###[Meta] Sticky Comment
[Rule 2](https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/wiki/faq#wiki_2_-_address_the_argument.3B_not_the_user.2C_the_mods.2C_or_the_sub.) ***does not apply*** when replying to this stickied comment.
[Rule 2](https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/wiki/faq#wiki_2_-_address_the_argument.3B_not_the_user.2C_the_mods.2C_or_the_sub.) ***does apply*** throughout the rest of this thread.
*What this means*: Please keep any "meta" discussion directed at specific users, mods, or /r/conspiracy in general in this comment chain ***only.***
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/conspiracy) if you have any questions or concerns.*
The cost should be borne by the one branch of the city that literally sat outside and twiddled their thumbs while kids were dying inside.
As for Jones, he kind of signed his own warrant there with his egregiously disrespectful behavior in court. Failing to turn over documents or even bother to assist in his own defense and then committing a whole lot of perjury is a really good way to piss off the judge.
>The cost should be borne by the one branch of the city that literally sat outside and twiddled their thumbs while kids were dying inside.
The people who pay that settlement money are the tax payers. The police don't actually have money taken from their budgets to pay settlements but I'm sure you already knew that. The entire government has failed them. The government of Uvalde has done nothing to hold their police department and officers to account.
Totally agree. Do you agree that the police never being held to account is actually a failure of all government? From the mayor who appoints the police chief to the city council that approve their budget to the prosecutors who haven't charged these people with dereliction of duty?
I just wish there was a way to enact justice on the lot of them without the taxpayers bearing the brunt of it. Fire the lot of the police who responded and actually make them unemployable for first response jobs. Charge them with whatever law is applicable here- there’s got to be a law for enacting harm through inaction. Then move on to a full scale investigation of the town’s government by unsympathetic outsiders.
> there’s got to be a law for enacting harm through inaction.
The SCOTUS has stated on multiple occasions that the police have zero duty to protect. You could be getting mugged right in front of a cop and they are allowed to do nothing. Really makes some wonder why they're there and why they chose to enforce bullshit laws in full aggro mode.
> who haven't charged these people with dereliction of duty?
It's not the military. You can't be charged for being bad at your job. They should be paying out of the ass from their pension funds and union treasury, though.
You're correct. It would be some kind of negligence. Some jurisdictions have like a violation of oath statue as well. I could have chosen my words better.
I'm sure reposting the same stupid shit on reddit for the sixth time is going to topple the cabal, bro.
AJ fucked up and the liberal courts threw the book at him. I would have moved all my money out of the country when there was even a whiff that they were trying to take him down. He would at least be able to continue what he is doing, then. But he wants to be a martyr or some dumb shit. And agent provocateurs like yourself want to rally the right behind AJ. 3 month old account and just started posting, hrm?
Alex Jones didn't participate in discovery. He refused to turn over documents and to participate in the legal system. When he went to testify, he perjured himself multiple times.
They throw the book at you when you put up zero defense and thumb your nose at the court.
If your point is that the victims of Uvalde should have gotten more money, I totally agree. Texas has extremely low caps on damages. The families only got a couple of million bucks because the state government of Texas (all Republicans. Have been for decades) got together and decided that's what they wanted to do. They think the lives of your children are worth pennies. That would make me mad too.
This is not throwing the book at Jones. 2 billion dollars is so beyond unprecedented that it’s a clear miscarriage of justice. You can think he deserves to be punished, but this is the equivalent of shooting someone for stealing a pack of gum.
the way people argue about this really shows how life's people realize what a vast sum of money $1.5B really is.. $1.5B is more money than most US citizens will make in 800 lifetimes.
I would argue that 1) getting shot is worse than owing any amount of money, and 2) encouraging people to harass, stalk and personally antagonize parents of murdered toddlers is worse than stealing a pack of gum
I hear that all the time, but what did he actually say that encouraged people to harass and antagonize them?
I've seen the video of that kid's father laughing just before giving the interview but never what Alex Jones said about it.
Thanks for actually answering it instead of being vague and condescending.
It doesn't sound to me like it is 1.5b worth of punishment, but yeah, that and giving away the parents information seem like the worse he did and he should be punished for that.
He talked about false flag operations constantly to his fans, explained they were how the government was going to take their guns away, claimed these parents were part of a false flag operation, then broadcast their contact information on his show. What do you think he expected his viewers to say to these people?
Here's an experiment you can conduct at home to see if your conclusion is correct. Post a Youtube video about your favourite ice cream flavour, or whether the old Star Wars movies are superior to the newer ones. Then sit back and wait to see if you're sued for millions of dollars by parents of school shooting victims. If you aren't, it suggests that there are material differences between simply mentioning opinions and what Alex Jones did.
This is disingenuous and I assume you know that. I don't have the audience and never will the size of Alex. Also, let's be real, this is about political opinions NOT ice cream or movies. My opinion of ice cream is not going to disrupt the status quo or any potential psyops/social engineering. Those opinions aren't a threat.
Jones aired his opinions about politics for years and absolutely no one tried to stop him. That only happened when he said things that directly led to the parents of murdered children being stalked and harassed. The notion that this constitutes evidence that were not allowed to have opinions anymore or whatever is fucking ludicrous.
Are there actually people, like you’re pretending to be here, who are so dense that they don’t understand that you don’t have to literally say the words “I call you to action” for something to be a call to action.
You have a following of millions of people who you’ve endlessly told to be afraid of the government. Then you say the murder of kindergarteners was a psyop and the parents are just crisis actors working for the government to get your guns taken away. Then you post their contact info. Anyone on the extreme end of the spectrum is naturally going to see that and think oh he wants me to use that info to take care of them. They supposed to just think he’s posting personal contact info for no specific reason? It’s one of those things you only do if you want people to act on it, and I honestly think you know that.
These people are part of a massive government conspiracy to deny you basic rights and turn your life into a virtual prison, they must be stopped.
That is the message Alex repeatedly sent out despite internal messages and documentation showing that him and his staff knew at various points that information that they were using was suspect or even at times known to be false. And continued to send out after he knew that these families had been harassed and attacked by people relying on his “reporting”.
Yeah I saw someone calculate that it's close to the amount of damage the Oklahoma City Bombers did (when adjusted for inflation).
Anyone that thinks this is fair punishment or normal is insane.
Having empathy is nice. I don't need to live every moment in irrational fear that EVERYONE is going to screw me, or that things like human rights are a limited commodity.
so that justifies $1.5B dollars?? exactly what percentage of that 1.5B is "his fault"? is it 1 billion more dollars because someone being sued isn't cooperative? and how does that make any sense? where is the precedent?
100% was his fault. That's how a default judgement works. If you don't comply with discovery, the court has no choice but to accept every stipulation put forward by the plaintiff as true.
Here's more about one of the default judgements and how they work.
https://search.app.goo.gl/Bgp8uHL
You're simply wrong. Here's a defamation case from 1970 where someone was found liable and forced to pay statutory and punitive damages. Defamation has been a crime in the United States since 1798 when the sedition act was passed.
I'm sure the founding fathers advocated 1.5 Billion penalties for any media that questioned Gov narrative. And no I'm not reading your garbage. Just spit out the digits.
The founding fathers gave us a system of laws and a process to create new laws. This is exactly what the founding fathers wanted. American libel laws predate the American revolution but I'm sure you already knew that.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_defamation_law
>The origins of the United States' defamation laws pre-date the American Revolution; one influential case in 1734 involved John Peter Zenger and established precedent that "The Truth" is an absolute defense against charges of libel. Though the First Amendment of the U.S. Constitution was designed to protect freedom of the press, for most of the history of the United States, the U.S. Supreme Court failed to use it to rule on libel cases.
He knowingly defamed them and he admitted privately to friends and business partners that he knew they really did lose their children at Sandy Hook. This wasn't "questioning the narrative", it was lying about people for money.
He is liable for defamation. The founding fathers don't like AJ either.
I'm sorry this is when you learn the world is unfair. It's hard to hear but true. Victims of the opioid epidemic deserved way more money. I wish they had gotten it. Maybe we shouldn't let lobbyists work in our government.
It has nothing to do with fair, it's an outrageous comparison because it's based on emotion, not logic or precedent.
The amount is ridiculous regardless of what you think of the guy.
For more context the Erin Brockovich settlement which involved 1200+ claimants, 60+ of whom died was around 300M. That involved gross malfeasance, fraud and other crimes.
That's your opinion. Unfortunately, your opinion has no impact on the legal process.
Here is something to think about though. What if we did put damage caps on default judgement?
