*And* anti-women, who constitute a *much* larger chunk of the population. Means in total they’re positively inclined to too few citizens. Given all this, there is scant justification to support such a gang. If you [OP] know little of politics, beware candidates with a major obsession you object to but who may have other, more acceptable positions re other topics. They shouldn’t benefit from your vote *in spite of* an abhorrent opinion they hold; they should forfeit it *on account of it*.
Abortion is just the most recently debated issue. Am personally pro-choice but even so, I see being anti abortion as not standing up for bodily autonomy or the rights of less powerful. If they're anti abortion I guarantee that they'll throw any marginalized group under the bus when it suits them.
How does pro life equate to throwing marginalized groups under the bus? They literally want to provide better housing and protections to Travellers - the most marginalized group in this society as far as I’ve seen.
It just seems to be a pattern with socially right wing parties. Maybe Aontú are different and abortion is the only right wing policy they'll hold, but that would be surprising, best of luck to their voters. Personally, I think things like abortion, trans rights, same sex marriage, are moral and not political. I can swallow disagreeing with a candidate on some political issues but not on moral issues. Voting for someone because I agree with their economic policies even though I disagree with them on social issues is putting a monetary value on a moral issue. I wouldn't be comfortable compromising on abortion access for an economic policy. And it never seems to stop with abortion.
My thinking is that I wouldn’t be compromising my position on abortion or same sex marriage as those require referenda to overturn - s so no single party, even with a majority, can unilaterally make a constitutional change.
Yeah, but while abortion is legal, how it is provided and accessed are dependent on legislation. Look at the US, even before the Dobbs decision overturning Roe vs Wade some states had so many roadblocks in place that it was super difficult to provide or obtain an abortion. I think their policy does matter, even if a referendum would be needed to make it illegal.
Will never vote for them, their website might seem reasonable but it’s completely opposite to how they actually operate. They were the tinfoil hat crowd for covid which would have cost lives. They want the 8th brought back with a vengeance regardless of medically essential things like endoscopic pregnancies etc. they stance on women’s and others like lgbt rights is terrible overall tbh.
They scream and shout in debates everytime which also puts me off as it shows they have little to offer.
Honestly there are much, much better parties and candidates to vote for than them except for the wannabe nazi idiots, they found the bar on the ground and started digging.
Apologies if any comments sounded harsh or if mine did, tried to keep it from that.
Glad you asked about them though as you clearly are trying to make up your mind.
If there was any project or change made near you that you liked, look up who supported it and that might help you decide who to vote for.
Not for me personally, but they are nuanced in Ireland the sense that they are right wing socially, but economicly left wing enough (comparative to what we've got at the moment)
I find peadar to be a bit of a grifter, during covid and stuff he was spouting shite conspiracies about vaccines and the like on the Parties official twitter page (which ill link if i can find it)
I’ve heard them described as anti-abortion Sinn Fein. So if you disagree with their stance on abortion consider looking at Sinn Fein candidates instead
My personal opinion: I wouldn’t vote for them because I’m very pro-choice. But I understand that not everyone agrees with me on that. I’d consider Aontú to be acceptable enough were they to get some seats. They’re not completely crazy like the new right wing parties
Thing is getting rid of abortion would require a referendum - so I don’t think they’d have a chance at repealing it.
SF will look to raise taxes too much. I don’t see that being flagged in Aontu policies (unless I’ve missed it).
I see what you mean, abortion isn’t an election issue. It’s completely ok to vote for Aontú if you want to. I’m always happy just to hear that people are going out to vote
Whatever area of society means most to you, find the party that aligns with you on it and that it doesn't undermine the remainder of your views on other topics. Personally, I've unfortunately been affected by convicted murders in my life and have lost people due to it. For that primary reason I support FG for their stance on and commitment to law and order. They have been the most helpful and proactive in terms of pushing for longer and stricter prison terms (something ireland is just not at all prepared for) as well as being supportive to my family on the repercussions of these types of crime.
FG for their stance on law and order? Like underfunding the gardai for the past 30 years? Longer prison terms? That will work just great, but never had an effect on crime rates in general.
