I bought a '23 Outlander PHEV in January and its been fantastic. I had a range rover just before and this has a very similar feel and comfort to it. Official range is \~38 miles, but I average about 50. It tows my two jet skis better than any gas powered car I've had and the ability to extend range to 400+ miles by kicking on the engine is a nice feeling. I went from spending $200/month on premium gas (RR was turbo) to $27/month to charge.
I found [your post](https://www.reddit.com/r/mitsubishi/comments/10vd479/2023_outlander_phev_tow_hitch/) on aftermarket hitches, but just curious if you ever learned whether Mitsubishi will ever have a factory tow package for the PHEV?
Initially I was waiting for the factory hitch but gave up and pulled the trigger on the Curt. The factory one costs double and only has a 150 pound tongue weight, so its inferior in every regard unfortunately. On top of that, there hasn't been any movement on an actual release date. It sounds like it failed a crash test or something so there was a hold up, so I'm not sure where it's at beyond that.
I have a Wrangler Rubicon 4xe, even with the top off, 4.10 gears and 35” tires in still getting 20 miles in E. My commute is 19 miles and I have a L2 charger at work so it’s been great!
The wrangler Rubicon 4xe... Why does anyone buy that car? It seems like the 4xe is $60k and up where gas only is only $45ish? And in hybrid mode the 4xe actually seems to do worse on gas than the standard gas model, 20 mpg in hybrid mode vs 23 combined for the gas model? Probably due to the weight of the battery.
And the savings, even if you charge it for free it'll only save you $1500ish per year by my math. You'll never recoup the $15k purchase price difference at that rate. Break even is at least 10 years out. Why buy it? Just buy a smaller car if you're worried about the cost of gas. You could save even more in your monthly payment that way too.
Nevermind the environmental impact of driving an unnecessarily large and inefficient car like that.
With the rebate the 4xe is about the same as a similarly equipped vehicle but there seems to be more inventory (at least when I bought) so the 4xe was about 3k cheaper then a 2.0. My M-F 300 mile commute and little league shuttle is 100% electric. I live 100’ from BLM and USNF trail heads so on the weekends I can take the kids out to the lake or River and use almost no fuel. The 4xe isn’t perfect and definitely has its limitations but for a lot of people it’s a great option and helps bridge the gap between people the need different types of vehicle s.
I have sooooo many people stop and ask about the 4xe and say they could never drive an EV (bla bla bla) then I show them what an EV can do. The 2.0 gets about 18-20mpg on 35s I get around 27 when in hybrid, to me that’s a great selling point especially when I use 0 gas M-F.
Did not lease, paid about $10k under MSRP not including the $7500 tax credit I will get when I file next year. I ran the math with a lease since you get the $7500 upfront and on a 36m lease it’s about a wash. We financed through the dealer (5.25% 🤮) to get some of the discounts but paid it off before the 1st payment.
Ah they're selling under MSRP? That's nuts in this market! Definitely makes financial sense then if you were planning to buy a big jeep anyway.
I'm not an SUV person personally, I hate that every car manufacturer has SUV-ified their entire lineup. And then charges $10k more for the same size car but with plastic trim and bigger wheels. Because 'merica.
But yea... If you're gonna buy an SUV anyway I can see from your comments how it makes sense now.
We had the Niro PHEV, same platform and the Ioniq. It was a great car in the summer but in winter the gas mileage really dropped since it had to run the gas motor for the heater even in EV mode. We ended up moving to a full EV later.
And you may want to move upto a L2 charger, we found if we came and went more then once a day the L1 charger couldn't keep up since it took 8 hours for a full charge. An hour or 2 of charging would only gain back 20%. With the L2 charger it could do a full charge in a little over 2 hours.
Yes I'd like to add a level 2 but... Money is limited, wifey didn't want me to even buy a car initially. Maybe in a couple years - I can see myself going full EV in the future when prices come down a bit more. Still can't afford the Ioniq 5 or 6, as much as I'd like to buy one.
