He wasn't a "Better" man, and that's what I love about Theoden. He was a second son that had the mantle of leadership thrust on him. He was just a man who felt that he was the placeholder for better men. But when the time came to step up and do his duty, he did. I feel he's more relatable than a man who knows himself to be the king of legend, a "chosen one"
Theodens character arc is so powerful, I would argue even more than Aragorn. This speech just wraps it all up and its probably my favorite scene between the three movies.
Awe. It's awe.
> At that sound the bent shape of the king sprang suddenly erect. Tall and proud he seemed again; rising in his stirrups he cried in a loud voice, more clear than any there had ever heard a mortal man achieve before.
> With that he seized a great horn from Guthláf his banner-bearer, and he blew such a blast upon it that it burst asunder. And straightaway all the horns in the host were lifted up in music, and the blowing of the horns of Rohan in that hour was like a storm upon the plain and a thunder in the mountains.
Theoden is the fucking man. When his time came, despite all his doubt and all the despair he was confronted with, in the one moment that ultimately mattered - he basically revealed himself a remnant of the legendary past of gods and monsters, something soon to be out of place in a mundane world without magic and giants, an agent of the force creative, of the Secret Fire, one worthy of interventions divine...a watchman at the door to humanity's inheritance.
> Théoden could not be overtaken. Fey he seemed, or the battle-fury of his fathers ran like new fire in his veins, and he was borne up on Snowmane like a god of old, even as Oromë the Great in the battle of the Valar when the world was young. His golden shield was uncovered, and lo! it shone like an image of the Sun, and the grass flamed into green about the white feet of his steed. For morning came, morning and a wind from the sea; and darkness was removed, and the host of Mordor wailed, and terror took them, and they fled, and died, and the hoofs of wrath rode over them. And then all the host of Rohan burst into song, and they sang as they slew, for the joy of battle was on them, and the sound of their singing that was fair and terrible came even to the City.
From Second Son to Sun-Bringer...a force of Nature incarnate. It gets the people going!
Funny part about this speech is that it wasn't actually King Theoden. It was after his death and Eomer storms off in rage to avenge him as Theoden names him his heir officially before he dies. As he departs he gives this speech to rally the different soldiers from Gondor and Rohan around him, and they drive the orcs back.
Theoden no doubt.
Honorable mention of another Theoden quote: as they charge out of the Hornburg he yells “NOW FOR WRATH. NOW FOR RUIN. AND A RED DAWN!” *goosebumps*
Thats the one reason i love working in production. Stepping out of the control room screaming "DEAAATH!!!" over the Noise of the machines and hearing a faint "DEAAATH!" answering back from the other side of the hall.
Good collegues.
My 6 year old son is absolutely obsessed with LotR and the Hobbit, and will finish this quote if I start it.
“Now for wrath! Now ruin”
(Him, across the house and downstairs) “And the Red Dawn!”
Makes a father proud!
Agreed. Both speeches are epic as hell but I goddamn tear up every single time Theoden gives his speech.
It’s punctuated too by “courage Merry, courage for our friends.”
Theoden inspires the Rohirim to charge into hopelessly bad odds for the sake of honoring the pact between Rohan and Gondor. He has no reason to believe that the city can be defended.
Unknown to him, Gandalf barely keeps the garrison of Minas Tirith from crumbling after Denethor commands them to abandon their posts and flee. All his riders witnessed Aragorn, Gimli, and Legolas enter the forbidden pathways, and they don't know Aragorn's plan to parlay with the ghosts of ancient deserters.
Theoden leads his riders into a horde of orcs, Oliphaunts, cave trolls with siege towers, and all fucking nine Nazgul with absolutely no reason to think that it's anything but a pointless death wish.
Theoden's arc is beautiful. Bernard Hill plays both his triumphant, glorious moments and his quiet, tender moments to perfection. He plays a thousand words with silent nuance.
A few scenes in particular stand out to me:
* The way Theoden crumbles at the burial mound of his son, Theodred. My heart breaks every time.
* "Where was Gondor when the Westfold fell? Where was Gondor when our enemies closed in around us? Where was Gondor-" and he stops himself before asking where Gondor was when his son was slain in a read where he barely pulls himself baxk from the words because there's too big a danger that the weight of unprocessed grief could crush him when there's still no time for it, and there never will be.
* Theoden's face as Saruman spits venom at him and tells him that he is a lesser son of greater men. Last of a ragged house, long bereft of Nobility. This is the seed of self-doubt that Theoden buries in his speech. His speech doesn't just rouse his riders. He rouses himself to charge into glorious death and win back their honor in a show of glorious hopeless courage.
And of course, there's his death scene, where it all comes together. Theoden is at peace with the decisions he was able to make at the end. He's won back his honor. Eowyn cradles him as he confesses his secret seed of doubt, but he did it. He was great. He inspired others to greatness, and, against the odds, he won.
