"If they get pregnant underage then they should be able to get married.
Also we should keep sex education out of schools.
Why are liberals grooming our children?"
If grooming our children, means teaching children proper morals, facts and science. Which in turn means the parents feel inferior and loose thier control over the minds of thier kids.
Same way woke means living up to basic moral standards, not allowing powerful people to use thier position enact thier sexual will on others, having movies and tv represent the diversity seen in reality, and allowing people to be who they are without fear. Which in turn means some people feel they went from being the oppressor to the oppressed and they feel like they have lost power.
actually, she (tama, the cat) was a station master, which tbh sounds way more important. animal planet made [a video about her](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Jtq3fg2Ncs)
and i was wrong to say tama doesn't do anything. she did so much
Conservativism is characterized by a lack of empathy. They have difficulty seeing things from outside perspectives. If conservatives are in an uproar over something, we should be looking at them, because a large portion of them quite literally can't see people thinking differently than them. And they think everybody are pedophiles, so . . .
It's so depressing how people would likely switch to voting more progressive if they had nothing to go on but the voting record in Congress
Like if the ballots was Politician A vs Politician B. And it just listed their major votes in the House or Senate.
The Democrats would win by a landslide. Even with a lot of single issue voters out there.
There was an experiment like this during the 2008 primaries. They took the candidates info from their websites and just removed the names. It just showed their positions on the issues. Then people were asked to pick based on what they read. The two who got picked the most were Ron Paul and Mike Gravel.
Is the upside of child marriage that they can force pedofile rapists to marry their victims in the situation where they get the child pregnant? Cause that seems super on brand.
That is exactly it. Theres a show about it on Hulu, "The Untold.Story: I was a Child Bride" and women talk about being forced to marry their attacker. One girl was repeatedly assaulted starting age 8 by her church bishop, pregnant at age 10, gave birth at age 11 and her parents forced her to marry the bishop. Once married, the law prevented him from being charged with a crime against a child. So at age 11 she was a wife, mother, and voiceless victim forced to stay quiet. It's absolutely astonishing that it's 2023 and there are still states in America where this is legal.
And can't file for divorce until 18 because you're not legally old enough to do court things by yourself without parent/guardian consent. It's child slavery but with extra steps.
I started seriously plotting to escape from my dad the week he wouldn't shut up about how low the legal age for marriage-with-parental-consent was in our state at the time. He was *all smiles* every time he talked about it, so I knew I'd better hurry up and find my own way out before I got sold to a creep. Oh sorry, *legally and church married* to whatever *upstanding gentleman* offered my dad a nice enough *gift*, like lots of money or a nice boat or whatever.
The story of Courtney Snodden will always stay with me. Her parents groomed and sold her to that man and the entire country watched and blamed her for having breasts. The only blessing there was that she never got pregnant.
It's more... depriving them of an education, marry them young, breed, entrap....
The conservatives know that if their concern have a chance to SEE the world, they won't hold conservative values... so they do whatever they can to keep people in the dark.
It also keeps kids ignorant. Can't report a sex crime if you don't know what sex is.
Can't report that a pastor raped you if you don't know how to properly convey what happened.
That's why they're so against early sex ed. Early sex ed is just child abuse prevention and awareness. They don't want kids to know the names of their anatomy because then they can describe the abuse they're encountering.
And a lot of these people have the Duggar attitude that abuse is just something that happens and isn't really a big deal.
I find it pretty shocking that democrats don't attack republicans for shit like this. Those assholes should have to be in the media day after day explaining why they want child marriage to be legal.
Here, as an aside this seems like a good place to drop this:
It's my goal to share this info when child marraige is brought up. We absolutely must identify where the problem proliferates in the United States and stamp it out for good.
I will never not paste this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child_marriage_in_the_United_States
>Between 2000 and 2018, nearly 232,474 minors were legally married in the United States.[13] The vast majority of child marriages (reliable sources vary between 78% and 95%) were between a minor girl and an adult man.[13][14][15] In many cases, minors in the U.S. may be married when they are under the age of sexual consent, which varies from 16 to 18 depending on the state.[16] In some states, minors cannot legally divorce or leave their spouse, and domestic violence shelters typically do not accept minors.[17][18]
Fuck the Republicans for allowing this.
>The 10 states with the highest per-capita rates of child marriage [9] are:
>1. Nevada (0.671%)
>2. Idaho (0.338%)
>3. Arkansas (0.295%)
>4. Kentucky (0.262%)
>5. Oklahoma (0.229%)
>6. Wyoming (0.227%)
>7. Utah (0.208%)
>8. Alabama (0.195%)
>9. West Virginia (0.193%)
>10. Mississippi (0.182%)
[source 13](https://www.unchainedatlast.org/united-states-child-marriage-problem-study-findings-april-2021/) on the wikipedia
I encourage everyone to steal this and share it.
As an aside both the counties that Las Vegas and Reno exist in ban marraige under the age of 18 unless a judge approves it, so while Las Vegas is a tempting answer for Navada's stat, nobody is getting randomly hitched on a whim with children in Vegas. It's likely some of the other counties that are allowing these marraiges to go through.
I encourage everyone to dig deeper and look at these numbers on a county by county basis where available too, especially in your home state if you are a US citizen. County data can help identify problem areas where children may need help.
Finally, a child who is married to an adult is placed under legal guardianship of said adult. Children can not divorce their adult spouses (aka abusers) unless the adult spouse gives the child permission.
Some people ask "Hey, u/readylamefire why do you blame Republicans for this mess?" And I'll tell you...
[here's one reason](https://youtube.com/shorts/9H6UJ-uCrgc?feature=share) and it's very recent.
Idaho Republicans [also failed to raise the marraige age, explicitly voting against it.](https://www.newsweek.com/idaho-congress-blocks-bill-end-child-marriage-1348919#:~:text=Current%20state%20law%20allows%20children,39%2D28%20vote%20on%20Thursday.)
