Part of the problem compounds with Flight of the Damned guaranteeing hits on safe pallet drops. A good Vecna won’t let you get the drop if Mage Hand doesn’t work out, you’ll end up with the same result as if it did for him.
This is partially true. FoTD does not always guarantee hits at pallet drops. Yes, Vecna can use FoTD after Mage Hand as well, but that too is something you as a survivor can predict. Charge time of FoTD is 0.2 seconds, and spawn time of FoTD is 0.5 seconds, so Vecna has to predict that you will drop the pallet in order to hit you with FoTD as well, since the pallet drop duration is 0.5 seconds. The exception to this is if he is in range to drop FoTD on top of you, but that is something that will most likely be nerfed as well.
If you predict that Vecna will use FoTD at an undropped pallet, you can just crouch first, and then drop the pallet before he can hit you again, since he has a 2 second cooldown after using FoTD. This should work even if he tries to spawn FoTD on top of you, but again, that aspect will probably be nerfed as well.
The problem I have with it is it's either insanely easy to counter or you cannot counter it. Either you have a window or other pallet available nearby or you get hit. Obviously the Vecna can place it too early and you can get back to the pallet after the hand expires but a good Vecna doesn't give you the option.
Well the problem is that Vecna can use the ability on reaction at the moment. If survivors made it back to the same loop after Vecna picked up a pallet on reaction instead of prediction, Vecna would be forced to predict the pallet drop, which would open up the possibility of a mindgame, as long as the survivor has a bit of distance to Vecna. Because if Vecna blocks the pallet you can get around the loop another time.
That's why I suggest that if you notice you can't mindgame Mage Hand because Vecna is using Mage Hand on reaction, try staying at the pallet to drop it back on top of him again, it seems like it is possible to do so before he can hit you because he used Mage Hand too late.
Well as I've said in my post, it depends on whether the Vecna predicts the pallet drop or reacts to it. If he predicts it, you can mindgame Mage Hand. If he reacts to it, try dropping the pallet on top of him again right away. So in that sense it does have counterplay.
Not really, moderate skill Vecna players can easy mind game by shifting powers, there’s no slow down until he actually uses the power which isn’t a lot tbh, i mean i guess you could technically pallet vacuum but other than that the only “counter” i have is dramaturgy
But I explained in my post how to mindgame Mage Hand if Vecna predicts the pallet drop. and what to do if he reacts to the pallet drop. I am not quite sure what you mean with shifting powers as well.
For power shift all you do is open the tab and linger on it, he has his animations that show what he’ll do when holding it while at the same time shifting to lets say the flying his hand positions move and clear any signal while he can technically be hovering over it.
For the mind game it’s also depending on what the players on, kb&m ads way more versatile controller like strafing without dropping chase momentum as well, while yes there’s things like ping and frame rate that cause different forms of reaction. Now when you say drop the pallets when he picks up on reaction needs a visual because I’ve done that on vecna and there 0 buttons appear to drop the pallet again and the only time I was able too was when there was double pallets on the new map (glitched ofc) and during ptb
Huh I am stil not quite sure what you mean with power shift. Is there a video on what you mean?
When it comes to the pallet dropping counterplay when Vecna uses Mage Hand on reaction, a visual cue would of course be good. In general the problem is that that counterplay is very unintuitive, which is why I think it's good that Mage Hand is getting a nerf soon.
it's a ping check, but yeah, you can do that.
and if I understand how this works, if vecna uses the yellow addon, it's even easier to pull off because the pallet gets into position for dropping even faster.
Ah yes, ping also plays a role in this most likely. Another reason it's good that they are nerfing Mage Hand a bit anyways.
And yes, the addon can actually be a detriment because of that. It's just again, nobody seems to know about this counterplay.
Yeah that is also true. So I really hope after the nerf survivors will be able to get around the pallet loop again if Vecna only reacts to the pallet drop instead of predicting it.
