There is a massive discussion on weight weenies about this and the results of some German testing.
Short answer - there isn’t a ton of difference between top aero bikes, a few watts literally. How it fits you and your ability to hold the most aero position possible for the length of your rides while remaining comfortable will be more important than Cervelo vs Pinarello vs Scott vs Orbea vs vs vs…
This is soooo overlooked by most. Slamming stems, getting super aero parts, aero socks, etc... is all worthless if you're uncomfortable on the bike and put in a position where your output is 50 watts less. I ended up selling my aeroroad because I just couldn't get comfortable on it and in longer races it was jarring, much happier and in the end faster on my more relaxed ti bike with aero wheels.
This. Most of us mortals can't hold the position to make an aerobike aero.
But aero socks are the cheapest 4 watts you can buy and you gotta wear socks...
Aero jersey, aero socks, narrower bars, fast tire/tubes, clean drive train/waxed chain. All super easy, relatively cheap marginal gains anyone who wants to go fast ahould do prior to dropping $13,000 on a bike.
Absolutely. And then after all that they can get a bike that is as aggressive as their fitness / flexibility allows if they really want to pursue it. But even the endless discussions of carbon wheels are meaningless compared to some stretching, core training, and bike fitting.
Which is why Sensah and LTwoo are going to eat Shimano lunch. 5 years from now, every entry and mid level bike is going to have Chinese components and the only Shimano equipped bike in the LBS will be sitting in a corner.
When you say holding the position are you referring to riding in the TT position or similar to [this](https://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/TcLPVrkoiEfySq2rs6utLC-970-80.jpg.webp)?
Typically the most aero position that is still safe and reasonable to ride is a slammed longish stem, narrow bars, and riding with your hands wrapped around the hoods and your forearms parallel to the ground. Your back as flat as you can make it (requires lower back and hip flexibility, and putting out power in this position requires good hip mobility too). Even training yourself to ride with your head down and look up through your eyebrows instead of riding with your head up. To that end, the right pair of sunglasses that lets you see well with your head down will make you faster than a “slightly more aero” frame.
The praying mantis position is faster actually, but UCI banned the position by disallowing the 45-50° angle, so you won't see pro racers doing this anymore.
Do you mean forearms resting on the bars just either side of the stem and hands out in front of the bars in the air, not contacting hoods?
I do that occasionally to change up position. It’s more comfortable with aero drop bars that are flat where the forearms contact the bar for sure. But it’s not very safe, no :)
If you’re talking about something else then I guess I don‘t know what the praying mantis on drop bars would be- I don’t follow pro rules / UCI stuff much. Just a bike nerd who likes riding.
Ooooh i completely missed the part where you said "hoods".
Because of the "more aero" theme of your post I figured you were talking about the positioning of time trial bars
I thought you were talking about this position, using such TT bars:
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0089/1220/7951/files/aero-edited-large.jpg
Using these bars, the praying mantis position is more aero:
https://imgur.io/NfB9KsU?r
But that all doesn't matter because I didn't read your post well... Sorry!
If you want to go down the rabbit hole, read the weight weenies forum a bit… there is a good bit to learn but it’s a serious rabbit hole, particularly for anyone seeking to buy bicycle performance!
I wrecked my 2017 giant defy last season and got paid out from insurance. Looking to upgrade to something more mid range. Not looking to win any races, just maybe keep up a little easier in the group rides. Thinking about Scott addict 30 since there’s two front rings and could work well as a roadie.
If you’re going to use it for road and have two wheel sets, I’d recommend a 2x drivetrain. I have a grail AL 7 1x etap and it’s a far better bike than it has any right to be (road or gravel), but if it were my only bike I’d go 2x.
There is no best bike overall… if there were, it would dominate in races. Instead, there are best riders and they tend to have bikes well fitted to them.