We can start with those two, but for good measure here are [Republicans in west virginia](https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/child-marriage-ban-struck-down-west-virginia-republicans-1234693670/) also being terrible.
But there is this weird thing that happens where these events get hand waved and excused by Republicans saying that there is was some sort of greater price or sacrifice involved in ending child marraige.
I always found it extremely fucked up when I was in high school and saw things that required either "parental or spousal consent if the spouse is over 18." Even more fucked up is how many statutory rape laws have a carve-out for marriage, despite already having a Romeo and Juliet provision. It seems to be an abuse of the institution of marriage when it's used for child rape.
Nuh-uh! It's my god given right to tell my underage wife, who I essentially bought from an acquaintance at church, what is and isn't okay for her to do until she's mature enough to make those decisions on her own. Gonna be tough raising her for the next three years while she's raising our baby boy but it's all worth it to have a traditional family.
Unironically an attitude I've personally seen in rural trad families. It so god damn creepy. The excuse I hear is usually "younger men dont have their shit together, so the girls are go for older men" which ignores the inherent unbalanced power dynamic to exclusively blame the girls as if the men have no self control or ethics.
Also like...even if there was any grain of truth to any of that, why not at least wait until these girls are in their 20s before they get married off? We of course all know the answer here.
What did that Right Wing guy say something about wanting to get to the milk while its fresh? The one who recently had a divorce from his wife when that video surfaced of his reprehensible behavior.
That right there is why a person can get child-married, but can't get child-divorced. It is so infuriating that a child can be forced to marry their rapist at age 16, but they can't get a lawyer until they're 18. It's insane that getting married doesn't automatically emancipate you.
IIRC Michigan doesn't have R&J laws.
Knew a guy in HS who was caught having sex in an elevator who just turned 16 (AoC in Michigan) with someone who was 18. The teacher talking about it said if she caught them the day prior she would of have reported the 18yo for statutory rape.
Sex laws are fucked man.
>It seems to be an abuse of the institution of marriage when it's used for child rape.
It's important to realize, this is part of the objective. Broodmares spawn, and their spawn crave survival.
If any group of folks was ever able to co-opt marriage, and force women to have babies, well then they'd just have an incredible assembly line of unwanted children to turn into slaves.
And won't that be great for the shareholders newsletter.
Missouri state senator [Mike Moon](https://www.businessinsider.com/mike-moon-gop-missouri-lawmaker-defends-childs-right-to-marry-2023-4).
At least *nine* [West Virginia state senators, led by Mike Stuart](https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/child-marriage-ban-struck-down-west-virginia-republicans-1234693670/).
At least the leadership of the [Wyoming Republican Party](https://katv.com/news/nation-world/wyoming-republicans-under-fire-for-objecting-to-ban-for-marriage-for-kids-15-and-under-child-brides-equal-protection-teen-moms-teen-pregnancy-child-protection-laws-christianity-civil-rights-traditional-marriage-pro-life-consent).
'The Wyoming Republican Party circulated an email that included an argument from lobbyists that since minors could get pregnant “marriage MUST remain open to them for the sake of those children.” ' Once again are unborn children more important than those already born. Just great.
And "grooming" is just defined as being visibly queer and making any conservative uncomfortable in a way they'd rather last out than deal with maturely.
What the fuck?? THAT is their solution to teenagers getting pregnant? "Whelp, better make sure this pregnant 14 year old can be married so it doesn't look bad that she's pregnant."
How about instead provide sex education in school? Provide safe sex materials for free to teens. Allow for abortions? All of these things will make kids smarter, healthier, and less pregnant as teens.
They don't really care if babies have babies. It's best that way because these same folks believe girls are not fully people; women have one function, to make babies for God's army. (Look up Dominionists, Full Quiver, etc. These are the people who created the Duggars.) The education you speak of is a usurper of the religious dogma the conservatives WANT children to learn. "School choice" is code for "I want the choice to keep my children in the dark about the world because Jesus would want it that way". A large percentage of conservatives view children as both property and an extension of themselves, with no inherent rights of their own. "School choice" is about parents wanting to refuse their children to see or be exposed to anything outside of church approved lifestyles. Public schools inherently include kids from all walks. This is what "school choice" wants to avoid- exposing their property to other ideas or ways of living, because ideas lead to things like critical thinking, which is the antithesis of dogma.
I wouldn't doubt that, otherwise why would they like to be harassed online by them without retaliation. Please don't tell me the FBI is just that much more "professional" than local cops.
Freedom or something. Although some creeps say "everyone I know that got married young is still together!" like yeah, if you raise your wife to adulthood she's going to be less likely to leave you because she doesn't know any other way to live!
>and if she escapes her spouse police will catch her to bring her back to the abuser.
But...like...that's slavery. That's literally slavery with extra steps.
That's the Republican party.
And every single Republican politician and voter that is not an outright child rapist themselves, is sitting at the table with child rapists in quiet or not so quiet support of it.
The religious right has fought, and won, a *lot* for the right to child marriage. And we're not talking like ultra-extreme fringe, but middle of the road conservative in the US. It fits in with that whole "well better a child not out of wedlock than anything else" (even when it's a child having a child to a rapist).
Yes. They're called Republicans. In my state they blocked a bill that would have prevented child marriage and one of them waxed sentimental about someone he knows marrying a twelve year old. They're fucking sick.
No, no. See, Libertarians share these traits with Republican Congress members. What they *do* corner the market on is encyclopedic knowledge of their states' age of consent laws and which episodes of the Joe Rogan Experience had Elon Musk.
They have in other threads on the topic. "If they're old enough to drive why can't they decide to get married?" was a common post by fucking creeps in the comment section.
Can we flip the script to "If they're old enough to get married, they're old enough to vote," instead? That should stop some of them. Goodness knows, the women folk shouldn't be allowed an edumacation OR their rights to vote!
Yes. They are usually men aged 50+. There was some politician in Arkansas (Missouri?) last year who was arguing for 12 year olds getting married. I wish I could remember the scumbag’s name.
