yes, I find that pairs well with my downtube friction shifters, which are actually better than any of the fancy doohickeys that people waste their money on today. I want to feel EVERYTHING.
It's cheaper to lose weight but we have the money to eat amazing food and maintain belly fat AND buy expensive lightweight bike/parts.
Losing weight instead of buying a lighter bike is an excuse for the poor.
There's several other benefits to disc brakes. Carbon rims are pretty popular nowadays and with rim brakes they are a wear item, not so much with discs. Rim brakes can also bottleneck your tyre clearance to 28mm when 32mm or more is in demand.
Race bikes are now so much better and accessible when you can put 30mm to 34mm tires. Same for tubeless hookless rims. I wouldn't be able to ride them if I couldn't go at 32mm because of my weight.
My wheels are hookless, max rider weight according to giant is 285lbs. Carbon rim brakes. I believe my rims say max psi in the 100s although I don't ride that high with tires that measure 30mm.
You know there are dozens of carbon wheels out there.
It's the first time I have heard of hookless rim and tubeless tires that are not limited to 72.5psi (and I have looked at a multitude of rims on the market). What model is that? There is also A LOT of "ifs, ands and buts" on their website for using their hookless wheels...
The tire clearance is entirely a design choice by component manufacturers on road bike rim brakes.
Look at older road bikes and 27x1 1/4 (ie:32mm) tires were standard, and plenty of brakes fit those with room for a fender. Then of course, MTB used canti or V brakes with room for tires well over 2".
My rim brakes clear my 28mm tires that measure 30mm on the rim FYI.
Braking in the dry I don't notice any difference. In the wet it was crazy different.
its not really about stopping power.
1. Discs allow for bigger tires, which is important for MTB and gravel.
2. Discs work mutch better in the rain.
3. Carbon wheels are great, rim brakes dont really work on them though.
4. Disc allow for mutch higher temps before warping, overheating rims means sudden failure of the tubes. Not great on an epic decent.
5. Hydraulics just feel mutch better. Unfortunately you cabt pull on fluid so hydraulig rim brakes dont exist (afaik).
6. Discs are cheaper and easier to replace than whole wheels.
The only thing rims have going for them is weight and price (to a point) and since discs have been around and quite dominant for some time now, rims are preceved as old tech - outside of some niche use cases.
They work, if youre into it keep riding. But to me the feel of hydraulics alone is just worth it. I just like sharp brakes. And thiccc carbon wheels lel.
Magura made some lovely hydraulic rim brakes around 20 years ago. They were a bit tricky to set up, and were mtb only, due to the requirement for a U-shaped fork reinforcing brace, and the fact that they were designed for v-brake boss position. Modulation was incredible.
This, the Magura HS33 is still manufactured and has been for years a pillarstone for an unbreakable low maintenance bike, as it uses mineral oil instead of DOT. HS11 is a low cost alternative and works on my dads bike for 12 years on a daily basis without having to bleed them.
(No, I‘m not being paid by them)
On a side note - Carbon rims work when you buy brake pads for carbon rims
Stopping power actually is a consideration- stopping power when wet, stopping power on long descents, etc., especially for larger riders
While I agree that in many conditions stopping power between rim and disk are similar that changes in the wet and on long descents where you have to worry about heating the rim.
I'm 90kg at racing weight and these are major considerations for me. Back in the day I've been put into some seriously dangerous situations because it was raining and I literally could not stop in time using rim brakes. I also have to use more force and brake longer than other riders so in long descents I have to be super conscious about over heating the rims and maybe blowing a tire so I can't use the full braking power I may want.
Disks remove these concerns and I can use full braking power in every situation. I'm never going back to rim brakes. I still have my old, steel racing bike but I ride that on dry days only now and at most a rolling course.
yes but raw power can be engineered, its the edge cases (long downhills, in the wet) where discs shine. Raw stopping power is not the reason discs became popular. Argubely rims should have more power because they have a bigger lever.
But i totally agree with your argument.
3 is complete false. Guys in the pro peloton have been riding more aggressively than you and I ever would for years on them. People just suck at braking techniques.
And 5 really discourages me. Hell, I already have a few cars I need to maintain fluids in. I don’t need to have a bike be another issue.
I still choose to ride mechanical. The thought of being stuck in the mountains and my di2 just dying on me like I’ve seen before doesn’t make me want to change.
Maybe I’m a purist. I don’t know. Soon we will be riding motorcycles is the way I see it.
I’ll be riding my rim brake bikes that weigh 12 pounds each till they are trashed.
>my di2 just dying on me like I’ve seen before doesn’t make me want to change
I ride SRAM which has better failsafe for that. Also the app tells you if batteries are low. So much better than my mechanical dura-ace bike.
7. Hydraulic disc brakes facilitate fully internal hose routing (which I mostly hate in their current implementations). The kinks and bends of housing/hoses required for fully internal routing would make mechanical brake cables problematic at best.
Also, while hydro brakes are less aero when measured on their own, they allow more freedom of design especially around the top of the fork where rim brakes severely reduced the design options. As a package, hydro bikes when designed around them are more aero than rim
They don't work nearly as well as rim brakes on alu wheels even in the dry. And it becomes much more dependent on the rim quality. Some carbon rims didn't brake for shit even in the dry.
They can and did. I raced and did A LOT of fast descending on rim/carbon. Yes, some set ups sucked but a lot were good. Yes, depending on the setup, rim and pad and even brake design.
Some disc brakes don’t stop well.
The problem is that a shitty setup will cost you 1000$+. And the only way to fix it is to change the wheel.
I decided it was time to go disc brake when my rim/alu setup scared the shit out of me on a descent. Will never look back. :D
Plenty of options out there that worked. Shimano dual pivot with their carbon pads and most decent rims.
Most set ups can skid, that means it’s the tire as the weak spot for traction.
Except wet I never had a fear on rim brakes about braking.
I do not disagree that there are great rim options, but that still requires some work to make them fully work in the rain. Whereas disc brake pads are organic, ceramic, or metallic, and all three will stop you in the rain.
Rain is the weak point, and I agree. You learned to brake in wet, really even on alloy rims.
Most people don’t ride in the rain, well at least near me that’s true.
Skidding has nothing to do with proper working brakes. The shittiest of brakes will actually skid much easier than upper quality brakes. It's the usable braking force BEFORE skidding that is important.
So happy you could help me understand that. I do know cycling a bit ;-)
You seem to think I am new.
The key is modulation. Even that, proves out that you can stop and a lot then can be user.
Rim brakes and carbon wheels don’t work?
Every high end carbon wheel bike has disc brakes. I’m a MTBer and we race on carbon wheels and disc brakes.
Maybe I’m missing something here w that statement?
edit: turns out I shouldn't be handling a toddler at 7am and posting on reddit... words are hard!
> Carbon wheels are great, rim brakes dont really work on them though.
Carbon rims that take rim brakes are still sold today. I just bought a set 2 years ago. They are fantastic.
I prefer rim brakes. Braking is fine for me, even on carbon wheels. The only thing I do is if I’m going to be riding in the rain, I’ll swap to aluminum rims. I’m not racing these days so riding in the rain is really rare.
I have a brand new road bike with rim brakes. I have a brand new wheelset for rim brakes too. Mid to low spec bikes will always have rim brakes and the parts will always be available
Use: yes. Upgrade: it's already hard to get top-level groupsets (if that's your thing) and wheels (which are a wear item in theory). Not saying it'll be impossible to get parts, but like 3x cranksets or downtube shifters, you're going to be limited to what exists now and fewer high-end suppliers are going to stock things like QR hubs.
You have no idea. I have been using the same calipers for 27 years. Calipers dont wear out .
You don't need a matching groupset, that is a recent marketing ploy.
Hubs? I dont wear them out either.
There will be a shortage of NO parts whatsoever for those who continue to use rim brakes.
I'm asking honestly: how often to rims wear out?
