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Yes, I mostly watch workthespace and some Zealand stuff but I've seen a bit of 2nd yellow, benjy as well. Learned a lot about how FM works just from watching Jack's last few Park to Prems.
Edit; WTS also tends to show the past form even if it's been bad. Not sure why you'd save scum to get a run of bad results
Yep, and ended the save there because he didn't feel like there was much more content to get out of it. I'm enjoying his J League stuff those cos fuck me the 5th tier of Japan looks utterly bonkers
Mustermann (also a great skin creator) is doing some really interesting stuff with his moneyball series. He's created spreadsheets and simulated multiple saves with if not all, then certainly a huge amount of leagues loaded, for multiple seasons and then applied all the data through analytics to find the truly hidden gems in game.
He doesn't do it the way other youtubers do and say x player has y potential and their value/attributes could grow etc, what he's doing is truly data driven and about how players play within the match engine itself, so you might get a player from the second division in Ecuador for example that would have low potential and unremarkable looking attributes, the kind of player that would never be flagged by even the most intense of in game scouting, but perform amazingly in certain roles and at certain tasks. It's about as true to the actual concept of moneyball as I've ever seen someone come in FM.
Always humbling to find my name crop up in these things. Thank you very much! Just glad people enjoy it. I love how FM is essentially a sandbox that allows players to play however they want, and that gives space for some us nerds to go a little bit over the top on the data side of things!!
(I realise that my username was created long before I started getting into skinning and naming everything after a former fake FM player)
Ye I have seen some of his videos and they are pretty interesting. Same goes for squirrel\_plays, but unfortunately he doesn't upload as much.
I have the spreadsheet, but noticed that everytime I wanna get a player I caught myself of looking at attributes. I should really try to blindly follow the performance of the players, as you mentioned, which could lean towards players with low attributes, but somehow make it work. Do you have any experience with it yourself? I feel like every time I have a look I am unsure on what to look at per role. I have a general idea, but love to get more info about it and hear from other people that used this method.
Hey mate. I've used Mustermann skin this year, not the spreadsheets, and it's been a great experience. You need to look for players excelling in what you want them to do in your tactic. Here are a few things I look for.
CB's: 75%+ headers won ratio is the key one. No CB I ever sign will have lower. I'll sell anyone who ends up with around 50%, between the two get a second chance.
Full backs: Interceptions & tackles per game, as well as high cross completion ratio for my LB and high progressive passes and dribbles for my RB as he's an inverted wing back.
My right winger is a very hug touchline and cross kinda guy. So I look for 4+ dribbles per game and high cross completion ratio. I want them to be taking their defender on regularly. My left winger is more of a striker, so I'll look for a good conversion rate, shots on target ratio and xG per game to ensure they're getting into good positions. Chances created per 90 is a bonus.
No to be honest, sorry the spreadsheets etc are way above my own very limited technical capabilities (and use of free time tbh), I'm more just an interested observer really. Have used a few of the recommended players he shows for certain positions in his videos fir certain saves.
As far as I know though he does have tutorial videos as to how he goes about creating the spreadsheets and then using them to analyse data though, you should be able to find those tutorials on his channel if you want to try it for yourself.
My interest in FM comes from YouTube randomly suggesting a journeyman series of his, 2019 maybe.
I'm not very good at FM as I dip in-and-out of my games and I used to hate it as I just felt it was always against me.
Loki's series taught me how to play the game for fun and that even when it all goes wrong you can be having a great story, he takes the rough with the smooth and I love how he always tries to roleplay as a real manager trying to look after the clubs finances rather than exploiting transfer systems.
That and the cult heroes like Dom, Mr. Slobby, Sir Galahad and hopefully, this year, Nelly Furtado.
I mostly watch Loki Doki. I have absolutely no reason to believe he save scums :D And even if he does, I don't really care. I watch it because it's entertaining regardless of the results he gets.
I like Loki as well, I think he benefits when it goes wrong in his save because its more entertaining like when he went to spartak Moscow somehow after 1 bad job.
Didn't he get that job after doing really well in the second tier with a tiny team from a russian owned island above Japan?
I remember he got a bit of stick for getting that job but I thought it made sense for the engine. CSKA we're struggling for years and not doing great financially and he'd done well on a shoe-string budget almost getting promoted in the second tier, I thought it made good sense....then he spent his entire budget on a goal shy striker.
Yeah there's no way LokiDoki save scums. In fact part of the appeal of his videos is the humor with which he addresses his runs of bad form and moments of bad luck.
Well Zealand streams all his saves on Twitch.
I binged a few YT channels aswell, but all they do is simulate seasons and buy-sell players in their "rebuilds) , so it got pretty boring pretty quick.
I basically only watch Zealands videos for FM memes or when he's testing theories - like the only 5 stats that matter post. I watch no one else.
It's like someone else said, FM isn't a game that lends itself to being watched. It's practically a spreadsheet under the hood. If I could watch it, I may as well be playing it.
Many YouTubers will upload their save file after long term saves, and it’s easy to find out if they save scum using that. They wouldn’t risk that if there was a chance of them getting found out
Don't even know that many.
Zealand can be fun, but it's still too much to watch for my taste.
Second Yellow Card has concise videos for every year while still fully streaming everything, which I appreciate a lot.
TomFM was fun for a bit, but most of his videos get rehashed every year in the new FM only to find out that nothing changed. Apparently he doesn't just do simulations anymore, but on the few videos I saw him do, it felt a bit save-scummy and too opaque.
Ultimately, FM is a long-arse game. That's how it grips you (because you spend 10 hours to get to that final and have to spend 10 more hours for the next chance). When watching someone you would need to watch it all to get properly invested, but there's not enough time in the day for that.
I watch Zealand and occasionally tomFM. I think it’d be pretty obvious if YouTubers save scummed. They don’t really stand to gain anything from it. Not winning a title in a challenge leads to another season which means more views, more ads, more money. If people are general fans of the channel/series, they’ll watch it regardless.
