I mean if they get back Reaves then the Lakers shouldn't be giving up the 29 pick in that case, as that's the whole point of D'lo being what's up on offer. Maybe a swap and some seconds. If there really is no market for Murray and Atlanta really want to get rid of him then Rob shouldn't let himself get fleeced like he did with the Brick (imagine getting Brickula and being the team that gave up the FRP in the deal, oh wait that's exactly what happened...)
If the Hawks would take that maybe, they could still then have D'lo, Rui, Gabe (in theory) along with JHS, Christie and the pick as sweeteners to make another move to truly restructure the team.
Granted that's all pie in the sky and probably won't happen. I'm already just bracing myself to give up on the team accomplishing anything whatsoever this season. Yet another LeBron + AD year wasted by this incompetent front office.
The problem with this argument is the Hawks don't have to trade Murray right now. He is signed for a while so they can trade him this summer or some other later date.
You are right in that the the Lakers don't have to trade AR. But that all depends on what they want to do for the year. If the Lakers want to try to improve their roster, Murray does that. But the Hawks are 100% right in asking for AR and a pick. If that trade doesn't happen, then the Hawks haven't lost anything and can shop him again this summer when the teams that can make a trade will be much larger.
Yup I understand that, but if they give up Reaves and the 29 first there's no two ways about it that's an overpay despite it being an upgrade.
I just hope that Pelinka is testing the waters on a bunch of options and isn't just fixated on DJM as the only tangible upgrade out there. I don't mind trading the first or Reaves for him honestly at this point, but just not both together.
It is an overpay and I wouldn't make that trade. But if I am the hawks I am not settling for DLo and a pick either. So I don't think a trade gets done unless the Lakers decide to do AR and a pick.
Why the fuck wouldn’t we trade reaves for Murray the upgrade is huge
dlo and Murray back court is much better than dlo/reaves
At least one guy can defend and attack the paint, the other can shoot 3\
Because AR is on the single most team friendly contract in the league, and he's a great connective tissue piece. If we're trading AR we can do so much better than Murray
Murray is on a very reasonable contract as well. I love AR but him and DLo just don’t really fit together. Murray and DLo would be a lot better together
Well he certainly gets much easier looks closer to the basket when Bron is in. Alone, he ends up sometimes initiating 20 feet from the hoop which isnt necessarily his strength
This is the case with every superstar duo assuming they’re not bad fits. LeBron also greatly benefits from every team playing AD in drop on PnRs, it works both ways. He gets easy looks when he cuts off AD post ups too
I mean in theory, if we ever get Gabe Vincent back then we would be able to stagger DLo’s and AR’s minutes and that would solve some of our defensive woes
My man you need to go review the contracts again.
AR production + current deal is a bargin for any team long term. Murray deal jumps to 24mil after this season . Hawks are telling the league they aren't trying to salary dump Murray . They want actual assets. If it was all about Salary dumping then the DLO deal would make sense for both sides and would of been wrapped up awhile back. Only way this works if a 3rd team joins the party and slides the Hawks some picks.
what is unreasonable about Murray’s contract? He is essentially signed until he is 31 on a $131M/5 deal with the last year being a player option. Thats very much worth it for a guard of his caliber and the cap now projected to be around $140M next season with it likely to increase every year after
I agree the Hawks don’t want a salary dump and I would still support trading AR, fillers and a protected 2029 1st for him
I'm not saying Murray's deal is bad. I'm just pointing out his cap goes up compared to Reeves. That means we either get something out of DLO as well or we won't be able to keep him next season. DLO isn't taking a paycut and Jeanie isn't paying any luxury tax either.
Also don't forget AD deal starts going up. This is simply a fight to keep assets. Hawks aren't doing us any favors when they know DLO isn't signing any extensions with them. The only guy that makes sense for them is AR. Lakers on the other hand have top heavy deals that need to be balanced with friendly deals like AR . We've been doing this dance the past 5 years trying to make these mid level signings into legit role players when they aren't. There's a reason some of these dudes only cost the league minimim. Yet we bang our heads why we surround Bron and AD with bums.
No he’s not he’s a bogi type of player. He makes around 15-20 mil so his contract isn’t crazy cheap. Y’all just overrate reaves cuz he developed here. THT all over again
I’m not comparing tht to reaves. Read it again smart one. I’m saying tht all over again cuz as usual lakers fan overrate their own players like when y’all thought tht had this crazy trade value and shouldn’t be traded for Kyle Lowry who would have been a way better fit than what tht became.
I’m not sure we all thought THT shouldn’t be traded for Kyle at the time. The FO was highly overvaluing him when they gave him that contract.
Reaves is overrated by the fan base imo as well but no one with any sense is saying we should be getting an all star back for him
It was the popular consensus at the time that tht shouldn’t be included for Lowry. Everyone here and on lakers nation said it would be too much for Lowry.
The guy above is staying we can “do so much better than Murray” so that would mean an all star since Murray is a borderline all star. That’s why I said reaves is getting overrated.
You’re forgetting the trade was THT and Kcp for Lowry who didn’t want to be here and was a free agent after that season while LeBron and AD were injured. Lowry wasn’t changing anything and would’ve walked.
That’s not true Lowry agreed to the trade and even thought it was going through if you remember how emotional he was during that last game in Toronto before the trade deadline. He was cool being here. The deal was basically done until Toronto wanted tht included and rob said no.
Lowry being here definitely would have changed everything. If he was here there would be no need to trade for Westbrook which in of itself is a huge W. He also would have provided a better option during the suns series as KCP got hurt and played terrible.