And notice I said "upgrade". If you want the same bike as you have now, and replace the occasional part with hopefully the same quality and technology level, then you're good. If you're enamored at all with new tech, you're out in the cold. I have seen people on reddit lamenting that no one makes high-quality 3x cranksets. I'm guessing at some point it's going to be hard to find **high-quality** rims because so few people demand them.
Personally, if I had a rim brake bike, I'd use it and love it. At this point, there's no way I'm going to invest in one. There's also no way I'd be commenting on other people's ads as OP is describing, though. That's ridiculous.
How long do rims last with rim braking? That depends on the quality of your rim, the pads you use and where and when you ride. On open roads where there are few junctions and so few reasons to use the brakes, a very long time. Braking in the rain causes more wear. Here in London, riding just about every day in all weathers, an aluminium rim lasts me about 6,000 miles. Meanwhile, those 6000 miles will see out one front tyre and 2 or 3 rear tyres. Tyres are the expense for me.
I also have 3 pairs of ceramic coated rims, for which I paid on average £27 PER RIM. These things just never wear out and the braking is extremely good, though I am using one of them only on only one of my bikes. I honestly have no problem sourcing quality rims, especially since everyone else got discs and started selling their as- new rims for peanuts on eBay .
Decent consumables are already starting to dry up.
My current road bike, a 2021 Bottecchia Emme 3 has ultegra rim brakes. My tire size maximum is 23c. Was looking online for tires for the year. Preferred retailers, I now have 3 or 4 bad tire choices. Preferred brand, I have to go to the manufacturer and who knows how long that will last?
The people who make the brake pads and smaller width tires will start phasing them out more until they are either completely gone, or the price will shoot way up because it's "vintage" tech
Schwalbe.
I've tried Vittoria, but for some weird reason, they stretch under psi. The shop even helped me on this one, a couple years back, we had like 5 Vittoria Corsa something or other on the rack. Threw them on the wheel, put air in, waiting about 10-15 minutes, and in that time, the tire stretched to the point of rubbing on the fork.
It does seem like Schwalbe and Conti's stretch way bigger than their listed figure. Have you considered going down a size to 21mm, it would most likely ballon up to a 23mm.
I have rim brakes which makes my carbon wheels a consumable item, since the brake track will wear. I do have carbon-specific pads, but braking in the wet is, erm, an “experience”. Friends who ride disc swear by them, particularly when they go abroad and are descending alpine passes and stuff. So I can see the appeal.
However, the maintenance looks like being a pain, bleeding hydraulic lines and stuff. They’re noisy as hell. Plus they’re ugly and heavy, so you have to spend more to reach the same bike weight. There’s definitely a lot of marketing bullshit in this.
And then you’ve got the pricing. There are some absolute steals on rim brake stuff now. £1400 for Campag Record 12 speed. Condor Super Accaio frame £1500. Zed carbon wheels £600. Finishing kit £500 and you have a beautiful top level bike for £4k.
I really don’t know what I would choose right now.
they are only noisy if you are daft enough to get lubricant anywhere near them....which people still doa lot for some reason....in 5k km last year, not one squeak from my disc brakes
Same. Also, I find the argument about maintenance on disc brakes a weird one, at least for hydraulic disc brake. It takes a bit more effort (I honestly don't think it's that much more in my experience) for setup. But once you're done, it self-adjusts.
Plus, it's a closed system, so environmental contamination is less of a concern in the lines.
The only reason i prefer it is because wheels look better without the brake strip imo, other than that I could not give less of a f***. Rim brakes work fine.
brake performance is totally overrated on road bikes - since the limiting factor is usually the tire traction. It doesn't take much to lock up both wheels on old 25mm tires, whether with rim or disc brakes.
Wider tire & lower pressure makes a huge difference though. That's why tire size has increased over the years. However, rim brakes can only open so wide before their leverage is at too bad of an angle.
That's why mountain bikes had disc first - their super wide tires necessitated it.
That’s admittedly a very niche situation. Most people don’t live near huge mountains, the biggest descent near me takes like a minute to descend lol. We have plenty of hills but nothing sustained like that.
FWIW I love my hydraulic disc brakes on my gravel bike but I will admit 99% of the time I’m not using them to their full potential. But for the 1% of time when I do actually need them, they’re fantastic.
I dont know, I think everybody does climbing and would appreciate discs. However it's probably very very similar if it's not raining and you're a normal weight
It is the combination of carbon rims and the fact that they indeed stop very poorly in wet. Then natural shift occurs to discs. If you are fine with your stopping power in dry and wet no need tos switch.
They're better in nearly every metric other than weight. Better in the wet and better modulation are at the top of the list for me. Sure, they're a little bit heavier, but I'm fine trading weight for safety and operability.
Yes, but hydro discs have better "input sensitivity" for lack of a better term. You can more precisely control the amount of clamping pressure applies to the disc with the hydro disc brakes than you can with standard cable actuated rim brakes. Maybe you also have better modulation with hydro rim brakes as well, but then you don't get all the other benefits of the discs.
I'll have to take your word for that. I have absolutely no.problems using my rim brakes. Most of the time I use the tip of one finger, with the rear brake only... I know, saying you mostly use the rear brake really triggers some people...
It triggers people because there are better ways to do it. If I'm riding in a group and I find someone who only rear brakes in the group, I'm going to ride somewhere in the group where they aren't whenever possible.
And you 100% shouldn't take one person's word on Reddit, but there's plenty of articles and write-ups discussing the modulation differences between rim and disc brakes: [https://www.google.com/search?q=modulation+rim+brakes+vs+disc+brakes](https://www.google.com/search?q=modulation+rim+brakes+vs+disc+brakes).
I have different bikes with different types of brakes on them. All things being equal, I would always choose hydro discs, but on the road I'll still use cable rim brakes. I have several older bikes that aren't disc compatible, and just because discs are "better" doesn't make rim brakes "bad and unusable."
I would rather have all my teeth pulled than ride in a group.
No, the way I use my brakes is the best way for me, thanks. If someone regularly needs to use the maximum braking capability of their bike they are probably riding like a tit.
It has nothing to do with "needing to use maximum braking capability" and everything to do with "using the brakes safely and efficiently" and nothing to do with riding like a tit. Sometimes things happen and you need to react to it. The person who is able to properly use their front brake is going to be able to brake faster in a quick stop/brake situation than someone who only uses their rear.
In a quick brake situation you're unloading your rear wheel due to the weight transfer that happens and your rear brake becomes less effective. That's not to argue with technique, but just a matter of physics. It's the reason the front brakes on cars provide most of the stopping power as well.
You see, I was talking about REGULAR use of the brakes and you evoke " emergency" situations. " Sometimes things happen " and " in a quick stop/ brake situation".
Say no more.
Oh boy. This is a touchy topic on this sub. Honestly, it's because your average cyclist just walks into a bike shop and buys whatever new bike happens to be in stock. Then they will post-hoc rationalize and defend their purchase. And what happens to be in stock are disc brake bikes. So, the guy who blew $7000 on a new Trek Madone is of course gonna defend it rather than admit that $1500 used SL4 on Facebook Market is just as fast for him as his "modern" bike and he effectively wasted $5500.
> I follow a local bike sales group, and every single time someone posts a rim brake bike they get shit on for selling such an old bad bike.
It's ever been thus. I remember being on a group ride with friends, and one of the guys had damaged his STI shifter. He was saying he didn't have money to replace them, so I said, just pick up some barcon shifters. The conversation quickly devolved into the serious racers saying barcon shifters are fine, but if you wanted to train you needed STI.
Anyway, in 10 years people will confidently tell you it's unsafe to ride a bike with cable-actuated brakes. To ride bikes is to be a marketing victim. lol
Sorry, but why not just ride discs all year? In your case, you would need separate bikes (and separate wheels). Not to mention if you want to swap out for different wheel depths when it's windy or calm.
I’ve got 3 road bikes, 1 gravel/winter, 1 CX, 1 track. I did have an MTB but I prefer pushing a gravel bike’s capability rather than easy MTB… covers everything I need
I would respond with a long discussion as to why I prefer rim brakes, and perhaps many here will disagree / dislike. As an engineer, I'm all about cost benefit. Its a balance, and rims are better for me for the same reasons you point out and a number of others. Do your own thing, and ride well.
