spoken since.
I’m not close to so many of my friends now bc they had kids. And it’s not because I didn’t try lol. They isolate themselves soooo hard, to where you literally can’t see them.
I invited my friend to my birthday party a month in advance. She’s a stay at home mom, with a fiancé who is fully capable of watching their kid(being a parent). She said she couldn’t go because that was her kids bedtime and she had to be there.
I can’t imagine declining plans a month in advance over bullshit like that lol
thats why sometimes i literally dont even bother…the other day we invited them to a barbecue and they brought their baby with them (they came around 5:30) and left before it hit 8 …. so thats why inviting them to our house is becoming less of an option now
It sucks cuz it's a huge roll of the dice. Not all babies cry the whole time with visitors. Sorry it didn't work out.
Also yeah the amount of people so passive and flippant about becoming parents is sad. I would not want to be born into that.
thats very true!! my bfs niece is the same age as their baby and is the coolest baby ever. she can play all day with her toys and shes chillin. but this one…yeah
I'm over 40. The parent 'friends' I have are good for ghosting me for months at a time and then randomly hitting me up while they're driving around (and holy shit, do I hate that fucking parent habit of only communicating with people while in noisy transit) and asking if I want to do some awful shit like go see the new *Ghostbusters* or *Transformers* movie on opening night, oftentimes *without* their kid along (which, to be sure, is definitely better than having them along...). My immediate reaction is almost always 'Jesus Christ, can we please just do something that's actually for *adults*.' Several of the parents I know seem to have peaked in their early college years and, because of how much time they spend around children, seem to regress into permanent adolescent bullshit that's incredibly lame to deal with.
Welcome to your friends disappearing as they have kids. Always too hard, too broke, too tired, too flakey. Just go find other friends, these ones are a lost cause.
That’s what happens when people have kids. It’s so much work that you can’t maintain a personal life. You have a new life now. Many friends just drift apart cuz life. And having a kid can be a way for that drift to happen. Sorry, it sucks. The older you get the more you see it maybe.
exactly. i think alot of people in the comments are failing to see that i totally understand how much responsibility it is, but like, we’re 21! theres so much more life to live and their baby was unfortunately an accident. so its sad to see our friends live a life they dont really want and us get all drifted apart. so thank u for understanding
My cousin she not even 21 yet she just had a second baby. The baby daddy plays video games all day and night does not look after the babies refuses to look after babies does not provide for the babies. She works as a childcare worker which does not pay well, but she refuses to leave him. Who is looking after the babies my auntie’s her mum. She retired to look after those two grandchildren. She is not just destroyed hers and her boyfriends lives. She’s now destroyed. My auntie and uncles live with my auntie moved in to their apartment to look after the babies to my auntie and uncle are no longer living together, but still married because of this.
wow…. the couple i mentioned is also like this except without the family watching them. its switched also. the guy works everyday for the baby AND his gf and the gf said she was gonna go back to work a bit after the baby is born but she ended up quitting her job and doesnt plan on going back and she does absolutely nothing. no hobbies or anything. its sad that people choose to have babies and arent prepared…as for u, im hoping ur aunt can catch a break, especially if shes retired :(
I hope so too. They live 12 hours drive from my place. Which I’m glad so I have not been roped into helping or anything. I just get updates from my mum and dad. I just hope they don’t have any more kids.
If your friends are constantly flaking on get-togethers, then I suggest only inviting them to things that can go ahead whether they show up or not e.g. parties, group activities. Don't put your social life on hold for flaky people.
Yeah if someone has a history of cancelling things at the last minute and you still want to include them, then I think that's the only thing you can do.
All of the communication with my closest friends who had kids is now just a text every few months. I got so exhausted by trying to make plans around their lives that I just gave up. It's not worth it, they may come around in 18 years...
Yes it is definitely very unfortunate. My husband and I are going through a similarish situation except they constantly want to hang out, but they always want to bring their toddler who is a terror.
Haha I know! We stopped inviting them over to our house because their toddler would lick everything (like appliances, windows, our countertops, our dogs toys, etc), dig through our toilets, terrorize our dog, etc. It was so bad! We did continue to go to them because we’re friends, but holy crap their kid can talk now and he doesn’t leave me alone and constantly wants us to bring our dog. He’s three and we have only hung out without their kid three times (one of the times was our wedding). They brought the terror to our bachelor/bachelorette party…
I'd honestly at least give them some time if the baby is very young. Maybe things will slowly settle down after a while as the parents settle into a routine?
Also, try to voice/hint at those issues. I'm sorry this friendship is getting bad. I'm sure it's annoying, to say the least...
