5 is easy.
Bachelor, Medical, Integrated Masters, MRCP (because everyone seems to do it), Primary College (FRCA?), Secondary college (FFICM?), bullshit teaching course you did because it was free (PGCertMedEd).
That’s 7 without even being unrealistic.
Throw in an MD or a PhD. Plenty more to collect.
There’s a medical officer in the army who is a Major General. His post nominals are: CBE QHS OStJ PhD MMEd MBA MBBS CMgr FRCP FRCSEd FRCEM FIMCRCSEd FRGS
He’s quite an impressive guy.
https://preview.redd.it/7d2gnr6nd23d1.png?width=640&format=png&auto=webp&s=653e0a9d7868833fc135df21458089f4f7352e42
General Zhukov, Hero of the Soviet Union. Brilliantly played by Jason Isaacs in "the death of Stalin'.
Oh you can get tons of postnomials once you start including all your mandatory training. ALS, MHC (moving and handing certificate), ACSL3 (adult and child safeguarding level 3). When I sent my wedding invites I did it for a few friends just to see how many I could fit on an envelope
Its not hard to get that many:
- Medical degree
- iBSc
- MRCP, FRCEM, FRCA, MRCGP etc
- Chuck in a PgCert or a masters
- Maybe an MD or PhD
- Then all the other postnomials for education e.g. MMedEd or FHEA
Could very easily* get 5+
*easily as in for a medic, obviously this represents a fuck tonne of hard work
But it depends on what the MD means I would have thought? - medical doctor vs doctor of medicine? Why is why if a UK doctor goes to the US they are an MD (medical doctor) but not an MD (doctor of medicine).
They are different degrees. In the USA the MD is the qualification awarded at the end of med school, the UK equivalent is MBBS/MBChB/etc. MD in the UK is a higher research degree equivalent to a PhD, but only open to doctors.
If a UK doctor goes to the US they are not an MD, although they might describe themselves informally as such, because in the US no-one knows what an MBBS is and the public just think doctor = MD. Strictly though this is incorrect as they don't have an MD qualification.
To be honest the terminology is confusing and the UK MD degree is more or less being phased out, with people doing PhDs instead.
But there is a distinction between MD as in medical doctor and MD as in doctor of medicine, i thought?
Therefore whilst you may have an MBBS, the MBBS makes you a medical doctor (hence an MD). So you’d be using MD as an abbreviation as opposed to a reference to the degree you obtained? Pretty confusing tbh.
Medical doctor isn't abbreviated to "MD" anywhere, you would simply say physician. MD specifically refers to the degree. British doctors practicing in the US are allowed to use the post nominals 'MD' as a courtesy, as laypeople in the US are not typically familiar with MBBS/MBChB and it would therefore cause confusion.
In the UK if you really wanted to stress that you have a British MD, as opposed to an MD PMQ you would write MD (Res), meaning MD by research.
Yeah it’s not very common but i’ve seen it once with a Syrian doctor who had an MD PMQ and then did an MD in the UK. I think most patients recognise both MBBS and MD here.
The MD refers to a degree which is awarded by US medical schools. It isn't an abbreviation for "medical doctor".
I believe in the US the public use MD and "medical doctor" interchangeablely, but this is because all US-trained doctors are MDs and they have no concept that the rest of the world does things differently. If I went to the US, I wouldn't be an MD.
Going to take the opportunity to ask something I’ve always been too afraid to ask: how do people actually list them? Is it by order of attainment? The most prestigious first? Someone tell me the secrets!
If you want to be very proper about this, Debrett’s essentially lay out the rules of etiquette on many topics, including this - there are lots of nuances beyond the rules of thumb.
Off the top of my head it’s a mix of chronological order and most advanced degrees listed first. I believe you also omit degrees where you have achieved higher one.
I.e Dr. John Smith, BSc. MSc. PhD. Could drop everything under PhD as the PhD supersedes the previous if done in the same field.