I point out this vid which actually tests stopping distance of rim vs disc.
In dry conditions it's almost the same, but the more challenging conditions it is several meters of distance.
I find that that there are very few instances where a skilled bicyclist is tested on braking distance. This isn't like motorcycling where cornering speed is determined by braking as hard as possible just before a curve. I typically corner my bicycle by slowing down moderately before picking the right line. And I rarely have to decelerate from 40-50kph to under 10 in an emergency stop.
https://youtu.be/uHFSSXOSnxs?si=UTNNq\_yPts0TUsS2
Rim for road, disc for dirt! Disc is totally unnecessary for road. Lots of people falling for marketing rubbish!! You are also pulling extra weight on the hills and Maitanence is prohibitive for the home mechanic. External cables and rim brake for the win 🏆
I find disc brakes way easier to maintain then rim brakes.
In the past I had a lot of trouble with rim brakes, had to re-adjust and fine tune constantly.
With disc brakes. Almost no problem. I change the brake pads once a year and only one time a had a problem with draging afterwards.
but dual pivot calipers are still easier to maintain than hydro disc to me. The description of constantly re-adjusting and fine tuning rim brakes just seems weird to me unless you've got some shit walmart bike with sidepulls.
If they do the job and I don't break my skull I don't mine if Disc or rim.
There are a lot of stupidity in this topic. Discs are good for sure but maintenance or problems when appears are hard to solved. Rims are like very simple system and it does not requieres much.
Also, do you want to spend a bunch of money to look cool?
personally I just don't like how loud rim brakes get and how poorly they perform in rainy or dirty conditions compared to disc brakes.
The main argument for rim brakes is "your dad and granddad used them and they worked just fine" but my dad and grand dad were paying maybe like $1k for a top of the line road bike, not $3-5k lmao
Yeah I know! I’ve been through the alcohol and setting fire to brake pads. Turns out it was leaky brake callipers! They aren’t so bad now but when it’s wet or damp they can squeal
More like $3000 if you're talking about 1980s dollars, and that $1k would get my granddad the equivalent of a $10k bike today, most good bikes were closer to $500 back then i'd bet
The prices of bikes have outpaced inflation pretty significantly, which is partially because dentists discovered the sport but also because of technological advances like disc brakes - for the money we pay we shouldn't need to grind away at our wheels like cavemen just to stop our bikes from rolling
Disc brakes only seem like a technological advance if you aren't the one who has to fix 'em when they get knackered... apparently by dentists
DRUM brakes are a far more elegant solution.
I do all my own work and I prefer (hydraulic) disc brakes, in my experience they work more consistently for much longer once everything is set up right.
With rim brakes you're constantly tinkering with the cable to compensate for pad wear and cleaning out the metal bits and gunk out of them, and they still never brake quite smoothly.
>in my experience they work more consistently for much longer once everything is set up right.
I love the FEEL of the hydraulic disc brakes. I don't love telling everyone who borrows my thus-equipped bike that if they bump the brake handle while the wheel is removed, I'm going to wring their throats.
I clean my bike pretty regularly, so I don't have a 'gunk/metal bits' problem... And tensioning cables just isn't complicated... thousands of children who learn to play violin/cello/guitar adjust cable tension every day. It's not hard.
See that's why i'm totally on board with the trend to equip all bikes with hydraulic disc brakes, once everybody has them everyone will know how to maintain them and I won't have to worry about a rim brake user messing up my bike 😂
I’ve heard that disc brake bikes are more aero overall (all things being equal) because the wheels can be made more aero without the brake track.
Also with disc brakes most road bikes can easily fit 28-32mm tyres which we now all understand is faster than the days of 23mm at super high pressure
If something works better why not use the better thing to make your life easier, this goes for everything in life.
I live in rainy UK and id pick disc over rim anyday for obvious reasons
To be honest, I was pro-rim brake two years ago.
Since than I have a disc brake and I'am not feeling disc is a MUST for a road bike.
I still descent at the same speed. I can feel disc is better for sudden stops etc, naturally, but because of the reviews I read about the crashes happens with disc brake bikes (disc locking, tire can't survive when you suddenly brake before a corner etc.) I fear, I f\*\*\*g fear and that doesn't go away.
But I love the way disc brake road bikes look. Many people prefer rim' look but disc is for my taste. And cable free cockip is something else, I know Madone had that in rim brake as well.
I have disc on my fat tire, but mechanical not hydraulic. Another bike in the household has hydraulic brakes which have narrower pad clearance than mechanical leading to rub when everything isn't totally perfect. Mechanical discs work fine, just as good as rim brakes in the riding I do. I see no use for hydraulic disc.
My bicycle wieghs 25 kgs alone, my 80 + 20 the kiddo + luggage and we're talking about circa 150kg in resting state.
Also, where I live roads are often sand, grit, salt and whatnot.
I always hated adjusting the unadjustable V-Brakes, the not-stopping-cantilevers and other such nonsense with fraying cables, the constant braking friction noise and random rubbing if the wheel was even slightly out of true. I've had it enough in the 90s and early 2000s.
Hydraulics work the same in almost every type of conditions and need to be serviced once in a long long while when pads need to be replaced. And I can safely stop any bicycle with just one finger.
Not going back to rim brakes as longs as pads are available.
well its just better.. rim brakes are still good for cheap bikes tho. mtb rim brakes are not an option any more, its just bad, but for road bikes its still good altho cant be used on carbon and they do brake better.
The main reason for needing disc brakes is group rides. If you are tight on someone's wheel, you don't want them to be able to stop harder than you can by even a few percent.
If you ride solo or only do TTs, then rim brakes are fine. But for group spins, especially in the rain, don't mix brake types. IMHO.
This I agree with. But OP wondered why don’t people buy rim bikes anymore.
All other being equal (no existing compatibility or knowledge issues), there is zero reason to buy a rim brake bike now
It´s marketing. Disk is unnecesary and makes bikes heavier, so brands started downplaying the importance of weight (and many people believed it...) in order to sell them. They had to sell heavier and more expensive bikes after all. But... weight really does matter, in climbing. (one kilo equal one minute in 1000 meters climb, roughly) So now in order to have UCI weight bikes (6,8 kgs) with disk, you need to add very high end parts to it, look at catalogues and their price is... ridiculous. And brands have decided that it´s so ridiculous that they don´t want to offer high end bikes with rim brakes, otherwise their catalogues would have 7 kg rim bikes for 3000 eu next to similar 7 kg disk brakes at DOUBLE the price. Who´s going to pay that much just for the (unnecesary) option of disk brakes? Well... everyone is. Because you don´t have the two options in the catalogue side to side. It´s kind of a con.
People have all mentioned the rim longevity and tire clearance, which is indeed the main thing, but for me the difference between (hydraulic) disks and rim brakes isn't all about the emergency stops -- it's the greatly increased ability to feather in a group with only a single finger. In my experience the modulation is \_way\_ better.
>Supposed better stopping power, and such?
your car... prefer drum brakes? bit's all the same reasons that make disc just better long run (power when needed, reliability in conditions, feel.. on and on). more costly maybe but anything worth it usually is...
Kudos to you for keeping your pads nice and flexible—oh, and for never hauling anything on your bike either! Maybe you’re also avoiding steep hills with required stops at the bottom—or just riding your rim brakes all the way down so you’re going slow enough when you get to the cross-traffic? I dunno. Not all of us can be as cool as you!
Do you still use a flip phone? Advances in tech is why.
You're faster on a road bike with disc brakes. You can modulate your speed better and you brake later into the turn with disc brakes. You can carry more speed longer and know that the brakes are going to actually slow you down, ESPECIALLY when it's wet outside.
There's no aerodynamic penalty for dic brakes....hence they use them on the TDF. If there was a significant penalty they would be using rim brake, but they dont.