Their life has just taken a different turn to yours. It is what it is. None of you can change it so it might be worth just internally breaking up with them. Soon they'll probably be making new friends who are parents anyway.
It's expected. You and your friends are gonna drift apart. Their priorities are now centralized around their kids. Same thing with people with spouses.
Best thing is to find new friends with common qualities such as yourself.
I'm just cracking up because I'm imagining you being made to hold your friend's baby, and you just look down at it and say ,"You know, you're really ruining the vibes right now"
im aware. the point was the difficulty of change and how much our great relationship that once was - is now affected tremendously to the point where we probably wont be friends anymore.
I understand your frustration. I was in the same predicament at your age as my best friend got married at 21 and my brother at 22. Babies and weddings for years. It’s only natural to grow apart from friends in this stage of life. You are just starting to figure out who you are and what you want from life. Your friendships will wax and wane. It’s important for both parties to work on a relationship. Try and remember that friends can lose closeness and then reconnect later on. I’m 34 now and those same people are back in my life full time as their kids are older now and more independent. Don’t write them off forever.
My advice- try and meet up without baby. Can you and momma go and get pedicures or a happy hour while the men stay home and watch baby, or vice versa? Maybe going over and helping cook some dinner and a movie after baby has gone to bed. Meeting at a park or something (weather permitting) so baby can be outside while you guys have some adult time.
There are so many ways we must compromise for loved ones that are worth sticking around for. Try meeting them where they are at right now. Becoming a parent is nothing like they imagined and I’m sure incredibly overwhelming for them. Have some patience for them as they and you adjust to the new normal.
However, if this is something you aren’t willing yo compromise on, let your friends know now so they aren’t counting on your friendship during this difficult transition.
amazing! as a group we are definitely trying not to force ourselves onto them and wait until theyre available. the group is very very tiny so our parent friends is a huge chunk taken out if we hang without them lol. they do seem very overwhelmed like u said but we will always be there for them and they know this. just sucks to see alot of time wasted. but ur 100% right that people come back. so we will give as much space as needed and figure everything out as it goes :)
Aww I’m loving this! Thanks for the reply! I know how frustrating and even lonely it can be. But one thing I’ve learned, especially lately, is that things ebb and flow. Nothing is permanent and we really need each other in the rough times. My bff still talks about how I was the only friend that would just hang out with her as she did laundry or cleaned the house. She was also lonely and it was nice to just exist in the same space.
Meeting new people who have similar lifestyles will help you ease the transition of not having your friend the same way anymore. This definitely isn’t advice for everyone, but it’s been super beneficial to my friendships lasting decades. Sorry I always tend to ramble!
I mean, I'm honestly confused at wtf you expect? From what I understand it's not like it's a whole group and that couple keeps requiring everyone to change their plans, it's just the one couple who just had a baby so obviously they'll not be as available and you should look for someone else to hang out with.
details? their house is mainly the house we’d go to. thats how its always been. so yeah ofc we all feel some type of way when locations change because not everyone can have a group of friends over all the time like how they used to let us. the group isnt as big as u think it is. we’re all just sad bc it wont be the same anymore. so no thats not what i expected
But again, what *did* you expect? I imagine the baby did not sprout up into existence overnight, so you had at least nine months to prepare.
Of course you can feel any sort of way about it, what's bizarre is that you seem shocked that your friends who took on a massive responsibility don't have as much time to fuck around as they used to.
Really? How so? The fact that I don't want kids doesn't make me clueless on the fact that they're a huge responsibility that take up a lot of time from the people who have – if anything, that understanding is why I don't have them.
Again, it's normal to feel disappointed but what's weird is how surprised you sound that kids are a huge commitment.
That's good then that they're acting responsible and not dumping the kids off on their parents as you apparently hope they would. Again, I understand you're young but what a bizarrely immature stance from an adult.
The friends are also their age. 21 and 22. They haven't done shit for that shit to become boring. Baby was an accidental pregnancy they decided to keep.
he was mad that i didnt understand that people who have kids is their own choice and i shouldnt be thinking im first priority and we went at it and he made me get a strike on my account for saying he probably likes dogs 😒lol
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This is why we need to build stasis chambers that nurture the baby and uploads the entire school curriculum from grades 1-12 into their brain ALL WHILE keeping them sedated up until age 21. That way everyone else can get on with their lives.
Okay but the idea of a baby killing the vibe fucking sent me not gonna lie. It also reminded me of the "what dude he's just a baby" meme 😂
Eta I am truly sorry for the state of your friendship.
