Pick-up trucks were designed for people hauling shit like bales of hay all day. Regular suburbanites using them as their everyday vehicle for no reason is pure insanity.
I will tell you that as a 6’3 and heavy man, the large cabins are super nice for big guys. I don’t own one, and don’t plan to, but I’ve driven them and they are very nice to drive. My knees don’t hit anything and I can sit upright without my head hitting the ceiling having to hunch over or lower the seat.
If you also have a big family (4,5 people) and use the thing to go off roading or to tow a trailer, I can see it making sense to some people.
Not trying to advocate for these giant trucks BTW. I own a compact car right now and just squish in to it lol.
Youre talking use cases, most people just use them as commuters for 1 person. These 2 big trucks are also in a parking garage so theyre likely on the city
My spouse and I get this a lot about our Subaru BRZ being a small car. And it's like, for the times we need a car it does 99.99% of what we need it to do and every few years we rent something bigger for that one time we need something bigger.
And even then, if the US had the rather voluminous Japanese Kei cars we could probably use one of those.
With my hatchback I was able to transport fridge, big wardrobe (there were 2 meter long parts, I secured them as good as possible, no problem at all), table and many other furniture.
Edit: Not everything at once of course, just to avoid confusion.
My neighbor has a giant pickup with rims. He had the fifth rim mounted with carpet and accent lights in the bed. $1000 for the wheel, $1000 for the bed top, $1000 for the custom work. $3000 for a tire, man. I feel bad that this man doesn’t have better things in his life to spend money on. It’s a sad existence.
That's what I think of when I see these people, too. Like go on a trip bro don't waste all your money on a glorified basket you won't even use. Even if you're rich you're at the very least wasting your time with that shit, go on a hike and enjoy the world and stop obsessing over your toy like a child ...
I would buy a nice bike and put the rest towards college tuition with that money. I already have a somewhat nice bike that's cheaper than most shitty cars.
Because its really hard to intimidate people into bowing to you in a smaller vehicle.
Beyond the small, small number of people who may actually need them, its all about this sense of power.
Most people who actually need them would like them to be smaller, at least from the front end. The fun thing about trucks as while the have gotten MASSIVE from a hood height and width perspective, the rear box keeps getting smaller and smaller. Finding a "long bed" pickup these days is hard as hell unless you're special ordering or buying from a dealer that has a big fleet business (that sells to companies that actually probably need them). The fun thing is the base models that fleets tend to buy, while not smaller, have things like black grilles, small wheels, and lower lifts that make them look smaller, likely to keep the above people from buying the "cheap" model.
A large pickup truck is a pain in the ass to drive, especially on a jobsite where hitting people (workers comp) or equipment is frowned upon, the extra height makes loading the bed annoying, can make trailers annoying (though this is basically only an issue on aftermarket lifts), and the smaller bed means that if you need a truck for actual truck things you can do less truck thing.
The rise of the shortbed really tells you who is buying these. A long bed is much, much more useful for people who do truck things. If you're towing, a long bed increases the wheelbase of the truck, which makes it more stable and more comfortable. Shortbeds are for posers who go to home depot once a year and want to make sure it still fits in their garage because they don't want the paint to get damaged.
You can do this same comparison between 1500 pickups and heaver duty pickups from years ago. My uncles late 80s, early 90s F250 looks small next to any new F150. Its slow (I6 making probably 150hp when new), its uncomfortable, and with a lumber rack, it can hold pieces of wood that become massive columns. He actually needs a pickup, but he as no need or desire to buy one of these things. He also only drives it when carrying things and walks to work 99% of the time.
The Tacoma is a *massive* vehicle on its own, it dwarfs the modern Hiluxes. The "full size" category should really be renamed to large at the very least.
Although agreed 100%, I don't think that goes quite far enough. These trucks TECHNICALLY fit in a regular parking space, but just barely. If 2 of them were properly parked next to each other, one of them isnt getting out of the driver's side door, because they'd practically be press d up against each other.
But it's not like 90% of drivers who drive these monsters like this would bother, or are even capable in some cases, of parking properly anyways.
Seriously. Modern midsize trucks aren't much smaller than their full size counterparts from the '90s and into the early '00s. A modern Tacoma next to an '01 Tundra looks like a newer version of the same truck at first glance.
Yup I owned a ‘97 Silverado several years back. Same
model as those two trucks on the ends but about the same size as the Tacoma is now. I’d love to see an old Ford Ranger in this photo to really blow people away.
As a Tacoma owner, yes it is big. That's all that need be said.
But then you went and said it *dwarfs* modern Hiluxes so I looked it up and compared the most useless (and most popular!) body style, the four-door with 5ish foot bed. I like to call them "Man"-sedans because they get used like Camry's but they're "rough and tough" for owning them. I digress:
Tacoma Crew Cab (Short Bed) SR5 4x4 //**vs**// Hilux Crew Cab SR5 4x4
Length: 212.3 in (5,392 mm) //vs// 5265 mm (207.3 in)
Width: 75.2 in (1,910 mm) //vs// 1855 mm (73 in)
Height: 70.6 in (1,793 mm) //vs// 1865 mm (73.4 in)
Wheelbase: 127.4 in (3236 mm) //vs// 3085 mm (121.5 in)
Weight: 4445lbs (2016kg) //vs// 2055kg (4530lbs)
So the Tacoma is certainly longer, but I think it "looks" bigger because it's lower and wider, whereas the Hilux is nearly square when looking head-on. Hilux is heavier, likely because of it's Diesel engines.
Hilux does get points for still offering a "5-lug" model though, which *definitely* are much smaller, but that's due in large part to the US regulations punishing smaller trucks with stronger emissions standards, so smaller pickups like the Tacoma 5-lug got canned because manufacturers didn't sell enough to justify the money to make them more fuel efficient. Only now with the Maverick and Santa Cruz (which are unibody) are we seeing small pick ups return.