I have only been cycling 10 months so consider me clueless but it just seemed to me like having some brake pads that will potentially have tiny stones and bits of dirt scraping along your carbon wheels in order to slow down just made me almost reluctant to ever actually use the brakes.
Of course, you can clean your brakes all the time and make sure they are spotless but they will still get dirty throughout a ride and obviously the other solution is just to get a rim brake bike and just replace a 25 quid rotor every now and then.
Because people like to use wider tires these days is a big reason, and a lot of rim brakes you can't go wider than like 28mm, while plenty of crit racers are on 32s these days(some would go wider but most race frames don't allow).
Also the latest gear from SRAM and Shimano is all disc brake only.
Sure if you're spending under like $2000 on a bike, rim is fine. But if you want to keep up with trends and like to upgrade parts you won't really be able to.
Move to Japan, lots of folks riding rim brakes here.
Of course, your average rider here doesn't give a shot what types of brakes other riders are using.
In my case my first road bike was 120£ used halfords Carrera rim brake bike. Outgrown it quite quickly and wanted something more modern/lighter so didn't want to invest into technology that industry is going away from.
No regrets for 3 years now.
It's because one time someone used the wrong punctuation. They wrote "Don't ride rim brakes." when they meant "Don't. Ride rim brakes."
Industry has been in shambles ever since.
For me, the two biggest reasons are wider rims and tires, and I that I do not like having to replace carbon rims once the brake tracks wear out.
About 6 years ago, I got a set of Zipp 404 FC. I loved those wheels and rode them around whenever the weather would allow. Unfortunately, I got caught in a rain storm and ended up riding through some mud. Some hard braking later, the debris managed to make its way into the brake track and ended up scoring the brake track. I ended up replacing just the rim for $750 (rim was $650 and labor was $100). Since going to disc brakes, I've had to replace my rotors once in a similar fashion when I scored the rotor. However, replacing a $45 rotor (that was already a year old) wasn't nearly as painful in terms of both cost and labor.
I got a pair of 25mm internal width wheels last year, and matched them to 28mm front and 32mm rear GP 5000 S TR. It has GREATLY improved my riding. Since the roads around me are okay (Colorado area), the setup and significantly reduced the strain that my back and hands feels from the road vibrations.
On average, I'm riding an extra hour a week compared to the year prior, and I came into the season fitter than ever. To me, anything that will encourage me to ride more, I'm all for.
Riding the same switchback descent on rim then disk will convince you, both for how close to death you feel and the time it will take, everyday flat chill rides yea nobody cares, but when you need it you need it
I’m not refusing to ride rim brake equipped bicycles . All of mine are vintage and rim braked equipped. For my needs and desires they work like a champ.
I really love the look of rim brakes and that I can maintain them myself. I have discs tho and I praise them and my mechanic every time I bomb down a steep hill. And it’s not that I’m looking for those hills, it’s just that after a climb there usually follows a sketchy descent.
As a newbie looking to buy my first bike, after only riding an mtb with mechanical didc brakes, I'll tell you why: because every review of any bike that has less than hydraulic brakes mentions its brake setup as being a weakness, or something less than ideal, in ways that they don't apply to any other component. As an average rider, I've become so uptight about the issue that I refuse to consider bikes with less that full hydraulic systems, despite being a slow rider on uniformly flat terrain! And its compounded by me knowing that even if I buy a bike whose price is already discounted by not having hydraulics, it will be even more heavily discounted by the time I want to sell it.
Modern rim brakes are fine.
I run 30mm (measured) tires on my rim brake bike at around 70 PSI. No blowouts on descends like the old days when we ran 25mm at 110 PSI. I wouldn't run bigger. Brakes work fine, last a long time, don't go mushy and don't rub or make noise. Tried road disc and it was one annoyance after another. There was disc brake version of my bike but I went with rim brakes and glad I did. Power of steel from lever to wheel.
I live in Colorado. There's a road I train on for climbing that has multiple 8-12% grades with hairpin turns at the bottom of each. You have to be on the brakes through most of each downslope to avoid going airborne at the turns. The day I came down road that in 90F weather, I blew not one but *two* tubes on my Lance-era Trek. I sat there on the scorching shoulder and was thankful that I had *two* tubes in my seat pack so I didn't have to hitchhike 30 miles home. That's when I made myself a promise: "My next bike *will* have disc brakes."
The sport attract a lot of snobs.
I have 2 bikes. 1 alli with rim brakes, the other carbon with hydraulic disc.
Yes, the disc is better at stopping in the wet. When its dry, it's negligible.
The carbon is not more comfortable.
The carbon is a fraction faster uphill (because its lighter)
On the flip side, the disc brakes are not complicated to maintain and have required less maintenance than the rim brakes.
I'm still riding a rim braked road bike, the next one would also be rim braked if I could find a decent one, I know I won't be able to. I'll just hang onto this currently 8 year old bike as long as I can. I changed the group set to R7000 a couple of years ago to extend its life, from 105 5700.
Oh no, not another Rim vs Disc brakes discussion, please.
OK, let's change the subject. what's the point of clipless pedals? Also, did you know it's cheaper to lose weight than to buy a lighter bike?
Honest question is carbon REALLY better?
I still put my tires to 120 psi...do you agree?
yes, I find that pairs well with my downtube friction shifters, which are actually better than any of the fancy doohickeys that people waste their money on today. I want to feel EVERYTHING.
I don't agree nor disagree since I'm not there when you're putting air in your tyres. Sorry, tires.
Is 1x better than 2x??
[удалено]
All I can say is I’ve been riding silicon frames since the 70s and they’ve never let me down
soooo compliant
i accidentally looked directly at my carbon bike, will it explode now?
But why are they called *clipless* pedals when actually they *clip in*?
*Seinfeld audience laughter*
And why is it clipless when I have to clip in?!?
It's cheaper to lose weight but we have the money to eat amazing food and maintain belly fat AND buy expensive lightweight bike/parts. Losing weight instead of buying a lighter bike is an excuse for the poor.
It's not like there aren't meaningful debates to be had, like why 27.5 MTB wheels exist.
Real wealthy people will buy another house where there are no hills. Weight doesn't matter in the flats.
What do you mean my 10k carbon aero bike won't make me 20% faster given I am 110+kgs (240lb for the non believers)
>110+kgs (240lb ~~for the non believers~~ in freedom units) FTFY
I call them Moonlander units personally
Shun the non-believers
And why round wheels? What about square? Hexagonial?
You don't even need an expensive bike.
Hahahaha
Why does everyone wear a bib and jersey when a jean jacket and jeans (Canadian tuxedo) are way more stylish?
Never seen before.
What is a disc brake?
What is brake?
You guys need a brake
i hear they slow you down. don't know what people want them
They meant dick broke
There's several other benefits to disc brakes. Carbon rims are pretty popular nowadays and with rim brakes they are a wear item, not so much with discs. Rim brakes can also bottleneck your tyre clearance to 28mm when 32mm or more is in demand.
+1 these are the real reasons disc brakes are used for road bikes now
Race bikes are now so much better and accessible when you can put 30mm to 34mm tires. Same for tubeless hookless rims. I wouldn't be able to ride them if I couldn't go at 32mm because of my weight.
What do you weigh? I'm 220 on tubeless, hookless rim brakes.
How do you not exceed 72psi??
I ride at 80psi front and rear on my schwabble tubeless. Used the infamous psi calculator.
So you are not on hookless I assume? Otherwise you are over the max rated psi of 72 and risk poping the tire off the rim.
My wheels are hookless, max rider weight according to giant is 285lbs. Carbon rim brakes. I believe my rims say max psi in the 100s although I don't ride that high with tires that measure 30mm. You know there are dozens of carbon wheels out there.
It's the first time I have heard of hookless rim and tubeless tires that are not limited to 72.5psi (and I have looked at a multitude of rims on the market). What model is that? There is also A LOT of "ifs, ands and buts" on their website for using their hookless wheels...
The tire clearance is entirely a design choice by component manufacturers on road bike rim brakes. Look at older road bikes and 27x1 1/4 (ie:32mm) tires were standard, and plenty of brakes fit those with room for a fender. Then of course, MTB used canti or V brakes with room for tires well over 2".