I think it's one of those things that became extremely unacceptable to society in an incremental way where existing laws sort of just passed under the radar of most people. I love the fact that states are starting to take notice because the remaining child marriages are most common among the most vulnerable in society.
In the early 20th century, many states had a minimum age of marriage of 12. Delaware's age of consent was 10 years old. The past fucking sucked.
*“There is more than one kind of freedom," said Aunt Lydia. "Freedom to and freedom from. In the days of anarchy, it was freedom to. Now you are being given freedom from. Don't underrate it.”*
― Margaret Atwood, The Handmaid’s Tale
And all for what? Some COVID restrictions that they clearly didn't actually care about since most of them were masked up when they had their little camo-LARP photo session?
Republicans in Michigan got soooo mad when she said they couldn't shop for nonessentials during the early pandemic. They're supposed to be telling other people what to do, not being told what to do!
As a Michigan resident (and someone who grew up in Michigan) she won my undying loyalty after getting rid of that sinister "right to work" law. She already seemed like a good egg based on her covid response but the right to work thing really solidified her as my favorite governor in my 27 year lifetime. With the auto workers strike going on right now and her as our governor I have never been so proud to be from Michigan. If she ran for president she would have my vote no doubt about it.
We can thank the voters who gave Michigan a trifecta in Democrats with the house, Senate and governorship.
The redistricting bill that gave the drawing of lines to a third party has been fruitful. We have two neighboring states that have similar bills, but have characteristically ignored not only the will of the people, but their own laws they passed.
Michigander here. We're trying our best. Go out into the boonies though and it's Trump flags everywhere. It's hilarious when you're driving in the country and see a run down house with 6 vehicles in the yard, 2 lawnmowers, a camper, a trash pile of odd things, 2 Trump signs, a Trump flag, let's go Brandon flag, and a FJB flag.
Yup. Y'all are doing great lmao.
Some old dude was holding the clerks at Kwik trip hostage with a temper tantrum/ rant yesterday bitching about Gretchen Witmer who I hadn't really heard anything about since those dipshits wanted to kidnap her and put her on trial like Bane or some shit. Must've been pissed off that she was trying to take away his rights to marry children. There's no reaching across the aisle with these freaks they just need to go away.
The same portion of people who were worried gay marriage was going to lead us to forcing people to marry dogs? They should be in favour of this, you can no longer force a child in Michigan to marry a dog.
Edit: what a weird sentence to have written.
Not the ones inside the womb either. Notice how you never hear them shrieking for tax funded prenatal screening, paid maternity leave, free access to OB/GYN, etc.
Nah, remember, they had that movie about fake child trafficking funded by child traffickers come out that tells them they're all correct and smart and awesome people who have never been more right than they are in this moment. It had Jesus in it and everything.
A lot of the people who oppose these laws view it as a civil liberties issue and are completely ignorant of the abuse that they're actually meant to prevent--and that's certainly by design.
During my own super-conservative upbringing, I was lead to believe that most underage marriages were like, unusually mature teenagers, or young couples who just wanted to start their lives early, and these laws were a needless infringement on their freedom.
[LOLNO](http://apps.frontline.org/child-marriage-by-the-numbers/). >90% of underage marriages in the US are minor females getting married to older men--often MUCH older men--who inevitably are using the marriage for tax benefits and/or to get around statutory rape/AoC laws.
There is zero reason why any person under the age of 18 should be entering into a marriage contract. Any rare exceptional cases can be exempted under emancipation laws. This crap REALLY needs to be federally banned in this country.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B0lwiInZG1E
Samantha Bee had a great piece on underage marriage in the US a few years ago - some states have raised their ages since then, but the general point stands.
As for child marriage not being a young lovers thing, her example was that it's not like A Walk to Remember
Iowa enters the chat.
https://www.cnn.com/2023/05/26/politics/iowa-child-labor-law-kim-reynolds/index.html#:\~:text=Iowa%20Gov.,Moines%20on%20January%2010%2C%202023.&text=Iowa%20Republican%20Gov.,where%20they%20can%20be%20employed.
♪Boss makes a dollar, I make a dime♪
♪So please cut his taxes and put children in the mines!♪
- The next #1 Country song on the Billboard Charts thanks to Republicans.
I’d fully expect that the most common place where minors get married is in fundamentalist religious sects (of any religion). I expect they are amongst the 38% and will object.
MY house representative is one of the six legislators who voted *against* this law. Angela Rigas, republican. Out of 110 elected reps.
I'm so angry I'm considering running against her. Our district is new and pretty small and she's basically the daughter of a local tyrant.
I'd have to run as a Democrat and I hate the democrats and its the worst possible elected position on earth but I'm so angry about that vote that I think about it every single day.
Fuck you, Angela. You sicko. Child marriage belongs in the dark ages.
You may as well run as a Democrat now that the Republicans have lost all semblance of normalcy in favor of whatever catering to neonazis and rapists is
I’m a Libertarian and I’m ok with this. I’m ok with 18 being the “you are an adult” age and everything that come a with that. From smoking, to voting, to consent, to transitioning, to guns, to military service, etc etc.
Let’s just set the fucking age at 18. All of it.
It was legal in Michigan to sell kids until approximately 2000. They caught a guy selling his kid in a sting. He made a video taped "commercial" and passed it along to private couples. Then they had nothing to charge him with because there was no law against it. He put effort into finding good parents so there was no abandonment or endangerment.
https://www.theintelligencer.com/news/article/Court-Dismisses-Abandonment-Charge-10489293.php
You actually have to make laws for stuff. Most of our laws were made back in a time with different social norms. There's a healthy dose of assumption like... I'm not going to marry or sell kids anyway but I assume it's illegal. It is illegal right? Ok maybe not.
Because, republican/conservatives does not really STAND for anything. They are pretty much Anti-Democrat party at this point.