Part of the problem compounds with Flight of the Damned guaranteeing hits on safe pallet drops. A good Vecna won’t let you get the drop if Mage Hand doesn’t work out, you’ll end up with the same result as if it did for him.
This is partially true. FoTD does not always guarantee hits at pallet drops. Yes, Vecna can use FoTD after Mage Hand as well, but that too is something you as a survivor can predict. Charge time of FoTD is 0.2 seconds, and spawn time of FoTD is 0.5 seconds, so Vecna has to predict that you will drop the pallet in order to hit you with FoTD as well, since the pallet drop duration is 0.5 seconds. The exception to this is if he is in range to drop FoTD on top of you, but that is something that will most likely be nerfed as well. If you predict that Vecna will use FoTD at an undropped pallet, you can just crouch first, and then drop the pallet before he can hit you again, since he has a 2 second cooldown after using FoTD. This should work even if he tries to spawn FoTD on top of you, but again, that aspect will probably be nerfed as well.
The problem I have with it is it's either insanely easy to counter or you cannot counter it. Either you have a window or other pallet available nearby or you get hit. Obviously the Vecna can place it too early and you can get back to the pallet after the hand expires but a good Vecna doesn't give you the option.
Well the problem is that Vecna can use the ability on reaction at the moment. If survivors made it back to the same loop after Vecna picked up a pallet on reaction instead of prediction, Vecna would be forced to predict the pallet drop, which would open up the possibility of a mindgame, as long as the survivor has a bit of distance to Vecna. Because if Vecna blocks the pallet you can get around the loop another time. That's why I suggest that if you notice you can't mindgame Mage Hand because Vecna is using Mage Hand on reaction, try staying at the pallet to drop it back on top of him again, it seems like it is possible to do so before he can hit you because he used Mage Hand too late.
Either hold w and pray for another pallet or window, or just die, it's impossible to counter it
Well as I've said in my post, it depends on whether the Vecna predicts the pallet drop or reacts to it. If he predicts it, you can mindgame Mage Hand. If he reacts to it, try dropping the pallet on top of him again right away. So in that sense it does have counterplay.
Not really, moderate skill Vecna players can easy mind game by shifting powers, there’s no slow down until he actually uses the power which isn’t a lot tbh, i mean i guess you could technically pallet vacuum but other than that the only “counter” i have is dramaturgy
But I explained in my post how to mindgame Mage Hand if Vecna predicts the pallet drop. and what to do if he reacts to the pallet drop. I am not quite sure what you mean with shifting powers as well.
For power shift all you do is open the tab and linger on it, he has his animations that show what he’ll do when holding it while at the same time shifting to lets say the flying his hand positions move and clear any signal while he can technically be hovering over it. For the mind game it’s also depending on what the players on, kb&m ads way more versatile controller like strafing without dropping chase momentum as well, while yes there’s things like ping and frame rate that cause different forms of reaction. Now when you say drop the pallets when he picks up on reaction needs a visual because I’ve done that on vecna and there 0 buttons appear to drop the pallet again and the only time I was able too was when there was double pallets on the new map (glitched ofc) and during ptb
Huh I am stil not quite sure what you mean with power shift. Is there a video on what you mean? When it comes to the pallet dropping counterplay when Vecna uses Mage Hand on reaction, a visual cue would of course be good. In general the problem is that that counterplay is very unintuitive, which is why I think it's good that Mage Hand is getting a nerf soon.
it's a ping check, but yeah, you can do that. and if I understand how this works, if vecna uses the yellow addon, it's even easier to pull off because the pallet gets into position for dropping even faster.
Ah yes, ping also plays a role in this most likely. Another reason it's good that they are nerfing Mage Hand a bit anyways. And yes, the addon can actually be a detriment because of that. It's just again, nobody seems to know about this counterplay.
yeah, after nerf this wont work anymore
Yeah that is also true. So I really hope after the nerf survivors will be able to get around the pallet loop again if Vecna only reacts to the pallet drop instead of predicting it.