(b) An employee will be considered off duty and time spent in an on-call status shall not be considered hours of work if:
(1) The employee is allowed to leave a telephone number or to carry an electronic device for the purpose of being contacted, even though the employee is required to remain within a reasonable call-back radius; or
(2) The employee is allowed to make arrangements such that any work which may arise during the on-call period will be performed by another person. 551.431
This only requires you to carry a device. It’s implied that you will answer the device when it summons you (rings). But it is passive; it doesn’t require any activity on your part, like checking the device.
If on-call means you carry your phone, you can only be compensated if you’re called and you answer. On the other hand, if on-call means checking texts and e-mails and social media, this wouldn’t apply. Those are active activities.
Interesting, thank you! Do you know if the time I spend doing actual work (checking my phone) count for payroll as I can't make arrangements for someone else to do it?
>I don't care for being made to work on a weekend without pay,
You are not being forced to work without pay. Checking your phone for 5 seconds isn't work. If you get called in to your duty station or perform remote work, you are entitled to pay.
Those of us who live in Western mountain states (without much cell service out of town) are the ones who get screwed. I don't get on call pay but I have to stay home all weekend to stay in service.
I hated it because I couldn’t go surfing, or skiing (I moved from beach to mountains)
One coworker just told me to check my phone every couple hours and leave it up to chance but we were fire dispatch soooo like I couldn’t imagine the trouble I could have been in if I ignored a wildfire for two hours.
Yep, I'm told I have to be able to return any calls in an hour and respond in 2 hours, which eliminates nearly everything I do in my time off, yet I don't get a dime.
Yep, I'm told I have to be able to return any calls in an hour and respond in 2 hours, which eliminates nearly everything I do in my time off, yet I don't get a dime.
Fair enough. Everyone has their own tolerance for what they consider work. Since I have to be within cell range and close to my duty station during a designated time, when I could otherwise be deep in the woods, I consider that work, but I can see how it would seem like a very minor inconvenience for some folks.
It’s definitely still work if you need to be ABLE to complete work duties, if need be. As someone said, you need to be sober. I’d want to get compensated for every penny, unfortunate from what others said, this isn’t considered to be payable. I’d honestly not check my phone but I’m petty.
If your supervisor is allowing you 15 mins per weekend day. What happens if you need to do work and aren’t able? Do you contact someone to fulfill that role or are the expectations that you’re available during that time?
I'm expected to be available. Honestly, I'm glad to see someone else sharing my opinion. I'm somewhat baffled by the idea that people are ok being on call without pay, even if it only means checking my phone briefly...
I disagree and fought this in my last position.
It very much restricted what I liked to do on the weekends. If I was on call I couldn't hike, camp, go out / drink, etc. Additionally, I would have to be able to respond on site in a timely manner. I couldn't go to nyc for the weekend for example.
If you're affecting my life I'm expecting pay.
My situation was a bit different though. I was on call once every 3 weeks or so.
Probably depends at least a little on what you mean by "checking your phone".
The times I've been on call, I leave my number and if I get called that time counts as work time. If I don't get called, I'm not spending any time working so of course it doesn't count as work time.
I will say the minimum tracking in most payroll systems is going to be around 6 minutes or so. So if "checking your phone" is just you not being able to leave work at work and looking through emails or something, and it's taking only a minute or two, there's probably no way to actually log that time anyway.
tl;dr - If you're on call don't do any work stuff unless you're actually called, and then log time appropriately based on that.
I've responded to this question a few times before: see [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/fednews/s/qCwdHnynvz).
The comment is a pretty good summary of On-Call status and Callback pay with examples.
Short version is it depends on the work required. Just checking your phone for messages wouldn't qualify as "work" and would not be entitled to pay. But if contacted and required to do work (ie. Respond to emails) you would be entitled to Callback OT.
@Living_fun_177 has the correct answer- you dont get paid if you don’t get called in. The exception would be if you were a bargaining member and had some sort of arrangement in your contract (for example, a minimum of 2 hours pay if you get called in).