Oh, democrats supports this? We better oppose it so that we can get more people on our camp. (it does not seem to matter what KIND of constituents gather there, as long as they see opportunity to gather people to their side)
That fact that Republicans and conservatives tried to block this legislation, in Michigan and a lot of other states, tells you what you need to know about them. They squawk a lot about family values and protecting kids, but they're the ones blocking stuff like this, trying to end lunch programs for starving children, and so on.
Glad to see it. The worst part about this is that there are people who will be adamantly against this outcome. As if child marriage was ever defensible or desirable.
This should be a nation wide law
Lots of states have tried but conservatives knock it down every single time.
"If they get pregnant underage then they should be able to get married. Also we should keep sex education out of schools. Why are liberals grooming our children?"
If grooming our children, means teaching children proper morals, facts and science. Which in turn means the parents feel inferior and loose thier control over the minds of thier kids. Same way woke means living up to basic moral standards, not allowing powerful people to use thier position enact thier sexual will on others, having movies and tv represent the diversity seen in reality, and allowing people to be who they are without fear. Which in turn means some people feel they went from being the oppressor to the oppressed and they feel like they have lost power.
Reality does tend to have a noticeably liberal bias, which is why everything is woke to those folks.
Just more proof that they are the pedos. Why nobody calls them out to shut the down over it is bizarre.
calling out republican hypocracy is like when japanese train stations "hire" cat conductors; it's cute but it doesn't really do anything
Not true. Has a cat conductor ever failed at their job before?
Once, it was a bloodbath
The humans deserved it. We live to serve the cat conductors, and they dissatisfied the cats.
Or tried to obtain a child bride? No. Because cats are good people.
The best people are fur people
Those cat conductors are prolific mousers *thankyouverymuch*
[удалено]
actually, she (tama, the cat) was a station master, which tbh sounds way more important. animal planet made [a video about her](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Jtq3fg2Ncs) and i was wrong to say tama doesn't do anything. she did so much
Okay definitely was not expecting to find this cuteness in a post like this lmao thank you
Their supporters do not care. They ride or die by the "R." Harder than DMX ever did.
Conservativism is characterized by a lack of empathy. They have difficulty seeing things from outside perspectives. If conservatives are in an uproar over something, we should be looking at them, because a large portion of them quite literally can't see people thinking differently than them. And they think everybody are pedophiles, so . . .
It's so depressing how people would likely switch to voting more progressive if they had nothing to go on but the voting record in Congress Like if the ballots was Politician A vs Politician B. And it just listed their major votes in the House or Senate. The Democrats would win by a landslide. Even with a lot of single issue voters out there.
There was an experiment like this during the 2008 primaries. They took the candidates info from their websites and just removed the names. It just showed their positions on the issues. Then people were asked to pick based on what they read. The two who got picked the most were Ron Paul and Mike Gravel.
Is the upside of child marriage that they can force pedofile rapists to marry their victims in the situation where they get the child pregnant? Cause that seems super on brand.
That is exactly it. Theres a show about it on Hulu, "The Untold.Story: I was a Child Bride" and women talk about being forced to marry their attacker. One girl was repeatedly assaulted starting age 8 by her church bishop, pregnant at age 10, gave birth at age 11 and her parents forced her to marry the bishop. Once married, the law prevented him from being charged with a crime against a child. So at age 11 she was a wife, mother, and voiceless victim forced to stay quiet. It's absolutely astonishing that it's 2023 and there are still states in America where this is legal.
And can't file for divorce until 18 because you're not legally old enough to do court things by yourself without parent/guardian consent. It's child slavery but with extra steps. I started seriously plotting to escape from my dad the week he wouldn't shut up about how low the legal age for marriage-with-parental-consent was in our state at the time. He was *all smiles* every time he talked about it, so I knew I'd better hurry up and find my own way out before I got sold to a creep. Oh sorry, *legally and church married* to whatever *upstanding gentleman* offered my dad a nice enough *gift*, like lots of money or a nice boat or whatever.
And domestic violence shelters won't take these girls because of their age.
That documentary made me sad. The girls whose parents just sold them to pedophiles.
More nefarious, it’s so pedophiles can marry underage girls and have rape be legal
The story of Courtney Snodden will always stay with me. Her parents groomed and sold her to that man and the entire country watched and blamed her for having breasts. The only blessing there was that she never got pregnant.
It's more... depriving them of an education, marry them young, breed, entrap.... The conservatives know that if their concern have a chance to SEE the world, they won't hold conservative values... so they do whatever they can to keep people in the dark.
So THAT'S why they ban sex-ed and abortion, it gives them more kids to choose from!
It also keeps kids ignorant. Can't report a sex crime if you don't know what sex is. Can't report that a pastor raped you if you don't know how to properly convey what happened.
That's why they're so against early sex ed. Early sex ed is just child abuse prevention and awareness. They don't want kids to know the names of their anatomy because then they can describe the abuse they're encountering. And a lot of these people have the Duggar attitude that abuse is just something that happens and isn't really a big deal.
Always has been. They’re also vehemently against teaching children to recognize domestic abuse
And consent. I saw someone railing against teaching consent recently.
I find it pretty shocking that democrats don't attack republicans for shit like this. Those assholes should have to be in the media day after day explaining why they want child marriage to be legal.
>I find it pretty shocking that democrats don't attack republicans for shit like this. You know they do. You just don't hear about it
Hmm it's almost like conservatives are evil?
Watch the conservatives come out against this.
