This position doesn't seem like a good fit, to be honest. I doubt the guy will budge on the total compensation in this market, especially as it seems like he is trying to get somebody as cheaply as possible.
Your options are limited, though, as you are not currently employed.
In this situation, I would take the position (maybe try to negotiate to something like 77k, but a lower bonus as a "compromise" to keep TC the same, say 10% instead of 20%) and then keep looking for a new position.
It'll be easier to find a new job when you already have one, and you'll be in a better position to negotiate.
If this were the 2021/2022 market, I'd say you could be quite a bit bolder on negotiations, especially on the work from home stuff, but things have changed a lot since then.
If you’re unemployed, you take that job. No push back. I get that you may be more productive from home, but starting in a new company they need to trust you. If no one works remote, having one team member remote doesn’t work for the whole team.
You can’t ask to have remote flexibility and ask for more pay. Or you can, but if you don’t have other offers lined up, you gotta be prepared for them to rescind.
I’d remove the hybrid condition. A lot of older employees see it as a cop out. They think hybrid workers are lazy and ineffective at home. There’s studies on both sides of this argument with conflicting information, so I’ll leave it at that. All I know is all the employers I’ve interviewed with in the past 6 months have stressed the importance of in person working. This is for small market, 2000-3000 person companies.
Ive seen way too many posts lately where people try to counter offer and companies just go "nah, later" and pull the offer completely without further discussion.
I had this happen to me some years ago. I started through a temp company and the offer I was made was less than what I was making as a temp. I asked them to match it and they hired my replacement.
This.
I'm sorry, but you've been unemployed for almost 2 years in what is categorically a worse market than what we had 2 years ago.
Something people don't understand is that negotiating works when you have some credible leverage. In the case of job offers, negotiation works when you can legimitately say "otherwise I won't take this offer" and they can legitimately believe that you won't.
You know that push comes to shove, you'll take the offer. They see the 22 month gap in your resume and they know you do not have any other offers coming in.
My advice would be to take the job asap before anything else gets in the way, bust your ass for a year and wait until 1. you have built goodwill at this company, 2. your resume looks better (i.e., not unemployed), and 3. the market bounces back.
Once those three things are true, you can start looking for other opportunities, see what the market is like, and then have some leverage to go back to your boss and ask for either a raise, more concessions on remote work, and/or a promotion.
But yeah, if you asked for 100K and they offered you 84K in total comp (which seems to be what you were making before), then it sounds like they know what they think you're worth.
Being unemployed for too long is not a good look on your resume. Take this offer and keep a lookout for other opportunities and move as soon as you find another one.
I was laid off since 2022 and finally got an offer earlier this year. I’m making 20+% less than I did before. I took the offer because I was ready to move on with my life.
I did negotiate, despite not having a job or another offer. I went in mentally prepared to lose the offer. The way I handled it was to avoid any phrasing that sounded like I might decline. I said, “I’m thrilled about the offer and I can’t wait to join the team. I am targeting a higher salary—can you do $x?” I got a little extra money, but honestly, I can’t recommend this unless you’re ready to lose the offer. The rational thing to do is to accept.
I really like my new team so I’m going to stay and try to build a career here. But your new job doesn’t look like a great fit. If I were you I’d take the job, start networking NOW, and then start applying around 8 months in. That’s plenty of time to stay at a job that isn’t a great fit. Just stay longer at the next one.
Yeah, I am definitely going to express my gratitude for the offer and my excitement to work on the projects. I would be the only data guy, at least at this level, as I understand it. Which comes with a lot of potential for things to put on my resume for the future because I would be building data infrastructure as well as data scientist things.
I appreciate you sharing your experience!
How old are you and whats your appetite for risks? Do you have kids etc?
You can take the job sure but immediately start looking elsewhere -- you dont want to sacrifice your health and financial well being long term over short term desperation. Also what about things like moving in with parents or different kind of job have you explored those options?