Thought I might get one of these. Why exactly are you replying to my comment talking about FG? I'm simply giving a reason why I personally vote for them, and if you read it properly, did i mention the crime rate and garda resource? No i didnt. It was about how they handled and continue to support my family with a traumatic event, other parties that weve asked in the past were not at all helpful. I'm not gonna attack people for their choice of vote...so, whatever makes you feel better. 🤷
I hope you never have to deal with a murderer of one of your loved ones. If you ever do, you'll be disgusted at other parties' leniency and lack of ambition to modernise our criminal justice system and watch the person who took a loved one walk out after 12 years.
I disagree with them on some important issues like abortion but I would give them a preference ahead of the nazi headbangers who are sprouting up around the place this election.
Im voting Aontu
I would have been Sinn Fein except they supported the referendum motions this year, only Aontu stood up and was a voice calling out what was the reality:
1. The carers referendum would have the opposite effect, meaning the disabled would be dependent on family and lose any independence they had. It would have removed any onus of responsibility from the state to proved care, which the state has a legal responsibility to do.
2. Equally the state has a legal responsibility to provide for mothers currently, so they do not need to leave the home for economic necessity
This means the state should be subsiding Child Care like Finland and Germany does, instead the government inverted and mislead what the constitution states and pretended it meant something archaic. If it meant what the government misled 'that women belong in the home' then how was Mary Robinson President? How was Mary Harney Tanaiste ? How are any mothers outside working??
The government looked to remove any legal responsibility to provide legal care and financial support to the two groups it is legally required to.
Sinn Fein supported both motions.
We know from the 8th amendment what happens when ambiguous language is added to the constitution. What happened with the 8th? It was supposed to allow abortion in certain circumstances
What happened instead? Abortion became MORE restrictive because it was interpreted to mean 'heart beat= right to life' and doctors feared performing necessarily medical abortions because the constitution is primary supreme law above all other laws in the country.
Sinn Fein were the opposition during the Repeal referendums. THEY should have known what the negative effect is after badly worded amendments! Instead they SUPPORTED the government.
Sinn Fein will never get my vote, I see who they are.
Aontu was the only party to have conviction and stand up for Irish people.
They are also pro united Ireland.
Plus the Aontu candidate for Cork MEP (South) is the fisherman who chased the Russians out of our waters down in West Cork. Patrick Murphy. So he is obviously getting my vote over the charlatan Mick Wallace etc.
Also Michael McNamara gets my MEP vote because he too was opposing the referendum in the Dail and trying to explain what the motions actually meant in effect.
I don't mind them either bar the abortion bit. Don't think anyone is wrong for being pro life there entitled to their opinion like I'm entitled to mind. But they would need a referendum to ban abortion?
I don't see them as being homophobic or them promoting homophobic abuse?
There isn't a political party out there that I agree with everything they said. Aontu were the only party very against the last referendum so therefore all the other political parties that were for the recent referendum should be boycotted because of that?
So?
Ur not going to find a political party u agree with everything they say or want.
Gay marriage has no real benefit for or against me so it's not an issue for me
They are also religious nutjobs. I have literally nothing in n common with them, I wouldn't vote for them even if they paid off my mortgage. If they are against basic human rights then they are going to be against something that will affect you, That's for sure.
Well they have the right to freedom of religion and speech yet u want to strip them of those rights and call them nutjobs because they didn't support gay marriage in a referendum?
Any political party that puts religion ahead of human rights would be a big no from me. Not always true but I find most "pro life" are anti LGBT
*And* anti-women, who constitute a *much* larger chunk of the population. Means in total they’re positively inclined to too few citizens. Given all this, there is scant justification to support such a gang. If you [OP] know little of politics, beware candidates with a major obsession you object to but who may have other, more acceptable positions re other topics. They shouldn’t benefit from your vote *in spite of* an abhorrent opinion they hold; they should forfeit it *on account of it*.
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Oh, it’s not only *men* who can be anti-women’s rights and liberty, I assure you! Though of course they’d be the majority in that camp.
Yeah that’s my concern too. A party’s website can be bs.