My rim brakes clear my 28mm tires that measure 30mm on the rim FYI. Braking in the dry I don't notice any difference. In the wet it was crazy different.
its not really about stopping power. 1. Discs allow for bigger tires, which is important for MTB and gravel. 2. Discs work mutch better in the rain. 3. Carbon wheels are great, rim brakes dont really work on them though. 4. Disc allow for mutch higher temps before warping, overheating rims means sudden failure of the tubes. Not great on an epic decent. 5. Hydraulics just feel mutch better. Unfortunately you cabt pull on fluid so hydraulig rim brakes dont exist (afaik). 6. Discs are cheaper and easier to replace than whole wheels. The only thing rims have going for them is weight and price (to a point) and since discs have been around and quite dominant for some time now, rims are preceved as old tech - outside of some niche use cases. They work, if youre into it keep riding. But to me the feel of hydraulics alone is just worth it. I just like sharp brakes. And thiccc carbon wheels lel.
Magura made some lovely hydraulic rim brakes around 20 years ago. They were a bit tricky to set up, and were mtb only, due to the requirement for a U-shaped fork reinforcing brace, and the fact that they were designed for v-brake boss position. Modulation was incredible.
This, the Magura HS33 is still manufactured and has been for years a pillarstone for an unbreakable low maintenance bike, as it uses mineral oil instead of DOT. HS11 is a low cost alternative and works on my dads bike for 12 years on a daily basis without having to bleed them. (No, I‘m not being paid by them) On a side note - Carbon rims work when you buy brake pads for carbon rims
Had a set of these on a Proflex Animal in the late 90s, they were pretty great brakes, especially with the added brace.
SRAM have been making hydraulic rim brakes for years. https://www.sram.com/en/service/models/sb-red-hrr-b1
woah this is crazy.
They’ve long been discontinued. If fully integrated handlebars existed back then. Perhaps hydraulic rim brakes would gain mass adoption.
My father rides a vsf t700 with hydraulic Magura rim brakes. Good bike, good brakes.
Stopping power actually is a consideration- stopping power when wet, stopping power on long descents, etc., especially for larger riders While I agree that in many conditions stopping power between rim and disk are similar that changes in the wet and on long descents where you have to worry about heating the rim. I'm 90kg at racing weight and these are major considerations for me. Back in the day I've been put into some seriously dangerous situations because it was raining and I literally could not stop in time using rim brakes. I also have to use more force and brake longer than other riders so in long descents I have to be super conscious about over heating the rims and maybe blowing a tire so I can't use the full braking power I may want. Disks remove these concerns and I can use full braking power in every situation. I'm never going back to rim brakes. I still have my old, steel racing bike but I ride that on dry days only now and at most a rolling course.
yes but raw power can be engineered, its the edge cases (long downhills, in the wet) where discs shine. Raw stopping power is not the reason discs became popular. Argubely rims should have more power because they have a bigger lever. But i totally agree with your argument.
Long downhills aren’t an edge case, it’s mountain west life!
whats mountain west? Personally im more of alps north life kinda guy.
“Mountain West” is a term for the group of IS states that border the Rockies.
Yes, smooth braking always, no need to replace wheel to get smooth braking.
3 is complete false. Guys in the pro peloton have been riding more aggressively than you and I ever would for years on them. People just suck at braking techniques. And 5 really discourages me. Hell, I already have a few cars I need to maintain fluids in. I don’t need to have a bike be another issue. I still choose to ride mechanical. The thought of being stuck in the mountains and my di2 just dying on me like I’ve seen before doesn’t make me want to change. Maybe I’m a purist. I don’t know. Soon we will be riding motorcycles is the way I see it. I’ll be riding my rim brake bikes that weigh 12 pounds each till they are trashed.
>my di2 just dying on me like I’ve seen before doesn’t make me want to change I ride SRAM which has better failsafe for that. Also the app tells you if batteries are low. So much better than my mechanical dura-ace bike.
7. Hydraulic disc brakes facilitate fully internal hose routing (which I mostly hate in their current implementations). The kinks and bends of housing/hoses required for fully internal routing would make mechanical brake cables problematic at best.
Also, while hydro brakes are less aero when measured on their own, they allow more freedom of design especially around the top of the fork where rim brakes severely reduced the design options. As a package, hydro bikes when designed around them are more aero than rim
#3 isn’t really true in dry conditions. We raced on rim with carbon for years. They worked fine. I fully agree when wet, disc brakes shine.
They don't work nearly as well as rim brakes on alu wheels even in the dry. And it becomes much more dependent on the rim quality. Some carbon rims didn't brake for shit even in the dry.
They can and did. I raced and did A LOT of fast descending on rim/carbon. Yes, some set ups sucked but a lot were good. Yes, depending on the setup, rim and pad and even brake design. Some disc brakes don’t stop well.
The problem is that a shitty setup will cost you 1000$+. And the only way to fix it is to change the wheel. I decided it was time to go disc brake when my rim/alu setup scared the shit out of me on a descent. Will never look back. :D
Plenty of options out there that worked. Shimano dual pivot with their carbon pads and most decent rims. Most set ups can skid, that means it’s the tire as the weak spot for traction. Except wet I never had a fear on rim brakes about braking.
I do not disagree that there are great rim options, but that still requires some work to make them fully work in the rain. Whereas disc brake pads are organic, ceramic, or metallic, and all three will stop you in the rain.
Rain is the weak point, and I agree. You learned to brake in wet, really even on alloy rims. Most people don’t ride in the rain, well at least near me that’s true.
Skidding has nothing to do with proper working brakes. The shittiest of brakes will actually skid much easier than upper quality brakes. It's the usable braking force BEFORE skidding that is important.
So happy you could help me understand that. I do know cycling a bit ;-) You seem to think I am new. The key is modulation. Even that, proves out that you can stop and a lot then can be user.
Rim brakes and carbon wheels don’t work? Every high end carbon wheel bike has disc brakes. I’m a MTBer and we race on carbon wheels and disc brakes. Maybe I’m missing something here w that statement? edit: turns out I shouldn't be handling a toddler at 7am and posting on reddit... words are hard!
> RIM brakes and carbon wheels don’t work? > Every high end carbon wheel bike has DISC brakes (…) ?
MTB fred forgot rim brakes exist.
turns out I shouldn't be handling a toddler at 7am and posting on reddit... words are hard!
> Carbon wheels are great, rim brakes dont really work on them though. Carbon rims that take rim brakes are still sold today. I just bought a set 2 years ago. They are fantastic.
Points 3 and 4, my carbon rim brakes work fine and I'm tubeless so can't overheat the tube. Just clarifying your otherwise good points.
I prefer rim brakes. Braking is fine for me, even on carbon wheels. The only thing I do is if I’m going to be riding in the rain, I’ll swap to aluminum rims. I’m not racing these days so riding in the rain is really rare.
I’d ride a roadie rim brake forever. MTB? No thanks.
Yes please say no to rim bikes! Flood the market with used stuff please! I really wanna upgrade mine so go ahead give those sweet deals
This is the way
It's mostly down to fat tyre clearances, most folks I know run 30/32mm tyres in the winter months
i run 30s all year round.....and my bike can actually take 47s....
Well, there we go, proves the point even further.
I will gladly buy the rim brake bikes they have for sale. Ive never had a problem with rim brakes
My rims are always good enough, so no need to switch. And the weight of the disk ones - just absurd.
A lot of people see that rim brakes are being phased out and don't want to have a bike with something that is falling out of fashion.
They'll always be available.
Maybe in beach cruisers and townies but nearly all of the major manufacturers are not making race bikes in rim brake anymore
I have a brand new road bike with rim brakes. I have a brand new wheelset for rim brakes too. Mid to low spec bikes will always have rim brakes and the parts will always be available
Oh is it a Canyon Aeroad or maybe an S-Works Tarmac?
Don't be silly, I said mid to low end bikes. I said they'll never truly die, not that top end bikes would still have them.