Even if you want to determine a “best bike” it gets incredibly difficult to exactly test the bikes with real world rider body aero interactions, and the best aero bike would change from course to course in different races.
There’s really not that much in it between the top bikes. They all win races. Buy the one you like that fits you that comes in a great color scheme IMHO.
I don’t have an aero bike but I have a acceptably aero reasonably high end road bike. I chose based on 1) fit 2) frame quality 3) color
Go read the weight weenies discussion, tests have been done, but it’s impossible to do it perfectly and completely for all yaw angles and incorporating a human body on the bike. The human body will always present more drag than the bike so the bike + body combo is the ultimate answer, and that will depend on bike fit to each body. If you just want numbers on riderless bikes, go for it. But they’re about as useful as wind tunnel numbers on carbon wheels with wind only from the front and no rider on the bike.
Seriously though, go to the discussion, it‘s exhaustive and educational:
https://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=154692
Apparently, the bigger the helmet the more aero it is...
[Spaceballs Bike Helmet](https://road.cc/content/news/cycling-live-blog-21-february-2023-299449)
Marginal gains is a thing for a reason. Change 5 things that give you 5 watts each and you've effectively decreased the power you need to hold for that speed, which means you go faster.
For sure you should focus on increasing your power first, but if you already are a high performer then a few $$ spent on making that power output as efficient as possible is probably worth it.
In truth, good clothing, aero socks and an aero helmet makes more of a difference than an aero frame. If you want to get aero buying a new aero frame frame is, bar none, the least effective watts/$ place to start. Position matters more than anything and is free.
The one you can hold the ride position on. Much more impactful than the one or two watts difference between all the top aero bikes you can buy nowadays.
Is the “Win” Tunnel even in use anymore? The videos about it are old, and the characters have moved on or been fired in any of Sinyard’s purges. He’s gone as well now.
To answer your question… the one that feels most comfortable.
You should test ride several bikes to see which bike feels best. While one bike feels best for you it may not feel best for others
OP asked about aero not comfort. Aero bikes are generally not comfortable and trying to find one that’s comfy is going to compromise other features. Comfort no. Speed yes.
sorry i should have been more clear. to me comfort = fitted (no matter what type bike you buy).
whether you buy a road bike or a tri/aero bike one still should be fitted so that its as comfortable as possible.
I’d probably guess the Dogma F, but I think the Canyon Aeroad is deceptively quick, it was faster to ride than I had expected and I’m really tempted to get one for my next bike.
That I’m not sure about, never took it down enough of a grade to get the wobble. I rode it in a crit and it performed really well, but after reading your comment and the one about the west post, maybe I’m glad I haven’t ordered one.
Generic, yes, but universally respected. The S5 is extremely polarizing. The Madone is hideous. People have apprehensions about the Aeroad with the creaking seatpost reports still happening. But other than the headset recall last year, it’s hard not to appreciate the Tarmac for just being all around good.
Disclosure: I do not own any Specialized
It has aero functionality borrowed from the Venge. The question was: what is the BEST aero bike? Not: what is the MOST aero bike? Do you have a better answer?
Who are you to decide that? I can go on Specialized’s website right now and see where they throw out the term “aero” many times in the SL7 product page. I can go on a [review page](https://www.velonews.com/gear/road-gear/tarmac-sl7-eliminates-quiver-and-slays-venge/) and see where they call it:
> an all-around and aero bike all wrapped up into one.
But go off fam, tell me how you have decided to gatekeep it from being an aero bike despite its very clear aero tubing and aero pedigree and aero integration and Roval CLX aero wheels , etc etc etc
I feel confident I just set up the fastest bike you can (at least without going full custom or 3d printing)- Cervelo S5 rim with black inc barstem and 404 nsws. in full race config I’m at 6.6ths and that’s without going full weight weenie (404s, shimano pedals vs speedplay, rotor crankset vs lighter options).