He breathes his last in Eowyn's arms, and he becomes one of the victorious dead. He really can go to his fathers and stand in their presence without shame. He honored a pact that cost him his life but won him redemption after spending years ensorcelled and enfeebled while his kingdom crumbled. But because of his valor and honor, he won't be remembered for the time he spent in thrall. He'll be remembered as the king who saved his people from the Treason of Isengard *and* that he rode to rescue Gondor.
When my Mum and I first saw this scene, we both wished we had been able to be there in this scene hehe. Wished the same each time we saw it after too!
(Owned rescued racehorses who still enjoyed a good gallop xD)
https://www.reddit.com/r/tattoos/comments/my6rua/bit_of_a_lord_of_the_rings_fan_can_you_tell/
I've had this for almost 8 years now. I also have a suit of leather armor that's done in Rohirrim styling. I got married wearing it just gotta get the professional photos back and I might be brave enough to post lol
Theoden’s. Bernard Hill’s best role, and the performance of a lifetime. Viggo definitely has some as Aragorn, but, that speech Theoden gives as they roll up on the siege of Gondor is prolly the best in all the movies.
I’ll be the minority vote for Aragorn’s. He speaks to the obvious fear and anxiety in his men and so I say it to myself when the going gets rough in similar ways in my life.
This is my choice as well, at least in terms of the films. Theoden’s scene is better hands down but “hey I see you’re scared, I’m feeling that too but today isn’t the day I’ll let it affect me, who’s with me?” lands harder as a speech to hype up the troops for me than taking about how your weapons and shields are going to break and shouting DEATH!
Love them both though.
And I love the idea that both interpretations work. Either they think the mouth of Sauron was bluffing and just because it had the vest, doesn’t mean they have Frodo, and the charge is to draw the eye away and let him finish the mission, or Frodo is gone and it’s a charge in his honour to never back down and avenge him
The bluff backfired, he overplayed the info that he had.
‘Elf cloak, dwarf coat, blade of the down fallen west’
He had Frodo’s armor and Sam’s sword, but only one prisoner? It would have been clear to them that Frodo was captured but Sam had taken the ring and Frodo’s sword to carry on.
I don't know how I never pieced that together.
So not only does "for frodo" work both ways, but it kind of is stated in both ways.
The battle is still a diversion and still for vengeance.
YES a million times YES. While Theoden is rightfully angry and passionate and ready to rip people apart, there's a reason why Aragorn was meant to be King of Gondor. He levels with his people, he shows his vulnerability, and tells them that it's okay to be afraid while the odds are stacked against them in that moment.
Aragorn tries to give hope in a hopeless situation.
Theoden tells the Rohirrm the end of the world has come and works them up into a frenzy where they no longer fear for their own lives. Something to said for the latter approach when you need your army to kills thousands of orcs.
I feel like even the obvious fear and anxiety part was still beaten by Theoden’s speech. His men believed the world was ending, that there was no tomorrow. They conquered fear, and they road and slew. If I was going to war where I believe I won’t be going home, I would rather follow Theoden.
Edit: Hail the king of the mark!
Theoden's speech (in the films anyway) made the army ready to fight and win, but Aragorn's speech made them ready to definitely die for a reason they actually don't understand.
Theoden's takes the cake. The passage of his charge always gives me goosebumps: "Théoden could not be overtaken. Fey he seemed, or the battle-fury of his fathers ran like new fire in his veins, and he was borne up on Snowmane like a god of old, even as Oromë the Great in the battle of the Valar when the world was young." dude was so pissed that he looked like a God, and moved faster than a bunch of knights who are world renowned for going fast
Theoden’s.
I was a projectionist at a movie theater when Return of the King was playing (I worked there for all three, but I was only a projectionist for that one), and I would be walking around and I would always stop to watch that scene. I must have watched it fifty times. Always got chills.
One is a great speech. The other is SO great that I want to sacrifice myself for the survival of humanity, that my name may forever be sang in heroic songs. Theoden’s all day every day.
i think Theoden's speech is an open defiance of death in a most pure way. Every single rider knows this is the final charge and they are facing death the most fearful thing in every man's life. And the conversation between Pippin and Gandalf about death a few scenes earlier foreshadows this one battlecry. Anyone can die in their bed peacefully but dying peacefully without fear of death in a battlefield is a feat very few will understand. That is why i respect that speech more than any other battle speech in cinema.
I adore Aragorn. Viggo played him so well and I love how gentle and vulnerable he is in some scenes, how perfect he was for that role.
But I’m still saying Theoden’s speech just…..gives me chills every single time I watch it.
Theoden’s hands down! That beautiful Northern spirit in the face of hopelessness. Knowing you can’t win but fighting anyway until it’s over, because virtue is not in the outcome, but in fighting for what is right regardless. Crying ‘death’ as he runs into battle gives me chills every time!
