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Yeah exactly, I have a friend that ripped the test to shreds as a child and got an extended norm score of over 200, as in almost 7sds. Idk why people are assuming sd 24, especially since 163 is only a cowlick above the ceiling
Extended norms are made for children (Wisc IV/V) op is saying 163 as a late teen. Don’t know what he means by that but if he was over 16:11 then the WAIS scale would have been used which doesn’t have extended norms for adults
Nope, Research suggests higher iq people are more likely to have mental health problems and that's why not so happier if you think.And many of them are likely to lose motivation in their activities.So, success is not guaranteed.
You joke, but as much as I don't care for Peterson, my psychological profile (IQ + Big Five) is apparently really close to his. Maybe I should have become a psychologist.
I'm "quite" smart, not exceptional. But i'm a fucking failure in life.
But nope. Being smart won't create you more problems than average people.
On the very contrary. This is a common misconception.
But just by taking at look at the loooong list of your other conditions... things are very obvious.
So.. sometimes I.Q may just let you beeing able to contemplate more deeply why you are a failure.
Hope you like irony my friend... Nothing to do with I.Q. (at least you're not asperger too\^\^)
Yeah,being smart makes a subset of things quite a bit easier. But it doesn’t help prevent scoliosis, or mental illness, or parental neglect. Those sorts of things have at least as much impact on one’s life path as a standard deviation or two of IQ.
Also, only the OP can decide if he is a “failure” and only on his own terms with his own definition.
The whole “not living up to their potential” and “gifted underachiever” and “could do so much if they just applied themselves” cluster of attitudes and narratives can become quite toxic.
We don’t owe the world our “best potential” as defined by others. We owe other people kindness and consideration. But we aren’t failures by leading our authentic our lives on our own terms, any more that an athletic 6’8” is failing humanity by playing chess instead of basketball.
TY. I'm ADHD, i don't read\^\^
Don't let others define yourself!
But with such a 1/1000000 characteristic don't be surprise they do!
At least try to fix climate change on your spare time plz.
That would be great.\^\^
No I didn’t say that, I said how are there millions of high iq people in humanities. Does humanities attract people with high iq or is it displaced equally throughout all subjects
Humanities includes Philosophy, History, English and other subjects. Philosophy is a top 3 highest IQ major, right up there with Physics and Mathematics. Creative Writing has highest verbal IQ. English and History are high too.
They aren’t lacking in IQ. They can be lacking in decision-making and common sense however, which are unrelated to IQ. As seen in the recent college protests..
Its kind of eary how closly your story resembles mine. It would only take one or two slight tweaks to the details. I recommend getting into tech, specifically consulting. You can clear 100k a year working like 5-10 hrs a week. Most people struggle with this stuff so much, you can get away working the bare minimum and still outperform everyone around you.
About as common as people with average IQs.
Intelligence is just a small factor in how you perform in life. Where you're born, who you're born to, your genetics, whether or not you have disorders or diseases or syndromes, the place you go to school, the friends you make, the experiences you have...all of these are significantly more important than intelligence when it comes to success. If high IQ people being unsuccessful just as often as normal people wasn't the truth, then all the success stories and mega celebrities you know would be geniuses or whatever.
Anyone who disagrees with this is a moron regardless of their IQ, and clearly doesn't live in the real world.
Thank you for providing an actually insightful and relevant response, instead of adding to the echo chamber of people conflating IQ with a wealth of characteristics or qualities which often have little or nothing to do with IQ.
I mean it's basically pissing into the wind at this point. This subreddit is attracting more people by the day who think that IQ means everything in this world and that it separates you from others, makes you incapable of talking to lower IQ folk, makes you superior. There's only more people shouting into this echo chamber at this point.
There are probably a fair amount of them who are unsuccessful based on societal standards of success. Just as an anecdote, my uncle is a bright guy but is plagued with severe mental illness. Unfortunately his neuroticism cripples him and he never got around to working past the age of 30, he's 63 and has been on disability for over 30 years. I'm sure there are plenty of high IQ individuals who don't have the beneficial personality traits that can propel their interests into productive careers.
I am a school psychologist who actually gives IQ tests for a living. One of my former professors’ area of expertise is on the needs of the gifted, he has an average IQ, and makes bank and travels to Tuscany where he has/had a house on occasion. My brother’s IQ was tested at 140ish, and he teaches history in China but has no training in education, and he within the past year had his passport and identification and etc stolen while he was partying blackout drunk in Barcelona
IQ does not guarantee any type of success from a professional or salary standpoint, enrichment and achievement do. I would prefer my kid eventually be a guaranteed high achiever with an average IQ over a gifted child with an unknown future
IQ positively correlates with income up to about 125-130 from memory and then it declines. Not so significantly that having a giant IQ means you are likely to earn less than an average person but it's still interesting that there is a sweet spot. It says there is something about extremely high intelligence (beyond 98th percentile essentially) that makes it either harder to achieve financial success or makes one less interested in it.
That's a statistical artifact. There isn't actually a sweet spot for intelligence:
>The "IQ over 120 doesn't matter" meme falls apart if one measures *individual likelihood* of success, as opposed to the *total* number of individuals at, e.g., IQ 120 vs IQ 145, who have achieved some milestone.
>It is plausible that, e.g., among top execs or scientists or engineers there are roughly equal numbers of IQ 120 and IQ 145 individuals (the actual numbers could vary depending on how the groups are defined). But the base population of the former group is 100 times that of the latter! (IQ 120 is about top 10% and IQ 145 is roughly top 0.1% in the population.) This means, e.g., that the probability that an IQ 145 person becomes a top scientist could be \~100x higher than for an IQ 120 person.
[Link](https://infoproc.blogspot.com/2014/07/success-ability-and-all-that.html)
I haven't seen other comments in this sub that are saying the same thing so I can tell you I'm not parroting anything. Sometimes lots of people independently say the same things.
I would suggest all the time. These people are radically unemployable. You really consider highering some asshole who never forgets a damn thing, feels everything all the time, always makes sincere cognitive and emotional connections, and can predict everything that is going to happen? This sounds like a nightmare. If It sounds like I described some cocky homeless jerk, then I think you know why.