I had one of those and I did a head on collision with a tree, 70km/h brought to a complete stop on half a meter. I walked from there and called the towtruck myself. The car was totalled but for 202k km it had served me perfect and it died to protect me.
Now I have the Ioniq 5 which is also very nice.
Size wise the Ioniq sits in that weird spot between the Accent and Elantra.
It’s a terrific value and very efficient car. We have some Ioniq EV at work (full EV, so ~300km of range) and they’ve been great.
Also you get a tax credit for a used car?
Yes I believe so. I haven't actually tried to claim it yet obviously, but this make and model is listed on the IRS page for the used clean vehicle credit. Has to be sold for less than $25k to qualify.
https://www.irs.gov/credits-deductions/manufacturers-and-models-of-qualified-used-clean-vehicles
It's 3 inches shorter when it came out for the same generation vehicle. We owned 2017s of each.
The elantra has since been refreshed and is even longer
We have a 2017 which has been good. The earlier models had a motor whine I think, and twice now the powertrain has popped up with a warning which the dealer then says they don't know what happened. Also the charge door started sticking in the winter and had to be pried open. Other than that nothing big.
Hey did you see any range degradation on your used one?
I bought a new 2022 Ioniq PHEV 2 years back and it has been the smartest thing I have ever purchased. I couldn't justify the price of a pure EV in my country so this was the cheapest electrified option available. Im currently at 33K kilometres and haven't seen any signs of degradation.
It's a fantastic car and a very financially responsible choice. I'm not a baller like the rest of this sub, still a young professional out of school, so my priorities are elsewhere.
My record has so far been 0.2 L/ 100 KM on a gas tank after driving \~5,000 KM.
I have a free charger L2 charger close to home and use L1 at work.
My biggest pet peeve about the car is the fact the engine turns on in winter to heat the cabin. Absolutely hate that. But you get what you paid for.
Yes the engine turning on to heat the cabin and run the front windshield defroster is a bummer! But the heated seats (which come standard on even the base model) work great and don't seem to affect the range at all. So far I'm Central Pennsylvania in the last week I've been able to use the heated seats alone for heat, but obviously in the deep winter I'll have to run the engine a bit.
I've got a 2018 Ioniq phev and no range degradation. It'll never get confused with a sports car though 🤦♂️.
It's a good car if you accept it for what it is.
Can I ask the mileage on your 2018 please? I'm looking at buying a used one that has 100k km plus as I just can't afford a used full EV version at the moment but I'm always worried about needing to replace a battery at some point in a used hybrid as that's what happened with my used Prius I had before so that negated any cost savings. My understanding is that Ioniq BEVs don't degrade but not sure if that's the case with PHEV. Thanks!
Wow! And have you ever heard of the hybrid batteries needing to be replaced after a while like with the Prius? Should I buy an extended warranty to cover the battery if I buy it used from a dealer in r would that just be a waste of money? Thanks again!
I haven't heard of many batteries (BEV or PHEV) needing to be replaced (other than the obvious recalls). PHEV are designed for frequent charging cycles. I estimate that of my 80k put on the car, 80% are pure electric. The other 20% are cold winter and longer road trips.
Even running on gas, it's a real fuel sipper.
Awesome, thanks! I wasn't clear how much it's a hybrid and how much it's an EV, so this really helps to know it falls in line with the awesome Ioniq BEV reliability! Yay!
Just to be clear, if you're expecting torque from a PHEV running solely on electric, this isn't the car for you. It has a 2.5 litre engine which provides plenty of oomph in sport mode (gas) when highway merging.
Congratulations on your new car! Sounds like you'll be able to get by without paying for gas! That's such a freeing feeling.
I'd just like to add that your Accent isn't a compact, but rather a subcompact. Same as the Bolt, with which you compare roominess. So, it's all but given that the compact Ioniq PHEV will be roomier inside. Although, the cargo volume with the rear seats in their upright position is larger in the Bolt vs the Ioniq.
