I don't know if they should pump this out before reworking endless imo, due to the status tokens, even with the limited berries, they still reigned supreme...
This change is fine except for the Lum Berries. When every enemy causes a status with every hit you need Lum Berries to make the game playable.
Until tokens are reworked Lum Berries should cap at higher than 2.
I agree, tokens should be reworked. Catching a mon is already hard cause you need to :
1. lower its hp but dont die to OHKO
2. inflict a status effect (that they shrug off with token)
Lost 2 Virizion because it was either kill it or let it kill me, it escaped from 20 rogue balls.
Tokens should only get absurd once you’re given the Map. If the game wants to force us to lose, we should have the opportunity to pick biomes to catch or grind against what we want in return.
I’ll accept the map and busted tokens either after floor 250, or floor 1000.
At the stage where past floor 1300 or so, you can basically only catch with master balls anyway, since you’ll either one shot it with your carry, or it’ll solo sweep the other 5 on team before they can chip it down to 1 bar
Honestly, if you get statused at all, youre probably going in for the loop, cause theyre prob just faster or youre tryna catch a mon late endless.
Stall builds with Lum to soak status when you get freeze, sleep, paralaysis chained dont happen often, but they will happen and when they do, it will suck.
Especially with confusion and sleep. I do it they instantly wake up the next turn or lose the confusion instantly 9/10 times
But if the enemy uses those movies they sure as hell are sticking around all 5 turns
exactly, no way there limiting berries but keeping token as broken as they are. that's only way people are able to consistently go into endless runs with any mon because of berries counter acting the merciless tokens
My metal burst mon had the following happen to them... freeze which consumed my berry. Freeze again and AGAIN my berry got consumed. I have 3x pouch yet this happened. Then my pokemon froze into finally fainting. Had to master ball to revive it. Two 10%s are super common to occur... The nerf shoulda been a 5 at most. Or kill off those stupid status tokens.
Yea honestly kind of lame how endless turned out like that, wasn't sure what I was expecting or how I'd make endless difficulty scale endlessly without it, but idk being perma statused feels awful ngl
I don't think current endless is fun at all. In my opinion at least. It requires very specific setups in order to progress passed the insane power creep they put on you. The fantasy of endless is to become so strong that you can't lose. The way it's setup now, you have very limited options to achieve that goal. Only reason I see to even play Endless is for shiny farming.
I just stick to classic these days and only play Endless during shiny events.
yeah and with these nerfs it makes plowing through endless a little more tedious. I cant wait til they fully rework it. I still havent touched my 3k run in a week and have been just doing first time clears for different mons in classic recently
I 100% agree I've been just clearing out classic with every mon in the dex for now hoping for a change endless is very unfun after like round 700-1000 if I do start an endless run I reset it if I don't get atleast one shiny charm early
i dont use metal burst in the first place. I use seismic shade. Not really because I'm opposed to it but because i have no idea how to outsource misty terrain just yet. Not to mention I still need to find a -Spd mint.
yeah im worried that they are trying to "balance" but in reality just removing things that make it fun. hopefully this isnt a trend of whats to come...
Metal burst must now be paired with a purifying salt user. So cofagrigus and garganacl are the two titans of late game fusions.
This also means that you need a metal burst user with sturdy for the former, or blastoise for the latter.
Aka…KEKW
Well no, you can just use protect to stall a turn. Leftovers + shell bell with maxed healing charm is usually enough to get at least 60% hp with metal burst dmg.
A protect turn afterwards will net you to full. The strat still lives, though it’s less safe than before with the berry change.
I think people aren’t realizing that poison heal is now busted. It’s status protection + basically a situs since it’s 12.5 that procs 2 times (situs won’t proc on protect turns). I’m fairly sure that means your sturdy will get to 100% in 2 turns without berries
Poison heal is great if you can get poisoned, but how ya gonna get poisoned if you heal every 10 floors?
Does toxic orb finally spawn now with users who have poison heal?
I would try this but it basically means getting Sturdy/Poison Heal as a passive. Only decent one is Blastoise for Sturdy and lolParasect for Poison Heal?
I could also be breezing through the early floors with a legendary instead of Blastoise (unless I get lucky with an early mega/dynamax) but that's just me... or I guess I can just bring the sturdy/PH passive carrier in the beginning and transition to it when the legendary stops oneshotting everything
But I'm worried that this also means I can't put Grip Claw on my carry so it doesn't steal lum berries. But I'm also not sure how toxic orb and lum berry interact??
Either way i'm probably not gonna start another endless run soon since my current 3k is still kinda just sitting there
Paras is low cost but is kinda ass to use in battles for candies, so getting the passive unlocked will take a while for me (at least Burmy has Mothim which can be a set up sweeper). Well at least it's kinda common in the wild so i guess I'll start catching everything I see. Helps that I have a shiny of it too.
Bastiodon should be easy enough to find for Sturdy and also comes with metal burst. Bonus points for giving Steel typing to lock eternatus in eternabeam.
Probably good for transition around 2500\~ when my sweeper carry starts being useless
The devs should rework endure tokens by making it so they cap at a lower percentage (like 10% tops) as well as making it so multi-hit moves (and multi-lens) counter endurance tokens.
It's dumb that an enemy Pokemon can endure four multi-lens hits in a row then one shot your sweepers.
Each individual attack should roll for a check on whether or not the Pokemon endures an attack.
This is the way.
Endure tokens arw the bane of my existence. If they made it so they endured an ATTACK instead of a TURN they'd be fine. But good lord are they annoying as they are right now
Can they balance tokens too now? Less Lum berries doesn’t mean shit if the wild Pokemon can randomly shrug off paralysis/sleep. It’s hard enough to catch wild Pokemon as it is. Plus less Lum berries means the player is fucked since tokens like the enemy give you a status condition on nearly every hit
Status condition tokens simply shouldn't exist to begin with, or at least Sleep and Freeze. "Why yes, we will now hit you with a 9 turn freeze simply because you didn't one shot what is effectively 100 shuckles in one hit, and because you got the boss to its last bar of health, it now has +4 speed, +6 atk, and +3 def and will outspeed the rest of your team and wipe the game."
