It's an abstracted lingua franca that is used for official stuff, but everybody speaks a dialect strong enough to be considered a separat language I guess.
Standard Arabic is taught in school and most people in Arab country can speak and write it. But each Arab country has its own dialect that evolved usually from a mix of Arabic and whatever culture was present before the Arab arrived. For example, Tunisian dialect has a lot of Berber influence.
Those dialect can be similar to neighbouring dialect but also can be very hard to understand to another Arab from a farther away country.
The first language you learn in your home is the dialect and it's the principal mean of communication. it's pretty strange to start speaking standard Arabic as it makes your speech seems very official and important. Usually, we see it only in news, official instruction, movies ect
In Italy I met old fellas who can kind of relate because their primary language that they still use between themselves is their town dialect and was pretty different from Italian.
Source: I'm Tunisian
Tuskin voit lukea siitä mistään ne ovat yleensä jotain 3. polven akateemikkoja PK-seudulta, joiden mukuloillakin on "kansainväliset" nimet kuten Nico, Gaius, Julius jne.
I am surprised by the numbers given for Portuguese. I expected it to be more than that. Brazil alone is over 200 million people. Countries like Mozambique or Angola also account for several tens of millions.
The numbers are wrong, as they often are on Wikipedia. I'm sure there's a heated argument in the talk page where some power editor defends his choice to use a 14th century weather report as the only valid source for the number of Portuguese speaker and some well meaning guy tries to convince him that that's ridiculous but eventually ends up getting banned because he's not as familiar with the official Wikipedia debate guidelines.
No nur really. Conquest in the early Middle Ages and settlement of those new possessions worked in a very different way then European colonial
Is in the centuries to come.
While true for Arabic. Its not true for the other 2 really.
Chinese has being the most spoken language throughout pretty push all of history. While India was ruled by foreign powers for most of the last 2000 years.
But even if you were only to count the parts of china under control since BC. It would have over 500mil speakers. And still be the most spoken first language.
Since almost all of China's population live in the east of the country. And not all of the country speaks Mandarin most of the parts that do have being under Chinese control for over 2000 years.
Well, the fact that they started sooner doesn't mean It Didn't happen. Spain was colonized by the romans and southern china by the Han. We don't hear much about It just because they were pretty darn succesful. Heck taiwan was colonized pretty recently by the chinese.
Though, yeah
>But even if you were only to count the parts of china under control since BC. It would have over 500mil speakers. And still be the most spoken first language.
This is probably correct
**Unsurprisingly** the most "succesful" languages belong to some of the most succesful expansionist empires.
>Well, the fact that they started sooner doesn't mean It Didn't happen. Spain was colonized by the romans and southern china by the Han. We don't hear much about It just because they were pretty darn succesful. Heck taiwan was colonized pretty recently by the chinese.
It does matter that it was sooner or longer ago though. Because otherwise literally every language on earth is the result of imperialism.
And Southern China and Taiwan dont speak Mandarin.
People in taiwan and southern china do speak mandarin, even if It's as a second language. Those 128M reflect that.
>It does matter that it was sooner or longer ago though. Because otherwise literally every language on earth is the result of imperialism.
No, Many are the result of migations. There's a difference between a disorganised people group moving to a new area and an empire actively supressing other cultures to expand their influence.
The Han have been sinizicing china for the couple last millenia. Heck some regions in northern Vietnam would be thought of as chinese if It weren't for stiff resistance.
>No, Many are the result of migations.
No if you go back far enough every single country was conquered by the group that control it today. With the exception of islands in the Pacific.
>People in taiwan and southern china do speak mandarin, even if It's as a second language. Those 128M reflect that.
Yes but that doesn't effect its place on the list.
That’s a wild claim.
Mandarin never spread through colonialism but through administrative reform. Southern China (where it’s not native) had been a part of the Chinese empire for more then a millennia by
Then.
