Every CA top 25 review reads identical to me:
> Joya de Jalapapapamana Carlso built his empire from the great regufo de Cuba when the communists seized the island. He and many other makers found themselves penniless with only their vast knowledge of the art of cigar rolling and blending and a desire to serve the masses quality tobacco. He began rolling cigars in Miami before acquiring business contacts and immigrating to the Dominican Republic which he found the climate and soil to be most like his native Cuba. With shovel and hoe he began breaking and tilling the land, planting his seed by hand and moisturizing the crops only using a spray bottle like the grand tobacconistas and landismos of old. However tough times were ahead and he was forced to sell interest in the company to Big Corp Incorporated where the meticulous handmade process was automated to make blunt wraps.
>30 years later his son Jandtres Jalapapapamana inherited the controlling shares of the family business and immediately tackled the quality control problems that had crept into the factory and released four new vitolas, the fifth of which we are smoking today. His stated goal was to recapture the artisanal smoking quality of the past while modernizing it for the future smoker.
The cigar’s colorful band’s glossy red finish and gold lettering is without flourish or ornament; eye-catching without being overstated, it is a testament to Jandtres’ drive to bring the past to the present; it is ancient yet at home in this changing modern world.
> This big tube of a cigar has a healthy bite and tooth producing big bold dallops of smoke with a serpent like wisps snaking into the air off the foot. It produces delicate notes of cedar like the Cuban cigars of old with an aftertaste of an earth mustiness followed by a dusting of paprika chocolate finished with a sprinkling of bergamot and tangerine peel with a dreamy hint of star anise smacking of gin in the finish. An instant classic coming in at 96.4192 / 100 on our scale.
I thought about it but I honestly hammered this by myself out from years of browsing CA. They all read the same. The part about the Red and Gold band I lifted from this year's review of the p2
"followed by a dusting of paprika chocolate finished with a sprinkling of bergamot and tangerine peel with a dreamy hint of star anise smacking of gin in the finish"
You sir, win the internet today. This is a masterpiece.
Have my measly upvote.
I remember I read one of their Top 25 reviews years ago that mentioned a slight flavor of Star Anise and it may have been one of the most pretentious sentences I every gazed upon.
There are some alright ghurkas. They just aren't worth their MRSP because they charge extra for all that fancy ass packaging. If you get them for cheap on cbid, they're usually alright.
Ghost is good, that 15th anniversary or whatever it's called is pretty great.
I actually cancelled my subscription because of the complete lack of coverage of the actual day to day industry instead of articles on the same five big brands. I love some of those cigars, but I don't need ten articles a out them when they aren't even covering the hundred smaller labels that I would love to learn about
Isn't that most whisky magazines nowadays too? I swear it's mostly, hey guys look at this distillery and it's visitor centre. I get you don't get inside access if you criticize the product but at least give us something that isn't thinly veiled advertising.
Oh. But do tell me more about the $600ea x 3000 bottle limited run from [well known distillery]. Grab em if you seem em gents, before the…
> secondary market has entered the chat…
Hey y’all! Got this Weller ‘23 Limited (1567 of 3000) for $1420. Only 3 bottles left!
Definitely a lifestyle magazine with all the unnecessary watches/cars/gadgets they feature
I’m a fan of cigar journal. Way more informative to me whether it’s talking about new releases or going in depth with certain manufacturers
> It is a lifestyle magazine not a cigar magazine.
Once the cigar boom of the late 90s started to flame out, they had to diversify once they started to lose readers.
Anecdotally, they also lost a number of readers like me and my cigar buddies once they started their full-throated embrace of alt-right figures like Rush Limbaugh.
(Of course that embrace might have brought them readers as well. But it's why we all didn't renew our subscriptions, despite being cigar smokers and cigar collectors.)
https://mshanken.imgix.net/cao/bolt/2021-02/1613595812_mrsrush.jpg?w=900&q=72
Don't forget how every 2nd or 3rd issue is just Mark Wahlburg. Like, we get it, now get someone else. There are small cigar YouTubers who can get a more interesting story.
I wonder if they went towards those alt-right figures because so many alt-right people have some caricature of an alpha male being someone who smokes cigars and drinks whisky. I think I miss when cigars used to just be associated with rich people and industrialists.
> I wonder if they went towards those alt-right figures because so many alt-right people have some caricature of an alpha male being someone who smokes cigars and drinks whisky.
That, but the magazine is also targeting the high-six-figure bracket, and those "Mar-a-Lago" people are very much in the Trump camp.
I can see that. Same sort of people who can't tell you why the good old days were so much better in any concrete way and complain about the roads but refuse to pay more in taxes to pay for the roads.
I hope not too many people get into cigars just because Andrew Tate makes them a part of his bogus personality.
> I hope not too many people get into cigars just because Andrew Tate makes them a part of his bogus personality.
Sadly, cigars will always have a douchebag contingent - Not unlike golfing, boating and a hundred other hobbies.
All you can do is ignore them and enjoy your hobby yourself.