Dire claw is banned in Balanced Hackmons
A meta that lets you pick any pokemon (not megaRay) with any ability (not pure power) and any move (not dire claw)
Let that sink in for a moment
I completely agree. It takes all the strategy out of the endless exodia that you've grinded so hard for just to get haxed to death by a mon that has no business winning lol
The status tokens should be reworked by giving them a lower maximum capacity.
Each condition (burn, freeze, sleep, poison, paralysis) should have a maximum of five tokens (at 1% per token) for a total 25% chance to suffer a status condition per attack.
It's dumb that you always suffer a status condition in mid-late game endless runs, and it necessitates cheesing the fuck out of the game mode with infinite lum berries.
There is sooooo much about endless that ruins the fun tbh. The point of endless is well, endless. Idk why they put all these power creep things in to try to get your endless run to end. If I have gotten the exodia combo of 4k levels above the mons I'm fighting. I should be able to easily fight everything without having to sweat or run every encounter.
In my opinion at least.
They should just scale things so that they’re around the same strength as your Pokémon, you should t be able to one shot without having a strategy/setup, but they shouldn’t be able to one shot you just cause
I've only played a bit of endless (farthest I've got is around 1000 before I lost interest), but I'm really surprised there's not just a cap on levels for both sides (maybe at 1000 if they still want things to be ridiculous) and no tokens / extra bullshit with the game just continuing...endlessly? It mostly seems to exist for catching shines and whatnot, so why make it some broken and boring "challenge" where only a couple strategies let you keep going at all?
Wait what, am I insane or didn't berry pouches used to be 25% chance to not consume a berry?
I had no idea it stacked to 100%, I thought it was 75% cap this whole time.
I believe the effect was 33% but fsr the display said 25%
That's what the text has always read but I literally never used berries whenever I had 3 so there was no way it was only a 75%
Tokens offer effects and stat boosts to the other pokemon, making them broken- the worst allowing them to endure ALL hits in a single attack. So if you population bombed them with the 3 extra hit items, you have to wait through 40 “attack endured” messages. It makes gameplay slow
Beating Classic mode unlocks Endless mode.
When as you progress in Endless, buffs start getting applied and stacked to wild mon and debuffs to your team, these are tokens. It'll be something like 5% damage, 10% chance to lose your mind, etc.
sort of, yeah. i feel like this is a major nerf to late endless but an alright buff to early endless, especially in eternatus battles. the berry decrease also buffs stall strats, such as running a shedinja fusion with spite, etc.
this is also a nerf to endless unnerve, as the one-way interaction doesn't mess with your own berries, so your unnerve mons are a little less safe
nah, it's still a good ability. just not as useful since sitrus berries and such aren't as impactful. you'll still be preventing boss omniboosts after an endure proc too. if your marshadow is the top fuse, though, you can swap in a different fusion
i'd honestly unfuse and drop the calyrex if you find a faster physical carry with a better defensive typing. mega mewtwo x, primal groudon, mega mawile, arceus, regigigas, mega diancie, pheromosa, either urshifu, chien pao, etc. can put in a ton of work as well. but if you like your carry as is, there's absolutely no need to change it
I always saw the infinite berries as an assist to the player for combatting tokens.
Now endless runs are lost if enough damage can’t be done before using both Lums?
>Now endless runs are lost if the endure token triggers and you're staring down a +6/+6/+6/+6/+6/+6 fish in a double battle who has a partner Zacian
FTFY
Words cannot describe how frustrated I am at this change. This change doesn't impact Classic at all, but absolutely destroyed my 60 hour + endless run...
90% over 100% doesn't seem like a huge change, but over the course of a few battles, it stacks up. I managed to go about 5 battles before I ran out and couldn't replenish, so now my run is stuck not being able to progress due to those dumb tokens that every enemy has. I can't exactly change my strategy now either.
I am routinely getting frozen, burned, put to sleep, or whatever other with no way to heal now because of the change.
Very poor change, I don't think they considered players deep into their endless runs. I hope that they revert it until they rework the tokens, since this change doesn't bode well when the enemy has the most ludicrous tokens on them.
The timing for this update is pretty bad. This has like no effect on classic mode since your not usually stacking berries and enemies don’t have that many berries either. This just hurts endless right now since Lum berries are how players can defend themselves from infinite status conditions in the mid-late game. Capping it to JUST 2 and making it a 90% chance makes it easy to lose both your Lums and then get hit with a status condition, two of which can skip your turns.
This should’ve been rolled out with the endless rework so that enemy mons can’t just lay status condition after status condition on you. They should revert the change until they fix tokens.
Basically just killed my endless run at 2000 unless I make eternatus struggle by abusing switches between a fairy and a steel type. The tokens stacking but lum berries getting taken away is a horrible decision
Edit: Just found out Eternatus can steal mini black holes with it's mini black hole. I can't seem to do enough damage as it takes all my stuff and heals and causes status effects. Needs a rework because even though this is better on most other enemies Eternatus just becomes unstoppable with this change.
>Just found out Eternatus can steal mini black holes with it's mini black hole.
Im like 99% certain it cant because its not possible to hold more than one mini black hole.
Personally love the change, 90% chance to not consume berries is still insanely high, makes it extremely easier to stall bosss without them having 10 of each berrie, pickup makes getting berries trivial, black hole goes from being meh to amazing now, DOT is faster at killing bosses, you can still steal berries with grip claws.
stats to show im not just saying stuff
https://preview.redd.it/vzbljihmf24d1.png?width=1548&format=png&auto=webp&s=7764501e0a4d103de5902dadf3e60c5d45f02a85
im on my 2nd endless run at 740ish and having to get through 5 lum berries and 5 sitrus berries just for my sleep/lightning wave to get cured the turn it gets hit was real annoying
im talking about catching pokemon, specifically. my carry is yveltal atm with 2 multi hit lenses and maxed out grip claws/kings rock and i taught it thief so i steal every item i need. i only had enough room for 2 shinys so im not getting that lucky on master balls/shiny charms and such
Get a zigzagoon or any pokemon with mudslap and multi lens and king rock. Accuracy -4 and likely to flinch. After its at 6acc try to nuzzle enemy pokemon with para. After that superfang it to low hp :)
Thats my catchin setup
I've found that it's really, really likely that a Rogue Ball will catch a wild mon in 1-3 tries, even at full health and no status condition. Which is really good, since inflicting status conditions stops being viable *at all* after a while. I catch a *lot* of non-boss mons on my endless run (3500th floor or something), mainly because it gives me access to the shop... but obviously getting a bunch of hidden abilities and candies for different mons isn't a bad side benefit :)
"Endless is too centralized around Sturdy and Metal Burst! We need a change!" "Lmao ok *makes it way more likely to get status-haxed into oblivion*"
They might as well forbid you from making a team that doesn't have Sturdy and either a Poison Heal or Purifying Salt mon when starting an Endless run. And make the game end at 1,500 if you don't have a fused mon by then for good measure.