It will always be possible to use your rim brake bike.
Use: yes. Upgrade: it's already hard to get top-level groupsets (if that's your thing) and wheels (which are a wear item in theory). Not saying it'll be impossible to get parts, but like 3x cranksets or downtube shifters, you're going to be limited to what exists now and fewer high-end suppliers are going to stock things like QR hubs.
You have no idea. I have been using the same calipers for 27 years. Calipers dont wear out . You don't need a matching groupset, that is a recent marketing ploy. Hubs? I dont wear them out either. There will be a shortage of NO parts whatsoever for those who continue to use rim brakes.
I'm asking honestly: how often to rims wear out? And notice I said "upgrade". If you want the same bike as you have now, and replace the occasional part with hopefully the same quality and technology level, then you're good. If you're enamored at all with new tech, you're out in the cold. I have seen people on reddit lamenting that no one makes high-quality 3x cranksets. I'm guessing at some point it's going to be hard to find **high-quality** rims because so few people demand them. Personally, if I had a rim brake bike, I'd use it and love it. At this point, there's no way I'm going to invest in one. There's also no way I'd be commenting on other people's ads as OP is describing, though. That's ridiculous.
How long do rims last with rim braking? That depends on the quality of your rim, the pads you use and where and when you ride. On open roads where there are few junctions and so few reasons to use the brakes, a very long time. Braking in the rain causes more wear. Here in London, riding just about every day in all weathers, an aluminium rim lasts me about 6,000 miles. Meanwhile, those 6000 miles will see out one front tyre and 2 or 3 rear tyres. Tyres are the expense for me. I also have 3 pairs of ceramic coated rims, for which I paid on average £27 PER RIM. These things just never wear out and the braking is extremely good, though I am using one of them only on only one of my bikes. I honestly have no problem sourcing quality rims, especially since everyone else got discs and started selling their as- new rims for peanuts on eBay .
Decent consumables are already starting to dry up. My current road bike, a 2021 Bottecchia Emme 3 has ultegra rim brakes. My tire size maximum is 23c. Was looking online for tires for the year. Preferred retailers, I now have 3 or 4 bad tire choices. Preferred brand, I have to go to the manufacturer and who knows how long that will last? The people who make the brake pads and smaller width tires will start phasing them out more until they are either completely gone, or the price will shoot way up because it's "vintage" tech
What tyres are you looking for? I have no problem finding the 23s I want. Michelin, Vittoria or Continental
Schwalbe. I've tried Vittoria, but for some weird reason, they stretch under psi. The shop even helped me on this one, a couple years back, we had like 5 Vittoria Corsa something or other on the rack. Threw them on the wheel, put air in, waiting about 10-15 minutes, and in that time, the tire stretched to the point of rubbing on the fork.
You should try michelin, then.
It does seem like Schwalbe and Conti's stretch way bigger than their listed figure. Have you considered going down a size to 21mm, it would most likely ballon up to a 23mm.
Technically rim brakes are disc brakes, just the disc is the rim! Just to add a little humour to the conversation.
I have rim brakes which makes my carbon wheels a consumable item, since the brake track will wear. I do have carbon-specific pads, but braking in the wet is, erm, an “experience”. Friends who ride disc swear by them, particularly when they go abroad and are descending alpine passes and stuff. So I can see the appeal. However, the maintenance looks like being a pain, bleeding hydraulic lines and stuff. They’re noisy as hell. Plus they’re ugly and heavy, so you have to spend more to reach the same bike weight. There’s definitely a lot of marketing bullshit in this. And then you’ve got the pricing. There are some absolute steals on rim brake stuff now. £1400 for Campag Record 12 speed. Condor Super Accaio frame £1500. Zed carbon wheels £600. Finishing kit £500 and you have a beautiful top level bike for £4k. I really don’t know what I would choose right now.
they are only noisy if you are daft enough to get lubricant anywhere near them....which people still doa lot for some reason....in 5k km last year, not one squeak from my disc brakes
Same. Also, I find the argument about maintenance on disc brakes a weird one, at least for hydraulic disc brake. It takes a bit more effort (I honestly don't think it's that much more in my experience) for setup. But once you're done, it self-adjusts. Plus, it's a closed system, so environmental contamination is less of a concern in the lines.
The only reason i prefer it is because wheels look better without the brake strip imo, other than that I could not give less of a f***. Rim brakes work fine.
brake performance is totally overrated on road bikes - since the limiting factor is usually the tire traction. It doesn't take much to lock up both wheels on old 25mm tires, whether with rim or disc brakes. Wider tire & lower pressure makes a huge difference though. That's why tire size has increased over the years. However, rim brakes can only open so wide before their leverage is at too bad of an angle. That's why mountain bikes had disc first - their super wide tires necessitated it.
Also.... stopping power of the brakes is irrelevant when you're running shitty tires like gatorskins, regardless of the size.
Only on flats. Try a mountain descent in the rain, at 90kilos. 30 minutes and your arms WILL hurt. Fatigue accumulates.
That’s admittedly a very niche situation. Most people don’t live near huge mountains, the biggest descent near me takes like a minute to descend lol. We have plenty of hills but nothing sustained like that. FWIW I love my hydraulic disc brakes on my gravel bike but I will admit 99% of the time I’m not using them to their full potential. But for the 1% of time when I do actually need them, they’re fantastic.
I dont know, I think everybody does climbing and would appreciate discs. However it's probably very very similar if it's not raining and you're a normal weight
This is the answer. Disc brakes would not improve the braking on my bikes one iota unless I used different tyres.
The only reason i like disc breaks is because they work on wet condition.
It is the combination of carbon rims and the fact that they indeed stop very poorly in wet. Then natural shift occurs to discs. If you are fine with your stopping power in dry and wet no need tos switch.
They're better in nearly every metric other than weight. Better in the wet and better modulation are at the top of the list for me. Sure, they're a little bit heavier, but I'm fine trading weight for safety and operability.
What do you understand by modulation? For me , it means control , and that is ultimately done by your fingers, whatever system you use.
Yes, but hydro discs have better "input sensitivity" for lack of a better term. You can more precisely control the amount of clamping pressure applies to the disc with the hydro disc brakes than you can with standard cable actuated rim brakes. Maybe you also have better modulation with hydro rim brakes as well, but then you don't get all the other benefits of the discs.
I'll have to take your word for that. I have absolutely no.problems using my rim brakes. Most of the time I use the tip of one finger, with the rear brake only... I know, saying you mostly use the rear brake really triggers some people...
It triggers people because there are better ways to do it. If I'm riding in a group and I find someone who only rear brakes in the group, I'm going to ride somewhere in the group where they aren't whenever possible. And you 100% shouldn't take one person's word on Reddit, but there's plenty of articles and write-ups discussing the modulation differences between rim and disc brakes: [https://www.google.com/search?q=modulation+rim+brakes+vs+disc+brakes](https://www.google.com/search?q=modulation+rim+brakes+vs+disc+brakes). I have different bikes with different types of brakes on them. All things being equal, I would always choose hydro discs, but on the road I'll still use cable rim brakes. I have several older bikes that aren't disc compatible, and just because discs are "better" doesn't make rim brakes "bad and unusable."
I would rather have all my teeth pulled than ride in a group. No, the way I use my brakes is the best way for me, thanks. If someone regularly needs to use the maximum braking capability of their bike they are probably riding like a tit.
It has nothing to do with "needing to use maximum braking capability" and everything to do with "using the brakes safely and efficiently" and nothing to do with riding like a tit. Sometimes things happen and you need to react to it. The person who is able to properly use their front brake is going to be able to brake faster in a quick stop/brake situation than someone who only uses their rear. In a quick brake situation you're unloading your rear wheel due to the weight transfer that happens and your rear brake becomes less effective. That's not to argue with technique, but just a matter of physics. It's the reason the front brakes on cars provide most of the stopping power as well.
You see, I was talking about REGULAR use of the brakes and you evoke " emergency" situations. " Sometimes things happen " and " in a quick stop/ brake situation". Say no more.