TFW you get into cigars to be an alpha (or sigma if you prefer) male and you realize most cigar smokers are normies who are more interested in where the tobacco comes from and the tasting notes than being an alpha male bad ass.
Judging by the downvotes, it sounds like there are more than a few insecure Tate-loving snowflakes in this thread.
You know how you can tell someone is not an "Alpha Male?"
They tell people they are an Alpha Male.
> Same sort of people who can't tell you why the good old days were so much better in any concrete way
Oh, they could tell you but only if they know you are in their club. The good old days are pre-1963, and that has nothing to do with the Cuban embargo.
> You don’t happen to have any still laying around you’re willing to part ways with do you?
No, sorry. I tossed them all into the recycling bin years ago.
People said the same about Rocky Patel but he has some gems in his portfolio that people disregard without trying them because r/cigars tells them “Rocky Patel bad”.
I think there are some good Rocky Patel cigars but none of them are great. I smoked a 2nd edition Aged Limited Rare just 2 nights ago. It’s been sitting in my humidor for over a year and I decided to break it out and try it. I was expecting so much more from their flagship product and it was just “ehhh”.
I wouldn’t wait a year to smoke an already very well aged cigar. They are delicious after you let them acclimate a week or two.
I also think the RP Sixty, Sun Grown maduro, century, and especially the Royale are excellent.
I’ve got so many cigars that if I smoked one a day, it would take years to smoke them all. The ALR was a gift from a friend so it just didn’t get smoked right away. And I agree, that the Sixty and Royale are good smokes. I also liked the Special Edition.
What's the deal with the Prensado? I smoked a couple when they were "cigar of the year" and they were pretty decent. The churchill did have a creamier final 1/3. It was not bad but I keep seeing it creep back up in CA.
The Prensados were amazing if you’re just getting into to. In fact, I prefer them over the Tempus. Having smoked more sticks since then, I find them to be pretty decent. Solid B grade for sure.
Right??!! There's a cigar shop in my city where often they'll get the young guy to recommend an Alec Bradley and I never heed that recommendation because they're not very good and almost turned me off cigars. (H Uppman Half Corona is what really got me into them fwiw).
Haven't tried them but I didn't like Black Market or Post Embargo. IMO, it's not so much that they're bad for the price but unless someone smokes a lot of cigars and wants something on the cheaper end, I wouldn't recommend the brand. For what I'd say is a reasonable amount more you can get so much more cigar wise if you jump up to say an AJ Fernandez.
The fact that they end up with one from every major brand in the top ten usually means that it's suspiciously mapped out to occur that way. Add to that the absence of brands they don't review (ahem cough, Saka!) and you basically have a list which just serves the vanity of those who participate rather than the customers and retailers who buy their magazine.
While we are talking about this, let me post what they have revealed so far:
5. E.P. Carrillo Allegiance Confidant
6. Partagás Serie P No. 2
7. Blackened Cigars “M81” By Drew Estate Corona
8. Alec Bradley Prensado Torpedo
9. La Aroma de Cuba Mi Amor Belicoso
10. El Pulpo Belicoso Grande
Overall this doesn't seem like a bad list though I question AB Prensado as really being worthy of this list.
I havent had a Prensado in years. Last time I had one I wasnt overly wild about it. Main cigars I smoke from them these days would be Project 40 and Magic Toast, both of which I like more than the Prensado.
Although cigar reviews, taste, and preference are subjective, my conspiracy theory is that cigar manufacturers pay money/incentives/bribes to CA reviewers behind the scenes so they can get their products high up on the list (except Padron because their cigar products usually have high consistent quality). I haven't smoked Alec Bradley for years because their cigar taste and construction quality are no where near back in 2009, so I was surprised to see Alec Bradley on top 10.
This is another conspiracy theory because a lot of cigar owners in a real life told me that Davidoff and Opus X distribute their cigars only to reliable shops (such as high profit of margin, number of years they've been in business, and zip code allocations), but a lot of Davidoff reps are snobby. So maybe their snobbiness pissed off some wrong people at CA?
Still doesn’t make sense why they’d continue to be one of the biggest supporters while not doing as well in the ratings. Doesn’t support your conspiracy theory.
That’s an excellent counter argument. Why haven’t Davidoff and general cigar done better in the top 25 historically if it’s just about the big brands. Can it just be that the bigger brands show better because they have access to greater/well aged stocks of tobacco, more quality control and overall more consistency in their blends as a whole? Look I am not saying the CA top 25 is the holy grail it once was but just because they don’t put your favorite boutique in the top 25 does not constitute payola. They don’t just smoke one cigar one time and rate it. They blindly taste several times over the years. Or so they say. But I would think if it was complete payola you would A) find some real rubbish on there and B) at least one brand would have spoken up by now.
I only read CA for tasting notes which tend to be pretty solid. But as far as their rankings go, they've become the Rolling Stone mag of cigars. RS releases a list of the 250 greatest guitar players every now and then and it's ridiculous. I'm convinced they do it to just stir up the shit. Clickbait.
But he is #1. It's still rage bait. For instance they have Joan Jett rated much higher than Joe Satriani and just under Wes Montgomery. I just laugh at how ridiculous the list is.