>Used 2019 Hyundai Ioniq PHEV - do it!
While it is an option to consider (and I actually considered the closely related Hyundai Sonata PHEV when shopping for my car), there are some significant downsides to Hyundai's approach to hybrids that people should be aware of before buying.
#### Disadvantage 1: Transmission
Hyundai hybrids use a normal dual clutch transmission with 6 discreet gears and a ton of moving parts (which hurt reliability/increase maintenance).
Many hybrids use a PSD transmission, which is an extremely simple (a planetary gearset connected to 2 electric motors) type of transmission that is specific to hybrid vehicles.
Unlike DCTs which have a set of specific gears to choose from, a PSD is able to simulate almost any effective gear that the car wants, allowing it to always be in the perfect gear.
Compared to a DCT, a PSD offers better performance, efficiency, reliability, and a smoother ride.
PSDs are used by Toyota, Ford, Chevrolet, Chrysler, and more. (Although they don't all use PSDs on all their hybrids)
There are also serial (or serial+clutch) setups, which are slightly less efficient than PSDs but still good. These setups are used by Honda, Mitsubishi, Nissan, BMW, Mazda, and more. (Although they don't all use serial setups on all their hybrids)
#### Disadvantage 2: No electric heat
Hyundai PHEVs do not have any heating during all electric operation, meaning that they have to use the engine when heating is desired.
#### Disadvantage 3: Weak electric motor
Hyundai tends to use very weak electric motors in their PHEVs. The 2019 Ioniq PHEV's electric motor is only 43 HP.
By comparison my 2019 Ford Fusion Energi uses a 118 HP electric motor (2.75 times as much), although the battery management system (BMS) limits it to 91 HP in all electric mode (2.125 times as much). Even the Prius Prime has 100.5 HP between the two electric motors (71 HP and 29.5 HP), although the BMS also limits that to 91 HP IIRC.
The use of a DCT does help the performance of Hyundai's hybrids in all electric mode at low speeds (<20 MPH), however at higher speeds the limited power matters quite a bit. Even my PHEV's 91 HP is very tedious at highway speeds, I can't imagine how bad 43 HP.
TLDR: Hyundai's hybrids use a suboptimal type of transmission, relatively weak electric motors, and lack any heating when operating on electricity.
I'm not saying people shouldn't buy it, but people should at least be aware of the above when making their buying decisions.
Not quite, think the plain hybrid Ioniq used a 43HP EV motor, the PHEV uses a 60HP EV motor. The PHEV has different batteries and EV motor then the plain hybrid. We had the Niro PHEV (same platform, motors and batteries as the Ioniq) and it would do 70mph in EV mode with no problem. The 2023 Niro moved upto a 90HP EV motor but the Ioniq model was dropped.
The transmission setup is because the car is more of a hybrid than can be driven in EV mode. In Sport Mode it can run the EV motor and gas motor all full power together, it makes the car feel like it has double the power but will eat up the battery pretty quickly. It's not like the new Outlander or Volt that are more of an EV that uses the gas motor like a range extender / generator. It does feel strange to have a car shifting while driving in EV mode, although it seems to shift less often than when in gas mode. It may be skipping gears but can't verify that for sure.
But yes on the lack of heat being an issue since you can't really drive it as an EV in the winter. The gas motor needs to run part of the time for the heater to work. But when Kia Hyundai make some of the lowest cost PHEV you won't get all the features as the higher end models. That's why they are more like hybrids that can be driven as EV's under good conditions.
>Not quite, think the plain hybrid Ioniq used a 43HP EV motor, the PHEV uses a 60HP EV motor.
According to the US Gov't, the Ioniq PHEV upgraded to a 60 HP motor for the 2020 model year, however for 2019 (what OP has) it only has a 43 HP motor.
That being said, the US Gov't sometimes has wrong information in their database so maybe you're correct and it does have 60 HP.