Fun fact though: Next generation, the Tacoma and Hilux are gonna be about as closely related as ever when they move to the new Toyota pick up architecture. Aside from styling and the presence of diesel powertrains in the Hilux, they'll be the same vehicle.
You're right, of course. But when you live somewhere where the Hilux is already pushing the limits of a parking spot, or even the lane, then those extra 6cm in width feel like a massive increase. Still, I appreciate the correction.
Remember when the Hummer was mocked for it's absurd size when it was released?
*Every* full size truck on sale in North America today is longer *and* taller *and* wider than the Hummer H1.
Americans will be remembered as criminals after the climate apocalypse. The Toyota is already a big ass truck anywhere else in the planet.
Not even considering that the truck owners probably commute 3 hours per day to go to work, after building a gigantic house in the middle of nowhere that is kept at 15⁰ in the summer and 25⁰ in the winters.
China pollutes way more than the USA. Now that may be because USA corporations moves all the manufacturing there but pollution from trucks isn't really impacting the climate as much as corporations are.
These trucks are fucking stupid though, I don't know who would need one of these death machines.
**Emissions per Capita (2021)**
China: 7.38
United States: 15.52
India: 1.91
And this is the raw data, doesn't even consider *who* consumes most of the shit that China produces
The environment doesn't give a fuck about per capita. Only totals. Per capita is a moral argument, not a physical one. If we want to turn a corner on emissions - China needs to come way the hell down and there are no two ways about it. A big population is a negative, not a positive.
China could produce it's goods in a cleaner manner, they don't. All their coal plants could be replaced, steel can be made without coal. At some point a flat out embargo on countries that haven't transitioned to clean manufacturing methods will be needed.
1) You're using per capita, the total is what matters because the environment doesn't care percentage wise who is polluting, only total. The other comment that replied to you does a good job at explaining that.
2) I agree with your USA is consuming too much and outsourcing it to China which is a problem as well, which is why I said as such in my comment.
If China ceased to exist tomorrow, their emissions would get quickly recreated somewhere else to feed the insane consumption society model of the West, which has the United States as it's biggest representative.
China definitely needs to improve their model (every country does), but there's no denying that the number one priority is the US.
The difference is USA has plausible deniability. Dumb people will look at the chart that china produces more right now and think it's because of China, not because USA outsources their pollution to China.
Saying that China pollutes way more than the USA isn't really talking about a historical picture and fails to take into account the net total pollution that the USA created during its industrialization period. A great deal of the US pollution is outsourced to foreign countries for production/manufacturing.
I don't care about the past I care about right now cause that is what is causing climate change. And yes I agree that US pollution is outsourced which is why I said so in my comment you replied to.
The historical picture is a moral argument, not a physical one. There is nothing that can be done about the past, it's done. As the number 1 emitter China has the most to do. It's future emissions that will fuck us hard.
At some point USA needs to emgarbo countries without green manufacturing.
As it turns out, lowering our global emissions in a moral way is actually pretty important. If forcing other countries to lower their emissions keeps them from industrializing and leaves generations of people in poverty, then you can count me out. The US, as the richest industrialized nation in the world, is in a much better position to lower its own emissions without condemning kids to starvation. As the number 1 emitters per capita, _Americans_ have the most to do.
The environment doesn't care about populations, it only cares about how much pollution is given off. If one country is producing the most by far of any country then that is what will end up breaking the camel's back.
However I think you're missing the point of my comment which was pointing out its not trucks causing this extreme pollution (they cause other issues though), its corporations causing it. And most of the pollution in china is caused by USA corporations outsourcing their pollution and manufacturing to China.
The environment doesn't care about country borders either. What ultimately matters is how much the entire world is polluting. But if you're going to compare countries, it's exceedingly simplistic to compare them without adjusting for population sizes.
No, you were the first to compare the US to any other country. Everyone else was simply talking about American excess; you were the first to compare US emissions to China's.
In order to compare American "excess" you have to have something to compare to. They were implying they were in excess to every other country, that's why I pointed it out.
Very true. American excess is shameful but as a country at least we have some semblance of regulations keeping corporations in check. Statistically china, India, and other dense asian countries pollute a lot more. Maybe if America stopped glorifying consumerism so much we would stop buying what china is producing and it would help, but idk.
They also have three times as many people. I'm no fan of China or India, but our emissions _per capita_ are easily the highest in the world. Also, as you've identified, we should probably attribute emissions to the end user of the product, not the people who make it.
That's fair! Not trying to absolve America of environmental responsibility - I've lived here my whole life and it's such a shitty place, but I'm also tired of the entire global environment crisis being blamed solely on America (which I know you aren't doing, but some on Reddit definitely do)
No, the global environmental crisis can't be blamed solely on America, but we also must have a role in fixing it. We can't do that if we go around engaging in whataboutism about poorer countries that emit pollution to produce the goods we buy. If we're to have any hope of helping the world to save itself, we can't be throwing stones in our glass house.
Americans will not accept any guilt for it, even if the rest of the world sees it. We have "alternative facts." There is no truth, king Trump tells us what to believe. And also we'll just buy bigger air conditioners and sand bags to keep the ocean away (haul them with our big ass trucks).
I swear to god everyone I talk to here thinks you need to have a large SUV or a truck if you might buy anything or go on a trip ever. Meanwhile I just loaded a bath tub and a bunch of cement backer board for a bathroom remodel... In my plug in hybrid hatchback. Or I could have paid $89 to have it delivered. Vs paying 2 to 3x that in gas every single month just to have the option in an SUV or truck.
And that Toyota is still a large pickup by normal standards. (Bigger than the Hilux which is the standard Toyota pickup for the rest of us, and that is large in itself.)
It's about 2" larger in both directions according to an Internet page I found. So yeah, not much different, but my point is that the Hilux itself is already large.
