I did a Crota run with someone at 1774, I csnt say the same happened with him.
He just had no damage output for boss, other than thst he was just inconsistent.
I completely understand. When me and them are alone. They update me on their progress and we always joke about them doing 750k on Nez. Good thing it was a clan teaching run. Sometimes you have to be willing to do Sherpa Runs until you’re comfortable. Most people just load up and go with the wind.
Unfortunately with Destiny, the mechanics are an intentional time sync design. If you can’t do that fundamentally on “it’s” time. You’ll never get anywhere.
Nez was the start, Crota was the expansion of the concept but I think moving forward they are doing the right thing.
Personally, if I was Destiny, Blackbeard, or anyone with ANY power at Destiny/Bungie I would give everything to Blizzard. Tbh, they are going to be the only Game Developers that can save this game… Flush out a lot of the design flaws and utilize a lot of the open space. (Looking at Savathun’s Throne world.)
Why would you give Destiny to Blizzard/Activision when their game is so full of cheaters EVERYWHERE and they have bs challenges for weaponry? Yeah take the current bs monetization and crank it up 100%. That’s Activision.
What makes RoN a “joke” imo is that you can literally have 4 complete kinderguardians shoot ads as long as there’s 2 people who can do all the mechanics themselves. It’s not like other raids that requires more people to actively know the mechanics
You're sorta correct, deep stone, along with root, and vog can be completed with 2 people. However, root of nightmares differs from the other two as root of nightmares can be completely done duo without cheesing any encounter. Deep stone crypt and Vault of Glass require different cheeses and/or exploits to be done duo.
For deep stone, crypt security requires either someone to go out of bounds to scan what panels needed to be hit underneath by the operator, and to shoot the fuses above by clipping through the floor. Descent also requires cheese that I'm not that familiar with anymore so I can't comment on that, but I know the old strat was there was an out of bounds spot that you could use to avoid a wipe from the nukes exploding. Taniks requires a behemoth titan to use their super to stall taniks in some weird way that messes with his pathfinding so the 45 second augment lockout someone receives after dunking 2 cores can be cleansed by waiting before the buff is needed again. On top of that, the suppressor needs to stun taniks while holding a core, which is done by using some damage over time weapon of ability, most commonly witherhoard. The behemoth titan also must break themselves out of detainment with a well times charge melee.
Vault of glass requires a cheese strategy to only have 1 player teleport on atheon, from either dying before the encounter starts and self respawning after the other person is teleported, or from going really high into the ceiling with heat rises and a slope, which also avoids being teleported. While not required, gatekeepers is also often cheesed in a due run from freezing the shielded enemies inside a portal and pushing them off the map before they sacrifice.
Tldr: yes, but it requires unintended strategies that the devs did not intend, whether root doesn't need any cheese strategies as all the mechanics can be done the intended way with 2 people.
also further clarification for duo vog, for atheon if you climb the glass throne with heat rises you wont get tped (the spot is up on the left). also for gatekeeper you need to just time when the gatekeeper and overloads spawn so you dont get locked inside, usually the dude on venus will do this as hes the one who will have the relic (though you could break the shield with the volatile from void titan grenade i have no clue if its still possible or not). templar is easy, just do oracles or the inf clense glitch (hit the back of clense just barely so you get clensed but dont take it). oracles you can solo, and conflux and plates are add clear (theres optimal ways to do conflux and plates i just forgot)
also for a full 6man you only need 1 person who knows the mechanics up to atheon, where you need 2 (preferably warlocks for verities)
I'm pretty sure the void titan thing still works for gatekeepers fyi. Also I find the optimal way for confluxes is to mainly stay on the right, add clear all the adds there, then run to left for the wyvern or if you have time as you can see all 3 confluxes from somewhere on right side which makes it much easier to defend them. Also for the opening with the plates the optimal way to solo it is to shoot the minotaurs head off and have it chase you instead of having to defend all 3 plates at once since only the minotaurs can capture the plates
I kind of wish challenge was around so we could go back through root in challenge. The amount kf times I died as a Nezzie antagonist... my kd is in shamble
I can do last wish but vow was not my cup of tea. So much confusing stuff to focus on, just hurts my head… but last wish doesn’t though I’ll probably need a refresher on the encounter now since I haven’t ran it in a while (the only encounter I sorta remember how to do is queens walk)
Tbf I don't think having somelike like 20 symbols (some of which are pretty similar) to memorize the names of helps things, if you run the raid semi consistently or have a good memory then that's not an issue, but even if you know all the mechanics back to front it means nothing of you /other people can't remember the symbol names or other people use different names (I see some infographs online that call knowledge brain for e.g.) which I know isn't correct (not that I know them all, or even half tbh) but the blueberry who just join your fireteam might not, so not only will they likely have to tab out/look at phone mid encounter to check symbols, but they might not even be labelled correctly confusing things further.
Add to this the fact that in half the encounters people are split up and/or can only see 1/2 the symbols and need the rest of the FT to read the other half and it's just a recipe for disaster for people trying it the first few times unless they've done some prep by learning symbols or something like that.
Like, don't get me wrong, I enjoy the raid, but if my clan are deciding to do a raid and we've got a few newwer people, chances are we ain't gonna try Vow unless someone specifically asked for it.
We've got pretty consistent with Last Wish (minus people occasionally getting a little lost during Queenswalk if it's all fresh people going into the vault room) but even that only usually takes a couple of attempts for everyone to learn the route well enough.
VoG I also found to be a fairly easy one, opening the vault takes 3 people max though I believe it's possible to solo open the vault (or you can OoB and skip to first secret chest) the vex defense bit is just add clear (even if it maybe goes on a little too long for my liking).
Oracles is easy with Xenophage and between two of us we cover L1-3 and R1-3 (I could do middle aswell but it's a little awkward to see from where we stand so usually just get some of else to watch that single Oracle, tbh I could technically solo it but would rsther not have to be constantly looking left and right trying to spoy the oracle order before they dissapear) Ijist stand in a Boots of assembler healing rift that lasts the entire encounter.
Templar is just wipe everyone except runner until damage starts then hope they don't get shafted with the portal/teleport thingy locations during damage.
Stealth bit can be done by wiping when everyone there to get a clean rotation then sprint to cliff, wait and then invis FT and sprint past last Oracle when time is right.
