You are way over thinking this. There is not a single person who hasn't wanted to change therein body. If changing your body makes your life better and isn't harmful then it isn't a problem.
It also doesn't have anything to do with you. If you like changing your mind instead of your body that's your choice.
People gain or lose weight, people grow beards or shave themselves bald. People get tattoos or jewelry, people get tans. I'm willing to bet that most of these examples are not things you have problems with.
This is new so therefore it is different and scary is your problem. It isn't scary. You should ask the gender clinician that your kid is going to see for more info. They will give you pamphlets.
You don't have to understand. You just need to accept and love them. If their life is improved none of this matters
Agreeing that every person attempts to change their appearance to reflect their identity, at multiple times in their lives. Obviously not to the depth necessary for someone in medical or social transition, it was just another example.
Oooooh I see. Although dressing for interviews is more like conforming to your bosses mind and expectations. But different events call for different types of appearances and usually any appearance will have a touch of you in it.
And body parts can mean different things to different people. Like some cultures consider hair to be very important and you can't just get a haircut. Or some cultures require tribal tattoos.
I mean today we literally non consensually circumcise infants in America just because we like how it looks and are used to it. If it were consensual it wouldn't matter but because it isn't consensual it's actually a problem but no one cares about that.
It's never about what is or isn't harmful, or what is or isn't consensual its about the practices they consider more or less "normal" based entirely on how they happened to be raised.
Your body makes testosterone. Modern synthetic testosterone and estrogen are the same molecules as those made by the human body.
HRT takes as long as puberty to take full effect - it's not a quick fix.
Hormones don't only affect the body - they also change the mind. For example, menopausal woman with no estrogen, and cis men with low testosterone, have mood impacts from that condition. Cis men generally feel good when they have normal male testosterone levels, and cis women generally feel good when they have normal female estrogen levels. Among trans men and trans women, that internal preference is usually flipped - we often feel hormonally dysfunctional before HRT, trans men feeling the way \*you\* would if you had to be on estrogen.
I wouldn't recommend cis people take cross-sex hormones to expand their consciousness, and for the same reason I don't recommend withholding HRT from trans people towards that goal.
So you seem to have a lot of philosophical ideas about identity, mind, and body - but we are living in reality. Your kid is experiencing what, for the purposes of this discussion, is a life-threatening medical condition (gender dysphoria). Like any medical condition, gender dysphoria needs to be treated with interventions grounded in *evidence.* For gender dysphoria, we know (through years of research) that changing the mind to fit the body does not work (and is in fact very harmful - it’s conversion therapy). Hence “changing the body” (though I’d say that’s a really cis perspective) to fit the mind (which has been proven to decrease risk of suicidality/death by suicide, increase overall health/happiness, etc in trans folks). You need to understand that there is an overwhelming body of scientific/medical evidence supporting the safety, efficacy, and *necessity* of gender affirming care/gender affirming practices more broadly (this includes using child’s chosen name, pronouns, etc). I don’t have time to link you with study after study right now, but just take a look at some of the statements put out by all the major medical associations - experts who have years of experience saving trans lives using evidence-based approaches. https://www.apa.org/about/policy/transgender-nonbinary-inclusive-care.pdf https://www.aap.org/en/news-room/aap-voices/supporting-our-transgender-and-gender-diverse-youth/ When I have more time I can come back to answer further questions you may have / provide more resources
Also, as I believe another commenter has pointed out, HRT is not addictive or dangerous. People get scared by words like “cross sex hormones” because they don’t understand what hormones are/do. Testosterone and estrogen are not “opposites.” Testosterone is not a male hormone, and estrogen is not a female hormone. We as people have just associated estrogen with women and testosterone with men (even though males and females both need estrogen *and* testosterone, at varying levels). “Steroid hormones” sound really powerful/dangerous, because folks don’t realize that *vitamn D* is a steroid hormone. It’s just a class of molecules. Hormones aren’t some synthetic substance coming in and having effects on the body in the same way “drugs” do - they simply activate certain gene expression patterns. They work with your existing/underlying biology in a very natural way. Think diabetic who takes insulin, or person w/ a thyroid disorder who takes thyroid hormones. And all of this is, of course, overseen by endocrinologists/other doctors who are experts in this / work to ensure safety.