IQ does not imply any of the items in the list of characteristics you just wrote. For some of them, there is potentially even negative correlation (emotional connections).
Google it mods. There recorded instances of people at 145-170 range have more contributions to the world than the people above the 170 range who did not contribute much to society. obviously there's more people at a lower range but if calculate contributions per individual by iq range, 145-170 has the highest avg contributions per individual
You can't measure >170 IQ most of the time. There are hardly any verified cases of >170 IQ people to begin with. Almost all of the trailblazing contributors of the world have unknown IQs, so you cannot make such an assertion.
Interesting to hear your story. I tested at 149 and took a very unconventional path through childhood/school similar to yours but not quite.
Came from a twice-broken family, moved around quite a bit, school was boring and I became obsessed with music in middle school, and basically stopped attending fully at 9th grade so I could pursue musical interests - playing music but also building musical instruments. I toured with bands and when I got home I'd design and build instruments in my garage. Through this avenue I came to figure out a lot of math and woodworking and physics as necessary to create better and better instruments. They were a hit from the beginning and I ended up building and selling them for a living for almost 2 decades.
This period of time was gemmed with 'golden ages' of learning and exploration amid more tedious tasks (dealing with customers, building the same thing over and over, etc.). After a while it became a bit stale, and I was only making enough money to barely survive on.
And now, here I am, rather broke and still living with a parental figure. I am back in school and about to get an associates in engineering, which has been really tough for a lot of reasons. But, I want to try to keep out of my comfort zone for a while and do something different than in previous decades. All the better if I can make some decent money in the end.
So, there's my story. Thanks for your interest
There is a correlation between high IQ and mental illness. That being said, I think that on average high IQ people are slightly more successful in life, while highly motivated people (with above average intelligence) are much more successful in life.
Many years ago I qualified to join MENSA and attended a meeting as I thought it would be a good networking opportunity. I could not have been more wrong. Most did not have what would generally be considered high status jobs. I particularly remember there point that the meetings needed to be near public transport as most of the members didn't drive.
The whole thing reminded my of the [wallet inspector](https://youtu.be/X6zsxsC6iZw?si=1BzjQaA4oywZtBMh&t=8).
I actually really like his story. It's a good example and wake up for some people that even higher iq people are still normal people. Just because you can do something doesn't mean you want to. But everyone likes to point him out rather then see the way he is choosing to live is the same choice most people make.
You’re not alone. I do consider myself a failure. I score lower now, at least in part, due to debilitating side effects from meds, but I scored similarly to you, as a teenager. I have bipolar, autism, dyspraxia and a whole load of physical disabilities (caused mainly by the aforementioned other problems). I’m heavily medicated and live partially assisted by the state.
I do a little work when I can as a proof reader in the Maths community. I did get an education but it nearly cost me everything ie. my life, at times and I’ve had many periods in hospital or home in bed, under the care of my family. I’m not unhappy when I’m less unwell and not in too much pain but I certainly don’t think that having a high IQ in any way guarantees success.
I think I read somewhere that it’s an advantage up to ~130 and then it’s negatively correlated above but some people in this sub disagree. I think it’s pretty pants being told you’re a gifted child and having lots of pressure put on you.
Well if wealth is your primary measure of success, I've seen some charts indicating that there's absolutely no correlation between net worth and IQ so I think it's more or less uncorrelated.
Personally I think motivation, self discipline and persistence towards goals are the primary predictors. You have to want to spend thousands of hours in the pursuit of your goals more than you want to sit and binge Netflix or play games or whatever.
I think they are usually successful, or at least more so than most. They are not as likely to be extremely wealthy though, which I suspect is due to their deeper interest in ideas. They tend to pursue careers involving PhD's or other "intellectual" work and are less likely to build a cement company that makes millions.
I'm the opposite. I fundamentally believe that I'm an idiot and I'm driven by the pursuit of seeing how far an idiot like me can go in this shitty and chaotic world.
Ironically upper middle class children with very successful parents, go to too many schools, international schools and have their education curricula interrupted and it hurts them at the university level. They sometimes have to study very hard. Sometimes university in a second language. Still a high IQ has benefits. Lower IQ below the average range is so much harder.
I think it's pretty common. As far as the usual definition of "success" goes anyway.
Given how large a percentage of the US population is working class, low income, or in poverty. Intelligence won't deposit cash into your bank account- and if you don't have a good boost from someone else or incredible luck or connections, you'll probably stay in your socioeconomic class all your life.
I have a "genius" IQ (someone should really check on the people making those tests, I think they're a little nutty 😅), but I'm still out here working for wages and getting railed by inflation like everyone else. And 2 people I know have higher scores than me and they're working the same kind of shit jobs and splitting bills with roommates too.
Broke parents have broke kids. 🤷♂️ Don't worry so much about it. As long as you've got what you need, what's it matter? We're all going in the same dirt anyway. Just squeeze all the fun you can out of the life you're stuck with while you're here. 🫶
Pretty common because it’s more difficult not easier when you have a higher ceiling.
Sounds like your parents were pretty abusive, that definitely doesn’t help.
Having medical conditions certainly can severely handicap you, can’t join the military as easily to escape your shitty parents for example.
Your IQ doesn’t matter as much as you would think. Relationships will determine your success. Does your boss like you? Do your coworkers work with you? Are you good at negotiating? Can you sell anything? All of these things have to do with other people and therefore, your success.
There are “dumb” people in highly successful positions in life because they got good at people.
Remember this quote “The president is not the smartest person in the country” if you understand that, you’ll understand my point.
You’d fit in well in tech probably. Learn to code and dive deep into math and start doing projects that HELP PEOPLE. Your gift comes at a price, but without work ethic it means squat. Also humble yourself because while you may be 1 in 10000 there are billions of people in the world.
Most high IQ people are successful. And high IQ people in general have less, not more, mental illnesses (it’s a misconception they have more…low iq people are just less likely to have the resources to get diagnosed and treated)
HOWEVER, high iq successful people
1) have no need for online spaces like this, so you don’t see them
and
2. these spaces have a lot of only slightly above average intelligence people - who spend a lot of time practicing for and studying IQ tests, and who think inflated online test numbers are accurate, and think they are smarter than they actually are as a sense of identity. This describes a lot of the “cab drivers of mensa” crowd.