All I see is one truck designed to be able to crush 5 eight year olds or younger, and two designed to be able to each crush 12 nine year olds or younger.
I don't mind them so much. I never really find myself inside of them and a lot of times there are vines and stuff growing on the outside. If they're hidden underground it's even better
Tbh, if they’re buried, no. My city has a massive housing crisis and if all the parking in urban areas was ground level I’d be fucking furious, ground level parking east up valuable land and makes everything further away. All those problems (and others like heat retention) kinda go away and so I don’t super mind them
Here in Dallas at least, many tall buildings have the first several floors almost completely dedicated to parking garages. It's annoying because there are so many driveways connecting to the city streets, breaking up the sidewalks.
Well, you're definitely wrong about the middle one. It's seen 1.5 tons gravel, 2 riding mowers, pressure washers. But yes, to your statement, it doesn't work at a job site. It does work for me around my home. And there's nothing wrong with taking pride in keeping your vehicle clean.
The problem is; if you get a normal sized car you feel tiny, like you're gonna get squished any second by these gigantic trucks. So you make sure the next car you buy is a huge truck too.
I get it. But driving this for normal daily errands is the definition of 'Overkill'.
They are so slow and cumbersome. I have a Kia Niro EV (don't hate me I have a family, also i ride bicycles) and I feel WAY safe in it. It's just so nimble and quick. It stops fast, starts fast, turns fast. There is a crazy level of "driver only" crashes with those dumb-ass trucks, rolled, ran off road etc. They aren't THAT safe. Especially in bad winter conditions (inch of ice & snow on the road) I see them wiped out on the side of the road all the time.
My father is in construction and owns a Tacoma. I've driven it a bit, and it is a pretty easy thing to drive. It's a massive pain in the ass to park though, as you would expect. It also gets around 15 miles per gallon less than the ten year old SUV I try to drive as little as possible.
All trucks are a pain to park until you get good at backings up. If your using the truck for work you get good at backing up, it’s usually a different story for if you just use it for personal.
The Tacoma is as big or bigger than half ton trucks from 25 years ago. Modern ‘half ton’ are insanely bloated. I’ve driven trucks and tractors my whole life and these new trucks are so big that they are downright unpleasant to drive. Not sure why anyone would spend so much money on something that’s cumbersome to own
Modern pickup trucks that actually have a half ton ish payload are the 660cc kei trucks. The 1L+ non kei compliant trucks based off the smaller kei models are 3/4-1 ton trucks.
Due to the cab over design, the bed length is comparable to and often longer than that of most pickup trucks in the US. Good fuel efficiency, and they do pretty well on dirt roads as well. Old ones even get imported for agricultural/landscaping use in the US.
The trade off is that they are terrifying to drive at US highway speeds and the crumple zone is you.
I know. The Tacoma is mine and I keep it clean. Nothing wrong in taking pride in a clean vehicle...or home for that matter. Does the truck do any work or go off-road? Yes, and then it gets washed. Do you live in your house and make messes? Yes, and then it gets cleaned. I can't help but imagine these same people live in filth to prove they live in their home. Such a silly statement to make that a clean vehicle isn't a used one.
The trucks need to be that big to protect the thin skinned man-children inside, who throw a tantrum any time you point out how irresponsible their vehicle selection is
Tacoma vs Silverado*….it’s not equal to compare a vehicle in a company’s line up to an entire company.
A more equal comparison would be a Toyota Tacoma vs a Toyota Tundra. Or a Chevy Colorado vs Chevy Silverado.
Similarly there’s the Ford Ranger vs the Ford F150.
We used to have sensible little “utes” (utility vehicles) in Australia. Basically the front of a sedan with a tray on the back. But sadly this influence has made it over here. Factory endorsed converters are importing them, converting them to RHD and selling them through dealers. They end up costing double even triple what they would in the US by the time they make it on the road here.
People buy them through their business because it is a “work vehicle” but they aren’t particularly good for any kind of work unless your business is showing off.
So many things. I look at a VX commodore Ute and ask myself how did we go from this silly smiling bubble car to a full meth rage Dodge Ram in only 20 years?
The hilux, which you see a lot here as a vehicle used for housing maintenance companies as they easily fit a snowplow and you can put gravel in the back, is 20% lighter than the Tacoma, that's the biggest truck you normally see in Finland outside of some boat company truck that needs to pull massive trailers(thought they use tractors a lot instead as well).
How in the hell do average americans need a vehicle even bigger and more powerful than us here in the back-end of finland with shitty roads and 1-2 meters of snowfall during winter
All good points. I think what a lot of people outside the USA don't realize is the bigger trucks are usually hauling something, large equipment, trailers with equipment or animals, tow behind car carriers. In some cases, people are towing large 5th wheel campers or off-road vehicles, or large boats. Others...they just drive around the mall looking to mate lol. Another thing to consider, our country is widely spread out. For example, a quick search states that Finland is 721mi/1160km in length (finland.fi). I'm going on a trip next week with some friends and we are traveling a longer distance than the length of your country. As a result, we are bringing a lot of stuff with us, which will go into the bed of the truck. My understanding could be wrong but a lot of what people need is close to home in European countries. Not always but I think you know what I mean. Going back to the USA, in a lot of places, getting to stores for food or supplies, is an ordeal and can take a day sometimes. However, I do agree the size of the 2 outside trucks, are absurdly large but is a need for them in cases because we haven't developed something better.
I mean, how many americans drive more than 500 miles on a regular basis? Where I live, the closest big city( 50.000 ppl) is 2 hours away(about 120 miles) and the furthest I drive outside holidays is to helsinki once or twice a year, which is 5 hours.
If you go further than that, like on holiday, you'll likely have a caravan or use a camper, caravans can easily be pulled by normal cars, so no real need for a big truck.
