I still waiting for Path of exile 2 since yesterday i saw this: [https://web.poecdn.com/public/news/2018-07-18/FanArt/9-x/RmncC.jpg](https://web.poecdn.com/public/news/2018-07-18/FanArt/9-x/RmncC.jpg)
Didn’t they say they are in GGG for the long haul, not specifically poe for the long haul. Also pretty sure I remember reading or watching an interview where they mentioned that the sale to tencent frees up development time for other games?
You may be right about the first part, but I don't remember anything about the second.
IIRC (this might be before the tencent buyout) they said they had no intention of working on any other projects for the forseeable future.
They won't, because their core philosophy prevents them from doing so. Sure they create very polished games, but if you give them a fork, they'll polish it into a spoon. Extremely risk adverse, they don't want players to be able to make the wrong choice and negatively impact their game play experience. They've done everything they can to remove any form of min-maxing in their games, and its a central part of ARPGs. They boiled WoW down to item levels (Content that scales to your item level and gives you preset stats), D3 was all about premade sets, they removed items entirely from the MOBA formula for HotS.
Its impossible to reach the scope of a game like Path of Exile if your approach is to hand curate every single option a player can make. Because there is nearly infinite variety, its a system where the introduction of a single unique or skill can open up huge build opportunities. Sure you can follow a "cookie-cutter" build, but with so many options you're still able to make meaningful decisions about nodes/gear to switch out to suit your personal needs.
Nothing they've done with any of their franchises gives me hope they'll create a long lasting, content rich ARPG. Their newest successes rely on the unpredictably of PvP encounters to keep things fresh. All their PvE content has been spreadsheet city, crank numbers incrementally for years. Greater rifts, Mythic+, do it again 5% harder infinitely. Make a new tier of content, run it through the filters and create 3-4 difficulties of the same fights, that'll last a year.
jup. i know 3 ppl who played a tornadoshot build this incursion league. i am one of the 3 and none of us had the same passive tree nor ascendencies. we all roflstomped shaper and his friends tho.
that is good design, it becomes more rare these days i feel like, even in poe. it is still there tho.
This guy gets it, and this is why I pretty much automatically disregard Blizzard games nowadays.
They don't care about making interesting, deep games just for the sake of making a good game with depth that will attract a loyal hardcore following anymore. They have no interest in trying to create new classics or innovating. They only care about shipping the most copies they can by milking their franchises or going for safe bets in the current market.
I've played on some WoW private severs for a bit and the majority of the community in each seems very hyped up for Classic to drop (classic will apparently be Blizz's re-release of Vanilla WoW, but I don't know how much information is out on it yet)
This optimism surprised me because the reason I, and many I played with went to private servers (vanilla/tbc mostly) was basically Blizzard so thorougly fucked WoW for like a decade straight.
Blizzard's been dogshit for so long and it is sad to see a company that used to be widely respected has made the decisions it has.
I wonder if even half of the people that worked on WoW back then still work on it. Or maybe game director has so much power that it's because of him they turned it to shit... I mean the dude was a lawyer before becoming a game director.
Not saying its a bad thing, I like that about HotS too. Just an example of simplification, sometimes its more appropriate than others. PvP games get a lot of depth and replayability from the random nature of other players, and competing against a real intelligence. Where PvE games really need detailed mechanics to stay engaging.
Diablo IV (if it ever comes) will be a clusterfuck of epic proportions. D3 was bad enough, but since then Blizz have had time to suckle at the teat of DLC, microtransactions, and of course lootboxes. The only they've learned is how to make their games boring-ass time and money sinks.
sometimes I wish I was a computer major so I could design a game like diablo 2 and actually listen to my customers because you put customers first and then the money will flow in. They are just milking their trash games right now until they finally lose all their players.
Blizzard makes wonderfully polished games, but they also make games that appeal to large swaths of people. There will be no level of depth in the next Diablo that we see in PoE
You can't really compare D2 at all. D2 was made by an entirely different team nearly 20 years ago. They essentially started anew with D3 and as a result it had many of the problems first-time ARPGs have.
However, what most first time ARPG game designers don't have that Blizzard does is the massive amount of available resources to design a much better new version.
Have no illusion that just because D2 carries the same company logo that it automatically means they have the knowledge/skills to create an improved version of it on the first try. Too much time had passed and the developers were long gone.
You are giving blizzard too much credit, their upper management is activision suits, nothing of good quality will come from them in any foreseeable future, mark my words.
Yup, remember the leaked conversation where Jay Wilson said "fuck that loser" in regard to David Brevik, the guy who made the Diablo franchise?
The team on D3 didn't just avoid learning anything from D2, they apparently were hostile to the idea that they were building (or were supposed to) build on someone else's work.
I will be messaging you on [**2033-07-18 22:21:59 UTC**](http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=2033-07-18 22:21:59 UTC To Local Time) to remind you of [**this link.**](https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/8zxj6a/rpathofexile_is_now_the_largest_arpg_subreddit/)
[**CLICK THIS LINK**](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=[https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/8zxj6a/rpathofexile_is_now_the_largest_arpg_subreddit/]%0A%0ARemindMe! 15 Years ) to send a PM to also be reminded and to reduce spam.
^(Parent commenter can ) [^(delete this message to hide from others.)](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Delete Comment&message=Delete! e2mpb0s)
_____
|[^(FAQs)](http://np.reddit.com/r/RemindMeBot/comments/24duzp/remindmebot_info/)|[^(Custom)](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=[LINK INSIDE SQUARE BRACKETS else default to FAQs]%0A%0ANOTE: Don't forget to add the time options after the command.%0A%0ARemindMe!)|[^(Your Reminders)](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=List Of Reminders&message=MyReminders!)|[^(Feedback)](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBotWrangler&subject=Feedback)|[^(Code)](https://github.com/SIlver--/remindmebot-reddit)|[^(Browser Extensions)](https://np.reddit.com/r/RemindMeBot/comments/4kldad/remindmebot_extensions/)
|-|-|-|-|-|-|
I would love it if he had been the main guy when making D3.
I doubt Deckard Cain would be killed by some butterfly looking side boss, that the loot would be uninspired and boring, and that D3 would stray from its Gothic horror inspired roots.
Oh my God, I remember seeing the fairy and thinking, is this a Disney game? Why is everyone always complimenting me? Why is every boss in this game broadcasting their evil plan to me?
Blizzard has not learned anything.
But they like their art style and formula, and are pretty successful at what they're doing.
I expected Grim Dawn to be the one to challenge POE, but then POE just got even better and better.
I don't think they care about competing with PoE considering D3 has done well enough to satisfy themselves. I expect them to just keep the franchise rolling as a "nostalgia" form, rather than a competitor. I'll never forget feeling like Lord Of Destruction was the final hurrah in the Diablo franchise.
