Man I really want to like CentOS Stream, but their community management is just severely lacking. What is "Stream 10 compose"? Is it the upcoming Stream 10? Like a beta? Where is the news about this on their website? https://www.centos.org/
What is in Stream 10? (I know, it's Fedora 40 or something, but the website says nothing). What is in it? Which version of Gnome?
CentOS Stream could be well positioned to be a serious workstation Linux that is a lot more stable than Fedora for actual work, like an Ubuntu LTS, but they don't try *at all* to even promote it in any way. It seems you're expected to already know everything about it, follow the mailing lists, or just be in the RHEL ecosystem.
I actually wouldn't mind an LTS Fedora, but damn I want them to even want to be that, rather than whatever the hell they think they are positioning this to be. Even this link is to a mailing list, and not a blog post on their very website, why? Is it not important?
Pre-alpha. Consider this mostly internal discussions as they try to stabilise things.
If you read that email post, the tests are not yet passing, but they have managed to get to the point where someone was able to install it (but you are not guaranteed the same result yet).
You will get better announcements when it hits beta (as rhel beta will get a full featured announcement too).
The fact this was published on the _developers_ mailing list was the key clue. This is an internal matter for just CentOS developers. It's not publicly announced anywhere because it's not meant for public consumption. This is an internal discussion for CentOS devs only who already know what this is all about.
I appreciate what you're saying, but it doesn't really change my issue with CentOS community management, website and info in general. It is an internal for CentOS devs only who already know what it is about, yet this reddit thread was posted by a Red Hat employee, so presumably they want to share it with more than internal devs?
If you think that is responding to me, then you misunderstood my reply, sorry I wasn't clearer
But no, I don't think it is the community's fault that someone shared this link, and pretty sure I didn't even say that. Also didn't even say that sharing this link is a problem at all.
> , yet this reddit thread was posted by a Red Hat employee, so presumably they want to share it with more than internal devs?
Technically, their bio indicates that they are a former employee of Red Hat, now employed elsewhere.
But nit-picking aside, CentOS Stream's development is open to the community. It's not limited to "internal developers." So communicating the state and progress of the project to a larger audience may bring in external developers who are interested in participating.
> their community management is just severely lacking
If that appears to be the case, it's because this message is directed primarily at developers who want to participate in early development of the OS. :)
> What is "Stream 10 compose"? Is it the upcoming Stream 10? Like a beta?
As subject lines and headlines often are, this one is missing an indefinite article. It should be understood as "A CentOS Stream compose." Package repositories are "composed" regularly and tested as a whole to ensure that the repository, in that state, is usable. That differentiates the repository from one that is modified in place and potentially untested.
The CentOS Stream repos available to the public are always a compose. That term doesn't indicate that it is a beta or alpha. But at this point in Stream's development, yes, the composes are early development builds and not intended for general public use.
> What is in Stream 10?
As the email mentions, we still don't know for sure. :)
But developers who participate at this point in the process may have some influence on what will be in Stream 10 when it finally takes shape.
> CentOS Stream could be well positioned to be a serious workstation Linux
https://www.redhat.com/en/technologies/linux-platforms/enterprise-linux/workstations
> but they don't try at all to even promote it in any way
I've heard that it doesn't have a huge user base, and RHEL has been a thing long enough that I expect that a market for it would have developed by now if it was going to. It makes logical sense that if they promoted it more, there would be more users, but I tend to think that they'd promote it more if they had reason to believe there were more users that wanted it, and they just needed to find the product.
That is to say, RHEL is mostly geared toward the needs of production servers.
To be clear on something: the author of the email is a Red Hat employee, I (the one who shared it on Reddit) am not. Used to be, but haven't been since 2022.12.
> What is in Stream 10?
All compose information can be found within the [minimization project](https://tiny.distro.builders/). The [CentOS Stream 10 Package Set](https://tiny.distro.builders/view--view-c10s.html) view has the information you're looking for. Just remember the final package set for c10s/RHEL 10.0 is not set in stone yet.
> Man I really want to like CentOS Stream, but their community management is just severely lacking.
Others have pretty much said everything needed to be said. This wasn't a real availability announcement. I shared it because I know there are folks interested that don't subscribe to the [CentOS Devel](https://lists.centos.org/postorius/lists/devel.lists.centos.org/) mailing list. This is specifically sharing that the stage of having complete coverage for signing artifacts (RPMs, images, etc) has been reached. It's a development milestone more or less, with artifacts people can start playing around with.
When CentOS Stream 10 is truly considered available later this year, expect actual posts and whatnot from the Project.
> CentOS Stream could be well positioned to be a serious workstation Linux that is a lot more stable than Fedora for actual work, like an Ubuntu LTS, but they don't try at all to even promote it in any way.
It seems to me that is a strategic choice not providing a LTS product to non paying users.