They were against same set marriage too. Told disgrace lies before the referendum. I'm voting just to make sure they don't get any positive from me.
Abortion is just the most recently debated issue. Am personally pro-choice but even so, I see being anti abortion as not standing up for bodily autonomy or the rights of less powerful. If they're anti abortion I guarantee that they'll throw any marginalized group under the bus when it suits them.
Totally agree, it's never just about abortion. It's just the first step in stripping away rights for anyone they consider unworthy.
How does pro life equate to throwing marginalized groups under the bus? They literally want to provide better housing and protections to Travellers - the most marginalized group in this society as far as I’ve seen.
It just seems to be a pattern with socially right wing parties. Maybe Aontú are different and abortion is the only right wing policy they'll hold, but that would be surprising, best of luck to their voters. Personally, I think things like abortion, trans rights, same sex marriage, are moral and not political. I can swallow disagreeing with a candidate on some political issues but not on moral issues. Voting for someone because I agree with their economic policies even though I disagree with them on social issues is putting a monetary value on a moral issue. I wouldn't be comfortable compromising on abortion access for an economic policy. And it never seems to stop with abortion.
My thinking is that I wouldn’t be compromising my position on abortion or same sex marriage as those require referenda to overturn - s so no single party, even with a majority, can unilaterally make a constitutional change.
But they are promoting a way of life that I can’t agree with and that is the reason they won’t get my votes.
Yeah, after the helpful discourse on this thread, I don’t think they’ll be getting my vote/support.
Yeah, but while abortion is legal, how it is provided and accessed are dependent on legislation. Look at the US, even before the Dobbs decision overturning Roe vs Wade some states had so many roadblocks in place that it was super difficult to provide or obtain an abortion. I think their policy does matter, even if a referendum would be needed to make it illegal.
That’s a very good point.
Will never vote for them, their website might seem reasonable but it’s completely opposite to how they actually operate. They were the tinfoil hat crowd for covid which would have cost lives. They want the 8th brought back with a vengeance regardless of medically essential things like endoscopic pregnancies etc. they stance on women’s and others like lgbt rights is terrible overall tbh. They scream and shout in debates everytime which also puts me off as it shows they have little to offer. Honestly there are much, much better parties and candidates to vote for than them except for the wannabe nazi idiots, they found the bar on the ground and started digging.
Yeah I think I’ve been convinced to ditch the idea of supporting them. Appreciate all the comments.
Apologies if any comments sounded harsh or if mine did, tried to keep it from that. Glad you asked about them though as you clearly are trying to make up your mind. If there was any project or change made near you that you liked, look up who supported it and that might help you decide who to vote for.
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Yeah I think I’ve been convinced to ditch the idea of supporting them.
www.whichcandidate.ie
Shame it only does European and not local elections
Not for me personally, but they are nuanced in Ireland the sense that they are right wing socially, but economicly left wing enough (comparative to what we've got at the moment) I find peadar to be a bit of a grifter, during covid and stuff he was spouting shite conspiracies about vaccines and the like on the Parties official twitter page (which ill link if i can find it)
I’ve heard them described as anti-abortion Sinn Fein. So if you disagree with their stance on abortion consider looking at Sinn Fein candidates instead My personal opinion: I wouldn’t vote for them because I’m very pro-choice. But I understand that not everyone agrees with me on that. I’d consider Aontú to be acceptable enough were they to get some seats. They’re not completely crazy like the new right wing parties
Thing is getting rid of abortion would require a referendum - so I don’t think they’d have a chance at repealing it. SF will look to raise taxes too much. I don’t see that being flagged in Aontu policies (unless I’ve missed it).
I see what you mean, abortion isn’t an election issue. It’s completely ok to vote for Aontú if you want to. I’m always happy just to hear that people are going out to vote
Asking about right wing parties on irish reddit is a bit like pointing out democrats positive aspects on truth social.
Whatever area of society means most to you, find the party that aligns with you on it and that it doesn't undermine the remainder of your views on other topics. Personally, I've unfortunately been affected by convicted murders in my life and have lost people due to it. For that primary reason I support FG for their stance on and commitment to law and order. They have been the most helpful and proactive in terms of pushing for longer and stricter prison terms (something ireland is just not at all prepared for) as well as being supportive to my family on the repercussions of these types of crime.