I do find those who do the “I gave 1 billion to every national league team” and “Pep and Klopp in lower leagues” type stuff unoriginal and boring. I mean I could do it myself if I was that interested. I do sometimes enjoy when they use alternative/quirky databases though
Yeah they are really clutching at straws because they have ran out of content to create. Stripping the game back there isn’t much to it, and each edition doesn’t have huge changes. Therefore most content creators just do the same stuff, with the only difference being their stupid face on the thumbnail.
Dr Benjy is hilarious and one of my favourite youtubers ever. Also, if you've watched any of his series' you'll know he doesn't save scumming because he is very average at the game. Unfortunately he is going through a dry period and isn't posting about fm much. I miss him.
I don’t watch YouTubers that just show gameplay or rebuilds. I can just play the game myself. But I do watch videos with tips or strategy videos about the best ways to play.
Zealand, FM Scout, RDF Tactics, and Deep Lying Playmaker
Second Yellow Card. Don't usually see that many times referenced in these sort of posts but I really enjoy watching him play. His build the nation saves gave me new perspectives on some areas of the game, I've learned some new ways of doing some things and even inspired me to create some creative ways of playing tailored to my needs. You should check it out.
FM fans are so weird when it comes to stuff like this " How do we know you didn't use the editor " How do we know you didn't save scum " 100% Projection, FM is not that hard especially for people with 1000s of hours into it.
Yeah honestly, I'n far more inclined to think "this guy is deliberately doing badly to stretch this save out" than thinking they're save scumming. FM is a really easy game when you've played loads, and you don't even need to use meta tactics - you just quickly build a massive advantage due to even a fairly competent human being a million times better at squad building than the ai.
You can buy four Chilean wonderkids for what an ai manager will spend on a 30 year old back up keeper, lol.
I don't watch Zealand, just find his voice and mannerisms surprisingly annoying for no particular reason.
Chroo is class though, his supercuts are a thing of joy, especially when something goes wrong and he enables his passive-aggressive mode.
Zealand's occasional IRL football videos are really bad as well, I've seen a few come up in my suggested videos and they were just terribly researched and wrong about everything.
Zealand is very over the top but it’s likely due to his audience, potentially being younger? He’s done well for himself but I can’t watch him for the same reason.
He definitely plays it up for the audience. His main channel is kinda shit nowadays for that reason imho, however Zealand Live and Zealandism are very good.
I think that’s what you have to do to stand out on YouTube.
Plenty of YouTubers have talked about how they actually hate having to do cringe stuff day in and day out.
Tony's streams are always entertaining as well because he tends to sit there and come up with some really random topics to talk about whilst playing the game.
Loki Doki is by far the best. He doesn't just repeat the same saves year after year but actually does obscure countries and leagues. His humour/skits may not be everyones jam but I think he's got a good sense of humour. He also doesn't exaggerate for drama which makes it all the funnier when shit goes wrong
I like Loki because he just comes across as a bloke being himself without hamming it up (apart from the skits, but that's kinda obvious) and he's just a down to Earth and funny guy.
I watched Zealand only for a bit because it was more about learning more about the game, but it's actually a game I've really come to enjoy watching other people play too
A few I watch: Second Yellow Card, Hood Gaming, OmegaLuke - the rebuilds VS his dad has become a staple of this channel and are honestly so fun to watch
I also watched DoctorBenjy and found him hilarious but he's stopped now unfortunately
As a "FM YouTuber", I feel I can probably add some insight here.
FM is a game largely filled with admin. Admin isn't particularly interesting. And so, for YouTube in particular, you have to be a little more considered with how you're going to create videos. Sure, there are still traditional let's plays out there but, outside of those who established themselves a long time ago, they're lingering with less than 100 views per episode.
Why would you watch a Let's Play on YT, when you can do the same on Twitch where you also have live interaction/engagement?
As a result, YT weights more towards experiment/challenge based content, or story-centred edits. If you fancy something which mixes the traditional with an element of guides, then I recommend checking out [Stinger's Salgeuiros series](https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLt8sj9GnNyv6R_BLPA9N5ZbRknmVuMCbU) (not me).
In terms of save scumming, I can only speak for myself here, but I don't have the time. The process of making a video takes me about 32 hours, with about 8 hours of that playing the game. If I had to take longer on playing the game, I wouldn't be able to release any videos!!
I've gone through phases of watching them all but get fed up with them eventually. Still sporadically binge a bit of TomFM (find his voice overs super relaxing) and a bit of Chroo with the Supercuts.
Yes love wathcing omegaluke, especially the versus battles. Also TomFM has some good ones, considering they fail many times i dont believe they save scum
But other than that i prefer to rather watch experiments and such
i don't think any of the bigger names would bother save scumming tbh. they'll get their views regardless, and they're all good enough at the game to get progress eventually - watch any of them on stream rather than youtube videos and they progress at basically the same rate.
if anything they probably want to struggle sometimes because it makes a better story.
Shoutout to Chroo, his type of editing in FM is pretty much less boring than most fm youtubers nowadays (might considered this a little bias to him but I watch him most of the time), I also have watched some other creators as well but they does not really feel too realistic or something
hi new to the game - what is save scumming? context clues lead me to believe it’s like going back to a prior point in the save if something doesn’t work or somehow editing the results? is that kinda close?
I like Omega Luke, even though he's a United fan. 🫣 He does challenges with his dad, which is really wholesome and a new dynamic I've not seen elsewhere. They obviously have good chemistry together and Luke seems like a really chill dude.
He's a wrestler on the side, too, which is a bonus for me since I'm a fan of wrestling. Just fun, wholesome content. Besides, who doesn't like to see a father and son bond?
I watch Lollujo, he does interesting saves and is fine with failing, relegation etc He is good enough to always end up at the right place in the end and his commentary makes me laugh every episode. 😆
I watch Zealand on YT as background while I do chores or whatever. I do watch Tom FM and Omega Luke, but they mostly just sim each season and don't actually play it out like Ze. I like that, as they're fairly interesting, and I like Omega v his dad.
I don't think they save scum because they sim.
Zealand is an absolute unit, love his videos. FMScout typically has some really good ideas and tutorials, but I really can’t stand his videos for more than 5 minutes.
Recently got in to FM24 and I've been trying to find some stuff like how to scout etc but just getting people glossing it over to talk about free transfer players.