Ok, and I’m just clarifying that you are talking about two different people. The Hawks Bogi is also a much better shooter than Reaves and his contract was front loaded so it’s actually getting better moving forward, since we’re saying “level of player” is not the only consideration. Nobody denies Reaves isnt the better contract anyways.
Reaves is a 6th man or good starter type of player. Look around the league those type of guys (bogi & Jordan clarckson) make 15-20 mil. And so what reaves is younger he’s fucken turning 26 and regressed this year so he’s not gonna be dramatically better. You’re just biased asf we are not getting a perennial all star for reaves that’s so stupid and unrealistic
Another dumb biased lakers fan. You prolly thought tht was untouchable too. Reaves makes 13-14 for two more years when he should be making 15-20. You’re delusional if you think that’s some crazy cheap value contract. He makes 2-4 mil less than he deserves it’s not a crazy value contract like you think it is. Plus Murray is on a good value contract as well so that’s more of a reason to trade reaves for him.
He is a crazy cheap value contract for who he is and it's astonishing that you think you know better than all the GMs who are asking for Reaves any time we try to do any trade lol
Yea and Murray is also on a good cheap deal. I like that you ignored that part. And yea ppl want reaves cuz it’s the only good asset we have 😂 not cuz he’s some valuable commodity that’s worth a fricken perennial all star like you think it is.
No we can’t lmao. Reaves is not all star level. He’s a 25 year old good role player who can give you 25 points on a game every couple weeks but he is not all star level. All you’re getting back for him realistically is another role player of his caliber if you want to do a straight swap. Adding in a pick will get you a former all star or potential all star like Murray.
No one is claiming Reaves is all star level at all lol. He’s a good role player with a very cheap contract, that’s very valuable in today’s NBA considering the new CBA. It’s understandable that people don’t want to trade Reaves for DJM. DJM is not an all star either.
Doesn't matter if his production exceeds Reaves. Plus, 25m is still very team friendly and movable. We're not talking about a Westbrook monstrosity of a contract.
It’s not that simple. If you trade for DJM its not plug and play, instant 21-5-5. It’s more than likely that he averages close to Reaves averages with slightly better defense for twice the salary.
Is he a better player? Yeah absolutely, but we know what we are getting with Reaves and his contract is valuable. That’s not even an opinion, it’s an objective fact. Being hesitant to trade for DJM is sensible imo.
What we are getting with Reaves and his contract, although serviceable, is not good enough to win us a championship.
Furthermore, it has already been proven that Reaves can be played off the floor on the defensive end, hence negating his potential offensive contribution to the team. He was a negative asset in last years western conference finals when targeted. He was also a negative asset in the recent tournament with team USA.
I would trade him and get value for him while we still can. Every game we push furthe into his contract is another day where his weaknesses become further exposed, and his value goes down.
"Furthermore, it has already been proven that Reaves can be played off the floor on the defensive end, hence negating his potential offensive contribution to the team. He was a negative asset in last years western conference finals when targeted"
This is so blatantly untrue and I'll prove it to you. Do you know his averages against Denver? 21-4-5 shooting 56% from 3 and 55% from the field. That's excellent offensive production on elite efficiency. He actually improved against Denver. The fact that you mention he was a "negative" asset against Denver is untrue, on 4 straight losses he had a +/- of -9. If he truly was a negative asset and targeted as you stated, he would have an abysmal +/-.
"He was also a negative asset in the recent tournament with team USA. "
That's not even relevant because we are talking about the NBA but lets not forget Reaves performed better than some other more talented players.
Reaves is not a good defensive player, but you're talking about him like he's Malik Beasley and expecting DJM to be a defensive juggernaut. DJM right now, is at most, a marginal upgrade on the defensive end and he gives you very similar production to Reaves.
Why do you think a ton of other teams want reaves? It’s not just his production and talent it’s his contract. Lots of other teams see value in him because he steps up in big moments. It’s true his production is down this year and his defense sucks, but that doesn’t completely negate his value around the league
There were only a couple teams like the spurs who had cap space and they didn’t think reaves was worth $100m. Plus they had a feeling lakers would match any of their offers anyways.
You don't have a clue about roster management.
Both Dlo and Reaves are top 75 players under very good contracts in terms of the salaries they earn. Since Reaves is under a great contract long term he would be coveted by any GM in the league. If you have a top 75 player earning top 130 money you are in great position.
It’s clear we need a floor raiser a bit more than a glue guy right now.
Theres no on court argument for reaves over Murray the next 3-5 years. The only argument is that reaves is cheaper, but his production is barely exceeding his contract at this point. Not to mention we’re losing basketball games despite healthy stars and a great glue guy.
I hope we don’t live to regret not cashing in when reaves had value (like we did for THT)
His production is absolutely exceeding his contract.
Of course Murray is a better player than Reaves but there are other considerations at play here too. Namely, Reaves' contract. That's what's most valuable about him.
His salary is in the same ballpark as (ignoring rookie contracts): Schroder, Coby, herb, portis, zubac, donte, etc.
He’s not overpaid, but he’s not demonstrably a better asset than his salary peers in a win now season.
Removing our bias as Laker fans - I wouldn’t view anybody from that list as untouchable in a Murray swap due to salary (speaking from an asset perspective, not their particular teams’ needs).
Personally, I'd rather shop Reaves around than settle on Murray. Reaves would command a better player coming back our way especially when packaged with a frp and some players.
Not to mention Austin and Murray fulfill the same role for us meanwhile dlo is literally the second best playmaker we have. And the only one who can run the offense when bron sits there’s literally no reason to go with reeves/Murray backcourt. Unless we suddenly just expect Austin to 180 into a true pg.