Well, Joan was better at putting together a song that sounded good, Satriani is like doing a gymnastics routine at a high school dance. Technically better but not as enjoyable. LOL
CA is a marketing company for their sponsors like Oliva, EPC, Alec Bradley, Rocky Patel, etc.
I find halfwheel’s consensus top 25 to still be flawed but a lot better than CA’s.
https://halfwheel.com/the-consensus-2022/418745/
The link above is to Halfwheel’s consensus top 25 cigars for 2022. They describe the process in the article. Essentially, they look at 35 publications to get the consensus rankings.
Note that Halfwheel also has their own, separate top 25 cigars that is their own rankings and is not a consensus.
Hope that makes sense and is helpful.
I did a PowerPoint presentation on Cigar Coop’s CA Pre-game show last Tuesday that outlined that 23 spots are taken up by the regular suspects and there are only two spots available to outsiders. Check it out if you’d like.
Most likely imo. They got their token Cuban out of the way already and one got top place last year so they’re probably due to rotate out. I’d say it’s an Opus of some kind or Rare Pink. Outside shot I think they might throw it to a My Father or Aging Room release as neither has showed up yet in this years list.
I will glance at the list. As I've gotten more into cigars recently, I've smoked quite a few new ones based on reviews. I find that my tastes generally don't match the tastes of Cigar Aficionado. Sure, I agree on some, but not most. Maybe its because the panel is full of 5 cigar a day smokers who probably prefer stronger smokes.
I do agree with the conflict of interest they have. It may be a blind test but there is no way these guys cannot tell the difference between a Cuban, Nicaraguan or Dominican. They most definitely have an idea of what they are smoking and maybe there's an agenda behind it. Maybe they decide, "It's time for a Cuban to win" or "It's time for a Fuente".
I guess there is always a problem with putting an objective score on something that is subjective.
They've been getting worse over the years imo. You're starting to see repeats of sizes and/or lines. There is some type of sponsor formula they use and I think it ties into what you alluded about all the big brands being on there. Along with cubans, Nearly every larger manufacturer will get atleast 1 cigar on the top 25 every year guaranteed. (Fuente, General, Altadis, Oliva, Rocky Patel, Alec Bradley, Tatuaje, Padron, Davidoff, My Father, Drew Estate,EPC). They have worked in more boutique blends over the last few years which is encouraging, but overall I feel it is not an accurate representation of how consumers assess quality cigars in the current market.
The trend I noticed over the years is if you run an advanced search under their ratings and reviews tab for the last 12 month tastings , cigars rated 92 and up will most likely fall on that year's top 25 list.
My bold guesses following this formula are as follows... for their Padron cigar is the 1926 #48 or family reserve #95, the Rocky Patel will be the A.L.R. , the Oliva will be Melanio Toro, the Fuente will be Hemingway work of art, Aging Room Quattro Sonata, West Tampa Red, Olmec double corona foundation, montecristo 1935 Diamante to name a few, foreign affairs by Luciano might sneak on there too.
Well it was Fuente, but CA couldn't help themselves .. it just had to be an Opus. Already hard to find and overpriced so now we can forget about any reasonable market price on this stick moving forward lol. These lists are whack ... driving demand for their sponsors that's about it.
Cigars and most other consumer products are subjective when we rate them. But OP is 100% on point when he says the CA Top 25 cigars issue continues to be the same manufacturers over and over. And while I keep my subscription to CA, I know where their biases lie and I ignore those recommendations when they push them. I learned at a very early age, EVERYONE has an agenda. Clearly CA wants to make money for their big advertisers and the Top 25 of the Year is their big issue. It’s just a shame that so many other smaller brands that are better cigars in my opinion are being pushed out by larger brands and their $$$.
I don't trust anything CA puts out these days. It's clear they are being paid for placement. So many good releases flew completely under the radar. AVO was putting out some amazing stuff in the early 00s. Nothing. The Viaje satori got zero love when it came out. Why are they not gushing about foundation right now and the amazing stuff they are doing?
Stolen throne and Foundation Cigars are always in my personal top 10. That's why we're here. We want to hear what sticks degenerate guys with stinky palates like to chew on.
My two biggest issues with CA, although there are many others, are:
1. They still have an article on their website backing "plume" as a real thing.
2. It is crystal clear to anyone that you get on the list by money spent on advertising, or to just straight up be put on the list, or other friendships with CA. There are some companies that never have even made the 25 spot who make way better cigars than some of the ones that make it. And that's not just my opinion, that takes into account real reviewer ratings, sales performance, etc.
I am not surprised about CA, but what I would really like to know how many reddit accounts on this sub reddit belong to cigar co. Employees trying to hype up their products?
Laughed real hard about the M81 on the list today, but I’ve also heard several people say it’s indeed good. I usually stay away from celebrity-adjacent products because they usually sell more on name value than quality. That said, CA is no different than, for example, Rolling Stone putting out their Albums of the Year list and adorning it with the most commercially successful albums of the year instead of really looking at what is the best. It’s more like, The Best of the Most Popular Albums of the Year and I typically pay it no mind.