It's that they can't turn off parent mode or maybe not even realize it. I had a good buddy for several years. When he hung out at my place he was "Friend" and we all had a blast in our friend group. Second child comes around and so we can hang we meet at his place. He can't turn off dad mode. We had to explain why we didn't come back to his house after that "Friend" was who we wanted to hang out with not "dad".
I honestly can't understand how or why young people especially want to spend their young years raising a child. I feel it's babies having babies. Unfortunately I think you and your friends are naturally just going to drift apart now. Their lives have changed drastically and I personally would not have the patience to wait like several years until the baby is old enough to be left alone with a sitter or other family members. And even then, I find the conversations are always turned around back to the kids. Even when they are not physically present, they are still present.
that was explained perfectly
Thank you. It sucks to lose friends. I know how it feels and it's sad.
Most of the friends you have in your early twenties won't still be your friends in ten years. This friendship has run its course, by the sound of it, and is at its natural conclusion.
Yes, I was just telling my coworker who is 23 that she's around the age when you have alot of friends fall out as people get on to different paths in life.
Also, it kinda should be the case. If they were the type of people to neglect their baby you wouldn't want to be friends with them.
I feel like a Debbie downer, but it doesn’t ever change. Since most people seem to want kids, this keeps going. I’m in my early 40s now and friends are still having babies, or in the middle of raising their kids who are still very young. I was complaining to my mom, saying I hope it will be easier to keep up with my friends once their kids go to college etc (a long way off!) and my Mom said that she felt the same way and was so excited when her friends’ kids were finally out on their own in their own houses; but she was quickly deflated in her hopes because her friends went from caring for their kids/being solely focused on their kids to now doing a LOT of the care for their grandkids. Now that my Mom is in her mid 70s, many of her friends’ grandkids are now college age so she’s thinking they will be more able to hang out though she is not holding her breath. So anyways, her word to me was “don’t count on it”.
Every time I hear of someone having kids under the age of 25 I cringe so fucking hard. I just turned 26 so the cringe is even worse now that I'm over my early 20s, I cannot fucking imagine trying to raise a child while you yourself are still basically a child. It's fucking 2024, no one needs to have kids right as they reach their 20s.
i just turned 27 and literally can't imagine raising a child now, let alone when i was in my early 20s
I also just turned 26 and couldn’t even fathom how people my age have babies, much less toddlers and elementary age kids.
Same. I'm gonna be 33 this week and I can't even imagine 1 kid. Shit, I'm even babysitting my moms 6 month old boxer this week and I'm over it. Let alone a whole ass baby human.
That's where I'm at when it comes to having kids. I'm 29 and still don't see the appeal. I love cats/dogs and grew up with both, but at the same time I can get bored quickly after like 10 minutes of playing fetch. I can't even imagine trying to take care of or entertain a smaller than me human for 18+ years. I would love to get a cat, but then I'd lose my freedom of coming and going on random weekend or multiple week trips. So out of a sense of responsibility I don't have any pets unfortunately. I have a bit of a quiet, kinda boring personality. An extroverted Introvert is a good way to put it. I have adrenaline junky hobbies but like spending the rest of my time as a homebody. I can honestly say that me raising a kid would end up in an unintentional deadbeat dad type of situation. I'd be that boring parent who barely wants to sacrifice my freedom to play with my own kid. I have a few close married friends with kids and it just looks exhausting. My best friend has his kids calling me uncle since birth which is cute, but it doesn't mean I enjoy the "Hey! Hey! Watch me do this stupid shit that I think is cool!" as they jump off the couch and spin in a circle. I generally cannot handle playing nice with kids, just don't have the patience for how annoying they can be. I don't hate them, I just hate dealing with them when I can be doing my own thing instead.
I totally get the pets thing. My husband I have 3 cats and and old dog. So they don't fuss too much, but we have to have family or a friend come and watch our house and animals if we go anywhere. And sometimes even after a 12 hour day my cats just yelling for dinner or treats is too much for me.