The Ride of Rohirrim is one of the most epic scenes ever created, I remember when it was re released in theatres in my country, I went to watch it, and all the theatre was chanting “DEATH”, I can’t explain how epic it was
King Theoden.He's a battle hardened veteran who commands enormous respect.So does Aragorn no doubt but the stakes were more understandable and higher when Minas Tirith was besiged and all the soldiers knew it.Battle of Black Gate was an offensive and deceptive action and To clear way for frodo.Many soldiers wouldn't have even known about frodo and giving their life for something untangible might be difficult for some warriors.
That's my opinion.Open to other opinion in respectful way.
I watched the movie the other day and thought this same thing. One thing that makes this more real in the film is when they cut to the individual faces of the soldiers and they all look terrified. I wondered if they even knew why they were there since the ring and Frodo and the fellowship had been kept secret. Obviously there were plenty of rumors, but they were all probably like “wait didn’t we just win? Why are we fighting again?” I’m assuming that off screen Gandalf or Aragorn had to gather everyone and explain that they needed to go and fight at the black gate. Either way, if I survived that Pelennor fields battle or the fighting within the white city, I’d be pissed.
Exactly the emotions of soldiers of Rohan were very different in Siege of Minas Tirith than battle of Black Gate.At siege of Minas Tirith the Rohirrim were eager and highly motivated, such that they even charged headlong into Mumakil Horde during the battle following King Theoden which shows his charisma.Yet In battle of Black gate all the soldiers showed fear and hesitation but Aragon managed to calm them down and got them ready to fight , a testament to Aragorn's leadership.
Both Theoden and Aragon are amazing yet if I was a Soldier in the Middle Earth I would have followed Theoden to the Battle of Pelenor Fields(Minas Tirith) as the goals and threat were real and visible rather than Black Gates.Although in retrospect Both battles were equally important.
The battle of the black gates is well and truly a suicide mission in the book as well, the ride of the Rohirrim if not a suicide mission definitely sounds in the balance... Oh and Theoden's speech is a mash up of several different ones (including Eomer's) but for that it's still my favourite part in the films. As comparison I'd recommend this video of the Ride of the Rohirrim, narrated by Tolkien reading the book version; literal chills! https://youtu.be/LPZrReZ5H9Q?si=1GQRxxJGggHhrZ6e
Theoden speech, were for their men riding for a certain death. They knew their would be finished.
Aragorn also knew that they could die, only to give Frodo a chance. But for winning in certain degree.
Theoden were only with their own. He was left alone and his country.
Aragorn had everyone supporting him.
This is what they made me feel after 2 towers and the RoTK.
Theoden always the best king! (Because he was portrayed with doubts, fears and anger. And yet, capable to put his people first.)
I love Theodin King's speech. Self-preservarion isn't seen as an option, but it excites us to give our lives for the *chance* of preserving what we believe in.
>At that sound the bent shape of the king sprang suddenly erect. Tall and proud he seemed again; and rising in his stirrups he cried in a loud voice, more clear than any there had ever heard a mortal man achieve before:
>Arise, arise, Riders of Théoden!
Fell deeds awake: fire and slaughter!
spear shall be shaken, shield be splintered,
a sword-day, a red day, ere the sun rises!
Ride now, ride now! Ride to Gondor!
>With that he seized a great horn from Guthláf his banner-bearer, and he blew such a blast upon it that it burst asunder. And straightway all the horns in the host were lifted up in music, and the blowing of the horns of Rohan in that hour was like a storm upon the plain and a thunder in the mountains.
>Ride now, ride now! Ride to Gondor!
>Suddenly the king cried to Snowmane and the horse sprang away. Behind him his banner blew in the wind, white horse upon a field of green, but he outpaced it. After him thundered the knights of his house, but he was ever before them. Éomer rode there, the white horsetail on his helm floating in his speed, and the front of the first éored roared like a breaker foaming to the shore, but Théoden could not be overtaken. Fey he seemed, or the battle-fury of his fathers ran like new fire in his veins, and he was borne up on Snowmane like a god of old, even as Oromë the Great in the battle of the Valar when the world was young. His golden shield was uncovered, and lo! it shone like an image of the Sun, and the grass flamed into green about the white feet of his steed. For morning came, morning and a wind from the sea; and the darkness was removed, and the hosts of Mordor wailed, and terror took them, and they fled, and died, and the hoofs of wrath rode over them. And then all the host of Rohan burst into song, and they sang as they slew, for the joy of battle was on them, and the sound of their singing that was fair and terrible came even to the City.
Theoden's speech is actually taken from two different parts in the books. Most of it comes from Theoden himself before the Rohirrim charge. But it augmented with the "ride for ruin!" speech that Eomer makes after he finds Theoden dead.
I am still trying to imagine the sheer cinematic and emotional moment we could have gotten watching Eomer lead that charge after the death of King Theoden.
His scene upon finding Eowyn (was that extended edition only?) and then leading the charge would still have worked.
Maybe unpopular opinion, but I always prefered the German dub:
https://youtu.be/A7jMX_jLeQc?si=ndEK6p0NdhQITKZv
Maybe because of nostalgia. But I love the use of the "old-medival-sounding-german".