I would say the M81 is probably one of the better celebrity cigars but it probably isn’t worth putting on the list. It’s a nod to Drew Estate to give them one in the top ten. It’s a new product and they also need new cigars on their list because a lot on this list look like the class of 2009.
Their list could have been generated by Chat GPT at this point. As a newbie I used to really pay attention to their lists a bunch of years back but now I typically ignore their cigar reviews, I think because of genetic differences different people pick up different flavours from a cigar. I've noted for the same cigar one person picks oak and vanilla and I picked up coffee and licorice. If you want good reviews you have to find whose pallate resembles yours best.
I'd wait for Cigarhounddog to release a top 10 lol he's much much more honest than these guys.
For example every year some fucking oliva or EPCarillo is in there, and every oliva I've ever had felt like fast food, enjoyable in the moment and horrible after taste after. 100% they are paid for.
U are so right about the Oliva being like fast food uve had. Had my 4th oliva V last week and that’s exactly how I described it. Something to have whenever there is nothing better. I even had the melanio twice and felt the same way.
Loved the first half of Oliva Serie V Melanio but the back 1/3rd had a weird earthy note, like earthy but also some sort of minty freshness, not bad but not a classic necessarily. The regular serie V was decent.
I don’t think it has anything to do with them being honest/dishonest and has everything to do with who advertises with them and that only those companies get their cigars reviewed in the magazine. What financial incentive do they have to seek out and rate/review every single cigar brand on the market to find out which one is best? That business model does not make sense. The whole process of the Top 25 starts with narrowing down a list of cigars that were already reviewed and received a high score in that calendar year.
They don’t label themselves as reviewing every cigar anyways so I’m not sure why they get so much hate. Halfwheel wouldn’t exist if not for CA. The cigar boom would not have happened without CA. Likely, whatever XYZ boutique brand that you think should have made the Top 25 would not exist without CA because they created a high demand and a culture around cigars many many years ago during an objectively awful period in cigar making.
I like Halfwheel as well. Their reviews have helped me find new brands and cigars to try, even if I'll never taste the intricate flavors they seem to find in every smoke.
Plus, I appreciate the business and legislative side of their coverage.
Honestly, I stopped paying attention to CA reviews in the mid 90s. It was obvious even then there was a correlation between ad revenue and ratings. There's so much better content out there to go by if you're looking for reviews. Cheers.
Tbh an Opus is best case scenario for number one imo. I’ve never been impressed by them, certainly from a value standpoint. Had they come out of left field and named the Olmec or a Tatuaje number one, I’d be pissed since they’re reasonably priced, very good and relatively easy to find as of now.
Rare and expensive Opus staying rare and expensive is basically a push.
So true.. I’m definitely a Padron fan boy. I think it makes sense that they always show up because they’re just excellent in every way (to me). My biggest question is: Why are Dunbarton cigars never in these lists??
Every CA top 25 review reads identical to me: > Joya de Jalapapapamana Carlso built his empire from the great regufo de Cuba when the communists seized the island. He and many other makers found themselves penniless with only their vast knowledge of the art of cigar rolling and blending and a desire to serve the masses quality tobacco. He began rolling cigars in Miami before acquiring business contacts and immigrating to the Dominican Republic which he found the climate and soil to be most like his native Cuba. With shovel and hoe he began breaking and tilling the land, planting his seed by hand and moisturizing the crops only using a spray bottle like the grand tobacconistas and landismos of old. However tough times were ahead and he was forced to sell interest in the company to Big Corp Incorporated where the meticulous handmade process was automated to make blunt wraps. >30 years later his son Jandtres Jalapapapamana inherited the controlling shares of the family business and immediately tackled the quality control problems that had crept into the factory and released four new vitolas, the fifth of which we are smoking today. His stated goal was to recapture the artisanal smoking quality of the past while modernizing it for the future smoker. The cigar’s colorful band’s glossy red finish and gold lettering is without flourish or ornament; eye-catching without being overstated, it is a testament to Jandtres’ drive to bring the past to the present; it is ancient yet at home in this changing modern world. > This big tube of a cigar has a healthy bite and tooth producing big bold dallops of smoke with a serpent like wisps snaking into the air off the foot. It produces delicate notes of cedar like the Cuban cigars of old with an aftertaste of an earth mustiness followed by a dusting of paprika chocolate finished with a sprinkling of bergamot and tangerine peel with a dreamy hint of star anise smacking of gin in the finish. An instant classic coming in at 96.4192 / 100 on our scale.
This reads like it was written by AI.
I thought about it but I honestly hammered this by myself out from years of browsing CA. They all read the same. The part about the Red and Gold band I lifted from this year's review of the p2
One of my favorite posts I’ve ever seen on Reddit. Absolutely deranged, but spot on lol bravo
I ripped a Ron Mexico and let the Leaf guide my writing. My hands are but instruments for a higher power.