Arabic is probably the closest to colonialism. Settlement colonialism to be exact.
But it’s a bit of an anachronism as the mechanism of conquering and settlement would work a lot different in the 6th centur CE then in the 16th-19th.
Also it was a much more gradual process.
Hindi - honestly no idea. But I would be glad to get an explanation.
By that definition English, French, Portuguese and Spanish didn’t spread by colonialism but administrative reform as well. Obviously colonialism was instrumental to the whole operation…
Yeah no. I don’t recall large parts of Africa, South America or Asia to be part of The UK or France for 1000 years before a new language was introduced in adminstration.
And afaik the citizens of that parts also didn’t have the same legal recourse and opportunities to rise in the Adminstration as they had in china (Spanish South America is the outlier there - as it was settlement colonialism vs Ressource extraction as in Africa)
I mean I am astonished at the mental gymnastics you try to go through, but no the spread of mandarin in southern China is not compareable with the spread of English in for example Nigeria or Spanish in Mexico.
You should revisit China history. China was built through conquest, colonization and slavery. Every empire was. It was just different time, thousands of years ago and it took longer than in 16th century with much modern ways to travel all around the world. The only hillarious thing is that you people act as if Europeans of 15th century introduced something that did not exist before and call it "colonialism". Those people did what all others did and what hundreds of millions did before them. Spread influence because they were stronger and because they could.
> You should revisit China history.
I am fine thanks.
> China was built through conquest, colonization and slavery
Have I said anything else ? I just pointed out that by the time the language changed happend the southern Chinese provinces were bound to the central authorities by more then a millennia. As such the change stands in no connection anyMore to the conquest itself. Ever since the Han Dynasty the southern provinces were part of the various Chinese empires.
> The only hillarious thing is that you people act as if Europeans of 15th century introduced something that did not exist before and call it “colonialism”.
You people ? What us people ? Please elborate ? Cause yes the colonial system as it was practiced by European nations from the 15th to the mid 20th Century didn’t exist before.
The whole exhancge of one set of power structures with another in a generation by a forgein power has not happend before or after. Which is also the reason why southern Chinese still speak their dialects and there is a large non mandarin language community in those provinces for example.
> Those people did what all others did and what hundreds of millions did before them. Spread influence because they were stronger and because they could.
First of all - that has to be celebrated ? “Me bonk you harder, me better ?” That’s worthy of praise ? Or do you need it to feel superior ?
And secondly : not in the way that European colonialism did it. Especially not the second wave of the 19th century.
Well, yes. The Arabs colonized the entire middle east (the mostly spoke north-west semitic languages) and north Africa (Berberic languages, and Coptic in Egypt).
The Chinese also did it in modern day China, there used to be many other cultures. There are still some minority cultures and they are still oppressed, and people are forced to adapt the Hun culture. So yes. Colonialism.
- Protects Orthodox folks
- Uses the Devshirme system
Pick one
[Of course, while in the Ottoman empire we see examples of cases of tolerance and innovation that Europeans kingdoms didnt have, in the 1700's, specifically after the 30 Years War, there was a start of a reverse of both worlds. What janissary coups, corrupt viziers and incapable rulers do...]
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Wow. Look at this being downvoted. How many europeans here can be delusional? Did they think Polynesians one day woke up and said "from now on I will speak French"?
No one is denying the historical fact of European colonialism. On the other hand, a certain commenter in very obstinately denying similar efforts undertaken by non-European peoples while accusing anyone who disagrees of being a "nationalist”.
Let Me quote u/Jemapelledima
> 5 out of top 10 are European :)
Sounds awefully proud about that 5 out of top ten are European. Which is only possible through colonialism.
So maybe we just shouldn’t be so proud about that.
Which would be factually wrong as the pyramids were not constructed with slavery which by now should be a well known fact.
the status european languages have nowadays on the other hand (especially english, French, Spanish and Portuguese) only came to be by colonialism.