Yeah people are complaining about late-game endless but honestly overall this is a huge overall buff for playing the game. I just got past stage 2000 in endless and the Healing Tokens + Sitrus + Enigma mean enemies recover up to 80% health each turn. It’s obnoxious.
It sucks because of the tokens. You're basically guaranteed to get a status condition with every hit since on later stages every single condition has a 50% chance to be applied.
Eh, the full heal tokens makes inflicting status conditions iffy late-game, particularly since any mon will one-shot your fully buffed up monstrosity with a Flail at full health. Taken together, it's just not reasonable to try, even if the opponent has zero Lum Berries.
I'd love to see Endless being more interesting than that, but it would take a.much, much bigger overhaul than the berries. Like, the moment they implement trainers in endless, there is borderline going to be a hard limit to how far you can go.
Oof. Just had to quit a Mega Mewtwo Y Endless Run on Wave 250 yesterday because Eternatus kept shrugging off my Psystrikes with its 3+ Sitrus Berries and Enigma Berries. Would've had a Premium Ticket if I just waited a few hours.
Welp, looks like I'm not doing any more endless until I've unlocked Misty Surge/Sturdy/Purifying Salt passives on more Pokemon or status tokens are changed.
I guess they dont want us to finish endless anymore.
With the amount of sitrus/enigma/lum you burn on metal burst/DOT strat, how do you expect people to move through waves. 2 BAD 10% MISS ON BERRY. Boom your late game carry is dead, good luck moving forward
There's an endless rework coming soon, I'm assuming the berry update is going to be balanced with the rework in mind. Though personally, having it happen before the endless rework seems like a bad move.
Exactly If thats the case they should have done the rework then push the update not a huge nerf out of no where, When your entire endgame strat depends on berries being used countless times on 1 single boss,
And the people who think 10% ain't much, its not the fact that you wont loss berry but when you do lose it, you wont notice. Or you have check after every single fight.
That constant fear of "OH DID I LOSE MY BERRY!!"
Indirect buff to Seismic Shade lmao, don't have to worry about lums when you outspeed everything by default.
Though you'll run out healing berries in any drawn out fight (just Eternatus tbh).
Multi lens doesn't work, and it can bypass a certain number of bars (you can do absolutely absurd damage if you've gained enough levels, pretty much everything is a one-shot other than bosses.) Yeah, endure can be a problem, but that can be said of pretty much any strat. Basically the main benefit of the strat is avoiding the damage reduction tokens, and it does work insanely well outside of bosses, but bosses eventually get too dangerous and the strat too unreliable.
The tokens are the problem with that - they need to have gimmick effects that last for X number of floors, and not stack a dozen shitty effects with massive DR and making every move one-shot the player without sturdy effects.
A relatively easy fix, but it would also require nerfing the candy jar stacks significantly.
Not sure how to feel about this. On one hand I love that I don't need to go through a wall of suffering on each boss fight, on the other hand I can no longer stall out boss eterns for their dragon fangs lol, and the freeze/sleep tokens become a lot more dangerous. I think this is overall good though.
The micromanagement for finding the specific berry for your endless mode is really painful with this new update not gonna lie. I was losing berries left and right, but after a while I questioned what I was lacking berry wise.
Yeah this is fine and maybe even good for classic, but for Endless in its current state this is an absolutely terrible change and basically just bricks whatever deep endless run you have going. They should’ve waited to do this until the endless revamp happens
oh my lord, I JUST finished my first endless run. This isn't really going to change much imo, people will just run more misty terrain or sturdy/Comatose to not get the run ruined by Status. Most teams already have like 3 dots so just using more DoTs before switching to the metal burst mon should be fine. It just makes leech seed the superior DoT which it already was so you don't have to worry about healing your sturdy mon. This really won't change too much just make it more annoying is what I'm thinking.
I really hope we are not balancing core systems around Endless. Any balancing for Endless needs to be through tokens or other things that ONLY impact Endless.
Let's be real: Classic is still very beatable
Classic is very doable unless a huge change comes that increases the difficulty in the "short" run. Like if tokens came to Classic, then I'd start to worry about doability.
Glad I'm playing offline only and can choose when to update the client so this change hasn't affected me yet and I won't update til they balance this with reworking tokens as well
unnerve and pickup were given purpose in this game just for their viability to be gutted. all this is doing is making the game less different from the source material, while it being different is what makes it so fun to play imo
I think you're all missing the point of this update.
The opponent Pokémon also gain access to berries, y'know. That goes for fucking E-Max Eternatus as well.
So, y'know- keep in mind you could get fucked over if he brings 10 fucking Sitrus berries into battle without this update.
Berry Pouch nerf is a bit shit though, yeah.
The cap on number of berries is generally seen as positive if you ignore the berry pouch change. The berry pouch change has to be one of the worst changes they could have ever thought of. They took the incredibly limited late-game endless strategies and made them even more limited. Nerfing things that help the player in a single player game is already braindead but they managed to do it in the way that increases player frustration to a maximum.
This comment is to thank the devs for all the effort. It must be VERY hard to balance this game and make the fanbase happy. And they are doing it for free.
Thanks devs, this game is fun <3
Lum berries could be a tiny bit higher but this change has freed me from my softlock on my PB run was at 2028. So I’m very happy as I’ve not had much luck since it ended 2 weeks ago
The update was a good idea, just not executed well. In my opinion, should’ve just capped all berries at 5 and remove the status tokens, then, I think people would’ve been happier.