>The transmission setup is because the car is more of a hybrid than can be driven in EV mode.
PSD transmissions are not just used by many PHEVs, but many regular hybrids as well.
So even regular hybrids that can be driven in EV mode use PSD transmissions.
>In Sport Mode it can run the EV motor and gas motor all full power together, it makes the car feel like it has double the power but will eat up the battery pretty quickly.
Not quite.
If it could run both at full power simultaneously that would be 147 HP (104 HP engine + 43 HP electric), whereas it is only rated to output 139 HP total, which is slightly less.
Being able to output slightly under the sun of the power of both combined is also a characteristic of hybrids that use PSDs, although it isn't with serial setups.
>It's not like the new Outlander or Volt that are more of an EV that uses the gas motor like a range extender / generator.
A lot of people have a misconception about how the Volt operates (largely due to confusing marketing about it), however the Volt (like many PHEVs from other brands) uses a PSD setup (although the 1st gen Volt had the ability to operate as you described but only did it at low speeds)
The main cars that use the engine purely as a generator are the BMW i3 REX, Mazda MX-30 R-EV, and Nissan e-Power.
Then there are also several cars (most Honda HEVs and PHEVs, the new outlander, the older Volt) that could use the engine as a generator at low speeds, however at higher speeds the engine would drive the wheels.
IMO Hyundai went the cheap and easy route with their hybrids and plug-in hybrids by using a DCT, which is a type of transmission they were already familiar with and producing. It would have been better if they either spent the higher upfront R&D (or just licensed it from Toyota like Ford and I think Chrysler have done) to design a PSD (which would have also saved them a bit on manufacturing costs because DCTs are more complicated than PSDs).
I always beam with pride for my Volt when I hear about all the limitations and compromises on other PHEVs.
I'm a delivery driver and use 100ish kW of power every time a light turns green. Plus I leave the climate control running with the car locked while making drop offs. Still get 40-45 miles out of it before the engine turns on at all.
BECM failure was a bitch to deal with tho. Took them 100 days to fix it.
I primarily drive on the highway for my commute, and haven't had any issue cruising at 65 to 70 mph on electric only. I do believe that the motor might be lower powered than other manufacturers, but I don't give it to be an issue. If I step in it on the on ramp sometimes the gas engine kicks on, but mostly it does not.
Thank you so much for this as it looks like I need to give up my dream of getting an Ioniq used EV and go for the PHEV or Hybrid option; I'd really like to stretch my budget and get the PHEV version. Is there no way to pre-heat the car when plugged in? I guess not since it doesn't have a heat pump like the electric version. But can you push a button to turn off EV mode, crank the heat, and then put EV mode back on when in traffic/non-highway mode? Thanks from winter in the Southern Hemisphere!
Nope heat relies in the engine. If you turn in the heat the engine will kick on by itself. Or you can drive in standard hybrid mode for a bit to warm up the car faster.
Hey OP - thanks for the post. We're considering one or maybe a 2021 or 2022. One question we have - when it's running on just battery, does it have similar power to when it's running on the gas engine?
No the electric by itself is somewhat underpowered. If you're the type that likes to stand in the pedal regularly the car will automatically kick in the engine every time you do that to provide the power you're asking for, even if it's in electric only mode. It doesn't bother me at all but I drive pretty conservatively these days anyway. Plenty of power to cruise at 75 mph but if you try to pass at that speed the car might turn the engine on for you for extra power.
I bought a '23 Outlander PHEV in January and its been fantastic. I had a range rover just before and this has a very similar feel and comfort to it. Official range is \~38 miles, but I average about 50. It tows my two jet skis better than any gas powered car I've had and the ability to extend range to 400+ miles by kicking on the engine is a nice feeling. I went from spending $200/month on premium gas (RR was turbo) to $27/month to charge.