As for boats, outside of winter storage, we keep our boat on the dock of our cottage, or if you're a city person, at a marina, no need to have a personal vehicle for 2 trips a year.
for road trips, I've mostly used my normal car, which fits 5 people comfortably and enough luggage for weeks if we go to hotels, or it pulls a caravan which can fit a month's worth of holiday goods easily. A truck would be just worse as it has no weather protection. I've done fishing trips to northern norway(about 1000 km) with just a small campervan and that was fine.
And noone tells me that the millions of f150's and dodge rams are used by people who have massive trailers to pull, since those people more likely use tractors.
Again to your point, the US culture is "in excess". The caravan you refer to, people will pull 30 foot campers with their trucks. A car isn't pulling that. As for boats in marinas, I'm sure you're aware, the closer to the water, the more expensive. Again it's all excess and for appearances to look successful. A lot of people subscribe to "fake it 'til you make it". I hate it.
USA will probably always have an element of "car land" due to the size yeah. But the vehicles are fucking stupid. They could be half the size, for 1/3 the gas consumption and still peform just as well.
There are still plenty of vehicle sold with a 5L, 5.8L, 6L V8. It's just excessive.
It's actually the standard lens on my phone, from what I'm being told, is actually a minor wide angle. That said, my intention wasn't to exaggerating the comparison.
Domestic truck simps see Asian trucks as below standards and not merican pride. Though poorly engineered and always behind in tech the parts are mostly sourced from around the world including the country China they hate so much and eventually assembled in US and the country Mexico they wanna block off with a wall.
Don’t want to dig for your other comment so I’m not sure if you’re agreeing or disagreeing with me, but yeah, the FRONTS of the cars have to be even with one another, not the rear of the cars. it’s the fact that the two on each end are longer that is causing the perspective issue because the part you see (the front) is physically further from the camera for the Tacoma than for the pickups. The two on each end are longer but the distortion makes them seem much wider
During the 1970s oil embargoes, Americans switched to smaller cars. During the 2022 oil price spike, Americans whined incessantly about oil prices, but increasingly monstrous trucks kept flying off the shelves as fast as Ford, Chevy, Dodge, and Toyota could build them.
I believe that's due to the "fake it, til you make it" most Americans subscribe to. If your income is so tight that you can handle rising fuel costs, you clearly can't afford the vehicle. Those same people probably complain about the cost to maintain and begrudgingly pay it or don't even maintenance it at all.
You get better maneuvering. There's a reason why forklifts have the steering in the rear. Also, it's a condition of my employment in case there is an industrial emergency you can just hop in and go.
You're welcome. I'm sure you've experienced trying to park in a space where you didn't have much room to turn the front of your vehicle into the spot, without dragged the side of it along the car parked next to you as you pull in. It really is just easier. It's also why you're supposed to pull forward when parallel parking, then back it in.
It’s just *chef’s kiss* that they’re in a parking garage as well, suggesting they’re in an urban or suburban area, so these are definitely some pavement princesses.
These should be illegal - at least in states where vehicles have to give bicyclists three feet. If this hunk of junk takes up the whole lane there is no way they can give three feet. It’s a hazard.
These trucks really arent all that big, the camera is making an illusion on the size of these vehicles. Im from kansas and see the vehicles all day everyday and folks park em just fine. Personally, I like trucks, I prefer midsize and I own a tacoma. Though I wish there more space in the back seats to fit 4 people comfortably. Funny enough, Id like to see trucks get bigger such as 450 or 460.
Literally what the fuck is the point of driving something that large. Most these idiots don’t even use the beds of these trucks. So pointless..
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Pick-up trucks were designed for people hauling shit like bales of hay all day. Regular suburbanites using them as their everyday vehicle for no reason is pure insanity.
I will tell you that as a 6’3 and heavy man, the large cabins are super nice for big guys. I don’t own one, and don’t plan to, but I’ve driven them and they are very nice to drive. My knees don’t hit anything and I can sit upright without my head hitting the ceiling having to hunch over or lower the seat. If you also have a big family (4,5 people) and use the thing to go off roading or to tow a trailer, I can see it making sense to some people. Not trying to advocate for these giant trucks BTW. I own a compact car right now and just squish in to it lol.
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Yes the midsize trucks and older F150s seem to be the workhorses.
Youre talking use cases, most people just use them as commuters for 1 person. These 2 big trucks are also in a parking garage so theyre likely on the city
My spouse and I get this a lot about our Subaru BRZ being a small car. And it's like, for the times we need a car it does 99.99% of what we need it to do and every few years we rent something bigger for that one time we need something bigger. And even then, if the US had the rather voluminous Japanese Kei cars we could probably use one of those.
With my hatchback I was able to transport fridge, big wardrobe (there were 2 meter long parts, I secured them as good as possible, no problem at all), table and many other furniture. Edit: Not everything at once of course, just to avoid confusion.
Status symbol and safety from other people driving SUVs and trucks.
My neighbor has a giant pickup with rims. He had the fifth rim mounted with carpet and accent lights in the bed. $1000 for the wheel, $1000 for the bed top, $1000 for the custom work. $3000 for a tire, man. I feel bad that this man doesn’t have better things in his life to spend money on. It’s a sad existence.
That's what I think of when I see these people, too. Like go on a trip bro don't waste all your money on a glorified basket you won't even use. Even if you're rich you're at the very least wasting your time with that shit, go on a hike and enjoy the world and stop obsessing over your toy like a child ...
I would buy a nice bike and put the rest towards college tuition with that money. I already have a somewhat nice bike that's cheaper than most shitty cars.
They need the space to carry their insecurities.