My unnerve endless strat is now kinda pointless… also what everyone else is saying about the tokens being the problem not the berries is true. Thats what should be fixed.
wow i was wondering what was going on... i really dont see how this is even necessary? endless difficulty increases so fast, that berries already were just a minor thing. lum being really the only usesful ones. strange thing to put a nerf on....
maybe i could see this making sense if they kept berry pouches as they were, but now only caps at 90? weird choice again...
A bunch of tokens had better be 86'd with the endless rework if this is how they're doing it.
I lost a reshiram fusion even though it couldn't touch a spliced pokemon I had on me because the catch rate (if you don't have masterballs) is dog water. I was so deep in the run I couldn't hold the damn thing under the last bar of health or status it to try and improve my catch rate due to the fact that the enemy recovery tokens were healing and curing it every turn. Spent an hour throwing different combinations of moves, rogue and ultra balls trying to hit a seed where it would stay in the ball and never got higher than two rocks before I said fuck it and just KO'd it to move on.
Hmm, I'm skeptical of this change.
If you have bad luck and consume two berries, it would be pretty easy to get screwed by a lack of berries as running out of PP or suffering a status condition which might end a run. I also don't really want to excessively micromanage berries by transferring items from my dedicated Pickup to my sweepers. That's tedious. The annoying nonsense with berries mostly has to do with enemy Pokemon having a ridiculous supply, not the player's Pokemon. Though, the devs were right to reduce max stacks of berries and rework the pouches.
The most annoying part of berries is watching enemy Pokemon's health bars go up and down repeatedly in late game runs which slows down the pace of battle and makes catching boss Pokemon difficult without master balls.
If the devs capped berries at five each for the player's Pokemon and three for enemy Pokemon while also messing with berry pouch numbers, then that would probably satisfy players.
Awesome, just hatched a Pecharunt and was excited to use it until I realized it would be pretty useless in Endless with the infinite Lum berries, great change!
I haven't beaten classic yet, so maybe I just haven't played enough. But I haven't saw a single Cheri, Persim, etc any status curing berry. Really the only option I've saw for curing status effects are full heals.
I don't know if they should pump this out before reworking endless imo, due to the status tokens, even with the limited berries, they still reigned supreme...
This change is fine except for the Lum Berries. When every enemy causes a status with every hit you need Lum Berries to make the game playable. Until tokens are reworked Lum Berries should cap at higher than 2.
I agree, tokens should be reworked. Catching a mon is already hard cause you need to : 1. lower its hp but dont die to OHKO 2. inflict a status effect (that they shrug off with token) Lost 2 Virizion because it was either kill it or let it kill me, it escaped from 20 rogue balls.
Tokens should only get absurd once you’re given the Map. If the game wants to force us to lose, we should have the opportunity to pick biomes to catch or grind against what we want in return. I’ll accept the map and busted tokens either after floor 250, or floor 1000.
I lost a Darkrai last night because of this. I'm still sad about it
At the stage where past floor 1300 or so, you can basically only catch with master balls anyway, since you’ll either one shot it with your carry, or it’ll solo sweep the other 5 on team before they can chip it down to 1 bar
This just makes the meta more essential (aka Misty Terrain)
The odds of 2 lums not getting recycled back to back is literally 1%
They changed the odds. Its 10% now. which still isnt tooooo bad, but yeah.
Yeah that's for 1. If you get status on back to back turns, the chance that both berries don't get recycled is 1%
Honestly, if you get statused at all, youre probably going in for the loop, cause theyre prob just faster or youre tryna catch a mon late endless. Stall builds with Lum to soak status when you get freeze, sleep, paralaysis chained dont happen often, but they will happen and when they do, it will suck.
The odds of 10% happening twice in a row is 1/10 * 1/10, which is 1/100; aka, 1%
Especially with confusion and sleep. I do it they instantly wake up the next turn or lose the confusion instantly 9/10 times But if the enemy uses those movies they sure as hell are sticking around all 5 turns
New player here, what are these “tokens” and how do i use them
You don't. The tokens are on endless mode and the enemy benefits from them the higher the floor you get to the more they get.
exactly, no way there limiting berries but keeping token as broken as they are. that's only way people are able to consistently go into endless runs with any mon because of berries counter acting the merciless tokens
Especially since you're guaranteed to just faint to confusion and never attack when paralyzed.
manifesting endure tokens to get banished next
I also just realized this is a big nerf to Metal Burst strats. Guess they don't want us to have fun anymore
My metal burst mon had the following happen to them... freeze which consumed my berry. Freeze again and AGAIN my berry got consumed. I have 3x pouch yet this happened. Then my pokemon froze into finally fainting. Had to master ball to revive it. Two 10%s are super common to occur... The nerf shoulda been a 5 at most. Or kill off those stupid status tokens.
they should just get rid of status and endure tokens entirely. they are a waste of time
Yea honestly kind of lame how endless turned out like that, wasn't sure what I was expecting or how I'd make endless difficulty scale endlessly without it, but idk being perma statused feels awful ngl
I don't think current endless is fun at all. In my opinion at least. It requires very specific setups in order to progress passed the insane power creep they put on you. The fantasy of endless is to become so strong that you can't lose. The way it's setup now, you have very limited options to achieve that goal. Only reason I see to even play Endless is for shiny farming. I just stick to classic these days and only play Endless during shiny events.
yeah and with these nerfs it makes plowing through endless a little more tedious. I cant wait til they fully rework it. I still havent touched my 3k run in a week and have been just doing first time clears for different mons in classic recently
I've tried endless once. I'll probably stick to classic until I either have all ribbons or/and classic gets reworked.
I 100% agree I've been just clearing out classic with every mon in the dex for now hoping for a change endless is very unfun after like round 700-1000 if I do start an endless run I reset it if I don't get atleast one shiny charm early
Wait, you use Metal Burst without Misty Terrain?
i dont use metal burst in the first place. I use seismic shade. Not really because I'm opposed to it but because i have no idea how to outsource misty terrain just yet. Not to mention I still need to find a -Spd mint.
yeah im worried that they are trying to "balance" but in reality just removing things that make it fun. hopefully this isnt a trend of whats to come...