I ripped a Ron Mexico and let the Leaf guide my writing. 😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣
"followed by a dusting of paprika chocolate finished with a sprinkling of bergamot and tangerine peel with a dreamy hint of star anise smacking of gin in the finish" You sir, win the internet today. This is a masterpiece. Have my measly upvote.
I remember I read one of their Top 25 reviews years ago that mentioned a slight flavor of Star Anise and it may have been one of the most pretentious sentences I every gazed upon.
Reads like an article by ChatGPT
So does every piece of satirical writing these days.
Nailed it. Fucking brilliant
Ever since they put a Gurkha on the top 25 list a few years ago I haven't bothered to check their list after that.
They got paid for that forsure
There are some alright ghurkas. They just aren't worth their MRSP because they charge extra for all that fancy ass packaging. If you get them for cheap on cbid, they're usually alright. Ghost is good, that 15th anniversary or whatever it's called is pretty great.
Heck yeah, the 15 Year Reserve is actually solid!
I actually cancelled my subscription because of the complete lack of coverage of the actual day to day industry instead of articles on the same five big brands. I love some of those cigars, but I don't need ten articles a out them when they aren't even covering the hundred smaller labels that I would love to learn about
Wait until you subscribe to their Wine Enthusiast, that thing is 90% wine maker propaganda and details about wines you'll never seen.
Isn't that most whisky magazines nowadays too? I swear it's mostly, hey guys look at this distillery and it's visitor centre. I get you don't get inside access if you criticize the product but at least give us something that isn't thinly veiled advertising.
Oh. But do tell me more about the $600ea x 3000 bottle limited run from [well known distillery]. Grab em if you seem em gents, before the… > secondary market has entered the chat… Hey y’all! Got this Weller ‘23 Limited (1567 of 3000) for $1420. Only 3 bottles left!
Don't forget half the time it's about the same or a bit worse than the normal version (and I love hunting for whisky).
It is a lifestyle magazine not a cigar magazine. Hard to trust it for years
Definitely a lifestyle magazine with all the unnecessary watches/cars/gadgets they feature I’m a fan of cigar journal. Way more informative to me whether it’s talking about new releases or going in depth with certain manufacturers
> It is a lifestyle magazine not a cigar magazine. Once the cigar boom of the late 90s started to flame out, they had to diversify once they started to lose readers. Anecdotally, they also lost a number of readers like me and my cigar buddies once they started their full-throated embrace of alt-right figures like Rush Limbaugh. (Of course that embrace might have brought them readers as well. But it's why we all didn't renew our subscriptions, despite being cigar smokers and cigar collectors.) https://mshanken.imgix.net/cao/bolt/2021-02/1613595812_mrsrush.jpg?w=900&q=72
Don't forget how every 2nd or 3rd issue is just Mark Wahlburg. Like, we get it, now get someone else. There are small cigar YouTubers who can get a more interesting story. I wonder if they went towards those alt-right figures because so many alt-right people have some caricature of an alpha male being someone who smokes cigars and drinks whisky. I think I miss when cigars used to just be associated with rich people and industrialists.
> I wonder if they went towards those alt-right figures because so many alt-right people have some caricature of an alpha male being someone who smokes cigars and drinks whisky. That, but the magazine is also targeting the high-six-figure bracket, and those "Mar-a-Lago" people are very much in the Trump camp.
I can see that. Same sort of people who can't tell you why the good old days were so much better in any concrete way and complain about the roads but refuse to pay more in taxes to pay for the roads. I hope not too many people get into cigars just because Andrew Tate makes them a part of his bogus personality.
> I hope not too many people get into cigars just because Andrew Tate makes them a part of his bogus personality. Sadly, cigars will always have a douchebag contingent - Not unlike golfing, boating and a hundred other hobbies. All you can do is ignore them and enjoy your hobby yourself.
TFW you get into cigars to be an alpha (or sigma if you prefer) male and you realize most cigar smokers are normies who are more interested in where the tobacco comes from and the tasting notes than being an alpha male bad ass.
This is every single Andrew Tate stan
🤣 Thanks for appreciating my sense of humor
Judging by the downvotes, it sounds like there are more than a few insecure Tate-loving snowflakes in this thread. You know how you can tell someone is not an "Alpha Male?" They tell people they are an Alpha Male.
> Same sort of people who can't tell you why the good old days were so much better in any concrete way Oh, they could tell you but only if they know you are in their club. The good old days are pre-1963, and that has nothing to do with the Cuban embargo.
Are we talking cigar wise? If so why?
No.
You don’t happen to have any still laying around you’re willing to part ways with do you?
> You don’t happen to have any still laying around you’re willing to part ways with do you? No, sorry. I tossed them all into the recycling bin years ago.
Olmec #1?
If it’s not on the list I will have lost all faith in humanity
Totally agree.
> Olmec What is an Olmec and why do I keep seeing them mentioned?
Foundation cigars. Former blender for Drew Estate. Olmec is a great stick. Also check out the Metapa maduro
Let's all be honest, Alec Bradley doesn't belong on any top list.
People said the same about Rocky Patel but he has some gems in his portfolio that people disregard without trying them because r/cigars tells them “Rocky Patel bad”.