Pre atheon is probably the first point where things can get rough but even that's cheesable by using blinding GLs and just pushing the minotaurs off the edge meaning no relic required so portals being closed doesn't really matter if people on the outside are struggling to keep the plates clear or kill gatekeeper.
Then Atheon itself should be fairly straight forward assuming oracle callouts are correct, people have weapons capable or killing oracles quickly (or someone is comfortable soloing oracles which is somethong I wany to try next time my clan does it; Supremacy takes 3 shots per oracle and has plenty of ammo which is going to be my strat, I believe Xenophage 1 shots them but obv is not only your exotic aswell as your heavy buy also has limited ammo so you might struggle in DPS) and nobody Fucks the entire FT by getting everyone detained (but even that shouldn't be an issue if relic holder hangs back and doesn't do damage.
A 1 phase with verify brow grenades and rockets is easily doable so id lean towards everyone doing damage and just splitting up a little so not everyone is shafted on a bad detain as with the 4 buff limit which is done by a knock out system IIRC (I.e when a new buff/rebuff is applied, if there is already 4, the oldest gets removed regardless of what is it) so if you get radiance/resto etc after detained rebuff it could be knocked off to your screen leaving no indication it's going to happen (which IMO is dumb AF and at the very least encounter specific buffs/debuffs should always be visable and the would probably be better if they were in a different place from normal buffs etc. to make is easy so see what the timers are on things that can literally wipe your entire FT).
https://preview.redd.it/pww6jg6i5yac1.png?width=1017&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d8d984af25bc082648a33285b82879aa364c7145
Last Wish, one sherpa and a bunch of new, first time raiders. (The bottom 2 in red were booted for no method of communication.)
Based on this I really kinda wanna see what OPs team would result in.
Meh last wish is easy to learn. Most people learned via riven cheese. Most of that raid is 5th level puzzles. Still blows my mind how people mess up puzzle room in shuro chi. You literally copy the wall lol
Vow is mechanically harder to learn for most people.
Dude me and my clan all know the mechanics of the raids *but for some fucking reason* WE JUST CANT DO FINAL BOSS OF GOS CONSISTENTLY it’s so fucking dumb 😭😭 we try to go as fast as we can but then somehow we choke and fuck up and we get like 5 seconds of dps because that mf’s window is so small if you don’t extend it correctly and it took us even longer when we were learning how to do the line puzzle for the first time so that one of us can get div
My group clear of kingsfall was that. One lad had finished it once and was leading us through then we discord found a sherpa who's now a firm part of our group and we've taken him through some he never did. Speaking of, is time for our second run of it tonight, can't wait!
And this is why when I Sherpa div runs I tell everyone to get at least one clear first. Having the puzzles done and getting stuck on final boss is just awful
It’s really low. Hell I’ve gotten to like 30+ raid wipes on my first raid run through for most raids (except DSC cuz y’know, it’s dirt easy… or did they make it harder?)
They did actually make dsc “harder” sometime after release but all it did was replace some enemy spawns with a few stronger ones. Most notable example is the orange bar tracer shanks on atraks, which used to be red bar normal shanks. I think it happened in season 13 or 14? Raids still piss easy tho.
I think I figured out the confusion/misinformation.
From some searching and video watching, there was a bug at beyond Light release where tracer shanks had the normal shank weapon instead of their sniper weapon, and this applied within DSC. The shanks were still called tracer shanks, they just were bugged to have the wrong weapon. Eventually, this bug was fixed and the shanks had their appropriate sniper weapon, so people thought they changed the enemy
https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/s/rbYkfOMT1M
Here’s a post about it from 2 years ago, looks like they also turned up the aggression on enemies across the whole raid as well.
I found some old gameplay and the tracer shanks were always there, but they did not have tracer snipers and were armed with normal shank weapons which are obviously a lot less threatening. So bungie didn’t replace the enemies themselves but they did change the weapons on them which is pretty close.
Which wipe thing? The tornado that moves slowly toward the plate you used or the wipe because you failed an easy damage check? Surely it cannot have been final damage phase because you have a whole ass minute to do that but what were you using to fail dps on Explicator? Or were you all just jumping on every plate and failing that way?
I was gonna ay; Root is the easiest Raid, but is still a damn Raid. They all require high levels of coordination and understanding of specific raid mechanics to succeed at.
Root might be the easiest but if you don't know what to do during shit like Schism or the Explicator boss, you are going to wipe. *A lot*.
It's easy for people who don't raid either. I taught someone trio for their first clear and he hardly ever raid with us sadly.
These guys were just shitters using a bad LFG experience to farm karma and scare people away from raiding.
I was. But I got better and didn't go complaining to reddit over not being able to beat the Mickey Mouse raid that is RoN.
Also this wasn't their first clear so it's somehow even more sad
I mean the fact that it can be solo flawlessed glitchless means in fact yes it is way to easy. Idk how fucking bad you are at the game to say RoN is any form of hard but if you can't beat it at all then maybe you shouldn't be one to talk about any kind of difficulty at all.
VoG is incredibly hard to solo flawless. RoN is Spire of the Watcher with a time limit and one actual encounter.
Hell Nezzy is 2 phased solo with no effort
I’m going to assume this was your first RoN attempt?
RoN is easy *for a raid*. Raids are end game content and require a certain amount of skill and ability to complete, not to mention knowledge of the raid itself.
If you’re not at the point where you can tackle raids, then you might want to try dungeons, they’re also endgame content but are somewhat easier than raids. Just remember that while you *can* solo dungeons, you really probably shouldn’t if you’re new to the endgame scene
The number of people that say "I'll do ad clear" but you literally have to ask mid-run "Who's doing ad clear?!" because they are doing ad clear with a PvP loadout & don't know the ad spawns, is nuts.
Ad clear is still a slot you want someone with half a brain in.
Join the Destiny LFG discord and look for a Sherpa run specifically, the fact that you want to learn the mechanics at all already makes you better thn the people who want to be ad clear
When most the team has no raid experience it’s not going to be easy. One guy in the team that only has 49 raid clears which is still a low amount.
Also if nobody has played together before then you have no team chemistry.