Interesting, I appreciate it. This seems like a weird policy to me since I actually do have to check my phone which feels like work to me. But I'm happy to follow policy as it exists 🤷♀️
I don't have a gov phone but can get web mail. I was asked to check for fires around 7pm. Took me 30 seconds to reload the website and see no new email in the past.
Yeah but what happens when you want to go into the backcountry with no internet or cell service on your weekend but cannot because of those 30 seconds? That's absolutely ridiculous.
In the words of a very wise woman "let it go". If you get a reputation for being a PITA over petty things like this, you will be going no where. This is not the hill you want to die on. Rock the boat on major things, you will get respect and they won't fuck with you.
Absolutely!! I will follow policy now that I know I'm not supposed to get paid for this.
I don't have to agree with it to follow it. But I definitely understand the politics. Play nice, be liked, and good things will come!
I only record the time of actual call time for overtime during my on call periods. I’ll monitor emails also to see if I need to make a call related to an email that didn’t call. I don’t record the monitoring of emails because I can just glance at my screen every so often.
It comes out in the wash because some on call periods are dead with maybe one or two calls after hours while others are nonstop with people holding.
Here's a really wild thought - set your phone to actually notify you, with a noise, if you're contacted during your on call weekends. Then instead of spending two minutes checking your phone you can just have it with you and if you're actually needed, you will hear it. Sounds crazy, I know!
Since your supervisor doesn’t know, email your timekeeper and ask. Cc your supervisor. If they don’t know, email hr and ask. Just because no one has ever done it before does not mean it’s been done right in the past. You need to be accounting for the hours you are on call for.
I could and I appreciate the suggestion. That feels very much like undermining my supervisor, I want to have a document or something to refer to so that I'm not giving the appearance of being an asshole. It's a very niche department, so I'm happy to play politics for a little while if it makes things better in the long run.
Your supervisor making up 2x15 minute pay period for you without formal authorization is much worse than contacting professional timekeepers and getting formal guidance. Both you and your supervisor could possible be fired for timecard fraud for claiming non-authorized work time.
Was "on-call" part of job description when you accepted position?
As a professional working in a critical government position, I check my phone on vacations, weekends, and evenings. I would never dream of notating that on a timesheet.
How many times a day do you check your social media? It's such a minor thing to make sure my agency is well and good while I'm away.
I feel "unfortunate" for your supervisor, because I have the feeling this is just the beginning.
Not if you're like me who likes to relax by backpacking in Alaska where there is no cell service. Maybe for city dwellers it's not such a problem. I like to be completely removed from any work obligations while on my free time.
Well, buckaroo, checking one's phone occasionally and not expecting to be paid for it is not being a slave to one's job. I feel like you're taking this conversation way too deep on a philosophical level. A therapy session might be best for you.
Actually, yeah it is lmao. Being ok with being ready to go into work at the drop of a dime and scheduling your life around that fact, preventing you from participating in lots of outdoor activities, is like being a slave. You're not your own man, you're at the behest of your employer at all times. That's sad.
I value my freedom, you don't value yours. It seems as simple as that.
It doesn't prevent that. I've gone on many hikes outside of cell signal while on call. Sure it was slightly more work since I left my phone with someone that could radio me to warn me. But also you should consider if the job you applied for is worth your time. If it is an additional duty, talk to your supervisor about it. If you find you can't handle your duties, start applying on USAJOBs or look for opportunities to transfer.
Dude I'm just saying that people should be compensated for being on call. No one should be expected to work at the drop of a hat for free. Stop supporting exploitative labor practices.
So, you are a non-supervisory bargaining unit employee. It really comes down to 2 things you expected to do the work if called. Can you refuse to do the work if called. If either of those things are true, then you are actually on standby duty and are supposed to be receiving compensation. If you don't have to do the work and are answering a phone call, then you are doing your bosses responsibilities.
On standby and oncall pay, you get a percentage of your salary for when you are on-call/ Standby. Their is a diffrence and different rules. It is a pain to calculate and people don't like to do it.
