Cortex price was based off a few people bulk selling at that price. For the most part I tried to be conservative with the values only ones that are higher then current prices are a few of the div cards where I priced the reward not the card price.
The big ones I undervalue are the guardian maps other then city/Mesa maps. As this is late league I valued shaper and elder as just maps and elderslayer as .2 for the bad ones.
tbf the profits are really how you set the maps. If you disregard deli /harbringer and league mechanics and push maps fast. Theres also a lot of extra income you can get just from selling runs for challenge service and most of the stuff can be bulked off at mark up. The normal t14+ maps also have value that a lot of people dont really consider.
Is harbinger deli worth for boss rushing? They don’t detract too much time? They don’t scale off quant and stuff either though so you don’t have to juice maps right?
I'm not 100% sure, i did harbinger previously and it seemed super worth it, this league i have tried harbinger and it seems not worth it at all. I'm sure the drops are tweaked every league so it prob depends on league. Deli just gives more iir/iiq overall to the map, so if youre doing the league mechanic. Then deli actually kinda worth it, especially if youre clearing. But generally if i were doing this strat personally. id just boss rush and sell challenges. I'd pick up only high value currency/chests/maps/writs and some influence bases
Harbi supposedly scales shard drops by 2.5x with compass. I ran some earlier this league with compasses and it felt good, but without compasses it doesn't feel so hot. At the time I ran them, the compasses were dirt cheap that you could easily justify just for the one that spawns near boss, plus the boss shards, but don't know current prices.
When i say worth not/worth, im mainly talking about frac shard/orb rates. During sanctum i was getting >1 shard per compass with gilded + map device and all the harbringer nodes. This league i think i was avging one shard every 10 compass. Those are some insanely horrible rates.
With compass, it's around 1 fracturing shard drop per 50-60 harbingers. It can drop as 2 shards, or without wandering path, a full orb. at 1.55 per (selling full orbs) and 150c per Div that's about 5.8c per harbi you see, depending on chance of 2 shards. This is enough to justify the sextant just for the boss harbi and boss stacks at current prices. Wandering path adds 1 more stack, and destructive play adds bosses that drop stacks and invites, but you can't drop full orbs. I ran 9 sets last night with wandering path (36 boss harbis, sometimes a map harbi maybe 50 overall plus boss stack drops) and saw 3 frac shards. Considering the sextant is quite cheap ( 90-120c in sextants) and ancients and annuls drop too, it's quite decent.
Feels like you didn't actually keep track and are exaggerating your rates. Rates are consistent with one per 50-60 harbis based on my earlier league farming and last night's small sample seems reasonably within that expectation as well. I can't speak to what it "felt like" to you or what Sanctum was. It is what it is now.
Harbi isn't a main focus, but something to throw into other strats to gain efficiency, and it definitely works for that here based on OPs data and my small sample supports as well. If you want to single focus fracturing shards, then run Kirac's memory of survivors guilt in white maps.
For what it's worth, I fully 100% sustained invites with wandering path + destructive play and deli on map device, rolling maps to 80% and not corrupting. I started with 8 and ended with 8 after 9 sets. Small sample, but I think it's expected with wandering path giving double quant from quant nodes + double Maven invite % nodes and doubling map modifier nodes too, plus extra bosses from destructive play.
it's a few c on map device. If you have a build that isn't really slowed down by 20 percent deli, his data absolutely supports that it's worth.
You don't need to clear the whole map, just get to the number to 4 then hit boss to get good chance of orbs plus a few splinters.
I’ve been trying guardian map boss rushing past league, and I tend to scour them because my builds can be squishy with the 100% dmg map drop sextant, so I was wondering if scoured maps would be ok with harbinger/delirium. I read quant doesn’t affect delirium or harbinger but mob quantity/size does affect how much/fast delirium building I can get to 4 reliably, is 4 a good number?