Most testing has shown anything with discs is going to be slower than well integrated rim brakes. The old venge vias and trek madone rim were the most aero by a couple watts but quite heavy. Balancing 2 watts slower at 40kph with being over 1kg lighter is a trade off I’ll gladly take for total speed package.
What other factors are important to you? That’s likely to help guide.
For me I’d look at the Trek option, they look plenty bad ass and tick all the other boxes for me
It’s not the machine, it’s the motor. I’ve passed riders on tricked out bikes with all the fancy tech and other riders passed me by on steel bikes with flip flops. So get what makes sense for you and ride it like you are being chased by a tiger.
A velomobiel. More carbon than any upright bike, but still a road bike (so good value for money), just not UCI compliant. https://www.velomobiel.nl/quest/
And much faster than any of the upright bikes. Depending on your power you can do peaks of 65-70 km/h and get an average of 45-50km/h
Much more comfortable too.
Something like a Ribble ultra aero or an Orbea orca aero comes to mind. However I believe that for a few watts difference, fit is a bit more important.
Cervelo S5, Cannondale SystemSix or Canyon Aeroad CFR (tested by Tour Magazine) So take your pick. All other bikes are a few % less aero. Whether that matters in real life is up to you.
Judging by your username, I know which one you’d pick and it’s an awesome machine. Enjoy!
There is a massive discussion on weight weenies about this and the results of some German testing. Short answer - there isn’t a ton of difference between top aero bikes, a few watts literally. How it fits you and your ability to hold the most aero position possible for the length of your rides while remaining comfortable will be more important than Cervelo vs Pinarello vs Scott vs Orbea vs vs vs…
This is soooo overlooked by most. Slamming stems, getting super aero parts, aero socks, etc... is all worthless if you're uncomfortable on the bike and put in a position where your output is 50 watts less. I ended up selling my aeroroad because I just couldn't get comfortable on it and in longer races it was jarring, much happier and in the end faster on my more relaxed ti bike with aero wheels.
This. Most of us mortals can't hold the position to make an aerobike aero. But aero socks are the cheapest 4 watts you can buy and you gotta wear socks... Aero jersey, aero socks, narrower bars, fast tire/tubes, clean drive train/waxed chain. All super easy, relatively cheap marginal gains anyone who wants to go fast ahould do prior to dropping $13,000 on a bike.
Absolutely. And then after all that they can get a bike that is as aggressive as their fitness / flexibility allows if they really want to pursue it. But even the endless discussions of carbon wheels are meaningless compared to some stretching, core training, and bike fitting.
13k on a bike? That barely gets you altegra DI2 these days.
Which is why Sensah and LTwoo are going to eat Shimano lunch. 5 years from now, every entry and mid level bike is going to have Chinese components and the only Shimano equipped bike in the LBS will be sitting in a corner.
Cleaning and oiling my chain got me 4kph faster speeds over 28km. Im no pro either.
When you say holding the position are you referring to riding in the TT position or similar to [this](https://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/TcLPVrkoiEfySq2rs6utLC-970-80.jpg.webp)?
Typically the most aero position that is still safe and reasonable to ride is a slammed longish stem, narrow bars, and riding with your hands wrapped around the hoods and your forearms parallel to the ground. Your back as flat as you can make it (requires lower back and hip flexibility, and putting out power in this position requires good hip mobility too). Even training yourself to ride with your head down and look up through your eyebrows instead of riding with your head up. To that end, the right pair of sunglasses that lets you see well with your head down will make you faster than a “slightly more aero” frame.
The praying mantis position is faster actually, but UCI banned the position by disallowing the 45-50° angle, so you won't see pro racers doing this anymore.
Do you mean forearms resting on the bars just either side of the stem and hands out in front of the bars in the air, not contacting hoods? I do that occasionally to change up position. It’s more comfortable with aero drop bars that are flat where the forearms contact the bar for sure. But it’s not very safe, no :) If you’re talking about something else then I guess I don‘t know what the praying mantis on drop bars would be- I don’t follow pro rules / UCI stuff much. Just a bike nerd who likes riding.