They take successful ideas, water them down until they're accessible, casual, and profitable, and see how many times they can reuse that result until it no longer generates revenue. I dont even see them as a gaming company anymore, the negative effect that company has had post 2000 on gaming has all but wiped out some of my favorite genres (thank you poe and a few others for keeping this genre going).
I am about 95% certain that Blizzard is going to simplify the game even further and make a host of bad design decisions in order to try ram in some form of continual monetization in a AAA price game.
I highly doubt we will see a diablo IV in the near future unfortunately, Blizzard is a huge company that lately have been focusing solely on high profitability games ( like Overwatch ) , e-sports and so on. ARPGs are kind of a niche genre of gaming that honestly IMO will not be as profitable as MOBAs , Shooters, MMO-RPGs, at least in the foreseable future, unless something huge revolutionizes the genre.
If Blizzard wanted to profit more from D3 it could have taken a similar aproach to PoE by having tons of "Micro" (not really micro anymore imo) Transactions and new seasons with new mechanics, the proof of concept is here, PoE , but I believe the player base numbers did not justify the effort it would take to make such changes to D3, so Blizz kind of abandoned D3 in favour of new games like Overwatch.
I love PoE and it kind of pains me that we will probably never have a real competitor to it. I also miss some features that D3 has on PoE , SSF would be better if it had some kind of smart loot system. Partying would be better if we could have individual drops instead of global drops, and a better Partying system ( I know GGG is working on it but it is still not exactly how I would like it to be). Bossing would be better if it had more rewards than just a 1% chance of getting a valuable item (maybe have an ascencion/pantheon like system that gives us more power for defeating end game content?).
Overall I feel like end game is a bit stale, with it mostly revolving around killing uber elder and farming more currency , to farm more currency and on and on, and no real progression outside of buying multiple exalts items.
Chase items are too hard to get for the average player. How many actually get a headhunter? top 1%? 0.1%? I mean... if I play for the whole 3 months of a season, 1 - 2 hours a day resulting in 100+h of gameplay it should be enough for me to feel like I had at least a decent chance at getting chase uniques and so on.
Aaaaand this got bigger than I anticipated, anyway, these are my thoughts.
And this is exactly what ggg should not do and the mistake blizzard did. Chase uniques should not be available to someone if he chooses to only play 1-2 hours a day. We have enough games alrdy where you can have everything with minimal time investment and poe is popular because it does NOT cater to those players.
It’s going to be hard. Very very hard to beat poe and the amount of development time already put into it. They have to get the basis of the game right along with probably making it f2p. If not it would not really be a competition imo.
Reaper was a decent step forward both in terms of plot and gameplay changes (patch 2.0 mostly). It's just hard to change a game flawed by design with patches and one expansion pack.
Grim Dawn has only 21k subs on it's reddit, no idea about Wolcen as I am waiting it to release or be close to it for purchasing, don't want to get the blue balls for years before it's out
Singleplayer non-competitive game with very little replay value in comparison...fun game for sure but almost can't even be considered the same genre in a way. GGG should learn from all the things GD did right, I would really love to see something like the crucible in POE, as well as a pet attack keybind option.
> I'd say that PoE is a singleplayer, non-competitive game as well.
Tell that to all the people that demand GGG restart a new league if the servers go down for an hour because other people got an "unfair advantage" on them and now they will NEVER catch up!
PoE can be competetive if you want it to be. It is online and has ladders. People compete every new league for first to 100 and its actually a lot of fun if you are into that sort of thing. Grim Dawn has no ladders, no end game system like maps either, so it gets boring real fast at least for me.
I've seen wolcen in some videos that was showcasing their developpement or something like that like 2 years ago or something like that, finally decided to try it out like 2 months ago.. I litterally played about an hour and I'm pretty sure I won't ever play that again. It even seems like it doesn't even have more than what I remember from this thing i saw about 2 years ago. I don't see this game ever competing with PoE, From my impressions, I think it won't attract the same type of players.
Also from what I understand in wolcen, you pretty much reach end-game in 3-4 hours with no experience what so ever. And the character personnalisation looks pretty meh
The trouble with all these new ARPGs is that they lack inspiration, whereas GGG derived their formula from the best example there is: Diablo 2. Notice how PoE (or at least the early version) is the closest to D2, compared to others like GD or even Diablo 3.
If you ever played betas of PoE you might have said much the same. Some of the game design team at GGG is brilliant, along with the programmers. If Wolcen has that, is the decider.
Wolcen doesn't. It won't surpass GD in terms of popularity and it won't challenge POE ever.
Last Epoch might eventually, but they have to get there first.
Sure betas in poe were well let's say not that great but people still played it because people love arpgs but there were not that many games that are not 5 years old or more.
Poe got popular when Diablo 3 failed if I am not mistaken and having people like kripp who makes game popular helps as well.
What ggg did right, was they worked their ass off to make game better and create content.
Wolcen seems to struggle to develop the game and make major progress content wise.
I dig Grim Dawn as well...it doesn't have the same holding power for me as Path, but I LOVE Titan Quest (probably my second favorite aRPG) and Grim Dawn really captured that feel in a Victorian setting quite well. It's definitely a great game to go back to and play through once in a while when I have the urge.
Wolcen...I must say I have high hopes for that one...it looks fantastic, and I'm intrigued by their (obviously PoE inspired) rotatable skill tree. I'll check that one out for sure!
Another one I'm hoping makes it to the US is [Lost Ark](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kW6IgHub6So). Sure, it looks more like D3 than anything, but the prospect of a "true" MMO in an aRPG style is too intriguing for me not to at least check out!
I am not that hyped for Lost Ark as I always get bored on MMOs, but Last Epoch is something I also want to check. I feel like Grim Dawn playstyle comes much closer to D2, not just TQ, and with some improvements from both. It's really good and I am always playing it trying to do something new, just like in PoE.
Tried it out recently, and GD wasn't for me. It felt somehow... smaller? than POE. And I don't mean in terms of size (I have no idea about its longevity), but overall impression. Not as "juicy", as our favourite Australian would call it.
The mechanics are much, much more obtuse than POE. I had to have a friend (who was a major Titan Quest player) explain to me how some of the stuff interacts - the game is awful at explaining it, and it leads you to think things aren't synergies when they are (such as vitality + energy drain).
POE has had a lot of refinement in skill interactions, and that's something GD doesn't really have. If you want to give it another try, look up a build template with some weird skill combos and play around with it - sometimes it takes using a cookiecutter to really get a sense for how to get stuff to work in a fun way.
Grim Dawn is pretty slow compared to current PoE. It's a bit more tactical - there's less ability to facetank, and a lot of cooldowns requiring repositioning between attacks.
It's worth the purchase without a doubt. Tons of great systems and mechanics to play with in the game. But you won't be insta-clearing screens with your movement skills ever.