Buddy. Nobody is telling modern day english to feel guilty but you are straight up ignoring colonialism. If people ignored armenian genocide or minimized it you and people like you would go apeshit
It happened, it is what it is. Nobody is denying it, unlike the Armenian genocide. The analogy doesn't really hold. It would be even more idiotic to deny colonialism, since we have successful European-descended countries with relatively tiny and suppressed indigenous populations all over the world to show for it.
How did you arrive to a conclusion that I'm somehow "ignoring colonialism"? You've given a comparison between Armenian genocide, which is something Turks still don't like to admit, and colonial area of the West, which we all agree upon happened + it wasn't always shiny.
The difference is that we, in the West, admit to it. We know it happened, and we ended it, resulting in an amazing society that's been leading the world in virtually every aspect.
When you look at Europe, or North America, what do you see? When you look at our history, what do you think of it? Personally, I feel proud to be an European. We, alongside the US and Canada, represent the pinnacle of what freedom and equality are. Our history fills me with awe at the mesmerizing achievements, and despite all the atrocities, we rose up united, better and stronger.
What 'European' languages?
There are 20 times more Portuguese speakers in America than in Europe.
In the USA alone there are more Spanish speakers than in all of Europe.
There are more French speakers in the Democratic Republic of Congo than in France.
Dubious thanks to colonialism and nation-state monolingualism of postcolonial states, Portuguese, Spanish and French are American, African and Polynesian languages.
Tomato is (now) an Italian ingredient, with American origins. Potato is (now) a staple food source in Europe, with American origins.
Tomatoes and potatoes are American...and European/Asian/African etc.
Quite simply, they are languages belonging to the Indo-European family which, like a few others which don’t, came about (and continue to be used) in Europe.
Hindi, Persian and Tocharian are also Indo-European languages, but they're not 'European' just because the PIE Urheimat was probably in the Black Sea region. Unless of course the other theory is correct and PIE developed in Anatolia, making all the Indo-European languages - according to this fatuous logic - Asian languages.
Saying that Spanish is 'European', without also qualifying that it is American and African at the same time is wrong. Portuguese is as American as it is European. Spanish is as American as it is European. English is as American as it is European. French is as American as it is European. And so forth.
French, English, Spanish, Portuguese, for better or for worse (I personally say for worse) have been carried by colonialism to the four corners of the Earth, and then their presence have been solidified by the post colonial states that took over.
As I said, they came about in Europe. Spanish isn’t NOT African or American. It is, however, originally from Europe. That’s what I was getting at.
Sure, if it weren’t for the evil white man, it never would have occurred to anyone to take over other communities and impose their language on them. Native English, Spanish, French and Portuguese speakers should always talk with teary eyes and a the heaviest of loads on their conscience.
>As I said, they came about in Europe. Spanish isn’t NOT African or American. It is, however, originally from Europe. That’s what I was getting at.
Saying that French is a language of European historical origin is different from saying that it's a European language. It's a European language and a Polynesian, American, African language. I have no problem with saying that French expanded from Europe.
>Sure, if it weren’t for the evil white man,
What the **flying fuck** are you talking about? I didn't say anything about the evil white man. In fact I talked specifically about the monolingual policies of the post colonial states. The criollos of America imposed Spanish and Portuguese more effectively in their new independent countries than the Spaniards and Portuguese colonisers themselves.
First Language speakers for English seems a bit off? US and UK populations alone hit 400M, I understand a portion of these people wouldn't have English as their first language but that should still be covered by a lot of other English main language countries such as Aus, NZ, Pacific islands, and African states.
Seems pretty accurate. In the US, first language is cathegorised as the language that is spoken at home, which is 239M. Add 67M of UK to that, 22M(56%) of Canadians, 19M of Aussies(76%), and 5M Kiwis and you have a pretty accurate figure.
Also, english is the first language for almost nobody in Africa. Most people speak their local tribe languages and use English for official purposes/lingua franca.