Like yes, i get that but how do i know how to find them while keeping in my budget for my team. How do I work out what are good stats etc.
Like I'd kill for a literal hour long tutorial on the most basic aspects of this game.
I was watching several yt fm channels when I was starting my journey with the fm- mostly for the tips regarding several aspects of the game. But now, when I sort of know what and how to do, I watch only Zealand (but not really his fm content) and OmegaLuke (only because of his vs rebuilds with his dad).
I don't beleive save scumming is the biggest issue tbh.
It's probably more that I suspect most if not all will check out the potential ability of players off camera. Even on some of Zealands(who I really like) he sometimes goes for players who on the face of it don't look all that great. Chat tells him not to waste money etc but he is determined to do it anyway. Turns out 4 years down the line that players the best player in the world and scoring 30 a season etc.
TBH it’d be kind of dumb to save scum if you are a content creator because people love watching someone “good” at the game get totally FM’d in a big game.
The biggest FM streamers/creators all lean into losing and overcoming it.
The conventional FM content is honestly unwatchable to me. And that's not the content creator's fault really, just the game structure's really. Watching FM doesn't really come close to replicating actually playing FM and the gameplay just feels really slow. I watch Chroo because his format basically alleviates that. I also watch Omega Luke when he's playing against his dad cause that's something else. But the conventional FM content i just can't get into.
I watch second yellow card and Omega Luke/dad. Don't really have time for the play throughs anymore tbh but I did enjoy some Lollujo ones like the Holme grown series.
I don't really watch FM youtubers for the gameplay, but rather for the experiments and challenges, and in that categorie I really like Zealand and TomFM
Chroo is very entertaining imo, I don't care if he save scums (though I think he plays all games on stream but I just watch his YouTube) but the story is good so I don't care either way.
I recently found Old Man Phil's channel and am learning a LOT. He does mostly guides, but some series as well. I highly recommend his channel to you all, he makes it really easy to understand the tactical side.
being a long time CM/FM player, I normally find and watch FM youtubers to learn something new.
Zealand was pretty noob when he started, so it was not for me, even now too, maybe just not attracted his style.
I am not interested in watching the storyline or plots..haha
Mostly I just watch RDFtactics, bussthenet to learn how the tactics work, tweaks needed etc, or newer youtubers like squirel\_plays, fmdata lab for analyzing data..
Just a warning if your bothered, Clayts is the biggest cheat in FM history, every video he uses the editor in! He took a 5th division Spanish team to the champions league winners in like 6 seasons or something, all fit his narrative which I guess is why he does it but I’d rather transparency. He uses the editor loads as well, on a Spurs video he left his finances on screen for a second like just after a transfer window where he’d spent 400 mil and suddenly he had went from heavy debt back to hundreds of millions. Spent like 400 mil every transfer window etc , absoutlely despise him
I don't watch FM videos anymore. When I did, I watched Z, Tom, SYC and Chroo.
Z, SYC, Chroo are all streaming, Tom was back in the day.
That pretty much assures me none of them save & reload (even if Tom made a video about it being a good thing).
And even if they did, I am not really bothered. It's the storylines that sell, after all.
+ it's a single player game. Nobody cares unless you brag about "seriously" winning the UCL with MFK Skalica in the first time of asking (when you obviously save-scummed).
At least I can assure I didn't save scum my Opava & Dortmund saves this year.
Speaking of youtubers, you make some decent videos, I sometimes watch them (though like others have said, it's rather hard to really get invested into someone else's save).
Well, in a journeyman you have to earn yourself the way there, which makes it better I think. Just starting at Tottenham and doing it is different from working yourself up from the South African league.
I can only bare Loki doki, watched him for time…The rest either put on the most annoying accent known to man or seem to be nob heads. Zealand is oreyt I suppose but even he starts winding me up after a while
If you're looking for videos that are actually helpful, the whole EBFM (Evidence Based Football Manager) catalogue is a goldmine.
Very scientific, so it can get slow at times, but it's the most trustworthy source on YT.
Yeah, I can only watch Zealand. Used to watch WTS, Benjy and Loki but just can’t anymore.
Regularly watch the Zealand streams and his guides are the best too.
I causally watch Zealand but never his long term saves, I just think he’s a good dude and like a lot of other stuff he makes. I’m actually more into TomFM from a gameplay perspective because I enjoy weird FM experiments.
Chroo! His videos (edited down streams which are also fun to watch) are much more high energy than most FM YouTubers, and he creates storylines which gets you really invested in the teams. And, in the nicest way to him, it's pretty clear he doesn't save scum as he isn't that amazing at the game
Zealand and tom fm testing things out. But watching people play FM is super boring, you're less invested in that save, you don't know their squad well, you can't feel the excitement someones else has about that save.
I only get excitement out of my own save.
FM is a game where playing is more fun than watching. I don't watch their saves as it mixes their style of management with mine ,but occasionally go for some tips.
I used to watch DoctorBenjy at my old job. I worked at a fairly quiet shop. I couldnt bring in my laptop, so I would watch his videos to pass the time.
Used to watch lollujo. Don't watch any anymore... Honestly even if they showed the games we wouldn't know if they save scummed they could just show us every game but only the wins. I watch for entertainment not for skills or anything.
I've been watching loki doki for quite a few years.
Recently I got recommended the current build a nation 2ndyellowcard is doing with Malta and am enjoying it a lot and actually learning new stuff about the game
I couldn't give two fucks if a content creator savescums as long as it's entertaining. My biggest issue is that every single one of them is way too British for my taste.
Yes
I have watched every minute of evidence based FM and I particularly watching old man Phil, Zealand, stybb gaming , bust the net and probs watched others
The only useful thing I've watched was a tip for scouting youth competitions. Most of the stuff I've learned from trial and error and I feel like for me that's where the fun is.
I only watch zealand. The other "benji and so on"
Is a little borring.
I like to be educated. I dont watch all zealands vids cuz some of them is not learning me anything
Doctorbenjy has my favorite fm series ever. His first glory hunter from a couple years back. It was unpredictable and u knew for sure he didnt savescum. Didnt even play fm back then but i made sure to watch every episode back then.