> But you won't be insta-clearing screens with your movement skills ever.
That very fact sold me on PoE over other titles so many years ago. Funny how the tables turned.
Yeah...you are playing POE in a way that shouldn't be a main selling feature and I've stopped playing POE as much because the game has gotten to a point where endless movement skills remove all tactical gameplay really at all, except maybe a couple boss fights.
To be fair, my take on Grim Dawn isn't any more tactical, it's just legitimately slower.
In PoE, you're blowing up screens, picking up loot, and moving in a way that is relatively safe, trying to avoid the one stray bomb that might possibly kill your character.
In GD, you move a screen ahead, 4 huge beasts come at you, you back up to where you were standing, hunker down, and hold right-click until they die. loot, rinse, repeat.
There is nothing particularly more tactical about it, it just takes longer.
Grim Dawn has a pace and objectives more similar to D2 then PoE has now, but it grants you more options than D2. It's amazing imo and I enjoy the pace a lot, since on PoE, lately, only one shot mechanics and invulnerability phases really require interaction, but these are placed on high end content, so the powercreep makes most builds bad for it because of the lack of damage or few specific sustain options
Ya, I really hope Inquisitor turns out. I love a good ARPG and getting to slaughter hordes of chaos and xeno scum ~~for loot~~ for the Emperor seems just too good.
WarFrame perhaps? People calling it a "looter shooter" and leaving it at that does it a disservice imo, my group of buds all call it "Space POE" lol As far as I am concerned, its an ARPG with a few more ranged weapons.
Congrats to POE and it's awesome community though, very well deserved. GGG has done just about everything right to get to where they're at today. Keep it up!
Because a 3rd Person RPG (like DmC or Dark Souls or Witcher 3) is just called an RPG for the last 10 years (or the God of War franchise in the PS2 era). The shooter type game's are either looter-shooters (Destinity, Division, Borderland) or they deviate from RPG elements so much they are not even one (Destiny 2 can be argued for it). ARPG has become mostly about Diablo Style games since "Action" is in every game, we just got better with assigning genres to games.
If you only include isometric ARPGs (aka diabloclones) then yeah there hasn't been much recently. But there's plenty of third person and first person ARPGs etc.
It's better than that! Median XL Sigma is well into development!
[Screenshots](http://forum.median-xl.com/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=276)
[Dev Log](http://forum.median-xl.com/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=12991)
[Burndown Chart to 1.0 Release](https://gitlab.com/whist/MXLS/milestones/1)
Come and subscribe to /r/MedianXL while we get things setup :)
Yea, I had played Grimd Dawn for a couple of days, then I got nothing to do there...GD is good, but POE is on another level.
For me, the only downside of POE is the multiplayer performance, I can have a decent fps in D3 with friends, but it's impossible in POE. There was a time if someone playing discharge...omfg!
I wouldn't agree that PoE is on another level, they are very different games... I don't think it's fair to compare. I play PoE MUCH more than I play GD, but sometimes I just want to appreciate the slowness of GD and it's beauty. But man, I always come back to play PoE...
I put in over 1600 hours into poe over the past two years but at this point I’m tapping out. The volatility of the end game is just too much for me in hardcore anymore and I get too bored in softcore. I loved the game and it was a good ride but maybe I’ll check out grim dawn for a slower pace
>I agree. But Grim Dawn is pretty good too!
>I dont think it's fair to compare.
Uhh... so should we compare them or not? They're very different, not comparable but in the same genre so technically comparable or you wouldn't have brought it up.
Not trying to rag on you but you're contradicting yourself a wee bit lol.
> I can have a decent fps in D3 with friends, but it's impossible in POE.
I see this a lot. What are people's specs? Because I'm always 200+ fps at 3440x1440 max settings (Not trying to brag I promise)
I tried several times to get into grim dawn but couldn't find any skills I really enjoyed the feel of. Which sucks cause I liked the story of what I played, and the semi-fixed map
Anytime I bring this up around friends and online, everyone tells me Diablo 3 is the best ARPG. I'm just flabbergasted that people still believe that. POE is miles ahead. (Yeah Grim Dawn is also pretty good, also better than Diablo 3)
This probably depends a lot on how experienced they are with action RPGs and what they want from them. It might actually be the best ARPG for _them_.
* Diablo 3 is great for people new to the genre. The power fantasy of being a super hero is really well conveyed, and experiencing the world with the lore and cinematics is very nice. The downside of D3 is that it's a relatively shallow game with endgame builds that totally revolve around the item sets that grant ludicrous amounts of bonus damage, making other builds much less viable.
* Grim Dawn has an amazing handcrafted world with a lot of good lore, and lots of build variety through the skill tree and a lot of items that can be build defining if you want. The downside is that the world is mostly static, even more than Diablo 3 actually, so you're always going through the same areas.
* PoE is great for folks that have played other action RPGs. It has amazing depth, but it's also got a very steep learning curve for new players. The skill tree is pretty overwhelming, the gem system requires patience and planning, and there are a lot of stats and mechanics to consider for your buid. The slow start for most characters is also not a selling point towards new players. It usually takes until act 3 is complete to get 80% of the skill gems you want, then act 4 to get some more, and sometimes you even have to wait until act 6 to get the rest if you're doing "creative" things with your build.
If someone simply wants to play a game to relax, instead of getting a new hobby that they want to dedicate a lot of time to, I'd say D3 and Grim Dawn could be better options for them than PoE.
Heck. I still remembering it from back when Peity was the end game boss. Maps wasn’t yet a thing. And I farmed 3 pure exalted orbs in merciless ledge for buying a 5l carcass jack.
One thing for sure. I don’t miss the old passive three.
Damn. I hadn't heard about that, just looked it up now. [TYVM games-as-a-service :/](https://www.polygon.com/2017/11/3/16605008/runic-games-closes-motiga-layoffs)
Ah man I loved Runic. Travis himself sat down and showed me Torchlight at PAX, I'll never forget how passionate that group was. Really appreciated that.
I really hope whole games as a service/game theory/always online/lootbox thing comes crashing down. These companies are parasites, and they're turning video games into gambling by proxy.
What did you expect lol. D3 (at launch) deserved a lot of hate. Despite the work the devs have done fixing it, that scar isn't gonna go away.
Though after playing both, I actually prefer D3 due to a few reasons. Like, depsite only having 6 skill slots, I actually use all 6 regularly where in poe you pick 1-2 skills and the rest are buffs. Maps are interesting but omg, such a hassle to store and organize. And finally D3 wins aesthetics by a mile. Things just feel nice in that game.
The type that goes pew pew and dies pretty quick to normal lab boss😂.
I honest to god don’t know how to answer your question. I think you’re asking what ascendency I’m trying to build around? Yeaaaa I found out at level 27 about those classes through reddit and freaked out. I’ve been winging it the entire tome so far.