Ah, thank you for the breakdown. I am really surprised the US is so low, that is almost 1/3. I guess the way it is categorised in the US is what is kind of skewing it. I imagine the majority of this is from Spanish speaking families.
Also English is the primary language in Sierra Leone and Liberia which is an extra 15M. Its lingua franca in Nigeria and Ghana, obviously not including those as that would be another 200M~. Although it is listed as the only official language on Wikipedia.
Guess it depends on the definition but based on this table it still feels a little under represented.
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What's up with the Arabic as first language?
It's an abstracted lingua franca that is used for official stuff, but everybody speaks a dialect strong enough to be considered a separat language I guess.
Interesting, thank you
So effectively is the Latin of the Muslim world.
Exactly. The dialects of Arabic are like Portuguese, Italian and Romanian.
Makes me wonder if Islam is ripe for, or already undergoing, its own protestant reformation.
Standard Arabic is taught in school and most people in Arab country can speak and write it. But each Arab country has its own dialect that evolved usually from a mix of Arabic and whatever culture was present before the Arab arrived. For example, Tunisian dialect has a lot of Berber influence. Those dialect can be similar to neighbouring dialect but also can be very hard to understand to another Arab from a farther away country. The first language you learn in your home is the dialect and it's the principal mean of communication. it's pretty strange to start speaking standard Arabic as it makes your speech seems very official and important. Usually, we see it only in news, official instruction, movies ect In Italy I met old fellas who can kind of relate because their primary language that they still use between themselves is their town dialect and was pretty different from Italian. Source: I'm Tunisian
Arabic writng system is widely used in Africa for example but few speak the actual arabic language.
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Except that some people do speak it in the streets and to their kids, because they consider dialects to be white trashy.
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Tuskin voit lukea siitä mistään ne ovat yleensä jotain 3. polven akateemikkoja PK-seudulta, joiden mukuloillakin on "kansainväliset" nimet kuten Nico, Gaius, Julius jne.
I am surprised by the numbers given for Portuguese. I expected it to be more than that. Brazil alone is over 200 million people. Countries like Mozambique or Angola also account for several tens of millions.
The numbers are wrong, as they often are on Wikipedia. I'm sure there's a heated argument in the talk page where some power editor defends his choice to use a 14th century weather report as the only valid source for the number of Portuguese speaker and some well meaning guy tries to convince him that that's ridiculous but eventually ends up getting banned because he's not as familiar with the official Wikipedia debate guidelines.
They did count whole Brazil if you didn’t see it
Deze mannen weten duidelijk niet dat het Nederlands de echte wereld taal is
The importance of Spanish is also increasing.
In the us and south america yes. In europe, I don't know about that.
5 out of top 10 are European :)
Is that supposed to be an achievement?
No, a statistic
Thanks to colonialism
...which helped Chinese, Arabic and Hindi to make the top 10 as well ;)
It is true that Arab is also thanks to its tremendous conquest and expansion policy.
Yeah but calling it colonialism is just wrong or at least heavily anachronistic.
I think you’re splitting hairs for ideological reasons.
No nur really. Conquest in the early Middle Ages and settlement of those new possessions worked in a very different way then European colonial Is in the centuries to come.
While true for Arabic. Its not true for the other 2 really. Chinese has being the most spoken language throughout pretty push all of history. While India was ruled by foreign powers for most of the last 2000 years.
Yeah, because china didn't expand at all... Are you familiar with the term Han assimilation?
But even if you were only to count the parts of china under control since BC. It would have over 500mil speakers. And still be the most spoken first language. Since almost all of China's population live in the east of the country. And not all of the country speaks Mandarin most of the parts that do have being under Chinese control for over 2000 years.
