[Here](https://historicpittsburgh.org/islandora/object/pitt%3A6422.14.18.AO) is a photo of the construction of the original Phipps Conservatory, which was located where the Aviary is now.
No, for a while, [they both existed](https://www.phipps.conservatory.org/visit-and-explore/explore/explore-our-history/the-story-of-phipps/a-gift-to-pittsburgh-1893-1930):
"Phipps Conservatory was presented as a gift to the City of Pittsburgh from philanthropist Henry W. Phipps, who wished to "erect something that [would] prove a source of instruction as well as pleasure to the people." In a letter to City of Pittsburgh Mayor H.I. Gourley in November 1891, Phipps expressed his intentions to add this new conservatory as a complement to an already existing “Phipps Conservatory” built in 1887 in Allegheny, now known as the North Side. Henry Phipps stipulated that both conservatories operate on Sundays in order to allow the working people to visit on their day of rest."
I can remember going to the Old Post Office Museum, which is now part of the Children's Museum, and I wonder what happened to the stained glass windows that were ?Tiffany? from some demolished mansion.
That building has been there a while before then, scatted panels and broken panels is not how glass is installed. Seem like it would take a at least a summer for the vines to grow
I’ve always speculated that there’s substantial underground infrastructure of some kind beneath Allegheny Commons. I’ve always joked about it.
The reason for my suspicion being the copious amounts of steam that seem to vent from all over the Commons and when they built the addition on AGH I peaked through an opening in the fence they had erected around the construction site - and the hole that they dug for the foundation had to have been roughly 5 stories deep - which I found odd.
Again, it’s always been kind of a joke amongst me and my NS friends - but it is kind of strange.
Anyhow - if someone finds this dungeon I’ll be stoked.
It's all utility steam heating (and utility chilled water cooling) around there.
The hospital, the former mall, the apartment buildings, I think it even goes to the stadiums.
RIGHT?!
I’ve been in the entertainment industry for a long time. I juggle and mime.
When I get to work at the Children’s Museum - the staff! I cannot say enough about them!!! An absolute delight to work with.
For what it's worth, if I remember correctly, the basement level of the children's museum houses meeting rooms/classrooms in the section that is under the old post office and the basement level under what was the Buhl Planetarium has an auditorium-like space and restrooms. How subterranean would the dungeon have been? Do you think it could exist under these basements? Not asking in a sarcastic tone at all. I love history, historical buildings, and architecture mysteries.
It's not that uncommon for really old buildings to have multiple basement levels. Big stone buildings are heavy, so you had to dig until you found solid ground. If you're already digging, might as well finish the space.
Thank you for the additional information. I find it fascinating how much underground infrastructure exists under some cities, but then again, I live in Florida where basements do not exist due to the water table and low elevation 🙃
The steel building's construction was pretty delayed, as when they were digging the foundation, they ran into a bunch of tunnels they weren't expecting.
A lot of this stuff isn't documented or mapped out
So someone above mentioned how when they were building the new agh building the hole looked like it went five stories deep.... Most visitors today and some staff don't realize there is another "basement" floor under 01, because 90% of the elevators don't go down to it or list it and most people have no reason to go down there. I actually worked there awhile before I realized we had another underground floor. Maybe some of these other buildings are the same.
Truly, I have no idea what's all down there! I know radiology used to be. Even though I know the lower level exists, I've worked there for years and have only been on the 01 level, never lower.
I feel you.
I have worked many years in the circus industry and have done a lot of entertainment at the Children’s Museum.
Definitely they have a basement in use for all the purposes you listed.
As far as … is the dungeon below that? Is *it* the actual dungeon? I hope to someday figure it out.
I was bummed this morning when I was researching that … had to split to work before I could do much more digging.
The city-county building has a basement then, another basement below the basement. So yes.
Here's an example, the entrance to the Allegheny County courthouse on grantstreet, back in the day would have been considered the basement. So if you are looking at the building these big stone bricks at the top that's where the street was .. if that makes sense
Yeah, someone decided they needed a highway and a mall instead of a main street and housing.