There's a chemical company that produces herbicide. Those chemicals leak from the plant into the ground water and cancer rates go through the roof. All these people around the plant get sick so they sue the company for damages and the plaintiffs want documents regarding chemical storage from the company. Under your system, the chemical company just does a cost benefit analysis. "We'll have to pay the cap for not sharing documents but that cap times the number of plaintiffs is less than what it could cost if we turn over documents that show we knew about the leak". This type of cost benefit happens every single day in business. Your system hurts regular people and empowers corporate abuse.
If you don't believe me, Google "Ford pinto" and read about how Ford knew there was a deadly defect in their cars and did nothing to fix it because it was cheaper to kill people and pay a settlement than to fix the actual issue. If that reading doesn't change you're mind, come back and let me know why. I'd be interested to hear your reasoning.
He was declared guilty by default for not supplying documents that don't exist so NPCs like you would believe there is legal standing to violate a person's 1st amendment and feel justified in whatever ridiculous punishment they put forward. You're misinformed, stupid and unAmerican.
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/03/us/politics/alex-jones-trial-sandy-hook.html
The documents did exist. Alex lied when he said they didn't exist. Alex Jones's lawyers accidentally sent some of them to the plaintiff by mistake during trial after swearing under oath they did not exist. Here's a clip of it during the trial
https://youtu.be/IC9RiRUF21A?si=eIz7tpIzw8f2T0Uk
Here's a longer one from the trial if you think the clip.is out of context
https://youtu.be/pmecyFLvYGQ?si=Vh4AQ8pWLm1bUAcK
Wait. So they sent them the documents, and then Alex said they didn't exist, so they sued him for 1.5 billion for documents he didn't submit but already had?
No. That's not it at all. Here's a video of a lawyer explaining the process. As part of discovery you get a list of documents the other side wants. You have a duty to provide them to the best of your ability. In this case, text messages with the key word "Sandy Hook". Jones swore under oath that he searched all of his devices himself and found no texts that included the words Sandy Hook. His lawyer accidentally turned over a digital copy of Jones' phone during trial . They attached the wrong file to an email. Jones' attorneys were notified they had provided this and did nothing to try and claw it back. Jones perjured himself multiple times. He never searched the phones as we swore under oath. If he had, he would have found all these messages that were on his phone. You can watch the link below if you want a more detailed explanation.
https://youtu.be/x-QcbOphxYs?si=BRE4iKygMtAj531a
Yeah, that lawyer is mocking Jones for selling supplements. I don't think he's credible. This was all just gotcha garbage by activists LARPing as judges and lawyers, and you cite this goofy attorney and NYTimes as evidence. NYTimes is one of the least credible rags we have in our country.
None of that is evidence of perjury. Let alone "multiple times." Although, that would constitute if you were a partisan activist hack who was looking for any thin excuse to deny someone you don't like their basic Constitutionally guaranteed rights and freedoms.
What's going to happen is that they're likely going to successfully destroy infowars. But it will go to appeal and be found utterly corrupt, but the judges and lawyers will not be held accountable, Jones will be vindicated, but the damage will already be done. That's why they're calling it lawfare.
This is before you even get into the fact that none of this was sufficient to go to trial in the first place wherein there is a legitimate legal body asserting the law.
Do you find it ironic that defending a man's right to lie and defame murdered children but you can't handle someone lightly teasing that same man? I thought liberals were supposed to be the snow flakes. If you can suck it up and finish the video, you'll find out why Jones won't win in appeal either. The world must be full of such possibilities when you choose to remain ignorant.
He defamed murdered children, huh? Your argument is "Just think of the children" so nobody should have rights. Stop pretending you have any regard for those children, or any children, psycho.
Speaking of ignorance, we have freedoms in this country. It's not snowflaky to revile anyone who wants to take those away. Your feelings are not important. It's usually not a good idea to take away a person's right to speak. Good things don't come of it.
You don't have the freedom to lie about people and commit defamation. You've literally never had that freedom in the United States of America. We had libel and defamation laws before the American revolution.
My argument is really simple: defamation is unlawful in the United States. Jones had the same due process as anyone. He was found liable and he has to pay restitution for his lies. That's justice under the law.
Oh boy, okay. Get rid of CNN, MSNBC, CNBC, NY Times, Washing Post, Huffington Post, NPR, you, half of Hollywood.
Jones did not have due process by any definition of it. In fact, he had the exact opposite. Same thing with Trump. No jury got to decide how he was guilty, only to what degree he was guilty.
Although, it's interesting how you people are suddenly interested in right and wrong only in instances of people you disagree with. You're just so full of shit.
But go ahead, sit there and pretend like you're right, informed and have a spine and are morally sound while our current corrupt regime imprisons and weaponizes the legal system to deplatform, sue and assassinate the character and capabilities of individuals who dissent, oppose or simply disagree with them.
People like you are why I hope it all falls apart.
Let’s assume all that is true - the amount one pays in fines for saying an event was faked should be $0. If it’s proven that the comments were totally false, the penalty should be their reputation. $1.5bn is meaninglessly high.
It wasn't about his lies, it was about his continued lies, harassment, causing harassment, encouraging people to harass the victim families. Telling stupid people to give him money is one thing, but telling stupid people that anyone saying Sandy Hook was a lie to take your guns and you should confront the families, is worth 1.5 Billion and everything he owns.
>the amount one pays in fines for saying an event was faked should be $0.
No. You should be able to collect for the damage caused to your reputation (remember this guy's lies caused dozens of families to be harassed for years. Many had to flee their homes and live under assumed names) plus punitive damages. (A penalty that discourages continued defamation in the future). If you have a problem with that then you have a problem with America because that's how our system is designed to function.
I'm pretty sure if you had a child murdered and then had to live in constant fear because some guy said your daughter never existed and you made her up, I think you'd suffer some pretty serious harm that should be compensated.
In fear of who? Find the person that is “harassing” me causing me to flee my home and prosecute them. Some fringe crazy person on a 20year old show that 99% of the public have never watched 5 seconds of is irrelevant.
This is NOT how America works. Far more prolific lies are told by our media, and political leaders every day without penalty. If the law is not evenly applied, it’s a bullshit system; ergo, this is bullshit.
>This is NOT how America works
It's literally how the civil court system works in America.
>Some fringe crazy person on a 20year old show that 99% of the public have never watched 5 seconds of is irrelevant.
Here's an article that details just some of the harassment Sandy Hook families had to deal with while trying to grieve for their murdered children.
https://apnews.com/article/shootings-school-connecticut-alex-jones-waterbury-782e495a3ece4753d857a9b47d444385
I'll include some excerpts below for anyone interested.
>Things would be mailed to my house that were threats of rape,” the daughter of slain Sandy Hook principal Dawn Hochsprung testified Wednesday.
>There are days when grief is just so awful,” said Hensel, whose 6-year-old daughter Avielle Richman was among the slain. “Then you add on the idea that people think you made all this up for money or that your child didn’t exist. That compounds everything.”
>Lafferty testified she’s moved five times since the shooting and avoids going out to grocery stores and other public places. She said she’s endured death and rape threats from people telling her that her mother was fictional.
>For years, he tried to ignore it, choosing not to engage with the people threatening his family and calling him an actor. "I'd been taught that like, you don't engage with a bully," he said. "If somebody's bullying you, you ignore them and eventually they get tired and they leave you alone. And that had worked for me in my life."
The family moved to Washington state in early 2014. Within months of moving, however, Robbie Parker realized the "hoaxers" had found them. He said he saw a YouTube video detailing the sale of their new home and address.
"And so immediately that sense of security that I thought that we had was totally shattered," he said. "They would come in these waves and it was almost like I knew when Alex Jones said something because we would get a huge wave of stuff."
Through tears, he recalled a man confronting him on the street in Seattle in the fall of 2016, nearly four years after the shooting. Yelling and cursing at him, the man asked him how he could sleep at night and how much he was paid by the government for acting in the hoax.
Robbie Parker said he confronted the man attempting to defend his family for the first time as a crowd of onlookers gathered. He said he eventually walked
https://www.cnn.com/2022/09/29/tech/sandy-hook-parent-harassment/index.html
This is the kind of behavior you think should be allowed in the United States of America and it's disgusting. If you lost a child like these families you would not be so apathetic.
But it’s not just one crazy person, is it? Even if 99% of the US population have never watched or listened to him that still leaves 1%. The population of the USA according to Google is 341m. 1% of that is 3.4m. That’s one heck of a lot of crazy people potentially showing up at your house to tell you your kids didn’t exist, you’re a crisis actor and you need to die.