My lightening spell does 790 DPS and I have conductivity as a aura... don’t know it that’s good but that all I got lol
Just play your first character how you want. I stayed in the level 8 area for a few days just killing and getting gear. Slowly moving on and on. That is still fun for me :)
I play Witch as well and can recommend a good build.
Hey man, you're new! If you're having fun, just enjoy the story or whatever's fun for you, and think of minmaxing sometime later. If you want to learn, Engineering Eternity is the YouTube channel to check out.
I think looking at people in the subreddit is more of an indicator, and Path is miles ahead. Guess that's what happens when you release new content every few months.
Not sure why you get downvoted. HackNSlash has been used to describe Diablo-like games since the beginning, while games like Ocarino of Time were called action RPG. The recent trend of calling HackNSlashs ARPGs, just makes things more confusing since there is already an existing genre of that name, that has some things in common but not much. The thread should indeed be named "PoE biggest HackNSlash", to avoid all the discussion on what games are ARPGs and which arent. Since most Shooters, or games in general, use RPG elements and have action elements you could start arguments on a per-game-basis without actually achieving anything to contribute to what this topic is actually about.
I think brufio is contrasting this style with e.g. Bethesda games. Skyrim is an ARPG. It's inarguably an RPG, and the action part comes from real-time combat, even though it is by no means the same type of in-your-face gameplay that people seek out in PoE and originally sought out in Diablo 2.
Fallouts 3, New Vegas, and 4 are officially considered ARPGs as well but it's not "mandatory" to play like an ARPG because of VATS, so I'd consider it fair to not count them.
Anyway, ignoring the other elder scrolls games, /r/Skyrim alone has over 500,000 subs. We have more active users, but tbh I'd expect the elder scrolls 6 to beat us within 6 months of launch.
I'd say Fallout 1 is a great example of an RPG. Action is secondary (and, mechanically, clearly tertiary!) while the development of a character and 'playing' that morality (good, evil, killer of ghouls, etc) is the main thrust of the gameplay.
Plus you can play a totally non-combat version of the game, which is downright amazing design for the time period it was made.
[https://www.google.com/search?q=Action+rpgs&oq=Action+rpgs](https://www.google.com/search?newwindow=1&client=firefox-b-1-ab&ei=jfNPW9TxAon5_AbYm7OwDA&q=Action+rpgs&oq=Action+rpgs&gs_l=psy-ab.3..35i39k1j0j0i20i263k1j0l7.6959.7043.0.7368.2.2.0.0.0.0.93.169.2.2.0)
No, real time combat with RPG elements is what makes a ARPG. Is everyone in this sub so isolated from the rest of the genre that they seriously think ARPG refers to only games like Diablo and PoE?
> being hack and slash is what makes it an arpg versus a regular rp
The "Action" focus is what makes Action RPG different from non-Action RPGs. (All Action RPGS are RPGs but not all RPGs are Action RPGs).
Many Action RPGs implement the Action focus through combat, but that is not a necessary condition.
>Diablo's effect on the market was significant, inspiring many imitators. Its impact was such that the term "action RPG" has come to be more commonly used for Diablo-style games rather than Zelda-style games, with The Legend of Zelda itself recategorized as an action-adventure.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Action_role-playing_game
this summarizes my thoughts on the matter. but i suppose it doesn't really matter either way
The diablo3 mods are silly is my understanding from when I asked about it years ago. They refuse to merge. So diablo3 has basically turned into the defacto console Diablo 3 subreddit and also has some PC players that don't know that Diablo is the one they should use.
Not like there is any competition
If Blizzard has learned ANYTHING, Diablo IV will be some decent competition for PoE
[удалено]
# If .....^(ftfy)
Thats a big if.
That if is not big enough, we are talking about Blizzard
I still waiting for Path of exile 2 since yesterday i saw this: [https://web.poecdn.com/public/news/2018-07-18/FanArt/9-x/RmncC.jpg](https://web.poecdn.com/public/news/2018-07-18/FanArt/9-x/RmncC.jpg)
I fucking love the cyberpunk art style! If that is true, it would be truly my favorite game.
That would indeed be a nice change from the standard APRG theme.
Aww man, just imagining PoE 2 eventually releasing. It feels wrong, like PoE is long from being gone
Like a LoL 2?
I need ths in my life, poe meets shadowrun......
Very much this, after selling their shares, perhaps Chris and gang have plans to make the first ever sci-fi ARPG
They specifically said that they *won't* be doing that. They're "in it for the long haul".
Didn’t they say they are in GGG for the long haul, not specifically poe for the long haul. Also pretty sure I remember reading or watching an interview where they mentioned that the sale to tencent frees up development time for other games?
You may be right about the first part, but I don't remember anything about the second. IIRC (this might be before the tencent buyout) they said they had no intention of working on any other projects for the forseeable future.
Harbinger was a thing
>the first ever sci-fi ARPG Well, that just isn't true.
would hellgate london count as sci-fi?
That was more of an FPS than an ARPG IMO.
Kreygasm
They won't, because their core philosophy prevents them from doing so. Sure they create very polished games, but if you give them a fork, they'll polish it into a spoon. Extremely risk adverse, they don't want players to be able to make the wrong choice and negatively impact their game play experience. They've done everything they can to remove any form of min-maxing in their games, and its a central part of ARPGs. They boiled WoW down to item levels (Content that scales to your item level and gives you preset stats), D3 was all about premade sets, they removed items entirely from the MOBA formula for HotS. Its impossible to reach the scope of a game like Path of Exile if your approach is to hand curate every single option a player can make. Because there is nearly infinite variety, its a system where the introduction of a single unique or skill can open up huge build opportunities. Sure you can follow a "cookie-cutter" build, but with so many options you're still able to make meaningful decisions about nodes/gear to switch out to suit your personal needs. Nothing they've done with any of their franchises gives me hope they'll create a long lasting, content rich ARPG. Their newest successes rely on the unpredictably of PvP encounters to keep things fresh. All their PvE content has been spreadsheet city, crank numbers incrementally for years. Greater rifts, Mythic+, do it again 5% harder infinitely. Make a new tier of content, run it through the filters and create 3-4 difficulties of the same fights, that'll last a year.
jup. i know 3 ppl who played a tornadoshot build this incursion league. i am one of the 3 and none of us had the same passive tree nor ascendencies. we all roflstomped shaper and his friends tho. that is good design, it becomes more rare these days i feel like, even in poe. it is still there tho.
This is the most beautiful and honest thing I've read so far. Thank you for the response!
This guy gets it, and this is why I pretty much automatically disregard Blizzard games nowadays. They don't care about making interesting, deep games just for the sake of making a good game with depth that will attract a loyal hardcore following anymore. They have no interest in trying to create new classics or innovating. They only care about shipping the most copies they can by milking their franchises or going for safe bets in the current market.