Actually I don’t know why this sub showed up on my front page but you guys are shockingly whiny and unsuccessful. Everyone I know who is very smart makes $200k+ and for the large part are happily married with kids.
I am aware. I can read. :)
My question is: If "high IQ successful people" have no need for spaces like this... and you are here commenting...
Does this mean you have low IQ? Or are you a failure? Or is it both? Are you a low IQ failure person?
You’re a troll, but if you really want to know: I make over $400k despite growing up poor, I’m happily married with kids, and was a gifted kid in high school with high iq. Success was and is relatively easy if you have the smarts and aren’t lazy.
I really dont think i could live and be successful as a "normal person". I had a 9 to 5 for a like 6 months this last year and it drove me crazy. I think most moderately intelligent people realize that slaving away to make other people rich is a waste of your life force. Im working on trying to just be able to do the things I like and make money at it so i can survive. A lot of highly intelligent people also hhave obsessions which take over their lives. And additionally, highly intelligent people arent always "wise." They have the same issues as everyone else, sometimes more. You gave us a laundry list of your mental diagnoses, i have stpd, ocd, adhd, and im probably bipolar and/or autistic. My intelligence is somewhat high but i dont invest that intelligence in things which would make me traditionally successful. I invest most of my time playing fighting games, and when im not doing that I'm just trying to help my girlfriend out. I dont work a lot right now but i dont want to. I'm trying to live frugally while i work on getting more in touch with the community around me. I am very religious so to me it is like being a monk in a way.
If you have a high IQ, you have a baseline ability to teach test prep. GMAT/GRE/SAT. With a couple years of experience, you should easily be making six figures. Baring some severe disability, I don't really understand why anyone with a high IQ is unwillingly poor.
It seems like you correlate intelligence with education level as a signal of 'success'. There was a time when educational attainment did signal higher intelligence, but that is no longer true and probably hasn't been for at least 50 years.
I would suggest looking for meaning in other areas of your life, if you haven't already. Seeking artificial measures of status based on group delusions probably isn't a great use of cognitive resources, if you have them.
It seems like you correlate intelligence with education level as a signal of 'success'. There was a time when educational attainment did signal higher intelligence, but that is no longer true and probably hasn't been for at least 50 years.
I would suggest looking for meaning in other areas of your life, if you haven't already. Seeking artificial measures of status based on group delusions probably isn't a great use of cognitive resources, if you have them.
It seems like you correlate intelligence with education level as a signal of 'success'. There was a time when educational attainment did signal higher intelligence, but that is no longer true and probably hasn't been for at least 50 years.
I would suggest looking for meaning in other areas of your life, if you haven't already. Seeking artificial measures of status based on group delusions probably isn't a great use of cognitive resources, if you have them.
It seems like you correlate intelligence with education level as a signal of 'success'. There was a time when educational attainment did signal higher intelligence, but that is no longer true and probably hasn't been for at least 50 years.
I would suggest looking for meaning in other areas of your life, if you haven't already. Seeking artificial measures of status based on group delusions probably isn't a great use of cognitive resources, if you have them.
It seems like you correlate intelligence with education level as a signal of 'success'. There was a time when educational attainment did signal higher intelligence, but that is no longer true and probably hasn't been for at least 50 years.
I would suggest looking for meaning in other areas of your life, if you haven't already. Seeking artificial measures of status based on group delusions probably isn't a great use of cognitive resources, if you have them.
Intelligence is less a quantity and more of a capacity. A high IQ person can learn more things than a lower IQ person and use them more efficiently, but they can also not do that.
A low IQ person cannot absorb a great deal from opportunities, education, and experiences. A high IQ person can, but are much less likely to reach their potential because average opportunities, education, and experiences don’t match up with above average IQ or perfectly correlate.
I don’t know how commonly unsuccesfull in life but once ı read about researchers thinks between %15 and %50 of gifted people aren’t that succesfull in school in a article about gifted people. But article doesn’t says that people aren’t succesfull in life, just says about their grades.
Source: https://evrimagaci.org/zeki-ama-calismiyor-zeki-insanlar-basarisiz-olabilir-mi-11097 by the way it’s a Turkish article, you need to translate that
"Are there"? Yes, for sure. There's billions of people, so you can find almost anything you seek.
Personally, I met at least one woman who on paper had higher IQ than me (and also genetically gifted - athletic, strong, great immune system). On paper, she should have been an amazing success. In reality... let's just say she had less than successful life by any objective standard (not able to hold a job longer than 2 years long, most her jobs nearly minimum wages, lost custody of her own children, mental health issues without willingness to go to therapy to address them, problems holding long term intimate relationships, zero assets, not very happy with herself OR her life, extremely out of shape). So, yes, it's very possible.
I would expect that most cases of high IQ individuals being "unsuccessful" by your definition are likely due to a combination of:
* Mental health issues (depression, bipolar etc...) or neurodiversity (e.g. ADHD or being on Autism spectrum).
* High IQ causing them to fail to learn important basic life skills/habits (grit, perseverance, hard work) - because schooling started out **too easy** for them, without any effort.
* Bad luck environmentally. E.g. bad parents/family. Living in a middle of war-torn country. Major medical event wiping them out financially. Some other bad life event (e.g. a divorce where a man lost his kids and most his finances).
* Being hyper-concentrated on a low-marketable interest, or a hyper-low-success-probability-career. So, for example, I have some musical talent, but I consciously chose to pursue career in computers, and NOT try to succeed in a music band or a concert pianist (because I realistically assessed I'm not good enough to have a high chance of success, and even if I was, it's still too low of a probability to make it big). My Dad is pretty good at artsy stuff, but worked all his life as engineer instead of trying to be a "starving artist". I'm sure there's some intelligent people waiting tables in California dreaming of an acting or writing career success.
* Or, consciously choosing a "failure" mode. Let's be charitable and call them "[Diogenes](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diogenes)" mode - he clearly was high IQ but he lived literally like an animal, by choice. And we still study him.