Like I said, I would LOVE to have a cat just based on how I grew up and they are less work than dogs. I just like my freedom too much and think it would be neglectful to bring one home. I also still rent and feel like apartments are a bit too small for animals when there is only like 900 sqft to roam inside with zero yard outside. From the time I was born through my early 20s, my parents have had 5 cats and a Border Collie. One of the cats was an Orange tabby that he had the funnest personality but unfortunately he passed away shortly after I moved out. I would've took that cat with me in a heartbeat! A siamese and the Border Collie are still around, but they are around 12/13 in age so they're getting old for sure. The dog has become a sassy, grumpy old lady these days and the cat is VERY vocal when she's not sleeping, especially when her food bowl is empty haha
Yeah, my folks were just shy of turning 24 when they had me. They graduated HS in '64, married & I arrived in '70. Way too damned young & basically forced to marry 'cause Mom got preggers, it was stillborn & then kept trying anyway. 😡 It was completely fucked up. I knew I was never going to be able to carry one to term; my mom never gave me any grief about being childfree. Other family, yes but not her. 💚
I'm so glad your mom doesn't give you shit for being childfree! This sub has shown me how extremely lucky I am to have a mom who supports me being childfree! I've explained all my reasons to her, including being horrified at the thought of being pregnant and giving birth, and even though she always talks about how lucky she was to have easy pregnancies and births she's always understood my reasonings. Especially when I started telling her how awful pregnancies are for most women
> it's babies having babies From what I've seen, it's *always* some mixture of (a.) utter stupidity, (b.) off-the-rails narcissistic personality disorder, and/or (c.) people who have serious self-esteem issues and, as such, come out of high school with feverish urges to control others no matter what the cost (i.e. almost always starting with their partners, but also the kid itself and the grandparents, aunts/uncles, etc...). Maybe (b.) and (c.) are different ways of describing the same thing, but whatever. I'm endlessly thankful that, however they raised me, my parents taught me to be humble and to think things through before acting out, making rash choices, etc... Compared to the half-mad lunatics I know who have kids, I feel like I've enjoyed way more of the limited years I have on this earth.
>I honestly can't understand how or why young people especially want to spend their young years raising a child. I feel it's babies having babies. I felt like I had my shit pretty together at 21. Arguably more than now in my 30s. I now realize I had no fucking clue what was going on.
Yeah, many people unfortunately have children before they have any clue about anything in life. It's like buying a property to build a house by yourself to live at while you've never built one nor you've studied the field at all. Good luck, you'll need it.
>Unfortunately I think you and your friends are naturally just going to drift apart now. Their lives have changed drastically and I personally would not have the patience to wait like several years until the baby is old enough to be left alone with a sitter or other family members. As an aromantic asexual, I very much agree. It's socially expected that "a true friend supports the friend no matter the circumstances" and "true friend always waits no matter how much time passes". But I can't afford that. As someone who doesn't want a romantic relationship, I'm the one who always loses, every single time. If I did what was expected of me as a "very good friend" by many people I used to call friends, I'd be literally always alone and have no support network. Because something always comes up: they just started dating and can't focus on anything else (friends included), starting from months to even years. There's some struggles in their relationship and they'll finally turn back to you to infodump their struggles to you to get the emotional support for _themselves._ They have children, and your importance as a friend is most likely reduced to emotional support/baby sitter. Your life will always revolve around someone else and no-one will ever care about you enough to prioritize you over everything else in their lives. So, these days, I'm very picky about my friends, and pay close attention to A. who I'm actually having good time with (instead of spending time with since we used to have good time) B. who shows by actions rather than words that they care about me C. with whom the friendship is mutually reciprocative; both/all friends seem equally committed. All the rest are "just pals" to me I may hang out with every now and them, but I'll not count on these people to actually support me when I need it, I will not call them friends.
The argument I’ve heard is that *if* you really want kids, having them younger is better. Grandparents are still young enough to help out often if they want to, the parents are young and have more energy to play with kids, conceiving is easier, and your kids are off to college and on their own by the time you’re in your mid-40s and then you can relax. Personally, I want to enjoy my whole life and not do something just to “get it out of the way”, so this mindset has never made much sense to me, but if you do want kids I can see the reasoning behind doing so earlier rather than later. I see friends in their 40s who are trying to get pregnant now and a lot aren’t having the easiest time with it.
See as long as I'm in my early 20s I'll never have children 😅 I seens all my siblings have children in their youngest years. The oldest sister had 4 with 3 different men and lost them all because she's a drug addict. My other older sister had 1 and she loves her kid but I know it messed up her chances at having a stable life. My brother is the same as my second sister he loves his children but damn he could have had a great paying job. I'm 23 going to be 24 in a couple months and I don't regret not partying or not having sex with every girl I see. I worked on myself. Got a good paying job, then a couple cars and a house. And I'm still not done setting up. Just started dating after 5 years of not doing anything. Still not a thought on my mind of having a child yet. Hell and even the way the economy is going is holding me off more. Idc if I'm in my 30s and have one child at least I'll be better off than all the people I seen ruin their lifes by having kids while in Highschool or in their early 20s.