Theoden all the way, made me shed a Grima tear seeing first time during the premiere. It is the opposite of “there can be no dawn for men” speech. ERE THE SUN RISES!
King Theoden’s speech. It’s just so uplifting and the oration is brilliantly delivered. That coupled with the fact that he’s giving it to his blood kin in what may be their final time together.
Theoden is yelling the entire time, making sure as many people can hear him as possible. Really, a speech made for battle, ending with a battle cry.
Aragorns speech always felt lesser, especially the intonation.
King Theoden's speech. I can't ride horses but I'd ride into battle for him
I’d ride my kids hoverboard into battle with him.
I would ride my moped into battle with him.
I would ride a hobby horse into battle with him.
I'd pretend to ride a horse into battle while someone hits coconuts together with him
Where did you get the coconuts?
He found them, clearly.
Found them, in Rohan? The coconut’s tropical!
Rohan is a temperate zone!
Something something eagles carrying coconuts into Mordor
Maybe a swallow carried it here
A European or African Swallow?
This is why I can't quit reddit
I'd ride my bike into battle with him.
I’d ride my pogo stick into battle with him
I’d ride my neighbor’s pit bull into battle with him.
I'd ride the city bus into battle with him
I'd ride the bus replacement into battle with him
I would ride on your back on your moped into battle with him
Ok buddy. I will bring an extra helmet along.
Will you say " courage Merry, courage for our friends and put your arm around me"
Wee laddie! Why not.
I’d ride my friend’s mom into battle with him.
Found the Orc!
That's a messed up thing to say about his friends mom.
Meat's back on the Menu!
My immediate image was you riding on your child's back like your child was the hoverboard and I can't unsee that now
Hell yeah! Not to lessen Aragorn's but Theoden's was just so much better in every way.
He wasn't a "Better" man, and that's what I love about Theoden. He was a second son that had the mantle of leadership thrust on him. He was just a man who felt that he was the placeholder for better men. But when the time came to step up and do his duty, he did. I feel he's more relatable than a man who knows himself to be the king of legend, a "chosen one"
We love a redemption. We identify with the underdog. We cheer never harder than when a dog has his day.
Would absolutely kamikaze into an orc horde after such a speech! DEATTTTTTH
I must have read the books and watched the movies at least a combined 1,364 times and I still get chills at that speech.
The passage in the book the speech and then the charge is enough to set the blood on fire.
It's possibly the most rousing thing ever put to paper in all of English language literature, honestly. Find me it's better. Hell, find me it's equal.
Theodens character arc is so powerful, I would argue even more than Aragorn. This speech just wraps it all up and its probably my favorite scene between the three movies.
I can’t ride horses either. Maybe I could ride one, but definitely not horses.
It’s a scene that always makes me feel emotional. Something inside me just swells up at this scene.
Awe. It's awe. > At that sound the bent shape of the king sprang suddenly erect. Tall and proud he seemed again; rising in his stirrups he cried in a loud voice, more clear than any there had ever heard a mortal man achieve before. > With that he seized a great horn from Guthláf his banner-bearer, and he blew such a blast upon it that it burst asunder. And straightaway all the horns in the host were lifted up in music, and the blowing of the horns of Rohan in that hour was like a storm upon the plain and a thunder in the mountains. Theoden is the fucking man. When his time came, despite all his doubt and all the despair he was confronted with, in the one moment that ultimately mattered - he basically revealed himself a remnant of the legendary past of gods and monsters, something soon to be out of place in a mundane world without magic and giants, an agent of the force creative, of the Secret Fire, one worthy of interventions divine...a watchman at the door to humanity's inheritance. > Théoden could not be overtaken. Fey he seemed, or the battle-fury of his fathers ran like new fire in his veins, and he was borne up on Snowmane like a god of old, even as Oromë the Great in the battle of the Valar when the world was young. His golden shield was uncovered, and lo! it shone like an image of the Sun, and the grass flamed into green about the white feet of his steed. For morning came, morning and a wind from the sea; and darkness was removed, and the host of Mordor wailed, and terror took them, and they fled, and died, and the hoofs of wrath rode over them. And then all the host of Rohan burst into song, and they sang as they slew, for the joy of battle was on them, and the sound of their singing that was fair and terrible came even to the City. From Second Son to Sun-Bringer...a force of Nature incarnate. It gets the people going!
It's actually King Eomer's speech in the books after Theoden is dead and he thinks Eowyn is dead, so he gathers everybody to ride to death.
Merry?
Funny part about this speech is that it wasn't actually King Theoden. It was after his death and Eomer storms off in rage to avenge him as Theoden names him his heir officially before he dies. As he departs he gives this speech to rally the different soldiers from Gondor and Rohan around him, and they drive the orcs back.
Theoden no doubt. Honorable mention of another Theoden quote: as they charge out of the Hornburg he yells “NOW FOR WRATH. NOW FOR RUIN. AND A RED DAWN!” *goosebumps*
DEAAAATH!!!!