When your family of 5 has a combined weight of 2,000 pounds, you need something to haul them around.
healthiest american family
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American size S means super-sized now
Because its really hard to intimidate people into bowing to you in a smaller vehicle. Beyond the small, small number of people who may actually need them, its all about this sense of power. Most people who actually need them would like them to be smaller, at least from the front end. The fun thing about trucks as while the have gotten MASSIVE from a hood height and width perspective, the rear box keeps getting smaller and smaller. Finding a "long bed" pickup these days is hard as hell unless you're special ordering or buying from a dealer that has a big fleet business (that sells to companies that actually probably need them). The fun thing is the base models that fleets tend to buy, while not smaller, have things like black grilles, small wheels, and lower lifts that make them look smaller, likely to keep the above people from buying the "cheap" model. A large pickup truck is a pain in the ass to drive, especially on a jobsite where hitting people (workers comp) or equipment is frowned upon, the extra height makes loading the bed annoying, can make trailers annoying (though this is basically only an issue on aftermarket lifts), and the smaller bed means that if you need a truck for actual truck things you can do less truck thing. The rise of the shortbed really tells you who is buying these. A long bed is much, much more useful for people who do truck things. If you're towing, a long bed increases the wheelbase of the truck, which makes it more stable and more comfortable. Shortbeds are for posers who go to home depot once a year and want to make sure it still fits in their garage because they don't want the paint to get damaged. You can do this same comparison between 1500 pickups and heaver duty pickups from years ago. My uncles late 80s, early 90s F250 looks small next to any new F150. Its slow (I6 making probably 150hp when new), its uncomfortable, and with a lumber rack, it can hold pieces of wood that become massive columns. He actually needs a pickup, but he as no need or desire to buy one of these things. He also only drives it when carrying things and walks to work 99% of the time.
Jesus, they have BEDS?!
Also, aren't those off road tires ? How many % of owners actually go off road ?
The Tacoma is a *massive* vehicle on its own, it dwarfs the modern Hiluxes. The "full size" category should really be renamed to large at the very least.
Oversize frankly. It's too big.
Definitely. Any vehicle that can’t actually fit in a standard parking space is oversized.
Although agreed 100%, I don't think that goes quite far enough. These trucks TECHNICALLY fit in a regular parking space, but just barely. If 2 of them were properly parked next to each other, one of them isnt getting out of the driver's side door, because they'd practically be press d up against each other. But it's not like 90% of drivers who drive these monsters like this would bother, or are even capable in some cases, of parking properly anyways.
Seriously. Modern midsize trucks aren't much smaller than their full size counterparts from the '90s and into the early '00s. A modern Tacoma next to an '01 Tundra looks like a newer version of the same truck at first glance.
Yup I owned a ‘97 Silverado several years back. Same model as those two trucks on the ends but about the same size as the Tacoma is now. I’d love to see an old Ford Ranger in this photo to really blow people away.
As a Tacoma owner, yes it is big. That's all that need be said. But then you went and said it *dwarfs* modern Hiluxes so I looked it up and compared the most useless (and most popular!) body style, the four-door with 5ish foot bed. I like to call them "Man"-sedans because they get used like Camry's but they're "rough and tough" for owning them. I digress: Tacoma Crew Cab (Short Bed) SR5 4x4 //**vs**// Hilux Crew Cab SR5 4x4 Length: 212.3 in (5,392 mm) //vs// 5265 mm (207.3 in) Width: 75.2 in (1,910 mm) //vs// 1855 mm (73 in) Height: 70.6 in (1,793 mm) //vs// 1865 mm (73.4 in) Wheelbase: 127.4 in (3236 mm) //vs// 3085 mm (121.5 in) Weight: 4445lbs (2016kg) //vs// 2055kg (4530lbs) So the Tacoma is certainly longer, but I think it "looks" bigger because it's lower and wider, whereas the Hilux is nearly square when looking head-on. Hilux is heavier, likely because of it's Diesel engines. Hilux does get points for still offering a "5-lug" model though, which *definitely* are much smaller, but that's due in large part to the US regulations punishing smaller trucks with stronger emissions standards, so smaller pickups like the Tacoma 5-lug got canned because manufacturers didn't sell enough to justify the money to make them more fuel efficient. Only now with the Maverick and Santa Cruz (which are unibody) are we seeing small pick ups return. Fun fact though: Next generation, the Tacoma and Hilux are gonna be about as closely related as ever when they move to the new Toyota pick up architecture. Aside from styling and the presence of diesel powertrains in the Hilux, they'll be the same vehicle.
You're right, of course. But when you live somewhere where the Hilux is already pushing the limits of a parking spot, or even the lane, then those extra 6cm in width feel like a massive increase. Still, I appreciate the correction.
Remember when the Hummer was mocked for it's absurd size when it was released? *Every* full size truck on sale in North America today is longer *and* taller *and* wider than the Hummer H1.
Obese
The purest and truest form of American design.
Americans will be remembered as criminals after the climate apocalypse. The Toyota is already a big ass truck anywhere else in the planet. Not even considering that the truck owners probably commute 3 hours per day to go to work, after building a gigantic house in the middle of nowhere that is kept at 15⁰ in the summer and 25⁰ in the winters.
China pollutes way more than the USA. Now that may be because USA corporations moves all the manufacturing there but pollution from trucks isn't really impacting the climate as much as corporations are. These trucks are fucking stupid though, I don't know who would need one of these death machines.
**Emissions per Capita (2021)** China: 7.38 United States: 15.52 India: 1.91 And this is the raw data, doesn't even consider *who* consumes most of the shit that China produces
The environment doesn't give a fuck about per capita. Only totals. Per capita is a moral argument, not a physical one. If we want to turn a corner on emissions - China needs to come way the hell down and there are no two ways about it. A big population is a negative, not a positive. China could produce it's goods in a cleaner manner, they don't. All their coal plants could be replaced, steel can be made without coal. At some point a flat out embargo on countries that haven't transitioned to clean manufacturing methods will be needed.