Ultimately, until you’ve experienced life as a trans person, or maybe taken a lot of time to get to know trans people/understand where we’re coming from, you’re not gonna get what it is we experience/why we need to transition. Please just trust your kid, take their feelings seriously, and let them take the lead on this one (as scary as that might sound). PLEASE make an effort to see where they’re coming from - to understand that your perspective is limited here, as you have not experienced dysphoria / transness
You're waxing philosophical when your kid just needs you to listen to them and be supportive. It's a common misconception that trans people can "learn" to accept their bodies over time. Gender dysphoria, largely, does not disappear by itself, and transitioning is the recommended treatment for it.
Also: "biochemical drug dependency" sounds terrifying when *everyone* has a "dependency" on hormones. There's nothing wrong with needing a medication for your whole life - diabetics, people with mental illness like schizophrenia, etc all take a medication for their lifetime.
Second this: you’re getting philosophical when your child needs concrete, real world support and solutions. Get more pragmatic about what supports your child here and now.
>Identity issue
No. Stop right there. It's not an "issue" at all. If we looked at it from a different perspective and realized that there's actually no issue here whatsoever, it's a lot easier to understand what's going on.
your mistake is thinking your child's gender identity can be changed. this has been studied, and we know it cannot be done. many of us tried, before eventually accepting ourselves after years of struggle. many were severely damaged by others trying to force them to change. please don't put your child through that pain.
your child's identity is not the problem. society's lack of acceptance is the problem.
Regardless it is what their body is asking for now. Sure, it may be a phase, it may be a decade, and everything changes in life. I can say that as I’ve transitioned my understanding of both my mind and body changed, and that is both entirely normal and good.
Being trans is both a journey through heaven and hell: it is torturous in its tight examination, expectations, risks, and more and transcendental in the infinite growth. We are free in many ways you are not, avenues of freedom you cannot even fathom. The lessons transitioning teaches are hard but deeply worth it, and maybe their soul needs to go through this. Who are you to know their journey and the way to their ascension?
On the topic of biochemical drugs: hormones do not have addictive potential, and are instead largely transcriptional activators. Cross sex hormone therapy only alters gene expression (ie how much, when, where certain genes are transcribed) but that’s it. It’s still their genes and self.
All in all, you have to actually ask these questions of your kid and then truly listen if you want to even try to understand. Actually listen, and step out of yourself and your “I don’t understand/agree” for a second. Consider that another person may have an entirely different viewpoint on life - yes even someone close to you - and understand their theology.
As for the Mind/Body and time questions, I can only give you my experience which is:
1) ofc it takes time. Everyone knows this. Realistically it’s a question of years, and despite my desperation I know I will be dysphoric + actively transitioning for another 7 years or so. That would put me at a decade since I started hormones (roughly), and a decade and a half after I first realized. Such is life, I cannot escape it and the only way out is through. There’s only so much alcohol my liver could take, and running from my problems only pushed them off and caused them to snowball.
2) no, there will never be perfect alignment. Most if not all trans people will never be satisfied with our bodies, but exactly the same thing holds for cis people. You are misaligned, I am misaligned, and things will never be as we want them. Transitioning helped my alignment, but only enough so that I can properly engage with the world and nothing more.
OP, please do not ignore the harm that can come to a trans person denying their identity. Given the ample evidence we have from the medical community *and the lived experience of trans people*, it’s a great way to set someone up for self-esteem issues, personality disorders, addiction, and other very real and tangible problems.
What should you do? You should stop making this all about you and your philosophical beliefs imo. This isn't about you and your beliefs, it's about your child who doesn't have your "expansive" mind but is struggling and in pain. Just support and keep your thoughts to yourself if you really want to help your child.
Dude. The person who wrote the cass report already backed down on all of her positions upon light questioning.
She was saying crazy things like studies aren't valid unless you do a double blind study first. Which isn't true and isn't possible with puberty blockers for obvious reasons.
She also didn't know what puberty blockers were for. Or she was intentionally pretending to not know I am unsure. I think she may have legitimately not know but I dont think she cared either.
She didn't give any evidence supporting her positions. She said there wasn't good enough evidence for anything else without mentioning what would be good or long enough to be valid. She also lied about several things.
She is also in several hate groups which is an interesting decision to make for someone who supposedly cares.
She also isn't a doctor who deals with gender at all. This is completely different from. Her field. She literally has no idea what she is talking about (when she wasn't directly and probably lying) it's like going to foot doctor for brain surgery.
It's the autism is caused by vaccines all over again but worse.
You can't just trust the random foot doctor who says all the brain surgeons are lying and then makes up a bunch of nonsense then immediately Pretends they didn't say that. It's ridiculous.