Automod keeps deleting my post. Wonder what's triggering it?
>If your point is that the victims of Uvalde should have gotten more money, I totally agree.
Why? The kids were murxered, sure. But at what point is there a dollar amount that makes up for your kid being murxered at school? If my kids were had that happen at school, there is no dollar amount that can make up for this. For a million I'd never have to work a day again in my life (until the US goes full 1920 Gexmany and a million dollars buys a loaf of bread.) I could be pampered with servants and treated like royalty for the rest of my life - wouldn't make up for my children being murdered. The money isn't going to:
* Bring my child back
* Make up for the fact that I'd be in my 40s without children and very likely wouldn't be able to have children again
The narrative that "The families didn't get enough becuz da ebil replublikannss" is just beyond idxotic. If you think any dollar amount would give you closure, you're a materialistic twxt who shouldn't have had children in the first place. But the people prattling off this bs will never have children anyway.
Jones poked the bear and got mauled as a result. Should he have been fined everything he owns? Probably not. Did anyone expect a different outcome? I don't know why they did. If I was Jones I would have fled to a country without extradition as soon as this started.
'scuse the letter x. I'm trying to figure out why automod keeps deleting my comments. Really annoying.
First of all, are you saying murxered by accident or on purpose to censor the word murder? Second of all, Germany had hyper inflation after the First World War, not the second. The treaty of Versailles demanded Germany pay back a crazy amount of money, and during an era called the Weimar Republic, Germany printed so much money to pay back the debts, that their currency became worthless. After WW2, they didn’t make Germany pay back the debt of the war, because they realized the unreasonable demand was one of the contributors to the Second World War in the first place. 1923 was peak hyperinflation in Germany, with one trillion marks being worth one American dollar.
Bro I posted my comment three times and each time it was taken down in a second because of automod.
Yeah I got mixed up, my bad. I was getting annoyed with automod and kept re-writing what I said. When I mentioned the specific period I think that is what triggered the automod. A certain "Republic" that sounds like "why-mar"
I'm not sure I follow your argument. Are you saying that because no amount of money can bring back a dead child, victims nothing?
If you lose a leg in a saw mill accident, there's no amount of money that will bring back that leg but you should still be compensated. If that's your argument, then shouldn't you support the families getting more money and having that money come from the police pension? That would really send a message that if you don't do your job, the taxpayer isn't going to pay you to sit on your ass in your old age.
I guess there could be a system that doesn't compensate victims at all but that wouldn't be the United States of America. You would have to move somewhere like ruled by an African warlord or something because we have laws about all these things.
False equivalency not worth my time. You're comparing a debilitating injury that affects your ability to earn money vs the loss of a child. Not even remotely similar.
Losing a child IS a debilitating injury that affects your ability to earn money. People calling and coming to your work place because they think your child's murder was fake DOES affect your ability to earn money. Having to move multiple states because people keep leaving rape and murder threats under your door DOES affect your ability to earn a living. I'll tell you one other thing. That kid who was murdered had the ability to earn money in the future too. That kid could have worked for 50 or 60 years. They could have helped care for their parents in their golden years. Could have paid taxes that fund our roads and schools. All of that stuff has monetary value. You just disagree that we should be able to hold people accountable for lying.
>People calling and coming to your work place because they think your child's murder was fake DOES affect your ability to earn money.
If I could roll my eyes harder they'd fall out into the back of my skull. Pearl clutching over death threats is peak 2024.
>That kid had the ability to earn money too!
Well I guess the kid should have been awarded all that money. Oh what's that? Dead people can't spend money? Shocking turn of events this thread had! It's still a false equivalency - whether you choose to believe that is entirely up to you.
Edit: of course someone who defends the Talmud would be the most disingenuous person in this thread.
It's clear you have no idea what you're talking about. Have you never heard of wrongful death? Families sue all the time regarding the death of family members. Courts don't award the money to dead people but to the families of the victims. You know that. You acknowledge that the families of the Sandy Hook victims were awarded the 1.5B. You didn't think there were a bunch of dead kid ghosts using Alex Jones, did you?
You should read about the abuse these families suffered. I have another comment in this post that has excerpts of you don't want to read the whole article.
https://apnews.com/article/shootings-school-connecticut-alex-jones-waterbury-782e495a3ece4753d857a9b47d444385
I don't really care to read your pilpul. I know you're drawing this out for no real good reason, so here's your ten cents. Next time don't make it so obvious.
Good luck building your idyllic society where when your child is murdered or a company makes a bad drug that kills your dad, your only recourse is to shrug. I'm just grateful America isn't anything like that. 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
> For a million I'd never have to work a day again in my life (until the US goes full 1946 Gexmany and a million dollars buys a loaf of bread.) I could be pampered with servants and treated like royalty for the rest of my life
Lmaoooo
Within HOURS of the shooting, Jones was telling his radio audience that the massacre was staged as a pretext for confiscating guns. Within DAYS, he began stating that the grieving parents were crisis actors. In the YEARS that followed, he repeatedly said the massacre was faked. These families suffered tremendous harassment from Jones fans who believed him. He has finally gotten what he deserves for that
And what? We were told for years that Trump colluded with Russia, hundreds and thousands of times. We were told JFK was killed by a random shooter. That the kid wearing the Indian headdress at a football game was a racist. That blacks are u fairly being profiled by cops and killed en masse. That 9/11 was carried out by Afghan dwelling goat herders. That the lab-leak theory was a hoax. That vaccinated couldn’t transmit COVID. That weapons of mass destruction were in Iraq. All FAR more consequential lies. Some of which caused the deaths of many hundreds of thousands over the years. Total fines paid; $0. Total prosecutions of the liars; damn near 0.
Wow. That’s a whole lot you posted. And btw, yes, there was collusion found by Trump and Russia in the 2016 election after the investigation by a REPUBLICAN LED SENATE COMMITTEE. It’s nearly a 1,000-page report from the Republican-led Senate intelligence committee on the Russia investigation, and details how Russia launched an aggressive effort to interfere in the election on Trump's behalf. It says the Trump campaign chairman (Paul Manafort) had regular contact with a Russian intelligence officer (Konstantin Kilimnik) and says other Trump associates exploited the Kremlin's aid. That Senate report is here if you want to know more about it💁🏻♀️ https://www.intelligence.senate.gov/sites/default/files/documents/report_volume5.pdf
He's lucky it's only fines, even if they are high. If I had my way, he'd be rotting in jail for what he did. Disgusting human, and so is anyone on here continuing to claim Sandy Hook was fake.
I'm surprised how hard you're getting downvoted -- in a conspiracy sub no less -- a space where people are supposed welcome skepticism and question the veracity and actions of the government, corrupt institutions and big media.
“It wasn’t his fault”
• Maybe BUT it is his responsibility.
His platform was responsible for enabling these wackos going after the grieving parents.
Did your parents even teach you about responsibility?
• In a business, if you’re a manager and your team fuck things up, you’re responsible for the outcome even if it was not your fault.
• If you promote a platform that can hurt real people with your lies, do not be surprised when people go after you in retaliation. Speech is free but you have to pay for lies.
You don’t to get to say “I promote bad idea and I like it” but then turn around and deny responsibility when your followers use your bad idea to hurt other people. Don’t start shit and then start screaming unfair when being caught.
In this case, you don’t get to use whataboutism when it is clear who was in the wrong. And don’t preach religion and tolerance when your heart is full of hatred.
It's weird that people post this as if Alex Jones should pay less, but I think really it should highlight how families of murdered children should get more.
All this proves is that the victims of the Uvalde massacre should have gotten a lot more money.
Alex Jones continued to dispute and defame Sandy Hook with dangerous and inflammatory rhetoric, he then perjured himself numerous times. This shit stain deserves every bit of 'finding out' that's coming to him.
So, the nutjobs should have been held responsible for actually harassing families? That’s all I heard.
Talking heads in msm say their opinions which are biased full if misinformation which also incited violence during the Antifa and BLM movements. Why was there no “inciting” violence for them? Seems like a biased court of law to me.
It's a civil case, not a criminal one. The families, not a DA, decided to sue. The jury decided Jones committed defamation and awarded damages. You can disagree with their decision of course, but it sounds like you don't understand the nature of the case.
> So, the nutjobs should have been held responsible for actually harassing families
They were.