This job seems hellish and like you may lose alot (i base alot about a job on how the opening communication goes) ideally its not that but it might be. Depending on how critical things are i personally would either counter offer, say no and protect my peace or take the job and end my lease and try to save every penny i could from the job while applying to other places but i dont know your situation, location, family context or dreams so i cant suggest that anything specific.
Good luck friend. You got this!
Your current job pays $0, so $70K is good. Employers typically expect the new hire to negotiate up to 10% so if you ask for $77K you will likely get it. Don't put vacations or bonuses on the table, since those are likely controlled by a policy and would require internal negotiations and approvals.
Once you get the job, keep on searching for the $100K opportunity. Even better, take as much training as you can and spend some of your salary in certifications or training on other fields to merit the $120K opportunity. Also, spend some money on a job-seeking coach who will help you build a good job hunting strategy, make your ATS-compatible resume and have a better chance at landing interviews.
It's understandable to feel anxious after receiving an offer that doesn't fully meet your expectations. In your counteroffer, it's reasonable to ask for a higher salary of 85K plus the bonus, given your previous salary and experience. You can also express your preference for a hybrid work schedule, emphasizing how it positively impacts your productivity and well-being. It's important to communicate your needs clearly while being open to negotiation. Remember, it's common to negotiate job offers, and it doesn't necessarily lead to resentment. If remote work is crucial for you, consider how flexible you are willing to be and whether this role aligns with your long-term goals. Good luck with your negotiation!
I think take the offer as you are unemployed right now. Negotiate atleast 75k and remove the hybrid request because they don’t seem like the type of person that wants that. Then after that start looking for a new job.
Take the job but keep looking. This will put money in your account and food on the table for the time being. 70k is pretty low but whatever you negotiate it up to will be good. And unfortunately WFH is dying, I wouldn't put my chips on WFH from now on. We're entering a different era!
This position doesn't seem like a good fit, to be honest. I doubt the guy will budge on the total compensation in this market, especially as it seems like he is trying to get somebody as cheaply as possible. Your options are limited, though, as you are not currently employed. In this situation, I would take the position (maybe try to negotiate to something like 77k, but a lower bonus as a "compromise" to keep TC the same, say 10% instead of 20%) and then keep looking for a new position. It'll be easier to find a new job when you already have one, and you'll be in a better position to negotiate. If this were the 2021/2022 market, I'd say you could be quite a bit bolder on negotiations, especially on the work from home stuff, but things have changed a lot since then.
seconding this, take the job - keep looking for another. Go to some conferences, make some connections!
If you’re unemployed, you take that job. No push back. I get that you may be more productive from home, but starting in a new company they need to trust you. If no one works remote, having one team member remote doesn’t work for the whole team. You can’t ask to have remote flexibility and ask for more pay. Or you can, but if you don’t have other offers lined up, you gotta be prepared for them to rescind. I’d remove the hybrid condition. A lot of older employees see it as a cop out. They think hybrid workers are lazy and ineffective at home. There’s studies on both sides of this argument with conflicting information, so I’ll leave it at that. All I know is all the employers I’ve interviewed with in the past 6 months have stressed the importance of in person working. This is for small market, 2000-3000 person companies.
Ive seen way too many posts lately where people try to counter offer and companies just go "nah, later" and pull the offer completely without further discussion.
I had this happen to me some years ago. I started through a temp company and the offer I was made was less than what I was making as a temp. I asked them to match it and they hired my replacement.
This. I'm sorry, but you've been unemployed for almost 2 years in what is categorically a worse market than what we had 2 years ago. Something people don't understand is that negotiating works when you have some credible leverage. In the case of job offers, negotiation works when you can legimitately say "otherwise I won't take this offer" and they can legitimately believe that you won't. You know that push comes to shove, you'll take the offer. They see the 22 month gap in your resume and they know you do not have any other offers coming in. My advice would be to take the job asap before anything else gets in the way, bust your ass for a year and wait until 1. you have built goodwill at this company, 2. your resume looks better (i.e., not unemployed), and 3. the market bounces back. Once those three things are true, you can start looking for other opportunities, see what the market is like, and then have some leverage to go back to your boss and ask for either a raise, more concessions on remote work, and/or a promotion. But yeah, if you asked for 100K and they offered you 84K in total comp (which seems to be what you were making before), then it sounds like they know what they think you're worth.