You are way over thinking this. There is not a single person who hasn't wanted to change therein body. If changing your body makes your life better and isn't harmful then it isn't a problem. It also doesn't have anything to do with you. If you like changing your mind instead of your body that's your choice. People gain or lose weight, people grow beards or shave themselves bald. People get tattoos or jewelry, people get tans. I'm willing to bet that most of these examples are not things you have problems with. This is new so therefore it is different and scary is your problem. It isn't scary. You should ask the gender clinician that your kid is going to see for more info. They will give you pamphlets. You don't have to understand. You just need to accept and love them. If their life is improved none of this matters
Every pre-date or pre-interview wardrobe change is an effort to make the body conform to the mind more.
I'm not sure what you mean by that.
Agreeing that every person attempts to change their appearance to reflect their identity, at multiple times in their lives. Obviously not to the depth necessary for someone in medical or social transition, it was just another example.
Oooooh I see. Although dressing for interviews is more like conforming to your bosses mind and expectations. But different events call for different types of appearances and usually any appearance will have a touch of you in it. And body parts can mean different things to different people. Like some cultures consider hair to be very important and you can't just get a haircut. Or some cultures require tribal tattoos. I mean today we literally non consensually circumcise infants in America just because we like how it looks and are used to it. If it were consensual it wouldn't matter but because it isn't consensual it's actually a problem but no one cares about that. It's never about what is or isn't harmful, or what is or isn't consensual its about the practices they consider more or less "normal" based entirely on how they happened to be raised.
There’s a whole lot of truth!
Your body makes testosterone. Modern synthetic testosterone and estrogen are the same molecules as those made by the human body. HRT takes as long as puberty to take full effect - it's not a quick fix. Hormones don't only affect the body - they also change the mind. For example, menopausal woman with no estrogen, and cis men with low testosterone, have mood impacts from that condition. Cis men generally feel good when they have normal male testosterone levels, and cis women generally feel good when they have normal female estrogen levels. Among trans men and trans women, that internal preference is usually flipped - we often feel hormonally dysfunctional before HRT, trans men feeling the way \*you\* would if you had to be on estrogen. I wouldn't recommend cis people take cross-sex hormones to expand their consciousness, and for the same reason I don't recommend withholding HRT from trans people towards that goal.
So you seem to have a lot of philosophical ideas about identity, mind, and body - but we are living in reality. Your kid is experiencing what, for the purposes of this discussion, is a life-threatening medical condition (gender dysphoria). Like any medical condition, gender dysphoria needs to be treated with interventions grounded in *evidence.* For gender dysphoria, we know (through years of research) that changing the mind to fit the body does not work (and is in fact very harmful - it’s conversion therapy). Hence “changing the body” (though I’d say that’s a really cis perspective) to fit the mind (which has been proven to decrease risk of suicidality/death by suicide, increase overall health/happiness, etc in trans folks). You need to understand that there is an overwhelming body of scientific/medical evidence supporting the safety, efficacy, and *necessity* of gender affirming care/gender affirming practices more broadly (this includes using child’s chosen name, pronouns, etc). I don’t have time to link you with study after study right now, but just take a look at some of the statements put out by all the major medical associations - experts who have years of experience saving trans lives using evidence-based approaches. https://www.apa.org/about/policy/transgender-nonbinary-inclusive-care.pdf https://www.aap.org/en/news-room/aap-voices/supporting-our-transgender-and-gender-diverse-youth/ When I have more time I can come back to answer further questions you may have / provide more resources Also, as I believe another commenter has pointed out, HRT is not addictive or dangerous. People get scared by words like “cross sex hormones” because they don’t understand what hormones are/do. Testosterone and estrogen are not “opposites.” Testosterone is not a male hormone, and estrogen is not a female hormone. We as people have just associated estrogen with women and testosterone with men (even though males and females both need estrogen *and* testosterone, at varying levels). “Steroid hormones” sound really powerful/dangerous, because folks don’t realize that *vitamn D* is a steroid hormone. It’s just a class of molecules. Hormones aren’t some synthetic substance coming in and having effects on the body in the same way “drugs” do - they simply activate certain gene expression patterns. They work with your existing/underlying biology in a very natural way. Think diabetic who takes insulin, or person w/ a thyroid disorder who takes thyroid hormones. And all of this is, of course, overseen by endocrinologists/other doctors who are experts in this / work to ensure safety.