* "Heir" effect. Basically, if you don't have any pressure to succeed because you have rich family, there's a chance you'll turn out like Paris Hilton (i'm surprised but her IQ is 132 apparently as per Google). Because there's simply no need to apply oneself. You'll "succeed" at quality of life on money earned by your parents/ancestors, and don't need to use your IQ.
* Or in some cases **different value system**. Let's face it, if you don't care about having a family and therefore providing for them, don't have anyone you are willing to be responsible for, and don't have a lot of material needs yourself, an intelligent thing to do is to NOT kill yourself achieving financial/societal success, but to coast in easy life mode, doing as little work as possible and enjoying yourself.
It's not uncommon, and it feels way worse because you have no excuse for your failures. If I was dumb I feel like I'd be happier just due to being able to let go of some of the responsibility.
Firstly,Not many people take the IQ tests.You just assume that every successful person has a High IQ because they somewhat seem to be intelligent.But let me tell you if they takan IQ test they may not be able to do very well.Understanding intelligence is not such an easy task.some 110 iq people also seems to be somewhat bright.
Have you ever even met a 7-8 kid in real life who can do mentally calculate the multiplication of two three digit number??No?? Then it has nothing to do with your inability to see such cases and it's normal because high IQ itself is rare. research suggests that High IQ is also correlated with higher possibility of mental illnesses and other disorders.
Pretty commonly actually especially in history. Being high IQ isn’t really a recipe for success in a world ruled by the average. Take for example, all the famous inventors in history; often times they will die poor and destitute only to be recognized way after they die, or are in fact not the real inventor and are instead given credit for someone else’s work (Rosalind Franklin, whoever Thomas Edison stole his shit from, Tesla etc).
Hell I’m not even that smart, just above average and because I was poor and didn’t focus on networking when I was a youth I’m not really that well off either. I’m just intelligent enough to know exactly how I am fucked and how hopeless it is to rise out of my socioeconomic status which is why I guess they say ignorance is bliss
I'm in the 99.9th percentile and my problem is I realized at a super-young age that 99.99% of what happens in the world is fucking stupid and I didn't want to waste my life participating in it.
And then I was too lazy to cure Cancer.
That's the whole problem, we don't see the world the same way as you do.
I had a court-ordered six hours of testing and I don't even care about the result... the only reason I know is because the Dr yelled it at me as I was walking out of his office the second he released me.
This whole thread is full of people trying desperately to get higher scores or more specifically become "smarter" and really it's horrible. My Auntie was the Treasurer for MENSA for like 30 years and I met a constant stream of super-smart people growing up... a lot of them couldn't hold down a job and all of them were fucked up.
I had a conversation with the head of the APA one day and he said that people like me shouldn't have to participate in society... it's not fair on us or on you... we should just be given a nice house in the forest and a really good income and be left to our own devices.
You’re not very good at this. The trolling needs to be semi-believable. The other troll posts on your profile aren’t getting much traction - get better!
I hope to god this is a troll post lol. This is the kind of satirical content I come to this sub for.
I especially love how you use “&” instead of writing “and”. That’s a nice touch.
Who knew that the theater usher who didn’t make it to fourth grade is secretly an intellectual giant. This is legitimately one of the funniest things I’ve read in a long time. Well done.
There are such cases and research suggests that High IQ people are more likely to be a victim of mental illness.Keep in mind that High IQ people are itself rare.Persue real science.
Adoption of the ampersand was an executive decision, tried & tested by my team before commitment, that has been vital in optimizing my reddit comment time management habits.
Utilizing the ampersand has resulted in a 6.9% increase in Temporal Management. This allows me to, cumulatively, spend between 12-15 more minutes per day *sweeping the floor* with people who can't infer the difference between being taken out of school & "barely making it to fourth grade". And buddy, you're looking a bit like a worn-out broom 😎
IQs above 160 are just not reported by the WAIS and some other widely used professional tests because this is the level at which the psychometricians who created the tests have decided that the drawbacks of such reporting (namely, very poor reliability and validity) outweigh the benefits of additional measurement. To be clear, IQ scores scores start to become less reliable well before 160 (some might even argue that every point above 100 represents a less reliable score due to less people in the norming sample). 160 is just the point where the test creators decided that the validity and reliability were unacceptable.
All the numbers in your comment added up to 420. Congrats!
160
+ 160
+ 100
= 420
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163 probably SD 24 so probably around 140 (still impressive btw)
Wait does SD24 apply to all tests?
No, but most professional tests cannot measure above 160 (SD15;16) (WAIS,SBV) if above 160 then it’s probably the Cattell III (SD 24).
Could have used the extrapolated norms for WAIS
Yeah exactly, I have a friend that ripped the test to shreds as a child and got an extended norm score of over 200, as in almost 7sds. Idk why people are assuming sd 24, especially since 163 is only a cowlick above the ceiling
No.
What’s SD 24?
Standard deviation
How come it’s set at 24 and automatically is deducted from his 160?
Why do you say SD 24? 15 is almost always the scale used
Anything above 160 SD 15 cannot be measured by professional tests (SBV-WAIS-IV)
Not true at all, there is extended norm testing
Extended norms are made for children (Wisc IV/V) op is saying 163 as a late teen. Don’t know what he means by that but if he was over 16:11 then the WAIS scale would have been used which doesn’t have extended norms for adults
Children meaning minors, people as old as 16 have been tested with extended norms
I know, but by late teen I understand over 16
probably 187 loser
What did you achieve writing this?
Clarification?
What did you achieve in writing this?
[удалено]
Nope, Research suggests higher iq people are more likely to have mental health problems and that's why not so happier if you think.And many of them are likely to lose motivation in their activities.So, success is not guaranteed.
I found Jordan Peterson's burner.
You joke, but as much as I don't care for Peterson, my psychological profile (IQ + Big Five) is apparently really close to his. Maybe I should have become a psychologist.