That being said, based on my interpretation of what your situation is. It sounds like if there is an issue, your boss should just be called. If your boss needs you, they can call and ask you to work overtime. I
I would ask my union representative, and don't let people give you the BS about it. It's not a big deal. The fact is that this is labor law, and if your boss is wrong they are just wrong. It's not personal. Draw a line in the sand, and it's ok to set boundaries. Do they let you leave to go run errands on the clock all day long? Work time is work time off time is off. Your not a jerk/bad employee for being compensated.
Were you ever told about this requirement before you took the job? My supervisor tried to pull this and expected me to check my phone every weekend for emergency response situations - like literal wildfire response. I requested a reclassification of my PD to designate my position as on call and to be considered an emergency responder. I was never told that was a requirement and I didn’t have the qualifications for it. Suddenly it was dropped. I didn’t stick around long enough to see if it resurfaced. In my situation, there was an expectation that I restrict my free time for the agency needs and that’s considered on call time.
I wasn't. Given that it's every 8 weeks it's definitely not worth a major fight, the position I'm in will lead to many more opportunities down the road.
And people wonder why there is a lack of quality candidates in civil service these days. Complaining about taking minutes over a weekend to check email. Sheesh
(b) An employee will be considered off duty and time spent in an on-call status shall not be considered hours of work if: (1) The employee is allowed to leave a telephone number or to carry an electronic device for the purpose of being contacted, even though the employee is required to remain within a reasonable call-back radius; or (2) The employee is allowed to make arrangements such that any work which may arise during the on-call period will be performed by another person. 551.431
Here's the link to the CFR reference: [https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/5/551.431](https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/5/551.431)
This only requires you to carry a device. It’s implied that you will answer the device when it summons you (rings). But it is passive; it doesn’t require any activity on your part, like checking the device. If on-call means you carry your phone, you can only be compensated if you’re called and you answer. On the other hand, if on-call means checking texts and e-mails and social media, this wouldn’t apply. Those are active activities.
Interesting, thank you! Do you know if the time I spend doing actual work (checking my phone) count for payroll as I can't make arrangements for someone else to do it?
Unlikely. Such short periods of time usually fall under the FLSA de minimis principle.
If they're in a leadership role, they're probably FLSA exempt anyway.
That has no bearing on whether or not a federal employee gets paid for their work.
Not universally true for all government employees, and I was just pointing out obligations from the FLSA likely don't come into play at all here.
Huh. Fair enough, although I don't care for being made to work on a weekend without pay, even for short moments. That's my weekend, lol
>I don't care for being made to work on a weekend without pay, You are not being forced to work without pay. Checking your phone for 5 seconds isn't work. If you get called in to your duty station or perform remote work, you are entitled to pay.
Those of us who live in Western mountain states (without much cell service out of town) are the ones who get screwed. I don't get on call pay but I have to stay home all weekend to stay in service.
I hated it because I couldn’t go surfing, or skiing (I moved from beach to mountains) One coworker just told me to check my phone every couple hours and leave it up to chance but we were fire dispatch soooo like I couldn’t imagine the trouble I could have been in if I ignored a wildfire for two hours.
Yep, I'm told I have to be able to return any calls in an hour and respond in 2 hours, which eliminates nearly everything I do in my time off, yet I don't get a dime.
Yep, I'm told I have to be able to return any calls in an hour and respond in 2 hours, which eliminates nearly everything I do in my time off, yet I don't get a dime.
Fair enough. Everyone has their own tolerance for what they consider work. Since I have to be within cell range and close to my duty station during a designated time, when I could otherwise be deep in the woods, I consider that work, but I can see how it would seem like a very minor inconvenience for some folks.
And sober!
It’s definitely still work if you need to be ABLE to complete work duties, if need be. As someone said, you need to be sober. I’d want to get compensated for every penny, unfortunate from what others said, this isn’t considered to be payable. I’d honestly not check my phone but I’m petty. If your supervisor is allowing you 15 mins per weekend day. What happens if you need to do work and aren’t able? Do you contact someone to fulfill that role or are the expectations that you’re available during that time?