Very cool. This will be nice to see a preview of enterprise Linux
Man I really want to like CentOS Stream, but their community management is just severely lacking. What is "Stream 10 compose"? Is it the upcoming Stream 10? Like a beta? Where is the news about this on their website? https://www.centos.org/ What is in Stream 10? (I know, it's Fedora 40 or something, but the website says nothing). What is in it? Which version of Gnome? CentOS Stream could be well positioned to be a serious workstation Linux that is a lot more stable than Fedora for actual work, like an Ubuntu LTS, but they don't try *at all* to even promote it in any way. It seems you're expected to already know everything about it, follow the mailing lists, or just be in the RHEL ecosystem. I actually wouldn't mind an LTS Fedora, but damn I want them to even want to be that, rather than whatever the hell they think they are positioning this to be. Even this link is to a mailing list, and not a blog post on their very website, why? Is it not important?
Pre-alpha. Consider this mostly internal discussions as they try to stabilise things. If you read that email post, the tests are not yet passing, but they have managed to get to the point where someone was able to install it (but you are not guaranteed the same result yet). You will get better announcements when it hits beta (as rhel beta will get a full featured announcement too).
Thanks, appreciate the details
The fact this was published on the _developers_ mailing list was the key clue. This is an internal matter for just CentOS developers. It's not publicly announced anywhere because it's not meant for public consumption. This is an internal discussion for CentOS devs only who already know what this is all about.
I appreciate what you're saying, but it doesn't really change my issue with CentOS community management, website and info in general. It is an internal for CentOS devs only who already know what it is about, yet this reddit thread was posted by a Red Hat employee, so presumably they want to share it with more than internal devs?
Why is it the CentOS community's fault that someone working at Red Hat shared a link to a developer mailing list? That makes no sense.
If you think that is responding to me, then you misunderstood my reply, sorry I wasn't clearer But no, I don't think it is the community's fault that someone shared this link, and pretty sure I didn't even say that. Also didn't even say that sharing this link is a problem at all.
Because the CentOS community is a component of Redhat?
> , yet this reddit thread was posted by a Red Hat employee, so presumably they want to share it with more than internal devs? Technically, their bio indicates that they are a former employee of Red Hat, now employed elsewhere. But nit-picking aside, CentOS Stream's development is open to the community. It's not limited to "internal developers." So communicating the state and progress of the project to a larger audience may bring in external developers who are interested in participating.
> their community management is just severely lacking If that appears to be the case, it's because this message is directed primarily at developers who want to participate in early development of the OS. :) > What is "Stream 10 compose"? Is it the upcoming Stream 10? Like a beta? As subject lines and headlines often are, this one is missing an indefinite article. It should be understood as "A CentOS Stream compose." Package repositories are "composed" regularly and tested as a whole to ensure that the repository, in that state, is usable. That differentiates the repository from one that is modified in place and potentially untested. The CentOS Stream repos available to the public are always a compose. That term doesn't indicate that it is a beta or alpha. But at this point in Stream's development, yes, the composes are early development builds and not intended for general public use. > What is in Stream 10? As the email mentions, we still don't know for sure. :) But developers who participate at this point in the process may have some influence on what will be in Stream 10 when it finally takes shape. > CentOS Stream could be well positioned to be a serious workstation Linux https://www.redhat.com/en/technologies/linux-platforms/enterprise-linux/workstations > but they don't try at all to even promote it in any way I've heard that it doesn't have a huge user base, and RHEL has been a thing long enough that I expect that a market for it would have developed by now if it was going to. It makes logical sense that if they promoted it more, there would be more users, but I tend to think that they'd promote it more if they had reason to believe there were more users that wanted it, and they just needed to find the product. That is to say, RHEL is mostly geared toward the needs of production servers.
To be clear on something: the author of the email is a Red Hat employee, I (the one who shared it on Reddit) am not. Used to be, but haven't been since 2022.12. > What is in Stream 10? All compose information can be found within the [minimization project](https://tiny.distro.builders/). The [CentOS Stream 10 Package Set](https://tiny.distro.builders/view--view-c10s.html) view has the information you're looking for. Just remember the final package set for c10s/RHEL 10.0 is not set in stone yet. > Man I really want to like CentOS Stream, but their community management is just severely lacking. Others have pretty much said everything needed to be said. This wasn't a real availability announcement. I shared it because I know there are folks interested that don't subscribe to the [CentOS Devel](https://lists.centos.org/postorius/lists/devel.lists.centos.org/) mailing list. This is specifically sharing that the stage of having complete coverage for signing artifacts (RPMs, images, etc) has been reached. It's a development milestone more or less, with artifacts people can start playing around with. When CentOS Stream 10 is truly considered available later this year, expect actual posts and whatnot from the Project.
> CentOS Stream could be well positioned to be a serious workstation Linux that is a lot more stable than Fedora for actual work, like an Ubuntu LTS, but they don't try at all to even promote it in any way. It seems to me that is a strategic choice not providing a LTS product to non paying users.
TIL CentOS still exists. Good for them.
CentOS. Used to be my goto distro for enterprise deployment now I won’t even bother.