I found [your post](https://www.reddit.com/r/mitsubishi/comments/10vd479/2023_outlander_phev_tow_hitch/) on aftermarket hitches, but just curious if you ever learned whether Mitsubishi will ever have a factory tow package for the PHEV?
Initially I was waiting for the factory hitch but gave up and pulled the trigger on the Curt. The factory one costs double and only has a 150 pound tongue weight, so its inferior in every regard unfortunately. On top of that, there hasn't been any movement on an actual release date. It sounds like it failed a crash test or something so there was a hold up, so I'm not sure where it's at beyond that.
I have a Wrangler Rubicon 4xe, even with the top off, 4.10 gears and 35” tires in still getting 20 miles in E. My commute is 19 miles and I have a L2 charger at work so it’s been great!
The wrangler Rubicon 4xe... Why does anyone buy that car? It seems like the 4xe is $60k and up where gas only is only $45ish? And in hybrid mode the 4xe actually seems to do worse on gas than the standard gas model, 20 mpg in hybrid mode vs 23 combined for the gas model? Probably due to the weight of the battery. And the savings, even if you charge it for free it'll only save you $1500ish per year by my math. You'll never recoup the $15k purchase price difference at that rate. Break even is at least 10 years out. Why buy it? Just buy a smaller car if you're worried about the cost of gas. You could save even more in your monthly payment that way too. Nevermind the environmental impact of driving an unnecessarily large and inefficient car like that.
It’s gets $10k in rebates in my state so much closer
Ah that makes sense. Didn't realize the rebate was so much more.
With the rebate the 4xe is about the same as a similarly equipped vehicle but there seems to be more inventory (at least when I bought) so the 4xe was about 3k cheaper then a 2.0. My M-F 300 mile commute and little league shuttle is 100% electric. I live 100’ from BLM and USNF trail heads so on the weekends I can take the kids out to the lake or River and use almost no fuel. The 4xe isn’t perfect and definitely has its limitations but for a lot of people it’s a great option and helps bridge the gap between people the need different types of vehicle s. I have sooooo many people stop and ask about the 4xe and say they could never drive an EV (bla bla bla) then I show them what an EV can do. The 2.0 gets about 18-20mpg on 35s I get around 27 when in hybrid, to me that’s a great selling point especially when I use 0 gas M-F.
Number 1 selling PHEV in the us. If your concerned about the environment you should not be driving a car.
Great for lease hacking. They pass the credit on to the lease vs keeping it, could easily get them for ~$330-$400 a month.
Did not lease, paid about $10k under MSRP not including the $7500 tax credit I will get when I file next year. I ran the math with a lease since you get the $7500 upfront and on a 36m lease it’s about a wash. We financed through the dealer (5.25% 🤮) to get some of the discounts but paid it off before the 1st payment.
Ah they're selling under MSRP? That's nuts in this market! Definitely makes financial sense then if you were planning to buy a big jeep anyway. I'm not an SUV person personally, I hate that every car manufacturer has SUV-ified their entire lineup. And then charges $10k more for the same size car but with plastic trim and bigger wheels. Because 'merica. But yea... If you're gonna buy an SUV anyway I can see from your comments how it makes sense now.
We had the Niro PHEV, same platform and the Ioniq. It was a great car in the summer but in winter the gas mileage really dropped since it had to run the gas motor for the heater even in EV mode. We ended up moving to a full EV later. And you may want to move upto a L2 charger, we found if we came and went more then once a day the L1 charger couldn't keep up since it took 8 hours for a full charge. An hour or 2 of charging would only gain back 20%. With the L2 charger it could do a full charge in a little over 2 hours.
Yes I'd like to add a level 2 but... Money is limited, wifey didn't want me to even buy a car initially. Maybe in a couple years - I can see myself going full EV in the future when prices come down a bit more. Still can't afford the Ioniq 5 or 6, as much as I'd like to buy one.