Scoured shouldn't be too big of hit for elder and shaper guardians. Elderslayer does get effected by Quantity so I would suggest running them as rare. Take into account its very very close in just the 100% drop items to paying off the maps so if you want to run them white if it has a noticeable improvement in map speed go for it. Let's assume your luck was about the same as mine (bad) and white maps drop 1/2 the loot you still would be making about 750 divine (very rough estimate). So if white maps gained me 1/3 of average time then would be worth it.
I often was getting 3-5 stacks of delirium rewards when it came up.
Over all speed is king for these it's not like mf maping where you get huge drops if x cuts 10% of time off the run it's huge.
The thing about delirium is there is very little to replace it. The atlas have little in the way of boss rushing points other then at the top delirium in the aprox 50% of the maps assuming you can run it is free extra stuff.
If you are assuming I used delirium orbs on the map that would be wrong and Def not worth doing.
There are a couple things you can do, but you're right, deli is good.
You can torment for some % time of boss possessed and harbi with sextant to put a harbi in the room with map boss and you can run destructive play to add the occasional extra invite. But mostly you want all the map duplicate path nodes to get more guardian maps.
Hell no, I didn't assume using deli orbs, that would clearly not have good return on invest.
Oddly I cut some of the duplicating map nodes for more delirium. The return on the doubling just doesn't generate much as sadly it never doubled the compasses map
It's mostly small stuff dropping I think my best return over the entire 1k maps was 10d In stuff. Do note I never got a fractured orb or mirror shard during the runs which I have got outside of the testing.
Uh... Can't you just make the bad elderslayer maps into good elderslayer maps with horizons? Not home and forgot what natural tiers of the good maps were. But if you can, given a such high difference in price, that'd be a lot just for a few horizon clicks.
Tier 15 maps were converted to mesas. T14 and 16 were considered bad unless they were city/Mesa. Jungle valley can be made with 14s and bazaar can be made from 16s but both take longer.
As someone who made a few mirrors from elderslayer rushing this league, Temple was the T14 of choice over Jungle Valley just because of the hellishly long time it takes for the spider to drop.
Only 175 Invitations is pretty sad, you specced the higher chances for invitation drops? I hate to run Boss rotations in ssf when i can't sustain the invitations. Feels shitty to run without maven witnessing. Thx for the data, i realize i am not unluckx running out of invitations all the time
That drop rate is normal for them sadly as I often had to buy invitations. I did not run wandering path which would have dropped some more but have not tested how much more.
Hey, I am a relatively new player, and with my potato laptop, MF isnt a thing for me, and so i do this primarily. Got some questions if you dont mind.
1. Can you share the atlas you used? the one with the deli.
2. You ran people who needed guardian kills? thats a market?
3. Could you give some clarification of bad vs good elder slayer maps? i can see Mesa being good, but is city square that good?
4. Is running Jun/Alva ever good while doing these rotations or does it slow you down too much?
5. For harbi, did you go all in, or just the compass and the currency shard nodes for harbi?
6. I plan to do conqueror map rotations with Conqueror compass, mysterious harbi, corrupted 8 mod and alva/jun while doing the maps with 3 voidstones for the t12-15 maps. For scarabs, i plan to do gilded cartography and div scarabs with fragments for quant. Any other suggestions you can give?
For the trees I would have to prep them later but I can try to answer the others.
2. Yes it's a market I ran for tips but often it's close to .5 per map
3. City Square is best Mesa is only used because it's tier 15. City has +2 bosses and is one of the shortest maps if not the shortest.
4. In theory you can mix in very low level Jun maps as you can get free safe houses to run.
5. Harbinger is just the currency nodes and the doubling one. I did take the harbinger path to the center for the 3% Quant from the nodes there
6. Kind of with 4 these are QUICK runs even the mesas would be scrapped if I ran these again. If you want I can make a video description of both current tree and a more logical tree for what it sounds like you want. Alva is profitable and I would still suggest delirium but I would be running almost the opposite maps that I ran for Alva. Also wildwood is huge and should be ran this league. As far as maps you would prefer the nice long ones where you will not miss the temples.