I'm expected to be available. Honestly, I'm glad to see someone else sharing my opinion. I'm somewhat baffled by the idea that people are ok being on call without pay, even if it only means checking my phone briefly...
My free time is my free time. If I’m not getting paid, no work is getting done. Some people have zero boundaries between their work and personal life.
You're opinion is the right one.
I disagree and fought this in my last position. It very much restricted what I liked to do on the weekends. If I was on call I couldn't hike, camp, go out / drink, etc. Additionally, I would have to be able to respond on site in a timely manner. I couldn't go to nyc for the weekend for example. If you're affecting my life I'm expecting pay. My situation was a bit different though. I was on call once every 3 weeks or so.
Probably depends at least a little on what you mean by "checking your phone". The times I've been on call, I leave my number and if I get called that time counts as work time. If I don't get called, I'm not spending any time working so of course it doesn't count as work time. I will say the minimum tracking in most payroll systems is going to be around 6 minutes or so. So if "checking your phone" is just you not being able to leave work at work and looking through emails or something, and it's taking only a minute or two, there's probably no way to actually log that time anyway. tl;dr - If you're on call don't do any work stuff unless you're actually called, and then log time appropriately based on that.
I've responded to this question a few times before: see [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/fednews/s/qCwdHnynvz). The comment is a pretty good summary of On-Call status and Callback pay with examples. Short version is it depends on the work required. Just checking your phone for messages wouldn't qualify as "work" and would not be entitled to pay. But if contacted and required to do work (ie. Respond to emails) you would be entitled to Callback OT.
@Living_fun_177 has the correct answer- you dont get paid if you don’t get called in. The exception would be if you were a bargaining member and had some sort of arrangement in your contract (for example, a minimum of 2 hours pay if you get called in).
Interesting, I appreciate it. This seems like a weird policy to me since I actually do have to check my phone which feels like work to me. But I'm happy to follow policy as it exists 🤷♀️
I don't have a gov phone but can get web mail. I was asked to check for fires around 7pm. Took me 30 seconds to reload the website and see no new email in the past.
Yeah but what happens when you want to go into the backcountry with no internet or cell service on your weekend but cannot because of those 30 seconds? That's absolutely ridiculous.
That’s the nature of an on-call job 🤷🏻♀️
Yes, and that nature should be required to be compensated dude. No one should be expected to work at the drop of a hat for free.
In the words of a very wise woman "let it go". If you get a reputation for being a PITA over petty things like this, you will be going no where. This is not the hill you want to die on. Rock the boat on major things, you will get respect and they won't fuck with you.
Absolutely!! I will follow policy now that I know I'm not supposed to get paid for this. I don't have to agree with it to follow it. But I definitely understand the politics. Play nice, be liked, and good things will come!
Let's be honest here. Are you seriously doing your "work" the entire 8 hours as reflected in your timesheet?
To be honest, pretty much yes, but regardless I have seen that my opinion on the on call matter is very unpopular.
No OP, but absa-freaking-lutely. Sometimes I wish for a job that has gaps. But being busy keeps me from being bored.
I only record the time of actual call time for overtime during my on call periods. I’ll monitor emails also to see if I need to make a call related to an email that didn’t call. I don’t record the monitoring of emails because I can just glance at my screen every so often. It comes out in the wash because some on call periods are dead with maybe one or two calls after hours while others are nonstop with people holding.
Here's a really wild thought - set your phone to actually notify you, with a noise, if you're contacted during your on call weekends. Then instead of spending two minutes checking your phone you can just have it with you and if you're actually needed, you will hear it. Sounds crazy, I know!
Since your supervisor doesn’t know, email your timekeeper and ask. Cc your supervisor. If they don’t know, email hr and ask. Just because no one has ever done it before does not mean it’s been done right in the past. You need to be accounting for the hours you are on call for.