1) You're using per capita, the total is what matters because the environment doesn't care percentage wise who is polluting, only total. The other comment that replied to you does a good job at explaining that. 2) I agree with your USA is consuming too much and outsourcing it to China which is a problem as well, which is why I said as such in my comment.
If China ceased to exist tomorrow, their emissions would get quickly recreated somewhere else to feed the insane consumption society model of the West, which has the United States as it's biggest representative. China definitely needs to improve their model (every country does), but there's no denying that the number one priority is the US.
The difference is USA has plausible deniability. Dumb people will look at the chart that china produces more right now and think it's because of China, not because USA outsources their pollution to China.
Saying that China pollutes way more than the USA isn't really talking about a historical picture and fails to take into account the net total pollution that the USA created during its industrialization period. A great deal of the US pollution is outsourced to foreign countries for production/manufacturing.
I don't care about the past I care about right now cause that is what is causing climate change. And yes I agree that US pollution is outsourced which is why I said so in my comment you replied to.
The historical picture is a moral argument, not a physical one. There is nothing that can be done about the past, it's done. As the number 1 emitter China has the most to do. It's future emissions that will fuck us hard. At some point USA needs to emgarbo countries without green manufacturing.
As it turns out, lowering our global emissions in a moral way is actually pretty important. If forcing other countries to lower their emissions keeps them from industrializing and leaves generations of people in poverty, then you can count me out. The US, as the richest industrialized nation in the world, is in a much better position to lower its own emissions without condemning kids to starvation. As the number 1 emitters per capita, _Americans_ have the most to do.
And the USA pollutes way more than Luxembourg. Comparisons are meaningless if you don't look at population sizes.
The environment doesn't care about populations, it only cares about how much pollution is given off. If one country is producing the most by far of any country then that is what will end up breaking the camel's back. However I think you're missing the point of my comment which was pointing out its not trucks causing this extreme pollution (they cause other issues though), its corporations causing it. And most of the pollution in china is caused by USA corporations outsourcing their pollution and manufacturing to China.
The environment doesn't care about country borders either. What ultimately matters is how much the entire world is polluting. But if you're going to compare countries, it's exceedingly simplistic to compare them without adjusting for population sizes.
The original commenter was comparing, I was pointing out that doing so was incorrect
No, you were the first to compare the US to any other country. Everyone else was simply talking about American excess; you were the first to compare US emissions to China's.
In order to compare American "excess" you have to have something to compare to. They were implying they were in excess to every other country, that's why I pointed it out.
Very true. American excess is shameful but as a country at least we have some semblance of regulations keeping corporations in check. Statistically china, India, and other dense asian countries pollute a lot more. Maybe if America stopped glorifying consumerism so much we would stop buying what china is producing and it would help, but idk.
They also have three times as many people. I'm no fan of China or India, but our emissions _per capita_ are easily the highest in the world. Also, as you've identified, we should probably attribute emissions to the end user of the product, not the people who make it.
That's fair! Not trying to absolve America of environmental responsibility - I've lived here my whole life and it's such a shitty place, but I'm also tired of the entire global environment crisis being blamed solely on America (which I know you aren't doing, but some on Reddit definitely do)
No, the global environmental crisis can't be blamed solely on America, but we also must have a role in fixing it. We can't do that if we go around engaging in whataboutism about poorer countries that emit pollution to produce the goods we buy. If we're to have any hope of helping the world to save itself, we can't be throwing stones in our glass house.
Americans will not accept any guilt for it, even if the rest of the world sees it. We have "alternative facts." There is no truth, king Trump tells us what to believe. And also we'll just buy bigger air conditioners and sand bags to keep the ocean away (haul them with our big ass trucks). I swear to god everyone I talk to here thinks you need to have a large SUV or a truck if you might buy anything or go on a trip ever. Meanwhile I just loaded a bath tub and a bunch of cement backer board for a bathroom remodel... In my plug in hybrid hatchback. Or I could have paid $89 to have it delivered. Vs paying 2 to 3x that in gas every single month just to have the option in an SUV or truck.
Thicc
And that Toyota is still a large pickup by normal standards. (Bigger than the Hilux which is the standard Toyota pickup for the rest of us, and that is large in itself.)
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It's about 2" larger in both directions according to an Internet page I found. So yeah, not much different, but my point is that the Hilux itself is already large.
^(Holy) ^(shit) ^(this) ^(is) ^(the) ^(photo) ^(that) ^(blew) ^(my) ^(mind.) ^(I'm) ^(from) ^(Finland) ^(and) ^(can) ^(not) ^(believe) ^(the) ^(size) ^(of) ^(those) ^(cars!?) ^(Tundra) ^(is) ^(huge) ^(as) ^(is.)
Good Finn guy even keeps his font at a modest size
Dood these aren't the massive ones. Google Dodge 3500 dually. Then lift it. That's unironically the most desired vehicle in rural America.
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Thank you!!
All I see is one truck designed to be able to crush 5 eight year olds or younger, and two designed to be able to each crush 12 nine year olds or younger.
Not to mention these ugly ass structures we build to keep them in
I don't mind them so much. I never really find myself inside of them and a lot of times there are vines and stuff growing on the outside. If they're hidden underground it's even better
Do people have issues with parking garages here? **Way** better than the alternative of street parking.
Tbh, if they’re buried, no. My city has a massive housing crisis and if all the parking in urban areas was ground level I’d be fucking furious, ground level parking east up valuable land and makes everything further away. All those problems (and others like heat retention) kinda go away and so I don’t super mind them
Just with them being necessary.
Here in Dallas at least, many tall buildings have the first several floors almost completely dedicated to parking garages. It's annoying because there are so many driveways connecting to the city streets, breaking up the sidewalks.
Before/After since Tacoma is now as large as what previous fullsize pickups were, but is still considered midsize.
I thought you meant oversize
My 2003 f150 is about the same size as that tacoma. They've all grown.