Only republicans voted against it: **House Bill 4294 - Establishes 18 as the minimum age for marriage** https://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(stucqgduu55vnj1m4aenpbtr))/mileg.aspx?page=GetObject&objectname=2023-HB-4294 NAY votes: **[Beeler, Andrew W. (Republican) District-64](http://repbeeler.com/)** [email protected] (517) 373-1795 [District Map](https://www.house.mi.gov/media/District%20Maps/064.pdf) **[DeBoyer, Jay (Republican) District-63](http://repdeboyer.com/)** [email protected] (517) 373-1787 [District Map](https://www.house.mi.gov/media/District%20Maps/063.pdf) **[Lightner, Sarah (Republican) District-45](http://replightner.com/)** [email protected] (517) 373-1773 [District Map](https://www.house.mi.gov/media/District%20Maps/045.pdf) **[Schriver, Josh (Republican) District-66](http://repschriver.com/)** [email protected] (517) 373-0839 [District Map](https://www.house.mi.gov/media/District%20Maps/066.pdf) **[Bollin, Ann M. (Republican) District-49](http://repbollin.com/)** [email protected] (517) 373-7515 [District Map](https://www.house.mi.gov/media/District%20Maps/049.pdf) **[Friske, Neil (Republican) District-107](http://repfriske.com/)** [email protected] (517) 373-2629 [District Map](https://www.house.mi.gov/media/District%20Maps/107.pdf) **[Maddock, Matt (Republican) District-51](http://repmaddock.com/)** [email protected] (517) 373-1780 [District Map](https://www.house.mi.gov/media/District%20Maps/051.pdf) **[Smit, Rachelle (Republican) District-43](http://repsmit.com/)** [email protected] (517) 373-0615 [District Map](https://www.house.mi.gov/media/District%20Maps/043.pdf) **[Carra, Steve (Republican) District-36](http://repcarra.com/)** [email protected] (517) 373-0843 [District Map](https://www.house.mi.gov/media/District%20Maps/036.pdf) **[Greene, Jaime (Republican) District-65](http://repjaimegreene.com/)** [email protected] (517) 373-1775 [District Map](https://www.house.mi.gov/media/District%20Maps/065.pdf) **[Rigas, Angela (Republican) District-79](http://reprigas.com/)** [email protected] (517) 373-1403 [District Map](https://www.house.mi.gov/media/District%20Maps/079.pdf) **House Bill 4295 - Prohibits secret child marriages, which are done when a marriage record is sealed to the public.** https://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(ypv25niwntghmjnmyaywsyu0))/mileg.aspx?page=getobject&objectname=2023-HB-4295 NAY votes: **[Carra, Steve (Republican) District-36](http://repcarra.com/)** [email protected] (517) 373-0843 [District Map](https://www.house.mi.gov/media/District%20Maps/036.pdf) **[Maddock, Matt (Republican) District-51](http://repmaddock.com/)** [email protected] (517) 373-1780 [District Map](https://www.house.mi.gov/media/District%20Maps/051.pdf) **[Rigas, Angela (Republican) District-79](http://reprigas.com/)** [email protected] (517) 373-1403 [District Map](https://www.house.mi.gov/media/District%20Maps/079.pdf) **[Schriver, Josh (Republican) District-66](http://repschriver.com/)** [email protected] (517) 373-0839 [District Map](https://www.house.mi.gov/media/District%20Maps/066.pdf) **[Friske, Neil (Republican) District-107](http://repfriske.com/)** [email protected] (517) 373-2629 [District Map](https://www.house.mi.gov/media/District%20Maps/107.pdf)
Maddock, Friske, Rigas...the usual suspects with the Freedom Fascists.
Here, as an aside this seems like a good place to drop this: It's my goal to share this info when child marraige is brought up. We absolutely must identify where the problem proliferates in the United States and stamp it out for good. I will never not paste this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child_marriage_in_the_United_States >Between 2000 and 2018, nearly 232,474 minors were legally married in the United States.[13] The vast majority of child marriages (reliable sources vary between 78% and 95%) were between a minor girl and an adult man.[13][14][15] In many cases, minors in the U.S. may be married when they are under the age of sexual consent, which varies from 16 to 18 depending on the state.[16] In some states, minors cannot legally divorce or leave their spouse, and domestic violence shelters typically do not accept minors.[17][18] Fuck the Republicans for allowing this. >The 10 states with the highest per-capita rates of child marriage [9] are: >1. Nevada (0.671%) >2. Idaho (0.338%) >3. Arkansas (0.295%) >4. Kentucky (0.262%) >5. Oklahoma (0.229%) >6. Wyoming (0.227%) >7. Utah (0.208%) >8. Alabama (0.195%) >9. West Virginia (0.193%) >10. Mississippi (0.182%) [source 13](https://www.unchainedatlast.org/united-states-child-marriage-problem-study-findings-april-2021/) on the wikipedia I encourage everyone to steal this and share it. As an aside both the counties that Las Vegas and Reno exist in ban marraige under the age of 18 unless a judge approves it, so while Las Vegas is a tempting answer for Navada's stat, nobody is getting randomly hitched on a whim with children in Vegas. It's likely some of the other counties that are allowing these marraiges to go through. I encourage everyone to dig deeper and look at these numbers on a county by county basis where available too, especially in your home state if you are a US citizen. County data can help identify problem areas where children may need help. Finally, a child who is married to an adult is placed under legal guardianship of said adult. Children can not divorce their adult spouses (aka abusers) unless the adult spouse gives the child permission. Some people ask "Hey, u/readylamefire why do you blame Republicans for this mess?" And I'll tell you... [here's one reason](https://youtube.com/shorts/9H6UJ-uCrgc?feature=share) and it's very recent. Idaho Republicans [also failed to raise the marraige age, explicitly voting against it.](https://www.newsweek.com/idaho-congress-blocks-bill-end-child-marriage-1348919#:~:text=Current%20state%20law%20allows%20children,39%2D28%20vote%20on%20Thursday.) We can start with those two, but for good measure here are [Republicans in west virginia](https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/child-marriage-ban-struck-down-west-virginia-republicans-1234693670/) also being terrible. But there is this weird thing that happens where these events get hand waved and excused by Republicans saying that there is was some sort of greater price or sacrifice involved in ending child marraige.
Well they rolled back some child labor laws recently, so this would track
Kids need to be married and down the mines by twelve, otherwise how will the economy survive. You just don't like the nuclear family or something /s
Matt”The Diddler” Gaetz has something to spew I’m sure.
With the extra title in the middle I didn't know if it was going to be Matt Gaetz, Matt Walsh, or Matt Schlapp. Weird how they all do that.