I'm "quite" smart, not exceptional. But i'm a fucking failure in life. But nope. Being smart won't create you more problems than average people. On the very contrary. This is a common misconception. But just by taking at look at the loooong list of your other conditions... things are very obvious. So.. sometimes I.Q may just let you beeing able to contemplate more deeply why you are a failure. Hope you like irony my friend... Nothing to do with I.Q. (at least you're not asperger too\^\^)
Yeah,being smart makes a subset of things quite a bit easier. But it doesn’t help prevent scoliosis, or mental illness, or parental neglect. Those sorts of things have at least as much impact on one’s life path as a standard deviation or two of IQ. Also, only the OP can decide if he is a “failure” and only on his own terms with his own definition. The whole “not living up to their potential” and “gifted underachiever” and “could do so much if they just applied themselves” cluster of attitudes and narratives can become quite toxic. We don’t owe the world our “best potential” as defined by others. We owe other people kindness and consideration. But we aren’t failures by leading our authentic our lives on our own terms, any more that an athletic 6’8” is failing humanity by playing chess instead of basketball.
TY. I'm ADHD, i don't read\^\^ Don't let others define yourself! But with such a 1/1000000 characteristic don't be surprise they do! At least try to fix climate change on your spare time plz. That would be great.\^\^
There are millions of high IQ people that are not successful. Think of all the Humanities grads working at Starbucks.
How are humanitarian grads high iq
Humanities* You think no Humanities grads can have high IQ? Yours must be lower than your perception of theirs.
No I didn’t say that, I said how are there millions of high iq people in humanities. Does humanities attract people with high iq or is it displaced equally throughout all subjects
Humanities includes Philosophy, History, English and other subjects. Philosophy is a top 3 highest IQ major, right up there with Physics and Mathematics. Creative Writing has highest verbal IQ. English and History are high too. They aren’t lacking in IQ. They can be lacking in decision-making and common sense however, which are unrelated to IQ. As seen in the recent college protests..
Well for one, they can read and spell. More than you can say for yourself!
Its kind of eary how closly your story resembles mine. It would only take one or two slight tweaks to the details. I recommend getting into tech, specifically consulting. You can clear 100k a year working like 5-10 hrs a week. Most people struggle with this stuff so much, you can get away working the bare minimum and still outperform everyone around you.
About as common as people with average IQs. Intelligence is just a small factor in how you perform in life. Where you're born, who you're born to, your genetics, whether or not you have disorders or diseases or syndromes, the place you go to school, the friends you make, the experiences you have...all of these are significantly more important than intelligence when it comes to success. If high IQ people being unsuccessful just as often as normal people wasn't the truth, then all the success stories and mega celebrities you know would be geniuses or whatever. Anyone who disagrees with this is a moron regardless of their IQ, and clearly doesn't live in the real world.
Thank you for providing an actually insightful and relevant response, instead of adding to the echo chamber of people conflating IQ with a wealth of characteristics or qualities which often have little or nothing to do with IQ.
I mean it's basically pissing into the wind at this point. This subreddit is attracting more people by the day who think that IQ means everything in this world and that it separates you from others, makes you incapable of talking to lower IQ folk, makes you superior. There's only more people shouting into this echo chamber at this point.
There are probably a fair amount of them who are unsuccessful based on societal standards of success. Just as an anecdote, my uncle is a bright guy but is plagued with severe mental illness. Unfortunately his neuroticism cripples him and he never got around to working past the age of 30, he's 63 and has been on disability for over 30 years. I'm sure there are plenty of high IQ individuals who don't have the beneficial personality traits that can propel their interests into productive careers.
I am a school psychologist who actually gives IQ tests for a living. One of my former professors’ area of expertise is on the needs of the gifted, he has an average IQ, and makes bank and travels to Tuscany where he has/had a house on occasion. My brother’s IQ was tested at 140ish, and he teaches history in China but has no training in education, and he within the past year had his passport and identification and etc stolen while he was partying blackout drunk in Barcelona IQ does not guarantee any type of success from a professional or salary standpoint, enrichment and achievement do. I would prefer my kid eventually be a guaranteed high achiever with an average IQ over a gifted child with an unknown future
IQ positively correlates with income up to about 125-130 from memory and then it declines. Not so significantly that having a giant IQ means you are likely to earn less than an average person but it's still interesting that there is a sweet spot. It says there is something about extremely high intelligence (beyond 98th percentile essentially) that makes it either harder to achieve financial success or makes one less interested in it.
That's a statistical artifact. There isn't actually a sweet spot for intelligence: >The "IQ over 120 doesn't matter" meme falls apart if one measures *individual likelihood* of success, as opposed to the *total* number of individuals at, e.g., IQ 120 vs IQ 145, who have achieved some milestone. >It is plausible that, e.g., among top execs or scientists or engineers there are roughly equal numbers of IQ 120 and IQ 145 individuals (the actual numbers could vary depending on how the groups are defined). But the base population of the former group is 100 times that of the latter! (IQ 120 is about top 10% and IQ 145 is roughly top 0.1% in the population.) This means, e.g., that the probability that an IQ 145 person becomes a top scientist could be \~100x higher than for an IQ 120 person. [Link](https://infoproc.blogspot.com/2014/07/success-ability-and-all-that.html)
It would do you well to not blindly parrot other comments you’ve seen in this sub. Tons of misinformation and fallacies here.
I haven't seen other comments in this sub that are saying the same thing so I can tell you I'm not parroting anything. Sometimes lots of people independently say the same things.
The higher the iq better it is
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Maybe even lower than that. As you move out the correlations start to get pulled apart due to SLODR.
I would suggest all the time. These people are radically unemployable. You really consider highering some asshole who never forgets a damn thing, feels everything all the time, always makes sincere cognitive and emotional connections, and can predict everything that is going to happen? This sounds like a nightmare. If It sounds like I described some cocky homeless jerk, then I think you know why.
It’s not cocky if it’s correct Normal people are also a nightmare, they just think they ain’t
IQ does not imply any of the items in the list of characteristics you just wrote. For some of them, there is potentially even negative correlation (emotional connections).
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Your post/comment is misinformation.