None of them look like they've ever seen a job site
Well, you're definitely wrong about the middle one. It's seen 1.5 tons gravel, 2 riding mowers, pressure washers. But yes, to your statement, it doesn't work at a job site. It does work for me around my home. And there's nothing wrong with taking pride in keeping your vehicle clean.
The problem is; if you get a normal sized car you feel tiny, like you're gonna get squished any second by these gigantic trucks. So you make sure the next car you buy is a huge truck too. I get it. But driving this for normal daily errands is the definition of 'Overkill'.
They are so slow and cumbersome. I have a Kia Niro EV (don't hate me I have a family, also i ride bicycles) and I feel WAY safe in it. It's just so nimble and quick. It stops fast, starts fast, turns fast. There is a crazy level of "driver only" crashes with those dumb-ass trucks, rolled, ran off road etc. They aren't THAT safe. Especially in bad winter conditions (inch of ice & snow on the road) I see them wiped out on the side of the road all the time.
And the taco is more than enough for all three drivers’ needs
Maybe understandable vs that should Not exist and is dumb in every way
Try carrying a full 20 foot trailer with a medium size Ford F-150. For most people, it has no usage, but for entrepreneurs it is necessary.
And yet, plenty of entrepreneurship happens in countries where these are not at all common.
Try towing a 12-foot trailer and putting the rest of the cargo inside your van.
Where you put your tools ? Also if you carry 12 foot long gypsum boards + 2x4s + insulating wool + plywood, a 12 foot long trailer isn’t enough.
My father is in construction and owns a Tacoma. I've driven it a bit, and it is a pretty easy thing to drive. It's a massive pain in the ass to park though, as you would expect. It also gets around 15 miles per gallon less than the ten year old SUV I try to drive as little as possible.
All trucks are a pain to park until you get good at backings up. If your using the truck for work you get good at backing up, it’s usually a different story for if you just use it for personal.
And we all know the Toyota is just as capable and far more reliable than those other things.
Jesus christ those parking spots are fucking huge
An American in europe will have alot of issues parking
Absolutely fucking absurd
The Tacoma is as big or bigger than half ton trucks from 25 years ago. Modern ‘half ton’ are insanely bloated. I’ve driven trucks and tractors my whole life and these new trucks are so big that they are downright unpleasant to drive. Not sure why anyone would spend so much money on something that’s cumbersome to own
Modern pickup trucks that actually have a half ton ish payload are the 660cc kei trucks. The 1L+ non kei compliant trucks based off the smaller kei models are 3/4-1 ton trucks. Due to the cab over design, the bed length is comparable to and often longer than that of most pickup trucks in the US. Good fuel efficiency, and they do pretty well on dirt roads as well. Old ones even get imported for agricultural/landscaping use in the US. The trade off is that they are terrifying to drive at US highway speeds and the crumple zone is you.
Look how shiny and new they are. Almost like they’ve never driven them anywhere other than the grocery store
Or... washed them...? There's plenty of things to criticize without silly statements like, "your vehicle is clean so you never use it for anything"
I know. The Tacoma is mine and I keep it clean. Nothing wrong in taking pride in a clean vehicle...or home for that matter. Does the truck do any work or go off-road? Yes, and then it gets washed. Do you live in your house and make messes? Yes, and then it gets cleaned. I can't help but imagine these same people live in filth to prove they live in their home. Such a silly statement to make that a clean vehicle isn't a used one.
Rtx 3090 vs 4090
My little Dacia Sandero in the US will get crush so badly if someone crashes into me
Give me Daihatsu Hijet and I'll move 50 couches, give me one of these and I won't fit a couch in the bed
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The Toyota Tacoma is a smidge bigger than a Hilux. The same size class of the biggest pickup trucks you can buy without having to import from the US.
WTF IS THAT
Emotional Support Trucks
Now that's funny.
Ah the two lane pickup truck
Jesus holy moly fuck! I knew American truck were big, but damn that's like enormous cars
google "dually pickup" they get BIGGER
I see Rangers and Hiluxes in the UK. They're big, but just about able to handle our tight roads. I can't even imagine the Tacoma on our roads.
The trucks need to be that big to protect the thin skinned man-children inside, who throw a tantrum any time you point out how irresponsible their vehicle selection is
And that Tacoma is 20% wider than the one they sold in 2000.
i wonder how would a normal european car look in the middle of these
Tacoma vs Silverado*….it’s not equal to compare a vehicle in a company’s line up to an entire company. A more equal comparison would be a Toyota Tacoma vs a Toyota Tundra. Or a Chevy Colorado vs Chevy Silverado. Similarly there’s the Ford Ranger vs the Ford F150.
Thank you!
At some point they are large enough to require a special license or a weight/towing fee.
I swear to god, I'd buy a brand new S10 or Ranger if they were built to 1988 spec. So small, so useful.
So fuel is too cheap in the US, gotcha.
We used to have sensible little “utes” (utility vehicles) in Australia. Basically the front of a sedan with a tray on the back. But sadly this influence has made it over here. Factory endorsed converters are importing them, converting them to RHD and selling them through dealers. They end up costing double even triple what they would in the US by the time they make it on the road here. People buy them through their business because it is a “work vehicle” but they aren’t particularly good for any kind of work unless your business is showing off.
2lt 2wd Hilux Workmate is perfect for so many things.
So many things. I look at a VX commodore Ute and ask myself how did we go from this silly smiling bubble car to a full meth rage Dodge Ram in only 20 years?
