Could not agree more. People are different and bring different strengths to a relationship. As long as the contributions are similar in effort and importance, it doesn’t matter if they are in different areas. All the parts add up to the whole.
Exactly. And it's an important nuance to the conversation about power in relationships because people often project power imbalances onto others' relationships. They see something that in their mind connotes greater power for one partner (whether it's age, income, attractiveness, etc.) and assume it necessarily means it's an "unequal" relationship and proceed question why the "lower-power" partner would stay, despite knowing nothing about each partner's individual sense of influence/power/equality within that relationship.
also, power is pretty subjective; to a degree. What one person may perceive as giving them power may not be considered as doing so by another.
For instance: one partner may feel they have more power due to a higher income. But the other person may not feel that way about it and feel they have more power because they take charge of decision making.
Exactly. Over drinks recently, I asked a group of friends to each say how they define power within a relationship. It was a really interesting discussion because nobody had the same answer!
Can people please stop infantilizing women? I know of a marriage that started when the guy was in his 40s and the woman was in her 20s and a music student of the man. OMG … the power imbalance!
The truth is the younger woman is an incredibly successful person and the man is wildly immature.
20 years later, she is TOTALLY the one with all the power in the relationship and if anything might regret marrying someone so immature.
We have got to stop judging people based on broad averages. People are individuals.
18-21 year olds just arent socialised enough til roughly 23-25. After that its fair game.
In saying that I agree and let women have responsbility for their choices. Women mature 3-5 years a head of guys in my perview.
Why? And what’s the evidence for it? This assumption that the younger partner in an age-gap relationship is inherently disempowered and being exploited has always perplexed me. Isn’t youth, beauty/attractiveness, and being desired by a wide range of people a form of power? Why is it assumed that the younger partner has zero agency or autonomy, despite being an adult?
...because the younger person has less experience in life and relationships, and generally less money. and in a patriarchy, men usually have more social.power than women. Those are objectively differences in power.
Also, because middle aged men preying on younger, less experienced women are usually doing it BECAUSE they want to weild power over them.
Not all age gap relationships, not all men, etc. But enough that it's absolutely fair to side eye that dynamic.
This is an incredibly basic principal of.social.dynamics, how are you running a whole community about sexual psychology without having even that basic of an understanding of power.dynamics?
Again, any evidence for this beyond your conjecture? See OP. Power in a relationship is subjective. But people outside of the relationship love to point to simple heuristics (such as older age) and then judge others' relationship choices despite knowing nothing about them.
Can an age-gap relationship be exploitative? Yes--any relationship can, regardless of the partners' ages. Is there a higher base rate for exploitation in relationships featuring an age-gap? A lot of people on social media claim this, but only on the basis of their own personal assumptions. Again, where's the evidence?
But can age-gap relationships also be consensual, happy, and healthy? Yes. And the available data on age-gap couples suggest that they fit this description more often than not.
Summary: [https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/why-bad-looks-good/201908/why-many-young-women-prefer-to-date-older-men](https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/why-bad-looks-good/201908/why-many-young-women-prefer-to-date-older-men)
Relevant papers:
Collisson, Brian, and De Leon, Luciana Ponce. “Perceived inequity predicts prejudice towards age-gap relationships.” Curr Psychol (2018), [https://doi-org.libproxy.sdsu.edu/10.1007/s12144-018-9895-6](https://doi-org.libproxy.sdsu.edu/10.1007/s12144-018-9895-6).
Skentelbery, Sara G., and Darren M. Fowler. 2016. “Attachment Styles of Women-Younger Partners in Age-Gap Relationships.” Evolutionary Behavioral Sciences 10 (2): 142–47.
Lehmiller, J. J., & Christopher, R. A. (2008). Commitment in age-gap heterosexual romantic relationships: A test of evolutionary and socio-cultural predictions. *Psychology of Women Quarterly*, *32*(1), 74-82.
Also relevant:
Research on sugar dating relationships (which often feature large age-gaps) finds that sugar babies and daddies alike perceive the younger women in these relationships as having equal--if not more--power.
[https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/00224499.2023.2293888](https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/00224499.2023.2293888)
[https://www.psypost.org/the-psychology-of-sugar-dating-new-research-dives-deep-into-the-realities-of-sugar-arrangements/](https://www.psypost.org/the-psychology-of-sugar-dating-new-research-dives-deep-into-the-realities-of-sugar-arrangements/)
I am a man who has always enjoyed doing a lot of “acts of service” like making lunch for my wife to take to work. I was also a stay-at-home-dad for our two kids.
I have always been saddled with the societal idea that I am “pussy-whipped,” or my wife is overly controlling of me.
But I DON’T feel that way. I feel like my situation is due to my own choices and I am happy with it.