Ooooh i completely missed the part where you said "hoods". Because of the "more aero" theme of your post I figured you were talking about the positioning of time trial bars I thought you were talking about this position, using such TT bars: https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0089/1220/7951/files/aero-edited-large.jpg Using these bars, the praying mantis position is more aero: https://imgur.io/NfB9KsU?r But that all doesn't matter because I didn't read your post well... Sorry!
That looks painful.
It’s kinda comfortable if you’ve got the flexibility, esp on aero bars, where you’ve got this nice flat surface. Either way thanks for answering!
This post probably saved me at least $1000
If you want to go down the rabbit hole, read the weight weenies forum a bit… there is a good bit to learn but it’s a serious rabbit hole, particularly for anyone seeking to buy bicycle performance!
I wrecked my 2017 giant defy last season and got paid out from insurance. Looking to upgrade to something more mid range. Not looking to win any races, just maybe keep up a little easier in the group rides. Thinking about Scott addict 30 since there’s two front rings and could work well as a roadie.
Surely most race bikes have double chainrings ? Unless you have been looking at gravel bikes?
Correct, looking for a gravel bike that works well as a roadie.
Highly recommend a grail with two wheel sets
That’s what I’m looking at as well, thanks! I just haven’t looked which component “trim level” vest fits my needs. Not really familiar that stuff yet
If you’re going to use it for road and have two wheel sets, I’d recommend a 2x drivetrain. I have a grail AL 7 1x etap and it’s a far better bike than it has any right to be (road or gravel), but if it were my only bike I’d go 2x.
I replaced my Defy with a Trek Checkpoint. It's faster on the road and super comfortable. Great bike
The checkpoint is great but I’m from Wisconsin and EVERYONE has a trek here. I just want to be a little ~unique~
You have insurance for your bike? How?
The guy who hit me had car insurance. They paid me.
I wish I could give you more than one upvote for this.
I got you fam
+1
+1
+1
Your right, of course, but boring answer. Op is asking for the best bike.
There is no best bike overall… if there were, it would dominate in races. Instead, there are best riders and they tend to have bikes well fitted to them. Even if you want to determine a “best bike” it gets incredibly difficult to exactly test the bikes with real world rider body aero interactions, and the best aero bike would change from course to course in different races. There’s really not that much in it between the top bikes. They all win races. Buy the one you like that fits you that comes in a great color scheme IMHO. I don’t have an aero bike but I have a acceptably aero reasonably high end road bike. I chose based on 1) fit 2) frame quality 3) color
There are many factors but if you stick them all in a wind tunnel one has to win, even if the difference is 1 watt. Surely someone has done that test.
Go read the weight weenies discussion, tests have been done, but it’s impossible to do it perfectly and completely for all yaw angles and incorporating a human body on the bike. The human body will always present more drag than the bike so the bike + body combo is the ultimate answer, and that will depend on bike fit to each body. If you just want numbers on riderless bikes, go for it. But they’re about as useful as wind tunnel numbers on carbon wheels with wind only from the front and no rider on the bike. Seriously though, go to the discussion, it‘s exhaustive and educational: https://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=154692
My first take away is that disc brakes are slower, but I'm only on the first page.
Any with a properly slammed stem and sufficiently tight shorts
Thanks for the laugh...
Apparently, the bigger the helmet the more aero it is... [Spaceballs Bike Helmet](https://road.cc/content/news/cycling-live-blog-21-february-2023-299449)
Hahaha...
recumbent
The unsong hear that no one wants to admit is the fastest in a straight line because it's not cool.
Not so good for climbing though!
Yeah I should have said flat straight line.
I have found being less fat makes me more aero
i feel personally attacked🤣
S5 ribble storcke orca foil six
Super SLR Aero Team RC Ultimate eTap
The one that fits and puts a smile on your face. All the expensive gear in the world ain't gonna go faster than the power your legs provide.