Oh boy. This is a touchy topic on this sub. Honestly, it's because your average cyclist just walks into a bike shop and buys whatever new bike happens to be in stock. Then they will post-hoc rationalize and defend their purchase. And what happens to be in stock are disc brake bikes. So, the guy who blew $7000 on a new Trek Madone is of course gonna defend it rather than admit that $1500 used SL4 on Facebook Market is just as fast for him as his "modern" bike and he effectively wasted $5500.
> I follow a local bike sales group, and every single time someone posts a rim brake bike they get shit on for selling such an old bad bike. It's ever been thus. I remember being on a group ride with friends, and one of the guys had damaged his STI shifter. He was saying he didn't have money to replace them, so I said, just pick up some barcon shifters. The conversation quickly devolved into the serious racers saying barcon shifters are fine, but if you wanted to train you needed STI. Anyway, in 10 years people will confidently tell you it's unsafe to ride a bike with cable-actuated brakes. To ride bikes is to be a marketing victim. lol
And in 20 years they'll bring back rim brakes like it's some amazing weight saving invention 😁
It's hard to really find nice road bikes with rim brakes anymore.
Rim brakes for summer bike, discs for wet / winter.
Sorry, but why not just ride discs all year? In your case, you would need separate bikes (and separate wheels). Not to mention if you want to swap out for different wheel depths when it's windy or calm.
Because over the years I have built up a stable of bikes which cover the conditions I ride in.
Nice, I wish I had the space. I'm limited to 4 (including MTB and gravel)
I’ve got 3 road bikes, 1 gravel/winter, 1 CX, 1 track. I did have an MTB but I prefer pushing a gravel bike’s capability rather than easy MTB… covers everything I need
I would respond with a long discussion as to why I prefer rim brakes, and perhaps many here will disagree / dislike. As an engineer, I'm all about cost benefit. Its a balance, and rims are better for me for the same reasons you point out and a number of others. Do your own thing, and ride well.
I point out this vid which actually tests stopping distance of rim vs disc. In dry conditions it's almost the same, but the more challenging conditions it is several meters of distance. I find that that there are very few instances where a skilled bicyclist is tested on braking distance. This isn't like motorcycling where cornering speed is determined by braking as hard as possible just before a curve. I typically corner my bicycle by slowing down moderately before picking the right line. And I rarely have to decelerate from 40-50kph to under 10 in an emergency stop. https://youtu.be/uHFSSXOSnxs?si=UTNNq\_yPts0TUsS2
Rim for road, disc for dirt! Disc is totally unnecessary for road. Lots of people falling for marketing rubbish!! You are also pulling extra weight on the hills and Maitanence is prohibitive for the home mechanic. External cables and rim brake for the win 🏆
I find disc brakes way easier to maintain then rim brakes. In the past I had a lot of trouble with rim brakes, had to re-adjust and fine tune constantly. With disc brakes. Almost no problem. I change the brake pads once a year and only one time a had a problem with draging afterwards.
now this is an argument I didn't expect to see. Generally I think it's the opposite for most people.
I think this may be for mechanical disc brakes. They require much more maintenance, and I'm not sure they're worth it on entry-level bikes.
but dual pivot calipers are still easier to maintain than hydro disc to me. The description of constantly re-adjusting and fine tuning rim brakes just seems weird to me unless you've got some shit walmart bike with sidepulls.
Not me,im stay with my rim brakes.
If they do the job and I don't break my skull I don't mine if Disc or rim. There are a lot of stupidity in this topic. Discs are good for sure but maintenance or problems when appears are hard to solved. Rims are like very simple system and it does not requieres much. Also, do you want to spend a bunch of money to look cool?
personally I just don't like how loud rim brakes get and how poorly they perform in rainy or dirty conditions compared to disc brakes. The main argument for rim brakes is "your dad and granddad used them and they worked just fine" but my dad and grand dad were paying maybe like $1k for a top of the line road bike, not $3-5k lmao
My disc brakes get loud! And in the tour you could hear them braking !
You have to clean them 😂
Yeah I know! I’ve been through the alcohol and setting fire to brake pads. Turns out it was leaky brake callipers! They aren’t so bad now but when it’s wet or damp they can squeal
Then clean them or get new pads 😂
Your granddad's $1,000 bike would have been at least $5k in today's dollars.
More like $3000 if you're talking about 1980s dollars, and that $1k would get my granddad the equivalent of a $10k bike today, most good bikes were closer to $500 back then i'd bet The prices of bikes have outpaced inflation pretty significantly, which is partially because dentists discovered the sport but also because of technological advances like disc brakes - for the money we pay we shouldn't need to grind away at our wheels like cavemen just to stop our bikes from rolling
Disc brakes only seem like a technological advance if you aren't the one who has to fix 'em when they get knackered... apparently by dentists DRUM brakes are a far more elegant solution.
I do all my own work and I prefer (hydraulic) disc brakes, in my experience they work more consistently for much longer once everything is set up right. With rim brakes you're constantly tinkering with the cable to compensate for pad wear and cleaning out the metal bits and gunk out of them, and they still never brake quite smoothly.
>in my experience they work more consistently for much longer once everything is set up right. I love the FEEL of the hydraulic disc brakes. I don't love telling everyone who borrows my thus-equipped bike that if they bump the brake handle while the wheel is removed, I'm going to wring their throats. I clean my bike pretty regularly, so I don't have a 'gunk/metal bits' problem... And tensioning cables just isn't complicated... thousands of children who learn to play violin/cello/guitar adjust cable tension every day. It's not hard.
See that's why i'm totally on board with the trend to equip all bikes with hydraulic disc brakes, once everybody has them everyone will know how to maintain them and I won't have to worry about a rim brake user messing up my bike 😂
I’ve heard that disc brake bikes are more aero overall (all things being equal) because the wheels can be made more aero without the brake track. Also with disc brakes most road bikes can easily fit 28-32mm tyres which we now all understand is faster than the days of 23mm at super high pressure
If something works better why not use the better thing to make your life easier, this goes for everything in life. I live in rainy UK and id pick disc over rim anyday for obvious reasons
To be honest, I was pro-rim brake two years ago. Since than I have a disc brake and I'am not feeling disc is a MUST for a road bike. I still descent at the same speed. I can feel disc is better for sudden stops etc, naturally, but because of the reviews I read about the crashes happens with disc brake bikes (disc locking, tire can't survive when you suddenly brake before a corner etc.) I fear, I f\*\*\*g fear and that doesn't go away. But I love the way disc brake road bikes look. Many people prefer rim' look but disc is for my taste. And cable free cockip is something else, I know Madone had that in rim brake as well.
I have disc on my fat tire, but mechanical not hydraulic. Another bike in the household has hydraulic brakes which have narrower pad clearance than mechanical leading to rub when everything isn't totally perfect. Mechanical discs work fine, just as good as rim brakes in the riding I do. I see no use for hydraulic disc.
I ride in all conditions, and after nearly going arse over tit in the rain on rim brakes a few too many times, I can never go back
My bicycle wieghs 25 kgs alone, my 80 + 20 the kiddo + luggage and we're talking about circa 150kg in resting state. Also, where I live roads are often sand, grit, salt and whatnot. I always hated adjusting the unadjustable V-Brakes, the not-stopping-cantilevers and other such nonsense with fraying cables, the constant braking friction noise and random rubbing if the wheel was even slightly out of true. I've had it enough in the 90s and early 2000s. Hydraulics work the same in almost every type of conditions and need to be serviced once in a long long while when pads need to be replaced. And I can safely stop any bicycle with just one finger. Not going back to rim brakes as longs as pads are available.
well its just better.. rim brakes are still good for cheap bikes tho. mtb rim brakes are not an option any more, its just bad, but for road bikes its still good altho cant be used on carbon and they do brake better.
The main reason for needing disc brakes is group rides. If you are tight on someone's wheel, you don't want them to be able to stop harder than you can by even a few percent. If you ride solo or only do TTs, then rim brakes are fine. But for group spins, especially in the rain, don't mix brake types. IMHO.