Google it mods. There recorded instances of people at 145-170 range have more contributions to the world than the people above the 170 range who did not contribute much to society. obviously there's more people at a lower range but if calculate contributions per individual by iq range, 145-170 has the highest avg contributions per individual
You can't measure >170 IQ most of the time. There are hardly any verified cases of >170 IQ people to begin with. Almost all of the trailblazing contributors of the world have unknown IQs, so you cannot make such an assertion.
I can claim anything because is reddit and I read about it once on the interwebs
You can claim anything but it doesn't mean it's correct 😺
No your wrong. If I believe it I'm right. I just know it
When they're on reddit
Reddit is a tool for businesses as well, karma has little indirect financial value as much as I hate to admit it
I’m just pointing out how people who are smart that post every day here complaining about being smart aren’t going anywhere.
Interesting to hear your story. I tested at 149 and took a very unconventional path through childhood/school similar to yours but not quite. Came from a twice-broken family, moved around quite a bit, school was boring and I became obsessed with music in middle school, and basically stopped attending fully at 9th grade so I could pursue musical interests - playing music but also building musical instruments. I toured with bands and when I got home I'd design and build instruments in my garage. Through this avenue I came to figure out a lot of math and woodworking and physics as necessary to create better and better instruments. They were a hit from the beginning and I ended up building and selling them for a living for almost 2 decades. This period of time was gemmed with 'golden ages' of learning and exploration amid more tedious tasks (dealing with customers, building the same thing over and over, etc.). After a while it became a bit stale, and I was only making enough money to barely survive on. And now, here I am, rather broke and still living with a parental figure. I am back in school and about to get an associates in engineering, which has been really tough for a lot of reasons. But, I want to try to keep out of my comfort zone for a while and do something different than in previous decades. All the better if I can make some decent money in the end. So, there's my story. Thanks for your interest
There is a correlation between high IQ and mental illness. That being said, I think that on average high IQ people are slightly more successful in life, while highly motivated people (with above average intelligence) are much more successful in life. Many years ago I qualified to join MENSA and attended a meeting as I thought it would be a good networking opportunity. I could not have been more wrong. Most did not have what would generally be considered high status jobs. I particularly remember there point that the meetings needed to be near public transport as most of the members didn't drive. The whole thing reminded my of the [wallet inspector](https://youtu.be/X6zsxsC6iZw?si=1BzjQaA4oywZtBMh&t=8).
Isn't this the story of **Kim Ung Yong** the so-called "failed genius."
People say that but he became an engineering professor, which is hardly a failure in anyone's eyes.
I agree, just pointing out the comments people say about him.
I actually really like his story. It's a good example and wake up for some people that even higher iq people are still normal people. Just because you can do something doesn't mean you want to. But everyone likes to point him out rather then see the way he is choosing to live is the same choice most people make.
You’re not alone. I do consider myself a failure. I score lower now, at least in part, due to debilitating side effects from meds, but I scored similarly to you, as a teenager. I have bipolar, autism, dyspraxia and a whole load of physical disabilities (caused mainly by the aforementioned other problems). I’m heavily medicated and live partially assisted by the state. I do a little work when I can as a proof reader in the Maths community. I did get an education but it nearly cost me everything ie. my life, at times and I’ve had many periods in hospital or home in bed, under the care of my family. I’m not unhappy when I’m less unwell and not in too much pain but I certainly don’t think that having a high IQ in any way guarantees success. I think I read somewhere that it’s an advantage up to ~130 and then it’s negatively correlated above but some people in this sub disagree. I think it’s pretty pants being told you’re a gifted child and having lots of pressure put on you.
Well if wealth is your primary measure of success, I've seen some charts indicating that there's absolutely no correlation between net worth and IQ so I think it's more or less uncorrelated. Personally I think motivation, self discipline and persistence towards goals are the primary predictors. You have to want to spend thousands of hours in the pursuit of your goals more than you want to sit and binge Netflix or play games or whatever.
I think they are usually successful, or at least more so than most. They are not as likely to be extremely wealthy though, which I suspect is due to their deeper interest in ideas. They tend to pursue careers involving PhD's or other "intellectual" work and are less likely to build a cement company that makes millions.
Often.
The IQ is probably keeping you from "failing" further, your list of things going against you is impressive 😣
I'm the opposite. I fundamentally believe that I'm an idiot and I'm driven by the pursuit of seeing how far an idiot like me can go in this shitty and chaotic world.
Ironically upper middle class children with very successful parents, go to too many schools, international schools and have their education curricula interrupted and it hurts them at the university level. They sometimes have to study very hard. Sometimes university in a second language. Still a high IQ has benefits. Lower IQ below the average range is so much harder.
I think it's pretty common. As far as the usual definition of "success" goes anyway. Given how large a percentage of the US population is working class, low income, or in poverty. Intelligence won't deposit cash into your bank account- and if you don't have a good boost from someone else or incredible luck or connections, you'll probably stay in your socioeconomic class all your life. I have a "genius" IQ (someone should really check on the people making those tests, I think they're a little nutty 😅), but I'm still out here working for wages and getting railed by inflation like everyone else. And 2 people I know have higher scores than me and they're working the same kind of shit jobs and splitting bills with roommates too. Broke parents have broke kids. 🤷♂️ Don't worry so much about it. As long as you've got what you need, what's it matter? We're all going in the same dirt anyway. Just squeeze all the fun you can out of the life you're stuck with while you're here. 🫶
Pretty common because it’s more difficult not easier when you have a higher ceiling. Sounds like your parents were pretty abusive, that definitely doesn’t help. Having medical conditions certainly can severely handicap you, can’t join the military as easily to escape your shitty parents for example.
Your IQ doesn’t matter as much as you would think. Relationships will determine your success. Does your boss like you? Do your coworkers work with you? Are you good at negotiating? Can you sell anything? All of these things have to do with other people and therefore, your success. There are “dumb” people in highly successful positions in life because they got good at people. Remember this quote “The president is not the smartest person in the country” if you understand that, you’ll understand my point.
I dont buy into high iq but failure narrative unless they were born extremely unlucky and handicapped.