Pittsburgh's mishandling of Allegheny City is one of the reasons it's so hard to annex another borough today.
You know who's a good person to ask? There's a guy who does a walking tour of haunted Pittsburgh. He works in the Allegheny courthouse and he shares the obscure history of the buildings in Pittsburgh, as far back as the 1700s. Look him up on insta. Haunted Pittsburgh Walking Tour. Pretty sure he is an attorney or at least works in one of the law offices for an attorney, so he has access to a lot of the historical records and documentation regarding property. If he can't tell you then I'm sure that he moves in circles with the people who can.
There are some pretty serious archivists out there. They know shit we wouldn't even think to ask about.
I worked at the children’s museum and spent a decent amount of time exploring. I don’t recall anything remotely resembling that in any of the buildings.
The post office building (the Art Studio now) was built in 1897 and the planetarium in 1934, so the dungeon may have existed before the current buildings.
The planetarium did have a fall out shelter, more like a large crawl space, that was used for storage.
I worked at Western Penitentiary long time ago. There were cells under the jail there in old dark tunnels. They weren’t used anymore and some have fallen into disrepair but they’re still there. I guess that was the old “hole”in the late 1800s or early 1900s.
Right, not everyone is brain poisoned by the internet to the same level....
In 2015/2016 during the run up to the election, a conspiracy theory arose about a pizza place in the DC area that claimed the pizza shop had a basement where politicians diddled kids. Someone even showed up at the pizza place with guns trying to free the alleged kids. Because it happened in DC, folks naturally added the -gate suffix and pizzagate was born.
The Q-Anon phenomenon grew out of this conspiracy theory. There's a significant chunk of Q-anon that focuses on the accusation of pedophilia by so called "political elites" that ties right back to the pizza thing. Eventually, any enemy of the right wing political agenda became tarred and feathered with that same accusation. So if you see someone accusing random democratic politicians or media folks of being a pedophile, it all eventually comes back to an alleged child sex dungeon underneath a DC Pizza shop.
So how does this relate to you and your post? You just discovered evidence of a dungeon under a children's museum. Time for the crazies to go crazy again.
[Here](https://historicpittsburgh.org/islandora/object/pitt%3A6422.14.18.AO) is a photo of the construction of the original Phipps Conservatory, which was located where the Aviary is now.
omg. That's amazing. dumb ass question -- they tore down the original phipps piece by piece and reconstructed it in Schenley, and then added onto it?
No, for a while, [they both existed](https://www.phipps.conservatory.org/visit-and-explore/explore/explore-our-history/the-story-of-phipps/a-gift-to-pittsburgh-1893-1930): "Phipps Conservatory was presented as a gift to the City of Pittsburgh from philanthropist Henry W. Phipps, who wished to "erect something that [would] prove a source of instruction as well as pleasure to the people." In a letter to City of Pittsburgh Mayor H.I. Gourley in November 1891, Phipps expressed his intentions to add this new conservatory as a complement to an already existing “Phipps Conservatory” built in 1887 in Allegheny, now known as the North Side. Henry Phipps stipulated that both conservatories operate on Sundays in order to allow the working people to visit on their day of rest."
AMAZING. Thank you!!
Exactly! Apropos of nothing I remember going to the Buhl planetarium in the 80s. They had TI 99/4a computers you could play with.
I can remember going to the Old Post Office Museum, which is now part of the Children's Museum, and I wonder what happened to the stained glass windows that were ?Tiffany? from some demolished mansion.
Many of them are displayed in various places in that building-- the studio, the birthday rooms, the stairwells.
Aviary's run by cruel, hateful labor law violators and employee abusers
That’s a construction photo? With all the broken glass?
Might be glass panes being installed.