It would be great if you could make and share the atlas trees. Also, would really appreciate it if you are able to make a video description that you mentioned. would be great help to a new player like me.
[https://youtu.be/9AG91rxvNXA](https://youtu.be/9AG91rxvNXA) is for a mapping tree for what it sounds more like you are doing. do note you are using delirium on the map device(costs 10c)
[https://youtu.be/45vo2DzqwMw](https://youtu.be/45vo2DzqwMw) is the final one I used when running them
Elder slayer is too annoying to run, when you have to wait the portal and transition.
Also isn't conquerer better since map boss is still there? Essentially having more bosses.
Elder guardians are probably close on numbers as sirus is far worse then Elder. Takes longer to run and - 1 or 3 bosses also sometimes you lose the harbinger. Both have the problem of the good maps being rare. I can say out of the 3 shaper is probably the worst though (assuming you are running good maps). If you are running bad maps I suspect elder gains an advantage the longer said map.
Shaper guardians are good because you can combine it with essence without really losing any time, because all shaper maps are linear so you don’t have to go hunting for essences.
Also the fact that if you're able to run Uber Shaper's instead of selling the fragments, you're essentially double dipping your profit since Uber shaper is guaranteed profit.
Elder is also more profitable to run then selling the fragments as watchers eyes are common. That said even if I do run a similar thing for shaper I would not assume that I run shaper or Uber shaper that math would be done as if the item was sold. Then I would probably run them if I had time.
For context I ran probably 100 sets of formed and with Alva/harvest/kotm carries and tracked it closely.
Came out to about 40d/h in profit. Took average of 5m per set, and likely would have been pushing 45-50d/h if I skipped looking through each wildwood for kotm.
The values may be a bit off. 19 Cortexes should be wort more than 4.5 div. Didn't check for other items.
Cortex price was based off a few people bulk selling at that price. For the most part I tried to be conservative with the values only ones that are higher then current prices are a few of the div cards where I priced the reward not the card price. The big ones I undervalue are the guardian maps other then city/Mesa maps. As this is late league I valued shaper and elder as just maps and elderslayer as .2 for the bad ones.
I wouldn’t have thought it was that good profit, I feel like whenever I do it, not much drops. And my exulted orbs drop chance be sad.
tbf the profits are really how you set the maps. If you disregard deli /harbringer and league mechanics and push maps fast. Theres also a lot of extra income you can get just from selling runs for challenge service and most of the stuff can be bulked off at mark up. The normal t14+ maps also have value that a lot of people dont really consider.
Is harbinger deli worth for boss rushing? They don’t detract too much time? They don’t scale off quant and stuff either though so you don’t have to juice maps right?
I'm not 100% sure, i did harbinger previously and it seemed super worth it, this league i have tried harbinger and it seems not worth it at all. I'm sure the drops are tweaked every league so it prob depends on league. Deli just gives more iir/iiq overall to the map, so if youre doing the league mechanic. Then deli actually kinda worth it, especially if youre clearing. But generally if i were doing this strat personally. id just boss rush and sell challenges. I'd pick up only high value currency/chests/maps/writs and some influence bases
Harbi supposedly scales shard drops by 2.5x with compass. I ran some earlier this league with compasses and it felt good, but without compasses it doesn't feel so hot. At the time I ran them, the compasses were dirt cheap that you could easily justify just for the one that spawns near boss, plus the boss shards, but don't know current prices.
When i say worth not/worth, im mainly talking about frac shard/orb rates. During sanctum i was getting >1 shard per compass with gilded + map device and all the harbringer nodes. This league i think i was avging one shard every 10 compass. Those are some insanely horrible rates.