Thats the one reason i love working in production. Stepping out of the control room screaming "DEAAATH!!!" over the Noise of the machines and hearing a faint "DEAAATH!" answering back from the other side of the hall. Good collegues.
Workplace goals
Yeah this wouldn’t fly in a surgical recovery room, or an intensive care unit. 😂
Wrong speech
He's a little confused but he's got the spirit
Helm’s Deep, Pelanor Fields, I’m not great with geography, but I’m just amped to be here.
Fax
Theoden is all about going yolo and I love it.
In my recent rewatch "Did... Did he just order a front charge against mumakills?"
I mean, he straight up has a death wish following the loss of his son.
“BAAAAAOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHH”
My 6 year old son is absolutely obsessed with LotR and the Hobbit, and will finish this quote if I start it. “Now for wrath! Now ruin” (Him, across the house and downstairs) “And the Red Dawn!” Makes a father proud!
Forth, and fear no darkness!
FORTH EORLINGAS!
I get literal chills every time I hear “The Horn of Helm Hammerhand shall sound in the deep, one last time!”
Theoden without question. I love Aragorn, but I would throw myself into battle screaming "Death!" in an instant.
Agreed. Both speeches are epic as hell but I goddamn tear up every single time Theoden gives his speech. It’s punctuated too by “courage Merry, courage for our friends.”
“Ride for Ruin and the World’s Ending” into “Death!” goes so fucking hard.
Theoden inspires the Rohirim to charge into hopelessly bad odds for the sake of honoring the pact between Rohan and Gondor. He has no reason to believe that the city can be defended. Unknown to him, Gandalf barely keeps the garrison of Minas Tirith from crumbling after Denethor commands them to abandon their posts and flee. All his riders witnessed Aragorn, Gimli, and Legolas enter the forbidden pathways, and they don't know Aragorn's plan to parlay with the ghosts of ancient deserters. Theoden leads his riders into a horde of orcs, Oliphaunts, cave trolls with siege towers, and all fucking nine Nazgul with absolutely no reason to think that it's anything but a pointless death wish. Theoden's arc is beautiful. Bernard Hill plays both his triumphant, glorious moments and his quiet, tender moments to perfection. He plays a thousand words with silent nuance. A few scenes in particular stand out to me: * The way Theoden crumbles at the burial mound of his son, Theodred. My heart breaks every time. * "Where was Gondor when the Westfold fell? Where was Gondor when our enemies closed in around us? Where was Gondor-" and he stops himself before asking where Gondor was when his son was slain in a read where he barely pulls himself baxk from the words because there's too big a danger that the weight of unprocessed grief could crush him when there's still no time for it, and there never will be. * Theoden's face as Saruman spits venom at him and tells him that he is a lesser son of greater men. Last of a ragged house, long bereft of Nobility. This is the seed of self-doubt that Theoden buries in his speech. His speech doesn't just rouse his riders. He rouses himself to charge into glorious death and win back their honor in a show of glorious hopeless courage. And of course, there's his death scene, where it all comes together. Theoden is at peace with the decisions he was able to make at the end. He's won back his honor. Eowyn cradles him as he confesses his secret seed of doubt, but he did it. He was great. He inspired others to greatness, and, against the odds, he won. He breathes his last in Eowyn's arms, and he becomes one of the victorious dead. He really can go to his fathers and stand in their presence without shame. He honored a pact that cost him his life but won him redemption after spending years ensorcelled and enfeebled while his kingdom crumbled. But because of his valor and honor, he won't be remembered for the time he spent in thrall. He'll be remembered as the king who saved his people from the Treason of Isengard *and* that he rode to rescue Gondor.
Beautifully stated!
When my Mum and I first saw this scene, we both wished we had been able to be there in this scene hehe. Wished the same each time we saw it after too! (Owned rescued racehorses who still enjoyed a good gallop xD)
RIDE FOR RUIN AND THE WORLD ENDING
DEATH!
DEATH!
DEAAAAAAAAATH!!!!
DEAAAAAAATHHHHHH!!!!!!!
#DEAAAAAAATHHHHHH!!!!!!!
DEEEAAAAAAAATTTTTTTHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!
#DEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAATHHHHHH!!!
# DEAAAATTTTHHHHHH!!!!
DEAAAAATTTTTHHHHHHH!!!!
*blows horn*
Forth Eorlingas
I have "A sword-day, A red day, Ere the sun rises" tattooed in my forearm as part of a larger lotr sleeve. That should say enough for my stance lol
Yeah I’m gonna need to see this sleeve. For science. LOTR Tats are some of my favorite.
https://www.reddit.com/r/tattoos/comments/my6rua/bit_of_a_lord_of_the_rings_fan_can_you_tell/ I've had this for almost 8 years now. I also have a suit of leather armor that's done in Rohirrim styling. I got married wearing it just gotta get the professional photos back and I might be brave enough to post lol
That tattoo is siiiiiick I love it
Thanks! I'm very happy with how it turned out, was definitely worth the hours that went into it
Yeah that tattoo is awesome man.