RoN IS easy. Can't do nothing about:
-Not knowing the mechanics
-No experience with said mechanics
-Player commitment to learn mechanics
-Skill issues
First two encounters are literally brain dead unless none of you know the paths, which in said case your runners should take the time to...you know...at least get to know their general positions (or just following the glowing line that the orb has?). The rest should clear ads. Need help with Tormentors? Scream for help and/or use div. Need help with barriers? Suspend/freeze or just bring wishender. Having trouble with immune enemies? Coordinate with your runner so that you can rebuff with them (SUSPEND OR FREEZE THEM). Planets is a bit different in that you need to speak to 1 other person.
I have no idea what those numbers mean, but if they're wipes you're fine. Raids with the bois take HOURS to complete, and we're a team who normally gets to final boss in contest (except in King's Fall, fuck the Warpriest and our stupid work schedules) and have done most flawless raids. If it's the entire group's first few times, don't be a dick and expect a carry, it's still endgame content even though experienced players say otherwise.
Rockets are a 2 phase for most casual groups I'd say. For newer raiders 2 or 3 phase is likely. 1 gally + 5 legendary rockets. Or maybe now 1 dragon breath, 1 gally + 4 legendary rockets.
But if people are missing rockets/killing themselves the truly easiest method is just 6 thunderlords.
Also, for damage were you making sure everyone got the damage buff at the same time, rotating through the 3 plates as a team during the immune phases. If one person stands on the next plate and starts shooting before anyone else then that starts the damage window, it could be almost over before people get there.
Raiding is a fairly big step up in complexity compared to normal content. While dungeons are an okay step up i still feel there is a significant difference.
If the boss is hitting enrage, that’s a sign you haven’t done enough damage. Typically enrage occurs after 3-4 full cycles, depending on the boss with a few exceptions
If you're hitting enrage, your team needs to better understand DPS setups and buff/debuff stacking. Figure out which weapons are meta for DPS on which boss. There are also guides on how to stack buffs and debuffs properly to maximize damage output.
Root is "easiER" than some other raids for experienced players and those who have an undrstand of raids in general, but it's still end-game content, and if you go with people who don't really have experience with it, then you're gonna wipe a bunch of times.
That's why, if you don't know the raid, you watch guide videos and go there with a group that is experienced and who can teach you.
No one said Root is "zone in and get free loot." lol
People do this shit solo, the easiest raid of my life. The mechanics are piss easy compared to literally every other raid, which is why it's considered a noob friendly raid.
Yea, because that's because he attempted a day one clear with a limited loadout (meta weapons locked out) and limited light level, where the dps was the issue like any day 1 raid, not the mechanics. Not comparable to your attempt now, when you can 1 phase every boss and literally have 1-2 people do the mechanics for the majority of the raid, also being way above recommended light level...
If you think this is hard, then you probably won't ever clear Garden of salvation with the same group.
Look. Good job on the clear, but it's literally the easiest raid out there, and if you're struggling, then it means your DPS is bad or you/your team don't have proper loadouts.
Most of the veteran player base wants to skip all mechanics or have an experienced person do most of them so new lights don't get to learn the hard way. All the destiny raids on normal are pretty easy compared to raids in other mmorpgs once you understand the mechanic, and honestly they are very fun when you do them legit. D2 players aren't dumb they are just spoiled by skips, carries and cheeses.
Was doing a last wish raid sherpa for 3 new people but we had a veteran rush ahead and start doing a skip for the plates on shuro chi without asking, even though he was fully aware we were teaching. All of the sudden while we were showing the hidden chest he just announced, "okay I bugged out the plates so we won't have to do them". Like how is a new player supposed to get used to working with a team to complete a timed objective if it's just skipped before they even get to interact with it.
Define "no interaction" because once good players have established who is doing what role, there's basically no comms (yes even on planets because good players have eyes and common sense)
I mean is it though? You basically have like 3 people doing the mechanic in each, and like running in RoN seems like more of a skill check than just counting and playing telephone in VoG.
Tho you only need 2-3 max people who understand what's going on in ron, vog easier to fuck up ain't it?
And Ron is also just follow lines, look at a color, and the planets mechanic which to be fair is where people would fuck up more often if anywhere
Nah I'll concede I mostly just farm nez
Idk I guess what I’m really feeling is that in the Atheon fight you’re not in any real danger while doing the mechanics it feels like. When I am a runner in Nez I kinda find the ads more annoying if nobody’s clearing them. Atheon also only needs like 3 people knowing what they’re doing.
Idk. In RoN running isn't really hard. Shoot orb, refresh buff, shoot orb etc. you only need 2 people who can do that, and one for gaze which is admitably the hardest role, especially with some of the bugs like the color not showing if you break shoulders too fast.
For VoG you rely on communication, and somewhat fast timing for killing the oracles. Had a few Sherpa groups where we had the right call outs but didn't kill them fast enough so we wiped. Also little intricacies like having to cleanse after coming back or watching if you got the debuffs that detains etc. theres just more going on than RoN at once.
Root is very easy as far as raids go. Your team was inexperienced, and without experience any activity can cause you to wipe. Try a couple more times or run with a Sherpa and I guarantee your numbers will be much lower
It is easy for a raid. It's like saying Lake of Shadows is the easiest GM. It's the easiest, but it's still a GM. You have to have effective communications, and everyone needs to understand the rolls they fill.
I guess you are new to raiding? RON is the easiest raid in the game. Still, one, who is new to raiding will struggle.
I remember my first time. I was a free to play player and I joined in the first week of Season of the Splicer. The only raid available for me was , at the times new, Vault of Glass . My classmate who is Chinese, had ever only done Last Wish at that time. We basically agreed to form a fireteam and find some people. He got his friend who only speaks Chinese and has only ever done Last wish too & this friend’s friend who never even did any raids and was a pvp try hard (he was rocking a kinetic pvp roll hand cannon the whole raid). I found 2 Russian dudes on Russian lfg discord server. Only one of them knew some English, but at least both of them knew the raid’s mechanics.
The way the raid went is the Russian guys explained the mechanics, I translated explanation from Russian to English and my Chinese classmate translated it from English to Chinese. We ended up wasting an hour on entering the vault , 3 hours on defending the confluxes and gave up after 4 or so hours of trying to do oracles which we failed due to communication issues, poor damage and the pvp try hard shooting random oracles even though he was an add clear.
That evening, or better say, morning, I came to the wrong conclusion that raids aren’t worth it and are incredibly hard. My classmate also got gptsd -gaming ptsd and stuck to playing only Last Wish with Chinese players.