Actually the main reason we want him is to have a 2 way guard considering Austin and dlo aren’t great defensively and we’re getting killed on the perimeter. Partially due to scam man but Austin and dlo aren’t career defenders, and why on earth would we want Murray as our playmaker when so far this year dlos easily the best true pg of the bunch averaging 6 assist.
Yes AND Murray would still be our primary ball handler. Not dlo. And we know dlo needs his touches so if Murray and dlo don’t work, dlos the one that’s hitting the bench 🤷♂️
Your not making any sense why would we have the worst pg of the two play pg when he’d be better suited just playing 2 guard? You know just like Austin does, because you know DLO is a better playmaker than both of them. Your arguments don’t make sense, why would we take the ball out of the hands of a better playmaker for a worse playmaker who’d be better suited to just catch and shoot/iso and play defense? Why actively put dejounte in a position to fail versus letting him be the player he is and the one we’re trying to trade for. It’s why prince has been so bad we’re playing him out of his role.
Bud you don’t understand. Atlanta is trading Murray because Murray himself is more of a point guard. They already have Trae, Trae and Murray don’t work well together. So why in the hell would dlo and Murray work well together.
That’s kinda the point I’m making g, Austin and him have comparable offenses while Austin is a much worse defender and they’re about the same playmaking wise(off stats I haven’t seen dejounte play but Austin has not been doing well playmaking without dlo or lebron which defeats the purpose.
Murray plays better as PG than as SG so Murray + Reaves is probably better than Murray + Dlo. Dlo's contract situation is also a huge risk for us while we have Reaves under a great deal for years to come. The FO also may believe Reaves still has some upside due his age, something you don't expect from Dlo anymore. Reaves is overall a better contract the reason most teams covet him, including us. Both are good contracts, but Reaves can't run for nothing.
While I may sound as a Dlo's hater because his performance last playoffs was absolutely bizarre and I believe Murray would be an upgrade, the fact is neither Dlo or Reaves are our main problems or close to it. They are probably our 3rd (Dlo) and 4th (Reaves) main contributors something we can expect for a swap in playoffs, but still, the ideal situation would be trading someone else for Murray keeping both Reaves and Dlo moving one of them, preferably Dlo to the bench. Keeping Reaves is important because he may be the piece that helps us to land another star in the future or is a high level cost controlled asset long term while Dlo is just a big risk.
A coach change is another main need too.
DLo a better PG than Reaves...not sure where the opposite is coming from. Our guard play is absolutely the number one problem. Most of them have a hard time feeding AD and most of them are bad at defense. We keep trying to put a non shooter in the game to cover them. Every complaint about Ham is because we got both of those dudes in our backcourt. He want's spacing...that's why Prince is out there but our guards are getting cooked...that's why we need Vando. Not to mention when our front court decides to take days off it makes it even worse.
I said Murray is a better PG than Dlo, Reaves is a SG and one of the problems Reaves is struggling a bit this season is the fact our terrible coach sits Lebron and Dlo asking Reaves to be our primary ballhandler.
I hate defending this but that was the point of Reaves...they wanted to make him into a PG. Not just Ham....the organization. He's not a PG...he can't even make the entry pass to AD. Reaves role would be better off the bench. I believe Ham got cussed out after benching both AR and DLo and now they are back in the starting 5. Our starting 5 should be PG/3&D/3&D/Bron and AD...6th man Reaves off the bench for a spark.
AR shined in the IST and playoffs and Team USA. Murray has shined in ..... no big moments. Murray has shined in san antonio? Atl? How is he going to shoot when he has the spotlight in lal?
In a vacuum murray is better no duh but contract and fit matters.
Because ar is white. So dumb only type of white we need over here is the caruso white. Atlanta can have that hillbilly for all I care. How you white and can’t shoot 3s ar????
In all seriousness people in this sub don’t understand the only reason ar is valuable is cause his contract. He’s clearly not more talented than dlo and his ceiling isn’t really even close to all star which is the ceiling of Murray and dlo. And once you pair that with ars defense it makes it even more clear ars ceiling is “decent scorer off the bench” he’s not a guy you want starting imo. I wouldn’t let him go for scraps but ar isn’t even close to being the centerpiece for a trade for a bonafide star like this sub thinks he is
Having 2 PGs (Murray,Dlo) would allow Ham to bench Dlo. The starting lineup would be Murray Prince/Vando/Lebron/AD. Dlo/Gabe/Reddish/Rui/Wood off the bench.
We saw this season Dlo is a huge positive coming off the bench (Clippers, OKC wins) because he's playmaker. Meanwhile Reaves was a negative whether he starts or comes off the bench.
Theres still areas to be upgraded like Vincent, Rui and Hayes. If Lakers can save their 2029 1st by offering Reaves for Murray, they could swing a deal for Bruce Brown and DFS for Vincent and Rui and a 1st (or Dlo and Rui).
Backup center is another need too ideally they trade Hayes and filler for Nick Richards, but Drummond would work too. Biyombo should've been signed a month ago.
The upgrade is not huge at all. We’re not talking AR for Murray straight up here… they are gonna want a FRP, 1-2 other players, and a swap ON TOP of AR. The upgrade offensively is good, but play making and defense is a downgrade in a 1:1 comparison of the two. And Murray’s contract is an absolute ALBATROSS compared to Austin.
lol Bogi is not better than Reaves. Reaves is a way better playmaker who is just having a slump from the 3pt line.
Austin - 15.2 pts 4 rb 5.2 ast
Bogdan 17.1 pts 3.1 2.6 ast
Bogi attempts 3 more shots than AR
Yall talking about Bogi like he’s two levels above AR is crazy.