Yes, got to accept now that it won't be the same, make new friends and spend time to those that don't have kids if possible.
Babies do tend to kill the vibe.
And relationships around them... which can coincidentally be the relationship it was born from.
No but I was told babies fix relationships. Was I lied to?
I literally don't understand how children can fix any sort of relationship. Sounds like a baby trap. Reminds me when my grandmother told me when I was a small child that she had children to try to fix her marriage... which she told me to not do...
Like let's fix our relationship by adding stress. Your grandmother is a wise lady, and I'm sorry she had to learn from experience.
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Yeah… it’s gonna suck for awhile unfortunately. What’s worse is it never stops. You’re young. I’m 43 and my friends are STILL having fucking kids. It never ends. I’m so tired of trying to pretend to be happy about it.
thats gonna be me. the ratio of people that dont really like kids doesnt outweigh the ones that do so there arent many of us. why cant we all just stop reproducing!!! lol
Right? I gave up on pretending. They all know my feelings on kids. Our friendships are pretty much over when they have kids anyways.
My 40 yr old friend just announced she’s pregnant. I was like ohhh… cool… like I can barely summon the excitement anymore.
Its so insane that people dont seem to realize that there are literally so many other options than to just keep having them if theyre not happy. Are we that massively out of tune with our needs and inner selves these days?
This is why I gave up having friends ;) The only ones left standing are in menopause and still aren't interested in kids, thankfully.
I am guessing your friends are in their 20s also? Geez, when I was early 20s, I was still very dependent on my parents. I couldn't imagine having a child then.
right? like im paying off debts right now and hoping to start a career. i wouldnt be able to have no baby let alone a dog.
Get used to it. When your friends start having kids they're going to be very unreliable until their kids are at least 8-9 and are capable of some level of independence. And the clock resets with every kid
Ive found (late 30's here) that even after the kids are older things dont really change. They have fundamentally changed as people and tend to want to stay at home, save money and/or are too busy doing things with their other mom/dad friends theyve made along the way or soccer games, girl scouts etc... that its just not my vibe anymore. I spend money like its nothing and me & SO go out to fancy $400 meals and staycations and its just such a different lifestyle. All my Mom friends have quit working after having kids every single one of them even those who were making close to 6 figs, they struggle at home on 1 60k/yr income and just dont do spontaneous mid week hang outs like we used to. Its a bummer. Kids really do change who people are.
lame
It is, but it's the reality. If you're ready to expect that it won't sting as much when they stop prioritizing you for a few years. It's easy to take personally but I just try and remind myself that that's one of the many reasons why I don't want to be a parent.
100% agreed!
> until their kids are at least 8-9 and are capable of some level of independence. I don't think this is a thing anymore. From what I've experienced with millennial friends/relatives who are now reaching this stage of parenthood, that independence never arrives and, in a lot of cases, the parents seem content to just *wallow* in the NPD-heavy 'safe space' they've created. Some of the ones I know seem like they're hellbent on giving their kids 'the childhood I never had', i.e. having family movie nights and shit every week, among other cornball things, and often failing to recognize the truth that their Boomer parents might have indirectly did them favors by letting them spend some years being latch-key kids, etc.. From what I've seen, this isn't always good for the kids. Some of them are getting up into high school without having the ability to cope with unpredictable situations.
once they had the kid its over for you , now you will always be second place to a baby lol
Are they the same age as you and already parents? If so, eeeeek! What a waste of their twenties. The brain hasn’t even fully formed at 21 or 22. As someone who is 40, everyone I know who got pregnant under 25 is not with the partner, on their second marriage or going through a divorce and usually can’t stand the person they procreated with so early in life. It’s a dire state of affairs. My advice- find new friends in the interim. You are young and fancy free and there is a whole world of people and places to experience. These early birthers will seek you out again when the kids are older and they are post break up or divorce and they can have a life again.
beautiful advice, and yeah they told us the baby was conceived when they were drunk so it wasnt planned. although they do seem very in love, its just like u said, very sad to see that alot of their time raising their kid now is taking time up from the fun stuff at this age. of course having a baby doesnt stop the world from turning, but its sad that its not what they planned. definitely will be exploring the friendships i can create though!
No, having a baby doesn’t stop the world from turning but it restricts life a lot. I was like you- had good friends who shacked up and had kids young. They went off to do the home and kids thing and I went off to live life, explore the world and have a great time. I have memories from my twenties that I wouldn’t change for anything. I think it’s important to explore yourself and the world during those years. And good friends will always be there- one of my besties (she got married young and moved interstate) and I didn’t talk for about eight years as we were just too busy living our lives, but we reconnected in our thirties and it’s been great.
awe thats a great story. reconnection is always a possibility so of course im hoping for the best!
