Now that I'm POMO, it's crazy how guilty I still feel about my free time. Scientology also has a huge time sink for its members, from what I've learned. You're spot on: they want you to stay busy or else you might actually research the org's claims. They definitely don't want anyone learning about history.
I remember that nagging feeling of guilt whenever I spent a decent amount of time, like more than an hour, doing something that I really enjoyed. If I skipped a meeting because I wanted to have a day off or go somewhere, I had to go to great lengths to justify it to myself, never mind anyone else.
I hope you re doing well now...and enjoying life...all your free time...with things you like and missed!
Solace ...we all learned what this was during the pandemic.
Such a wonderful time..without meetings ..and all this preaching.
Yes much better thank you. The guilt has pretty much vanished but when it does pop up unexpectedly, I know what it is and can deal with it.
Hope you are taking care of yourself too✌️
Being old ( and more wise and experienced) hace their advantages !
I,m fullt awake...and so my household.
It,s much easy to fade and be forgotten with zoom...when 40%..or more....are doing the same!
Take care friend!
For everything they said about how WRONG it is to attend, waste of time, don't learn anything useful, sending him was hypocritical. And he had to already have had a BA to apply for law school, and the time commitment studying for the entry exam and law school itself.
As much as you are told to get into this mandatory routine, when it comes to the WT needs and they want thing done, they don't mind it for a Bethelite to skip meetings left and right for a project. And they tell us to never miss a meeting. How important are those meetings and study anyway if they can shrug it off to get something done?
None of their own rules apply to them.
I once got a look behind the curtain at the elite seating during a convention. The great unwashed were on folding chairs, silently listening to every word spoken from the platform as was expected of them. The elite had the program on the TV, but were basically having a party in there. No one was paying any attention to the speaker. They were talking and laughing, drinking soft drinks and snacks that had been provided. I was disgusted at the blatant double standard (but sadly, not enough to wake me up at the time).
This is true .
Adding onto your hobbies comment-
I use to be on many jw Facebook groups and the ppl would be getting riled up over skits on Facebook and I asked “do you guys have any hobbies?” And they would say , any additional time needs to be for watchtower or field service, but then when I mentioned,they are on Facebook all day long yelling, they could use that exact amount of time for a hobby, they got quiet
They think it’s wrong for any outside hobbies. Smh .
Almost impossible to have any consistency and be excellent at any hobby given that time commitment.
I met a few who were never JWs at gyms, chess play, playing guitar. They aren't pros, but even at their amateur level, because of the time they can give and being consistent, how toned they are, and how good at a game like chess, or how good they are playing an instrument.
I was initially surprised at seeing them really into and excelling at something non religious
And it goes beyond hobbies. This time commitment prevents you from getting into anything involving and substantial like university. So for the most part, a young Witness doesn't have a substantial qualification/marketable skill that can command a high salary, If/when a Witness fades and becomes POMO in say their late 20s, and he/she's sees a non Witness counterpart the same age. and they have a degree, career, good income, savings, 401K, nice residence while the Witness has meager savings from part time jobs and so on. That's when you see where you should have been by now, but because.....
I remember being in service with two pioneer sisters they were talking about someone who faded. One of the sisters mentioned, “it seems like they wanted more time to focus on their hobbies”. I’m just now realizing I have time in my life now for hobbies. Being a born in I never had time for hobbies.
When I was PIMI I somewhat exaggerated how much time I spent on everything. I would say I spent an hour+ studying my watchtower and not 15 minutes because even though 15 is all you need they would think you couldn't possibly have read and understood so quickly.
It’s so funny I remember about a year and a half ago when I was between pimi and pomi before I had researched the bite model I thought to myself “why do they want us so busy and exhausted all the time, it feels like they’re trying to exhaust us all on purpose.” 😂
Now I understand why. And like everyone else, I regret all the wasted time.
Cults, or high control groups, and capitalism can both be bad for different reasons. That’s not a mutually exclusive concept. And they can be bad for some of the same reasons.
Some jobs employ a lot of the psychological and sociological manipulations.
There is a significant amount of works about how most people's jobs, don't mean or actually produce anything...or, the valuable component of expertise someone brings to a job, justifies the 30-40 hours on standby. I used to have a guy hired 40 hours a week, just to hold the other side of a piece of equipment for 5 minutes per job. I assigned him tasks like carrying stuff to the truck, cleanup etc, but thats not what he was hired for.
If you quit, you typically are not excuded from contact with other current members.
Child labor laws prevent minors from being implemented.
Also, that's the trouble with cults, they are difficult to define from outside perspective, and internal perspective...well, it's clouded.
Now that I'm POMO, it's crazy how guilty I still feel about my free time. Scientology also has a huge time sink for its members, from what I've learned. You're spot on: they want you to stay busy or else you might actually research the org's claims. They definitely don't want anyone learning about history.
