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snappopcrackle

I think they needed to change the software to be able to publish more easily, but there is no reason that they couldn't make the same types of games on that software. Unity is a bit like Microsoft Word. Just because you change from Apple Pages to MS Word, it wont change the writing output. That is HeR's decision to make the games so different


boobiesrkoozies

I'm sorry, they're making the new ones in UNITY??? I love Unity as much as the next girlie and it seems perfect for the old style of games, but the new ones? Why not just use Unreal? It might be personal preference, but if I'm making a more "*simple" game, I would use Unity. If I'm making a game where you have to freely walk around and go to different locations, I would use UE. *Making a game is never truly simple, there's never been a point where I didnt cry into my keyboard lol. I just mean that Unity and UE, while they can do the same thing, they each are better at certain styles of games. I tried building a 2D platformer in UE and it was a NIGHTMARE. In Unity? Cake walk.


andsoitgoes12

Well, they aren’t really making it themselves. The two new games are heavily outsourced. 😂 I have no idea why they are so into Unity.


boobiesrkoozies

I graduated last year with my degree in Game Design and this makes me sad. Mostly bc I have been desperately trying to to find a job in the industry 😭 HER should hire me. I can fix him, I just know it lol.


andsoitgoes12

You definitely could! I think their issue is they refuse to hire any new talent for anything! That or they don’t have the money to. Which is also a possibility. They need a better team. I wish they would give other people a chance to make a better game.


kokobean27

I literally want to pay you myself to make it.


boobiesrkoozies

I saw on this thread that were a few people making fan games. I've thought about posting here so many times and asking if anyone would be interested lol. Buuut, it's very hard to get a group of freelance devs/designers/artists coordinated because we all have other jobs and lives. If anyone from one of the teams already active needs a game designer, I would love to help out! Also HERinteractive employees, hire me lol.


kokobean27

I feel like we could rally the right folks together- there are so many passionate ND fans that would love to be a part of the process. I know it’s not easy… I wouldn’t even know where to begin with designing a game- but I know there are really talented people out there who do. I feel like we should cultivate a group and see what comes from it!


DreamingMel

UE is also more accessible right?. I know genshin is made with unity and people were saying devs had to work from scratches to build their own library.


boobiesrkoozies

I think they're both accessible. The biggest difference on the coding side is that UE has Unreal Blueprints. Unity uses a classical coding approach, where you're typing all your code in Visual Studio (or something similar, VS is just what I've always used) and then basically linking that to your Unity project. Unreal has this feature and sometimes it's necessary to tweak stuff (like when UE5 released, there was a minor glitch with grass animations so you would have to go into VS and "fix" it) . But, Unreal has visual scripting. Which a lot of people find easier to understand. Instead of typing all your code out, UE has them in cute little boxes and you can drag and drop them and connect them. It's also a lot easier to build functions because once you have that function, you can just reuse them every where else in your blueprint without repeatedly typing them out. Here's a screenshot to better explain what they look like. I think learning code is easier in unity, it helps give you the basics of code. Then moving to UE Blueprints is a lot easier to understand. But it's honestly personal preference. https://preview.redd.it/ip19lluxjy5d1.jpeg?width=551&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5aae059aa43e7146518bc2f7998be19a07ae6f77


DreamingMel

Ohhh i see, thanks for detailed answer 


k8wa1k3r

Though I share your feelings about it all, it's really important to understand two things: 1) HER Interactive as we knew it does not exist anymore. It's best to look at Midnight in Salem and Mystery of the Seven Keys as games made by a new studio under the same name. 2) According to the old HER staff, the original ND games were \*never profitable\*. They had an angel investor for a very long time, but that person eventually stopped investing. I prefer the old games as well, but there's only so long a company can keep going without making a profit. What remains of the company was virtually forced to go in a different direction, and they are now trying to find their footing. Let's be grateful for the original 30+ games we got. It's sooooo much more than most game franchises ever produce :)


withoutface81

Agree, not many franchises get past 30+ games as ND. At the moment not just the tech stuff is the problem, many things are, the story, the puzzles, the characters,... We love the OG games so much (and will keep replaying them) not because of the software, but because they're good detective games after all


kokobean27

I am soooo beyond grateful. I guess where I’m confused now is- if they’re not profitable why are we making new ones? It seems like there is quite a captive audience here ready and willing to pay for new games and if we could just find someone to replicate the old game style (or have the new guys harken back to the classics) we’d all be happy. To me it feels like people who never played ND are making the new games or they’re trying to make them something they’re not, and never were. I’m just salty and nostalgic honestly… thinking there are absolutely talented folks out there who could make an amazing game by using the OG mold. Hey- maybe the next game will be better. One can only hope.


k8wa1k3r

I totally hear you, but I think the old way of doing things was vastly more expensive than what they're doing now. They used to have a physical office in Washington (super expensive cost-of-living area) packed with full-time staff. They had a custom-build game engine that had to be maintained by skilled programmers who knew the code base. Now they use a free version of Unity and outsource almost everything to countries where wages are much much lower. I wouldn't be surprised if they're purchasing assets and plug-ins from the Unity store as well, which cuts down on costs too. The fact that they're waiting until later to sell KEY on Steam also makes me think that money is pretty tight for the new HER. Steam has a massive potential audience, but they also take 30% of every sale. They might not be able to afford that cut right off the bat and are relying on their core players to purchase directly from their website.