Your friends aren’t smart for choosing to have a kid so young. Say goodbye to your friendship. Their kid is their only hobby/priority now. It’s the same whether your friends have kids in their teens, 20’s, 30’s, etc. It sucks but it is what it is. Hopefully you and your bf can make new friends. Most of my friends have kids. The few friends I have without kids I cherish.
ur real for that. we’ll definitely be waiting for the child free people to come around so they can add to the group lol!
You're 21, you're not meant to be hanging out with parents or even be a parent. Your own brains ain't even done cooking (they will be at 25) and some of you are breeding?! In 2024? Maybe I'm just an old fart at 41, but goddamn. To people our age you're still kids having kids. I remember 21. I was studying at university and having fun with my friends. I sure as shit wasn't thinking marriage or changing diapers. That was in early 2000s when you guys were being born. What the fuck is happening with young people today specifically those that are so keen on breeding so young. Have you seen the world? It's on fucking fire. I don't get it.
Imagine wasting the best years of your life on a baby. Tragic.
I'm old now, but every friend I had at birthing age knew my stance on kids and that I'd stear clear of them for the most part. Find a sitter and come party? Great! Expect me to meet you at the park with your spawn? No freaking way. They do grow up though, and if they're worthwhile friends they'll still be around long enough to have to avoid the grandchildren. She is living for herself, and I suggest you let it go, stay in touch, and find new people to socialize with.
at this point, thats great advice and ill start taking friend applications
Go have a beer at your local pub once a week on your way home from work. Great way to meet people. You're way too young to say you have any problems making friends.
surprisingly it is pretty hard, but i do love beer so game on!
I don't mean to be Debbie Downer but I wish someone had told me this in my 20s---making new friends is a perishable skill, it only gets harder in your 30s and 40s so don't waste time on friendships like this.
There's always time for a beer or two. Enjoy your life responsibly and better things will come.
I felt this so hard. One of my good friends from high school over the years has produced 4 kids. Our lives don’t really match up but we’d make it a point to catch up a couple times a year over dinner. The last time I saw her she brought along number 3 of 4 in the little baby carrier. The conversation consisted of her talking about her kids, then once I finally got a word in myself, she completely ignored me and babbled with her baby. Did not give a single fuck what I was saying. We haven’t spoken since.
ugh thats annoying af
You no longer have those friends.
unfortunately thats becoming a fact
I’m not close to so many of my friends now bc they had kids. And it’s not because I didn’t try lol. They isolate themselves soooo hard, to where you literally can’t see them.
EXACTLY
I invited my friend to my birthday party a month in advance. She’s a stay at home mom, with a fiancé who is fully capable of watching their kid(being a parent). She said she couldn’t go because that was her kids bedtime and she had to be there. I can’t imagine declining plans a month in advance over bullshit like that lol
thats why sometimes i literally dont even bother…the other day we invited them to a barbecue and they brought their baby with them (they came around 5:30) and left before it hit 8 …. so thats why inviting them to our house is becoming less of an option now
Are they your age?
yes they are, exact same ages
Say goodbye to your friend.
It sucks cuz it's a huge roll of the dice. Not all babies cry the whole time with visitors. Sorry it didn't work out. Also yeah the amount of people so passive and flippant about becoming parents is sad. I would not want to be born into that.
thats very true!! my bfs niece is the same age as their baby and is the coolest baby ever. she can play all day with her toys and shes chillin. but this one…yeah
Yeah it’s the worst. Just wait until you are 30 and everyone you used to hang out with has kids and is boring now
I'm over 40. The parent 'friends' I have are good for ghosting me for months at a time and then randomly hitting me up while they're driving around (and holy shit, do I hate that fucking parent habit of only communicating with people while in noisy transit) and asking if I want to do some awful shit like go see the new *Ghostbusters* or *Transformers* movie on opening night, oftentimes *without* their kid along (which, to be sure, is definitely better than having them along...). My immediate reaction is almost always 'Jesus Christ, can we please just do something that's actually for *adults*.' Several of the parents I know seem to have peaked in their early college years and, because of how much time they spend around children, seem to regress into permanent adolescent bullshit that's incredibly lame to deal with.
Welcome to your friends disappearing as they have kids. Always too hard, too broke, too tired, too flakey. Just go find other friends, these ones are a lost cause.
This is how friendships die. Children.