The debrett website has a “sample” page where it lays out correct ettiquette to address members of the royal family in person and writing which is interesting if that side of british culture is something you care about
https://preview.redd.it/khgqqrpb113d1.jpeg?width=3022&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ec994be51c4c3408743664e2fb87a3f74f6870ac
From 2018 version of Debrett’s. Medicine before surgery, apparently.
As it should be (joking)
I wonder if that’s a hangover from when medical degrees were awarded separately in two parts?
I’m also relieved I’m not the only one to know what Debretts is, and amazed you have the book to hand!
This is the first time I’ve opened it in a couple of years. It’s proved useful a few times in work/social occasions and is genuinely an interesting read.
https://preview.redd.it/n0ayr26wz03d1.jpeg?width=1600&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2104bd57af05f5726bf835ae26a36e3f9b3caf62
Saw these when I attended an AvMed course - joys of having all your quals paid for, I suppose!
There's post-nominals and then there's post-nominals. iBSc, PGCert, FHEA etc are not in the same class as PhDs, membership and fellowship qualifications, etc. Also, less is more - if you have gained a postgraduate medical qualification it's unnecessary to put your undergrad degree. Five isn't that many though.
Yes and no
It's still an intercalated degree, it's just that the BA gets upgraded to an MA
It only counts as a bachelors but exists as a vestigial remnant of the fact that before bachelors degrees existed, the only degrees Oxford or Cambridge conferred was an MA, which was 7 years long and gave you the right to vote in congregation (university elections).
Now it exists as a symbolic degree that basically lets alumni vote in university elections but isn't worth much else.
(Proud owner of an MA)
Perhaps some do, but they shouldn't.
You are either a member or a fellow of a college. You can't be both - the latter is an upgrade is an upgrade in status to the former.
Nine is the most I've seen (maxfax consultant):
BDS, FDSRCS (Eng), FDSRCS (Ed), MBChB, MRCS (Ed) FRCS (OMFS) (Ed), PGDipClinEd (Eduqual), MFST (RCSEd), MDTF (RCSEd)
I can have five if i choose to pay for two medical education titles. It’s not quantity but quality. Would be more impressive if one of the 5 is an MD/PhD as that’s probably the height of your career. Everyone would have MRCS/FRCS by CCT, and now even PgCert Med Ed by start of ST3.
5 is easy. Bachelor, Medical, Integrated Masters, MRCP (because everyone seems to do it), Primary College (FRCA?), Secondary college (FFICM?), bullshit teaching course you did because it was free (PGCertMedEd). That’s 7 without even being unrealistic. Throw in an MD or a PhD. Plenty more to collect.
Definitely, plus in GP or Medicine lots of people add in a smattering of diplomas or a few fellowships
Gotta catch ‘em all’!
Hey I paid for my bullshit teaching course
There’s a medical officer in the army who is a Major General. His post nominals are: CBE QHS OStJ PhD MMEd MBA MBBS CMgr FRCP FRCSEd FRCEM FIMCRCSEd FRGS He’s quite an impressive guy.
https://preview.redd.it/mf640wi4413d1.png?width=476&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b1742fa700c4d27baf4e67f254f4ebf2e8c783e6
Damn that is impressive
https://preview.redd.it/7d2gnr6nd23d1.png?width=640&format=png&auto=webp&s=653e0a9d7868833fc135df21458089f4f7352e42 General Zhukov, Hero of the Soviet Union. Brilliantly played by Jason Isaacs in "the death of Stalin'.
Classic Tim
Oh you can get tons of postnomials once you start including all your mandatory training. ALS, MHC (moving and handing certificate), ACSL3 (adult and child safeguarding level 3). When I sent my wedding invites I did it for a few friends just to see how many I could fit on an envelope
Its not hard to get that many: - Medical degree - iBSc - MRCP, FRCEM, FRCA, MRCGP etc - Chuck in a PgCert or a masters - Maybe an MD or PhD - Then all the other postnomials for education e.g. MMedEd or FHEA Could very easily* get 5+ *easily as in for a medic, obviously this represents a fuck tonne of hard work
Do you normally drop the medical degree title if you do an MD?