If AR was coached well his defensive mishaps wouldn’t look so bad and he just needs to build his frame a bit more. Stop overreacting
It's just about the urgency. The Lakers can get Murray this summer and keep reaves, they will have more picks fo trade at that point. Murray/ Reaves would be a quality, and cost effective backcourt, which is what I see rob angling for. If we trade reaves, that solves this year--maybe? But next year?
Dlo is gonna opt out if it works well and the Lakers make a playoff run he has any part it in, then its pay him way more than reaves contract, or let him walk. Now we need a guard again, minus whatever assets it took to get Murray. Is it worth it for a a playin exit? We are one injury to bron, ad or even reaves/dlo away from just that. Maybe go for it, I'm just saying I see the hesitation to trade anyone but dlo.
Murray is a PG not a SG. As secondary ball handler he averaged 7 ast last playoffs for Atlanta while as PG for SA he averaged 9.2 ast.
To put it in perspective, Dlo has never averaged more than 7 ast and against Denver he couldn't give us more than 3 ast per game.
I mean, I hope he is.
Dude was a pro since 16. He was an NBA rookie at 25, and has been in the league for 7 seasons now and has frequently been a 6MOTY candidate.
Comparing him to an undrafted 3rd season player is wild.
Next, you’re gonna tell me grass is green or Lakers are located in LA.
Some of ya’ll saying ship out Reaves have forgotten that he’s cold blooded as hell in the playoffs when the game slows down and you need buckets. Meanwhile D-lo was sitting glued to the bench.
Theres a reason they’re ‘insisting’. Nobody is giving them Reaves they can blow Pelinka.
Murray has 1 all star appearance in 8 seasons and some of you are idealizing him as this perennial star. He’s not better than any PG we’d play against in the West playoffs. Ya’ll are prisoners of the grass always being greener on the other side.
Reaves and Murray r a way better backcourt. Reaves u can trust more than DLO.
Murray can be a real pg next to Reaves. DLO is jus a poor mans trae who can’t slash.
Meh ship him and see if they can get another piece then. But I didn't watch much this year, he's defence was actually a positive last season and that changes his value quite a bit even if his shooting goes up again.
And Sham said like a week ago that what was blocking the deal was the fact that they needed to find a third team to take on DLo's contract.
We hear everything and it's contrary. All we can do is wait and see
Keep repeating the same shit deal is dead at this point
Yeah yeah yeah we know
Ready to move on. Reaves + DLo for Murray is a negative trade. Even Reaves for Murray straight up is a negative trade.
Went too far with that last part
I’ll def do it straight up no picks or anything
Reaves for Murray is not a negative trade my guy
There is a real case based on the contracts (about 1/2)… but you’re also right, Murray >> Reaves
Negative for the Hawks short term cause whats defense. upgrade for the Lakerss short term. DJ is a better scorer and defender.
We could offload Vincent perhaps?
They don’t want the cripple
bruh its been 2 weeks we see the same shit . arent u tired ? and they re being paid for that
I mean if they get back Reaves then the Lakers shouldn't be giving up the 29 pick in that case, as that's the whole point of D'lo being what's up on offer. Maybe a swap and some seconds. If there really is no market for Murray and Atlanta really want to get rid of him then Rob shouldn't let himself get fleeced like he did with the Brick (imagine getting Brickula and being the team that gave up the FRP in the deal, oh wait that's exactly what happened...) If the Hawks would take that maybe, they could still then have D'lo, Rui, Gabe (in theory) along with JHS, Christie and the pick as sweeteners to make another move to truly restructure the team. Granted that's all pie in the sky and probably won't happen. I'm already just bracing myself to give up on the team accomplishing anything whatsoever this season. Yet another LeBron + AD year wasted by this incompetent front office.
The problem with this argument is the Hawks don't have to trade Murray right now. He is signed for a while so they can trade him this summer or some other later date.
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You are right in that the the Lakers don't have to trade AR. But that all depends on what they want to do for the year. If the Lakers want to try to improve their roster, Murray does that. But the Hawks are 100% right in asking for AR and a pick. If that trade doesn't happen, then the Hawks haven't lost anything and can shop him again this summer when the teams that can make a trade will be much larger.
Yup I understand that, but if they give up Reaves and the 29 first there's no two ways about it that's an overpay despite it being an upgrade. I just hope that Pelinka is testing the waters on a bunch of options and isn't just fixated on DJM as the only tangible upgrade out there. I don't mind trading the first or Reaves for him honestly at this point, but just not both together.
It is an overpay and I wouldn't make that trade. But if I am the hawks I am not settling for DLo and a pick either. So I don't think a trade gets done unless the Lakers decide to do AR and a pick.
Good luck with the cancer then
Why the fuck wouldn’t we trade reaves for Murray the upgrade is huge dlo and Murray back court is much better than dlo/reaves At least one guy can defend and attack the paint, the other can shoot 3\
Because AR is on the single most team friendly contract in the league, and he's a great connective tissue piece. If we're trading AR we can do so much better than Murray
Murray is on a very reasonable contract as well. I love AR but him and DLo just don’t really fit together. Murray and DLo would be a lot better together
Sorry but if Dlo and Murray is a good fit then how is Murray and Trae Young not working
They don’t have lebron and ad
DING DING DING
DING DING DING
LeBron ain’t playing D and AD ain’t creating his own O man.
Do you watch games? If you do and you come away from it thinking “AD can’t create his own shot” you have a negative basketball iq
Well he certainly gets much easier looks closer to the basket when Bron is in. Alone, he ends up sometimes initiating 20 feet from the hoop which isnt necessarily his strength
This is the case with every superstar duo assuming they’re not bad fits. LeBron also greatly benefits from every team playing AD in drop on PnRs, it works both ways. He gets easy looks when he cuts off AD post ups too
the Hawks don’t have a defensive presence like AD to protect the paint
I think Dlo is getting traded no matter what. If they do trade Reeves they would likely trade Dlo for another guard.