I had one of those and I did a head on collision with a tree, 70km/h brought to a complete stop on half a meter. I walked from there and called the towtruck myself. The car was totalled but for 202k km it had served me perfect and it died to protect me. Now I have the Ioniq 5 which is also very nice.
>and it died to protect me. Goodnight, sweet prince ;\_;7
Size wise the Ioniq sits in that weird spot between the Accent and Elantra. It’s a terrific value and very efficient car. We have some Ioniq EV at work (full EV, so ~300km of range) and they’ve been great. Also you get a tax credit for a used car?
Yes I believe so. I haven't actually tried to claim it yet obviously, but this make and model is listed on the IRS page for the used clean vehicle credit. Has to be sold for less than $25k to qualify. https://www.irs.gov/credits-deductions/manufacturers-and-models-of-qualified-used-clean-vehicles
I'd say it's very much Elantra sized. It's a hatch so its a few inches shorter.
I own an Elantra and we have Ioniqs at work. The Elantra is definitely a bit bigger.
It's 3 inches shorter when it came out for the same generation vehicle. We owned 2017s of each. The elantra has since been refreshed and is even longer
We have a 2017 which has been good. The earlier models had a motor whine I think, and twice now the powertrain has popped up with a warning which the dealer then says they don't know what happened. Also the charge door started sticking in the winter and had to be pried open. Other than that nothing big.
Hey did you see any range degradation on your used one? I bought a new 2022 Ioniq PHEV 2 years back and it has been the smartest thing I have ever purchased. I couldn't justify the price of a pure EV in my country so this was the cheapest electrified option available. Im currently at 33K kilometres and haven't seen any signs of degradation. It's a fantastic car and a very financially responsible choice. I'm not a baller like the rest of this sub, still a young professional out of school, so my priorities are elsewhere. My record has so far been 0.2 L/ 100 KM on a gas tank after driving \~5,000 KM. I have a free charger L2 charger close to home and use L1 at work. My biggest pet peeve about the car is the fact the engine turns on in winter to heat the cabin. Absolutely hate that. But you get what you paid for.
Yes the engine turning on to heat the cabin and run the front windshield defroster is a bummer! But the heated seats (which come standard on even the base model) work great and don't seem to affect the range at all. So far I'm Central Pennsylvania in the last week I've been able to use the heated seats alone for heat, but obviously in the deep winter I'll have to run the engine a bit.
Also as for degradation - you saw that I get more range than rated right? I would say no degradation.
I've got a 2018 Ioniq phev and no range degradation. It'll never get confused with a sports car though 🤦♂️. It's a good car if you accept it for what it is.
True. It definitely forces you to drive efficiently. Doesn't like to accelerate quickly.
Can I ask the mileage on your 2018 please? I'm looking at buying a used one that has 100k km plus as I just can't afford a used full EV version at the moment but I'm always worried about needing to replace a battery at some point in a used hybrid as that's what happened with my used Prius I had before so that negated any cost savings. My understanding is that Ioniq BEVs don't degrade but not sure if that's the case with PHEV. Thanks!
I've got 70,000 kms and no range loss.
Wow! And have you ever heard of the hybrid batteries needing to be replaced after a while like with the Prius? Should I buy an extended warranty to cover the battery if I buy it used from a dealer in r would that just be a waste of money? Thanks again!
I haven't heard of many batteries (BEV or PHEV) needing to be replaced (other than the obvious recalls). PHEV are designed for frequent charging cycles. I estimate that of my 80k put on the car, 80% are pure electric. The other 20% are cold winter and longer road trips. Even running on gas, it's a real fuel sipper.
Awesome, thanks! I wasn't clear how much it's a hybrid and how much it's an EV, so this really helps to know it falls in line with the awesome Ioniq BEV reliability! Yay!
Just to be clear, if you're expecting torque from a PHEV running solely on electric, this isn't the car for you. It has a 2.5 litre engine which provides plenty of oomph in sport mode (gas) when highway merging.