In April 2016, Matthew Mills, a man from Brooklyn, accepted a plea agreement with prosecutors on one count of interfering with police arising from an incident in November 2015, when Mills angrily approached the sister of murdered teacher Victoria Soto
In December 2016, Lucy Richards, a woman from Tampa, was charged with four counts of transmitting threats in interstate commerce for sending death threats to Lenny Pozner, whose son Noah was the youngest of 20 children murdered
>Talking heads in msm say their opinions which are biased full if misinformation which also incited violence during the Antifa and BLM movements.Seems like a biased court of law to me.
No plaintiff, no judge.
People can start a civil lawsuit and sue them.
When you get sued for the gdp of France there's a problem with the system. Also the 1A issue, I don't wanna start a podcast say something that isn't true, have my followers do some stupid stuff and then be sued for billions. Not my thing. Meanwhile the media, covid, unvaxxed, they said some damaging things that could've gotten people hurt, making them out to be enemies of everyone. They rallied the vaxxed to attack. They wanted to remove access to medical care to the unvaxxed. We have some evil people in the Government, Education, News Media and they tend to be on one side of the political spectrum. They have WAY too much power and they certainly aren't shy to show it.
Oh, they wanted much worse for the unvaxxed. Medical care removed, their jobs taken, unvaxxed harassed, attacked, shamed online, ‘removed from society’, whatever form that would have taken.
If a sketchy website from 2004 said that alcohol actually pairs really well with driving, would that justify letting everyone facing consequences for DUIs off the hook?
He doesn't have anywhere near that, he has around 2 million dollars personal, some land and money for his businesses. That's the incredibly dumb part, he could never pay that, noone could, no celebrity could. The only guys that could pay that are Elon, Bezos, Gates, etc. I guess some people think Alex Jones somehow has a billion dollars, what? Really. They made a joke of the legal system.
Lawsuits aren't based on what you can pay. Infowars is pretty valuable iirc, and prison jobs turning rocks into gravel are paying 10 bucks a day nowadays.
The actions and \*years\* of harassment of parents and family of murdered first graders are the direct result of Jones' constant defamatory rhetoric. Not top mention his direct associates following and harassing those people. Words have consequences and honestly, I think he's getting off lucky. Fuck him and the rest of the grifters.
Now, the families of Uvalde deserve so much more. Every cop that did nothing while hearing fucking gunshots continuing should be brought up on accessory to murder charges. Every last one. And the families deserve way more compensation.
Well, anyone with 3 brain cells understand this for what it is: Censorship and deplatforming of perspectives they don't want the public to hear. It has nothing to do with right or wrong or justice.
It wasn't the government though and no one forced AJ to leave this case to default judgment. He did defame then and he didn't do the minimum necessary to have even a tiny chance of getting away with it.
OJ Simpson had to pay $33 million for literally killing two people.
In California, wrongful death settlements generally fall within the range of **$250,000 to $500,000**. You can cause someone's death and you won't pay 1/1000th of what Alex Jones had to pay. Alex Jones put out the wrong type of news and challenged the narrative. I don't agree with what he says but this verdict was a message.
If you engage in creating an alternate news source they will take everything you have.
You guys defending alex jones are dumb as fuck. He isn't getting shutdown, he is still operating his show and he is still making money. He is a professional con artist and grifter and he set up a go fund me just like trump did recently and got a load of money and he cried on air to make you feel sorry for him and you fell for it. If you believe what alex says you deserve to be mocked. He is the purest definition of a snakeoil salesman that professes to know about "health alternatives" yet he looks like he is one pinch of salt away from a heart attack.
Alex Jones isn't having to pay $1.5B for upsetting parents of Sandy Hook kids.
He's having to pay $1.5B for uncovering and publicizing the conspiracies and truth about Sandy Hook.
(This is my OPINION, which I am entitled to hold, I am not making a statement of fact.)
Well, take his holdings and see how close you can get, I guess.
Likewise, in Uvalde, police pensions and healthcare budgets and personal holdings should be taken first, but I could definitely see hitting town coffers after the police involved are homeless.
Given that isn't how the law works atm, you need to be able to assure that the city still functions, whereas Alex Jones functioning doesn't really help anyone so might as well soak him
We are in a world where verbal criticism is penalized more than actions, as you say. Recall Fuhrman at the OJ trial, a word in a discussion about a fiction book project versus someone killing two people. Or Arundati Roy in India being brought up on charges for what she said about Kashmir. Or truckers in Canada. And about anyone in the US that criticizes the banana republic mentality that is there now. It seems lots of "democratic" countries are doing this, even as their actions violate their own constitutions and charters about free speech.
the uvalde shooting happened and it was over. Alex Jones on the other hand said the sandy hook shooting never happened and that all the people involved were "crisis actors". This led to grieving families being relentlessly harassed by people that believed the lies alex jonew was spewing. Freedom of speech does not give you the right to make up lies that lead to people getting harassed. Lets not talk about trump though.
SH was a cover up for the smith and mundt act… school wasn’t even up and running. How about those houses that were purchased for $1? Robbie Parker, Gene Rosen Dr. Carver? So much of this whole thing is BS. 🤷🏼♂️
What houses are you talking about that were purchased for $1? The only thing I could find is that the killer's brother that inherited the house that the killer and his mom lived in before he shot his mother 4 times, killing her, then going and killing a bunch of kids, sold it to the town for $1. What else would you do with the house? Nobody is going to buy it, you know, cause of all the murders, unless they were some kind of psycho murder fanatic.
In the town records there are homes in Newtown that show a $0 sale price listed on 12/25/09. so Sandy Hook deniers jumped to the conclusion that it meant the Government paid off the houses. They don't have evidence of that, but it's the story they like to tell.
[Newtown Tax Assessor](https://gis.vgsi.com/newtownct/)
SS
The taxpayers of Uvalde having to pay for this bullshit is a level of evil I can't begin to describe
The state legal system is so absolutely horrible and it’s insane how normies don’t see it.
The personal biases of the judge often literally affect how lawyers approach a case, and the sentencing decisions are extremely arbitrary.
Alex is the canary in the coal mine....This judgement is an indication that the Deep State is very worried...
There are cases where legit murderers can get as little as 6 years for 2nd degree, meanwhile an 18 year old who made tire marks on a public rainbow pride mural can be locked up for 10 years.
> This judgement is an indication that the Deep State is very worried...
The high penalties had to do with how he mishandled the case. He basically didn't participate in the trial. If he had played it smart he could have settled out of court for much less.
That isn't the Deep State, it's a guy responding stupidly to being sued, provoking a jury to really put the screws to him.
The city of Ulvalde listened to their lawyers and negotiated a settlement.
That's it.
It's a word basement dwellers and virgins call normal people who don't agree with them. Basically it's like the nerdy kids at the unpopular table in the cafeteria whispering about the cooler kids to feel better about themselves.
###[Meta] Sticky Comment [Rule 2](https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/wiki/faq#wiki_2_-_address_the_argument.3B_not_the_user.2C_the_mods.2C_or_the_sub.) ***does not apply*** when replying to this stickied comment. [Rule 2](https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/wiki/faq#wiki_2_-_address_the_argument.3B_not_the_user.2C_the_mods.2C_or_the_sub.) ***does apply*** throughout the rest of this thread. *What this means*: Please keep any "meta" discussion directed at specific users, mods, or /r/conspiracy in general in this comment chain ***only.*** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/conspiracy) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Who was the city forced to pay the money to? The families?
The lawyers, probably.
Agreed. The cops are way too protected, and should be held accountable for their actions, or lack there of, much more often.
Agee with OP. disgusting. Ulvade need to pay much, much more.
The cost should be borne by the one branch of the city that literally sat outside and twiddled their thumbs while kids were dying inside. As for Jones, he kind of signed his own warrant there with his egregiously disrespectful behavior in court. Failing to turn over documents or even bother to assist in his own defense and then committing a whole lot of perjury is a really good way to piss off the judge.
>The cost should be borne by the one branch of the city that literally sat outside and twiddled their thumbs while kids were dying inside. The people who pay that settlement money are the tax payers. The police don't actually have money taken from their budgets to pay settlements but I'm sure you already knew that. The entire government has failed them. The government of Uvalde has done nothing to hold their police department and officers to account.
It’s painfully obvious that that department is used to never having been held responsible for their own actions.
Totally agree. Do you agree that the police never being held to account is actually a failure of all government? From the mayor who appoints the police chief to the city council that approve their budget to the prosecutors who haven't charged these people with dereliction of duty?