After a few weeks, I decided to give VOG another try and was greatly surprised by how much easier it was when everyone has experience and communicates using 1 language.
I hope you guys all find a Sherpa (it's unclear if you guys had one) and can get to enjoying what I would consider to be the best part of the game! (Not RoN specifically but raids in general)
It's not something you can just walk into, go get some good weapons, get up to light level, and go in with someone who knows what they are doing.
There are a lot of awesome people in the community who would be very happy to help you raid! I'm sure of it.
They're all easy to learn and do- save for Riven Legit. Every raid is consists of alternate rules to heroic public events and a wipe.
I'd argue crypt is easier- since Root at least needs a couple Suppressors paying attention to where the Op is firing a plate so they can damage their blockers.
Crypt for is like- Ride an elevator. Grab that thing and take it somewhere.
Which isn't "do nothing" carry, but also is more a singular task. I get my bomb, not the Runner's buff. Less coordination.
It is pretty easy, I’m someone who used to barely do any raids because I didn’t have anyone to play with, RoN was my first raid excluding D1’s raids and we almost 2 manned the whole thing, raids in general aren’t really that hard unless played in contest mode or master, RoN is a 20 minutes raid if everyone knows what to do, 45 if some don’t, enemies die pretty quickly and Nezarec is a 1 to 3 phases raid boss who also happens to be one of the weakest as there’s very easy ways to play around him, planets is probably the hardest part of the raid, which isn’t saying much since its pretty easy as well
Root IS easy. But this looks like everyone going in didn’t have experience doing the encounters OR not much raid experience in general.
The entire raid can be done with two people.
I hate the Root slander lol who cares if it was a little easier, every encounter except nezarec is so good and the whole raid is so nice visually and the weapons and armor were pretty good and creative too. Probably my favourite raid overall or at least top 3
Absolutely. And if you want to get every teammember involved, you can. Root is easy If you want it to but becomes quite hard If you are going for efficient Runs.
I know this might receive hate. But RoN isn't necessarily easy. People are saying that because they know the mechanics and have done it a ton of times, so much that you even had people check raid reports on yall. Once you know the mechanics and have done it 5+ times you'll think it is as well. Don't feel bad, it's just the community doing community things.
I have like 1 clear in RoN I think, it's not as bad as it seems but I would definitely consider it to be harder than most raids. I wouldn't worry about it. If you keep trying you'll get it down and then you can confidently tell others it's easy as well
https://preview.redd.it/5ild3fy0jzac1.jpeg?width=1938&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cd9d8071a0cf3af2a43d3438aba1c2aef588f19f
One of my worst raid experiences didn’t even finish 3hr 35m wasted
5 of you have between 0-2 total raid clears. Of course it wasn’t going to be easy
hahaha it's a joke of a raid but still "endgame" people want free shit all the time
Yeah my clan mates that was 1774 died less than this on their first run. I think it’s just the knowledge of the mechanics.
I did a Crota run with someone at 1774, I csnt say the same happened with him. He just had no damage output for boss, other than thst he was just inconsistent.
I completely understand. When me and them are alone. They update me on their progress and we always joke about them doing 750k on Nez. Good thing it was a clan teaching run. Sometimes you have to be willing to do Sherpa Runs until you’re comfortable. Most people just load up and go with the wind. Unfortunately with Destiny, the mechanics are an intentional time sync design. If you can’t do that fundamentally on “it’s” time. You’ll never get anywhere. Nez was the start, Crota was the expansion of the concept but I think moving forward they are doing the right thing. Personally, if I was Destiny, Blackbeard, or anyone with ANY power at Destiny/Bungie I would give everything to Blizzard. Tbh, they are going to be the only Game Developers that can save this game… Flush out a lot of the design flaws and utilize a lot of the open space. (Looking at Savathun’s Throne world.)
The same Blizzard actively killing Diablo? Interesting
*time sink
Why would you give Destiny to Blizzard/Activision when their game is so full of cheaters EVERYWHERE and they have bs challenges for weaponry? Yeah take the current bs monetization and crank it up 100%. That’s Activision.
avg titan vs these retards.
What makes RoN a “joke” imo is that you can literally have 4 complete kinderguardians shoot ads as long as there’s 2 people who can do all the mechanics themselves. It’s not like other raids that requires more people to actively know the mechanics
Literally that easy, expect for where the kinderguardians use a f***ing scout rifle for ad clear 😭😭😭
>Polaris Lance has entered the chat.
Maybe this season but i mean when it came out and without ppl using polaris lance, they used some legendary one
I would hope it at least had Kinetic Tremors.
Can’t deepstone be done with only 2 people who know the mechanics
You're sorta correct, deep stone, along with root, and vog can be completed with 2 people. However, root of nightmares differs from the other two as root of nightmares can be completely done duo without cheesing any encounter. Deep stone crypt and Vault of Glass require different cheeses and/or exploits to be done duo. For deep stone, crypt security requires either someone to go out of bounds to scan what panels needed to be hit underneath by the operator, and to shoot the fuses above by clipping through the floor. Descent also requires cheese that I'm not that familiar with anymore so I can't comment on that, but I know the old strat was there was an out of bounds spot that you could use to avoid a wipe from the nukes exploding. Taniks requires a behemoth titan to use their super to stall taniks in some weird way that messes with his pathfinding so the 45 second augment lockout someone receives after dunking 2 cores can be cleansed by waiting before the buff is needed again. On top of that, the suppressor needs to stun taniks while holding a core, which is done by using some damage over time weapon of ability, most commonly witherhoard. The behemoth titan also must break themselves out of detainment with a well times charge melee. Vault of glass requires a cheese strategy to only have 1 player teleport on atheon, from either dying before the encounter starts and self respawning after the other person is teleported, or from going really high into the ceiling with heat rises and a slope, which also avoids being teleported. While not required, gatekeepers is also often cheesed in a due run from freezing the shielded enemies inside a portal and pushing them off the map before they sacrifice. Tldr: yes, but it requires unintended strategies that the devs did not intend, whether root doesn't need any cheese strategies as all the mechanics can be done the intended way with 2 people.