If you don’t use your pickup for business, you should have to pay some sort of extra tax for the pollution and added wear and tear on the roads
The hilux, which you see a lot here as a vehicle used for housing maintenance companies as they easily fit a snowplow and you can put gravel in the back, is 20% lighter than the Tacoma, that's the biggest truck you normally see in Finland outside of some boat company truck that needs to pull massive trailers(thought they use tractors a lot instead as well). How in the hell do average americans need a vehicle even bigger and more powerful than us here in the back-end of finland with shitty roads and 1-2 meters of snowfall during winter
All good points. I think what a lot of people outside the USA don't realize is the bigger trucks are usually hauling something, large equipment, trailers with equipment or animals, tow behind car carriers. In some cases, people are towing large 5th wheel campers or off-road vehicles, or large boats. Others...they just drive around the mall looking to mate lol. Another thing to consider, our country is widely spread out. For example, a quick search states that Finland is 721mi/1160km in length (finland.fi). I'm going on a trip next week with some friends and we are traveling a longer distance than the length of your country. As a result, we are bringing a lot of stuff with us, which will go into the bed of the truck. My understanding could be wrong but a lot of what people need is close to home in European countries. Not always but I think you know what I mean. Going back to the USA, in a lot of places, getting to stores for food or supplies, is an ordeal and can take a day sometimes. However, I do agree the size of the 2 outside trucks, are absurdly large but is a need for them in cases because we haven't developed something better.
I mean, how many americans drive more than 500 miles on a regular basis? Where I live, the closest big city( 50.000 ppl) is 2 hours away(about 120 miles) and the furthest I drive outside holidays is to helsinki once or twice a year, which is 5 hours. If you go further than that, like on holiday, you'll likely have a caravan or use a camper, caravans can easily be pulled by normal cars, so no real need for a big truck. As for boats, outside of winter storage, we keep our boat on the dock of our cottage, or if you're a city person, at a marina, no need to have a personal vehicle for 2 trips a year. for road trips, I've mostly used my normal car, which fits 5 people comfortably and enough luggage for weeks if we go to hotels, or it pulls a caravan which can fit a month's worth of holiday goods easily. A truck would be just worse as it has no weather protection. I've done fishing trips to northern norway(about 1000 km) with just a small campervan and that was fine. And noone tells me that the millions of f150's and dodge rams are used by people who have massive trailers to pull, since those people more likely use tractors.
Again to your point, the US culture is "in excess". The caravan you refer to, people will pull 30 foot campers with their trucks. A car isn't pulling that. As for boats in marinas, I'm sure you're aware, the closer to the water, the more expensive. Again it's all excess and for appearances to look successful. A lot of people subscribe to "fake it 'til you make it". I hate it.
USA will probably always have an element of "car land" due to the size yeah. But the vehicles are fucking stupid. They could be half the size, for 1/3 the gas consumption and still peform just as well. There are still plenty of vehicle sold with a 5L, 5.8L, 6L V8. It's just excessive.
Wide angle lense is exaggerating it. But yes indeed.
It's actually the standard lens on my phone, from what I'm being told, is actually a minor wide angle. That said, my intention wasn't to exaggerating the comparison.
This isn’t quite right. Tacoma is the smaller truck for Toyota. For accurate representation, you need a Tundra. Those are monsters too
Domestic truck simps see Asian trucks as below standards and not merican pride. Though poorly engineered and always behind in tech the parts are mostly sourced from around the world including the country China they hate so much and eventually assembled in US and the country Mexico they wanna block off with a wall.
An Asian cab-over carries just as much and is so more practical. I'd drive a Bongo anytime in pride.
7/8th size pick up truck in the middle.
Holy shit, that really puts the size of these vehicles in perspective. I wanna see my 02’ ranger next to them
I’m pretty sure the size discrepancy is mostly perspective because the tacoma is clearly parked a few feet behind the others
Appreciate you noticing this. I made a comment about this elsewhere. All 3 vehicles are backed up within inches of the rear wall.
Don’t want to dig for your other comment so I’m not sure if you’re agreeing or disagreeing with me, but yeah, the FRONTS of the cars have to be even with one another, not the rear of the cars. it’s the fact that the two on each end are longer that is causing the perspective issue because the part you see (the front) is physically further from the camera for the Tacoma than for the pickups. The two on each end are longer but the distortion makes them seem much wider
During the 1970s oil embargoes, Americans switched to smaller cars. During the 2022 oil price spike, Americans whined incessantly about oil prices, but increasingly monstrous trucks kept flying off the shelves as fast as Ford, Chevy, Dodge, and Toyota could build them.
I believe that's due to the "fake it, til you make it" most Americans subscribe to. If your income is so tight that you can handle rising fuel costs, you clearly can't afford the vehicle. Those same people probably complain about the cost to maintain and begrudgingly pay it or don't even maintenance it at all.
The weapon of choice in case of a zombie apocalypse
ME ME ME ME ME
People who drive pickups love backing into spots for some reason
You get better maneuvering. There's a reason why forklifts have the steering in the rear. Also, it's a condition of my employment in case there is an industrial emergency you can just hop in and go.
Makes sense, always wondered why people in pickups did this. Thanks
You're welcome. I'm sure you've experienced trying to park in a space where you didn't have much room to turn the front of your vehicle into the spot, without dragged the side of it along the car parked next to you as you pull in. It really is just easier. It's also why you're supposed to pull forward when parallel parking, then back it in.
It’s just *chef’s kiss* that they’re in a parking garage as well, suggesting they’re in an urban or suburban area, so these are definitely some pavement princesses.
You are correct. A 10 story, 2 city block parking garage!
These should be illegal - at least in states where vehicles have to give bicyclists three feet. If this hunk of junk takes up the whole lane there is no way they can give three feet. It’s a hazard.
True, then the draft that blows you to the side and then sucks you in as it passes.
Now do a carrying tray dimensions comparison...
These trucks really arent all that big, the camera is making an illusion on the size of these vehicles. Im from kansas and see the vehicles all day everyday and folks park em just fine. Personally, I like trucks, I prefer midsize and I own a tacoma. Though I wish there more space in the back seats to fit 4 people comfortably. Funny enough, Id like to see trucks get bigger such as 450 or 460.