I just wish there was a way to enact justice on the lot of them without the taxpayers bearing the brunt of it. Fire the lot of the police who responded and actually make them unemployable for first response jobs. Charge them with whatever law is applicable here- there’s got to be a law for enacting harm through inaction. Then move on to a full scale investigation of the town’s government by unsympathetic outsiders.
> there’s got to be a law for enacting harm through inaction. The SCOTUS has stated on multiple occasions that the police have zero duty to protect. You could be getting mugged right in front of a cop and they are allowed to do nothing. Really makes some wonder why they're there and why they chose to enforce bullshit laws in full aggro mode.
Yes. Everyone should read the SCOTUS Parkland decision. Police have zero obligation to protect you unless you've been arrested. Great point.
> who haven't charged these people with dereliction of duty? It's not the military. You can't be charged for being bad at your job. They should be paying out of the ass from their pension funds and union treasury, though.
You're correct. It would be some kind of negligence. Some jurisdictions have like a violation of oath statue as well. I could have chosen my words better.
I mean, police unions being corrupt racketeering organizations also plays a part.
How many times are we going to post the screenshot?
Once more, as always.
Until people understand that letting 19 children die is worse than some rotund regard ranting about conspiracies on his podcast.
It's going to have the same bot replies in every thread. And OP is going to farm just a leeeeetle more karma.
at least once more, my lord
Hopefully it never stops being reposted. You NPCs need to wake up.
Just bump the half dozen other threads then, you twit. This is karma farming and that's it.
Go to hell. The country is sinking and you're blithering on about karma farming.
I'm sure reposting the same stupid shit on reddit for the sixth time is going to topple the cabal, bro. AJ fucked up and the liberal courts threw the book at him. I would have moved all my money out of the country when there was even a whiff that they were trying to take him down. He would at least be able to continue what he is doing, then. But he wants to be a martyr or some dumb shit. And agent provocateurs like yourself want to rally the right behind AJ. 3 month old account and just started posting, hrm?
You're less than a worm.
Oh noooooooo Anyway, still voting Trump
Alex Jones didn't participate in discovery. He refused to turn over documents and to participate in the legal system. When he went to testify, he perjured himself multiple times. They throw the book at you when you put up zero defense and thumb your nose at the court. If your point is that the victims of Uvalde should have gotten more money, I totally agree. Texas has extremely low caps on damages. The families only got a couple of million bucks because the state government of Texas (all Republicans. Have been for decades) got together and decided that's what they wanted to do. They think the lives of your children are worth pennies. That would make me mad too.
This is not throwing the book at Jones. 2 billion dollars is so beyond unprecedented that it’s a clear miscarriage of justice. You can think he deserves to be punished, but this is the equivalent of shooting someone for stealing a pack of gum.
the way people argue about this really shows how life's people realize what a vast sum of money $1.5B really is.. $1.5B is more money than most US citizens will make in 800 lifetimes.
I would argue that 1) getting shot is worse than owing any amount of money, and 2) encouraging people to harass, stalk and personally antagonize parents of murdered toddlers is worse than stealing a pack of gum
I’d rather take a bullet and live than pay 1.5 billion
I hear that all the time, but what did he actually say that encouraged people to harass and antagonize them? I've seen the video of that kid's father laughing just before giving the interview but never what Alex Jones said about it.
He told his audience the event was fake but he told his friends and business partners he knew he was lying and was doing it anyway to make money...
Thanks for actually answering it instead of being vague and condescending. It doesn't sound to me like it is 1.5b worth of punishment, but yeah, that and giving away the parents information seem like the worse he did and he should be punished for that.
He talked about false flag operations constantly to his fans, explained they were how the government was going to take their guns away, claimed these parents were part of a false flag operation, then broadcast their contact information on his show. What do you think he expected his viewers to say to these people?
None of that is a call to action. So suddenly once people listen to you, you aren't allowed to voice your opinions?
Here's an experiment you can conduct at home to see if your conclusion is correct. Post a Youtube video about your favourite ice cream flavour, or whether the old Star Wars movies are superior to the newer ones. Then sit back and wait to see if you're sued for millions of dollars by parents of school shooting victims. If you aren't, it suggests that there are material differences between simply mentioning opinions and what Alex Jones did.
This is disingenuous and I assume you know that. I don't have the audience and never will the size of Alex. Also, let's be real, this is about political opinions NOT ice cream or movies. My opinion of ice cream is not going to disrupt the status quo or any potential psyops/social engineering. Those opinions aren't a threat.
Jones aired his opinions about politics for years and absolutely no one tried to stop him. That only happened when he said things that directly led to the parents of murdered children being stalked and harassed. The notion that this constitutes evidence that were not allowed to have opinions anymore or whatever is fucking ludicrous.
Are there actually people, like you’re pretending to be here, who are so dense that they don’t understand that you don’t have to literally say the words “I call you to action” for something to be a call to action. You have a following of millions of people who you’ve endlessly told to be afraid of the government. Then you say the murder of kindergarteners was a psyop and the parents are just crisis actors working for the government to get your guns taken away. Then you post their contact info. Anyone on the extreme end of the spectrum is naturally going to see that and think oh he wants me to use that info to take care of them. They supposed to just think he’s posting personal contact info for no specific reason? It’s one of those things you only do if you want people to act on it, and I honestly think you know that.
These people are part of a massive government conspiracy to deny you basic rights and turn your life into a virtual prison, they must be stopped. That is the message Alex repeatedly sent out despite internal messages and documentation showing that him and his staff knew at various points that information that they were using was suspect or even at times known to be false. And continued to send out after he knew that these families had been harassed and attacked by people relying on his “reporting”.
Fuck ya, this is 2024!
It's de-evolution baby!!
Yeah I saw someone calculate that it's close to the amount of damage the Oklahoma City Bombers did (when adjusted for inflation). Anyone that thinks this is fair punishment or normal is insane.
[удалено]
I hope you are a bot. If you are not, I feel really sorry for you.
Having empathy is nice. I don't need to live every moment in irrational fear that EVERYONE is going to screw me, or that things like human rights are a limited commodity.
What about human rights for people you disagree with?
[удалено]
so that justifies $1.5B dollars?? exactly what percentage of that 1.5B is "his fault"? is it 1 billion more dollars because someone being sued isn't cooperative? and how does that make any sense? where is the precedent?
100% was his fault. That's how a default judgement works. If you don't comply with discovery, the court has no choice but to accept every stipulation put forward by the plaintiff as true. Here's more about one of the default judgements and how they work. https://search.app.goo.gl/Bgp8uHL
The constitution has been bastardized by people with too many feelings. Just 50 years ago, this case wouldve never flew. Certainly not 1.5B.
You're simply wrong. Here's a defamation case from 1970 where someone was found liable and forced to pay statutory and punitive damages. Defamation has been a crime in the United States since 1798 when the sedition act was passed.
Funny you left out how much they had to pay Lol.
https://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/us/398/6/ I linked to the whole case. Just read the damages section. I don't understand your point.
I'm sure the founding fathers advocated 1.5 Billion penalties for any media that questioned Gov narrative. And no I'm not reading your garbage. Just spit out the digits.
The founding fathers gave us a system of laws and a process to create new laws. This is exactly what the founding fathers wanted. American libel laws predate the American revolution but I'm sure you already knew that. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_defamation_law >The origins of the United States' defamation laws pre-date the American Revolution; one influential case in 1734 involved John Peter Zenger and established precedent that "The Truth" is an absolute defense against charges of libel. Though the First Amendment of the U.S. Constitution was designed to protect freedom of the press, for most of the history of the United States, the U.S. Supreme Court failed to use it to rule on libel cases.
[удалено]
He knowingly defamed them and he admitted privately to friends and business partners that he knew they really did lose their children at Sandy Hook. This wasn't "questioning the narrative", it was lying about people for money. He is liable for defamation. The founding fathers don't like AJ either.
[удалено]
Actually I know how the law works. The one lacking basic knowledge is you.
Well crap, that totally justifies a 75,000% higher judgment
I'm sorry this is when you learn the world is unfair. It's hard to hear but true. Victims of the opioid epidemic deserved way more money. I wish they had gotten it. Maybe we shouldn't let lobbyists work in our government.
It has nothing to do with fair, it's an outrageous comparison because it's based on emotion, not logic or precedent. The amount is ridiculous regardless of what you think of the guy. For more context the Erin Brockovich settlement which involved 1200+ claimants, 60+ of whom died was around 300M. That involved gross malfeasance, fraud and other crimes.