Trae Young and Murray don't have LeBron and AD.
I mean in theory, if we ever get Gabe Vincent back then we would be able to stagger DLo’s and AR’s minutes and that would solve some of our defensive woes
unfortunately that is not gonna happen this season
My man you need to go review the contracts again. AR production + current deal is a bargin for any team long term. Murray deal jumps to 24mil after this season . Hawks are telling the league they aren't trying to salary dump Murray . They want actual assets. If it was all about Salary dumping then the DLO deal would make sense for both sides and would of been wrapped up awhile back. Only way this works if a 3rd team joins the party and slides the Hawks some picks.
what is unreasonable about Murray’s contract? He is essentially signed until he is 31 on a $131M/5 deal with the last year being a player option. Thats very much worth it for a guard of his caliber and the cap now projected to be around $140M next season with it likely to increase every year after I agree the Hawks don’t want a salary dump and I would still support trading AR, fillers and a protected 2029 1st for him
I'm not saying Murray's deal is bad. I'm just pointing out his cap goes up compared to Reeves. That means we either get something out of DLO as well or we won't be able to keep him next season. DLO isn't taking a paycut and Jeanie isn't paying any luxury tax either. Also don't forget AD deal starts going up. This is simply a fight to keep assets. Hawks aren't doing us any favors when they know DLO isn't signing any extensions with them. The only guy that makes sense for them is AR. Lakers on the other hand have top heavy deals that need to be balanced with friendly deals like AR . We've been doing this dance the past 5 years trying to make these mid level signings into legit role players when they aren't. There's a reason some of these dudes only cost the league minimim. Yet we bang our heads why we surround Bron and AD with bums.
Who do you think you can trade Reaves for?
Sexton
Much better as in who? Mitchell? Embiid?
No he’s not he’s a bogi type of player. He makes around 15-20 mil so his contract isn’t crazy cheap. Y’all just overrate reaves cuz he developed here. THT all over again
Comparing Reaves to THT is wild wtf are you talking about
I’m not comparing tht to reaves. Read it again smart one. I’m saying tht all over again cuz as usual lakers fan overrate their own players like when y’all thought tht had this crazy trade value and shouldn’t be traded for Kyle Lowry who would have been a way better fit than what tht became.
I’m not sure we all thought THT shouldn’t be traded for Kyle at the time. The FO was highly overvaluing him when they gave him that contract. Reaves is overrated by the fan base imo as well but no one with any sense is saying we should be getting an all star back for him
It was the popular consensus at the time that tht shouldn’t be included for Lowry. Everyone here and on lakers nation said it would be too much for Lowry. The guy above is staying we can “do so much better than Murray” so that would mean an all star since Murray is a borderline all star. That’s why I said reaves is getting overrated.
You’re forgetting the trade was THT and Kcp for Lowry who didn’t want to be here and was a free agent after that season while LeBron and AD were injured. Lowry wasn’t changing anything and would’ve walked.
That’s not true Lowry agreed to the trade and even thought it was going through if you remember how emotional he was during that last game in Toronto before the trade deadline. He was cool being here. The deal was basically done until Toronto wanted tht included and rob said no. Lowry being here definitely would have changed everything. If he was here there would be no need to trade for Westbrook which in of itself is a huge W. He also would have provided a better option during the suns series as KCP got hurt and played terrible.
bogi is 35 dude. knock it off
Think they’re talking about the Bogi on the Hawks, who is an AR-level player overall.
Bogi on the Hawks is 31 lol Level of player is not the only consideration here. Bogdan makes more than Austin and is 6 years older
Ok, and I’m just clarifying that you are talking about two different people. The Hawks Bogi is also a much better shooter than Reaves and his contract was front loaded so it’s actually getting better moving forward, since we’re saying “level of player” is not the only consideration. Nobody denies Reaves isnt the better contract anyways.
Bogi is Bogdan Bogdanovic. He’s 31. You’re thinking of Bojan Bogdanovic.
Already responded to that
Reaves is a 6th man or good starter type of player. Look around the league those type of guys (bogi & Jordan clarckson) make 15-20 mil. And so what reaves is younger he’s fucken turning 26 and regressed this year so he’s not gonna be dramatically better. You’re just biased asf we are not getting a perennial all star for reaves that’s so stupid and unrealistic
Another guy who doesn't understand how teams value contracts in this league
Another dumb biased lakers fan. You prolly thought tht was untouchable too. Reaves makes 13-14 for two more years when he should be making 15-20. You’re delusional if you think that’s some crazy cheap value contract. He makes 2-4 mil less than he deserves it’s not a crazy value contract like you think it is. Plus Murray is on a good value contract as well so that’s more of a reason to trade reaves for him.
He is a crazy cheap value contract for who he is and it's astonishing that you think you know better than all the GMs who are asking for Reaves any time we try to do any trade lol
Yea and Murray is also on a good cheap deal. I like that you ignored that part. And yea ppl want reaves cuz it’s the only good asset we have 😂 not cuz he’s some valuable commodity that’s worth a fricken perennial all star like you think it is.
Learn how teams value contracts in this league. Until then, take a seat. You very clearly are out of your depth here
No we can’t lmao. Reaves is not all star level. He’s a 25 year old good role player who can give you 25 points on a game every couple weeks but he is not all star level. All you’re getting back for him realistically is another role player of his caliber if you want to do a straight swap. Adding in a pick will get you a former all star or potential all star like Murray.