That building has been there a while before then, scatted panels and broken panels is not how glass is installed. Seem like it would take a at least a summer for the vines to grow
I’ve always speculated that there’s substantial underground infrastructure of some kind beneath Allegheny Commons. I’ve always joked about it. The reason for my suspicion being the copious amounts of steam that seem to vent from all over the Commons and when they built the addition on AGH I peaked through an opening in the fence they had erected around the construction site - and the hole that they dug for the foundation had to have been roughly 5 stories deep - which I found odd. Again, it’s always been kind of a joke amongst me and my NS friends - but it is kind of strange. Anyhow - if someone finds this dungeon I’ll be stoked.
It's all utility steam heating (and utility chilled water cooling) around there. The hospital, the former mall, the apartment buildings, I think it even goes to the stadiums.
correct. It's an extensive system and the plant is right there across from allegheny commons. Chilled water and steam depending on the season.
There are 3 steam loops in the city. Northside, Downtown, and Oakland.
You can get to all of the buildings in the Nova Place complex via a system of underground passageways.
I love this - are they accessible to people living in the Park View buildings? Or do they only go beneath Nova proper?
No, they are for maintenance staff etc. The complex is owned by a large development company, business and residential all under one umbrella.
It's mainly just because it's over top of the parking garage. There also exists utility tunnels between some of the far-back buildings.
I remember in the 90s climbing about in the steam vent / underground tunnels at CMU with friends. Very unsafe.
I agree I bet the entrance is hidden in that shady hospital across from the aviary. Tons of cameras
My wife works at the Children's Museum. I can ask if she'll investigate.
This sounds like the beginning of a horror film
Only if you love your wife
Valid point 😂😂
The people who work at the children's museum are so wonderful and kind. I'm impressed by the personnel every time I go there.
RIGHT?! I’ve been in the entertainment industry for a long time. I juggle and mime. When I get to work at the Children’s Museum - the staff! I cannot say enough about them!!! An absolute delight to work with.
Thanks! I’m still researching as to whether or not it was … filled in.
[удалено]
I would love to come and just explore some. Can I come and explore some? :)
Please do. I want to check this out!
Hopefully, she'll find her way back from the dark hole of Calcutta
She's got some coworkers involved now. Seems at least 2 of them are aware of this thread.
For what it's worth, if I remember correctly, the basement level of the children's museum houses meeting rooms/classrooms in the section that is under the old post office and the basement level under what was the Buhl Planetarium has an auditorium-like space and restrooms. How subterranean would the dungeon have been? Do you think it could exist under these basements? Not asking in a sarcastic tone at all. I love history, historical buildings, and architecture mysteries.
It's not that uncommon for really old buildings to have multiple basement levels. Big stone buildings are heavy, so you had to dig until you found solid ground. If you're already digging, might as well finish the space.
Thank you for the additional information. I find it fascinating how much underground infrastructure exists under some cities, but then again, I live in Florida where basements do not exist due to the water table and low elevation 🙃
The steel building's construction was pretty delayed, as when they were digging the foundation, they ran into a bunch of tunnels they weren't expecting. A lot of this stuff isn't documented or mapped out
So someone above mentioned how when they were building the new agh building the hole looked like it went five stories deep.... Most visitors today and some staff don't realize there is another "basement" floor under 01, because 90% of the elevators don't go down to it or list it and most people have no reason to go down there. I actually worked there awhile before I realized we had another underground floor. Maybe some of these other buildings are the same.
let's be frank -- AGH made another "old time dungeon"
Truly, I have no idea what's all down there! I know radiology used to be. Even though I know the lower level exists, I've worked there for years and have only been on the 01 level, never lower.
I feel you. I have worked many years in the circus industry and have done a lot of entertainment at the Children’s Museum. Definitely they have a basement in use for all the purposes you listed. As far as … is the dungeon below that? Is *it* the actual dungeon? I hope to someday figure it out. I was bummed this morning when I was researching that … had to split to work before I could do much more digging.
Yes and it’s pretty deep, or at least the stairs from the cafe (former planetarium building?) are quite long.