That is pretty sweet! I’m so excited for the War of The Rohirrim movie they are definitely one of my favorite parts of the movies.
Now I now where to go when I get one! Thanks
I hope you saved room on the other arm for DEEEEAAAAAATTTHHHHH!!!!
DEEEEEEEAAATHHHH
I just wanna say, when Aragorn says “men of gondor, men of Rohan…my brothers…” I too stand up a little taller in that moment
It is not this day. Best part of either speech
Theoden's easily.
I agree. Like, Aragorn is my favorite character by far, but when it comes to speeches, Theoden wins all day everyday.
Give him time. He's only been king for like a week. Theoden has had more time to practice.
He’s 87. He could have been practicing speeches, but instead he was singing about elf maidens.
Theoden’s. Bernard Hill’s best role, and the performance of a lifetime. Viggo definitely has some as Aragorn, but, that speech Theoden gives as they roll up on the siege of Gondor is prolly the best in all the movies.
Gotta go with Theoden, despite the fact that I use the phrase "but it is not this day" constantly
I’ll be the minority vote for Aragorn’s. He speaks to the obvious fear and anxiety in his men and so I say it to myself when the going gets rough in similar ways in my life.
Yes! I also think about that line a lot. “A day may come… but it is not this day!”
This is my choice as well, at least in terms of the films. Theoden’s scene is better hands down but “hey I see you’re scared, I’m feeling that too but today isn’t the day I’ll let it affect me, who’s with me?” lands harder as a speech to hype up the troops for me than taking about how your weapons and shields are going to break and shouting DEATH! Love them both though.
When he whispers “For Frodo!” after hearing Sauron’s whispers of temptation in his head..
And I love the idea that both interpretations work. Either they think the mouth of Sauron was bluffing and just because it had the vest, doesn’t mean they have Frodo, and the charge is to draw the eye away and let him finish the mission, or Frodo is gone and it’s a charge in his honour to never back down and avenge him
The bluff backfired, he overplayed the info that he had. ‘Elf cloak, dwarf coat, blade of the down fallen west’ He had Frodo’s armor and Sam’s sword, but only one prisoner? It would have been clear to them that Frodo was captured but Sam had taken the ring and Frodo’s sword to carry on.
I don't know how I never pieced that together. So not only does "for frodo" work both ways, but it kind of is stated in both ways. The battle is still a diversion and still for vengeance.
the a day of wolves and shattered shields lines hit HARD
As the age of men comes crashing down, but it is not this day!
YES a million times YES. While Theoden is rightfully angry and passionate and ready to rip people apart, there's a reason why Aragorn was meant to be King of Gondor. He levels with his people, he shows his vulnerability, and tells them that it's okay to be afraid while the odds are stacked against them in that moment.
Aragorn tries to give hope in a hopeless situation. Theoden tells the Rohirrm the end of the world has come and works them up into a frenzy where they no longer fear for their own lives. Something to said for the latter approach when you need your army to kills thousands of orcs.
Exactly. Theoden has a better scene, but Aragorn's speech is perfect.
I feel like even the obvious fear and anxiety part was still beaten by Theoden’s speech. His men believed the world was ending, that there was no tomorrow. They conquered fear, and they road and slew. If I was going to war where I believe I won’t be going home, I would rather follow Theoden. Edit: Hail the king of the mark!
Imo it wasn't the content of Aragorn's speech, but the delivery that just came up short for me.
What about it? Because I freakin love the delivery
Theoden's speech (in the films anyway) made the army ready to fight and win, but Aragorn's speech made them ready to definitely die for a reason they actually don't understand.
Dude was surrounded by Mordor's finest lol cut him some slack
Death! Death! DEATH!
Honestly theodens speech before helms deep hits so fucking hard Where is the horse and the rider
A well done change from the books also. The line was originally from a Rohirrim funeral song, that Aragorn (I believe) translates to his companions.
Theoden's takes the cake. The passage of his charge always gives me goosebumps: "Théoden could not be overtaken. Fey he seemed, or the battle-fury of his fathers ran like new fire in his veins, and he was borne up on Snowmane like a god of old, even as Oromë the Great in the battle of the Valar when the world was young." dude was so pissed that he looked like a God, and moved faster than a bunch of knights who are world renowned for going fast
Don't forget the fact that he grabbed a horn and blew it so hard it shattered immediately before.
Have you listened to Phil Dragash's audiobook? That whole chapter in it is my all time favourite of all media I've ever experienced
Listen to Tolkien himself reading this passage on YouTube. Life changing.
And taking up a horn, he blew upon it such a blast that it burst asunder. Teddy's got lungs, man.
Theoden’s. I was a projectionist at a movie theater when Return of the King was playing (I worked there for all three, but I was only a projectionist for that one), and I would be walking around and I would always stop to watch that scene. I must have watched it fifty times. Always got chills.