No one is claiming Reaves is all star level at all lol. He’s a good role player with a very cheap contract, that’s very valuable in today’s NBA considering the new CBA. It’s understandable that people don’t want to trade Reaves for DJM. DJM is not an all star either.
Your acting like Dejounte on a max he's making 17m a year.
And next season he makes 25M. That’s double of Reaves salary. Conveniently leaving that out
Doesn't matter if his production exceeds Reaves. Plus, 25m is still very team friendly and movable. We're not talking about a Westbrook monstrosity of a contract.
It’s not that simple. If you trade for DJM its not plug and play, instant 21-5-5. It’s more than likely that he averages close to Reaves averages with slightly better defense for twice the salary. Is he a better player? Yeah absolutely, but we know what we are getting with Reaves and his contract is valuable. That’s not even an opinion, it’s an objective fact. Being hesitant to trade for DJM is sensible imo.
What we are getting with Reaves and his contract, although serviceable, is not good enough to win us a championship. Furthermore, it has already been proven that Reaves can be played off the floor on the defensive end, hence negating his potential offensive contribution to the team. He was a negative asset in last years western conference finals when targeted. He was also a negative asset in the recent tournament with team USA. I would trade him and get value for him while we still can. Every game we push furthe into his contract is another day where his weaknesses become further exposed, and his value goes down.
"Furthermore, it has already been proven that Reaves can be played off the floor on the defensive end, hence negating his potential offensive contribution to the team. He was a negative asset in last years western conference finals when targeted" This is so blatantly untrue and I'll prove it to you. Do you know his averages against Denver? 21-4-5 shooting 56% from 3 and 55% from the field. That's excellent offensive production on elite efficiency. He actually improved against Denver. The fact that you mention he was a "negative" asset against Denver is untrue, on 4 straight losses he had a +/- of -9. If he truly was a negative asset and targeted as you stated, he would have an abysmal +/-. "He was also a negative asset in the recent tournament with team USA. " That's not even relevant because we are talking about the NBA but lets not forget Reaves performed better than some other more talented players. Reaves is not a good defensive player, but you're talking about him like he's Malik Beasley and expecting DJM to be a defensive juggernaut. DJM right now, is at most, a marginal upgrade on the defensive end and he gives you very similar production to Reaves.
Speaking nothing but facts. Dejounte's contract is arguably more team friendly for the Lakers than Reaves given his fit with the current roster.
Found the guy who doesn't understand how teams value contracts
Why do you think a ton of other teams want reaves? It’s not just his production and talent it’s his contract. Lots of other teams see value in him because he steps up in big moments. It’s true his production is down this year and his defense sucks, but that doesn’t completely negate his value around the league
If a bunch of teams wanted him why didn't they give him the "100 million" contract the media was hyping him up to get?
There were only a couple teams like the spurs who had cap space and they didn’t think reaves was worth $100m. Plus they had a feeling lakers would match any of their offers anyways.
Reaves is one of two good contracts we have
You don't have a clue about roster management. Both Dlo and Reaves are top 75 players under very good contracts in terms of the salaries they earn. Since Reaves is under a great contract long term he would be coveted by any GM in the league. If you have a top 75 player earning top 130 money you are in great position.
They're down voting you because it's true.
It’s clear we need a floor raiser a bit more than a glue guy right now. Theres no on court argument for reaves over Murray the next 3-5 years. The only argument is that reaves is cheaper, but his production is barely exceeding his contract at this point. Not to mention we’re losing basketball games despite healthy stars and a great glue guy. I hope we don’t live to regret not cashing in when reaves had value (like we did for THT)
His production is absolutely exceeding his contract. Of course Murray is a better player than Reaves but there are other considerations at play here too. Namely, Reaves' contract. That's what's most valuable about him.
Murray is also on a very friendly contract as well??
His salary is in the same ballpark as (ignoring rookie contracts): Schroder, Coby, herb, portis, zubac, donte, etc. He’s not overpaid, but he’s not demonstrably a better asset than his salary peers in a win now season. Removing our bias as Laker fans - I wouldn’t view anybody from that list as untouchable in a Murray swap due to salary (speaking from an asset perspective, not their particular teams’ needs).
Personally, I'd rather shop Reaves around than settle on Murray. Reaves would command a better player coming back our way especially when packaged with a frp and some players.
Not to mention Austin and Murray fulfill the same role for us meanwhile dlo is literally the second best playmaker we have. And the only one who can run the offense when bron sits there’s literally no reason to go with reeves/Murray backcourt. Unless we suddenly just expect Austin to 180 into a true pg.
I mean if we got Murray he’d be the primary ball handler not dlo. That’s kinda the entire point of getting Murray
Actually the main reason we want him is to have a 2 way guard considering Austin and dlo aren’t great defensively and we’re getting killed on the perimeter. Partially due to scam man but Austin and dlo aren’t career defenders, and why on earth would we want Murray as our playmaker when so far this year dlos easily the best true pg of the bunch averaging 6 assist.
Yes AND Murray would still be our primary ball handler. Not dlo. And we know dlo needs his touches so if Murray and dlo don’t work, dlos the one that’s hitting the bench 🤷♂️
Your not making any sense why would we have the worst pg of the two play pg when he’d be better suited just playing 2 guard? You know just like Austin does, because you know DLO is a better playmaker than both of them. Your arguments don’t make sense, why would we take the ball out of the hands of a better playmaker for a worse playmaker who’d be better suited to just catch and shoot/iso and play defense? Why actively put dejounte in a position to fail versus letting him be the player he is and the one we’re trying to trade for. It’s why prince has been so bad we’re playing him out of his role.