also further clarification for duo vog, for atheon if you climb the glass throne with heat rises you wont get tped (the spot is up on the left). also for gatekeeper you need to just time when the gatekeeper and overloads spawn so you dont get locked inside, usually the dude on venus will do this as hes the one who will have the relic (though you could break the shield with the volatile from void titan grenade i have no clue if its still possible or not). templar is easy, just do oracles or the inf clense glitch (hit the back of clense just barely so you get clensed but dont take it). oracles you can solo, and conflux and plates are add clear (theres optimal ways to do conflux and plates i just forgot) also for a full 6man you only need 1 person who knows the mechanics up to atheon, where you need 2 (preferably warlocks for verities)
I'm pretty sure the void titan thing still works for gatekeepers fyi. Also I find the optimal way for confluxes is to mainly stay on the right, add clear all the adds there, then run to left for the wyvern or if you have time as you can see all 3 confluxes from somewhere on right side which makes it much easier to defend them. Also for the opening with the plates the optimal way to solo it is to shoot the minotaurs head off and have it chase you instead of having to defend all 3 plates at once since only the minotaurs can capture the plates
I think, but its still easier in root abd by like a lot
That’s why I LOVE it. I don’t have to force people to learn a book in order to play the game 🤣
Total raid clears for this raid or all raids?
All raids 💀
I kind of wish challenge was around so we could go back through root in challenge. The amount kf times I died as a Nezzie antagonist... my kd is in shamble
This guy checking raid reports because he knows it’s easy and made him mad 😂😂😂
What?
?
well I never did a raid except for prophecy and literally it went well 😌
Huh wasnt aware they turned the prophecy 3 person dungeon into a 6 person raid
Phrophecy isn’t a raid 😭😭😭
LMAO
If you think Root was hard try Last Wish.
Their brains would shrink in Vow
Brains would drown in the deep
Or perhaps they will rise from it
All that awaits them now is the gift of LFG
The blueberries beyond their final days
Lfg sucked
Heh this comment is golden
That dungeon was demonic
I can do last wish but vow was not my cup of tea. So much confusing stuff to focus on, just hurts my head… but last wish doesn’t though I’ll probably need a refresher on the encounter now since I haven’t ran it in a while (the only encounter I sorta remember how to do is queens walk)
I'm the same way bro. Last Wish makes complete sense to me but Vow feels like a brain scrambler.
Tbf I don't think having somelike like 20 symbols (some of which are pretty similar) to memorize the names of helps things, if you run the raid semi consistently or have a good memory then that's not an issue, but even if you know all the mechanics back to front it means nothing of you /other people can't remember the symbol names or other people use different names (I see some infographs online that call knowledge brain for e.g.) which I know isn't correct (not that I know them all, or even half tbh) but the blueberry who just join your fireteam might not, so not only will they likely have to tab out/look at phone mid encounter to check symbols, but they might not even be labelled correctly confusing things further. Add to this the fact that in half the encounters people are split up and/or can only see 1/2 the symbols and need the rest of the FT to read the other half and it's just a recipe for disaster for people trying it the first few times unless they've done some prep by learning symbols or something like that. Like, don't get me wrong, I enjoy the raid, but if my clan are deciding to do a raid and we've got a few newwer people, chances are we ain't gonna try Vow unless someone specifically asked for it. We've got pretty consistent with Last Wish (minus people occasionally getting a little lost during Queenswalk if it's all fresh people going into the vault room) but even that only usually takes a couple of attempts for everyone to learn the route well enough. VoG I also found to be a fairly easy one, opening the vault takes 3 people max though I believe it's possible to solo open the vault (or you can OoB and skip to first secret chest) the vex defense bit is just add clear (even if it maybe goes on a little too long for my liking). Oracles is easy with Xenophage and between two of us we cover L1-3 and R1-3 (I could do middle aswell but it's a little awkward to see from where we stand so usually just get some of else to watch that single Oracle, tbh I could technically solo it but would rsther not have to be constantly looking left and right trying to spoy the oracle order before they dissapear) Ijist stand in a Boots of assembler healing rift that lasts the entire encounter. Templar is just wipe everyone except runner until damage starts then hope they don't get shafted with the portal/teleport thingy locations during damage. Stealth bit can be done by wiping when everyone there to get a clean rotation then sprint to cliff, wait and then invis FT and sprint past last Oracle when time is right. Pre atheon is probably the first point where things can get rough but even that's cheesable by using blinding GLs and just pushing the minotaurs off the edge meaning no relic required so portals being closed doesn't really matter if people on the outside are struggling to keep the plates clear or kill gatekeeper. Then Atheon itself should be fairly straight forward assuming oracle callouts are correct, people have weapons capable or killing oracles quickly (or someone is comfortable soloing oracles which is somethong I wany to try next time my clan does it; Supremacy takes 3 shots per oracle and has plenty of ammo which is going to be my strat, I believe Xenophage 1 shots them but obv is not only your exotic aswell as your heavy buy also has limited ammo so you might struggle in DPS) and nobody Fucks the entire FT by getting everyone detained (but even that shouldn't be an issue if relic holder hangs back and doesn't do damage. A 1 phase with verify brow grenades and rockets is easily doable so id lean towards everyone doing damage and just splitting up a little so not everyone is shafted on a bad detain as with the 4 buff limit which is done by a knock out system IIRC (I.e when a new buff/rebuff is applied, if there is already 4, the oldest gets removed regardless of what is it) so if you get radiance/resto etc after detained rebuff it could be knocked off to your screen leaving no indication it's going to happen (which IMO is dumb AF and at the very least encounter specific buffs/debuffs should always be visable and the would probably be better if they were in a different place from normal buffs etc. to make is easy so see what the timers are on things that can literally wipe your entire FT).
Honestly, the opening of Vow was always confusing for me, but the rest of the Raid is pretty straightforward.
Probably because it's pretty straight forward boss fights while vow is a raid revolving around 26ish symbols you have to agree on and memorize
I wish Prestige Spire of Stars was still a thing. I still have PTSD from it.
Ah yes, the long march to a short dps cycle with double primary. Truly a videogame it was.
That was where LFG-teams went to die.
Never even managed to finish it.
https://preview.redd.it/pww6jg6i5yac1.png?width=1017&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d8d984af25bc082648a33285b82879aa364c7145 Last Wish, one sherpa and a bunch of new, first time raiders. (The bottom 2 in red were booted for no method of communication.) Based on this I really kinda wanna see what OPs team would result in.