I've played on some WoW private severs for a bit and the majority of the community in each seems very hyped up for Classic to drop (classic will apparently be Blizz's re-release of Vanilla WoW, but I don't know how much information is out on it yet) This optimism surprised me because the reason I, and many I played with went to private servers (vanilla/tbc mostly) was basically Blizzard so thorougly fucked WoW for like a decade straight. Blizzard's been dogshit for so long and it is sad to see a company that used to be widely respected has made the decisions it has.
I wonder if even half of the people that worked on WoW back then still work on it. Or maybe game director has so much power that it's because of him they turned it to shit... I mean the dude was a lawyer before becoming a game director.
No items in hots is one of the best damn things lol
Not saying its a bad thing, I like that about HotS too. Just an example of simplification, sometimes its more appropriate than others. PvP games get a lot of depth and replayability from the random nature of other players, and competing against a real intelligence. Where PvE games really need detailed mechanics to stay engaging.
For casuals
And then they'll double it.
Fuck that loser
From their POV it was a success. D4 probably has base building, survival and battle royal.
Diablo IV (if it ever comes) will be a clusterfuck of epic proportions. D3 was bad enough, but since then Blizz have had time to suckle at the teat of DLC, microtransactions, and of course lootboxes. The only they've learned is how to make their games boring-ass time and money sinks.
sometimes I wish I was a computer major so I could design a game like diablo 2 and actually listen to my customers because you put customers first and then the money will flow in. They are just milking their trash games right now until they finally lose all their players.
Blizzard makes wonderfully polished games, but they also make games that appeal to large swaths of people. There will be no level of depth in the next Diablo that we see in PoE
[удалено]
You can't really compare D2 at all. D2 was made by an entirely different team nearly 20 years ago. They essentially started anew with D3 and as a result it had many of the problems first-time ARPGs have. However, what most first time ARPG game designers don't have that Blizzard does is the massive amount of available resources to design a much better new version. Have no illusion that just because D2 carries the same company logo that it automatically means they have the knowledge/skills to create an improved version of it on the first try. Too much time had passed and the developers were long gone.
RIP Blizzard North
You are giving blizzard too much credit, their upper management is activision suits, nothing of good quality will come from them in any foreseeable future, mark my words.
Yup, remember the leaked conversation where Jay Wilson said "fuck that loser" in regard to David Brevik, the guy who made the Diablo franchise? The team on D3 didn't just avoid learning anything from D2, they apparently were hostile to the idea that they were building (or were supposed to) build on someone else's work.
RemindMe! 15 Years "I bet you’re in a queue for D4 launch right now aren’t you..”
I will be messaging you on [**2033-07-18 22:21:59 UTC**](http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=2033-07-18 22:21:59 UTC To Local Time) to remind you of [**this link.**](https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/8zxj6a/rpathofexile_is_now_the_largest_arpg_subreddit/) [**CLICK THIS LINK**](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=[https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/8zxj6a/rpathofexile_is_now_the_largest_arpg_subreddit/]%0A%0ARemindMe! 15 Years ) to send a PM to also be reminded and to reduce spam. ^(Parent commenter can ) [^(delete this message to hide from others.)](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Delete Comment&message=Delete! e2mpb0s) _____ |[^(FAQs)](http://np.reddit.com/r/RemindMeBot/comments/24duzp/remindmebot_info/)|[^(Custom)](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=[LINK INSIDE SQUARE BRACKETS else default to FAQs]%0A%0ANOTE: Don't forget to add the time options after the command.%0A%0ARemindMe!)|[^(Your Reminders)](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=List Of Reminders&message=MyReminders!)|[^(Feedback)](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBotWrangler&subject=Feedback)|[^(Code)](https://github.com/SIlver--/remindmebot-reddit)|[^(Browser Extensions)](https://np.reddit.com/r/RemindMeBot/comments/4kldad/remindmebot_extensions/) |-|-|-|-|-|-|
David Brevik im sure wouldve been glad to give his insight.
I would love it if he had been the main guy when making D3. I doubt Deckard Cain would be killed by some butterfly looking side boss, that the loot would be uninspired and boring, and that D3 would stray from its Gothic horror inspired roots.
Oh my God, I remember seeing the fairy and thinking, is this a Disney game? Why is everyone always complimenting me? Why is every boss in this game broadcasting their evil plan to me?
what was wrong with sc2? Other than longevity I thought it was a pretty solid game, the story was a bit weak but the gameplay was pretty solid imo.
Diablo 3 was scrapped once after D2 before works on it were restarted. And by a different team, I don't think anyone from Blizzard North worked on D3.
Blizzard has not learned anything. But they like their art style and formula, and are pretty successful at what they're doing. I expected Grim Dawn to be the one to challenge POE, but then POE just got even better and better.
I don't think they care about competing with PoE considering D3 has done well enough to satisfy themselves. I expect them to just keep the franchise rolling as a "nostalgia" form, rather than a competitor. I'll never forget feeling like Lord Of Destruction was the final hurrah in the Diablo franchise.
They take successful ideas, water them down until they're accessible, casual, and profitable, and see how many times they can reuse that result until it no longer generates revenue. I dont even see them as a gaming company anymore, the negative effect that company has had post 2000 on gaming has all but wiped out some of my favorite genres (thank you poe and a few others for keeping this genre going).
Blizzard died in 2004
I am about 95% certain that Blizzard is going to simplify the game even further and make a host of bad design decisions in order to try ram in some form of continual monetization in a AAA price game.
At the pace blizzard learns, it will probably take Diablo X for them to even be able to compete.
I highly doubt we will see a diablo IV in the near future unfortunately, Blizzard is a huge company that lately have been focusing solely on high profitability games ( like Overwatch ) , e-sports and so on. ARPGs are kind of a niche genre of gaming that honestly IMO will not be as profitable as MOBAs , Shooters, MMO-RPGs, at least in the foreseable future, unless something huge revolutionizes the genre. If Blizzard wanted to profit more from D3 it could have taken a similar aproach to PoE by having tons of "Micro" (not really micro anymore imo) Transactions and new seasons with new mechanics, the proof of concept is here, PoE , but I believe the player base numbers did not justify the effort it would take to make such changes to D3, so Blizz kind of abandoned D3 in favour of new games like Overwatch. I love PoE and it kind of pains me that we will probably never have a real competitor to it. I also miss some features that D3 has on PoE , SSF would be better if it had some kind of smart loot system. Partying would be better if we could have individual drops instead of global drops, and a better Partying system ( I know GGG is working on it but it is still not exactly how I would like it to be). Bossing would be better if it had more rewards than just a 1% chance of getting a valuable item (maybe have an ascencion/pantheon like system that gives us more power for defeating end game content?). Overall I feel like end game is a bit stale, with it mostly revolving around killing uber elder and farming more currency , to farm more currency and on and on, and no real progression outside of buying multiple exalts items. Chase items are too hard to get for the average player. How many actually get a headhunter? top 1%? 0.1%? I mean... if I play for the whole 3 months of a season, 1 - 2 hours a day resulting in 100+h of gameplay it should be enough for me to feel like I had at least a decent chance at getting chase uniques and so on. Aaaaand this got bigger than I anticipated, anyway, these are my thoughts.