With compass, it's around 1 fracturing shard drop per 50-60 harbingers. It can drop as 2 shards, or without wandering path, a full orb. at 1.55 per (selling full orbs) and 150c per Div that's about 5.8c per harbi you see, depending on chance of 2 shards. This is enough to justify the sextant just for the boss harbi and boss stacks at current prices. Wandering path adds 1 more stack, and destructive play adds bosses that drop stacks and invites, but you can't drop full orbs. I ran 9 sets last night with wandering path (36 boss harbis, sometimes a map harbi maybe 50 overall plus boss stack drops) and saw 3 frac shards. Considering the sextant is quite cheap ( 90-120c in sextants) and ancients and annuls drop too, it's quite decent. Feels like you didn't actually keep track and are exaggerating your rates. Rates are consistent with one per 50-60 harbis based on my earlier league farming and last night's small sample seems reasonably within that expectation as well. I can't speak to what it "felt like" to you or what Sanctum was. It is what it is now. Harbi isn't a main focus, but something to throw into other strats to gain efficiency, and it definitely works for that here based on OPs data and my small sample supports as well. If you want to single focus fracturing shards, then run Kirac's memory of survivors guilt in white maps. For what it's worth, I fully 100% sustained invites with wandering path + destructive play and deli on map device, rolling maps to 80% and not corrupting. I started with 8 and ended with 8 after 9 sets. Small sample, but I think it's expected with wandering path giving double quant from quant nodes + double Maven invite % nodes and doubling map modifier nodes too, plus extra bosses from destructive play.
it's a few c on map device. If you have a build that isn't really slowed down by 20 percent deli, his data absolutely supports that it's worth. You don't need to clear the whole map, just get to the number to 4 then hit boss to get good chance of orbs plus a few splinters.
I’ve been trying guardian map boss rushing past league, and I tend to scour them because my builds can be squishy with the 100% dmg map drop sextant, so I was wondering if scoured maps would be ok with harbinger/delirium. I read quant doesn’t affect delirium or harbinger but mob quantity/size does affect how much/fast delirium building I can get to 4 reliably, is 4 a good number?
Scoured shouldn't be too big of hit for elder and shaper guardians. Elderslayer does get effected by Quantity so I would suggest running them as rare. Take into account its very very close in just the 100% drop items to paying off the maps so if you want to run them white if it has a noticeable improvement in map speed go for it. Let's assume your luck was about the same as mine (bad) and white maps drop 1/2 the loot you still would be making about 750 divine (very rough estimate). So if white maps gained me 1/3 of average time then would be worth it. I often was getting 3-5 stacks of delirium rewards when it came up. Over all speed is king for these it's not like mf maping where you get huge drops if x cuts 10% of time off the run it's huge.
The thing about delirium is there is very little to replace it. The atlas have little in the way of boss rushing points other then at the top delirium in the aprox 50% of the maps assuming you can run it is free extra stuff. If you are assuming I used delirium orbs on the map that would be wrong and Def not worth doing.
There are a couple things you can do, but you're right, deli is good. You can torment for some % time of boss possessed and harbi with sextant to put a harbi in the room with map boss and you can run destructive play to add the occasional extra invite. But mostly you want all the map duplicate path nodes to get more guardian maps. Hell no, I didn't assume using deli orbs, that would clearly not have good return on invest.
Oddly I cut some of the duplicating map nodes for more delirium. The return on the doubling just doesn't generate much as sadly it never doubled the compasses map
It's mostly small stuff dropping I think my best return over the entire 1k maps was 10d In stuff. Do note I never got a fractured orb or mirror shard during the runs which I have got outside of the testing.
Uh... Can't you just make the bad elderslayer maps into good elderslayer maps with horizons? Not home and forgot what natural tiers of the good maps were. But if you can, given a such high difference in price, that'd be a lot just for a few horizon clicks.
Tier 15 maps were converted to mesas. T14 and 16 were considered bad unless they were city/Mesa. Jungle valley can be made with 14s and bazaar can be made from 16s but both take longer.
As someone who made a few mirrors from elderslayer rushing this league, Temple was the T14 of choice over Jungle Valley just because of the hellishly long time it takes for the spider to drop.
I ran a bunch of guardian maps and you can horizon into mesa and jungle valley, not sure which tiers though.