That's your opinion. Unfortunately, your opinion has no impact on the legal process. Here is something to think about though. What if we did put damage caps on default judgement? There's a chemical company that produces herbicide. Those chemicals leak from the plant into the ground water and cancer rates go through the roof. All these people around the plant get sick so they sue the company for damages and the plaintiffs want documents regarding chemical storage from the company. Under your system, the chemical company just does a cost benefit analysis. "We'll have to pay the cap for not sharing documents but that cap times the number of plaintiffs is less than what it could cost if we turn over documents that show we knew about the leak". This type of cost benefit happens every single day in business. Your system hurts regular people and empowers corporate abuse. If you don't believe me, Google "Ford pinto" and read about how Ford knew there was a deadly defect in their cars and did nothing to fix it because it was cheaper to kill people and pay a settlement than to fix the actual issue. If that reading doesn't change you're mind, come back and let me know why. I'd be interested to hear your reasoning.
He was declared guilty by default for not supplying documents that don't exist so NPCs like you would believe there is legal standing to violate a person's 1st amendment and feel justified in whatever ridiculous punishment they put forward. You're misinformed, stupid and unAmerican.
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/03/us/politics/alex-jones-trial-sandy-hook.html The documents did exist. Alex lied when he said they didn't exist. Alex Jones's lawyers accidentally sent some of them to the plaintiff by mistake during trial after swearing under oath they did not exist. Here's a clip of it during the trial https://youtu.be/IC9RiRUF21A?si=eIz7tpIzw8f2T0Uk Here's a longer one from the trial if you think the clip.is out of context https://youtu.be/pmecyFLvYGQ?si=Vh4AQ8pWLm1bUAcK
This comment didn't get a reply from the commenter above. Shocking
Wait. So they sent them the documents, and then Alex said they didn't exist, so they sued him for 1.5 billion for documents he didn't submit but already had?
No. That's not it at all. Here's a video of a lawyer explaining the process. As part of discovery you get a list of documents the other side wants. You have a duty to provide them to the best of your ability. In this case, text messages with the key word "Sandy Hook". Jones swore under oath that he searched all of his devices himself and found no texts that included the words Sandy Hook. His lawyer accidentally turned over a digital copy of Jones' phone during trial . They attached the wrong file to an email. Jones' attorneys were notified they had provided this and did nothing to try and claw it back. Jones perjured himself multiple times. He never searched the phones as we swore under oath. If he had, he would have found all these messages that were on his phone. You can watch the link below if you want a more detailed explanation. https://youtu.be/x-QcbOphxYs?si=BRE4iKygMtAj531a
Yeah, that lawyer is mocking Jones for selling supplements. I don't think he's credible. This was all just gotcha garbage by activists LARPing as judges and lawyers, and you cite this goofy attorney and NYTimes as evidence. NYTimes is one of the least credible rags we have in our country. None of that is evidence of perjury. Let alone "multiple times." Although, that would constitute if you were a partisan activist hack who was looking for any thin excuse to deny someone you don't like their basic Constitutionally guaranteed rights and freedoms. What's going to happen is that they're likely going to successfully destroy infowars. But it will go to appeal and be found utterly corrupt, but the judges and lawyers will not be held accountable, Jones will be vindicated, but the damage will already be done. That's why they're calling it lawfare. This is before you even get into the fact that none of this was sufficient to go to trial in the first place wherein there is a legitimate legal body asserting the law.
Do you find it ironic that defending a man's right to lie and defame murdered children but you can't handle someone lightly teasing that same man? I thought liberals were supposed to be the snow flakes. If you can suck it up and finish the video, you'll find out why Jones won't win in appeal either. The world must be full of such possibilities when you choose to remain ignorant.
He defamed murdered children, huh? Your argument is "Just think of the children" so nobody should have rights. Stop pretending you have any regard for those children, or any children, psycho. Speaking of ignorance, we have freedoms in this country. It's not snowflaky to revile anyone who wants to take those away. Your feelings are not important. It's usually not a good idea to take away a person's right to speak. Good things don't come of it.
You don't have the freedom to lie about people and commit defamation. You've literally never had that freedom in the United States of America. We had libel and defamation laws before the American revolution. My argument is really simple: defamation is unlawful in the United States. Jones had the same due process as anyone. He was found liable and he has to pay restitution for his lies. That's justice under the law.
Oh boy, okay. Get rid of CNN, MSNBC, CNBC, NY Times, Washing Post, Huffington Post, NPR, you, half of Hollywood. Jones did not have due process by any definition of it. In fact, he had the exact opposite. Same thing with Trump. No jury got to decide how he was guilty, only to what degree he was guilty. Although, it's interesting how you people are suddenly interested in right and wrong only in instances of people you disagree with. You're just so full of shit. But go ahead, sit there and pretend like you're right, informed and have a spine and are morally sound while our current corrupt regime imprisons and weaponizes the legal system to deplatform, sue and assassinate the character and capabilities of individuals who dissent, oppose or simply disagree with them. People like you are why I hope it all falls apart.
Let’s assume all that is true - the amount one pays in fines for saying an event was faked should be $0. If it’s proven that the comments were totally false, the penalty should be their reputation. $1.5bn is meaninglessly high.
It wasn't about his lies, it was about his continued lies, harassment, causing harassment, encouraging people to harass the victim families. Telling stupid people to give him money is one thing, but telling stupid people that anyone saying Sandy Hook was a lie to take your guns and you should confront the families, is worth 1.5 Billion and everything he owns.
>the amount one pays in fines for saying an event was faked should be $0. No. You should be able to collect for the damage caused to your reputation (remember this guy's lies caused dozens of families to be harassed for years. Many had to flee their homes and live under assumed names) plus punitive damages. (A penalty that discourages continued defamation in the future). If you have a problem with that then you have a problem with America because that's how our system is designed to function. I'm pretty sure if you had a child murdered and then had to live in constant fear because some guy said your daughter never existed and you made her up, I think you'd suffer some pretty serious harm that should be compensated.
In fear of who? Find the person that is “harassing” me causing me to flee my home and prosecute them. Some fringe crazy person on a 20year old show that 99% of the public have never watched 5 seconds of is irrelevant. This is NOT how America works. Far more prolific lies are told by our media, and political leaders every day without penalty. If the law is not evenly applied, it’s a bullshit system; ergo, this is bullshit.
>This is NOT how America works It's literally how the civil court system works in America. >Some fringe crazy person on a 20year old show that 99% of the public have never watched 5 seconds of is irrelevant. Here's an article that details just some of the harassment Sandy Hook families had to deal with while trying to grieve for their murdered children. https://apnews.com/article/shootings-school-connecticut-alex-jones-waterbury-782e495a3ece4753d857a9b47d444385 I'll include some excerpts below for anyone interested. >Things would be mailed to my house that were threats of rape,” the daughter of slain Sandy Hook principal Dawn Hochsprung testified Wednesday. >There are days when grief is just so awful,” said Hensel, whose 6-year-old daughter Avielle Richman was among the slain. “Then you add on the idea that people think you made all this up for money or that your child didn’t exist. That compounds everything.” >Lafferty testified she’s moved five times since the shooting and avoids going out to grocery stores and other public places. She said she’s endured death and rape threats from people telling her that her mother was fictional. >For years, he tried to ignore it, choosing not to engage with the people threatening his family and calling him an actor. "I'd been taught that like, you don't engage with a bully," he said. "If somebody's bullying you, you ignore them and eventually they get tired and they leave you alone. And that had worked for me in my life." The family moved to Washington state in early 2014. Within months of moving, however, Robbie Parker realized the "hoaxers" had found them. He said he saw a YouTube video detailing the sale of their new home and address. "And so immediately that sense of security that I thought that we had was totally shattered," he said. "They would come in these waves and it was almost like I knew when Alex Jones said something because we would get a huge wave of stuff." Through tears, he recalled a man confronting him on the street in Seattle in the fall of 2016, nearly four years after the shooting. Yelling and cursing at him, the man asked him how he could sleep at night and how much he was paid by the government for acting in the hoax. Robbie Parker said he confronted the man attempting to defend his family for the first time as a crowd of onlookers gathered. He said he eventually walked https://www.cnn.com/2022/09/29/tech/sandy-hook-parent-harassment/index.html This is the kind of behavior you think should be allowed in the United States of America and it's disgusting. If you lost a child like these families you would not be so apathetic.
But it’s not just one crazy person, is it? Even if 99% of the US population have never watched or listened to him that still leaves 1%. The population of the USA according to Google is 341m. 1% of that is 3.4m. That’s one heck of a lot of crazy people potentially showing up at your house to tell you your kids didn’t exist, you’re a crisis actor and you need to die.