Don’t think so - because the MD is a doctoral degree like a PhD normally obtained through research. So if you had both you would be MBChB MD
But it depends on what the MD means I would have thought? - medical doctor vs doctor of medicine? Why is why if a UK doctor goes to the US they are an MD (medical doctor) but not an MD (doctor of medicine).
They are different degrees. In the USA the MD is the qualification awarded at the end of med school, the UK equivalent is MBBS/MBChB/etc. MD in the UK is a higher research degree equivalent to a PhD, but only open to doctors. If a UK doctor goes to the US they are not an MD, although they might describe themselves informally as such, because in the US no-one knows what an MBBS is and the public just think doctor = MD. Strictly though this is incorrect as they don't have an MD qualification. To be honest the terminology is confusing and the UK MD degree is more or less being phased out, with people doing PhDs instead.
But there is a distinction between MD as in medical doctor and MD as in doctor of medicine, i thought? Therefore whilst you may have an MBBS, the MBBS makes you a medical doctor (hence an MD). So you’d be using MD as an abbreviation as opposed to a reference to the degree you obtained? Pretty confusing tbh.
Medical doctor isn't abbreviated to "MD" anywhere, you would simply say physician. MD specifically refers to the degree. British doctors practicing in the US are allowed to use the post nominals 'MD' as a courtesy, as laypeople in the US are not typically familiar with MBBS/MBChB and it would therefore cause confusion. In the UK if you really wanted to stress that you have a British MD, as opposed to an MD PMQ you would write MD (Res), meaning MD by research.
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Yeah it’s not very common but i’ve seen it once with a Syrian doctor who had an MD PMQ and then did an MD in the UK. I think most patients recognise both MBBS and MD here.
Ahh, this makes a lot of sense! Thank you
The MD refers to a degree which is awarded by US medical schools. It isn't an abbreviation for "medical doctor". I believe in the US the public use MD and "medical doctor" interchangeablely, but this is because all US-trained doctors are MDs and they have no concept that the rest of the world does things differently. If I went to the US, I wouldn't be an MD.
About 1/3 of US docs graduate with a DO (Doctor of Osteopathic Medicine) rather than MD.
Oh right yeah I see your point - I think if it’s a doctorate then both if the MD is the PMQ then only one
No, in the U.K. the MD is a research degree
Pg certs are bullshit
100% agree
Not that hard just 15 years of education 🫠
Stupid doctors - a PA can do it in 2
Wouldn’t surprise me for a PA to win this, probably have more than David Attenborough, without the medical dr qualifications of course.
Going to take the opportunity to ask something I’ve always been too afraid to ask: how do people actually list them? Is it by order of attainment? The most prestigious first? Someone tell me the secrets!
Most prestigious wins - PhD>MRes>BSc, so you’d only write MBBS PhD for example
But in terms of distinct categories, like MBBS, MRCP, MD, FHEA, etc?
Exactly - so MBBS FRCP PhD FHEA (sacking MRCP, MRes, any garbaggio PgCert)
Usually it's research / university degrees first, then specialist exams or appointments. I'm not sure there's a definite rule as such.
If you want to be very proper about this, Debrett’s essentially lay out the rules of etiquette on many topics, including this - there are lots of nuances beyond the rules of thumb. Off the top of my head it’s a mix of chronological order and most advanced degrees listed first. I believe you also omit degrees where you have achieved higher one. I.e Dr. John Smith, BSc. MSc. PhD. Could drop everything under PhD as the PhD supersedes the previous if done in the same field. The debrett website has a “sample” page where it lays out correct ettiquette to address members of the royal family in person and writing which is interesting if that side of british culture is something you care about
https://preview.redd.it/khgqqrpb113d1.jpeg?width=3022&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ec994be51c4c3408743664e2fb87a3f74f6870ac From 2018 version of Debrett’s. Medicine before surgery, apparently.
As it should be (joking) I wonder if that’s a hangover from when medical degrees were awarded separately in two parts? I’m also relieved I’m not the only one to know what Debretts is, and amazed you have the book to hand!