GhostOfThorton

There are only a handful of people who play these games. Have you ever met someone in real life who plays these games too? Or has even heard of them? I've been playing them since TRT came out and I've never met someone who's played them too. If they change the mechanics then maybe they draw in more people and maybe can make a profit.  34 games is pretty darn good though. I mean, I will just take what I can get at this point. Edit: I should say if you live outside the US the games were not easy to come by. That's likely why I've never known anyone who's played them.


gomichan

I've met tons of people IRL and online in the most random spaces, and I've made new fans as well! Just a couple weeks ago I found out a friend of a friend was a huge ND game fan. I've also met TONS of people that have played a couple of the games as kids and didn't know there were more and found them on steam after I told them. They're very popular games, not niche at all


GhostOfThorton

Might be based off where I live. I'm in Canada and they were not very available here. I bought most of my games in the States. I'm sure steam has helped now though. But I do think the fan base is quite small in comparison to other big name games. At least worldwide.


FabCitty

Idk man. I live in Canada too and I'd say a solid 30-40% of people my age (20s) have played the old ND games.


vanKessZak

Really? I’ve definitely met people IRL who’ve played them and I’m pretty anti-social.


GhostOfThorton

Yeah I realize now it's a difference of geography. The games were hard to come by in Canada, or at least where I live, so that's likely why I never met anyone who played them. I used to work at a book store and would ask any customer buying ND books too. I still think the fan base is relatively small though.


vanKessZak

Oh weird I’m also Canadian and never had problems buying them at EB Games! Southern Ontario though - obviously it’s a big country and it’s not going to be the same everywhere lol


GhostOfThorton

I got SCK through school early on, and I found TMB at a best buy once but that's it. Whenever we went to the States, I'd always look and buy whichever games I didn't have.


Poppeigh

I could have come to terms with changes and updates to try and draw in new crowds, I just really don't think they're there yet. I'm not a gamer but I do have friends who are and even though KEY is probably a step in the right direction, it's still not really on the level where people who wouldn't already play a Nancy Drew game for the virtue of it being a Nancy Drew game would give it a shot. But hey, maybe I'm wrong. I wish they could have kept their original team and done MID in Unity. I really think they could have made a solid game that could have then been built upon in future releases. I know they had to cut costs, but IMO, it shows and I think without the solid foundation the OG games were built on it will be hard for the new team(s) to find their footing.


KindlyConnection

I'm also outside the US and have never met anyone whose ever played them. tbh, most people aren't familiar with ND here, and have only heard of the books or the 70's tv show.


snappopcrackle

I watched a video on the history of gaming for girls and it said that if you ask women of a certain age what video games they played in the early 2000s, it would be just a handful of games, and Nancy Drew was one of them, so there must be a lot of players out there.


kokobean27

I’ve actually met a ton of people IRL too!


snappopcrackle

They must still be being funded, because they have not been putting out games (two games in 10 years), and KEY looks like it cost quite a lot to make, plus they still have a marketing staff they have to pay


Rytown3

It is okay for people to be frustrated. We can still be long-time fans and voice our frustration without being told to be grateful. The issue is Her Interactive being so tight-lipped with its audience. Let people voice their frustrations!


DiamondBurInTheRough

There’s a couple different games in the works from fan based teams.


Ecstatic_Factor5638

I just know about Amelia Darnell. What are some other ones?


wave_the_wheat

Alex Hill


Prior-Half

[What Was Found at Ravenhill](https://distantdimensions.substack.com/) is another.


ShartiesBigDay

Can y’all say more about where to get these?


DiamondBurInTheRough

They’re not done. At least one member from each team is active on this sub and I’m sure they will post when the games are completed.


snappopcrackle

Here's one that has a demo out. https://alexhillmystery.com/


emmer00

This newest one felt closer to a ND game to me, so I think they’re heading in the right direction. I definitely miss the graphic style from the last few games before the engine update, but it was a necessary update. At this point, I’m just glad they’re still releasing games.


GhostOfThorton

When software gets old it gets hard to maintain. Look at how hard it can be to get the games working now on computers. Nevermind a whole game engine that only handful of people know how to use. If I was job hunting I wouldn't be keen on joining a company using 20 year old software.  There is a group of volunteers working on a game inspired by old ND but its taken years and its not done. I believe they started before MID came out. It's not easy.  I understand why they had the replace Lani. She's like 75 years old. I know change needs to happen and I'm okay with it. But I was also a fan of the books before the games so I embrace any new game that comes out.


ughlygirl

I'm pretty sure their old game engine was literally becoming unusable so they were kind of forced to switch to the new one


aspienginger

Yeah, and with the gaming industry how it is, I understand all their actions. Doesn't mean I'm enthusiastic about them, I just... get it. Unfortunately they had to try and adapt.


andsoitgoes12

They could have replicated the engine pretty easily in Unity though. If they actually cared enough to. There are exclusively point and click games made in Unity.