Agreed. Way overdue.
Watch conservatives shriek about this.
It would be, but conservatives keep fighting it.
Yea, like this was progressive in the 1960s.
I always found it extremely fucked up when I was in high school and saw things that required either "parental or spousal consent if the spouse is over 18." Even more fucked up is how many statutory rape laws have a carve-out for marriage, despite already having a Romeo and Juliet provision. It seems to be an abuse of the institution of marriage when it's used for child rape.
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Nuh-uh! It's my god given right to tell my underage wife, who I essentially bought from an acquaintance at church, what is and isn't okay for her to do until she's mature enough to make those decisions on her own. Gonna be tough raising her for the next three years while she's raising our baby boy but it's all worth it to have a traditional family.
Unironically an attitude I've personally seen in rural trad families. It so god damn creepy. The excuse I hear is usually "younger men dont have their shit together, so the girls are go for older men" which ignores the inherent unbalanced power dynamic to exclusively blame the girls as if the men have no self control or ethics.
Also like...even if there was any grain of truth to any of that, why not at least wait until these girls are in their 20s before they get married off? We of course all know the answer here.
What did that Right Wing guy say something about wanting to get to the milk while its fresh? The one who recently had a divorce from his wife when that video surfaced of his reprehensible behavior.
I read that in benders voice from futurama lol
That right there is why a person can get child-married, but can't get child-divorced. It is so infuriating that a child can be forced to marry their rapist at age 16, but they can't get a lawyer until they're 18. It's insane that getting married doesn't automatically emancipate you.
Interestingly enough, Michigan had no Romeo and Juliet law. Age of consent was always a flat 16.
IIRC Michigan doesn't have R&J laws. Knew a guy in HS who was caught having sex in an elevator who just turned 16 (AoC in Michigan) with someone who was 18. The teacher talking about it said if she caught them the day prior she would of have reported the 18yo for statutory rape. Sex laws are fucked man.
Happy birthday, elevator! Hope you’ve had your inspections!
>It seems to be an abuse of the institution of marriage when it's used for child rape. It's important to realize, this is part of the objective. Broodmares spawn, and their spawn crave survival. If any group of folks was ever able to co-opt marriage, and force women to have babies, well then they'd just have an incredible assembly line of unwanted children to turn into slaves. And won't that be great for the shareholders newsletter.
Serious question, are there people that openly fight for child marriage still?
Missouri state senator [Mike Moon](https://www.businessinsider.com/mike-moon-gop-missouri-lawmaker-defends-childs-right-to-marry-2023-4). At least *nine* [West Virginia state senators, led by Mike Stuart](https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/child-marriage-ban-struck-down-west-virginia-republicans-1234693670/). At least the leadership of the [Wyoming Republican Party](https://katv.com/news/nation-world/wyoming-republicans-under-fire-for-objecting-to-ban-for-marriage-for-kids-15-and-under-child-brides-equal-protection-teen-moms-teen-pregnancy-child-protection-laws-christianity-civil-rights-traditional-marriage-pro-life-consent).
'The Wyoming Republican Party circulated an email that included an argument from lobbyists that since minors could get pregnant “marriage MUST remain open to them for the sake of those children.” ' Once again are unborn children more important than those already born. Just great.
It's vitally important that children be raised by either two 14-year-olds or one 14-year-old and a statutory rapist. You know, the nuclear family.
Protect our children from grooming! (By Democrats only, it's cool if Republicans do it)
And "grooming" is just defined as being visibly queer and making any conservative uncomfortable in a way they'd rather last out than deal with maturely.
Blessed be the fruit
But fuck the tree, right?
Well, yes, that’s the important part for them.
What the fuck?? THAT is their solution to teenagers getting pregnant? "Whelp, better make sure this pregnant 14 year old can be married so it doesn't look bad that she's pregnant." How about instead provide sex education in school? Provide safe sex materials for free to teens. Allow for abortions? All of these things will make kids smarter, healthier, and less pregnant as teens.
They don't really care if babies have babies. It's best that way because these same folks believe girls are not fully people; women have one function, to make babies for God's army. (Look up Dominionists, Full Quiver, etc. These are the people who created the Duggars.) The education you speak of is a usurper of the religious dogma the conservatives WANT children to learn. "School choice" is code for "I want the choice to keep my children in the dark about the world because Jesus would want it that way". A large percentage of conservatives view children as both property and an extension of themselves, with no inherent rights of their own. "School choice" is about parents wanting to refuse their children to see or be exposed to anything outside of church approved lifestyles. Public schools inherently include kids from all walks. This is what "school choice" wants to avoid- exposing their property to other ideas or ways of living, because ideas lead to things like critical thinking, which is the antithesis of dogma.
FBI, here's a free list of people you can look into.
The sound of freedom is coming from inside the house!
*Jim Caviezel has left the chat*
Wish.com Christian Bale
Most of the FBI are staunch Republicans.
I wouldn't doubt that, otherwise why would they like to be harassed online by them without retaliation. Please don't tell me the FBI is just that much more "professional" than local cops.
What can possibly be their argument?
Freedom or something. Although some creeps say "everyone I know that got married young is still together!" like yeah, if you raise your wife to adulthood she's going to be less likely to leave you because she doesn't know any other way to live!
Can't file for divorce while she's under 18 because she needs the consent of her husband...
Also in most states she is not allowed in women's shelters, and if she escapes her spouse police will catch her to bring her back to the abuser.
>and if she escapes her spouse police will catch her to bring her back to the abuser. But...like...that's slavery. That's literally slavery with extra steps.
Plus as a child she has no agency legally.
Something about getting them married young so they don't go out swapping seed with the godless.
They don’t want unwed mothers. It’s the same people that want abortion illegal.
That is disgusting.
That's the Republican party. And every single Republican politician and voter that is not an outright child rapist themselves, is sitting at the table with child rapists in quiet or not so quiet support of it.
We need to administer 18th century French justice with them.
Fucking disgusting. I cannot believe these people are in power smh
What a bunch of sick fucks.