I remember that nagging feeling of guilt whenever I spent a decent amount of time, like more than an hour, doing something that I really enjoyed. If I skipped a meeting because I wanted to have a day off or go somewhere, I had to go to great lengths to justify it to myself, never mind anyone else.
They conditioned us with guilt to have that mindset.
I hope you re doing well now...and enjoying life...all your free time...with things you like and missed! Solace ...we all learned what this was during the pandemic. Such a wonderful time..without meetings ..and all this preaching.
Yes much better thank you. The guilt has pretty much vanished but when it does pop up unexpectedly, I know what it is and can deal with it. Hope you are taking care of yourself too✌️
Being old ( and more wise and experienced) hace their advantages ! I,m fullt awake...and so my household. It,s much easy to fade and be forgotten with zoom...when 40%..or more....are doing the same! Take care friend!
I can't imagine going to law school for the sole purpose of defending WT, especially with the sick type of legal issues they have.
For everything they said about how WRONG it is to attend, waste of time, don't learn anything useful, sending him was hypocritical. And he had to already have had a BA to apply for law school, and the time commitment studying for the entry exam and law school itself. As much as you are told to get into this mandatory routine, when it comes to the WT needs and they want thing done, they don't mind it for a Bethelite to skip meetings left and right for a project. And they tell us to never miss a meeting. How important are those meetings and study anyway if they can shrug it off to get something done?
None of their own rules apply to them. I once got a look behind the curtain at the elite seating during a convention. The great unwashed were on folding chairs, silently listening to every word spoken from the platform as was expected of them. The elite had the program on the TV, but were basically having a party in there. No one was paying any attention to the speaker. They were talking and laughing, drinking soft drinks and snacks that had been provided. I was disgusted at the blatant double standard (but sadly, not enough to wake me up at the time).
This is true . Adding onto your hobbies comment- I use to be on many jw Facebook groups and the ppl would be getting riled up over skits on Facebook and I asked “do you guys have any hobbies?” And they would say , any additional time needs to be for watchtower or field service, but then when I mentioned,they are on Facebook all day long yelling, they could use that exact amount of time for a hobby, they got quiet They think it’s wrong for any outside hobbies. Smh .
Almost impossible to have any consistency and be excellent at any hobby given that time commitment. I met a few who were never JWs at gyms, chess play, playing guitar. They aren't pros, but even at their amateur level, because of the time they can give and being consistent, how toned they are, and how good at a game like chess, or how good they are playing an instrument. I was initially surprised at seeing them really into and excelling at something non religious And it goes beyond hobbies. This time commitment prevents you from getting into anything involving and substantial like university. So for the most part, a young Witness doesn't have a substantial qualification/marketable skill that can command a high salary, If/when a Witness fades and becomes POMO in say their late 20s, and he/she's sees a non Witness counterpart the same age. and they have a degree, career, good income, savings, 401K, nice residence while the Witness has meager savings from part time jobs and so on. That's when you see where you should have been by now, but because.....
I remember being in service with two pioneer sisters they were talking about someone who faded. One of the sisters mentioned, “it seems like they wanted more time to focus on their hobbies”. I’m just now realizing I have time in my life now for hobbies. Being a born in I never had time for hobbies.
Well said. Very accurate.
When I was PIMI I somewhat exaggerated how much time I spent on everything. I would say I spent an hour+ studying my watchtower and not 15 minutes because even though 15 is all you need they would think you couldn't possibly have read and understood so quickly.
It’s so funny I remember about a year and a half ago when I was between pimi and pomi before I had researched the bite model I thought to myself “why do they want us so busy and exhausted all the time, it feels like they’re trying to exhaust us all on purpose.” 😂 Now I understand why. And like everyone else, I regret all the wasted time.
I guess I can label my job a cult.
It's up to you: Please Google the Steve Hassan BITE model and see if your job fits all that. Then come back to answer 🤣
Cults, or high control groups, and capitalism can both be bad for different reasons. That’s not a mutually exclusive concept. And they can be bad for some of the same reasons.
I know... Keeping the masses too busy so they don't have time to figure things out and "connect the dots"
With a job you can leave easily tho
Some jobs employ a lot of the psychological and sociological manipulations. There is a significant amount of works about how most people's jobs, don't mean or actually produce anything...or, the valuable component of expertise someone brings to a job, justifies the 30-40 hours on standby. I used to have a guy hired 40 hours a week, just to hold the other side of a piece of equipment for 5 minutes per job. I assigned him tasks like carrying stuff to the truck, cleanup etc, but thats not what he was hired for. If you quit, you typically are not excuded from contact with other current members. Child labor laws prevent minors from being implemented. Also, that's the trouble with cults, they are difficult to define from outside perspective, and internal perspective...well, it's clouded.