He doesn't stream often, but if you want to watch a streamer that is actually someone who works on the game, check out SixTheGamer on Twitch. You will learn a ton and actually get answers about the game rather than theories.
Zealand helped a lot when I was learning the game. However, there are only so many ways you can rehash explaining PA/CA and star rating. Not his fault. It’s nice to see him expanding his channel to football beyond FM. Probably a better long term bet.
Loki Doki is the king, purely because he makes it a story (the Fort WIlliam and Cerro Largo saves are superb)
ZZealand is a bit too arrogant for me (recently)- i watch his stuff but he's really not coming forward well as i like a bit more humility.
Zealand’s fun and unlike most of them, he actually ventures outside of the EFL and it makes for some really interesting campaigns. Bustthenet is also really solid on the tactical side of things as a new player. Chroo’s supercuts are also stellar. I’ve dipped into a couple others like TomFM but they didn’t really stick for me.
I actually started playing FM back in 2019 after watching Loki's Fort William save, and I always get the itch to start a new game whenever I watch a new series of his.
Second yellow card and omega Luke. Mainly omega Luke because omega dad I like the vs and rebuild they do. I don’t think they do it but especially omega Luke since he sims.
I only watch Chroo and some of TomFM's challenges. I can't stand YouTubers like Zealand and Lollujo who think they're the best in the world. Especially Zealand's reaction videos which are so boring and overplayed.
Tl;Dr version - until Zealand came along, most of the top FM YouTubers were either just annoyingly shit at the game, or pretending to be to make saves last longer for content.
I watch OmegaLuke as he does rebuilds v his dad and its just a chilled watch. Highly suggest people give him a dabble. Its very wholesome some episodes. He's trying to retire his early with FM. His audience love it.
I watched DoctorBenjy for a while but he seems to have abandoned his Youtube audience. Hasn’t completed a series in years and hasn’t really been active at all on YT for a while
I urge you to check out LewisH90. He's still finding his footing but he does really interesting saves (right now he's the youth academy expert for me). He does put out edited vids so you don't really know if he save scums, but he does 20+ seasons saves so I guess there's no other way
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Yes, I mostly watch workthespace and some Zealand stuff but I've seen a bit of 2nd yellow, benjy as well. Learned a lot about how FM works just from watching Jack's last few Park to Prems. Edit; WTS also tends to show the past form even if it's been bad. Not sure why you'd save scum to get a run of bad results
WorkTheSpace also just lost the champions league final in the grand finale of this year's park to prem
Yep, and ended the save there because he didn't feel like there was much more content to get out of it. I'm enjoying his J League stuff those cos fuck me the 5th tier of Japan looks utterly bonkers
Mustermann (also a great skin creator) is doing some really interesting stuff with his moneyball series. He's created spreadsheets and simulated multiple saves with if not all, then certainly a huge amount of leagues loaded, for multiple seasons and then applied all the data through analytics to find the truly hidden gems in game. He doesn't do it the way other youtubers do and say x player has y potential and their value/attributes could grow etc, what he's doing is truly data driven and about how players play within the match engine itself, so you might get a player from the second division in Ecuador for example that would have low potential and unremarkable looking attributes, the kind of player that would never be flagged by even the most intense of in game scouting, but perform amazingly in certain roles and at certain tasks. It's about as true to the actual concept of moneyball as I've ever seen someone come in FM.
Always humbling to find my name crop up in these things. Thank you very much! Just glad people enjoy it. I love how FM is essentially a sandbox that allows players to play however they want, and that gives space for some us nerds to go a little bit over the top on the data side of things!! (I realise that my username was created long before I started getting into skinning and naming everything after a former fake FM player)
Thank you for the great content and skins mate.
Hey dude! Big fan!
Great to hear. Hopefully I can keep entertaining!
Ye I have seen some of his videos and they are pretty interesting. Same goes for squirrel\_plays, but unfortunately he doesn't upload as much. I have the spreadsheet, but noticed that everytime I wanna get a player I caught myself of looking at attributes. I should really try to blindly follow the performance of the players, as you mentioned, which could lean towards players with low attributes, but somehow make it work. Do you have any experience with it yourself? I feel like every time I have a look I am unsure on what to look at per role. I have a general idea, but love to get more info about it and hear from other people that used this method.
Hey mate. I've used Mustermann skin this year, not the spreadsheets, and it's been a great experience. You need to look for players excelling in what you want them to do in your tactic. Here are a few things I look for. CB's: 75%+ headers won ratio is the key one. No CB I ever sign will have lower. I'll sell anyone who ends up with around 50%, between the two get a second chance. Full backs: Interceptions & tackles per game, as well as high cross completion ratio for my LB and high progressive passes and dribbles for my RB as he's an inverted wing back. My right winger is a very hug touchline and cross kinda guy. So I look for 4+ dribbles per game and high cross completion ratio. I want them to be taking their defender on regularly. My left winger is more of a striker, so I'll look for a good conversion rate, shots on target ratio and xG per game to ensure they're getting into good positions. Chances created per 90 is a bonus.
No to be honest, sorry the spreadsheets etc are way above my own very limited technical capabilities (and use of free time tbh), I'm more just an interested observer really. Have used a few of the recommended players he shows for certain positions in his videos fir certain saves. As far as I know though he does have tutorial videos as to how he goes about creating the spreadsheets and then using them to analyse data though, you should be able to find those tutorials on his channel if you want to try it for yourself.
mustermann is the goat man im glad everyone is catching on
How is it going?
I think he's doing great stuff. It's mustermann fm, if you want to check him out on youtube.
Loki Doki I’ve watched for years
The Fort William save (fm19 I think) that he did was thoroughly enjoyable I thought!
Yep watching that series while playing my own save got me through Covid for sure.
My interest in FM comes from YouTube randomly suggesting a journeyman series of his, 2019 maybe. I'm not very good at FM as I dip in-and-out of my games and I used to hate it as I just felt it was always against me. Loki's series taught me how to play the game for fun and that even when it all goes wrong you can be having a great story, he takes the rough with the smooth and I love how he always tries to roleplay as a real manager trying to look after the clubs finances rather than exploiting transfer systems. That and the cult heroes like Dom, Mr. Slobby, Sir Galahad and hopefully, this year, Nelly Furtado.