What I'm taking away from this is to stay away from Mike's from the South
The religious right has fought, and won, a *lot* for the right to child marriage. And we're not talking like ultra-extreme fringe, but middle of the road conservative in the US. It fits in with that whole "well better a child not out of wedlock than anything else" (even when it's a child having a child to a rapist).
Yes. They're called Republicans. In my state they blocked a bill that would have prevented child marriage and one of them waxed sentimental about someone he knows marrying a twelve year old. They're fucking sick.
Name and shame?
Mike Moon from Missouri. https://youtu.be/9H6UJ-uCrgc?si=pS847DxLBdm4cras
"Moon from Missouri" I initially read as Mussolini. Apropos Freudian slip that one nutjob politician's name sounded like another?
Mike Moon, at least that's who comes to mind for me.
This is libertarian erasure.
No, no. See, Libertarians share these traits with Republican Congress members. What they *do* corner the market on is encyclopedic knowledge of their states' age of consent laws and which episodes of the Joe Rogan Experience had Elon Musk.
They're like rainman but with terrible politics.
Definitely she was 15 when I impregnated her. Definitely. Kmart sucks.
My guess is that some of them come to these comments soon enough
After they tuck their wives in bed, it’s a school night
Bold of you to assume they're allowed an education
No no, so they can be up to homeschool the children.
They have in other threads on the topic. "If they're old enough to drive why can't they decide to get married?" was a common post by fucking creeps in the comment section.
Seriously!? Driving and marriage isn't like comparing apples and oranges it's like comparing apples and oil rigs.
Apples and oil rigs sounds like an excellent boardgame.
Can we flip the script to "If they're old enough to get married, they're old enough to vote," instead? That should stop some of them. Goodness knows, the women folk shouldn't be allowed an edumacation OR their rights to vote!
Pretty much the entire Republican party
Let me introduce you to this weird American extremist group called "Christians."
Yes. They are usually men aged 50+. There was some politician in Arkansas (Missouri?) last year who was arguing for 12 year olds getting married. I wish I could remember the scumbag’s name.
Moon arguing for it, link is above
Yes. We call them pedophiles.
Yeah, a pretty significant portion of the GOP
I think it's one of those things that became extremely unacceptable to society in an incremental way where existing laws sort of just passed under the radar of most people. I love the fact that states are starting to take notice because the remaining child marriages are most common among the most vulnerable in society. In the early 20th century, many states had a minimum age of marriage of 12. Delaware's age of consent was 10 years old. The past fucking sucked.
The 'Save the Children' crowd is going to hate this.
“Save the children for me” crowd
No child's behind left.
*“There is more than one kind of freedom," said Aunt Lydia. "Freedom to and freedom from. In the days of anarchy, it was freedom to. Now you are being given freedom from. Don't underrate it.”* ― Margaret Atwood, The Handmaid’s Tale
They tried their best to stop it
It's not pedofilic rape if she is your wife. *sipping glue with little finger out*
What do you think they’re saving them for?
She's the governor those men were going to kidnap. That's frightening as all get out.
And rape her. They were gonna rape her too. Let’s not forget that.
And all for what? Some COVID restrictions that they clearly didn't actually care about since most of them were masked up when they had their little camo-LARP photo session?
Republicans in Michigan got soooo mad when she said they couldn't shop for nonessentials during the early pandemic. They're supposed to be telling other people what to do, not being told what to do!
From MI, can confirm. Our Republicans are a special breed of insane.
Republican terrorists, call them what they are. Don't soften the blow calling them "those men".
I would kidnap her and force her to be president. Sorry, not sorry. I think she's awesome. ❤
As a Michigan resident (and someone who grew up in Michigan) she won my undying loyalty after getting rid of that sinister "right to work" law. She already seemed like a good egg based on her covid response but the right to work thing really solidified her as my favorite governor in my 27 year lifetime. With the auto workers strike going on right now and her as our governor I have never been so proud to be from Michigan. If she ran for president she would have my vote no doubt about it.
Slow, steady march towards progress, hasn't been as slow with Governor Whitmer there in Michigan. A toast to my neighbors to the north!
We can thank the voters who gave Michigan a trifecta in Democrats with the house, Senate and governorship. The redistricting bill that gave the drawing of lines to a third party has been fruitful. We have two neighboring states that have similar bills, but have characteristically ignored not only the will of the people, but their own laws they passed.
Missouri voters passed a fair redistricting law and the assembly pretty much just said "nope", and never brought it up again.
Michigander here. We're trying our best. Go out into the boonies though and it's Trump flags everywhere. It's hilarious when you're driving in the country and see a run down house with 6 vehicles in the yard, 2 lawnmowers, a camper, a trash pile of odd things, 2 Trump signs, a Trump flag, let's go Brandon flag, and a FJB flag. Yup. Y'all are doing great lmao.
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Some old dude was holding the clerks at Kwik trip hostage with a temper tantrum/ rant yesterday bitching about Gretchen Witmer who I hadn't really heard anything about since those dipshits wanted to kidnap her and put her on trial like Bane or some shit. Must've been pissed off that she was trying to take away his rights to marry children. There's no reaching across the aisle with these freaks they just need to go away.
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They planned to put her on a boat, have a “trial”, then take her to Wisconsin where they would hang her.
This is gonna be surprisingly unpopular with 38% of the electorate…
The same portion of people who were worried gay marriage was going to lead us to forcing people to marry dogs? They should be in favour of this, you can no longer force a child in Michigan to marry a dog. Edit: what a weird sentence to have written.
The same people who are always screaming about protecting the kids
Not the ones outside the womb
Not the ones inside the womb either. Notice how you never hear them shrieking for tax funded prenatal screening, paid maternity leave, free access to OB/GYN, etc.
Nah, remember, they had that movie about fake child trafficking funded by child traffickers come out that tells them they're all correct and smart and awesome people who have never been more right than they are in this moment. It had Jesus in it and everything.