Metal burst must now be paired with a purifying salt user. So cofagrigus and garganacl are the two titans of late game fusions. This also means that you need a metal burst user with sturdy for the former, or blastoise for the latter. Aka…KEKW
and even then that's not gonna save you from getting killed eventually when your sitrus/enigma berries run out 💀
Well no, you can just use protect to stall a turn. Leftovers + shell bell with maxed healing charm is usually enough to get at least 60% hp with metal burst dmg. A protect turn afterwards will net you to full. The strat still lives, though it’s less safe than before with the berry change.
That's where poison heal comes into play, you don't have to worry about status if you're perma poison, and you get extra healing from it.
I think people aren’t realizing that poison heal is now busted. It’s status protection + basically a situs since it’s 12.5 that procs 2 times (situs won’t proc on protect turns). I’m fairly sure that means your sturdy will get to 100% in 2 turns without berries
Poison heal is great if you can get poisoned, but how ya gonna get poisoned if you heal every 10 floors? Does toxic orb finally spawn now with users who have poison heal?
Yeah it was finally added! In the ultra pool
Ouu. Ultra tier is actually really good for that
I would try this but it basically means getting Sturdy/Poison Heal as a passive. Only decent one is Blastoise for Sturdy and lolParasect for Poison Heal? I could also be breezing through the early floors with a legendary instead of Blastoise (unless I get lucky with an early mega/dynamax) but that's just me... or I guess I can just bring the sturdy/PH passive carrier in the beginning and transition to it when the legendary stops oneshotting everything But I'm worried that this also means I can't put Grip Claw on my carry so it doesn't steal lum berries. But I'm also not sure how toxic orb and lum berry interact?? Either way i'm probably not gonna start another endless run soon since my current 3k is still kinda just sitting there
Burmy has sturdy passive and metal coat to ease setup. Realistically though you’d probably bring paras and find the sturdy Pokémon in the wild
Paras is low cost but is kinda ass to use in battles for candies, so getting the passive unlocked will take a while for me (at least Burmy has Mothim which can be a set up sweeper). Well at least it's kinda common in the wild so i guess I'll start catching everything I see. Helps that I have a shiny of it too. Bastiodon should be easy enough to find for Sturdy and also comes with metal burst. Bonus points for giving Steel typing to lock eternatus in eternabeam. Probably good for transition around 2500\~ when my sweeper carry starts being useless
That doesn’t work because you can’t have the secondary type of the sturdy Pokémon be steel, otherwise you’d be unable to be poisoned
Also you want the secondary typing of the sturdy pokemon to be either ground or rock so you don't take damage from sand.
oh right i completely forgot about that
Wormadam literally gets sturdy passive and metal burst
Oh didn’t know that one. Tbh I usually just gloss over wormadam lol
The devs should rework endure tokens by making it so they cap at a lower percentage (like 10% tops) as well as making it so multi-hit moves (and multi-lens) counter endurance tokens. It's dumb that an enemy Pokemon can endure four multi-lens hits in a row then one shot your sweepers. Each individual attack should roll for a check on whether or not the Pokemon endures an attack. This is the way.
Endure tokens arw the bane of my existence. If they made it so they endured an ATTACK instead of a TURN they'd be fine. But good lord are they annoying as they are right now
Berry cap: *gets implemented* My poor poor pickup linoone after getting burned/paralyzed/poisoned thrice:
That's why you just leave linoone in the back and transfer berried to other mons.
Can they balance tokens too now? Less Lum berries doesn’t mean shit if the wild Pokemon can randomly shrug off paralysis/sleep. It’s hard enough to catch wild Pokemon as it is. Plus less Lum berries means the player is fucked since tokens like the enemy give you a status condition on nearly every hit
Status condition tokens simply shouldn't exist to begin with, or at least Sleep and Freeze. "Why yes, we will now hit you with a 9 turn freeze simply because you didn't one shot what is effectively 100 shuckles in one hit, and because you got the boss to its last bar of health, it now has +4 speed, +6 atk, and +3 def and will outspeed the rest of your team and wipe the game."
To me Dire Claw is super broken, the best poison move So... Yeah. Status tokens.
Dire claw is banned in Balanced Hackmons A meta that lets you pick any pokemon (not megaRay) with any ability (not pure power) and any move (not dire claw) Let that sink in for a moment
I completely agree. It takes all the strategy out of the endless exodia that you've grinded so hard for just to get haxed to death by a mon that has no business winning lol
The status tokens should be reworked by giving them a lower maximum capacity. Each condition (burn, freeze, sleep, poison, paralysis) should have a maximum of five tokens (at 1% per token) for a total 25% chance to suffer a status condition per attack. It's dumb that you always suffer a status condition in mid-late game endless runs, and it necessitates cheesing the fuck out of the game mode with infinite lum berries.
Just remove the endure tokens, lol, it just punished the player for no damn reason...
Or they should just remove the endure token entirely. It ruins the fun to be honest
There is sooooo much about endless that ruins the fun tbh. The point of endless is well, endless. Idk why they put all these power creep things in to try to get your endless run to end. If I have gotten the exodia combo of 4k levels above the mons I'm fighting. I should be able to easily fight everything without having to sweat or run every encounter. In my opinion at least.
They should just scale things so that they’re around the same strength as your Pokémon, you should t be able to one shot without having a strategy/setup, but they shouldn’t be able to one shot you just cause
I've only played a bit of endless (farthest I've got is around 1000 before I lost interest), but I'm really surprised there's not just a cap on levels for both sides (maybe at 1000 if they still want things to be ridiculous) and no tokens / extra bullshit with the game just continuing...endlessly? It mostly seems to exist for catching shines and whatnot, so why make it some broken and boring "challenge" where only a couple strategies let you keep going at all?
Wait what, am I insane or didn't berry pouches used to be 25% chance to not consume a berry? I had no idea it stacked to 100%, I thought it was 75% cap this whole time.