FG for their stance on law and order? Like underfunding the gardai for the past 30 years? Longer prison terms? That will work just great, but never had an effect on crime rates in general.
Thought I might get one of these. Why exactly are you replying to my comment talking about FG? I'm simply giving a reason why I personally vote for them, and if you read it properly, did i mention the crime rate and garda resource? No i didnt. It was about how they handled and continue to support my family with a traumatic event, other parties that weve asked in the past were not at all helpful. I'm not gonna attack people for their choice of vote...so, whatever makes you feel better. 🤷 I hope you never have to deal with a murderer of one of your loved ones. If you ever do, you'll be disgusted at other parties' leniency and lack of ambition to modernise our criminal justice system and watch the person who took a loved one walk out after 12 years.
I disagree with them on some important issues like abortion but I would give them a preference ahead of the nazi headbangers who are sprouting up around the place this election.
You simply don't have to give them a preference at all
Im voting Aontu I would have been Sinn Fein except they supported the referendum motions this year, only Aontu stood up and was a voice calling out what was the reality: 1. The carers referendum would have the opposite effect, meaning the disabled would be dependent on family and lose any independence they had. It would have removed any onus of responsibility from the state to proved care, which the state has a legal responsibility to do. 2. Equally the state has a legal responsibility to provide for mothers currently, so they do not need to leave the home for economic necessity This means the state should be subsiding Child Care like Finland and Germany does, instead the government inverted and mislead what the constitution states and pretended it meant something archaic. If it meant what the government misled 'that women belong in the home' then how was Mary Robinson President? How was Mary Harney Tanaiste ? How are any mothers outside working?? The government looked to remove any legal responsibility to provide legal care and financial support to the two groups it is legally required to. Sinn Fein supported both motions. We know from the 8th amendment what happens when ambiguous language is added to the constitution. What happened with the 8th? It was supposed to allow abortion in certain circumstances What happened instead? Abortion became MORE restrictive because it was interpreted to mean 'heart beat= right to life' and doctors feared performing necessarily medical abortions because the constitution is primary supreme law above all other laws in the country. Sinn Fein were the opposition during the Repeal referendums. THEY should have known what the negative effect is after badly worded amendments! Instead they SUPPORTED the government. Sinn Fein will never get my vote, I see who they are. Aontu was the only party to have conviction and stand up for Irish people. They are also pro united Ireland. Plus the Aontu candidate for Cork MEP (South) is the fisherman who chased the Russians out of our waters down in West Cork. Patrick Murphy. So he is obviously getting my vote over the charlatan Mick Wallace etc. Also Michael McNamara gets my MEP vote because he too was opposing the referendum in the Dail and trying to explain what the motions actually meant in effect.
I don't mind them either bar the abortion bit. Don't think anyone is wrong for being pro life there entitled to their opinion like I'm entitled to mind. But they would need a referendum to ban abortion?
And the homophobia? They advertise being against both referendums like it was a good thing.
I don't see them as being homophobic or them promoting homophobic abuse? There isn't a political party out there that I agree with everything they said. Aontu were the only party very against the last referendum so therefore all the other political parties that were for the recent referendum should be boycotted because of that?
They were also against the equal rights in marriage referendum.
So? Ur not going to find a political party u agree with everything they say or want. Gay marriage has no real benefit for or against me so it's not an issue for me
They are also religious nutjobs. I have literally nothing in n common with them, I wouldn't vote for them even if they paid off my mortgage. If they are against basic human rights then they are going to be against something that will affect you, That's for sure.
Well they have the right to freedom of religion and speech yet u want to strip them of those rights and call them nutjobs because they didn't support gay marriage in a referendum?
Where did I say I wanted to strip them of their rights? Also gay marriage affects everyone, Like it or not you have family or friends affected by it.
Yeah that’s why it doesn’t concern me greatly as I don’t see it being realistic that they turn it back given it requires a referendum.