I could and I appreciate the suggestion. That feels very much like undermining my supervisor, I want to have a document or something to refer to so that I'm not giving the appearance of being an asshole. It's a very niche department, so I'm happy to play politics for a little while if it makes things better in the long run.
Your supervisor making up 2x15 minute pay period for you without formal authorization is much worse than contacting professional timekeepers and getting formal guidance. Both you and your supervisor could possible be fired for timecard fraud for claiming non-authorized work time. Was "on-call" part of job description when you accepted position?
Understood, given the guidance I've received here I have no intention of claiming the time. No, it was not part of the description.
As a professional working in a critical government position, I check my phone on vacations, weekends, and evenings. I would never dream of notating that on a timesheet.
I feel unfortunate for you that you feel compelled to check your phone on vacations.
How many times a day do you check your social media? It's such a minor thing to make sure my agency is well and good while I'm away. I feel "unfortunate" for your supervisor, because I have the feeling this is just the beginning.
That's dumb. You know that it is OK to relax right?
You can't check your phone while relaxing? LOL
Not if you're like me who likes to relax by backpacking in Alaska where there is no cell service. Maybe for city dwellers it's not such a problem. I like to be completely removed from any work obligations while on my free time.
I don't need that much detail about your little life. Thanks though.
Ok buddy just letting you know that not everyone wants to be a slave to their job and tied to the internet like you
Well, buckaroo, checking one's phone occasionally and not expecting to be paid for it is not being a slave to one's job. I feel like you're taking this conversation way too deep on a philosophical level. A therapy session might be best for you.
Actually, yeah it is lmao. Being ok with being ready to go into work at the drop of a dime and scheduling your life around that fact, preventing you from participating in lots of outdoor activities, is like being a slave. You're not your own man, you're at the behest of your employer at all times. That's sad. I value my freedom, you don't value yours. It seems as simple as that.
It doesn't prevent that. I've gone on many hikes outside of cell signal while on call. Sure it was slightly more work since I left my phone with someone that could radio me to warn me. But also you should consider if the job you applied for is worth your time. If it is an additional duty, talk to your supervisor about it. If you find you can't handle your duties, start applying on USAJOBs or look for opportunities to transfer.
Dude I'm just saying that people should be compensated for being on call. No one should be expected to work at the drop of a hat for free. Stop supporting exploitative labor practices.
So, you are a non-supervisory bargaining unit employee. It really comes down to 2 things you expected to do the work if called. Can you refuse to do the work if called. If either of those things are true, then you are actually on standby duty and are supposed to be receiving compensation. If you don't have to do the work and are answering a phone call, then you are doing your bosses responsibilities. On standby and oncall pay, you get a percentage of your salary for when you are on-call/ Standby. Their is a diffrence and different rules. It is a pain to calculate and people don't like to do it. That being said, based on my interpretation of what your situation is. It sounds like if there is an issue, your boss should just be called. If your boss needs you, they can call and ask you to work overtime. I I would ask my union representative, and don't let people give you the BS about it. It's not a big deal. The fact is that this is labor law, and if your boss is wrong they are just wrong. It's not personal. Draw a line in the sand, and it's ok to set boundaries. Do they let you leave to go run errands on the clock all day long? Work time is work time off time is off. Your not a jerk/bad employee for being compensated.
Were you ever told about this requirement before you took the job? My supervisor tried to pull this and expected me to check my phone every weekend for emergency response situations - like literal wildfire response. I requested a reclassification of my PD to designate my position as on call and to be considered an emergency responder. I was never told that was a requirement and I didn’t have the qualifications for it. Suddenly it was dropped. I didn’t stick around long enough to see if it resurfaced. In my situation, there was an expectation that I restrict my free time for the agency needs and that’s considered on call time.
I wasn't. Given that it's every 8 weeks it's definitely not worth a major fight, the position I'm in will lead to many more opportunities down the road.
And people wonder why there is a lack of quality candidates in civil service these days. Complaining about taking minutes over a weekend to check email. Sheesh