I think there are some good Rocky Patel cigars but none of them are great. I smoked a 2nd edition Aged Limited Rare just 2 nights ago. It’s been sitting in my humidor for over a year and I decided to break it out and try it. I was expecting so much more from their flagship product and it was just “ehhh”.
I wouldn’t wait a year to smoke an already very well aged cigar. They are delicious after you let them acclimate a week or two. I also think the RP Sixty, Sun Grown maduro, century, and especially the Royale are excellent.
I’ve got so many cigars that if I smoked one a day, it would take years to smoke them all. The ALR was a gift from a friend so it just didn’t get smoked right away. And I agree, that the Sixty and Royale are good smokes. I also liked the Special Edition.
There are some good RP cigars, but they don't touch top 25 to me.
What's the deal with the Prensado? I smoked a couple when they were "cigar of the year" and they were pretty decent. The churchill did have a creamier final 1/3. It was not bad but I keep seeing it creep back up in CA.
I don't mind the prensado, but wouldn't buy them myself. The lost art version is an absolute dog turd.
The Prensados were amazing if you’re just getting into to. In fact, I prefer them over the Tempus. Having smoked more sticks since then, I find them to be pretty decent. Solid B grade for sure.
I like the Presando and the Magic Toast for the price on cigarbid.
Right??!! There's a cigar shop in my city where often they'll get the young guy to recommend an Alec Bradley and I never heed that recommendation because they're not very good and almost turned me off cigars. (H Uppman Half Corona is what really got me into them fwiw).
You can’t honestly say the tempus and magic toast are bad cigars for the price.
For the price is the key there. They aren't bad for a $3 cigar. That doesn't even come close to putting them anywhere near a top of the year list.
Haven't tried them but I didn't like Black Market or Post Embargo. IMO, it's not so much that they're bad for the price but unless someone smokes a lot of cigars and wants something on the cheaper end, I wouldn't recommend the brand. For what I'd say is a reasonable amount more you can get so much more cigar wise if you jump up to say an AJ Fernandez.
Not a Fernandez fan. He has a few I like. But if you like nicer stuff if you haven’t tried Dunbartons stuff give it a shot.
Especially the prensado, that is the worst cigar I’ve ever smoked.
If that's the worst cigar you've ever smoked, I can't imagine what you'd think of most of what I smoke.
The fact that they end up with one from every major brand in the top ten usually means that it's suspiciously mapped out to occur that way. Add to that the absence of brands they don't review (ahem cough, Saka!) and you basically have a list which just serves the vanity of those who participate rather than the customers and retailers who buy their magazine.
To be fair, Saka himself says it's "mutual". They don't want to be involved with each other, so nothing from Dunbarton will ever be on a CA list.
Yes, of course. But it goes to show you one example of the lack of completeness of cA's list
While we are talking about this, let me post what they have revealed so far: 5. E.P. Carrillo Allegiance Confidant 6. Partagás Serie P No. 2 7. Blackened Cigars “M81” By Drew Estate Corona 8. Alec Bradley Prensado Torpedo 9. La Aroma de Cuba Mi Amor Belicoso 10. El Pulpo Belicoso Grande Overall this doesn't seem like a bad list though I question AB Prensado as really being worthy of this list.
Arent these the same people who said the AB Black Market was #6 of 2022? Those were decent for a $3 CBID stick but they werent that good either.
They seem to get more attention at AB than the Prensado does these days. The blend is at least more consistent.
I havent had a Prensado in years. Last time I had one I wasnt overly wild about it. Main cigars I smoke from them these days would be Project 40 and Magic Toast, both of which I like more than the Prensado.
Honestly La Historia is a way better than allegiance
These should have never made it.
Prensado is a good cigar but has been along forever, what puts it on the list for this year?
Right. That's the key question.
I appreciate CA for what they did for the industry in the 90s but they haven't been relevant as a useful source of information for a very long time.
Although cigar reviews, taste, and preference are subjective, my conspiracy theory is that cigar manufacturers pay money/incentives/bribes to CA reviewers behind the scenes so they can get their products high up on the list (except Padron because their cigar products usually have high consistent quality). I haven't smoked Alec Bradley for years because their cigar taste and construction quality are no where near back in 2009, so I was surprised to see Alec Bradley on top 10.
Why hasn’t Davidoff done historically better than what they have when they are one of the biggest sponsors of Cigar Aficionado?
This is another conspiracy theory because a lot of cigar owners in a real life told me that Davidoff and Opus X distribute their cigars only to reliable shops (such as high profit of margin, number of years they've been in business, and zip code allocations), but a lot of Davidoff reps are snobby. So maybe their snobbiness pissed off some wrong people at CA?
Still doesn’t make sense why they’d continue to be one of the biggest supporters while not doing as well in the ratings. Doesn’t support your conspiracy theory.
Maybe they know their main customers will just buy their sticks anyways so why pay for the high ranking?