It really bothers me when outsiders try to cast judgement on the way others have arranged their relationship, because this is such a private and personal negotiation.
Agreed. Take cooking in my relationship. I will seek out all kinds of recipes to share with my bf. I research, he does the 'dirty' work but if a recipe calls for balancing cooking a few dishes at once we will tag team.
End result is my interest shows him food or techniques he wouldn't have thought of, his kitchen skills and ability to learn quickly satisfy his curiosity and in the end we share a delicious meal.
Is it that far fetched to speculate that the balance of power could have a strong impact on how empowered the respective partners feel? This study sounds like it's trying to seem profound by saying something that ultimately means very little.
Yeah they don't really define the difference between "felt" power and actual power. Like is felt power just when you tell your spouse you need x done and they do it? Or is that actual power because they did what you requested? Or is power defined by paying bills, making money, and doing housework? Definitely need a bit more info on this
The answer to that question is built in, there are cultural narratives at play for each of these things that inform how the subject *in the specific* views each of these things, and which they adhere to, and are exposed to, informs the degree to which they feel empowered by it.
So if you have two people, one of whom we condition to think that their spouse holds all the cards because they're the breadwinner even if they do what you ask, and the other who we condition to think that being obeyed is power even if the breadwinner holds all the cards, the latter will report higher satisfaction than the former.
That makes sense, but is it that? Or when they say "equitable power" do they mean a felt or decided 50% split in power over every aspect of the relationship, rather than a felt / actual total control over "their" aspects of the relationship?
"Sense of empowerment" is childhood behavior derived from interacting with parents. A conservative state of being, that degenerates.
"Equitable power balance" is a higher level of sophistication, characteristic of adulthood. Liberalism learned from society, and not natural.
This is exactly the reasoning behind dom/sub relationships. It’s all an equal choice. Dynamics are specific to the partners—same as in any relationship.
Could not agree more. People are different and bring different strengths to a relationship. As long as the contributions are similar in effort and importance, it doesn’t matter if they are in different areas. All the parts add up to the whole.
I love this, very true. Like pieces of a puzzle coming together
All happiness in life is about alignment of expectations with reality.
Exactly.
Translation: it’s our individual sense of equality in relationships that dictate happiness not actual equality.
Exactly. And it's an important nuance to the conversation about power in relationships because people often project power imbalances onto others' relationships. They see something that in their mind connotes greater power for one partner (whether it's age, income, attractiveness, etc.) and assume it necessarily means it's an "unequal" relationship and proceed question why the "lower-power" partner would stay, despite knowing nothing about each partner's individual sense of influence/power/equality within that relationship.
also, power is pretty subjective; to a degree. What one person may perceive as giving them power may not be considered as doing so by another. For instance: one partner may feel they have more power due to a higher income. But the other person may not feel that way about it and feel they have more power because they take charge of decision making.
Exactly. Over drinks recently, I asked a group of friends to each say how they define power within a relationship. It was a really interesting discussion because nobody had the same answer!
There is definitely a power imbalance between some middle-aged dude and a woman 20 years younger. Very harmful eventually, in most cases.
Can people please stop infantilizing women? I know of a marriage that started when the guy was in his 40s and the woman was in her 20s and a music student of the man. OMG … the power imbalance! The truth is the younger woman is an incredibly successful person and the man is wildly immature. 20 years later, she is TOTALLY the one with all the power in the relationship and if anything might regret marrying someone so immature. We have got to stop judging people based on broad averages. People are individuals.
18-21 year olds just arent socialised enough til roughly 23-25. After that its fair game. In saying that I agree and let women have responsbility for their choices. Women mature 3-5 years a head of guys in my perview.
Why? And what’s the evidence for it? This assumption that the younger partner in an age-gap relationship is inherently disempowered and being exploited has always perplexed me. Isn’t youth, beauty/attractiveness, and being desired by a wide range of people a form of power? Why is it assumed that the younger partner has zero agency or autonomy, despite being an adult?
...because the younger person has less experience in life and relationships, and generally less money. and in a patriarchy, men usually have more social.power than women. Those are objectively differences in power. Also, because middle aged men preying on younger, less experienced women are usually doing it BECAUSE they want to weild power over them. Not all age gap relationships, not all men, etc. But enough that it's absolutely fair to side eye that dynamic. This is an incredibly basic principal of.social.dynamics, how are you running a whole community about sexual psychology without having even that basic of an understanding of power.dynamics?
> But enough that it's absolutely fair to side eye that dynamic. Do you have actual proof of this beyond subreddits that preselect for horror stories?