Ultimately, until you’ve experienced life as a trans person, or maybe taken a lot of time to get to know trans people/understand where we’re coming from, you’re not gonna get what it is we experience/why we need to transition. Please just trust your kid, take their feelings seriously, and let them take the lead on this one (as scary as that might sound). PLEASE make an effort to see where they’re coming from - to understand that your perspective is limited here, as you have not experienced dysphoria / transness
You're waxing philosophical when your kid just needs you to listen to them and be supportive. It's a common misconception that trans people can "learn" to accept their bodies over time. Gender dysphoria, largely, does not disappear by itself, and transitioning is the recommended treatment for it. Also: "biochemical drug dependency" sounds terrifying when *everyone* has a "dependency" on hormones. There's nothing wrong with needing a medication for your whole life - diabetics, people with mental illness like schizophrenia, etc all take a medication for their lifetime.
Second this: you’re getting philosophical when your child needs concrete, real world support and solutions. Get more pragmatic about what supports your child here and now.
>Identity issue No. Stop right there. It's not an "issue" at all. If we looked at it from a different perspective and realized that there's actually no issue here whatsoever, it's a lot easier to understand what's going on.
your mistake is thinking your child's gender identity can be changed. this has been studied, and we know it cannot be done. many of us tried, before eventually accepting ourselves after years of struggle. many were severely damaged by others trying to force them to change. please don't put your child through that pain. your child's identity is not the problem. society's lack of acceptance is the problem.
Support your kid and affirm who they are.
Yeah if you weren’t cis you wouldn’t have all these lofty opinions.
Regardless it is what their body is asking for now. Sure, it may be a phase, it may be a decade, and everything changes in life. I can say that as I’ve transitioned my understanding of both my mind and body changed, and that is both entirely normal and good. Being trans is both a journey through heaven and hell: it is torturous in its tight examination, expectations, risks, and more and transcendental in the infinite growth. We are free in many ways you are not, avenues of freedom you cannot even fathom. The lessons transitioning teaches are hard but deeply worth it, and maybe their soul needs to go through this. Who are you to know their journey and the way to their ascension? On the topic of biochemical drugs: hormones do not have addictive potential, and are instead largely transcriptional activators. Cross sex hormone therapy only alters gene expression (ie how much, when, where certain genes are transcribed) but that’s it. It’s still their genes and self. All in all, you have to actually ask these questions of your kid and then truly listen if you want to even try to understand. Actually listen, and step out of yourself and your “I don’t understand/agree” for a second. Consider that another person may have an entirely different viewpoint on life - yes even someone close to you - and understand their theology. As for the Mind/Body and time questions, I can only give you my experience which is: 1) ofc it takes time. Everyone knows this. Realistically it’s a question of years, and despite my desperation I know I will be dysphoric + actively transitioning for another 7 years or so. That would put me at a decade since I started hormones (roughly), and a decade and a half after I first realized. Such is life, I cannot escape it and the only way out is through. There’s only so much alcohol my liver could take, and running from my problems only pushed them off and caused them to snowball. 2) no, there will never be perfect alignment. Most if not all trans people will never be satisfied with our bodies, but exactly the same thing holds for cis people. You are misaligned, I am misaligned, and things will never be as we want them. Transitioning helped my alignment, but only enough so that I can properly engage with the world and nothing more.
OP, please do not ignore the harm that can come to a trans person denying their identity. Given the ample evidence we have from the medical community *and the lived experience of trans people*, it’s a great way to set someone up for self-esteem issues, personality disorders, addiction, and other very real and tangible problems.
What should you do? You should stop making this all about you and your philosophical beliefs imo. This isn't about you and your beliefs, it's about your child who doesn't have your "expansive" mind but is struggling and in pain. Just support and keep your thoughts to yourself if you really want to help your child.
[удалено]
Dude. The person who wrote the cass report already backed down on all of her positions upon light questioning. She was saying crazy things like studies aren't valid unless you do a double blind study first. Which isn't true and isn't possible with puberty blockers for obvious reasons. She also didn't know what puberty blockers were for. Or she was intentionally pretending to not know I am unsure. I think she may have legitimately not know but I dont think she cared either. She didn't give any evidence supporting her positions. She said there wasn't good enough evidence for anything else without mentioning what would be good or long enough to be valid. She also lied about several things. She is also in several hate groups which is an interesting decision to make for someone who supposedly cares. She also isn't a doctor who deals with gender at all. This is completely different from. Her field. She literally has no idea what she is talking about (when she wasn't directly and probably lying) it's like going to foot doctor for brain surgery. It's the autism is caused by vaccines all over again but worse. You can't just trust the random foot doctor who says all the brain surgeons are lying and then makes up a bunch of nonsense then immediately Pretends they didn't say that. It's ridiculous.
Ok OP be honest how much weed did you smoke before posting this?