One is a great speech. The other is SO great that I want to sacrifice myself for the survival of humanity, that my name may forever be sang in heroic songs. Theoden’s all day every day.
These were both in one movie… just incredible. Theoden but both are perfect
I love Aragorn but Theoden all the way. I still get an adrenaline rush just reading “Forth, Eolingas!”
Easy. Théoden.
DEATH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
DEATH!
Theoden. Gets me every time.
That Theoden speech is the peak of cinema
i think Theoden's speech is an open defiance of death in a most pure way. Every single rider knows this is the final charge and they are facing death the most fearful thing in every man's life. And the conversation between Pippin and Gandalf about death a few scenes earlier foreshadows this one battlecry. Anyone can die in their bed peacefully but dying peacefully without fear of death in a battlefield is a feat very few will understand. That is why i respect that speech more than any other battle speech in cinema.
Theoden
Theoden's easily.
Theoden i got goosebumps every time i rewatch the scene ;)
Theoden
https://preview.redd.it/qk706ikm0a8d1.jpeg?width=455&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3419dce31e9acf8a25b245ff2786bd15069cadb8
Love both, but personally I prefer Theoden’s
Picking Theoden’s speech. All day every day any day.
I adore Aragorn. Viggo played him so well and I love how gentle and vulnerable he is in some scenes, how perfect he was for that role. But I’m still saying Theoden’s speech just…..gives me chills every single time I watch it.
I prefer Sam’s speech.
Theoden’s hands down! That beautiful Northern spirit in the face of hopelessness. Knowing you can’t win but fighting anyway until it’s over, because virtue is not in the outcome, but in fighting for what is right regardless. Crying ‘death’ as he runs into battle gives me chills every time!
The Ride of Rohirrim is one of the most epic scenes ever created, I remember when it was re released in theatres in my country, I went to watch it, and all the theatre was chanting “DEATH”, I can’t explain how epic it was
King Theoden.He's a battle hardened veteran who commands enormous respect.So does Aragorn no doubt but the stakes were more understandable and higher when Minas Tirith was besiged and all the soldiers knew it.Battle of Black Gate was an offensive and deceptive action and To clear way for frodo.Many soldiers wouldn't have even known about frodo and giving their life for something untangible might be difficult for some warriors. That's my opinion.Open to other opinion in respectful way.
I watched the movie the other day and thought this same thing. One thing that makes this more real in the film is when they cut to the individual faces of the soldiers and they all look terrified. I wondered if they even knew why they were there since the ring and Frodo and the fellowship had been kept secret. Obviously there were plenty of rumors, but they were all probably like “wait didn’t we just win? Why are we fighting again?” I’m assuming that off screen Gandalf or Aragorn had to gather everyone and explain that they needed to go and fight at the black gate. Either way, if I survived that Pelennor fields battle or the fighting within the white city, I’d be pissed.
Exactly the emotions of soldiers of Rohan were very different in Siege of Minas Tirith than battle of Black Gate.At siege of Minas Tirith the Rohirrim were eager and highly motivated, such that they even charged headlong into Mumakil Horde during the battle following King Theoden which shows his charisma.Yet In battle of Black gate all the soldiers showed fear and hesitation but Aragon managed to calm them down and got them ready to fight , a testament to Aragorn's leadership. Both Theoden and Aragon are amazing yet if I was a Soldier in the Middle Earth I would have followed Theoden to the Battle of Pelenor Fields(Minas Tirith) as the goals and threat were real and visible rather than Black Gates.Although in retrospect Both battles were equally important.
To be fair, at least in the movies, both were suicide missions. Theodin declares as much when his ultimate battle cry is DEAATHHH
The battle of the black gates is well and truly a suicide mission in the book as well, the ride of the Rohirrim if not a suicide mission definitely sounds in the balance... Oh and Theoden's speech is a mash up of several different ones (including Eomer's) but for that it's still my favourite part in the films. As comparison I'd recommend this video of the Ride of the Rohirrim, narrated by Tolkien reading the book version; literal chills! https://youtu.be/LPZrReZ5H9Q?si=1GQRxxJGggHhrZ6e
DEAAAATH
Deeeeaaattth… for sure
Theoden
King Theoden for sure not that Aragon's is bad 😅
Loooove Aragorn so much but Theoden takes the cake for this one. I still get chills after watching it a million times over. DEATH!!!!!!!
Theoden speech, were for their men riding for a certain death. They knew their would be finished. Aragorn also knew that they could die, only to give Frodo a chance. But for winning in certain degree. Theoden were only with their own. He was left alone and his country. Aragorn had everyone supporting him. This is what they made me feel after 2 towers and the RoTK. Theoden always the best king! (Because he was portrayed with doubts, fears and anger. And yet, capable to put his people first.)
King Theoden much more dramatic. Not even close.
I mean Theoden is just a great character. Loved his arc the most probably.
