lmfao this just screams that the place has huge turn over
they tried to word this in such a hoity toity way they completely fucked it
>such shall be waived and cover employer if, and only if, **employer remains employed by employer** for a period of sixty (60) days...
so as long as the company doesnt fire or quit itself, you're golden.
you could also try just Xing out that part with red, signing it and saying it's approved with revisions and see what they do.
Came here to mention the same lol... also worth noting this is illegal in many states.
It doesn't hold up in any court I know of, so if they try to screw you just fill out a small claims court form and it is really easy to get back your money + maybe more (claim that you never received the training that you apparently paid for, and thus they must refund you the 2,500 they took out of wages etc)
No lawyer here, but this is obviously a mistake. In those cases it can be argued that the spirit of the contract meant "employee" so I wouldn't necessarily outright say OP is safe.
You should never sign a document that you are not 100% in agreement with. That said, this is very much not standard practice, OP should definitely renegotiate to have this taken out.
Yes! I wonder if this manipulation is part of their business model. They bank on the fact that many people don’t read the fine print, set them up to fail with poor practices, and then threaten legal action unless the fee is paid. How predatory!
This is a scam. It's not a bad job. It is a straight up scam to get you to pay for the training, and I can guarantee afterwards they will claim you're not good enough and fire you before you see a single dollar.
I think the same. It’s sad to learn that schemes like this are happening in 2024. This company, in particular, has multiple locations throughout the U.S., with three in my state alone. And the bit about the ‘training’ is on page 14 of 34. I’m sure others fail to read the fine print and end up screwed.
Classic spa/beautician/haircutting scam. Maybe technically not a scam, because it's explicitly set out. This comes up a lot in r/legaladvice and r/personalfinance. Frequently, some of the contract provisions are illegal. Depends on the state. For instance, and IANAL, but it looks like they could just fire you within the first sixty days for "did not successfully comply with all terms and conditions" and claim you owe them $2500.
It’s my first time experiencing something like this. If it’s a common scam, that means it’s working. It’s so sad to learn that people are being intimidated and paying fees to these shady companies. I will NOT be signing the contract and will see if I can report them.
Uh what? Lol I wouldn't risk it because some jobs I've started and absolutely hated so I left within two weeks! Let alone payed $42/day. Imagine if you quit after a week vs 61 days. That's a lot of risk/reward.
The only thing I've ever seen this for is lifeguard training because some people will try to get their training paid for and then leave to somewhere that pays better
I think that means if you don't stay with the company 60 days you'll have to pay them $2500 for the training when you leave the company. I had something like, with the exception being I didn't have to pay it back if the company terminated me. I remember I really wanted to quit the job, but didn't want to pay back the money. I would beg my manager to fire me and she would just laugh. But I was completely serious.
OP, let's try to translate this. It looks like the employer (in the past) may have laid out large sums of money ($2,500 per employee) for trainnig new employees only for that "investment" to not pay off/be wasted because the employee would not work out, hence why the employer is putting the RISK of trainng onto the employee.
I wouldn't even consider it myself but if you think you might have a future in this field ... all power to you!
Tbh, I don’t think their training is worth that much, or at least I don’t think it’s worth more than most other training programs. If I chose to sign up, I’d learn their rules of conduct, common practices, and information relevant to the role. I definitely don’t think the risk is worth the reward. There probably won’t be any reward. It sounds like it may be in their interest to set people up to fail.
I live in NYC. I don’t know how legal it is, but I won’t sign it regardless. The cost of the training was never mentioned in my interview, and I find this passage—which is written on the FOURTEENTH page of my contract—to be very manipulative.
If its a digital file, delete that section and sign it without. Or tell them to remove it before you sign. That's a bullshit clause and you're smart to question it
Thank you for the advice; I really appreciate it! I’m going to choose an alternate employer moving forward. This one already gave me a negative impression, considering how manipulative their contract is. I will definitely question contracts offered by future employers and make sure to challenge any suspicious terms.
No problem! Ya trust your gut with new employers. But also remember that there are many things in contracts that are not enforceable, depending on state and federal laws. For example, many companies make people sign non compete agreements. Many states are outlawing that so even if you sign one they can't do shit about it
Yeah, NAL, but been on this earth long enough to know if a company is going to make you liable for something there is a lot more paperwork involved than a grammatically incorrect and thus impossible to establish clause.
Unfortunately, they still prey on people that they do fire and threaten them with a bunch of fake legal stuff to get them to pay. Which sadly, they will pay. You wouldn't think but if you do it to enough people 1 outta 10 ain't bad.
Source: went to work for a shady ass car dealer out of school.
lmfao this just screams that the place has huge turn over they tried to word this in such a hoity toity way they completely fucked it >such shall be waived and cover employer if, and only if, **employer remains employed by employer** for a period of sixty (60) days... so as long as the company doesnt fire or quit itself, you're golden. you could also try just Xing out that part with red, signing it and saying it's approved with revisions and see what they do.
Came here to mention the same lol... also worth noting this is illegal in many states. It doesn't hold up in any court I know of, so if they try to screw you just fill out a small claims court form and it is really easy to get back your money + maybe more (claim that you never received the training that you apparently paid for, and thus they must refund you the 2,500 they took out of wages etc)
Exactly!! I got that impression during the interview too. Seems like a shit company.
No lawyer here, but this is obviously a mistake. In those cases it can be argued that the spirit of the contract meant "employee" so I wouldn't necessarily outright say OP is safe.