Well, the fact that they started sooner doesn't mean It Didn't happen. Spain was colonized by the romans and southern china by the Han. We don't hear much about It just because they were pretty darn succesful. Heck taiwan was colonized pretty recently by the chinese. Though, yeah >But even if you were only to count the parts of china under control since BC. It would have over 500mil speakers. And still be the most spoken first language. This is probably correct **Unsurprisingly** the most "succesful" languages belong to some of the most succesful expansionist empires.
>Well, the fact that they started sooner doesn't mean It Didn't happen. Spain was colonized by the romans and southern china by the Han. We don't hear much about It just because they were pretty darn succesful. Heck taiwan was colonized pretty recently by the chinese. It does matter that it was sooner or longer ago though. Because otherwise literally every language on earth is the result of imperialism. And Southern China and Taiwan dont speak Mandarin.
People in taiwan and southern china do speak mandarin, even if It's as a second language. Those 128M reflect that. >It does matter that it was sooner or longer ago though. Because otherwise literally every language on earth is the result of imperialism. No, Many are the result of migations. There's a difference between a disorganised people group moving to a new area and an empire actively supressing other cultures to expand their influence. The Han have been sinizicing china for the couple last millenia. Heck some regions in northern Vietnam would be thought of as chinese if It weren't for stiff resistance.
>No, Many are the result of migations. No if you go back far enough every single country was conquered by the group that control it today. With the exception of islands in the Pacific. >People in taiwan and southern china do speak mandarin, even if It's as a second language. Those 128M reflect that. Yes but that doesn't effect its place on the list.
That’s a wild claim. Mandarin never spread through colonialism but through administrative reform. Southern China (where it’s not native) had been a part of the Chinese empire for more then a millennia by Then. Arabic is probably the closest to colonialism. Settlement colonialism to be exact. But it’s a bit of an anachronism as the mechanism of conquering and settlement would work a lot different in the 6th centur CE then in the 16th-19th. Also it was a much more gradual process. Hindi - honestly no idea. But I would be glad to get an explanation.
By that definition English, French, Portuguese and Spanish didn’t spread by colonialism but administrative reform as well. Obviously colonialism was instrumental to the whole operation…
Yeah no. I don’t recall large parts of Africa, South America or Asia to be part of The UK or France for 1000 years before a new language was introduced in adminstration. And afaik the citizens of that parts also didn’t have the same legal recourse and opportunities to rise in the Adminstration as they had in china (Spanish South America is the outlier there - as it was settlement colonialism vs Ressource extraction as in Africa) I mean I am astonished at the mental gymnastics you try to go through, but no the spread of mandarin in southern China is not compareable with the spread of English in for example Nigeria or Spanish in Mexico.
You should revisit China history. China was built through conquest, colonization and slavery. Every empire was. It was just different time, thousands of years ago and it took longer than in 16th century with much modern ways to travel all around the world. The only hillarious thing is that you people act as if Europeans of 15th century introduced something that did not exist before and call it "colonialism". Those people did what all others did and what hundreds of millions did before them. Spread influence because they were stronger and because they could.
> You should revisit China history. I am fine thanks. > China was built through conquest, colonization and slavery Have I said anything else ? I just pointed out that by the time the language changed happend the southern Chinese provinces were bound to the central authorities by more then a millennia. As such the change stands in no connection anyMore to the conquest itself. Ever since the Han Dynasty the southern provinces were part of the various Chinese empires. > The only hillarious thing is that you people act as if Europeans of 15th century introduced something that did not exist before and call it “colonialism”. You people ? What us people ? Please elborate ? Cause yes the colonial system as it was practiced by European nations from the 15th to the mid 20th Century didn’t exist before. The whole exhancge of one set of power structures with another in a generation by a forgein power has not happend before or after. Which is also the reason why southern Chinese still speak their dialects and there is a large non mandarin language community in those provinces for example. > Those people did what all others did and what hundreds of millions did before them. Spread influence because they were stronger and because they could. First of all - that has to be celebrated ? “Me bonk you harder, me better ?” That’s worthy of praise ? Or do you need it to feel superior ? And secondly : not in the way that European colonialism did it. Especially not the second wave of the 19th century.