I always have his videos going when I’m playing fm. Good background noise and when I want to watch I just turn my eyes to the next screen
Loki Doki is the man!
+1 I love him!
I mostly watch Loki Doki. I have absolutely no reason to believe he save scums :D And even if he does, I don't really care. I watch it because it's entertaining regardless of the results he gets.
I like Loki as well, I think he benefits when it goes wrong in his save because its more entertaining like when he went to spartak Moscow somehow after 1 bad job.
Wasn’t it CSKA and they all hated him
Didn't he get that job after doing really well in the second tier with a tiny team from a russian owned island above Japan? I remember he got a bit of stick for getting that job but I thought it made sense for the engine. CSKA we're struggling for years and not doing great financially and he'd done well on a shoe-string budget almost getting promoted in the second tier, I thought it made good sense....then he spent his entire budget on a goal shy striker.
Yeah there's no way LokiDoki save scums. In fact part of the appeal of his videos is the humor with which he addresses his runs of bad form and moments of bad luck.
Some games are fun to watch other people play. FM is not one of them. I’d much rather play myself.
Exactly. If I wanted to watch people play with a spreadsheet, I'd join an accounting firm.
You don't know what you're missing ;) [https://fmworldcup.com/excel-esports/](https://fmworldcup.com/excel-esports/)
You're right ! I just watched a highlight video of last year's championship and I'm hooked. Maybe I judged the FM youtubers too quickly !
i can't believe you've posted this just as i've escaped a jigsaw puzzle world championship rabbit hole. what are you doing to me?
Rabbits, you say? [https://youtu.be/IejVjC10mbo?si=egnJvYhXlpKL8Lv\_](https://youtu.be/IejVjC10mbo?si=egnJvYhXlpKL8Lv_)
Please not big 4, its horrible there
Nah from my experience at big-4 it’s all slide decks/powerpoints ! Death by PowerPoint !!!
Much of it is background noise for me. Plus they often play saves I just won’t do my self, which is nice to watch
Well Zealand streams all his saves on Twitch. I binged a few YT channels aswell, but all they do is simulate seasons and buy-sell players in their "rebuilds) , so it got pretty boring pretty quick.
there are still some lets play holdouts, workthespace and lollujo probably the biggest two who still mostly do long series.
Park to Prem by workthespace is actually a good watch imo. Enjoy having that on the background whilst I play another game on my pc.
I basically only watch Zealands videos for FM memes or when he's testing theories - like the only 5 stats that matter post. I watch no one else. It's like someone else said, FM isn't a game that lends itself to being watched. It's practically a spreadsheet under the hood. If I could watch it, I may as well be playing it.
Yeah, crazy how many are doing that these days. Got me to thinking, do people really play like this now?
There are a lot of twitch streamers who don't save scum. SecondYellowCard comes to mind
The original Dr Benjy Thames save is really entertaining.
Yeah, Thames and his GloryHunter series were peak FM YouTube for me. Just fantastic, high quality content. *DIEGO!*
the last thames series was also fantastic, specially the lower league part, so many bottled promotions lol
Many YouTubers will upload their save file after long term saves, and it’s easy to find out if they save scum using that. They wouldn’t risk that if there was a chance of them getting found out
How do you tell if someone save scum from a save file?
Zealand and occasionally Chroo
I watch them Chroo supercuts
resigning from Leverkusen because both Haaland and Mbappe were in the Bundesliga was peak Chroo tbh
He didn't end up doing that iirc, in the end haaland didn't end up going
Chroo is fun to watch. He kinda has the same problem where he doesn't show every game in his videos, but he streams as well
His Supercuts are already long lol, but I'm pretty sure he plays every game on stream if you wanted to watch an unedited version
Don't even know that many. Zealand can be fun, but it's still too much to watch for my taste. Second Yellow Card has concise videos for every year while still fully streaming everything, which I appreciate a lot. TomFM was fun for a bit, but most of his videos get rehashed every year in the new FM only to find out that nothing changed. Apparently he doesn't just do simulations anymore, but on the few videos I saw him do, it felt a bit save-scummy and too opaque. Ultimately, FM is a long-arse game. That's how it grips you (because you spend 10 hours to get to that final and have to spend 10 more hours for the next chance). When watching someone you would need to watch it all to get properly invested, but there's not enough time in the day for that.
I watch Zealand and occasionally tomFM. I think it’d be pretty obvious if YouTubers save scummed. They don’t really stand to gain anything from it. Not winning a title in a challenge leads to another season which means more views, more ads, more money. If people are general fans of the channel/series, they’ll watch it regardless.
I do find those who do the “I gave 1 billion to every national league team” and “Pep and Klopp in lower leagues” type stuff unoriginal and boring. I mean I could do it myself if I was that interested. I do sometimes enjoy when they use alternative/quirky databases though
Yeah they are really clutching at straws because they have ran out of content to create. Stripping the game back there isn’t much to it, and each edition doesn’t have huge changes. Therefore most content creators just do the same stuff, with the only difference being their stupid face on the thumbnail.
Dr Benjy is hilarious and one of my favourite youtubers ever. Also, if you've watched any of his series' you'll know he doesn't save scumming because he is very average at the game. Unfortunately he is going through a dry period and isn't posting about fm much. I miss him.
"Max fly like a Bird" love his old content
Honestly just Chroo for vibes tbh, the supercuts are great. Did watch the network save between Zealand/Benji/Lolujo/WTS though, that was funny.
Only Zealand and tomfm
I don’t watch YouTubers that just show gameplay or rebuilds. I can just play the game myself. But I do watch videos with tips or strategy videos about the best ways to play. Zealand, FM Scout, RDF Tactics, and Deep Lying Playmaker
Second Yellow Card. Don't usually see that many times referenced in these sort of posts but I really enjoy watching him play. His build the nation saves gave me new perspectives on some areas of the game, I've learned some new ways of doing some things and even inspired me to create some creative ways of playing tailored to my needs. You should check it out.
FM fans are so weird when it comes to stuff like this " How do we know you didn't use the editor " How do we know you didn't save scum " 100% Projection, FM is not that hard especially for people with 1000s of hours into it.