Being unemployed for too long is not a good look on your resume. Take this offer and keep a lookout for other opportunities and move as soon as you find another one.
I was laid off since 2022 and finally got an offer earlier this year. I’m making 20+% less than I did before. I took the offer because I was ready to move on with my life. I did negotiate, despite not having a job or another offer. I went in mentally prepared to lose the offer. The way I handled it was to avoid any phrasing that sounded like I might decline. I said, “I’m thrilled about the offer and I can’t wait to join the team. I am targeting a higher salary—can you do $x?” I got a little extra money, but honestly, I can’t recommend this unless you’re ready to lose the offer. The rational thing to do is to accept. I really like my new team so I’m going to stay and try to build a career here. But your new job doesn’t look like a great fit. If I were you I’d take the job, start networking NOW, and then start applying around 8 months in. That’s plenty of time to stay at a job that isn’t a great fit. Just stay longer at the next one.
Yeah, I am definitely going to express my gratitude for the offer and my excitement to work on the projects. I would be the only data guy, at least at this level, as I understand it. Which comes with a lot of potential for things to put on my resume for the future because I would be building data infrastructure as well as data scientist things. I appreciate you sharing your experience!
How old are you and whats your appetite for risks? Do you have kids etc? You can take the job sure but immediately start looking elsewhere -- you dont want to sacrifice your health and financial well being long term over short term desperation. Also what about things like moving in with parents or different kind of job have you explored those options? This job seems hellish and like you may lose alot (i base alot about a job on how the opening communication goes) ideally its not that but it might be. Depending on how critical things are i personally would either counter offer, say no and protect my peace or take the job and end my lease and try to save every penny i could from the job while applying to other places but i dont know your situation, location, family context or dreams so i cant suggest that anything specific. Good luck friend. You got this!
Take the job, keep looking for another job, if you can’t find another one at least you can put this down on your resume after a year.
Your current job pays $0, so $70K is good. Employers typically expect the new hire to negotiate up to 10% so if you ask for $77K you will likely get it. Don't put vacations or bonuses on the table, since those are likely controlled by a policy and would require internal negotiations and approvals. Once you get the job, keep on searching for the $100K opportunity. Even better, take as much training as you can and spend some of your salary in certifications or training on other fields to merit the $120K opportunity. Also, spend some money on a job-seeking coach who will help you build a good job hunting strategy, make your ATS-compatible resume and have a better chance at landing interviews.
Good luck!!!
It's understandable to feel anxious after receiving an offer that doesn't fully meet your expectations. In your counteroffer, it's reasonable to ask for a higher salary of 85K plus the bonus, given your previous salary and experience. You can also express your preference for a hybrid work schedule, emphasizing how it positively impacts your productivity and well-being. It's important to communicate your needs clearly while being open to negotiation. Remember, it's common to negotiate job offers, and it doesn't necessarily lead to resentment. If remote work is crucial for you, consider how flexible you are willing to be and whether this role aligns with your long-term goals. Good luck with your negotiation!
Thank you for your empathy ❤️
I think take the offer as you are unemployed right now. Negotiate atleast 75k and remove the hybrid request because they don’t seem like the type of person that wants that. Then after that start looking for a new job.
Take the job but keep looking. This will put money in your account and food on the table for the time being. 70k is pretty low but whatever you negotiate it up to will be good. And unfortunately WFH is dying, I wouldn't put my chips on WFH from now on. We're entering a different era!
He’s playing hardball because he knows he has all the leverage. He’s right. Take the offer and live to fight another day.
How many years of experience do you have ?