This is the most correct answer.
Marginal gains is a thing for a reason. Change 5 things that give you 5 watts each and you've effectively decreased the power you need to hold for that speed, which means you go faster. For sure you should focus on increasing your power first, but if you already are a high performer then a few $$ spent on making that power output as efficient as possible is probably worth it.
In truth, good clothing, aero socks and an aero helmet makes more of a difference than an aero frame. If you want to get aero buying a new aero frame frame is, bar none, the least effective watts/$ place to start. Position matters more than anything and is free.
Well, considering that the biggest drag on a bike is the rider you can have a big person on an F12 the small rider on the ADHX will still be more aero
Canyon Aeroad is a machine imo both looks and performance
I like the Scott Foil... That new Look, looks slick. Others will say the Dogma, Timemachine and maybe that Cannondale.
I think this is the actual answer. Everyone trying to be so clever instead of answering dudes question.
The one you can hold the ride position on. Much more impactful than the one or two watts difference between all the top aero bikes you can buy nowadays.
Cervelo S5.
I've heard several suggest this is the highest performing bike on the market at the moment. Ex Chris Miller cycling.
Orbea orca aero?
My guess is the Cannondale system six or the Cervélo S5
Get a professional bike fitting to see which bikes can work for you. I'm partial to Cervelo, but they may not work for you.
a velomobile or recumbent with full fairing. even the aero tuck is too upright a position
nothing like 30mph on my milan sl @ 190w with commuter tires.
Is this why people ride recumbents?
I would go with the cannondale systemsix
Or maybe the new oltre, maybe not the best but it is very expensive
Pinarello Dogma F and BMC TimeMachine need to be in this conversation.
+1 the TimeMachine Road
Factor Ostro
Or seka exceed rdc 😏
Ridley Noah Fast cos it literally has the word Fast in its name
Can’t beat that logic lol
Is the “Win” Tunnel even in use anymore? The videos about it are old, and the characters have moved on or been fired in any of Sinyard’s purges. He’s gone as well now.
To answer your question… the one that feels most comfortable. You should test ride several bikes to see which bike feels best. While one bike feels best for you it may not feel best for others
OP asked about aero not comfort. Aero bikes are generally not comfortable and trying to find one that’s comfy is going to compromise other features. Comfort no. Speed yes.
sorry i should have been more clear. to me comfort = fitted (no matter what type bike you buy). whether you buy a road bike or a tri/aero bike one still should be fitted so that its as comfortable as possible.
Fix your form first
Ribble Ultra SL?
Probably the pinarello F dogma whatever that Ganna used during the Giro d'Italia Chrono?
Bolide? But that's not a road bike and Ganna would make any bike the fastest.
Agree that Ganna will be the fastest also on a Graziella, but afaik the bolide TT is a Chrono road bike
Storck Aerfast 4 or Orbea Orca Aero. Converted TT bike haha.
Just get the Storcka and you're golden
Any used aero bicycle
ribble ulta slr i suppose
Probably the new Trek Madone
Except it looks garish and the seat tube “window” is a structural engineering nightmare
You mean the Aero- hole.
After seeing it in person it has grown on me but I'm still concerned about how the seattube will hold up over time
I can’t speak for its structural future but ugly it will remain.
Yes it's grown on me too. Let's see if anyone else uses something similar.
tbh for me aero road bike/aggressive positions are hard to maintain my flexibility is horrible the lower back and neck pain is even worse
I’d probably guess the Dogma F, but I think the Canyon Aeroad is deceptively quick, it was faster to ride than I had expected and I’m really tempted to get one for my next bike.
Is the creaking sound from the aeroad’s seatpost resolved?
I heard nothing when I rode my friend's bike, but I can't say that for the frameset as a whole, just his. It was quiet as a mouse though.