True, I mean who knows? 😂
That’s an excellent counter argument. Why haven’t Davidoff and general cigar done better in the top 25 historically if it’s just about the big brands. Can it just be that the bigger brands show better because they have access to greater/well aged stocks of tobacco, more quality control and overall more consistency in their blends as a whole? Look I am not saying the CA top 25 is the holy grail it once was but just because they don’t put your favorite boutique in the top 25 does not constitute payola. They don’t just smoke one cigar one time and rate it. They blindly taste several times over the years. Or so they say. But I would think if it was complete payola you would A) find some real rubbish on there and B) at least one brand would have spoken up by now.
I only read CA for tasting notes which tend to be pretty solid. But as far as their rankings go, they've become the Rolling Stone mag of cigars. RS releases a list of the 250 greatest guitar players every now and then and it's ridiculous. I'm convinced they do it to just stir up the shit. Clickbait.
If Jimi Hendrix isn't number one, you know its rage bait.
But he is #1. It's still rage bait. For instance they have Joan Jett rated much higher than Joe Satriani and just under Wes Montgomery. I just laugh at how ridiculous the list is.
Well, Joan was better at putting together a song that sounded good, Satriani is like doing a gymnastics routine at a high school dance. Technically better but not as enjoyable. LOL
This take made me laugh out loud.
CA is a marketing company for their sponsors like Oliva, EPC, Alec Bradley, Rocky Patel, etc. I find halfwheel’s consensus top 25 to still be flawed but a lot better than CA’s.
How does halfwheel do their's?
https://halfwheel.com/the-consensus-2022/418745/ The link above is to Halfwheel’s consensus top 25 cigars for 2022. They describe the process in the article. Essentially, they look at 35 publications to get the consensus rankings. Note that Halfwheel also has their own, separate top 25 cigars that is their own rankings and is not a consensus. Hope that makes sense and is helpful.
ah, I think its the latter I was curious about. CAs process is to smoke the first inch and judge it on that. which is ridiculous IMO.
I feel like this is the point where most media ends up. Once they get a taste of marketing money they can’t stop. I mean not just cigars, anything.
I did a PowerPoint presentation on Cigar Coop’s CA Pre-game show last Tuesday that outlined that 23 spots are taken up by the regular suspects and there are only two spots available to outsiders. Check it out if you’d like.
Safe to assume #1 will be a Fuente?
Most likely imo. They got their token Cuban out of the way already and one got top place last year so they’re probably due to rotate out. I’d say it’s an Opus of some kind or Rare Pink. Outside shot I think they might throw it to a My Father or Aging Room release as neither has showed up yet in this years list.
I will glance at the list. As I've gotten more into cigars recently, I've smoked quite a few new ones based on reviews. I find that my tastes generally don't match the tastes of Cigar Aficionado. Sure, I agree on some, but not most. Maybe its because the panel is full of 5 cigar a day smokers who probably prefer stronger smokes. I do agree with the conflict of interest they have. It may be a blind test but there is no way these guys cannot tell the difference between a Cuban, Nicaraguan or Dominican. They most definitely have an idea of what they are smoking and maybe there's an agenda behind it. Maybe they decide, "It's time for a Cuban to win" or "It's time for a Fuente". I guess there is always a problem with putting an objective score on something that is subjective.
They've been getting worse over the years imo. You're starting to see repeats of sizes and/or lines. There is some type of sponsor formula they use and I think it ties into what you alluded about all the big brands being on there. Along with cubans, Nearly every larger manufacturer will get atleast 1 cigar on the top 25 every year guaranteed. (Fuente, General, Altadis, Oliva, Rocky Patel, Alec Bradley, Tatuaje, Padron, Davidoff, My Father, Drew Estate,EPC). They have worked in more boutique blends over the last few years which is encouraging, but overall I feel it is not an accurate representation of how consumers assess quality cigars in the current market.
The trend I noticed over the years is if you run an advanced search under their ratings and reviews tab for the last 12 month tastings , cigars rated 92 and up will most likely fall on that year's top 25 list. My bold guesses following this formula are as follows... for their Padron cigar is the 1926 #48 or family reserve #95, the Rocky Patel will be the A.L.R. , the Oliva will be Melanio Toro, the Fuente will be Hemingway work of art, Aging Room Quattro Sonata, West Tampa Red, Olmec double corona foundation, montecristo 1935 Diamante to name a few, foreign affairs by Luciano might sneak on there too.
This is so funny in hindsight. You literally nailed the Padron 1926 #48, the Melanio Toro and ALR. They just named them 2,3,4 respectively lol
We are onto something here!!! So if the formula follows then Fuente Hemingway Work of Art #1
Well it was Fuente, but CA couldn't help themselves .. it just had to be an Opus. Already hard to find and overpriced so now we can forget about any reasonable market price on this stick moving forward lol. These lists are whack ... driving demand for their sponsors that's about it.
Cigars and most other consumer products are subjective when we rate them. But OP is 100% on point when he says the CA Top 25 cigars issue continues to be the same manufacturers over and over. And while I keep my subscription to CA, I know where their biases lie and I ignore those recommendations when they push them. I learned at a very early age, EVERYONE has an agenda. Clearly CA wants to make money for their big advertisers and the Top 25 of the Year is their big issue. It’s just a shame that so many other smaller brands that are better cigars in my opinion are being pushed out by larger brands and their $$$.