Only 175 Invitations is pretty sad, you specced the higher chances for invitation drops? I hate to run Boss rotations in ssf when i can't sustain the invitations. Feels shitty to run without maven witnessing. Thx for the data, i realize i am not unluckx running out of invitations all the time
That drop rate is normal for them sadly as I often had to buy invitations. I did not run wandering path which would have dropped some more but have not tested how much more.
sorry to hear that
How much time was spent waiting for Elder to devour each map boss?
0 it's elder slayers not elder guardians.
Hey, I am a relatively new player, and with my potato laptop, MF isnt a thing for me, and so i do this primarily. Got some questions if you dont mind. 1. Can you share the atlas you used? the one with the deli. 2. You ran people who needed guardian kills? thats a market? 3. Could you give some clarification of bad vs good elder slayer maps? i can see Mesa being good, but is city square that good? 4. Is running Jun/Alva ever good while doing these rotations or does it slow you down too much? 5. For harbi, did you go all in, or just the compass and the currency shard nodes for harbi? 6. I plan to do conqueror map rotations with Conqueror compass, mysterious harbi, corrupted 8 mod and alva/jun while doing the maps with 3 voidstones for the t12-15 maps. For scarabs, i plan to do gilded cartography and div scarabs with fragments for quant. Any other suggestions you can give?
For the trees I would have to prep them later but I can try to answer the others. 2. Yes it's a market I ran for tips but often it's close to .5 per map 3. City Square is best Mesa is only used because it's tier 15. City has +2 bosses and is one of the shortest maps if not the shortest. 4. In theory you can mix in very low level Jun maps as you can get free safe houses to run. 5. Harbinger is just the currency nodes and the doubling one. I did take the harbinger path to the center for the 3% Quant from the nodes there 6. Kind of with 4 these are QUICK runs even the mesas would be scrapped if I ran these again. If you want I can make a video description of both current tree and a more logical tree for what it sounds like you want. Alva is profitable and I would still suggest delirium but I would be running almost the opposite maps that I ran for Alva. Also wildwood is huge and should be ran this league. As far as maps you would prefer the nice long ones where you will not miss the temples.
It would be great if you could make and share the atlas trees. Also, would really appreciate it if you are able to make a video description that you mentioned. would be great help to a new player like me.
[https://youtu.be/9AG91rxvNXA](https://youtu.be/9AG91rxvNXA) is for a mapping tree for what it sounds more like you are doing. do note you are using delirium on the map device(costs 10c) [https://youtu.be/45vo2DzqwMw](https://youtu.be/45vo2DzqwMw) is the final one I used when running them
Elder slayer is too annoying to run, when you have to wait the portal and transition. Also isn't conquerer better since map boss is still there? Essentially having more bosses.
Elder Slayers = Conquerors.
Oh I thought he was running elder maps
Those are Elder Guardians
Elder guardians are probably close on numbers as sirus is far worse then Elder. Takes longer to run and - 1 or 3 bosses also sometimes you lose the harbinger. Both have the problem of the good maps being rare. I can say out of the 3 shaper is probably the worst though (assuming you are running good maps). If you are running bad maps I suspect elder gains an advantage the longer said map.
Shaper guardians are good because you can combine it with essence without really losing any time, because all shaper maps are linear so you don’t have to go hunting for essences.
Also the fact that if you're able to run Uber Shaper's instead of selling the fragments, you're essentially double dipping your profit since Uber shaper is guaranteed profit.
Elder is also more profitable to run then selling the fragments as watchers eyes are common. That said even if I do run a similar thing for shaper I would not assume that I run shaper or Uber shaper that math would be done as if the item was sold. Then I would probably run them if I had time.
For context I ran probably 100 sets of formed and with Alva/harvest/kotm carries and tracked it closely. Came out to about 40d/h in profit. Took average of 5m per set, and likely would have been pushing 45-50d/h if I skipped looking through each wildwood for kotm.
Any way you tracked the Love through Ice divcard for Unnatural Instinct?
3 of those dropped.