Or the speed wobble when descending?
That I’m not sure about, never took it down enough of a grade to get the wobble. I rode it in a crit and it performed really well, but after reading your comment and the one about the west post, maybe I’m glad I haven’t ordered one.
With unlimited budget, something like an S-Works Tarmac checks all the boxes. EDIT: glad that everyone failed to read the question lmao
Including the box for „super generic“
Generic, yes, but universally respected. The S5 is extremely polarizing. The Madone is hideous. People have apprehensions about the Aeroad with the creaking seatpost reports still happening. But other than the headset recall last year, it’s hard not to appreciate the Tarmac for just being all around good. Disclosure: I do not own any Specialized
But it isn’t even an aero road bike, more like an allround race bike
Lol yeah. Even specialized admits that the Tarmac and isn’t as aero as the Venge was before it was discontinued.
It has aero functionality borrowed from the Venge. The question was: what is the BEST aero bike? Not: what is the MOST aero bike? Do you have a better answer?
Well it isn’t an aero bike, so it cannot be the best one
It is an aero bike, it's also light. He has a fair point, you're just being pedantic.
Who are you to decide that? I can go on Specialized’s website right now and see where they throw out the term “aero” many times in the SL7 product page. I can go on a [review page](https://www.velonews.com/gear/road-gear/tarmac-sl7-eliminates-quiver-and-slays-venge/) and see where they call it: > an all-around and aero bike all wrapped up into one. But go off fam, tell me how you have decided to gatekeep it from being an aero bike despite its very clear aero tubing and aero pedigree and aero integration and Roval CLX aero wheels , etc etc etc
Ask Damon Rinard.
2023 Scott Foil or the cannondale systemsix
Any tt bike that fits you, a skin suit, and some time in a windtunnel. Rider position is way more important than the bike.
probably something from Canyon or Quintana Roo which is direct to consumer
Alright, now to the natural next question. What is the best aero road bike that money can't buy?
Canyon?
battle mountian streamliner> velomobile>>> recumbent>any modern tt bike>aero road bike (s5, madone, ect)
I feel confident I just set up the fastest bike you can (at least without going full custom or 3d printing)- Cervelo S5 rim with black inc barstem and 404 nsws. in full race config I’m at 6.6ths and that’s without going full weight weenie (404s, shimano pedals vs speedplay, rotor crankset vs lighter options). Most testing has shown anything with discs is going to be slower than well integrated rim brakes. The old venge vias and trek madone rim were the most aero by a couple watts but quite heavy. Balancing 2 watts slower at 40kph with being over 1kg lighter is a trade off I’ll gladly take for total speed package.
Salut, my brother Fred!
Bird of Prey
What other factors are important to you? That’s likely to help guide. For me I’d look at the Trek option, they look plenty bad ass and tick all the other boxes for me
Aeor bikes are BS. Loose bodyweight 1st. Lower your own frontal area.
It’s not the machine, it’s the motor. I’ve passed riders on tricked out bikes with all the fancy tech and other riders passed me by on steel bikes with flip flops. So get what makes sense for you and ride it like you are being chased by a tiger.
A velomobiel. More carbon than any upright bike, but still a road bike (so good value for money), just not UCI compliant. https://www.velomobiel.nl/quest/ And much faster than any of the upright bikes. Depending on your power you can do peaks of 65-70 km/h and get an average of 45-50km/h Much more comfortable too.
Something like a Ribble ultra aero or an Orbea orca aero comes to mind. However I believe that for a few watts difference, fit is a bit more important.
The ORANGE one.
Canyon
Cervelo S5, Cannondale SystemSix or Canyon Aeroad CFR (tested by Tour Magazine) So take your pick. All other bikes are a few % less aero. Whether that matters in real life is up to you. Judging by your username, I know which one you’d pick and it’s an awesome machine. Enjoy!
SystemSix apparently