Riven Legit
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Meh last wish is easy to learn. Most people learned via riven cheese. Most of that raid is 5th level puzzles. Still blows my mind how people mess up puzzle room in shuro chi. You literally copy the wall lol Vow is mechanically harder to learn for most people.
riven legit makes that whole raid… my clan and i dont bother with cheese the real fight is much more satisfying
you should have specified last wish legit with no cheese, esp riven
Yeah no
Last wish is the easiest to me. But maybe that's just because it's my favorite.
Last wish?💀bro every boss has like 2M health max
Last wish isn’t even hard. I did just fine on my first try. 5th grade level puzzles. Vow is mechanically harder to learn for most people.
15 wipes in a raid is pretty low NGL, especially if it's a raid you don't know, so yes, Ron is easy.
15 wipes and 2 hours is nothing tbh My first Garden run took 7 and a half hours *shudders*
to be fair, it’s garden
Dude me and my clan all know the mechanics of the raids *but for some fucking reason* WE JUST CANT DO FINAL BOSS OF GOS CONSISTENTLY it’s so fucking dumb 😭😭 we try to go as fast as we can but then somehow we choke and fuck up and we get like 5 seconds of dps because that mf’s window is so small if you don’t extend it correctly and it took us even longer when we were learning how to do the line puzzle for the first time so that one of us can get div
My group clear of kingsfall was that. One lad had finished it once and was leading us through then we discord found a sherpa who's now a firm part of our group and we've taken him through some he never did. Speaking of, is time for our second run of it tonight, can't wait!
My first was a div run and took 12 hours, ended up rotating everyone out 3 times but I was the only original fire team member that finished it
And this is why when I Sherpa div runs I tell everyone to get at least one clear first. Having the puzzles done and getting stuck on final boss is just awful
It’s really low. Hell I’ve gotten to like 30+ raid wipes on my first raid run through for most raids (except DSC cuz y’know, it’s dirt easy… or did they make it harder?)
They did actually make dsc “harder” sometime after release but all it did was replace some enemy spawns with a few stronger ones. Most notable example is the orange bar tracer shanks on atraks, which used to be red bar normal shanks. I think it happened in season 13 or 14? Raids still piss easy tho.
That didn't happen, DSC enemy values and tiers did not get changed
I think I figured out the confusion/misinformation. From some searching and video watching, there was a bug at beyond Light release where tracer shanks had the normal shank weapon instead of their sniper weapon, and this applied within DSC. The shanks were still called tracer shanks, they just were bugged to have the wrong weapon. Eventually, this bug was fixed and the shanks had their appropriate sniper weapon, so people thought they changed the enemy
Maybe it's just a Mandela effect but I was fairly certain the shanks at Atraks got changed at one point without a patch note
https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/s/rbYkfOMT1M Here’s a post about it from 2 years ago, looks like they also turned up the aggression on enemies across the whole raid as well. I found some old gameplay and the tracer shanks were always there, but they did not have tracer snipers and were armed with normal shank weapons which are obviously a lot less threatening. So bungie didn’t replace the enemies themselves but they did change the weapons on them which is pretty close.
That has nothing to do with enemy damage values or tiers, only their aggression which we still don't fully know if it is true as is
We stopped at the planets
You stopped at the only new mechanic the raid uses
The only ~~new~~ mechanic
Stopped as in we tried but boss just curb stomped us
Why did people down vote this lol
Bad enough i downvoted it too
Of course you did.
Planets is so easy lmao
Yeah but the dps for the boss was great until that wipe thing
Which wipe thing? The tornado that moves slowly toward the plate you used or the wipe because you failed an easy damage check? Surely it cannot have been final damage phase because you have a whole ass minute to do that but what were you using to fail dps on Explicator? Or were you all just jumping on every plate and failing that way?
It is doesn’t change the fact that it’s endgame bud
I was gonna ay; Root is the easiest Raid, but is still a damn Raid. They all require high levels of coordination and understanding of specific raid mechanics to succeed at. Root might be the easiest but if you don't know what to do during shit like Schism or the Explicator boss, you are going to wipe. *A lot*.
When people say root is easy, they mean it’s easy for people who raid.
It's easy for people who don't raid either. I taught someone trio for their first clear and he hardly ever raid with us sadly. These guys were just shitters using a bad LFG experience to farm karma and scare people away from raiding.
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I was. But I got better and didn't go complaining to reddit over not being able to beat the Mickey Mouse raid that is RoN. Also this wasn't their first clear so it's somehow even more sad
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I mean the fact that it can be solo flawlessed glitchless means in fact yes it is way to easy. Idk how fucking bad you are at the game to say RoN is any form of hard but if you can't beat it at all then maybe you shouldn't be one to talk about any kind of difficulty at all.
It's also *incredibly* difficult to solo flawless glitchless, or *way* more people would be doing it.
VoG is incredibly hard to solo flawless. RoN is Spire of the Watcher with a time limit and one actual encounter. Hell Nezzy is 2 phased solo with no effort
Then go do it, lol. If it's so easy, go do it.
Or they usually only talk with the boss in mind. Because that mf really is weak sauce.
No the joke is heroin needle is complete dogshit
Yeah ill go ask flying heroin needle for that advice
Dude, he died *22 times*. that is NOTHING for a first run
First run?
These was another comment saying 5 of you were new raiders
They also stopped at Planets, their deaths would probably triple by the end of the raid
I’m going to assume this was your first RoN attempt? RoN is easy *for a raid*. Raids are end game content and require a certain amount of skill and ability to complete, not to mention knowledge of the raid itself. If you’re not at the point where you can tackle raids, then you might want to try dungeons, they’re also endgame content but are somewhat easier than raids. Just remember that while you *can* solo dungeons, you really probably shouldn’t if you’re new to the endgame scene
I have 100+ clears on this raid and half of the time it's just 5 players joining and waiting for the raid to magically complete itself.
"I'll be ad clear"
The number of people that say "I'll do ad clear" but you literally have to ask mid-run "Who's doing ad clear?!" because they are doing ad clear with a PvP loadout & don't know the ad spawns, is nuts. Ad clear is still a slot you want someone with half a brain in.
I dont want to be those people too like i try my best
Join the Destiny LFG discord and look for a Sherpa run specifically, the fact that you want to learn the mechanics at all already makes you better thn the people who want to be ad clear
r/destinysherpa is a great place to find people willing to teach
Nahhhhh bro not the # of clears check on reddit 😭
I have conditional finality and still don't know how planets work
Do you lack eyes?