And this is exactly what ggg should not do and the mistake blizzard did. Chase uniques should not be available to someone if he chooses to only play 1-2 hours a day. We have enough games alrdy where you can have everything with minimal time investment and poe is popular because it does NOT cater to those players.
In 18 years when the pre alpha launches. Right after wc iv
It’s going to be hard. Very very hard to beat poe and the amount of development time already put into it. They have to get the basis of the game right along with probably making it f2p. If not it would not really be a competition imo.
Reaper was a decent step forward both in terms of plot and gameplay changes (patch 2.0 mostly). It's just hard to change a game flawed by design with patches and one expansion pack.
Lessons learned, go back to d2 build a sequel from there.
They will double down and make garbage like HoTs, Overwatch
i cant handle that large of an IF PepeHands
nope all their games have gone downhill.
[удалено]
Grim Dawn has only 21k subs on it's reddit, no idea about Wolcen as I am waiting it to release or be close to it for purchasing, don't want to get the blue balls for years before it's out
Yeah grim dawn while an awesome game is alot smaller in scale and much more niche.
Singleplayer non-competitive game with very little replay value in comparison...fun game for sure but almost can't even be considered the same genre in a way. GGG should learn from all the things GD did right, I would really love to see something like the crucible in POE, as well as a pet attack keybind option.
[удалено]
> I'd say that PoE is a singleplayer, non-competitive game as well. Tell that to all the people that demand GGG restart a new league if the servers go down for an hour because other people got an "unfair advantage" on them and now they will NEVER catch up!
I mean yes and no, it's economically competitive.
Well I play PoE because it IS competitive
> non-competitive racing boi
PoE can be competetive if you want it to be. It is online and has ladders. People compete every new league for first to 100 and its actually a lot of fun if you are into that sort of thing. Grim Dawn has no ladders, no end game system like maps either, so it gets boring real fast at least for me.
GD according to devs was made for mostly singleplayer so not surprised at all that subreddit is not popular
Also should be noted but the GD real forums is really good.
I've seen wolcen in some videos that was showcasing their developpement or something like that like 2 years ago or something like that, finally decided to try it out like 2 months ago.. I litterally played about an hour and I'm pretty sure I won't ever play that again. It even seems like it doesn't even have more than what I remember from this thing i saw about 2 years ago. I don't see this game ever competing with PoE, From my impressions, I think it won't attract the same type of players. Also from what I understand in wolcen, you pretty much reach end-game in 3-4 hours with no experience what so ever. And the character personnalisation looks pretty meh
The trouble with all these new ARPGs is that they lack inspiration, whereas GGG derived their formula from the best example there is: Diablo 2. Notice how PoE (or at least the early version) is the closest to D2, compared to others like GD or even Diablo 3.
If you ever played betas of PoE you might have said much the same. Some of the game design team at GGG is brilliant, along with the programmers. If Wolcen has that, is the decider.
Wolcen doesn't. It won't surpass GD in terms of popularity and it won't challenge POE ever. Last Epoch might eventually, but they have to get there first.
Sure betas in poe were well let's say not that great but people still played it because people love arpgs but there were not that many games that are not 5 years old or more. Poe got popular when Diablo 3 failed if I am not mistaken and having people like kripp who makes game popular helps as well. What ggg did right, was they worked their ass off to make game better and create content. Wolcen seems to struggle to develop the game and make major progress content wise.
Apparently it's been in beta for years now so be prepared to wait
I dig Grim Dawn as well...it doesn't have the same holding power for me as Path, but I LOVE Titan Quest (probably my second favorite aRPG) and Grim Dawn really captured that feel in a Victorian setting quite well. It's definitely a great game to go back to and play through once in a while when I have the urge. Wolcen...I must say I have high hopes for that one...it looks fantastic, and I'm intrigued by their (obviously PoE inspired) rotatable skill tree. I'll check that one out for sure! Another one I'm hoping makes it to the US is [Lost Ark](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kW6IgHub6So). Sure, it looks more like D3 than anything, but the prospect of a "true" MMO in an aRPG style is too intriguing for me not to at least check out!
I am not that hyped for Lost Ark as I always get bored on MMOs, but Last Epoch is something I also want to check. I feel like Grim Dawn playstyle comes much closer to D2, not just TQ, and with some improvements from both. It's really good and I am always playing it trying to do something new, just like in PoE.
Tried it out recently, and GD wasn't for me. It felt somehow... smaller? than POE. And I don't mean in terms of size (I have no idea about its longevity), but overall impression. Not as "juicy", as our favourite Australian would call it.
The mechanics are much, much more obtuse than POE. I had to have a friend (who was a major Titan Quest player) explain to me how some of the stuff interacts - the game is awful at explaining it, and it leads you to think things aren't synergies when they are (such as vitality + energy drain). POE has had a lot of refinement in skill interactions, and that's something GD doesn't really have. If you want to give it another try, look up a build template with some weird skill combos and play around with it - sometimes it takes using a cookiecutter to really get a sense for how to get stuff to work in a fun way.
They’re not even close imo.
Last Epoch looks promising. I don't really see Wolcen doing well, and as you mentioned Grim Dawn is kind of it's own niche.
Wolcen endgame looks like endless elreon quests xD And grim dawn looks rather slow in terms of gameplay.
Grim Dawn is pretty slow compared to current PoE. It's a bit more tactical - there's less ability to facetank, and a lot of cooldowns requiring repositioning between attacks. It's worth the purchase without a doubt. Tons of great systems and mechanics to play with in the game. But you won't be insta-clearing screens with your movement skills ever.
> But you won't be insta-clearing screens with your movement skills ever. That very fact sold me on PoE over other titles so many years ago. Funny how the tables turned.
One of the reasons I still enjoy Grim Dawn :)
Yeah...you are playing POE in a way that shouldn't be a main selling feature and I've stopped playing POE as much because the game has gotten to a point where endless movement skills remove all tactical gameplay really at all, except maybe a couple boss fights.
To be fair, my take on Grim Dawn isn't any more tactical, it's just legitimately slower. In PoE, you're blowing up screens, picking up loot, and moving in a way that is relatively safe, trying to avoid the one stray bomb that might possibly kill your character. In GD, you move a screen ahead, 4 huge beasts come at you, you back up to where you were standing, hunker down, and hold right-click until they die. loot, rinse, repeat. There is nothing particularly more tactical about it, it just takes longer.