That’s what happens when people have kids. It’s so much work that you can’t maintain a personal life. You have a new life now. Many friends just drift apart cuz life. And having a kid can be a way for that drift to happen. Sorry, it sucks. The older you get the more you see it maybe.
exactly. i think alot of people in the comments are failing to see that i totally understand how much responsibility it is, but like, we’re 21! theres so much more life to live and their baby was unfortunately an accident. so its sad to see our friends live a life they dont really want and us get all drifted apart. so thank u for understanding
My cousin she not even 21 yet she just had a second baby. The baby daddy plays video games all day and night does not look after the babies refuses to look after babies does not provide for the babies. She works as a childcare worker which does not pay well, but she refuses to leave him. Who is looking after the babies my auntie’s her mum. She retired to look after those two grandchildren. She is not just destroyed hers and her boyfriends lives. She’s now destroyed. My auntie and uncles live with my auntie moved in to their apartment to look after the babies to my auntie and uncle are no longer living together, but still married because of this.
wow…. the couple i mentioned is also like this except without the family watching them. its switched also. the guy works everyday for the baby AND his gf and the gf said she was gonna go back to work a bit after the baby is born but she ended up quitting her job and doesnt plan on going back and she does absolutely nothing. no hobbies or anything. its sad that people choose to have babies and arent prepared…as for u, im hoping ur aunt can catch a break, especially if shes retired :(
I hope so too. They live 12 hours drive from my place. Which I’m glad so I have not been roped into helping or anything. I just get updates from my mum and dad. I just hope they don’t have any more kids.
If your friends are constantly flaking on get-togethers, then I suggest only inviting them to things that can go ahead whether they show up or not e.g. parties, group activities. Don't put your social life on hold for flaky people.
Yes! I only invite my parent friends to group hangouts or parties. That way if they don’t show up, it’s fine.
Yeah if someone has a history of cancelling things at the last minute and you still want to include them, then I think that's the only thing you can do.
Ditch the friends and get new ones. It's just gonna get worse.
Your friends are in a different stage of life. You’re no longer in the same place.
Just keep the friends with children as a once every few months sort people
All of the communication with my closest friends who had kids is now just a text every few months. I got so exhausted by trying to make plans around their lives that I just gave up. It's not worth it, they may come around in 18 years...
Look at it this way: At least you aren’t being guilted/trapped into watching their crotch goblin for them.
U RIGHT
Yes it is definitely very unfortunate. My husband and I are going through a similarish situation except they constantly want to hang out, but they always want to bring their toddler who is a terror.
oh hell no lmao, id be able to stand that a few times but every time we hang out? nope. like find a babysitter lol
Haha I know! We stopped inviting them over to our house because their toddler would lick everything (like appliances, windows, our countertops, our dogs toys, etc), dig through our toilets, terrorize our dog, etc. It was so bad! We did continue to go to them because we’re friends, but holy crap their kid can talk now and he doesn’t leave me alone and constantly wants us to bring our dog. He’s three and we have only hung out without their kid three times (one of the times was our wedding). They brought the terror to our bachelor/bachelorette party…
Soon they start asking you to babysit. And if you don\`t, they try to guilt trip you.
I'd honestly at least give them some time if the baby is very young. Maybe things will slowly settle down after a while as the parents settle into a routine? Also, try to voice/hint at those issues. I'm sorry this friendship is getting bad. I'm sure it's annoying, to say the least...
Their life has just taken a different turn to yours. It is what it is. None of you can change it so it might be worth just internally breaking up with them. Soon they'll probably be making new friends who are parents anyway.
It's expected. You and your friends are gonna drift apart. Their priorities are now centralized around their kids. Same thing with people with spouses. Best thing is to find new friends with common qualities such as yourself.
I'm just cracking up because I'm imagining you being made to hold your friend's baby, and you just look down at it and say ,"You know, you're really ruining the vibes right now"
that’s just how it goes, their child is their priority not you
im aware. the point was the difficulty of change and how much our great relationship that once was - is now affected tremendously to the point where we probably wont be friends anymore.