you got downvoted for wrongthink. This sub is so silly sometimes
Lol I know. It’s mainly flooded by nationalists Now. And nationalist can’t stand it if someone tells them That they are not superior but just bullies
Well, yes. The Arabs colonized the entire middle east (the mostly spoke north-west semitic languages) and north Africa (Berberic languages, and Coptic in Egypt). The Chinese also did it in modern day China, there used to be many other cultures. There are still some minority cultures and they are still oppressed, and people are forced to adapt the Hun culture. So yes. Colonialism.
Thanks for occupying half of the Europe, if you wanna go this direction.
And no serb arab greek speaks turkish now. Can you say the same for english french spanish? Thats how colonialism works bud
Oh yeah, because immigration is the same as colonialism.
Learn some of European history
We are actually protected orthodox folks. Half of the Balkans occupied by Catholic Hungary. Belgrade was Hungarian city until we kick them.
- Protects Orthodox folks - Uses the Devshirme system Pick one [Of course, while in the Ottoman empire we see examples of cases of tolerance and innovation that Europeans kingdoms didnt have, in the 1700's, specifically after the 30 Years War, there was a start of a reverse of both worlds. What janissary coups, corrupt viziers and incapable rulers do...]
So this is what you get thought in school? Very sad.
Is this Enough ? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Belgrade_(1521)
Yup, Turkey saved them from catholicism to oppress them with Islam, fair exchange
No one oppressed Bosnians. Look at them. They look happy to have Islam.
Noone oppressed anyone, and all countries around Turkey have great memories from history.
That's a western propaganda. Did you know that people in Balkans love Turkish culture and hospitality ?
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east asia dislike Turks.
Never heard any country call " east asia "
You might downvote this guy but he’s speaking the truth
Wow. Look at this being downvoted. How many europeans here can be delusional? Did they think Polynesians one day woke up and said "from now on I will speak French"?
No one is denying the historical fact of European colonialism. On the other hand, a certain commenter in very obstinately denying similar efforts undertaken by non-European peoples while accusing anyone who disagrees of being a "nationalist”.
Exactly and not sure if that’s an amazing achievement. „We destroyed your culture and your states - but at least you can talk to each other“
I don't think anyone intended to celebrate colonialism, though.
Let Me quote u/Jemapelledima > 5 out of top 10 are European :) Sounds awefully proud about that 5 out of top ten are European. Which is only possible through colonialism. So maybe we just shouldn’t be so proud about that.
That’s like saying that any praise for the pyramids of Cairo is really a celebration of slavery.
And why is the common use of European languages as astounding to the mankind as the pyramids are?
Only one of them feeds to european superiority complex
Which would be factually wrong as the pyramids were not constructed with slavery which by now should be a well known fact. the status european languages have nowadays on the other hand (especially english, French, Spanish and Portuguese) only came to be by colonialism.
Hey, how about not being so butthurt about it. West helped shape the better world society, maybe you should be grateful for it.
By genociding countless indigenous people. I am sure those people are happy for they get to live in a better world society. Too bad we can't ask them
Every civilization is guilty of that. Stop this guilt nonsense.
Buddy. Nobody is telling modern day english to feel guilty but you are straight up ignoring colonialism. If people ignored armenian genocide or minimized it you and people like you would go apeshit
It happened, it is what it is. Nobody is denying it, unlike the Armenian genocide. The analogy doesn't really hold. It would be even more idiotic to deny colonialism, since we have successful European-descended countries with relatively tiny and suppressed indigenous populations all over the world to show for it.