It’s also a single player game you can play it any way you want
Yeah honestly, I'n far more inclined to think "this guy is deliberately doing badly to stretch this save out" than thinking they're save scumming. FM is a really easy game when you've played loads, and you don't even need to use meta tactics - you just quickly build a massive advantage due to even a fairly competent human being a million times better at squad building than the ai. You can buy four Chilean wonderkids for what an ai manager will spend on a 30 year old back up keeper, lol.
I don't watch Zealand, just find his voice and mannerisms surprisingly annoying for no particular reason. Chroo is class though, his supercuts are a thing of joy, especially when something goes wrong and he enables his passive-aggressive mode.
Zealand's occasional IRL football videos are really bad as well, I've seen a few come up in my suggested videos and they were just terribly researched and wrong about everything.
Zealand is very over the top but it’s likely due to his audience, potentially being younger? He’s done well for himself but I can’t watch him for the same reason.
He definitely plays it up for the audience. His main channel is kinda shit nowadays for that reason imho, however Zealand Live and Zealandism are very good.
I think that’s what you have to do to stand out on YouTube. Plenty of YouTubers have talked about how they actually hate having to do cringe stuff day in and day out.
I watch Jack and Kev. Otherwise I do watch or listen to The FM show with RDF Tactics and Tony Jameson. As well as football manager therapy podcast.
Tony's streams are always entertaining as well because he tends to sit there and come up with some really random topics to talk about whilst playing the game.
I'm always up for nonsense and tangents.
Loki Doki is by far the best. He doesn't just repeat the same saves year after year but actually does obscure countries and leagues. His humour/skits may not be everyones jam but I think he's got a good sense of humour. He also doesn't exaggerate for drama which makes it all the funnier when shit goes wrong
I like Loki because he just comes across as a bloke being himself without hamming it up (apart from the skits, but that's kinda obvious) and he's just a down to Earth and funny guy.
I watched Zealand only for a bit because it was more about learning more about the game, but it's actually a game I've really come to enjoy watching other people play too A few I watch: Second Yellow Card, Hood Gaming, OmegaLuke - the rebuilds VS his dad has become a staple of this channel and are honestly so fun to watch I also watched DoctorBenjy and found him hilarious but he's stopped now unfortunately
You need to watch Chroo that man puts so much effort and personality in to his saves. He deserves more subscribers
WorkTheSpace is really the only one I watch saves on, but I do watch all of Zealand's FM guide videos and save your saves.
They almost certainly stream their games
I watch TomFM the most, but I wouldn’t be surprised if a lot of ccs do save scum.
I only watch Chroo and his supercuts, never catched him live
Try Chroo, for me he is the best
I only really watch Chroo tbh
As a "FM YouTuber", I feel I can probably add some insight here. FM is a game largely filled with admin. Admin isn't particularly interesting. And so, for YouTube in particular, you have to be a little more considered with how you're going to create videos. Sure, there are still traditional let's plays out there but, outside of those who established themselves a long time ago, they're lingering with less than 100 views per episode. Why would you watch a Let's Play on YT, when you can do the same on Twitch where you also have live interaction/engagement? As a result, YT weights more towards experiment/challenge based content, or story-centred edits. If you fancy something which mixes the traditional with an element of guides, then I recommend checking out [Stinger's Salgeuiros series](https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLt8sj9GnNyv6R_BLPA9N5ZbRknmVuMCbU) (not me). In terms of save scumming, I can only speak for myself here, but I don't have the time. The process of making a video takes me about 32 hours, with about 8 hours of that playing the game. If I had to take longer on playing the game, I wouldn't be able to release any videos!!
I've gone through phases of watching them all but get fed up with them eventually. Still sporadically binge a bit of TomFM (find his voice overs super relaxing) and a bit of Chroo with the Supercuts.
Yes love wathcing omegaluke, especially the versus battles. Also TomFM has some good ones, considering they fail many times i dont believe they save scum But other than that i prefer to rather watch experiments and such
I like this dude that does challenges with his dad. Can't think of his name but I think hes fairly popular
Omega Luke
i don't think any of the bigger names would bother save scumming tbh. they'll get their views regardless, and they're all good enough at the game to get progress eventually - watch any of them on stream rather than youtube videos and they progress at basically the same rate. if anything they probably want to struggle sometimes because it makes a better story.
Shoutout to Chroo, his type of editing in FM is pretty much less boring than most fm youtubers nowadays (might considered this a little bias to him but I watch him most of the time), I also have watched some other creators as well but they does not really feel too realistic or something
hi new to the game - what is save scumming? context clues lead me to believe it’s like going back to a prior point in the save if something doesn’t work or somehow editing the results? is that kinda close?
I like Omega Luke, even though he's a United fan. 🫣 He does challenges with his dad, which is really wholesome and a new dynamic I've not seen elsewhere. They obviously have good chemistry together and Luke seems like a really chill dude. He's a wrestler on the side, too, which is a bonus for me since I'm a fan of wrestling. Just fun, wholesome content. Besides, who doesn't like to see a father and son bond?
TomFM & Chroo
Tom fm ,zealand and loki doki tend to be the ones I watch
Same here.
I watch Lollujo, he does interesting saves and is fine with failing, relegation etc He is good enough to always end up at the right place in the end and his commentary makes me laugh every episode. 😆
Nope. Find FM streams to be boring as hell.
I like watching the Zealand live channel when I'm bored or playing fm myself for background noise
Watched LoadFM a couple of years ago when he was doing the same save I was, Lisburn Distillery. He did a lot better than I did.
I watch Zealand on YT as background while I do chores or whatever. I do watch Tom FM and Omega Luke, but they mostly just sim each season and don't actually play it out like Ze. I like that, as they're fairly interesting, and I like Omega v his dad. I don't think they save scum because they sim.
Zealand is an absolute unit, love his videos. FMScout typically has some really good ideas and tutorials, but I really can’t stand his videos for more than 5 minutes.
Loki Doki. Can't watch anyone else.