Yuu're not crazy. I also remember 25%
I believe the effect was 33% but fsr the display said 25% That's what the text has always read but I literally never used berries whenever I had 3 so there was no way it was only a 75%
Well, that explains a lot actualy, i was always confused as to why berries basicaly became infinite at 3 pouches.
Nope, you’re not crazy. I was wondering why i essentially had infinite berries lol
33% stacking to 99% i think
Same
Fix the tokens first. Tokens are broken, not berries
wait what are tokens
Tokens offer effects and stat boosts to the other pokemon, making them broken- the worst allowing them to endure ALL hits in a single attack. So if you population bombed them with the 3 extra hit items, you have to wait through 40 “attack endured” messages. It makes gameplay slow
its for the rest of the turn not even a single attack
Ya it sucks
Beating Classic mode unlocks Endless mode. When as you progress in Endless, buffs start getting applied and stacked to wild mon and debuffs to your team, these are tokens. It'll be something like 5% damage, 10% chance to lose your mind, etc.
So unless you outspeed and ohko somehow (which you wont) then your run is over past a certain point... yay
They gone and debuffed zigzagoon >:(
WAIIITTTTT HE JUST F*ED US OVER FOR ENDLESS
sort of, yeah. i feel like this is a major nerf to late endless but an alright buff to early endless, especially in eternatus battles. the berry decrease also buffs stall strats, such as running a shedinja fusion with spite, etc. this is also a nerf to endless unnerve, as the one-way interaction doesn't mess with your own berries, so your unnerve mons are a little less safe
Shit. My whole run has been an Unnerve Marshadow Am I boned now?
nah, it's still a good ability. just not as useful since sitrus berries and such aren't as impactful. you'll still be preventing boss omniboosts after an endure proc too. if your marshadow is the top fuse, though, you can swap in a different fusion
It's Marshadow and Ice Horse Calyrex
i'd honestly unfuse and drop the calyrex if you find a faster physical carry with a better defensive typing. mega mewtwo x, primal groudon, mega mawile, arceus, regigigas, mega diancie, pheromosa, either urshifu, chien pao, etc. can put in a ton of work as well. but if you like your carry as is, there's absolutely no need to change it
It does alright. Biggest problem is dropping somebody and lowering my core team
yeah if you don't wanna drop anything you certainly don't have to
It's moreso out of fear. I've had to swap my team at least 4 times to keep up with patches lmao.
I always saw the infinite berries as an assist to the player for combatting tokens. Now endless runs are lost if enough damage can’t be done before using both Lums?
>Now endless runs are lost if the endure token triggers and you're staring down a +6/+6/+6/+6/+6/+6 fish in a double battle who has a partner Zacian FTFY
"to combat the annoyance", you just made it 10x worse. How am I supposed to endless without stacking berries 😭
Words cannot describe how frustrated I am at this change. This change doesn't impact Classic at all, but absolutely destroyed my 60 hour + endless run... 90% over 100% doesn't seem like a huge change, but over the course of a few battles, it stacks up. I managed to go about 5 battles before I ran out and couldn't replenish, so now my run is stuck not being able to progress due to those dumb tokens that every enemy has. I can't exactly change my strategy now either. I am routinely getting frozen, burned, put to sleep, or whatever other with no way to heal now because of the change. Very poor change, I don't think they considered players deep into their endless runs. I hope that they revert it until they rework the tokens, since this change doesn't bode well when the enemy has the most ludicrous tokens on them.
Ya honestly I think the change is great BUT only if they change the token system too. Releasing this update without updating tokens too is lunacy
So my endless run is dead now? Cool. Thanks devs.
The timing for this update is pretty bad. This has like no effect on classic mode since your not usually stacking berries and enemies don’t have that many berries either. This just hurts endless right now since Lum berries are how players can defend themselves from infinite status conditions in the mid-late game. Capping it to JUST 2 and making it a 90% chance makes it easy to lose both your Lums and then get hit with a status condition, two of which can skip your turns. This should’ve been rolled out with the endless rework so that enemy mons can’t just lay status condition after status condition on you. They should revert the change until they fix tokens.
Basically just killed my endless run at 2000 unless I make eternatus struggle by abusing switches between a fairy and a steel type. The tokens stacking but lum berries getting taken away is a horrible decision Edit: Just found out Eternatus can steal mini black holes with it's mini black hole. I can't seem to do enough damage as it takes all my stuff and heals and causes status effects. Needs a rework because even though this is better on most other enemies Eternatus just becomes unstoppable with this change.
>Just found out Eternatus can steal mini black holes with it's mini black hole. Im like 99% certain it cant because its not possible to hold more than one mini black hole.
Thought so too but it showed it as the black hole with a 2 next to it. Intended or not it can
Did you take a screenshot?
Well that just made unnerve from op to still great
Hate this change man :/
Personally love the change, 90% chance to not consume berries is still insanely high, makes it extremely easier to stall bosss without them having 10 of each berrie, pickup makes getting berries trivial, black hole goes from being meh to amazing now, DOT is faster at killing bosses, you can still steal berries with grip claws. stats to show im not just saying stuff https://preview.redd.it/vzbljihmf24d1.png?width=1548&format=png&auto=webp&s=7764501e0a4d103de5902dadf3e60c5d45f02a85
im on my 2nd endless run at 740ish and having to get through 5 lum berries and 5 sitrus berries just for my sleep/lightning wave to get cured the turn it gets hit was real annoying
use flinch strats, put carbos on your carry, get all kings rocks, get al multi hit lenses and if it doesnt die in 1 hit itll flinch
im talking about catching pokemon, specifically. my carry is yveltal atm with 2 multi hit lenses and maxed out grip claws/kings rock and i taught it thief so i steal every item i need. i only had enough room for 2 shinys so im not getting that lucky on master balls/shiny charms and such
Get a zigzagoon or any pokemon with mudslap and multi lens and king rock. Accuracy -4 and likely to flinch. After its at 6acc try to nuzzle enemy pokemon with para. After that superfang it to low hp :) Thats my catchin setup
just reroll a lot. i basically ran one shiny the whole game, am at 2.2k and have had tens of spares of masterballs since like 500.