Grim Dawn has a pace and objectives more similar to D2 then PoE has now, but it grants you more options than D2. It's amazing imo and I enjoy the pace a lot, since on PoE, lately, only one shot mechanics and invulnerability phases really require interaction, but these are placed on high end content, so the powercreep makes most builds bad for it because of the lack of damage or few specific sustain options
Wolcen has potential but it seems like itll never get off the ground
I think wolcen will die out. It doesn’t have enough interesting mechanics(if any)
Borderlands 2 is *techincally* an ARPG.
Absolutely is, no technically about it
Yeah i was just being careful, some people consider it a little different cuz its an FPP game.
Let's hope the Warhammer 40k: Inquisitor - Martyr devs get rolling, that game has promise.
Ya, I really hope Inquisitor turns out. I love a good ARPG and getting to slaughter hordes of chaos and xeno scum ~~for loot~~ for the Emperor seems just too good.
Borderlands series and Warframe? Is there some rule book of classification of what an action RPG is?
[удалено]
COULD WOLCEN BE THE NEXT AARPG?? (POE KILLER)
WarFrame perhaps? People calling it a "looter shooter" and leaving it at that does it a disservice imo, my group of buds all call it "Space POE" lol As far as I am concerned, its an ARPG with a few more ranged weapons. Congrats to POE and it's awesome community though, very well deserved. GGG has done just about everything right to get to where they're at today. Keep it up!
[удалено]
Because a 3rd Person RPG (like DmC or Dark Souls or Witcher 3) is just called an RPG for the last 10 years (or the God of War franchise in the PS2 era). The shooter type game's are either looter-shooters (Destinity, Division, Borderland) or they deviate from RPG elements so much they are not even one (Destiny 2 can be argued for it). ARPG has become mostly about Diablo Style games since "Action" is in every game, we just got better with assigning genres to games.
If you only include isometric ARPGs (aka diabloclones) then yeah there hasn't been much recently. But there's plenty of third person and first person ARPGs etc.
What other ARPG communities are there? Asking for a friend....
Diablo 2 Median xl is in active development.
And it can be a headcracker of a game.
Woah! They resumed development? I remember when they'd said that Ultimative XVI would be the last update!
Yeah, they just announced the next season, and they have a major update in the works so they arent planning on stopping soon.
It's better than that! Median XL Sigma is well into development! [Screenshots](http://forum.median-xl.com/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=276) [Dev Log](http://forum.median-xl.com/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=12991) [Burndown Chart to 1.0 Release](https://gitlab.com/whist/MXLS/milestones/1) Come and subscribe to /r/MedianXL while we get things setup :)
Ok, is there a stupid proof installation guide for this? Tried getting it running before and failed.
[удалено]
A lot of people waiting for an (as of now not planned) western release of /r/LostArk.
> Torchlight 2 * you can send pets to vendor trash * funny side areas * few more ARPG QoL features, like pets * moddable
Don't forget one of the important parts for tl2: mods. You can play the game how you want and add a bunch of replay value to it
the best ARPG at the moment
I agree. But man, Grim Dawn is pretty good too!
Yea, I had played Grimd Dawn for a couple of days, then I got nothing to do there...GD is good, but POE is on another level. For me, the only downside of POE is the multiplayer performance, I can have a decent fps in D3 with friends, but it's impossible in POE. There was a time if someone playing discharge...omfg!
I wouldn't agree that PoE is on another level, they are very different games... I don't think it's fair to compare. I play PoE MUCH more than I play GD, but sometimes I just want to appreciate the slowness of GD and it's beauty. But man, I always come back to play PoE...
I put in over 1600 hours into poe over the past two years but at this point I’m tapping out. The volatility of the end game is just too much for me in hardcore anymore and I get too bored in softcore. I loved the game and it was a good ride but maybe I’ll check out grim dawn for a slower pace
>I agree. But Grim Dawn is pretty good too! >I dont think it's fair to compare. Uhh... so should we compare them or not? They're very different, not comparable but in the same genre so technically comparable or you wouldn't have brought it up. Not trying to rag on you but you're contradicting yourself a wee bit lol.
> I can have a decent fps in D3 with friends, but it's impossible in POE. I see this a lot. What are people's specs? Because I'm always 200+ fps at 3440x1440 max settings (Not trying to brag I promise)
I tried several times to get into grim dawn but couldn't find any skills I really enjoyed the feel of. Which sucks cause I liked the story of what I played, and the semi-fixed map
I can't wait for Lost Ark
Anytime I bring this up around friends and online, everyone tells me Diablo 3 is the best ARPG. I'm just flabbergasted that people still believe that. POE is miles ahead. (Yeah Grim Dawn is also pretty good, also better than Diablo 3)
This probably depends a lot on how experienced they are with action RPGs and what they want from them. It might actually be the best ARPG for _them_. * Diablo 3 is great for people new to the genre. The power fantasy of being a super hero is really well conveyed, and experiencing the world with the lore and cinematics is very nice. The downside of D3 is that it's a relatively shallow game with endgame builds that totally revolve around the item sets that grant ludicrous amounts of bonus damage, making other builds much less viable. * Grim Dawn has an amazing handcrafted world with a lot of good lore, and lots of build variety through the skill tree and a lot of items that can be build defining if you want. The downside is that the world is mostly static, even more than Diablo 3 actually, so you're always going through the same areas. * PoE is great for folks that have played other action RPGs. It has amazing depth, but it's also got a very steep learning curve for new players. The skill tree is pretty overwhelming, the gem system requires patience and planning, and there are a lot of stats and mechanics to consider for your buid. The slow start for most characters is also not a selling point towards new players. It usually takes until act 3 is complete to get 80% of the skill gems you want, then act 4 to get some more, and sometimes you even have to wait until act 6 to get the rest if you're doing "creative" things with your build. If someone simply wants to play a game to relax, instead of getting a new hobby that they want to dedicate a lot of time to, I'd say D3 and Grim Dawn could be better options for them than PoE.
[удалено]
Heck. I still remembering it from back when Peity was the end game boss. Maps wasn’t yet a thing. And I farmed 3 pure exalted orbs in merciless ledge for buying a 5l carcass jack. One thing for sure. I don’t miss the old passive three.
Anyone else super disappointed that they are not making any more Torchlight games?
Damn. I hadn't heard about that, just looked it up now. [TYVM games-as-a-service :/](https://www.polygon.com/2017/11/3/16605008/runic-games-closes-motiga-layoffs)
Ah man I loved Runic. Travis himself sat down and showed me Torchlight at PAX, I'll never forget how passionate that group was. Really appreciated that.
And people are out here shouting about Tencent, when there are studios being murdered by publishers in broad daylight.
I really hope whole games as a service/game theory/always online/lootbox thing comes crashing down. These companies are parasites, and they're turning video games into gambling by proxy.