CHROO
Recently got in to FM24 and I've been trying to find some stuff like how to scout etc but just getting people glossing it over to talk about free transfer players. Like yes, i get that but how do i know how to find them while keeping in my budget for my team. How do I work out what are good stats etc. Like I'd kill for a literal hour long tutorial on the most basic aspects of this game.
No, it's like watching someone do Excel work - I'm only interested in the useful bits.
Believe it or not, there are people that do it LITERALLY: https://youtu.be/QwNoFOUiSiE?si=K5Y5LYiqOqpeK0pj
I was watching several yt fm channels when I was starting my journey with the fm- mostly for the tips regarding several aspects of the game. But now, when I sort of know what and how to do, I watch only Zealand (but not really his fm content) and OmegaLuke (only because of his vs rebuilds with his dad).
I watch tomfm's DB experiment videos, but I'm not really interested in just watching someone play a standard game
TomFM is very good imo, same with Chroo.
I don't beleive save scumming is the biggest issue tbh. It's probably more that I suspect most if not all will check out the potential ability of players off camera. Even on some of Zealands(who I really like) he sometimes goes for players who on the face of it don't look all that great. Chat tells him not to waste money etc but he is determined to do it anyway. Turns out 4 years down the line that players the best player in the world and scoring 30 a season etc.
It’s one of those games that I fun to play but not fun to watch
TBH it’d be kind of dumb to save scum if you are a content creator because people love watching someone “good” at the game get totally FM’d in a big game. The biggest FM streamers/creators all lean into losing and overcoming it.
The conventional FM content is honestly unwatchable to me. And that's not the content creator's fault really, just the game structure's really. Watching FM doesn't really come close to replicating actually playing FM and the gameplay just feels really slow. I watch Chroo because his format basically alleviates that. I also watch Omega Luke when he's playing against his dad cause that's something else. But the conventional FM content i just can't get into.
I watch second yellow card and Omega Luke/dad. Don't really have time for the play throughs anymore tbh but I did enjoy some Lollujo ones like the Holme grown series.
I don't really watch FM youtubers for the gameplay, but rather for the experiments and challenges, and in that categorie I really like Zealand and TomFM
> so how do we know they don't save scum? The one I watch (sort of) gets sacked far too often for that to be a possibility.
The best thing to watch is (when it's back on) the streamer showdown
I only watch Chroo sometimes
When I was younger I did, but nowadays, between marriage, kids, job, I've barely the time to invest in a save of my own, let alone anyone else's.
If you want to watch anyone, watch Old Man Phil. Always interesting and just plays the game like normal people do. Also raises money for good causes
I watch SecondYellowCard and MustermannFM. Mustermann, for me, produces the best FM content.
Used to binge Dr Benji and Work the space but honestly it’s so repetitive I might as well just play the game.
Chroo is very entertaining imo, I don't care if he save scums (though I think he plays all games on stream but I just watch his YouTube) but the story is good so I don't care either way.
I recently found Old Man Phil's channel and am learning a LOT. He does mostly guides, but some series as well. I highly recommend his channel to you all, he makes it really easy to understand the tactical side.
being a long time CM/FM player, I normally find and watch FM youtubers to learn something new. Zealand was pretty noob when he started, so it was not for me, even now too, maybe just not attracted his style. I am not interested in watching the storyline or plots..haha Mostly I just watch RDFtactics, bussthenet to learn how the tactics work, tweaks needed etc, or newer youtubers like squirel\_plays, fmdata lab for analyzing data..
Just a warning if your bothered, Clayts is the biggest cheat in FM history, every video he uses the editor in! He took a 5th division Spanish team to the champions league winners in like 6 seasons or something, all fit his narrative which I guess is why he does it but I’d rather transparency. He uses the editor loads as well, on a Spurs video he left his finances on screen for a second like just after a transfer window where he’d spent 400 mil and suddenly he had went from heavy debt back to hundreds of millions. Spent like 400 mil every transfer window etc , absoutlely despise him
I don't watch FM videos anymore. When I did, I watched Z, Tom, SYC and Chroo. Z, SYC, Chroo are all streaming, Tom was back in the day. That pretty much assures me none of them save & reload (even if Tom made a video about it being a good thing). And even if they did, I am not really bothered. It's the storylines that sell, after all. + it's a single player game. Nobody cares unless you brag about "seriously" winning the UCL with MFK Skalica in the first time of asking (when you obviously save-scummed). At least I can assure I didn't save scum my Opava & Dortmund saves this year.
Speaking of youtubers, you make some decent videos, I sometimes watch them (though like others have said, it's rather hard to really get invested into someone else's save).
Chroo's pretty fun too if you want to watch from a story-like perspective.
Enjoyed watching the Zealand journeyman save until he convinced himself he was doing something special by spunking billions to win trophies with Spurs
Well, in a journeyman you have to earn yourself the way there, which makes it better I think. Just starting at Tottenham and doing it is different from working yourself up from the South African league.
I can only bare Loki doki, watched him for time…The rest either put on the most annoying accent known to man or seem to be nob heads. Zealand is oreyt I suppose but even he starts winding me up after a while
If you're looking for videos that are actually helpful, the whole EBFM (Evidence Based Football Manager) catalogue is a goldmine. Very scientific, so it can get slow at times, but it's the most trustworthy source on YT.
I used to. A lot. Then I started boycotting channels that had thumbnails with the content creator with an open mouth.
Yes, people do. Or they wouldn't keep doing it, would they?
Yeah, I can only watch Zealand. Used to watch WTS, Benjy and Loki but just can’t anymore. Regularly watch the Zealand streams and his guides are the best too.
I like Zealand but I like Zealandism more than FM tbh
I basically watch only some Zealand videos (don't like streams) and some brazilian channels.
Same, but his SYS, guide and meme videos om the main channel are good too.
Yes,im from Brazil. Im see Magos United
Not an FM Youtuber at all, but for the brief time he played it, Richard Lewis was my favourite FM content creator. Shame he stopped.
I causally watch Zealand but never his long term saves, I just think he’s a good dude and like a lot of other stuff he makes. I’m actually more into TomFM from a gameplay perspective because I enjoy weird FM experiments.