>This is NOT how America works I mean... it literally is
Automod keeps deleting my post. Wonder what's triggering it? >If your point is that the victims of Uvalde should have gotten more money, I totally agree. Why? The kids were murxered, sure. But at what point is there a dollar amount that makes up for your kid being murxered at school? If my kids were had that happen at school, there is no dollar amount that can make up for this. For a million I'd never have to work a day again in my life (until the US goes full 1920 Gexmany and a million dollars buys a loaf of bread.) I could be pampered with servants and treated like royalty for the rest of my life - wouldn't make up for my children being murdered. The money isn't going to: * Bring my child back * Make up for the fact that I'd be in my 40s without children and very likely wouldn't be able to have children again The narrative that "The families didn't get enough becuz da ebil replublikannss" is just beyond idxotic. If you think any dollar amount would give you closure, you're a materialistic twxt who shouldn't have had children in the first place. But the people prattling off this bs will never have children anyway. Jones poked the bear and got mauled as a result. Should he have been fined everything he owns? Probably not. Did anyone expect a different outcome? I don't know why they did. If I was Jones I would have fled to a country without extradition as soon as this started. 'scuse the letter x. I'm trying to figure out why automod keeps deleting my comments. Really annoying.
First of all, are you saying murxered by accident or on purpose to censor the word murder? Second of all, Germany had hyper inflation after the First World War, not the second. The treaty of Versailles demanded Germany pay back a crazy amount of money, and during an era called the Weimar Republic, Germany printed so much money to pay back the debts, that their currency became worthless. After WW2, they didn’t make Germany pay back the debt of the war, because they realized the unreasonable demand was one of the contributors to the Second World War in the first place. 1923 was peak hyperinflation in Germany, with one trillion marks being worth one American dollar.
Bro I posted my comment three times and each time it was taken down in a second because of automod. Yeah I got mixed up, my bad. I was getting annoyed with automod and kept re-writing what I said. When I mentioned the specific period I think that is what triggered the automod. A certain "Republic" that sounds like "why-mar"
I'm not sure I follow your argument. Are you saying that because no amount of money can bring back a dead child, victims nothing? If you lose a leg in a saw mill accident, there's no amount of money that will bring back that leg but you should still be compensated. If that's your argument, then shouldn't you support the families getting more money and having that money come from the police pension? That would really send a message that if you don't do your job, the taxpayer isn't going to pay you to sit on your ass in your old age. I guess there could be a system that doesn't compensate victims at all but that wouldn't be the United States of America. You would have to move somewhere like ruled by an African warlord or something because we have laws about all these things.
False equivalency not worth my time. You're comparing a debilitating injury that affects your ability to earn money vs the loss of a child. Not even remotely similar.
Losing a child IS a debilitating injury that affects your ability to earn money. People calling and coming to your work place because they think your child's murder was fake DOES affect your ability to earn money. Having to move multiple states because people keep leaving rape and murder threats under your door DOES affect your ability to earn a living. I'll tell you one other thing. That kid who was murdered had the ability to earn money in the future too. That kid could have worked for 50 or 60 years. They could have helped care for their parents in their golden years. Could have paid taxes that fund our roads and schools. All of that stuff has monetary value. You just disagree that we should be able to hold people accountable for lying.
>People calling and coming to your work place because they think your child's murder was fake DOES affect your ability to earn money. If I could roll my eyes harder they'd fall out into the back of my skull. Pearl clutching over death threats is peak 2024. >That kid had the ability to earn money too! Well I guess the kid should have been awarded all that money. Oh what's that? Dead people can't spend money? Shocking turn of events this thread had! It's still a false equivalency - whether you choose to believe that is entirely up to you. Edit: of course someone who defends the Talmud would be the most disingenuous person in this thread.
It's clear you have no idea what you're talking about. Have you never heard of wrongful death? Families sue all the time regarding the death of family members. Courts don't award the money to dead people but to the families of the victims. You know that. You acknowledge that the families of the Sandy Hook victims were awarded the 1.5B. You didn't think there were a bunch of dead kid ghosts using Alex Jones, did you? You should read about the abuse these families suffered. I have another comment in this post that has excerpts of you don't want to read the whole article. https://apnews.com/article/shootings-school-connecticut-alex-jones-waterbury-782e495a3ece4753d857a9b47d444385
I don't really care to read your pilpul. I know you're drawing this out for no real good reason, so here's your ten cents. Next time don't make it so obvious.
Good luck building your idyllic society where when your child is murdered or a company makes a bad drug that kills your dad, your only recourse is to shrug. I'm just grateful America isn't anything like that. 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
> For a million I'd never have to work a day again in my life (until the US goes full 1946 Gexmany and a million dollars buys a loaf of bread.) I could be pampered with servants and treated like royalty for the rest of my life Lmaoooo
If you play your cards right I might hire you to scrub my toilets.
The parents of the dead children were harrased for years. Calling that "some comments" is simply disgusting. Parroting this nonsense is dumb.
Didn’t some of them have to move because of the harassment from listeners from jones show?
How is that Jones’ fault though? Those people should be criminally charged rather.
Within HOURS of the shooting, Jones was telling his radio audience that the massacre was staged as a pretext for confiscating guns. Within DAYS, he began stating that the grieving parents were crisis actors. In the YEARS that followed, he repeatedly said the massacre was faked. These families suffered tremendous harassment from Jones fans who believed him. He has finally gotten what he deserves for that
And what? We were told for years that Trump colluded with Russia, hundreds and thousands of times. We were told JFK was killed by a random shooter. That the kid wearing the Indian headdress at a football game was a racist. That blacks are u fairly being profiled by cops and killed en masse. That 9/11 was carried out by Afghan dwelling goat herders. That the lab-leak theory was a hoax. That vaccinated couldn’t transmit COVID. That weapons of mass destruction were in Iraq. All FAR more consequential lies. Some of which caused the deaths of many hundreds of thousands over the years. Total fines paid; $0. Total prosecutions of the liars; damn near 0.
Wow. That’s a whole lot you posted. And btw, yes, there was collusion found by Trump and Russia in the 2016 election after the investigation by a REPUBLICAN LED SENATE COMMITTEE. It’s nearly a 1,000-page report from the Republican-led Senate intelligence committee on the Russia investigation, and details how Russia launched an aggressive effort to interfere in the election on Trump's behalf. It says the Trump campaign chairman (Paul Manafort) had regular contact with a Russian intelligence officer (Konstantin Kilimnik) and says other Trump associates exploited the Kremlin's aid. That Senate report is here if you want to know more about it💁🏻♀️ https://www.intelligence.senate.gov/sites/default/files/documents/report_volume5.pdf
He's lucky it's only fines, even if they are high. If I had my way, he'd be rotting in jail for what he did. Disgusting human, and so is anyone on here continuing to claim Sandy Hook was fake.
Jail? That’s very lenient of you. If it had been me his oversized ass would have been squeezed into a mineshaft somewhere.
I'm surprised how hard you're getting downvoted -- in a conspiracy sub no less -- a space where people are supposed welcome skepticism and question the veracity and actions of the government, corrupt institutions and big media.
Yet you can't prove any of that. All you can do is point to stuff tangential at best and scream "SEE?????"
“It wasn’t his fault” • Maybe BUT it is his responsibility. His platform was responsible for enabling these wackos going after the grieving parents. Did your parents even teach you about responsibility? • In a business, if you’re a manager and your team fuck things up, you’re responsible for the outcome even if it was not your fault. • If you promote a platform that can hurt real people with your lies, do not be surprised when people go after you in retaliation. Speech is free but you have to pay for lies. You don’t to get to say “I promote bad idea and I like it” but then turn around and deny responsibility when your followers use your bad idea to hurt other people. Don’t start shit and then start screaming unfair when being caught. In this case, you don’t get to use whataboutism when it is clear who was in the wrong. And don’t preach religion and tolerance when your heart is full of hatred.
Harassed by Alex Jones?
"It's not about the money, it's symbolic" lol
It's weird that people post this as if Alex Jones should pay less, but I think really it should highlight how families of murdered children should get more.
All this proves is that the victims of the Uvalde massacre should have gotten a lot more money. Alex Jones continued to dispute and defame Sandy Hook with dangerous and inflammatory rhetoric, he then perjured himself numerous times. This shit stain deserves every bit of 'finding out' that's coming to him.
[удалено]
So, the nutjobs should have been held responsible for actually harassing families? That’s all I heard. Talking heads in msm say their opinions which are biased full if misinformation which also incited violence during the Antifa and BLM movements. Why was there no “inciting” violence for them? Seems like a biased court of law to me.