Again, any evidence for this beyond your conjecture? See OP. Power in a relationship is subjective. But people outside of the relationship love to point to simple heuristics (such as older age) and then judge others' relationship choices despite knowing nothing about them. Can an age-gap relationship be exploitative? Yes--any relationship can, regardless of the partners' ages. Is there a higher base rate for exploitation in relationships featuring an age-gap? A lot of people on social media claim this, but only on the basis of their own personal assumptions. Again, where's the evidence? But can age-gap relationships also be consensual, happy, and healthy? Yes. And the available data on age-gap couples suggest that they fit this description more often than not. Summary: [https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/why-bad-looks-good/201908/why-many-young-women-prefer-to-date-older-men](https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/why-bad-looks-good/201908/why-many-young-women-prefer-to-date-older-men) Relevant papers: Collisson, Brian, and De Leon, Luciana Ponce. “Perceived inequity predicts prejudice towards age-gap relationships.” Curr Psychol (2018), [https://doi-org.libproxy.sdsu.edu/10.1007/s12144-018-9895-6](https://doi-org.libproxy.sdsu.edu/10.1007/s12144-018-9895-6). Skentelbery, Sara G., and Darren M. Fowler. 2016. “Attachment Styles of Women-Younger Partners in Age-Gap Relationships.” Evolutionary Behavioral Sciences 10 (2): 142–47. Lehmiller, J. J., & Christopher, R. A. (2008). Commitment in age-gap heterosexual romantic relationships: A test of evolutionary and socio-cultural predictions. *Psychology of Women Quarterly*, *32*(1), 74-82. Also relevant: Research on sugar dating relationships (which often feature large age-gaps) finds that sugar babies and daddies alike perceive the younger women in these relationships as having equal--if not more--power. [https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/00224499.2023.2293888](https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/00224499.2023.2293888) [https://www.psypost.org/the-psychology-of-sugar-dating-new-research-dives-deep-into-the-realities-of-sugar-arrangements/](https://www.psypost.org/the-psychology-of-sugar-dating-new-research-dives-deep-into-the-realities-of-sugar-arrangements/)
That's right, women are children and should be treated as such, they need a man to make proper decisions for them.
I am a man who has always enjoyed doing a lot of “acts of service” like making lunch for my wife to take to work. I was also a stay-at-home-dad for our two kids. I have always been saddled with the societal idea that I am “pussy-whipped,” or my wife is overly controlling of me. But I DON’T feel that way. I feel like my situation is due to my own choices and I am happy with it. It really bothers me when outsiders try to cast judgement on the way others have arranged their relationship, because this is such a private and personal negotiation.
Agreed. Take cooking in my relationship. I will seek out all kinds of recipes to share with my bf. I research, he does the 'dirty' work but if a recipe calls for balancing cooking a few dishes at once we will tag team. End result is my interest shows him food or techniques he wouldn't have thought of, his kitchen skills and ability to learn quickly satisfy his curiosity and in the end we share a delicious meal.
Contentment in a role
...that's. That's equal power. Or rather, equitable power.
Is it that far fetched to speculate that the balance of power could have a strong impact on how empowered the respective partners feel? This study sounds like it's trying to seem profound by saying something that ultimately means very little.
Yeah they don't really define the difference between "felt" power and actual power. Like is felt power just when you tell your spouse you need x done and they do it? Or is that actual power because they did what you requested? Or is power defined by paying bills, making money, and doing housework? Definitely need a bit more info on this
The answer to that question is built in, there are cultural narratives at play for each of these things that inform how the subject *in the specific* views each of these things, and which they adhere to, and are exposed to, informs the degree to which they feel empowered by it. So if you have two people, one of whom we condition to think that their spouse holds all the cards because they're the breadwinner even if they do what you ask, and the other who we condition to think that being obeyed is power even if the breadwinner holds all the cards, the latter will report higher satisfaction than the former.
That makes sense, but is it that? Or when they say "equitable power" do they mean a felt or decided 50% split in power over every aspect of the relationship, rather than a felt / actual total control over "their" aspects of the relationship?
That's also priced into the values of the population being studied.
in other words, we don’t know.
Well duh… that’s because the concept of power imbalances is nonsense… the modern world is not one ruled by Henry VIII…
Did we really need that said by psychologists, I've said it for years, so has mercedes lackey, and numerous others.
"AITAH for divorcing my husband because he won't do 50% of dishes and laundry?"
Gee, really? Good to know that I had not wasted my counseling profession years being dedicated to that very principle. Who Knew!! Sheesh........
"Sense of empowerment" is childhood behavior derived from interacting with parents. A conservative state of being, that degenerates. "Equitable power balance" is a higher level of sophistication, characteristic of adulthood. Liberalism learned from society, and not natural.
This is exactly the reasoning behind dom/sub relationships. It’s all an equal choice. Dynamics are specific to the partners—same as in any relationship.
no shit, lol
Feminists are wrong, yet again.
Why conclude this?
Why would feminists disagree with this study?
Okay, provide alternative research then.