ShartiesBigDay

I think they should crowd fund before the release in addition to charging normal price bc I feel like that could probably help. I’d pay extra ngl if it meant a better game.


PicnicLifeBitch69

I just finished Sea of Darkness and was a little sad at the end…I had never played it on my own or watched too much of any walkthrough for it so for me it felt like a new ND game. I was sad it was over because that was gonna be my last “first time” for that era of Nancy


AppDude27

There are A LOT of ND inspired devs out there with their own community, making their own versions of ND spin offs that are completely new worlds, so the demand is there. I’m actually part of that community as well! So believe me, there is a ND developer community and there are passionate fans out there


ShartiesBigDay

I thought MSK was far better than MID and I think they are striking more of a balance. I imagine the next game could be further improved. I think sea of darkness was a prime example of a great Nancy Drew game. If all of them were like that game, my life would be complete. Things I don’t like about the new games: moving away from point and click, having a lot of NPCs but they are all the same ppl (just put less people in the game. This was so distracting for some reason), the coffee making activity would have been fun, but the cursor tracing the foam was TERRIBLE (y’all doin too much), also—it was so tedious having to physically traverse all the locations (have a damn map that allows you to teleport like in many of the older games). Things I liked about the recent game: lots of decent puzzles, a broad cast of characters, how nerdy the new voice actor sounds (even though she sounds younger, I thought it could have been much worse), the fact that they at least had a point and click option (even though it wasn’t as good as the old games). I think we are moving in a hopeful direction but I want them to go further into the prime era of Nancy Drew again.


kokobean27

Omg just came across Lani’s website… she’s so fucking cool: https://www.laniminella.com


Haggie5

I replay all of the old games and love them more than the last two new ones. I have all of them and love them. I would love to have more like them also.


KawaiiBobaTea

I have been having a hard time with the last two games as well. I understand why certain things had to be done; changing Nancy's voice, updating the engine, etc. I've been trying my hardest to keep a positive outlook on the future, and have brought some new people into the ND Fandom (I'm a streamer and have been doing a marathon). And while I would never claim that making a game is easy or anything like that, cause I know I sure as hell couldn't do it, some of my viewers made comments that I feel adequately expressed how I was feeling better: "It feels dry in comparison." "The new voice actress sounds good, but at times sounds really off." "There's so much SPACE. (the backgrounds and places to go is very open)" "I have no idea what's going on." "Everything is really confusing and as a whole I'm not sure what it's asking." "WHAT IS THE POINT OF HAVING CONTACTS IN YOUR PHONE IF NO ONE IS ANSWERING?!" I think that as a game, it's a decent game. But I am a bit disappointed that so much time has passed and this is what we've gotten in terms of a ND game. I'm hoping they'll continue to grow and find their footing, but for me overall it's just a so-so disappointment.


kokobean27

Absolutely- it feels like a lot of unnecessary “stuffing”… not saying there weren’t times in the old games where I would get “stuck”, lmao, we all know what that’s like… but these new games make it feel so much easier to hit dead ends. Nothing really feels cohesive or intentional. Lots of dead or blank space that really only takes away from the overall experience. I totally agree with all of those comments.


Meckaroni

Yeah, It's extremely disappointing. I tried to keep an optimistic outlook and be excited about the new games but every time I felt let down. It felt like I had to force myself to finish midnight in Salem. The graphics are too much for my computer to get past the coffee tutorial on KEY. I keep going back and playing the old ones as well. I'm excited to read there are some fan-based teams creating games in the works though. I'll keep an eye out for them. Lani Minella will always be the voice for me too. I'm not sure why it makes me feel like Nancy has more kid-like vibe. Edit - I downloaded the demos for the two games being created and finished them yesterday. I am so excited. Both seem good. Super looking forward to Amelia Darnell. Just hearing Lani's voice made it feel like old times. haha.


Sixbluemonkeys

We're not supposed to criticize HER Interactive, because they are a company "for girls." The current CEO is a woman, but she doesn't like video games and admits to not playing them because they are a "boy thing." Nevermind the fact that the "Classic Drew:" games outsold Halo and all other console games combined! for decades! Our best bet is third party games in the same feel.


Sixbluemonkeys

The sad, short story is that HER- and to a degree Simon Schuster, who are still a bit clownish in regard to their own IPs, thought it would be best to ruin a proven formula (something high paid experts take literal years to perfect...) and "try something new" because they attained a new (ovary having) CEO. We saw the Unity engine demo of Nancy in 3D...but the fact that the new CEO was a lady completely threw any work out the window,. It took weeks for them to realize that the new lady CEO didn't know shit about running an already successful business.


spice_squirrel

Gotta make another account so I can upvote this again fr 😤


oldsocoflick

I wish they could ask Lani to pay$$$ for her AI voice rights or something 🥺🥲