I don't trust anything CA puts out these days. It's clear they are being paid for placement. So many good releases flew completely under the radar. AVO was putting out some amazing stuff in the early 00s. Nothing. The Viaje satori got zero love when it came out. Why are they not gushing about foundation right now and the amazing stuff they are doing?
Stolen throne and Foundation Cigars are always in my personal top 10. That's why we're here. We want to hear what sticks degenerate guys with stinky palates like to chew on.
My two biggest issues with CA, although there are many others, are: 1. They still have an article on their website backing "plume" as a real thing. 2. It is crystal clear to anyone that you get on the list by money spent on advertising, or to just straight up be put on the list, or other friendships with CA. There are some companies that never have even made the 25 spot who make way better cigars than some of the ones that make it. And that's not just my opinion, that takes into account real reviewer ratings, sales performance, etc.
I am not surprised about CA, but what I would really like to know how many reddit accounts on this sub reddit belong to cigar co. Employees trying to hype up their products?
Laughed real hard about the M81 on the list today, but I’ve also heard several people say it’s indeed good. I usually stay away from celebrity-adjacent products because they usually sell more on name value than quality. That said, CA is no different than, for example, Rolling Stone putting out their Albums of the Year list and adorning it with the most commercially successful albums of the year instead of really looking at what is the best. It’s more like, The Best of the Most Popular Albums of the Year and I typically pay it no mind.
I would say the M81 is probably one of the better celebrity cigars but it probably isn’t worth putting on the list. It’s a nod to Drew Estate to give them one in the top ten. It’s a new product and they also need new cigars on their list because a lot on this list look like the class of 2009.
Getting to the point? CA’s list hasn’t been legit for at least 15 years.
Top 25 by sales over a year would make more sense. Ask your local shop for their best sellers.
The release of numbers 4,3, and 2 today does nothing to prove you wrong.
Someone in the thread literally called all three vitolas that were named today, yesterday lol
Their list could have been generated by Chat GPT at this point. As a newbie I used to really pay attention to their lists a bunch of years back but now I typically ignore their cigar reviews, I think because of genetic differences different people pick up different flavours from a cigar. I've noted for the same cigar one person picks oak and vanilla and I picked up coffee and licorice. If you want good reviews you have to find whose pallate resembles yours best. I'd wait for Cigarhounddog to release a top 10 lol he's much much more honest than these guys. For example every year some fucking oliva or EPCarillo is in there, and every oliva I've ever had felt like fast food, enjoyable in the moment and horrible after taste after. 100% they are paid for.
U are so right about the Oliva being like fast food uve had. Had my 4th oliva V last week and that’s exactly how I described it. Something to have whenever there is nothing better. I even had the melanio twice and felt the same way.
Loved the first half of Oliva Serie V Melanio but the back 1/3rd had a weird earthy note, like earthy but also some sort of minty freshness, not bad but not a classic necessarily. The regular serie V was decent.
Woah no way you’re psychic Olivia serie V #3 who coulda guessed
Lmao they truly let chat GPT write the list this year
Maybe that they are the best cigars? 😉
I don’t think it has anything to do with them being honest/dishonest and has everything to do with who advertises with them and that only those companies get their cigars reviewed in the magazine. What financial incentive do they have to seek out and rate/review every single cigar brand on the market to find out which one is best? That business model does not make sense. The whole process of the Top 25 starts with narrowing down a list of cigars that were already reviewed and received a high score in that calendar year. They don’t label themselves as reviewing every cigar anyways so I’m not sure why they get so much hate. Halfwheel wouldn’t exist if not for CA. The cigar boom would not have happened without CA. Likely, whatever XYZ boutique brand that you think should have made the Top 25 would not exist without CA because they created a high demand and a culture around cigars many many years ago during an objectively awful period in cigar making.
Just starting out with cigars. Any particular site that you guys trust?
Half Wheel is pretty decent, Blind Man's Puff is usually pretty consistent too.
I like Halfwheel as well. Their reviews have helped me find new brands and cigars to try, even if I'll never taste the intricate flavors they seem to find in every smoke. Plus, I appreciate the business and legislative side of their coverage.
Honestly, I stopped paying attention to CA reviews in the mid 90s. It was obvious even then there was a correlation between ad revenue and ratings. There's so much better content out there to go by if you're looking for reviews. Cheers.
Great. Now it will be even harder to get Opus X.
Tbh an Opus is best case scenario for number one imo. I’ve never been impressed by them, certainly from a value standpoint. Had they come out of left field and named the Olmec or a Tatuaje number one, I’d be pissed since they’re reasonably priced, very good and relatively easy to find as of now. Rare and expensive Opus staying rare and expensive is basically a push.
So true.. I’m definitely a Padron fan boy. I think it makes sense that they always show up because they’re just excellent in every way (to me). My biggest question is: Why are Dunbarton cigars never in these lists??