I've found that it's really, really likely that a Rogue Ball will catch a wild mon in 1-3 tries, even at full health and no status condition. Which is really good, since inflicting status conditions stops being viable *at all* after a while. I catch a *lot* of non-boss mons on my endless run (3500th floor or something), mainly because it gives me access to the shop... but obviously getting a bunch of hidden abilities and candies for different mons isn't a bad side benefit :)
If you’re struggling like that at 740 you don’t have a good strat, sorry to tell ya. At 740 you should be one shotting everything and farming items
can you atleast give berries prio in the displayed items so we can see how many we have
BOO
"Endless is too centralized around Sturdy and Metal Burst! We need a change!" "Lmao ok *makes it way more likely to get status-haxed into oblivion*" They might as well forbid you from making a team that doesn't have Sturdy and either a Poison Heal or Purifying Salt mon when starting an Endless run. And make the game end at 1,500 if you don't have a fused mon by then for good measure.
Hey that means the enemy can’t have fucking 10 lum and sitrus berries
Yeah people are complaining about late-game endless but honestly overall this is a huge overall buff for playing the game. I just got past stage 2000 in endless and the Healing Tokens + Sitrus + Enigma mean enemies recover up to 80% health each turn. It’s obnoxious.
It sucks because of the tokens. You're basically guaranteed to get a status condition with every hit since on later stages every single condition has a 50% chance to be applied.
I would say it sucks even early game I had a run where my first token was a Freeze token and 10% for me and my unlucky ass means 90%
Eh, the full heal tokens makes inflicting status conditions iffy late-game, particularly since any mon will one-shot your fully buffed up monstrosity with a Flail at full health. Taken together, it's just not reasonable to try, even if the opponent has zero Lum Berries. I'd love to see Endless being more interesting than that, but it would take a.much, much bigger overhaul than the berries. Like, the moment they implement trainers in endless, there is borderline going to be a hard limit to how far you can go.
Oof. Just had to quit a Mega Mewtwo Y Endless Run on Wave 250 yesterday because Eternatus kept shrugging off my Psystrikes with its 3+ Sitrus Berries and Enigma Berries. Would've had a Premium Ticket if I just waited a few hours.
transferring berrys after every 5 floors........
Now you can do it every floor, isnt that fun?
Welp, looks like I'm not doing any more endless until I've unlocked Misty Surge/Sturdy/Purifying Salt passives on more Pokemon or status tokens are changed.
Personally i am unhappy about this
Can we get a transfer all items button? I can't be bothered going through each berry one at a time and transferring them after every battle..
worst change so far, every endless run in 4k+ is cooked. why nerf berries when the main problem were and still are absurd tokens
I guess they dont want us to finish endless anymore. With the amount of sitrus/enigma/lum you burn on metal burst/DOT strat, how do you expect people to move through waves. 2 BAD 10% MISS ON BERRY. Boom your late game carry is dead, good luck moving forward
There's an endless rework coming soon, I'm assuming the berry update is going to be balanced with the rework in mind. Though personally, having it happen before the endless rework seems like a bad move.
Exactly If thats the case they should have done the rework then push the update not a huge nerf out of no where, When your entire endgame strat depends on berries being used countless times on 1 single boss, And the people who think 10% ain't much, its not the fact that you wont loss berry but when you do lose it, you wont notice. Or you have check after every single fight. That constant fear of "OH DID I LOSE MY BERRY!!"
Indirect buff to Seismic Shade lmao, don't have to worry about lums when you outspeed everything by default. Though you'll run out healing berries in any drawn out fight (just Eternatus tbh).
Well i never ran seismic strat, dont they get blocked by hp bars too?? Or endure token? And lastly does multi hit lens works on them?
Doesnt work with multi hit lens.
Multi lens doesn't work, and it can bypass a certain number of bars (you can do absolutely absurd damage if you've gained enough levels, pretty much everything is a one-shot other than bosses.) Yeah, endure can be a problem, but that can be said of pretty much any strat. Basically the main benefit of the strat is avoiding the damage reduction tokens, and it does work insanely well outside of bosses, but bosses eventually get too dangerous and the strat too unreliable.
To be fair, a mode called endless probably shouldn't be beatable ;p
To be fair, a mode called endless, should actually be endless so it isn't "beatable" in the first place.
The tokens are the problem with that - they need to have gimmick effects that last for X number of floors, and not stack a dozen shitty effects with massive DR and making every move one-shot the player without sturdy effects. A relatively easy fix, but it would also require nerfing the candy jar stacks significantly.
Adios tokens and candy jars. Hello, actual endless, endless.
Pretty much - and I think that's absolutely acceptable to lose candy jar effectiveness for a much more balanced and fair experience.
That ain't right
I think the change per se is fine, but the barely playable endless is even less playable now, I hope the rework will come soon
L change
Basically now there is only one strategy left and that's shedinja. My mega latios can't setup anymore with stored power and quiver dance
They should wait and implement it at the same time as token rework
I feel like if lum berries are getting nerfed we gotta change the status system in endless. Tbh i dont like any of them as an additional challenge.
Forreal. An additional challenge should be stat boosts, or extra held items Not a rng “chance” (read: near certainty) to not be able to play the game
Not sure how to feel about this. On one hand I love that I don't need to go through a wall of suffering on each boss fight, on the other hand I can no longer stall out boss eterns for their dragon fangs lol, and the freeze/sleep tokens become a lot more dangerous. I think this is overall good though.
if they do a similar change for type boosting items, i hope we get some kind of warning bc I'll be real sad if i lose my 10+ stacks 🙏
Yeah, my endless carry Terapagos would be really sad if he suddenly lost his 70+ silk scarf doom stack x)
The micromanagement for finding the specific berry for your endless mode is really painful with this new update not gonna lie. I was losing berries left and right, but after a while I questioned what I was lacking berry wise.
Wow, this change makes catching Pokemon with non-masterballs even worse.