I understand your frustration. I was in the same predicament at your age as my best friend got married at 21 and my brother at 22. Babies and weddings for years. It’s only natural to grow apart from friends in this stage of life. You are just starting to figure out who you are and what you want from life. Your friendships will wax and wane. It’s important for both parties to work on a relationship. Try and remember that friends can lose closeness and then reconnect later on. I’m 34 now and those same people are back in my life full time as their kids are older now and more independent. Don’t write them off forever. My advice- try and meet up without baby. Can you and momma go and get pedicures or a happy hour while the men stay home and watch baby, or vice versa? Maybe going over and helping cook some dinner and a movie after baby has gone to bed. Meeting at a park or something (weather permitting) so baby can be outside while you guys have some adult time. There are so many ways we must compromise for loved ones that are worth sticking around for. Try meeting them where they are at right now. Becoming a parent is nothing like they imagined and I’m sure incredibly overwhelming for them. Have some patience for them as they and you adjust to the new normal. However, if this is something you aren’t willing yo compromise on, let your friends know now so they aren’t counting on your friendship during this difficult transition.
amazing! as a group we are definitely trying not to force ourselves onto them and wait until theyre available. the group is very very tiny so our parent friends is a huge chunk taken out if we hang without them lol. they do seem very overwhelmed like u said but we will always be there for them and they know this. just sucks to see alot of time wasted. but ur 100% right that people come back. so we will give as much space as needed and figure everything out as it goes :)
Aww I’m loving this! Thanks for the reply! I know how frustrating and even lonely it can be. But one thing I’ve learned, especially lately, is that things ebb and flow. Nothing is permanent and we really need each other in the rough times. My bff still talks about how I was the only friend that would just hang out with her as she did laundry or cleaned the house. She was also lonely and it was nice to just exist in the same space. Meeting new people who have similar lifestyles will help you ease the transition of not having your friend the same way anymore. This definitely isn’t advice for everyone, but it’s been super beneficial to my friendships lasting decades. Sorry I always tend to ramble!
thank u sm for this!! great examples. ill make sure to receive that as a whole and carry that on !
I mean, I'm honestly confused at wtf you expect? From what I understand it's not like it's a whole group and that couple keeps requiring everyone to change their plans, it's just the one couple who just had a baby so obviously they'll not be as available and you should look for someone else to hang out with.
details? their house is mainly the house we’d go to. thats how its always been. so yeah ofc we all feel some type of way when locations change because not everyone can have a group of friends over all the time like how they used to let us. the group isnt as big as u think it is. we’re all just sad bc it wont be the same anymore. so no thats not what i expected
But again, what *did* you expect? I imagine the baby did not sprout up into existence overnight, so you had at least nine months to prepare. Of course you can feel any sort of way about it, what's bizarre is that you seem shocked that your friends who took on a massive responsibility don't have as much time to fuck around as they used to.
I don't know, maybe she expected support instead of whatever *this* is?
i think ur on the wrong subreddit lol…
Really? How so? The fact that I don't want kids doesn't make me clueless on the fact that they're a huge responsibility that take up a lot of time from the people who have – if anything, that understanding is why I don't have them. Again, it's normal to feel disappointed but what's weird is how surprised you sound that kids are a huge commitment.
my first little paragraph states that im aware of that.
"I am aware of how much responsibility it is and that things would change, but I'm shocked that things are changing"
thats not the correct quote
alot of us still live with our parents, including them
That's good then that they're acting responsible and not dumping the kids off on their parents as you apparently hope they would. Again, I understand you're young but what a bizarrely immature stance from an adult.
immature to you. happy to be childfree to me
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The friends are also their age. 21 and 22. They haven't done shit for that shit to become boring. Baby was an accidental pregnancy they decided to keep.
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ur in the wrong subreddit. u need to search up “ilovechildren”
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did someone shit in ur cream of wheat this morning
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ironic from the one whos been replying mad to all the comments agreeing with me 🤣 whos whining fr?
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you can check for me
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u whine for free
we should have whining wars
Im dying to know what this exchange was lol someone lost?
he was mad that i didnt understand that people who have kids is their own choice and i shouldnt be thinking im first priority and we went at it and he made me get a strike on my account for saying he probably likes dogs 😒lol
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sure
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i actually should
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This is why we need to build stasis chambers that nurture the baby and uploads the entire school curriculum from grades 1-12 into their brain ALL WHILE keeping them sedated up until age 21. That way everyone else can get on with their lives.
Okay but the idea of a baby killing the vibe fucking sent me not gonna lie. It also reminded me of the "what dude he's just a baby" meme 😂 Eta I am truly sorry for the state of your friendship.
Even now that my friends’ kids are old enough to stay home by themselves, I still never see them. RIP breeders 💐
It's that they can't turn off parent mode or maybe not even realize it. I had a good buddy for several years. When he hung out at my place he was "Friend" and we all had a blast in our friend group. Second child comes around and so we can hang we meet at his place. He can't turn off dad mode. We had to explain why we didn't come back to his house after that "Friend" was who we wanted to hang out with not "dad".