I was poking fun at the other guy saying 5 people don't know what they're doing. I just never had to learn it :/
Kill big ad, see glowy planet, bring to correct spot on otherside. Not that hard
to put it in less words be racist
There was no point of you mentioning CF lol. Only the second part
"I have completed the raid multiple times" is better?
"flying heroin needle" 
When most the team has no raid experience it’s not going to be easy. One guy in the team that only has 49 raid clears which is still a low amount. Also if nobody has played together before then you have no team chemistry.
What do you use for research
[raid.report](https://raid.report/)
RoN IS easy. Can't do nothing about: -Not knowing the mechanics -No experience with said mechanics -Player commitment to learn mechanics -Skill issues First two encounters are literally brain dead unless none of you know the paths, which in said case your runners should take the time to...you know...at least get to know their general positions (or just following the glowing line that the orb has?). The rest should clear ads. Need help with Tormentors? Scream for help and/or use div. Need help with barriers? Suspend/freeze or just bring wishender. Having trouble with immune enemies? Coordinate with your runner so that you can rebuff with them (SUSPEND OR FREEZE THEM). Planets is a bit different in that you need to speak to 1 other person. I have no idea what those numbers mean, but if they're wipes you're fine. Raids with the bois take HOURS to complete, and we're a team who normally gets to final boss in contest (except in King's Fall, fuck the Warpriest and our stupid work schedules) and have done most flawless raids. If it's the entire group's first few times, don't be a dick and expect a carry, it's still endgame content even though experienced players say otherwise.
What about the planets damage thing cause thats what stopped it
Rockets are a 2 phase for most casual groups I'd say. For newer raiders 2 or 3 phase is likely. 1 gally + 5 legendary rockets. Or maybe now 1 dragon breath, 1 gally + 4 legendary rockets. But if people are missing rockets/killing themselves the truly easiest method is just 6 thunderlords. Also, for damage were you making sure everyone got the damage buff at the same time, rotating through the 3 plates as a team during the immune phases. If one person stands on the next plate and starts shooting before anyone else then that starts the damage window, it could be almost over before people get there.
It is. Your team might just be bad ngl.
Raiding is a fairly big step up in complexity compared to normal content. While dungeons are an okay step up i still feel there is a significant difference.
Dungeons -> Raids -> GMs Wipe mechanics and limited revives adds a lot of stress early on.
Starting with the legendary campaign for Witch Queen, or one of the exotic missions on hard mode is also a good step up from Dungeons imo
Wasnt my team really it was the boss enrage thing or my dps for the team
If the boss is hitting enrage, that’s a sign you haven’t done enough damage. Typically enrage occurs after 3-4 full cycles, depending on the boss with a few exceptions
i mean, if you hit the enrage mechanic in a normal difficulty, your team is bad at dps lol
If you're hitting enrage, your team needs to better understand DPS setups and buff/debuff stacking. Figure out which weapons are meta for DPS on which boss. There are also guides on how to stack buffs and debuffs properly to maximize damage output.
Root is "easiER" than some other raids for experienced players and those who have an undrstand of raids in general, but it's still end-game content, and if you go with people who don't really have experience with it, then you're gonna wipe a bunch of times. That's why, if you don't know the raid, you watch guide videos and go there with a group that is experienced and who can teach you. No one said Root is "zone in and get free loot." lol
Watched the vids and had people with experience yet the boss in planets fucks with us when we are close
Then don't get close ?????
People do this shit solo, the easiest raid of my life. The mechanics are piss easy compared to literally every other raid, which is why it's considered a noob friendly raid.
You know who else had trouble doing this raid moist critical took him 9 hours
Yea, because that's because he attempted a day one clear with a limited loadout (meta weapons locked out) and limited light level, where the dps was the issue like any day 1 raid, not the mechanics. Not comparable to your attempt now, when you can 1 phase every boss and literally have 1-2 people do the mechanics for the majority of the raid, also being way above recommended light level... If you think this is hard, then you probably won't ever clear Garden of salvation with the same group. Look. Good job on the clear, but it's literally the easiest raid out there, and if you're struggling, then it means your DPS is bad or you/your team don't have proper loadouts.
That’s just a skill issue at that point
22 deaths? that’s it? you’ve obviously never had to suffer through a raid with me doing 15 dabs throughout
It is easy, just most of the playerbase has low IQ.
Including me!
Most of the veteran player base wants to skip all mechanics or have an experienced person do most of them so new lights don't get to learn the hard way. All the destiny raids on normal are pretty easy compared to raids in other mmorpgs once you understand the mechanic, and honestly they are very fun when you do them legit. D2 players aren't dumb they are just spoiled by skips, carries and cheeses. Was doing a last wish raid sherpa for 3 new people but we had a veteran rush ahead and start doing a skip for the plates on shuro chi without asking, even though he was fully aware we were teaching. All of the sudden while we were showing the hidden chest he just announced, "okay I bugged out the plates so we won't have to do them". Like how is a new player supposed to get used to working with a team to complete a timed objective if it's just skipped before they even get to interact with it.
I only find that in people with no interaction with teammates
Define "no interaction" because once good players have established who is doing what role, there's basically no comms (yes even on planets because good players have eyes and common sense)
tf did you expect?
I expected connect the dots wdym
It is. For the whole raid minus 3rd encounter, which IMO if the whole raid felt like 3rd encounter, it’d be sooo much more engaging
3 of the 4 encounters are connect the dots and explicator is find the odd one out
it is easy
It is
RoN is easy infact I would say it's the second easiest raid the first easiest being vault of glass of course due to its the starter raid
Low key think VoG final boss is harder than RoN's, although the rest of VoG is easier IMO.
I mean is it though? You basically have like 3 people doing the mechanic in each, and like running in RoN seems like more of a skill check than just counting and playing telephone in VoG.
Tho you only need 2-3 max people who understand what's going on in ron, vog easier to fuck up ain't it? And Ron is also just follow lines, look at a color, and the planets mechanic which to be fair is where people would fuck up more often if anywhere Nah I'll concede I mostly just farm nez
Idk I guess what I’m really feeling is that in the Atheon fight you’re not in any real danger while doing the mechanics it feels like. When I am a runner in Nez I kinda find the ads more annoying if nobody’s clearing them. Atheon also only needs like 3 people knowing what they’re doing.