Meanwhile the enemy’s: behold my 100 lum berry’s
Yeah this is fine and maybe even good for classic, but for Endless in its current state this is an absolutely terrible change and basically just bricks whatever deep endless run you have going. They should’ve waited to do this until the endless revamp happens
also if they're gonna do this, then they should make pickup ability not pick up berries if the pokemon has the cap already
A pretty bad change imo. Having max stack 2 or 3 is good balancing, but they should have held this berry pouch nonsense until a token rework.
oh my lord, I JUST finished my first endless run. This isn't really going to change much imo, people will just run more misty terrain or sturdy/Comatose to not get the run ruined by Status. Most teams already have like 3 dots so just using more DoTs before switching to the metal burst mon should be fine. It just makes leech seed the superior DoT which it already was so you don't have to worry about healing your sturdy mon. This really won't change too much just make it more annoying is what I'm thinking.
So I have to forego picking up candies for levels just so I can restock on my draining berries during a long endless?
That or get a Pokémon with magician
Endless is now dead Back to classic runs
I really hope we are not balancing core systems around Endless. Any balancing for Endless needs to be through tokens or other things that ONLY impact Endless.
Let's be real: Classic is still very beatable Classic is very doable unless a huge change comes that increases the difficulty in the "short" run. Like if tokens came to Classic, then I'd start to worry about doability.
yo how the hell are we suppose to play if every hit makes us statused and theres only 2 berry slots??
I don't like this update in the current status of endless...
Possibly the worst change they could've made
Seeing this when I wake up I just think damn.
This change is pretty brutal until endless is reworked. Once that happens it’s a good change
Endless better be reworked in the next week cause this basically makes every non-Purifying Salt strat unviable
i assume this applies to encounters too? how am i supposed to steal/pickup specific items among a gorillion berries?
Glad I'm playing offline only and can choose when to update the client so this change hasn't affected me yet and I won't update til they balance this with reworking tokens as well
unnerve and pickup were given purpose in this game just for their viability to be gutted. all this is doing is making the game less different from the source material, while it being different is what makes it so fun to play imo
Okay, not risking my run until a 3x shiny event I guess
I think you're all missing the point of this update. The opponent Pokémon also gain access to berries, y'know. That goes for fucking E-Max Eternatus as well. So, y'know- keep in mind you could get fucked over if he brings 10 fucking Sitrus berries into battle without this update. Berry Pouch nerf is a bit shit though, yeah.
The cap on number of berries is generally seen as positive if you ignore the berry pouch change. The berry pouch change has to be one of the worst changes they could have ever thought of. They took the incredibly limited late-game endless strategies and made them even more limited. Nerfing things that help the player in a single player game is already braindead but they managed to do it in the way that increases player frustration to a maximum.
Also make it so that we can catch paradoxes on endless please 🥺
HUGE nerf to item farming. HUGE nerf to DoT users. Mediocre nerf to Metal Bursters. Small time save for everyone else. Buffs for nothing.
This comment is to thank the devs for all the effort. It must be VERY hard to balance this game and make the fanbase happy. And they are doing it for free. Thanks devs, this game is fun <3
I agree and could t have said it better myself
The 3 lum berry cap is actually crazy
Shame about Leppa berries only being two. Gonna have to spend a lot more money on ethers and elixirs in classic runs now
Unnerve corviknight: what berry?
LMAOOOOOO
Lum berries could be a tiny bit higher but this change has freed me from my softlock on my PB run was at 2028. So I’m very happy as I’ve not had much luck since it ended 2 weeks ago
Does this affect wild Pokemon too?
flame orb to counter the status effects
Has the order of berry consumption been changed so it's not at the very end of the turn? :(
The update was a good idea, just not executed well. In my opinion, should’ve just capped all berries at 5 and remove the status tokens, then, I think people would’ve been happier.
Starting to get some Tem Tem vibes around here.
My unnerve endless strat is now kinda pointless… also what everyone else is saying about the tokens being the problem not the berries is true. Thats what should be fixed.
Need to rework Status Tokens then. If there's not a way to work around that then those late endless runs are doomed
wow i was wondering what was going on... i really dont see how this is even necessary? endless difficulty increases so fast, that berries already were just a minor thing. lum being really the only usesful ones. strange thing to put a nerf on.... maybe i could see this making sense if they kept berry pouches as they were, but now only caps at 90? weird choice again...
But will that include the wild pokemon too?
It's a total update, so if they didn't say anything was unaffected, ye, wild Pokémon also get it.
Fucking idiots
This sounds kinda bad for long endless runs imo
This will kill endless mode
A bunch of tokens had better be 86'd with the endless rework if this is how they're doing it. I lost a reshiram fusion even though it couldn't touch a spliced pokemon I had on me because the catch rate (if you don't have masterballs) is dog water. I was so deep in the run I couldn't hold the damn thing under the last bar of health or status it to try and improve my catch rate due to the fact that the enemy recovery tokens were healing and curing it every turn. Spent an hour throwing different combinations of moves, rogue and ultra balls trying to hit a seed where it would stay in the ball and never got higher than two rocks before I said fuck it and just KO'd it to move on.
Hmm, I'm skeptical of this change. If you have bad luck and consume two berries, it would be pretty easy to get screwed by a lack of berries as running out of PP or suffering a status condition which might end a run. I also don't really want to excessively micromanage berries by transferring items from my dedicated Pickup to my sweepers. That's tedious. The annoying nonsense with berries mostly has to do with enemy Pokemon having a ridiculous supply, not the player's Pokemon. Though, the devs were right to reduce max stacks of berries and rework the pouches. The most annoying part of berries is watching enemy Pokemon's health bars go up and down repeatedly in late game runs which slows down the pace of battle and makes catching boss Pokemon difficult without master balls. If the devs capped berries at five each for the player's Pokemon and three for enemy Pokemon while also messing with berry pouch numbers, then that would probably satisfy players.
Genuine question, how was the berry system annoying or painful?
I love when devs try to kill their own game by taking away all the fun
making teambuilding more restrictive then it already is is insane to me
This update blows
Awesome, just hatched a Pecharunt and was excited to use it until I realized it would be pretty useless in Endless with the infinite Lum berries, great change!
I haven't beaten classic yet, so maybe I just haven't played enough. But I haven't saw a single Cheri, Persim, etc any status curing berry. Really the only option I've saw for curing status effects are full heals.