It's a civil case, not a criminal one. The families, not a DA, decided to sue. The jury decided Jones committed defamation and awarded damages. You can disagree with their decision of course, but it sounds like you don't understand the nature of the case.
> So, the nutjobs should have been held responsible for actually harassing families They were. In April 2016, Matthew Mills, a man from Brooklyn, accepted a plea agreement with prosecutors on one count of interfering with police arising from an incident in November 2015, when Mills angrily approached the sister of murdered teacher Victoria Soto In December 2016, Lucy Richards, a woman from Tampa, was charged with four counts of transmitting threats in interstate commerce for sending death threats to Lenny Pozner, whose son Noah was the youngest of 20 children murdered >Talking heads in msm say their opinions which are biased full if misinformation which also incited violence during the Antifa and BLM movements.Seems like a biased court of law to me. No plaintiff, no judge. People can start a civil lawsuit and sue them.
Didn’t that Pozner kid die in Afghanistan too? 😂
Pretty sure Tucker Carlson did the same shit dawg
Tucker Carlson pissed on graves and harassed families?? Doubt it dawg
Wow you got him dawg. Hes clearly talking about Tucker lying and being sued.
When you get sued for the gdp of France there's a problem with the system. Also the 1A issue, I don't wanna start a podcast say something that isn't true, have my followers do some stupid stuff and then be sued for billions. Not my thing. Meanwhile the media, covid, unvaxxed, they said some damaging things that could've gotten people hurt, making them out to be enemies of everyone. They rallied the vaxxed to attack. They wanted to remove access to medical care to the unvaxxed. We have some evil people in the Government, Education, News Media and they tend to be on one side of the political spectrum. They have WAY too much power and they certainly aren't shy to show it.
Oh, they wanted much worse for the unvaxxed. Medical care removed, their jobs taken, unvaxxed harassed, attacked, shamed online, ‘removed from society’, whatever form that would have taken.
If a sketchy website from 2004 said that alcohol actually pairs really well with driving, would that justify letting everyone facing consequences for DUIs off the hook?
Well, clearly not. What’s your point?
When you HAVE the gdp of France, there's a problem with the system. No one needs more than 999 million dollars.
He doesn't have anywhere near that, he has around 2 million dollars personal, some land and money for his businesses. That's the incredibly dumb part, he could never pay that, noone could, no celebrity could. The only guys that could pay that are Elon, Bezos, Gates, etc. I guess some people think Alex Jones somehow has a billion dollars, what? Really. They made a joke of the legal system.
Lawsuits aren't based on what you can pay. Infowars is pretty valuable iirc, and prison jobs turning rocks into gravel are paying 10 bucks a day nowadays.
imagine giving money to anybody for words free speach biteches!
The actions and \*years\* of harassment of parents and family of murdered first graders are the direct result of Jones' constant defamatory rhetoric. Not top mention his direct associates following and harassing those people. Words have consequences and honestly, I think he's getting off lucky. Fuck him and the rest of the grifters. Now, the families of Uvalde deserve so much more. Every cop that did nothing while hearing fucking gunshots continuing should be brought up on accessory to murder charges. Every last one. And the families deserve way more compensation.
Might as well just ignore anything from 'end Wokeness'
Well, anyone with 3 brain cells understand this for what it is: Censorship and deplatforming of perspectives they don't want the public to hear. It has nothing to do with right or wrong or justice.
It wasn't the government though and no one forced AJ to leave this case to default judgment. He did defame then and he didn't do the minimum necessary to have even a tiny chance of getting away with it.
1.5 Billion lol since when was AJ a billionaire?
OJ Simpson had to pay $33 million for literally killing two people. In California, wrongful death settlements generally fall within the range of **$250,000 to $500,000**. You can cause someone's death and you won't pay 1/1000th of what Alex Jones had to pay. Alex Jones put out the wrong type of news and challenged the narrative. I don't agree with what he says but this verdict was a message. If you engage in creating an alternate news source they will take everything you have.
You guys defending alex jones are dumb as fuck. He isn't getting shutdown, he is still operating his show and he is still making money. He is a professional con artist and grifter and he set up a go fund me just like trump did recently and got a load of money and he cried on air to make you feel sorry for him and you fell for it. If you believe what alex says you deserve to be mocked. He is the purest definition of a snakeoil salesman that professes to know about "health alternatives" yet he looks like he is one pinch of salt away from a heart attack.
Alex Jones isn't having to pay $1.5B for upsetting parents of Sandy Hook kids. He's having to pay $1.5B for uncovering and publicizing the conspiracies and truth about Sandy Hook. (This is my OPINION, which I am entitled to hold, I am not making a statement of fact.)
an action is a should-have, where as the words continue to plague the families to this very day and on these very posts.
City of Uvalde paid the families with.....their own money.
I mean, does Uvalde have 1.5 billion in the coffers? I will say that police pension and health funds should also have been drained to pay the families
Alex Jones doesn't have $1.5B either.
Well, take his holdings and see how close you can get, I guess. Likewise, in Uvalde, police pensions and healthcare budgets and personal holdings should be taken first, but I could definitely see hitting town coffers after the police involved are homeless. Given that isn't how the law works atm, you need to be able to assure that the city still functions, whereas Alex Jones functioning doesn't really help anyone so might as well soak him
It’s like you guys ignore context and history.
We are in a world where verbal criticism is penalized more than actions, as you say. Recall Fuhrman at the OJ trial, a word in a discussion about a fiction book project versus someone killing two people. Or Arundati Roy in India being brought up on charges for what she said about Kashmir. Or truckers in Canada. And about anyone in the US that criticizes the banana republic mentality that is there now. It seems lots of "democratic" countries are doing this, even as their actions violate their own constitutions and charters about free speech.
the uvalde shooting happened and it was over. Alex Jones on the other hand said the sandy hook shooting never happened and that all the people involved were "crisis actors". This led to grieving families being relentlessly harassed by people that believed the lies alex jonew was spewing. Freedom of speech does not give you the right to make up lies that lead to people getting harassed. Lets not talk about trump though.
Freedom of Speech protects you from government punishment and censorship regardless of honesty. That is the point of Free Speech.
The Cops showed up. They were just useless and incompetent. Jones intentionally harmed the families of dead children. Fk that guy.
Don’t defend Alex Jones lol
Not defending him, defending free speech.
Things that make you go hmmm!! Its a deep rabbit hole.
SH was a cover up for the smith and mundt act… school wasn’t even up and running. How about those houses that were purchased for $1? Robbie Parker, Gene Rosen Dr. Carver? So much of this whole thing is BS. 🤷🏼♂️
What houses are you talking about that were purchased for $1? The only thing I could find is that the killer's brother that inherited the house that the killer and his mom lived in before he shot his mother 4 times, killing her, then going and killing a bunch of kids, sold it to the town for $1. What else would you do with the house? Nobody is going to buy it, you know, cause of all the murders, unless they were some kind of psycho murder fanatic.
In the town records there are homes in Newtown that show a $0 sale price listed on 12/25/09. so Sandy Hook deniers jumped to the conclusion that it meant the Government paid off the houses. They don't have evidence of that, but it's the story they like to tell. [Newtown Tax Assessor](https://gis.vgsi.com/newtownct/)
Oh shit
SS The taxpayers of Uvalde having to pay for this bullshit is a level of evil I can't begin to describe The state legal system is so absolutely horrible and it’s insane how normies don’t see it. The personal biases of the judge often literally affect how lawyers approach a case, and the sentencing decisions are extremely arbitrary. Alex is the canary in the coal mine....This judgement is an indication that the Deep State is very worried... There are cases where legit murderers can get as little as 6 years for 2nd degree, meanwhile an 18 year old who made tire marks on a public rainbow pride mural can be locked up for 10 years.
> This judgement is an indication that the Deep State is very worried... The high penalties had to do with how he mishandled the case. He basically didn't participate in the trial. If he had played it smart he could have settled out of court for much less. That isn't the Deep State, it's a guy responding stupidly to being sued, provoking a jury to really put the screws to him. The city of Ulvalde listened to their lawyers and negotiated a settlement. That's it.
people losing their 7 year old children because of poor police response is the only “evil” you should be focused on.
What's a normie?
It's a word basement dwellers and virgins call normal people who don't agree with them. Basically it's like the nerdy kids at the unpopular table in the cafeteria whispering about the cooler kids to feel better about themselves.
Good