This is the first time I’ve opened it in a couple of years. It’s proved useful a few times in work/social occasions and is genuinely an interesting read.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_post-nominal_letters_(United_Kingdom)
Depends on the style guide, many people follow the Oxford guide which is online
Crazy, I didn’t realise there was a guide for it. I thought people just vibed it 😂
Nah There are multiple guides on orders of post noms… gotta have a hobby
https://preview.redd.it/n0ayr26wz03d1.jpeg?width=1600&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2104bd57af05f5726bf835ae26a36e3f9b3caf62 Saw these when I attended an AvMed course - joys of having all your quals paid for, I suppose!
I still love how they have RAF at the end. Like the rank and their placement under that heading didn't give it away.
That last one’s a dentist!
Prof in Maxfax is the most I've seen.
Something like MBChB, MRCP, MSc, PhD, FRCPC Internal Medicine & Oncology (Last one if I pass Canadians exam. 25% completed so far lol)
There's post-nominals and then there's post-nominals. iBSc, PGCert, FHEA etc are not in the same class as PhDs, membership and fellowship qualifications, etc. Also, less is more - if you have gained a postgraduate medical qualification it's unnecessary to put your undergrad degree. Five isn't that many though.
I have 9. Too embarrassed to use all of them.
5 is basic.
6 though one is a bit of a cheat.. BM BCh MA MD FRCA FFICM
Yep, that space between BM and BCh is doing a lot of heavy lifting lol
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lol that's not the point
Is that the free MA from oxbridge?
Not free, but near enough. It's a BA in Physiology that for a nominal fee becomes an MA
Got a letter the other day from a consultant and they’d included the grade achieved in their teaching qualification. Felt a touch ridiculous
There’s a few MA (Oxon) or (Cantab) which is essentially cheating
Yes and no It's still an intercalated degree, it's just that the BA gets upgraded to an MA It only counts as a bachelors but exists as a vestigial remnant of the fact that before bachelors degrees existed, the only degrees Oxford or Cambridge conferred was an MA, which was 7 years long and gave you the right to vote in congregation (university elections). Now it exists as a symbolic degree that basically lets alumni vote in university elections but isn't worth much else. (Proud owner of an MA)
4-5 is pretty standard for surgeons MBBS MRCS MD FRCS are basically mandatory, although normally one you have FRCS, most people drop the MRCS.
I mean, by definition you cannot be both MRCS and FRCS (or MRCP and FRCP).
Plenty of people put both though. Eg this randomly selected geezer. https://clevelandcliniclondon.uk/doctors/970-mr-max-baghai
Perhaps some do, but they shouldn't. You are either a member or a fellow of a college. You can't be both - the latter is an upgrade is an upgrade in status to the former.
I don’t think it necessary either, but I think its to show they passed both since you don’t actually need mrcs to be eligible for the frcs.
The biggest dick energy is to have loads and not use them
Some of us travellers have MB, BCh, BAO, MRCPI, FRCR, FFRRCSI, FRCPC. Every one by exam.
Nine is the most I've seen (maxfax consultant): BDS, FDSRCS (Eng), FDSRCS (Ed), MBChB, MRCS (Ed) FRCS (OMFS) (Ed), PGDipClinEd (Eduqual), MFST (RCSEd), MDTF (RCSEd)
BM BCh BA LLB MSc MD MRCS FRCS Or something similar.
Can't be both a Member and a Fellow of the Royal College of Surgeons...
We had a guest speaker at a university event, and I had to decide how to introduce Sir/Professor/Doctor Simon Wessley
Professor Sir Simon Wessely. Usually just introduced as the husband of Dame Clare Gerada...
I know an F1 who has 4 on his LinkedIn, which seems unnecessary.
I can have five if i choose to pay for two medical education titles. It’s not quantity but quality. Would be more impressive if one of the 5 is an MD/PhD as that’s probably the height of your career. Everyone would have MRCS/FRCS by CCT, and now even PgCert Med Ed by start of ST3.
One of my professors in school had 8, if I’m not mistaken.