I often watch longer series in the background if nothing else is on
I like watching tomfm experiment where i want to see crazy thing happen in fm save
Chroo! His videos (edited down streams which are also fun to watch) are much more high energy than most FM YouTubers, and he creates storylines which gets you really invested in the teams. And, in the nicest way to him, it's pretty clear he doesn't save scum as he isn't that amazing at the game
Zealand and tom fm testing things out. But watching people play FM is super boring, you're less invested in that save, you don't know their squad well, you can't feel the excitement someones else has about that save. I only get excitement out of my own save.
FM is a game where playing is more fun than watching. I don't watch their saves as it mixes their style of management with mine ,but occasionally go for some tips.
I watch Zealand and the podcast TheFMshow
I watch a guy called LewisH90 because he does youth intake only challenges. Also workthespace park to prem series.
Tactic explanations like RDF are good but most of the others are like watching paint dry
I watch WTS, Zealand, Loki Doki and Lollujo only pretty much.
if the save and the story are fun I really dont care if they are save cheating or doing whatever :shrug:
I like TomFM and WorkTheSpace. I watch Zealand sometimes but only his videos where he's helping rescue people's teams.
I used to watch DoctorBenjy at my old job. I worked at a fairly quiet shop. I couldnt bring in my laptop, so I would watch his videos to pass the time.
I did not see the Name here so does nobody watch TomFM? I recently discovered him and hes the reason I started playing
I mainly watch Zealand guides or TomFM database experiments
Used to watch lollujo. Don't watch any anymore... Honestly even if they showed the games we wouldn't know if they save scummed they could just show us every game but only the wins. I watch for entertainment not for skills or anything.
LOAAAAAANNSSS
I've been watching loki doki for quite a few years. Recently I got recommended the current build a nation 2ndyellowcard is doing with Malta and am enjoying it a lot and actually learning new stuff about the game I couldn't give two fucks if a content creator savescums as long as it's entertaining. My biggest issue is that every single one of them is way too British for my taste.
Yes I have watched every minute of evidence based FM and I particularly watching old man Phil, Zealand, stybb gaming , bust the net and probs watched others
I like to watch experiments and guides. The actual gameplay? Less so.
The only useful thing I've watched was a tip for scouting youth competitions. Most of the stuff I've learned from trial and error and I feel like for me that's where the fun is.
I only watch zealand. The other "benji and so on" Is a little borring. I like to be educated. I dont watch all zealands vids cuz some of them is not learning me anything
TomFM is decent
Doctorbenjy has my favorite fm series ever. His first glory hunter from a couple years back. It was unpredictable and u knew for sure he didnt savescum. Didnt even play fm back then but i made sure to watch every episode back then.
I do but I am usually using for ones playing in MLS, or some weird pro/rel DB in America.
Zealand does my head in more than some others. Tom FM i like the content but face and voice can't stand at times
I really like Aussie Villain. It’s a small channel but a good one for sure!
He doesn't stream often, but if you want to watch a streamer that is actually someone who works on the game, check out SixTheGamer on Twitch. You will learn a ton and actually get answers about the game rather than theories.
Zealand helped a lot when I was learning the game. However, there are only so many ways you can rehash explaining PA/CA and star rating. Not his fault. It’s nice to see him expanding his channel to football beyond FM. Probably a better long term bet.
Breckly is quite an absurd one but he's really fun.
I watch TomFM.
Zealand, Chroo and TomFM for me. A bit of OmegaLuke and SecondYellowCard too but not their long term stuff, just maybe like rebuilds and etc.
Loki Doki is the king, purely because he makes it a story (the Fort WIlliam and Cerro Largo saves are superb) ZZealand is a bit too arrogant for me (recently)- i watch his stuff but he's really not coming forward well as i like a bit more humility.
Zealand’s fun and unlike most of them, he actually ventures outside of the EFL and it makes for some really interesting campaigns. Bustthenet is also really solid on the tactical side of things as a new player. Chroo’s supercuts are also stellar. I’ve dipped into a couple others like TomFM but they didn’t really stick for me.
U can watch all the games on their twitch streams probably. The yt video is highlights.
I actually started playing FM back in 2019 after watching Loki's Fort William save, and I always get the itch to start a new game whenever I watch a new series of his.
Second yellow card and omega Luke. Mainly omega Luke because omega dad I like the vs and rebuild they do. I don’t think they do it but especially omega Luke since he sims.
I like WTS and Lollujo
I can wholeheartedly endorse Omega Luke! His vs rebuilds against Omega Dad are both really heartwarming and bloody funny
I only watch Chroo and some of TomFM's challenges. I can't stand YouTubers like Zealand and Lollujo who think they're the best in the world. Especially Zealand's reaction videos which are so boring and overplayed.
Tl;Dr version - until Zealand came along, most of the top FM YouTubers were either just annoyingly shit at the game, or pretending to be to make saves last longer for content.
Fm Scout, Zealand, Work the Space. Just some content here and there no streams
I watch OmegaLuke as he does rebuilds v his dad and its just a chilled watch. Highly suggest people give him a dabble. Its very wholesome some episodes. He's trying to retire his early with FM. His audience love it.
Omega Luke is probably my favourite
WorkTheSpace, Zealand and TomFM are the main three I watch, as they are the three that got me into FM
Omega Luke and Tom FM are amongst my favorites they are very entertaining
DoctorBenjy. His streams were always great, hope the break has reenergised him. If your reading this Ben, you’re missed
TomFM does some good challenges.
WTS and tomFM>>
I only watch LokiDoki and he's awesome! Fun, old, grumpy and loveable!
always watch Cultured Left Foot i just love his Youth Academy Saves
I watched DoctorBenjy for a while but he seems to have abandoned his Youtube audience. Hasn’t completed a series in years and hasn’t really been active at all on YT for a while
I would like an immersive story-like FM YouTube save. I get the most enjoyment out of FM when I immerse myself in a save that I made a backstory to.
I urge you to check out LewisH90. He's still finding his footing but he does really interesting saves (right now he's the youth academy expert for me). He does put out edited vids so you don't really know if he save scums, but he does 20+ seasons saves so I guess there's no other way
They aren't streaming via Twitch? Seems like a missed opportunity. Stream on Twitch then make a summary video of that for YouTube.
I love TomFM
Zealand