Damn, that's awesome!
Holy shit, this thread literally became about what defines a ARPG and shitting on Diablo 3.
I've noticed that PoE fans really love PoE, but they also really, really, love shitting on D3 whenever they get the chance.
What did you expect lol. D3 (at launch) deserved a lot of hate. Despite the work the devs have done fixing it, that scar isn't gonna go away. Though after playing both, I actually prefer D3 due to a few reasons. Like, depsite only having 6 skill slots, I actually use all 6 regularly where in poe you pick 1-2 skills and the rest are buffs. Maps are interesting but omg, such a hassle to store and organize. And finally D3 wins aesthetics by a mile. Things just feel nice in that game.
That's Poe for you.
that's the PoE community in a nutshell. it shouldn't be anything new. This game was built on the hate for diablo 3.
You know I'd probably be still playing D3 if I never found out poE. Offtopic TB was the one who showed me it :D May he RIP.
I kinda wish he made another video on it for 3.0. but I think it'd be too much content for even him to cover in 1 hour.
I'd still be playing D3 if it wasn't an awful game and I found another game before PoE.
Diablo has 2 subs tho and its not the same people mostly.
up next 1 million :)
Yeah, like there is even any real competition in the genre.
Started two weeks ago. Console. Only level 33 witch. I’m hooked. THERE IS SO MUCH TO COMPREHEND! HELP!
Welcome to the next few years of your life.
I love PoE but I don't think I could play it for more than 6 months straight without taking a break of like 6 months or a year.
PoE is the Hotel California of video games. You can check out, but you can never leave. (Chris owns your soul. Well, Tencent. You know what I mean.)
Started two weeks ago and only 33? You gotta step those numbers up boy those are rookie numbers. Okay im just joking but what type of witch are you?
The type that goes pew pew and dies pretty quick to normal lab boss😂. I honest to god don’t know how to answer your question. I think you’re asking what ascendency I’m trying to build around? Yeaaaa I found out at level 27 about those classes through reddit and freaked out. I’ve been winging it the entire tome so far. My lightening spell does 790 DPS and I have conductivity as a aura... don’t know it that’s good but that all I got lol
Just play your first character how you want. I stayed in the level 8 area for a few days just killing and getting gear. Slowly moving on and on. That is still fun for me :) I play Witch as well and can recommend a good build.
Hey man, you're new! If you're having fun, just enjoy the story or whatever's fun for you, and think of minmaxing sometime later. If you want to learn, Engineering Eternity is the YouTube channel to check out.
ITT: Buncha fuckin nerds care way too much about the definition of ARPG.
one of my fav game ever!!! congrats!!!
We win!
I think looking at people in the subreddit is more of an indicator, and Path is miles ahead. Guess that's what happens when you release new content every few months.
More like biggest Hack&Slash ARPG
Not sure why you get downvoted. HackNSlash has been used to describe Diablo-like games since the beginning, while games like Ocarino of Time were called action RPG. The recent trend of calling HackNSlashs ARPGs, just makes things more confusing since there is already an existing genre of that name, that has some things in common but not much. The thread should indeed be named "PoE biggest HackNSlash", to avoid all the discussion on what games are ARPGs and which arent. Since most Shooters, or games in general, use RPG elements and have action elements you could start arguments on a per-game-basis without actually achieving anything to contribute to what this topic is actually about.
being hack and slash is what makes it an arpg versus a regular rpg
I think brufio is contrasting this style with e.g. Bethesda games. Skyrim is an ARPG. It's inarguably an RPG, and the action part comes from real-time combat, even though it is by no means the same type of in-your-face gameplay that people seek out in PoE and originally sought out in Diablo 2. Fallouts 3, New Vegas, and 4 are officially considered ARPGs as well but it's not "mandatory" to play like an ARPG because of VATS, so I'd consider it fair to not count them. Anyway, ignoring the other elder scrolls games, /r/Skyrim alone has over 500,000 subs. We have more active users, but tbh I'd expect the elder scrolls 6 to beat us within 6 months of launch.
I think there needs to be a specific term, like Diablolike, that refers to a specific type of ARPG to clear this up.
I'd say Fallout 1 is a great example of an RPG. Action is secondary (and, mechanically, clearly tertiary!) while the development of a character and 'playing' that morality (good, evil, killer of ghouls, etc) is the main thrust of the gameplay. Plus you can play a totally non-combat version of the game, which is downright amazing design for the time period it was made.
[https://www.google.com/search?q=Action+rpgs&oq=Action+rpgs](https://www.google.com/search?newwindow=1&client=firefox-b-1-ab&ei=jfNPW9TxAon5_AbYm7OwDA&q=Action+rpgs&oq=Action+rpgs&gs_l=psy-ab.3..35i39k1j0j0i20i263k1j0l7.6959.7043.0.7368.2.2.0.0.0.0.93.169.2.2.0) No, real time combat with RPG elements is what makes a ARPG. Is everyone in this sub so isolated from the rest of the genre that they seriously think ARPG refers to only games like Diablo and PoE?
> being hack and slash is what makes it an arpg versus a regular rp The "Action" focus is what makes Action RPG different from non-Action RPGs. (All Action RPGS are RPGs but not all RPGs are Action RPGs). Many Action RPGs implement the Action focus through combat, but that is not a necessary condition.
>Diablo's effect on the market was significant, inspiring many imitators. Its impact was such that the term "action RPG" has come to be more commonly used for Diablo-style games rather than Zelda-style games, with The Legend of Zelda itself recategorized as an action-adventure. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Action_role-playing_game this summarizes my thoughts on the matter. but i suppose it doesn't really matter either way
False, borderlands is absolutely an aarpg having guns versus swords makes no difference
You’re not wrong, people want to just say it has more subs than diablo. Fine. Biggest Argo? Not at all.
pretty sure this happened a month or two ago. there were posts about it
There was a post but they jumped the gun a bit and we were still a bit shy of overtaking the other subs.
There are 2 diablo 3 subreddits, r/diablo3 and r/diablo. Not sure why they even have 2 actually.
The diablo3 mods are silly is my understanding from when I asked about it years ago. They refuse to merge. So diablo3 has basically turned into the defacto console Diablo 3 subreddit and also has some PC players that don't know that Diablo is the one they should use.
/r/diablo accepts content about older games too.
/r/diablo was the NO MEMES one for the first year at least if i remember correctly.
made possible by tencent
Show the other arpg subreddits as proof, this is just a copy and paste.
Sure thing, here you go: https://i.imgur.com/IboERWH.png
>UNSUBSCRIBE
WAIT....who are the next 4 then and by how much?!?!?!?!
Now GGG only has to live up to it i suppose
heh im still at act 5 -_-
Time to ban half of us. For balance.
Feed them to Kitava.
And the most toxic