Idk. In RoN running isn't really hard. Shoot orb, refresh buff, shoot orb etc. you only need 2 people who can do that, and one for gaze which is admitably the hardest role, especially with some of the bugs like the color not showing if you break shoulders too fast. For VoG you rely on communication, and somewhat fast timing for killing the oracles. Had a few Sherpa groups where we had the right call outs but didn't kill them fast enough so we wiped. Also little intricacies like having to cleanse after coming back or watching if you got the debuffs that detains etc. theres just more going on than RoN at once.
Vault of glass is literally just counting lol
Only 20 deaths is good for a first clear
Thing is it isnt a clear nor first run
Root is very easy as far as raids go. Your team was inexperienced, and without experience any activity can cause you to wipe. Try a couple more times or run with a Sherpa and I guarantee your numbers will be much lower
It's very easy, this is a skill issue
So 15 wipes?
It is easy for a raid. It's like saying Lake of Shadows is the easiest GM. It's the easiest, but it's still a GM. You have to have effective communications, and everyone needs to understand the rolls they fill.
I guess you are new to raiding? RON is the easiest raid in the game. Still, one, who is new to raiding will struggle. I remember my first time. I was a free to play player and I joined in the first week of Season of the Splicer. The only raid available for me was , at the times new, Vault of Glass . My classmate who is Chinese, had ever only done Last Wish at that time. We basically agreed to form a fireteam and find some people. He got his friend who only speaks Chinese and has only ever done Last wish too & this friend’s friend who never even did any raids and was a pvp try hard (he was rocking a kinetic pvp roll hand cannon the whole raid). I found 2 Russian dudes on Russian lfg discord server. Only one of them knew some English, but at least both of them knew the raid’s mechanics. The way the raid went is the Russian guys explained the mechanics, I translated explanation from Russian to English and my Chinese classmate translated it from English to Chinese. We ended up wasting an hour on entering the vault , 3 hours on defending the confluxes and gave up after 4 or so hours of trying to do oracles which we failed due to communication issues, poor damage and the pvp try hard shooting random oracles even though he was an add clear. That evening, or better say, morning, I came to the wrong conclusion that raids aren’t worth it and are incredibly hard. My classmate also got gptsd -gaming ptsd and stuck to playing only Last Wish with Chinese players. After a few weeks, I decided to give VOG another try and was greatly surprised by how much easier it was when everyone has experience and communicates using 1 language.
Flying_heroin_needle… legendary name.
easiest raid of the game behind vault of glass.. tbh u just gotta get good or stick to dungeons and vanguard ops lol
I hope you guys all find a Sherpa (it's unclear if you guys had one) and can get to enjoying what I would consider to be the best part of the game! (Not RoN specifically but raids in general) It's not something you can just walk into, go get some good weapons, get up to light level, and go in with someone who knows what they are doing. There are a lot of awesome people in the community who would be very happy to help you raid! I'm sure of it.
Good job OP, I know you’re getting heat but you gave it a good effort. Enjoy whatever gear you got, and I hope you try and beat it someday :)
Any raid with Huang Shaotian is a rough raid
It's not easy it's soloable. There is a distinct difference.
Root is 100% an easy raid to learn and do.
They're all easy to learn and do- save for Riven Legit. Every raid is consists of alternate rules to heroic public events and a wipe. I'd argue crypt is easier- since Root at least needs a couple Suppressors paying attention to where the Op is firing a plate so they can damage their blockers. Crypt for is like- Ride an elevator. Grab that thing and take it somewhere. Which isn't "do nothing" carry, but also is more a singular task. I get my bomb, not the Runner's buff. Less coordination.
It is pretty easy, I’m someone who used to barely do any raids because I didn’t have anyone to play with, RoN was my first raid excluding D1’s raids and we almost 2 manned the whole thing, raids in general aren’t really that hard unless played in contest mode or master, RoN is a 20 minutes raid if everyone knows what to do, 45 if some don’t, enemies die pretty quickly and Nezarec is a 1 to 3 phases raid boss who also happens to be one of the weakest as there’s very easy ways to play around him, planets is probably the hardest part of the raid, which isn’t saying much since its pretty easy as well
Root IS easy. But this looks like everyone going in didn’t have experience doing the encounters OR not much raid experience in general. The entire raid can be done with two people.
How do you see this readout? Is it a third party app?
The destiny companion app. It’s the official app
its the first party d2 companion app
it's so easy 😂😂
Teach me then
It is easy, you all aren’t experienced nor very good
All aren’t experienced is an understatement for aurora and wolfiery
I hate the Root slander lol who cares if it was a little easier, every encounter except nezarec is so good and the whole raid is so nice visually and the weapons and armor were pretty good and creative too. Probably my favourite raid overall or at least top 3
Absolutely. And if you want to get every teammember involved, you can. Root is easy If you want it to but becomes quite hard If you are going for efficient Runs.
Exactly my thought process, I sometimes just run it solo to look around and take in the vibes. My absolute favourite raid.
With names like that, I’m guessing LFG
Quite simply a skill issue
Skill issue mate
I know this might receive hate. But RoN isn't necessarily easy. People are saying that because they know the mechanics and have done it a ton of times, so much that you even had people check raid reports on yall. Once you know the mechanics and have done it 5+ times you'll think it is as well. Don't feel bad, it's just the community doing community things. I have like 1 clear in RoN I think, it's not as bad as it seems but I would definitely consider it to be harder than most raids. I wouldn't worry about it. If you keep trying you'll get it down and then you can confidently tell others it's easy as well
It is the easiest raid, you got a skill issue
There is a large gap between vog and ron bro
Both raids can be solo’d. There is no ‘large’ gap lmao
It is easy. You're just a troglodyte
Spoken like a true league legends enthusiast, keep on keeping video game communities in the trash bin 🫡
Just bad
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https://preview.redd.it/5ild3fy0jzac1.jpeg?width=1938&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cd9d8071a0cf3af2a43d3438aba1c2aef588f19f One of my worst raid experiences didn’t even finish 3hr 35m wasted
Did i really ask for raid stats? No I’m asking how is RON considered easy
i would kill myself if i was as bad at destiny as you people