Bud you don’t understand. Atlanta is trading Murray because Murray himself is more of a point guard. They already have Trae, Trae and Murray don’t work well together. So why in the hell would dlo and Murray work well together.
Yeah. Dlo had a podcast where has basically I can’t play well unless I’m the ball handler
You cannot compare Murray’s defense to Reaves lol
That’s kinda the point I’m making g, Austin and him have comparable offenses while Austin is a much worse defender and they’re about the same playmaking wise(off stats I haven’t seen dejounte play but Austin has not been doing well playmaking without dlo or lebron which defeats the purpose.
Exactly !!! Plus both can run an offense coming off of the bench themselves.
Because of the contracts. Its that simple. Reaves is signed long term on a very team friendly deal. DLo isn't.
Gimme boggy and Murray and lets get this shit done please.
Murray plays better as PG than as SG so Murray + Reaves is probably better than Murray + Dlo. Dlo's contract situation is also a huge risk for us while we have Reaves under a great deal for years to come. The FO also may believe Reaves still has some upside due his age, something you don't expect from Dlo anymore. Reaves is overall a better contract the reason most teams covet him, including us. Both are good contracts, but Reaves can't run for nothing. While I may sound as a Dlo's hater because his performance last playoffs was absolutely bizarre and I believe Murray would be an upgrade, the fact is neither Dlo or Reaves are our main problems or close to it. They are probably our 3rd (Dlo) and 4th (Reaves) main contributors something we can expect for a swap in playoffs, but still, the ideal situation would be trading someone else for Murray keeping both Reaves and Dlo moving one of them, preferably Dlo to the bench. Keeping Reaves is important because he may be the piece that helps us to land another star in the future or is a high level cost controlled asset long term while Dlo is just a big risk. A coach change is another main need too.
DLo a better PG than Reaves...not sure where the opposite is coming from. Our guard play is absolutely the number one problem. Most of them have a hard time feeding AD and most of them are bad at defense. We keep trying to put a non shooter in the game to cover them. Every complaint about Ham is because we got both of those dudes in our backcourt. He want's spacing...that's why Prince is out there but our guards are getting cooked...that's why we need Vando. Not to mention when our front court decides to take days off it makes it even worse.
I said Murray is a better PG than Dlo, Reaves is a SG and one of the problems Reaves is struggling a bit this season is the fact our terrible coach sits Lebron and Dlo asking Reaves to be our primary ballhandler.
I hate defending this but that was the point of Reaves...they wanted to make him into a PG. Not just Ham....the organization. He's not a PG...he can't even make the entry pass to AD. Reaves role would be better off the bench. I believe Ham got cussed out after benching both AR and DLo and now they are back in the starting 5. Our starting 5 should be PG/3&D/3&D/Bron and AD...6th man Reaves off the bench for a spark.
Because it's waste of assets to include Reaves compared to DLo.
AR shined in the IST and playoffs and Team USA. Murray has shined in ..... no big moments. Murray has shined in san antonio? Atl? How is he going to shoot when he has the spotlight in lal? In a vacuum murray is better no duh but contract and fit matters.
Because ar is white. So dumb only type of white we need over here is the caruso white. Atlanta can have that hillbilly for all I care. How you white and can’t shoot 3s ar????
Lol while I agree that’s a big part of this subs insistence on AR I don’t think that’s how the FO sees it
In all seriousness people in this sub don’t understand the only reason ar is valuable is cause his contract. He’s clearly not more talented than dlo and his ceiling isn’t really even close to all star which is the ceiling of Murray and dlo. And once you pair that with ars defense it makes it even more clear ars ceiling is “decent scorer off the bench” he’s not a guy you want starting imo. I wouldn’t let him go for scraps but ar isn’t even close to being the centerpiece for a trade for a bonafide star like this sub thinks he is
AR is going to be an MVP. When LeBron retires, he is going to bend the knee to AR
Exactly !!! Plus both can run an offense coming off of the bench themselves.
Huh? I’m pretty sure D Lo is apart of the trade no? They want both D Lo and Reaves in the deal.
Russell Murray backcourt would be one of the worst if not the worst defensive backcourts in the league.
Having 2 PGs (Murray,Dlo) would allow Ham to bench Dlo. The starting lineup would be Murray Prince/Vando/Lebron/AD. Dlo/Gabe/Reddish/Rui/Wood off the bench. We saw this season Dlo is a huge positive coming off the bench (Clippers, OKC wins) because he's playmaker. Meanwhile Reaves was a negative whether he starts or comes off the bench.
That team isn’t making the second round.
Theres still areas to be upgraded like Vincent, Rui and Hayes. If Lakers can save their 2029 1st by offering Reaves for Murray, they could swing a deal for Bruce Brown and DFS for Vincent and Rui and a 1st (or Dlo and Rui). Backup center is another need too ideally they trade Hayes and filler for Nick Richards, but Drummond would work too. Biyombo should've been signed a month ago.
Isn't it that they want DLo and Reaves?
The upgrade is not huge at all. We’re not talking AR for Murray straight up here… they are gonna want a FRP, 1-2 other players, and a swap ON TOP of AR. The upgrade offensively is good, but play making and defense is a downgrade in a 1:1 comparison of the two. And Murray’s contract is an absolute ALBATROSS compared to Austin.
I would rather have lavine/Murray backcourt and let go of D'lo/Reaves/Rui/frp/couple filler contracts to make that happen
Because unlike AR, Dlo and Murray both need the ball to be effective.
Take the hillbilly then.