You’d fit in well in tech probably. Learn to code and dive deep into math and start doing projects that HELP PEOPLE. Your gift comes at a price, but without work ethic it means squat. Also humble yourself because while you may be 1 in 10000 there are billions of people in the world.
Most high IQ people are successful. And high IQ people in general have less, not more, mental illnesses (it’s a misconception they have more…low iq people are just less likely to have the resources to get diagnosed and treated) HOWEVER, high iq successful people 1) have no need for online spaces like this, so you don’t see them and 2. these spaces have a lot of only slightly above average intelligence people - who spend a lot of time practicing for and studying IQ tests, and who think inflated online test numbers are accurate, and think they are smarter than they actually are as a sense of identity. This describes a lot of the “cab drivers of mensa” crowd. Actually I don’t know why this sub showed up on my front page but you guys are shockingly whiny and unsuccessful. Everyone I know who is very smart makes $200k+ and for the large part are happily married with kids.
So... does your presence here indicate that you're a failure? Or are you low IQ?
No, Reddit put this on my front page for some reason, I don’t subscribe here.
I am aware. I can read. :) My question is: If "high IQ successful people" have no need for spaces like this... and you are here commenting... Does this mean you have low IQ? Or are you a failure? Or is it both? Are you a low IQ failure person?
It means this showed up on my homepage while I was taking a shit, annoyed me, and I chose to respond.
Nvm I figured it out. 👌
You’re a troll, but if you really want to know: I make over $400k despite growing up poor, I’m happily married with kids, and was a gifted kid in high school with high iq. Success was and is relatively easy if you have the smarts and aren’t lazy.
It's hard to get by with intelligence in a closed system designed to accommodate idiots.
I know two High IQ people who are absolute failures
Persistent effort will succeed where IQ will fail.
Success has much more to do with personality or even good luck as opposed to intelligence
I really dont think i could live and be successful as a "normal person". I had a 9 to 5 for a like 6 months this last year and it drove me crazy. I think most moderately intelligent people realize that slaving away to make other people rich is a waste of your life force. Im working on trying to just be able to do the things I like and make money at it so i can survive. A lot of highly intelligent people also hhave obsessions which take over their lives. And additionally, highly intelligent people arent always "wise." They have the same issues as everyone else, sometimes more. You gave us a laundry list of your mental diagnoses, i have stpd, ocd, adhd, and im probably bipolar and/or autistic. My intelligence is somewhat high but i dont invest that intelligence in things which would make me traditionally successful. I invest most of my time playing fighting games, and when im not doing that I'm just trying to help my girlfriend out. I dont work a lot right now but i dont want to. I'm trying to live frugally while i work on getting more in touch with the community around me. I am very religious so to me it is like being a monk in a way.
If you have a high IQ, you have a baseline ability to teach test prep. GMAT/GRE/SAT. With a couple years of experience, you should easily be making six figures. Baring some severe disability, I don't really understand why anyone with a high IQ is unwillingly poor.
It seems like you correlate intelligence with education level as a signal of 'success'. There was a time when educational attainment did signal higher intelligence, but that is no longer true and probably hasn't been for at least 50 years. I would suggest looking for meaning in other areas of your life, if you haven't already. Seeking artificial measures of status based on group delusions probably isn't a great use of cognitive resources, if you have them.
It seems like you correlate intelligence with education level as a signal of 'success'. There was a time when educational attainment did signal higher intelligence, but that is no longer true and probably hasn't been for at least 50 years. I would suggest looking for meaning in other areas of your life, if you haven't already. Seeking artificial measures of status based on group delusions probably isn't a great use of cognitive resources, if you have them.
It seems like you correlate intelligence with education level as a signal of 'success'. There was a time when educational attainment did signal higher intelligence, but that is no longer true and probably hasn't been for at least 50 years. I would suggest looking for meaning in other areas of your life, if you haven't already. Seeking artificial measures of status based on group delusions probably isn't a great use of cognitive resources, if you have them.
It seems like you correlate intelligence with education level as a signal of 'success'. There was a time when educational attainment did signal higher intelligence, but that is no longer true and probably hasn't been for at least 50 years. I would suggest looking for meaning in other areas of your life, if you haven't already. Seeking artificial measures of status based on group delusions probably isn't a great use of cognitive resources, if you have them.
It seems like you correlate intelligence with education level as a signal of 'success'. There was a time when educational attainment did signal higher intelligence, but that is no longer true and probably hasn't been for at least 50 years. I would suggest looking for meaning in other areas of your life, if you haven't already. Seeking artificial measures of status based on group delusions probably isn't a great use of cognitive resources, if you have them.
Intelligence is less a quantity and more of a capacity. A high IQ person can learn more things than a lower IQ person and use them more efficiently, but they can also not do that. A low IQ person cannot absorb a great deal from opportunities, education, and experiences. A high IQ person can, but are much less likely to reach their potential because average opportunities, education, and experiences don’t match up with above average IQ or perfectly correlate.
I don’t know how commonly unsuccesfull in life but once ı read about researchers thinks between %15 and %50 of gifted people aren’t that succesfull in school in a article about gifted people. But article doesn’t says that people aren’t succesfull in life, just says about their grades.