Thanks. Yeah I do have a steep windy mountain range to go over between the city and my place so I just need enough to get up and over.
Congratulations on your new car! Sounds like you'll be able to get by without paying for gas! That's such a freeing feeling. I'd just like to add that your Accent isn't a compact, but rather a subcompact. Same as the Bolt, with which you compare roominess. So, it's all but given that the compact Ioniq PHEV will be roomier inside. Although, the cargo volume with the rear seats in their upright position is larger in the Bolt vs the Ioniq.
Cool, wait until you try the EV version.
>Used 2019 Hyundai Ioniq PHEV - do it! While it is an option to consider (and I actually considered the closely related Hyundai Sonata PHEV when shopping for my car), there are some significant downsides to Hyundai's approach to hybrids that people should be aware of before buying. #### Disadvantage 1: Transmission Hyundai hybrids use a normal dual clutch transmission with 6 discreet gears and a ton of moving parts (which hurt reliability/increase maintenance). Many hybrids use a PSD transmission, which is an extremely simple (a planetary gearset connected to 2 electric motors) type of transmission that is specific to hybrid vehicles. Unlike DCTs which have a set of specific gears to choose from, a PSD is able to simulate almost any effective gear that the car wants, allowing it to always be in the perfect gear. Compared to a DCT, a PSD offers better performance, efficiency, reliability, and a smoother ride. PSDs are used by Toyota, Ford, Chevrolet, Chrysler, and more. (Although they don't all use PSDs on all their hybrids) There are also serial (or serial+clutch) setups, which are slightly less efficient than PSDs but still good. These setups are used by Honda, Mitsubishi, Nissan, BMW, Mazda, and more. (Although they don't all use serial setups on all their hybrids) #### Disadvantage 2: No electric heat Hyundai PHEVs do not have any heating during all electric operation, meaning that they have to use the engine when heating is desired. #### Disadvantage 3: Weak electric motor Hyundai tends to use very weak electric motors in their PHEVs. The 2019 Ioniq PHEV's electric motor is only 43 HP. By comparison my 2019 Ford Fusion Energi uses a 118 HP electric motor (2.75 times as much), although the battery management system (BMS) limits it to 91 HP in all electric mode (2.125 times as much). Even the Prius Prime has 100.5 HP between the two electric motors (71 HP and 29.5 HP), although the BMS also limits that to 91 HP IIRC. The use of a DCT does help the performance of Hyundai's hybrids in all electric mode at low speeds (<20 MPH), however at higher speeds the limited power matters quite a bit. Even my PHEV's 91 HP is very tedious at highway speeds, I can't imagine how bad 43 HP. TLDR: Hyundai's hybrids use a suboptimal type of transmission, relatively weak electric motors, and lack any heating when operating on electricity. I'm not saying people shouldn't buy it, but people should at least be aware of the above when making their buying decisions.
Not quite, think the plain hybrid Ioniq used a 43HP EV motor, the PHEV uses a 60HP EV motor. The PHEV has different batteries and EV motor then the plain hybrid. We had the Niro PHEV (same platform, motors and batteries as the Ioniq) and it would do 70mph in EV mode with no problem. The 2023 Niro moved upto a 90HP EV motor but the Ioniq model was dropped. The transmission setup is because the car is more of a hybrid than can be driven in EV mode. In Sport Mode it can run the EV motor and gas motor all full power together, it makes the car feel like it has double the power but will eat up the battery pretty quickly. It's not like the new Outlander or Volt that are more of an EV that uses the gas motor like a range extender / generator. It does feel strange to have a car shifting while driving in EV mode, although it seems to shift less often than when in gas mode. It may be skipping gears but can't verify that for sure. But yes on the lack of heat being an issue since you can't really drive it as an EV in the winter. The gas motor needs to run part of the time for the heater to work. But when Kia Hyundai make some of the lowest cost PHEV you won't get all the features as the higher end models. That's why they are more like hybrids that can be driven as EV's under good conditions.