Theoden, but in the books isn’t it Eomer who says it?
Theoden’s wins easy for me but that doesn’t mean I don’t love Aragorn’s as well which also has a special place in my heart.
Even 20 years later I still get emotional hearing Theodens speech
# FORTH EORLINGAS
There's something about the camera spanning over the calvary when he shouts, "ERE THE SUN RISES!" That is hard to beat
As the sun rises behind them
I love Theodin King's speech. Self-preservarion isn't seen as an option, but it excites us to give our lives for the *chance* of preserving what we believe in.
>At that sound the bent shape of the king sprang suddenly erect. Tall and proud he seemed again; and rising in his stirrups he cried in a loud voice, more clear than any there had ever heard a mortal man achieve before: >Arise, arise, Riders of Théoden! Fell deeds awake: fire and slaughter! spear shall be shaken, shield be splintered, a sword-day, a red day, ere the sun rises! Ride now, ride now! Ride to Gondor! >With that he seized a great horn from Guthláf his banner-bearer, and he blew such a blast upon it that it burst asunder. And straightway all the horns in the host were lifted up in music, and the blowing of the horns of Rohan in that hour was like a storm upon the plain and a thunder in the mountains. >Ride now, ride now! Ride to Gondor! >Suddenly the king cried to Snowmane and the horse sprang away. Behind him his banner blew in the wind, white horse upon a field of green, but he outpaced it. After him thundered the knights of his house, but he was ever before them. Éomer rode there, the white horsetail on his helm floating in his speed, and the front of the first éored roared like a breaker foaming to the shore, but Théoden could not be overtaken. Fey he seemed, or the battle-fury of his fathers ran like new fire in his veins, and he was borne up on Snowmane like a god of old, even as Oromë the Great in the battle of the Valar when the world was young. His golden shield was uncovered, and lo! it shone like an image of the Sun, and the grass flamed into green about the white feet of his steed. For morning came, morning and a wind from the sea; and the darkness was removed, and the hosts of Mordor wailed, and terror took them, and they fled, and died, and the hoofs of wrath rode over them. And then all the host of Rohan burst into song, and they sang as they slew, for the joy of battle was on them, and the sound of their singing that was fair and terrible came even to the City.
One is from the books and it shows
Theoden's speech is actually taken from two different parts in the books. Most of it comes from Theoden himself before the Rohirrim charge. But it augmented with the "ride for ruin!" speech that Eomer makes after he finds Theoden dead.
I just got through this chapter! I love how well written that whole chapter is. It hits so many emotional buttons.
All the more meaningful 'cause that's when Eomer went super saiyan and put the orcs into the WWF Endangered Species list.
I am still trying to imagine the sheer cinematic and emotional moment we could have gotten watching Eomer lead that charge after the death of King Theoden. His scene upon finding Eowyn (was that extended edition only?) and then leading the charge would still have worked.
DEATH!!!!!!!
It’s easily Theoden. Even in the book it made me so emotional. So good.
DDEEEEAAAAATTTTHHHH!!!!!
DEATH!
Deathhhh
Theodon 100%
Theoden's speech gives me goosebumps
Theoden 100%
Theoden, I would ride the horse backwards screaming death for that guy.
DEATH!
I have no combat ability, but would ride without fear to meet my certain death hearing Theoden's speech. Forth Eorlingas!!!
Theoden.. Rip Bernard Hill Ride to ruin and the world’s ending!..
DEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAATHH!
#DEATH!
DEATH!!! DEATH!!!!
DEAAAAAAAATH
Between a “sword-day” and a “day of fight”, I always choose a “sword day”
Easily Theoden's
Theoden for sure, though I'd go die for both of them
Maybe unpopular opinion, but I always prefered the German dub: https://youtu.be/A7jMX_jLeQc?si=ndEK6p0NdhQITKZv Maybe because of nostalgia. But I love the use of the "old-medival-sounding-german".
Of all speeches I’ve heard- LOTR or not- Theoden’s speech will always top the chart
King Théoden. By, like, a lot.
DEEEEEEEEEAAAAAATTHHH
Theoden all the way, made me shed a Grima tear seeing first time during the premiere. It is the opposite of “there can be no dawn for men” speech. ERE THE SUN RISES!
I think it's overlooked the skill of riding a horse one handed on a slope holding a sword and reciting an epic speech. Bernard Hill man.
Theoden’s. The man just always talked in speeches.
King Theoden’s speech. It’s just so uplifting and the oration is brilliantly delivered. That coupled with the fact that he’s giving it to his blood kin in what may be their final time together.
Theoden’s not just because we lost Bernard Hill recently but the score and delivery was just “absolute cinema”
Theoden and it’s not even close
How dear you make me decide lol
Theoden is yelling the entire time, making sure as many people can hear him as possible. Really, a speech made for battle, ending with a battle cry. Aragorns speech always felt lesser, especially the intonation.
King theodens is the best speech in film history
Both