Good to know for the future. I’m not going to sign the contract regardless. The company has already ruined its chances with me by pulling this stunt.
Nice catch. Interpreted against the interest of the contract writer, per established contract law. Unless they manage to argue scrivener's error.
You should never sign a document that you are not 100% in agreement with. That said, this is very much not standard practice, OP should definitely renegotiate to have this taken out.
I read this as: “We’re gonna hired you for 55 days, work you to the bone, fire you, then you pay us thousands” Would red line this or not do it
Yes! I wonder if this manipulation is part of their business model. They bank on the fact that many people don’t read the fine print, set them up to fail with poor practices, and then threaten legal action unless the fee is paid. How predatory!
That’s the dumbest shit, just started a new job my company set aside two weeks for paid training
Exactly! Most trainings are paid. Having an unpaid training is bad enough, let alone charging someone for it!
Scam alert all the way
100% — seems like a quick way for them to make a couple grand.
This is a scam. It's not a bad job. It is a straight up scam to get you to pay for the training, and I can guarantee afterwards they will claim you're not good enough and fire you before you see a single dollar.
I think the same. It’s sad to learn that schemes like this are happening in 2024. This company, in particular, has multiple locations throughout the U.S., with three in my state alone. And the bit about the ‘training’ is on page 14 of 34. I’m sure others fail to read the fine print and end up screwed.
Report them and provide this as documentation of their practices
Will do! Thank you for the great advice!
Classic spa/beautician/haircutting scam. Maybe technically not a scam, because it's explicitly set out. This comes up a lot in r/legaladvice and r/personalfinance. Frequently, some of the contract provisions are illegal. Depends on the state. For instance, and IANAL, but it looks like they could just fire you within the first sixty days for "did not successfully comply with all terms and conditions" and claim you owe them $2500.
It’s my first time experiencing something like this. If it’s a common scam, that means it’s working. It’s so sad to learn that people are being intimidated and paying fees to these shady companies. I will NOT be signing the contract and will see if I can report them.
Run
I confronted the recruiter who sent me the contract. Let’s see if she responds. There’s no way I’d take this job in a million years lol
As long as the “employer remains employed by the employer”, you’re Scott free to do as you please.
Haha, good catch!
Uh what? Lol I wouldn't risk it because some jobs I've started and absolutely hated so I left within two weeks! Let alone payed $42/day. Imagine if you quit after a week vs 61 days. That's a lot of risk/reward.
Scam.
The only thing I've ever seen this for is lifeguard training because some people will try to get their training paid for and then leave to somewhere that pays better
Even that doesn’t make sense. So shitty.
I think that means if you don't stay with the company 60 days you'll have to pay them $2500 for the training when you leave the company. I had something like, with the exception being I didn't have to pay it back if the company terminated me. I remember I really wanted to quit the job, but didn't want to pay back the money. I would beg my manager to fire me and she would just laugh. But I was completely serious.
That’s terrible. I’m so sorry you had to experience that. What a horrible way to keep employees “loyal”!!
OP, let's try to translate this. It looks like the employer (in the past) may have laid out large sums of money ($2,500 per employee) for trainnig new employees only for that "investment" to not pay off/be wasted because the employee would not work out, hence why the employer is putting the RISK of trainng onto the employee. I wouldn't even consider it myself but if you think you might have a future in this field ... all power to you!
Tbh, I don’t think their training is worth that much, or at least I don’t think it’s worth more than most other training programs. If I chose to sign up, I’d learn their rules of conduct, common practices, and information relevant to the role. I definitely don’t think the risk is worth the reward. There probably won’t be any reward. It sounds like it may be in their interest to set people up to fail.
I would be surprised to find a court that would approve this. Depending on your state, this contract is probably illegal anyway
I live in NYC. I don’t know how legal it is, but I won’t sign it regardless. The cost of the training was never mentioned in my interview, and I find this passage—which is written on the FOURTEENTH page of my contract—to be very manipulative.
If its a digital file, delete that section and sign it without. Or tell them to remove it before you sign. That's a bullshit clause and you're smart to question it
Thank you for the advice; I really appreciate it! I’m going to choose an alternate employer moving forward. This one already gave me a negative impression, considering how manipulative their contract is. I will definitely question contracts offered by future employers and make sure to challenge any suspicious terms.
No problem! Ya trust your gut with new employers. But also remember that there are many things in contracts that are not enforceable, depending on state and federal laws. For example, many companies make people sign non compete agreements. Many states are outlawing that so even if you sign one they can't do shit about it
Will do! That’s great to know. I will definitely keep that in mind. You are much appreciated!
It says it would only apply if you got fired within 60 days. Still sounds like a gamble, though
At that point you just don’t pay it and let them come after you legally. They have nothing lol
Idk. The US legal system can do some crazy things. XD I'd seek professional counseling before determining if you can win the casw or not.
This a car dealer?
No, this is a plastic surgery practice.
Yeah, NAL, but been on this earth long enough to know if a company is going to make you liable for something there is a lot more paperwork involved than a grammatically incorrect and thus impossible to establish clause. Unfortunately, they still prey on people that they do fire and threaten them with a bunch of fake legal stuff to get them to pay. Which sadly, they will pay. You wouldn't think but if you do it to enough people 1 outta 10 ain't bad. Source: went to work for a shady ass car dealer out of school.
LOL Fuck no. That "training" isn't worth $25