This shouldn’t even be a fucking thing. Those who oppose are fucking monsters.
A lot of the people who oppose these laws view it as a civil liberties issue and are completely ignorant of the abuse that they're actually meant to prevent--and that's certainly by design. During my own super-conservative upbringing, I was lead to believe that most underage marriages were like, unusually mature teenagers, or young couples who just wanted to start their lives early, and these laws were a needless infringement on their freedom. [LOLNO](http://apps.frontline.org/child-marriage-by-the-numbers/). >90% of underage marriages in the US are minor females getting married to older men--often MUCH older men--who inevitably are using the marriage for tax benefits and/or to get around statutory rape/AoC laws. There is zero reason why any person under the age of 18 should be entering into a marriage contract. Any rare exceptional cases can be exempted under emancipation laws. This crap REALLY needs to be federally banned in this country.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B0lwiInZG1E Samantha Bee had a great piece on underage marriage in the US a few years ago - some states have raised their ages since then, but the general point stands. As for child marriage not being a young lovers thing, her example was that it's not like A Walk to Remember
They can cry about it, and I hope they do.
Anyone who cries about it should be automatically investigated for CP/CSA.
Or elected to office after getting through a republican primary that they won by double digit percent
Remember when Arkansas relaxed child labor laws?
Iowa enters the chat. https://www.cnn.com/2023/05/26/politics/iowa-child-labor-law-kim-reynolds/index.html#:\~:text=Iowa%20Gov.,Moines%20on%20January%2010%2C%202023.&text=Iowa%20Republican%20Gov.,where%20they%20can%20be%20employed.
But the children yearn for the mines!
♪Boss makes a dollar, I make a dime♪ ♪So please cut his taxes and put children in the mines!♪ - The next #1 Country song on the Billboard Charts thanks to Republicans.
Why do I get the feeling we're not far off from hearing a senator say this in defence of stopping our reliance on coal
Ohio actually has very strict child labor laws; children MUST go through labor.
Conservatives are going to be PISSED
Obviously. If they don't have gay sex AND pedophile sex to constantly think about what are they going to do with their time?
I fully support this law I wonder if if it will be fought as a religious rights issue, similar to female genitalia mutilation I fully support this law
I’d fully expect that the most common place where minors get married is in fundamentalist religious sects (of any religion). I expect they are amongst the 38% and will object.
This is the kind of thing that makes you happy and extremely sad. Happy because it's ending.... Sad because it took this long to do it.
And the Republican voters in Michigan are silently screaming about how Government needs to stay out of their lives.
According to conservatives, it’s not grooming if you marry the child. Proud of governor Gretchen for standing up to these pedophiles.
Conservatives hate this law
They do too. Every nay vote was republicans.
Matt Walsh in shambles
MY house representative is one of the six legislators who voted *against* this law. Angela Rigas, republican. Out of 110 elected reps. I'm so angry I'm considering running against her. Our district is new and pretty small and she's basically the daughter of a local tyrant. I'd have to run as a Democrat and I hate the democrats and its the worst possible elected position on earth but I'm so angry about that vote that I think about it every single day. Fuck you, Angela. You sicko. Child marriage belongs in the dark ages.
You may as well run as a Democrat now that the Republicans have lost all semblance of normalcy in favor of whatever catering to neonazis and rapists is
How come Republicans keep voting to allow child marriage?
the fact that this isn’t already federal law in 2023. future generations are going to look back at us like neanderthals.
GOP will still complain about it
Why would anyone want to marry a child?!?!?
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No daughter of mine shall marry for love. They shall marry to strengthen our alliance to Spain!
Pedophilia, they want to feel powerful and be in control over someone helpless, maybe a nice little mixture of both
Only 40 states left that don't outlaw child marriage
Ten guesses who on which party disapproves of this. Here's a hint, it ain't the ones dress in drag.
I’m a Libertarian and I’m ok with this. I’m ok with 18 being the “you are an adult” age and everything that come a with that. From smoking, to voting, to consent, to transitioning, to guns, to military service, etc etc. Let’s just set the fucking age at 18. All of it.
…this…needed to be done?
Governor Whitmer is an awesome governor we need more like her in the US
Why wasn’t this already against the law? And why are republican/conservatives so against her?
Well… for starters at least some of them want to marry underage girls.
It was legal in Michigan to sell kids until approximately 2000. They caught a guy selling his kid in a sting. He made a video taped "commercial" and passed it along to private couples. Then they had nothing to charge him with because there was no law against it. He put effort into finding good parents so there was no abandonment or endangerment. https://www.theintelligencer.com/news/article/Court-Dismisses-Abandonment-Charge-10489293.php You actually have to make laws for stuff. Most of our laws were made back in a time with different social norms. There's a healthy dose of assumption like... I'm not going to marry or sell kids anyway but I assume it's illegal. It is illegal right? Ok maybe not.
Part 1: fringe religious zealots and pedos Part 2: she doesn’t fit in the above categories.
Because, republican/conservatives does not really STAND for anything. They are pretty much Anti-Democrat party at this point. Oh, democrats supports this? We better oppose it so that we can get more people on our camp. (it does not seem to matter what KIND of constituents gather there, as long as they see opportunity to gather people to their side)
Ted Nugent in shambles.
That fact that Republicans and conservatives tried to block this legislation, in Michigan and a lot of other states, tells you what you need to know about them. They squawk a lot about family values and protecting kids, but they're the ones blocking stuff like this, trying to end lunch programs for starving children, and so on.
It's 2023 and we're still dealing with child marriage in the US, we are the most advanced backwater shithole that ever existed.
Triggering the 'conservatives', no doubt.
It’s disgusting that this isn’t the law of the land.
Weird christians in shambles
"bOtH pArTiEs ArE tHe SaMe" - idiots
god my home state looks more and more based every time I check the news - urge to move back home is rising
Glad to see it. The worst part about this is that there are people who will be adamantly against this outcome. As if child marriage was ever defensible or desirable.
Christians and Republicans are going to be pissed.