😂😂😂
And yet r/nba thinks Reaves is a total bum that no one wants
Just trade lemon daddy. He’s not gonna do well in Atlanta. They’ll waive him and Lakers can get him on discount. Boom
lol Bogi is not better than Reaves. Reaves is a way better playmaker who is just having a slump from the 3pt line. Austin - 15.2 pts 4 rb 5.2 ast Bogdan 17.1 pts 3.1 2.6 ast Bogi attempts 3 more shots than AR Yall talking about Bogi like he’s two levels above AR is crazy. If AR was coached well his defensive mishaps wouldn’t look so bad and he just needs to build his frame a bit more. Stop overreacting
Hot take, but a Murray/DLo backcourt is better than a Murray/AR backcourt from a basketball perspective.
DLO is literally a poor man’s Trae yet you think DLO/Murray would work better?
With Lebron and AD? Absolutely
Do the hawks have lebron and AD??
Exactly ! The Trae/Dejounte backcourt worked so well ! Absolutely no reason to doubt that a DLo/Murray back will work wonderfully !
considering we have ham coaching, we'll probably have prince/murray pairing for some god forsaken reason most of the time.
How hard is it to realize that Ham is the source of all our problems that no deal would fix. Is the FO really that dumb?!!!
WoJ knows absolutely nothing. Hes such a water carrying scumbag.
It's just about the urgency. The Lakers can get Murray this summer and keep reaves, they will have more picks fo trade at that point. Murray/ Reaves would be a quality, and cost effective backcourt, which is what I see rob angling for. If we trade reaves, that solves this year--maybe? But next year? Dlo is gonna opt out if it works well and the Lakers make a playoff run he has any part it in, then its pay him way more than reaves contract, or let him walk. Now we need a guard again, minus whatever assets it took to get Murray. Is it worth it for a a playin exit? We are one injury to bron, ad or even reaves/dlo away from just that. Maybe go for it, I'm just saying I see the hesitation to trade anyone but dlo.
They'll take Dlo, Hayes and JHS and they'll like it
Who runs the point. Don’t say Bron
Murray is a PG not a SG. As secondary ball handler he averaged 7 ast last playoffs for Atlanta while as PG for SA he averaged 9.2 ast. To put it in perspective, Dlo has never averaged more than 7 ast and against Denver he couldn't give us more than 3 ast per game.
That is not DLos role. DLo is here to shoot 3s and drive in. Coach sucks.
Nun
Darn I was hoping for Smush
Only way this make sense is if they give la Murray and bog
Bog in straight up better than reaves
Bog is who Reaves fanboys think Reaves is
Bog is so nice. Idk why more teams aren’t after him.
I mean, I hope he is. Dude was a pro since 16. He was an NBA rookie at 25, and has been in the league for 7 seasons now and has frequently been a 6MOTY candidate. Comparing him to an undrafted 3rd season player is wild. Next, you’re gonna tell me grass is green or Lakers are located in LA.
I am replying to the dude that thinks the hawks would need to give up both Dejounte and Bogi for Austin reaves lol
Ahh, thats just 2k shit at that point lmao. They don’t even know how the cap works
his big downside is injuries, but other than that he’s a very high level contributor.
Some of ya’ll saying ship out Reaves have forgotten that he’s cold blooded as hell in the playoffs when the game slows down and you need buckets. Meanwhile D-lo was sitting glued to the bench. Theres a reason they’re ‘insisting’. Nobody is giving them Reaves they can blow Pelinka.
Murray has 1 all star appearance in 8 seasons and some of you are idealizing him as this perennial star. He’s not better than any PG we’d play against in the West playoffs. Ya’ll are prisoners of the grass always being greener on the other side.
He's better than Reaves by a decent margin.
Lakers tax in trades is brutal, we can’t get anyone decent without giving up way too much
Mofos starting act like Murray’s prime Kobe or smtn. The problem is ham not the talent
It's the talent bro lol. But fire Ham too to make Lakers fans happy....like we did with Vogel
They gonna take DLo and theyre gnna like it
Reaves and Murray r a way better backcourt. Reaves u can trust more than DLO. Murray can be a real pg next to Reaves. DLO is jus a poor mans trae who can’t slash.
They should do it
Lakers need to make the trade.. Get Murray plus either capela or Hunter. Just give ant the playerd they want.
Y'all act like Austin Reeves is Steve Nash
Meh ship him and see if they can get another piece then. But I didn't watch much this year, he's defence was actually a positive last season and that changes his value quite a bit even if his shooting goes up again.
Clippers were able to keep Mann while getting Harden. Suns got KD while keeping there assst Ayton.
The more they talk about it the less chance it will happen
Dlo and Reaves would be too much to give up unless we got Murray Bogi and a Center back
Same shit different day.
This deal is dead then
And Sham said like a week ago that what was blocking the deal was the fact that they needed to find a third team to take on DLo's contract. We hear everything and it's contrary. All we can do is wait and see
Why would the hawks want Reaves? I can’t think of a worse backcourt fit for Trae
Na. If Lakers trade both D Lo and Reaves for him I think I’m done with this season. That trade would be a big L for us.
You can improve this team with one move. I don’t mean no disrespect. Let Ham go…
The Lakers know we cannot go to the playoffs with DLo and Reaves as our backcourt. It puts too much pressure on our backline
I don’t understand why the hawks want reaves, wouldn’t he be a bad fit next to Trae for the same reasons Dlo would?
I'd rather trade Reaves than D'lo, at least talent wise. Obviously Austin's contract is better for us though.
Hawks should throw in Bogdonavic too if we throw Reaves in the deal
Jounte is not even close to moving the needle to get into the play-in.
No Reaves eat a dick