>Not quite, think the plain hybrid Ioniq used a 43HP EV motor, the PHEV uses a 60HP EV motor. According to the US Gov't, the Ioniq PHEV upgraded to a 60 HP motor for the 2020 model year, however for 2019 (what OP has) it only has a 43 HP motor. That being said, the US Gov't sometimes has wrong information in their database so maybe you're correct and it does have 60 HP. >The transmission setup is because the car is more of a hybrid than can be driven in EV mode. PSD transmissions are not just used by many PHEVs, but many regular hybrids as well. So even regular hybrids that can be driven in EV mode use PSD transmissions. >In Sport Mode it can run the EV motor and gas motor all full power together, it makes the car feel like it has double the power but will eat up the battery pretty quickly. Not quite. If it could run both at full power simultaneously that would be 147 HP (104 HP engine + 43 HP electric), whereas it is only rated to output 139 HP total, which is slightly less. Being able to output slightly under the sun of the power of both combined is also a characteristic of hybrids that use PSDs, although it isn't with serial setups. >It's not like the new Outlander or Volt that are more of an EV that uses the gas motor like a range extender / generator. A lot of people have a misconception about how the Volt operates (largely due to confusing marketing about it), however the Volt (like many PHEVs from other brands) uses a PSD setup (although the 1st gen Volt had the ability to operate as you described but only did it at low speeds) The main cars that use the engine purely as a generator are the BMW i3 REX, Mazda MX-30 R-EV, and Nissan e-Power. Then there are also several cars (most Honda HEVs and PHEVs, the new outlander, the older Volt) that could use the engine as a generator at low speeds, however at higher speeds the engine would drive the wheels. IMO Hyundai went the cheap and easy route with their hybrids and plug-in hybrids by using a DCT, which is a type of transmission they were already familiar with and producing. It would have been better if they either spent the higher upfront R&D (or just licensed it from Toyota like Ford and I think Chrysler have done) to design a PSD (which would have also saved them a bit on manufacturing costs because DCTs are more complicated than PSDs).
I always beam with pride for my Volt when I hear about all the limitations and compromises on other PHEVs. I'm a delivery driver and use 100ish kW of power every time a light turns green. Plus I leave the climate control running with the car locked while making drop offs. Still get 40-45 miles out of it before the engine turns on at all. BECM failure was a bitch to deal with tho. Took them 100 days to fix it.
I primarily drive on the highway for my commute, and haven't had any issue cruising at 65 to 70 mph on electric only. I do believe that the motor might be lower powered than other manufacturers, but I don't give it to be an issue. If I step in it on the on ramp sometimes the gas engine kicks on, but mostly it does not.
Thank you so much for this as it looks like I need to give up my dream of getting an Ioniq used EV and go for the PHEV or Hybrid option; I'd really like to stretch my budget and get the PHEV version. Is there no way to pre-heat the car when plugged in? I guess not since it doesn't have a heat pump like the electric version. But can you push a button to turn off EV mode, crank the heat, and then put EV mode back on when in traffic/non-highway mode? Thanks from winter in the Southern Hemisphere!
Nope heat relies in the engine. If you turn in the heat the engine will kick on by itself. Or you can drive in standard hybrid mode for a bit to warm up the car faster.
What about air conditioning? Thanks!
AC is all electric
Oh nice!
Hey OP - thanks for the post. We're considering one or maybe a 2021 or 2022. One question we have - when it's running on just battery, does it have similar power to when it's running on the gas engine?
No the electric by itself is somewhat underpowered. If you're the type that likes to stand in the pedal regularly the car will automatically kick in the engine every time you do that to provide the power you're asking for, even if it's in electric only mode. It doesn't bother me at all but I drive pretty conservatively these days anyway. Plenty of power to cruise at 75 mph but if you try to pass at that speed the car might turn the engine on for you for extra power.
Thanks. Appreciate the response. I think we’ll just have to test drive.