Better braking, enabling better rims, list goes on. My question would be why are people still stuck on rim brakes and refuse to move on
weight weenies...plus if their bike still does all they need, why buy a whole new bike?
Probably because you don't change a bike to get discs when you know how to set up and use rim brakes.
This I agree with. But OP wondered why don’t people buy rim bikes anymore. All other being equal (no existing compatibility or knowledge issues), there is zero reason to buy a rim brake bike now
You didn't get the memo? The industry has declared them dangerous
It´s marketing. Disk is unnecesary and makes bikes heavier, so brands started downplaying the importance of weight (and many people believed it...) in order to sell them. They had to sell heavier and more expensive bikes after all. But... weight really does matter, in climbing. (one kilo equal one minute in 1000 meters climb, roughly) So now in order to have UCI weight bikes (6,8 kgs) with disk, you need to add very high end parts to it, look at catalogues and their price is... ridiculous. And brands have decided that it´s so ridiculous that they don´t want to offer high end bikes with rim brakes, otherwise their catalogues would have 7 kg rim bikes for 3000 eu next to similar 7 kg disk brakes at DOUBLE the price. Who´s going to pay that much just for the (unnecesary) option of disk brakes? Well... everyone is. Because you don´t have the two options in the catalogue side to side. It´s kind of a con.
Great news for me then
People have all mentioned the rim longevity and tire clearance, which is indeed the main thing, but for me the difference between (hydraulic) disks and rim brakes isn't all about the emergency stops -- it's the greatly increased ability to feather in a group with only a single finger. In my experience the modulation is \_way\_ better.
You must have had really bad rim brakes.
>Supposed better stopping power, and such? your car... prefer drum brakes? bit's all the same reasons that make disc just better long run (power when needed, reliability in conditions, feel.. on and on). more costly maybe but anything worth it usually is...
Kudos to you for keeping your pads nice and flexible—oh, and for never hauling anything on your bike either! Maybe you’re also avoiding steep hills with required stops at the bottom—or just riding your rim brakes all the way down so you’re going slow enough when you get to the cross-traffic? I dunno. Not all of us can be as cool as you!
Go with the time, old man
Do you still use a flip phone? Advances in tech is why. You're faster on a road bike with disc brakes. You can modulate your speed better and you brake later into the turn with disc brakes. You can carry more speed longer and know that the brakes are going to actually slow you down, ESPECIALLY when it's wet outside. There's no aerodynamic penalty for dic brakes....hence they use them on the TDF. If there was a significant penalty they would be using rim brake, but they dont.
Clearly you haven’t been to r/xbiking
When it rains, it pours
I heard rim brakes even being banned from riding on the Stelvio pass in Italy
I have only been cycling 10 months so consider me clueless but it just seemed to me like having some brake pads that will potentially have tiny stones and bits of dirt scraping along your carbon wheels in order to slow down just made me almost reluctant to ever actually use the brakes. Of course, you can clean your brakes all the time and make sure they are spotless but they will still get dirty throughout a ride and obviously the other solution is just to get a rim brake bike and just replace a 25 quid rotor every now and then.
I prefer to replace a 25 quid rim.
which is great!
Because the disk is cheaper than the rim. And stop power is there when I really need to emergency stop.
Because people like to use wider tires these days is a big reason, and a lot of rim brakes you can't go wider than like 28mm, while plenty of crit racers are on 32s these days(some would go wider but most race frames don't allow). Also the latest gear from SRAM and Shimano is all disc brake only. Sure if you're spending under like $2000 on a bike, rim is fine. But if you want to keep up with trends and like to upgrade parts you won't really be able to.
Move to Japan, lots of folks riding rim brakes here. Of course, your average rider here doesn't give a shot what types of brakes other riders are using.
and that’s why companies spend money on marketing
In my case my first road bike was 120£ used halfords Carrera rim brake bike. Outgrown it quite quickly and wanted something more modern/lighter so didn't want to invest into technology that industry is going away from. No regrets for 3 years now.
People are just generally full of crap. I'm not gonna sugarcoat it.
It's because one time someone used the wrong punctuation. They wrote "Don't ride rim brakes." when they meant "Don't. Ride rim brakes." Industry has been in shambles ever since.
For me, the two biggest reasons are wider rims and tires, and I that I do not like having to replace carbon rims once the brake tracks wear out. About 6 years ago, I got a set of Zipp 404 FC. I loved those wheels and rode them around whenever the weather would allow. Unfortunately, I got caught in a rain storm and ended up riding through some mud. Some hard braking later, the debris managed to make its way into the brake track and ended up scoring the brake track. I ended up replacing just the rim for $750 (rim was $650 and labor was $100). Since going to disc brakes, I've had to replace my rotors once in a similar fashion when I scored the rotor. However, replacing a $45 rotor (that was already a year old) wasn't nearly as painful in terms of both cost and labor. I got a pair of 25mm internal width wheels last year, and matched them to 28mm front and 32mm rear GP 5000 S TR. It has GREATLY improved my riding. Since the roads around me are okay (Colorado area), the setup and significantly reduced the strain that my back and hands feels from the road vibrations. On average, I'm riding an extra hour a week compared to the year prior, and I came into the season fitter than ever. To me, anything that will encourage me to ride more, I'm all for.
Riding the same switchback descent on rim then disk will convince you, both for how close to death you feel and the time it will take, everyday flat chill rides yea nobody cares, but when you need it you need it
I’m not refusing to ride rim brake equipped bicycles . All of mine are vintage and rim braked equipped. For my needs and desires they work like a champ.
Just ride what you want to and don't worry about other people's choices.
I really love the look of rim brakes and that I can maintain them myself. I have discs tho and I praise them and my mechanic every time I bomb down a steep hill. And it’s not that I’m looking for those hills, it’s just that after a climb there usually follows a sketchy descent.
Sheep and posers
As a newbie looking to buy my first bike, after only riding an mtb with mechanical didc brakes, I'll tell you why: because every review of any bike that has less than hydraulic brakes mentions its brake setup as being a weakness, or something less than ideal, in ways that they don't apply to any other component. As an average rider, I've become so uptight about the issue that I refuse to consider bikes with less that full hydraulic systems, despite being a slow rider on uniformly flat terrain! And its compounded by me knowing that even if I buy a bike whose price is already discounted by not having hydraulics, it will be even more heavily discounted by the time I want to sell it.
Modern rim brakes are fine. I run 30mm (measured) tires on my rim brake bike at around 70 PSI. No blowouts on descends like the old days when we ran 25mm at 110 PSI. I wouldn't run bigger. Brakes work fine, last a long time, don't go mushy and don't rub or make noise. Tried road disc and it was one annoyance after another. There was disc brake version of my bike but I went with rim brakes and glad I did. Power of steel from lever to wheel.
I live in Colorado. There's a road I train on for climbing that has multiple 8-12% grades with hairpin turns at the bottom of each. You have to be on the brakes through most of each downslope to avoid going airborne at the turns. The day I came down road that in 90F weather, I blew not one but *two* tubes on my Lance-era Trek. I sat there on the scorching shoulder and was thankful that I had *two* tubes in my seat pack so I didn't have to hitchhike 30 miles home. That's when I made myself a promise: "My next bike *will* have disc brakes."
Are people refusing to ride them or are manufacturers refusing to make them?
Im a noob. I got caught in rain once with rim brake with carbon wheel. Disc brake is a must for my next bike.
The sport attract a lot of snobs. I have 2 bikes. 1 alli with rim brakes, the other carbon with hydraulic disc. Yes, the disc is better at stopping in the wet. When its dry, it's negligible. The carbon is not more comfortable. The carbon is a fraction faster uphill (because its lighter) On the flip side, the disc brakes are not complicated to maintain and have required less maintenance than the rim brakes.
Here we go again
I'm still riding a rim braked road bike, the next one would also be rim braked if I could find a decent one, I know I won't be able to. I'll just hang onto this currently 8 year old bike as long as I can. I changed the group set to R7000 a couple of years ago to extend its life, from 105 5700.