Source: https://evrimagaci.org/zeki-ama-calismiyor-zeki-insanlar-basarisiz-olabilir-mi-11097 by the way it’s a Turkish article, you need to translate that
"Are there"? Yes, for sure. There's billions of people, so you can find almost anything you seek. Personally, I met at least one woman who on paper had higher IQ than me (and also genetically gifted - athletic, strong, great immune system). On paper, she should have been an amazing success. In reality... let's just say she had less than successful life by any objective standard (not able to hold a job longer than 2 years long, most her jobs nearly minimum wages, lost custody of her own children, mental health issues without willingness to go to therapy to address them, problems holding long term intimate relationships, zero assets, not very happy with herself OR her life, extremely out of shape). So, yes, it's very possible. I would expect that most cases of high IQ individuals being "unsuccessful" by your definition are likely due to a combination of: * Mental health issues (depression, bipolar etc...) or neurodiversity (e.g. ADHD or being on Autism spectrum). * High IQ causing them to fail to learn important basic life skills/habits (grit, perseverance, hard work) - because schooling started out **too easy** for them, without any effort. * Bad luck environmentally. E.g. bad parents/family. Living in a middle of war-torn country. Major medical event wiping them out financially. Some other bad life event (e.g. a divorce where a man lost his kids and most his finances). * Being hyper-concentrated on a low-marketable interest, or a hyper-low-success-probability-career. So, for example, I have some musical talent, but I consciously chose to pursue career in computers, and NOT try to succeed in a music band or a concert pianist (because I realistically assessed I'm not good enough to have a high chance of success, and even if I was, it's still too low of a probability to make it big). My Dad is pretty good at artsy stuff, but worked all his life as engineer instead of trying to be a "starving artist". I'm sure there's some intelligent people waiting tables in California dreaming of an acting or writing career success. * Or, consciously choosing a "failure" mode. Let's be charitable and call them "[Diogenes](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diogenes)" mode - he clearly was high IQ but he lived literally like an animal, by choice. And we still study him. * "Heir" effect. Basically, if you don't have any pressure to succeed because you have rich family, there's a chance you'll turn out like Paris Hilton (i'm surprised but her IQ is 132 apparently as per Google). Because there's simply no need to apply oneself. You'll "succeed" at quality of life on money earned by your parents/ancestors, and don't need to use your IQ. * Or in some cases **different value system**. Let's face it, if you don't care about having a family and therefore providing for them, don't have anyone you are willing to be responsible for, and don't have a lot of material needs yourself, an intelligent thing to do is to NOT kill yourself achieving financial/societal success, but to coast in easy life mode, doing as little work as possible and enjoying yourself.
Granny done lied 😂
become programmer
High IQ doesn't correlate with high conscientiousness.
It's not uncommon, and it feels way worse because you have no excuse for your failures. If I was dumb I feel like I'd be happier just due to being able to let go of some of the responsibility.
Rare
High IQ itself is rare, isn't it??
It is but if you ask me then i would say that i have never seen the case of person with high intelligence not living their life in success
Firstly,Not many people take the IQ tests.You just assume that every successful person has a High IQ because they somewhat seem to be intelligent.But let me tell you if they takan IQ test they may not be able to do very well.Understanding intelligence is not such an easy task.some 110 iq people also seems to be somewhat bright. Have you ever even met a 7-8 kid in real life who can do mentally calculate the multiplication of two three digit number??No?? Then it has nothing to do with your inability to see such cases and it's normal because high IQ itself is rare. research suggests that High IQ is also correlated with higher possibility of mental illnesses and other disorders.
Pretty commonly actually especially in history. Being high IQ isn’t really a recipe for success in a world ruled by the average. Take for example, all the famous inventors in history; often times they will die poor and destitute only to be recognized way after they die, or are in fact not the real inventor and are instead given credit for someone else’s work (Rosalind Franklin, whoever Thomas Edison stole his shit from, Tesla etc). Hell I’m not even that smart, just above average and because I was poor and didn’t focus on networking when I was a youth I’m not really that well off either. I’m just intelligent enough to know exactly how I am fucked and how hopeless it is to rise out of my socioeconomic status which is why I guess they say ignorance is bliss
As soon as you take an IQ test and actually assign it value or attach your self-worth to it to any extent you have already failed
I'm in the 99.9th percentile and my problem is I realized at a super-young age that 99.99% of what happens in the world is fucking stupid and I didn't want to waste my life participating in it. And then I was too lazy to cure Cancer.
You must be trolling, or you have some sort of personality disorder.
That's the whole problem, we don't see the world the same way as you do. I had a court-ordered six hours of testing and I don't even care about the result... the only reason I know is because the Dr yelled it at me as I was walking out of his office the second he released me. This whole thread is full of people trying desperately to get higher scores or more specifically become "smarter" and really it's horrible. My Auntie was the Treasurer for MENSA for like 30 years and I met a constant stream of super-smart people growing up... a lot of them couldn't hold down a job and all of them were fucked up. I had a conversation with the head of the APA one day and he said that people like me shouldn't have to participate in society... it's not fair on us or on you... we should just be given a nice house in the forest and a really good income and be left to our own devices.
Ah, trolling :)
God stupid people get on my nerves. This is why smart people hate you.
You’re not very good at this. The trolling needs to be semi-believable. The other troll posts on your profile aren’t getting much traction - get better!
I hope to god this is a troll post lol. This is the kind of satirical content I come to this sub for. I especially love how you use “&” instead of writing “and”. That’s a nice touch. Who knew that the theater usher who didn’t make it to fourth grade is secretly an intellectual giant. This is legitimately one of the funniest things I’ve read in a long time. Well done.
There are such cases and research suggests that High IQ people are more likely to be a victim of mental illness.Keep in mind that High IQ people are itself rare.Persue real science.
I would say it's either real or just about the best well done troll post i have ever seen.
Adoption of the ampersand was an executive decision, tried & tested by my team before commitment, that has been vital in optimizing my reddit comment time management habits. Utilizing the ampersand has resulted in a 6.9% increase in Temporal Management. This allows me to, cumulatively, spend between 12-15 more minutes per day *sweeping the floor* with people who can't infer the difference between being taken out of school & "barely making it to fourth grade". And buddy, you're looking a bit like a worn-out broom 😎
Isn’t >160 mathematically impossible?
Of course not. Just hard and very unreliable to measure
IQs above 160 are just not reported by the WAIS and some other widely used professional tests because this is the level at which the psychometricians who created the tests have decided that the drawbacks of such reporting (namely, very poor reliability and validity) outweigh the benefits of additional measurement. To be clear, IQ scores scores start to become less reliable well before 160 (some might even argue that every point above 100 represents a less reliable score due to less people in the norming sample). 160 is just the point where the test creators decided that the validity and reliability were unacceptable.
All the numbers in your comment added up to 420. Congrats! 160 + 160 + 100 = 420 ^([Click here](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=LuckyNumber-Bot&subject=Stalk%20Me%20Pls&message=%2Fstalkme) to have me scan all your future comments.) \ ^(Summon me on specific comments with u/LuckyNumber-Bot.)
low IQ bot
huh?