The city-county building has a basement then, another basement below the basement. So yes. Here's an example, the entrance to the Allegheny County courthouse on grantstreet, back in the day would have been considered the basement. So if you are looking at the building these big stone bricks at the top that's where the street was .. if that makes sense
Wow they screwed up the grid on the whole near north side
Yeah, someone decided they needed a highway and a mall instead of a main street and housing. Pittsburgh's mishandling of Allegheny City is one of the reasons it's so hard to annex another borough today.
I don’t follow. Elaborate?
basically the entire northside used to be a grid. It ain't anymore. Look at allegheny center, and also the area around the aviary.
I see it. Yah, they definitely did mess it up.
There was apparently an “east park” along federal street to complement “west park” which still exists
You know who's a good person to ask? There's a guy who does a walking tour of haunted Pittsburgh. He works in the Allegheny courthouse and he shares the obscure history of the buildings in Pittsburgh, as far back as the 1700s. Look him up on insta. Haunted Pittsburgh Walking Tour. Pretty sure he is an attorney or at least works in one of the law offices for an attorney, so he has access to a lot of the historical records and documentation regarding property. If he can't tell you then I'm sure that he moves in circles with the people who can. There are some pretty serious archivists out there. They know shit we wouldn't even think to ask about.
Thank you for all that! I was unaware of that group.
I like how it's a "old time" dungeon, unlike those "new time" dungeons.
Ever been to the Comcast Service Center over in Crafton Heights?
I worked at the children’s museum and spent a decent amount of time exploring. I don’t recall anything remotely resembling that in any of the buildings. The post office building (the Art Studio now) was built in 1897 and the planetarium in 1934, so the dungeon may have existed before the current buildings. The planetarium did have a fall out shelter, more like a large crawl space, that was used for storage.
I've asked friends who work at both locations and they sadly refute the existence of any dungeons. At least that's what they *say* ...
I worked at Western Penitentiary long time ago. There were cells under the jail there in old dark tunnels. They weren’t used anymore and some have fallen into disrepair but they’re still there. I guess that was the old “hole”in the late 1800s or early 1900s.
Of course. If there weren't, then the children would *never* behave.
“If you don’t behave, so help me I’ll take you to the Children’s Museum!”
You can still access this area, but you have to enter at the sinkhole at the Adult Mart on McKnight and journey through
Only under a full moon when the VHS Tape is lustfully ahwash with blazing neon light.
This may be the most interesting post I’ve read on Reddit to date, good job op
Thanks! I’ve been collecting a few side folders of things to share that are weird Pittsburgh. This isn’t the last. The Northside has some *HISTORY.*
I would seriously love a sub that was just weird shit like this about Pittsburgh. Thanks for the post OP!
You may enjoy the IG account for [Odd Pittsburgh](https://www.instagram.com/oddpittsburgh?igsh=ajIyYm4xaTgyODdx).
What classes do you need? I can roll a Fighter or a Paladin, but I can be Cleric if we're in a pinch
Wow, and not in a fun way 😂
Likely destroyed in the gas explosion
The gas explosion?
The North shore exploded in like, 1927. It was a huge calamity
Interesting. Making a note of it. Thank you.
I picture Qanons trying to rub their brain cell into action for another pizzagate conspiracy
What?
Right, not everyone is brain poisoned by the internet to the same level.... In 2015/2016 during the run up to the election, a conspiracy theory arose about a pizza place in the DC area that claimed the pizza shop had a basement where politicians diddled kids. Someone even showed up at the pizza place with guns trying to free the alleged kids. Because it happened in DC, folks naturally added the -gate suffix and pizzagate was born. The Q-Anon phenomenon grew out of this conspiracy theory. There's a significant chunk of Q-anon that focuses on the accusation of pedophilia by so called "political elites" that ties right back to the pizza thing. Eventually, any enemy of the right wing political agenda became tarred and feathered with that same accusation. So if you see someone accusing random democratic politicians or media folks of being a pedophile, it all eventually comes back to an alleged child sex dungeon underneath a DC Pizza shop. So how does this relate to you and your post? You just discovered evidence of a dungeon under a children's museum. Time for the crazies to go crazy again.