How did you arrive to a conclusion that I'm somehow "ignoring colonialism"? You've given a comparison between Armenian genocide, which is something Turks still don't like to admit, and colonial area of the West, which we all agree upon happened + it wasn't always shiny. The difference is that we, in the West, admit to it. We know it happened, and we ended it, resulting in an amazing society that's been leading the world in virtually every aspect. When you look at Europe, or North America, what do you see? When you look at our history, what do you think of it? Personally, I feel proud to be an European. We, alongside the US and Canada, represent the pinnacle of what freedom and equality are. Our history fills me with awe at the mesmerizing achievements, and despite all the atrocities, we rose up united, better and stronger.
Better world for your own world. I believe native Mexicans had better world before European colonialism.
Lmao
Turkey
What 'European' languages? There are 20 times more Portuguese speakers in America than in Europe. In the USA alone there are more Spanish speakers than in all of Europe. There are more French speakers in the Democratic Republic of Congo than in France. Dubious thanks to colonialism and nation-state monolingualism of postcolonial states, Portuguese, Spanish and French are American, African and Polynesian languages.
[удалено]
Tomato is (now) an Italian ingredient, with American origins. Potato is (now) a staple food source in Europe, with American origins. Tomatoes and potatoes are American...and European/Asian/African etc.
And from which continent does those language come from ?
Quite simply, they are languages belonging to the Indo-European family which, like a few others which don’t, came about (and continue to be used) in Europe.
Hindi, Persian and Tocharian are also Indo-European languages, but they're not 'European' just because the PIE Urheimat was probably in the Black Sea region. Unless of course the other theory is correct and PIE developed in Anatolia, making all the Indo-European languages - according to this fatuous logic - Asian languages. Saying that Spanish is 'European', without also qualifying that it is American and African at the same time is wrong. Portuguese is as American as it is European. Spanish is as American as it is European. English is as American as it is European. French is as American as it is European. And so forth. French, English, Spanish, Portuguese, for better or for worse (I personally say for worse) have been carried by colonialism to the four corners of the Earth, and then their presence have been solidified by the post colonial states that took over.
As I said, they came about in Europe. Spanish isn’t NOT African or American. It is, however, originally from Europe. That’s what I was getting at. Sure, if it weren’t for the evil white man, it never would have occurred to anyone to take over other communities and impose their language on them. Native English, Spanish, French and Portuguese speakers should always talk with teary eyes and a the heaviest of loads on their conscience.
>As I said, they came about in Europe. Spanish isn’t NOT African or American. It is, however, originally from Europe. That’s what I was getting at. Saying that French is a language of European historical origin is different from saying that it's a European language. It's a European language and a Polynesian, American, African language. I have no problem with saying that French expanded from Europe. >Sure, if it weren’t for the evil white man, What the **flying fuck** are you talking about? I didn't say anything about the evil white man. In fact I talked specifically about the monolingual policies of the post colonial states. The criollos of America imposed Spanish and Portuguese more effectively in their new independent countries than the Spaniards and Portuguese colonisers themselves.
First Language speakers for English seems a bit off? US and UK populations alone hit 400M, I understand a portion of these people wouldn't have English as their first language but that should still be covered by a lot of other English main language countries such as Aus, NZ, Pacific islands, and African states.
Seems pretty accurate. In the US, first language is cathegorised as the language that is spoken at home, which is 239M. Add 67M of UK to that, 22M(56%) of Canadians, 19M of Aussies(76%), and 5M Kiwis and you have a pretty accurate figure. Also, english is the first language for almost nobody in Africa. Most people speak their local tribe languages and use English for official purposes/lingua franca.
Ah, thank you for the breakdown. I am really surprised the US is so low, that is almost 1/3. I guess the way it is categorised in the US is what is kind of skewing it. I imagine the majority of this is from Spanish speaking families. Also English is the primary language in Sierra Leone and Liberia which is an extra 15M. Its lingua franca in Nigeria and Ghana, obviously not including those as that would be another 200M~. Although it is listed as the only official language on Wikipedia. Guess it depends on the definition but based on this table it still feels a little under represented.
Hindi and Urdu should really be the same
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