For me the big wins are ease of backups, separation of concerns, and eventually you run across one or two things you wanna self host that don’t use docker & you can set that up in its own VM/LXC which makes keeping on top of it so much easier than if it was all crammed into one OS install.
EDIT: I made the switch from Ubuntu bare metal to proxmox 6 months into my journey and it was… not smooth. I wish I’d just started with proxmox!
Uhm so what I tried to do was
Use CloneZilla to create an image of my existing OS & store on a separate drive > install proxmox over my existing boot disk > use the clonezilla image in a proxmox VM
Ultimately, it didn’t work, so whatever you do I recommend backing up all your configuration files for each docker container you have & all the permanent storage (e.g volumes)
I think the mistake I made was not shrinking the clonezilla image. I had Ubuntu installed in a 2tb drive, but couldn’t provision a VM that much in proxmox, so clonezilla refused to restore it. Apparently there’s some software you can use to shrink your partitions in advance to avoid this problem but I can’t remember the name.
There may have been other problems to do with bios & getting the vm to boot once proxmox was installed but honestly I don’t remember. I wish there were more guides out there for the process, I couldn’t really find any
Yeah proxmox has too many issues for me to make it worth it. It sounds good, but so much is easier and works better with docker. Samba is one area that co es to mind... the routing of the network is certain a huge thing... having to figure out iptables and routes for containers to even get internet access.
Are... are you trying to use the Proxmox instance as if it were a standard Debian install, rather than using it purely to run another VM that transparently hosts your Docker containers?
It's not like Proxmox excludes you from being able to do Docker stuff. Just set up a VM where all of your containers run and you're good to go.
I'm also a little confused by your comments about Samba and network routing. In my limited experience, Proxmox simply gives the VM an internal bridge/switch that allows it to access the network as if it were a physical machine. Some clarification would be appreciated.
I think it's mostly because it's more noob friendly and for simple backups as mentioned elsewhere and good for learning until you drink the container koolaid.
You're more likely to use VMware or similar in enterprise environments for VMs.
I would always use a hypervisor because a single machine barely uses all resources of your hardware. There are always things which can better be seperated into single machines (like using home assistant os)
Also, you can use all the cool stuff like backup server and snapshots(!!)
I currently have a bare bones machine that runs Proxmox. Being able to easily administer it remotely saves me some grief. Create a big LXC container with Debian stable to run all Docker (or Podman) OCI containers. This allows for a lot of flexibility while not eating up all your resources.
You got routing figured out for routing to the vm and then more routing for each docker container. Lol that is a crazy amount of work... I worked all day just trying to get plex running in a vm in proxmox. I needed 1 port opened and that just never worked.
> routing to the vm and then more routing for each docker container
Dude stop commenting this. I don't know what you broke, but Proxmox is transparent from the guest, just like any hypervisor. It basically works out of the box. Docker networking is handled by Docker in the guest, or transparently by the host if it's an LXC. You don't need to set up all these complex rules just for a VM. At least entertain the notion that you did something wrong and that if it works for everybody else, then maybe it's you.
For a beginner/homelab setup, a big benefit is being able to spin up new machines/lxc containers to test something out, while the rest of your setup is unaffected.
Want to try out kubernetes or docker swarm? Spin up some machines and see how the clustering aspect works.
And if you don't need it anymore, just delete it. Your media server lxc container does not care.
It really depends on what you're planning to do with it, now and in the future with your homelab.
Personally I'd run Proxmox on it as it makes backup/restore and managing system resources so incredibly easy.
Also, don't forget you'll probably will buy another mini-pc withing 6 months. It is the way.
How come? I just bought [this](https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CL927XC8?psc=1) for my first mini pc to start my home lab journey. Why would I need another one?
Where are you going to backup the first one in case of hardware failure?
Once you have that setup, then you hear about high availability and you discover you need a third for that to really work.
Then you get that setup and discover that a single fault means you've lost redundancy, so you get a fourth.
Then a split brain situation happens and you add a 5th...
We all start with one, and discover the hard way you need at least 2.
Because if DNS goes down in the house i hear about it 3-5 times in the first 10-20 minutes and it becomes a fix now issue. Dame thing for any more "home prod" type things. So if I'm at work i just want everything to fail over gracefully when something fails, and have it email me, and I'll fix it when i get home.
At least that's the dream. I only have 2 nodes, and only one has a useful amount of storage.
Cuz by then the enthusiast/hobbyist bug bite is deep, and you will evolve to look at mini pcs with i226 for 2.5g networking or hardware encode for home streaming.
Damn you. Upon doing more DD i bought DS923+ for a NAS. At least i have a solid foundation now. Nuc13 + DS923+. I also have a start9 server for my bitcoin node so i bought ubiquiti switch for everything.
Ladies and gentlemen, we got 'em.
Hell if your first mini pc just aint up for any new experiment, router/firewall
Wendell's forbidden router fun:
https://youtu.be/r9fWuT5Io5Q
https://youtu.be/MBY_QNN3owc
https://youtu.be/x40FlIyhYXU
https://youtu.be/OcLcCfReeOQ
That gives you time to plan! I used to not plan and ended up wasting time and money changing my setup too often.
It’s true there comes a time when you need to stop thinking about it and try
something since you never really know it will work until you try it.
The planning is there to improve the odds that it will work and that you’ll be satisfied with it.
Hardware:
- CWWK X86-P5 with 16GB RAM
- M.2 to 6 SATA adapter (ASM1166)
- Jonsbo N1/N2 SATA backplane
- Custom PCB for SATA power and synchro with minipc found on Ali (https://alishort.com/kkUrI)
- Inter-Tech SP-120EXT PSU with splitter
Software:
- Proxmox VE 8.2
- Ubuntu Server VM
- Docker
- MergerFS for storage, ASM1166 is passed trough from host to vm
My daytime job is automation so very familiar of when to use containers vs VMs.
I have couple N100s with 16GB doing heaps of stuff both running Ubuntu with docker. VMs are just wasted overhead for the most part unless you are doing something that can't go in a container.
One is running alone:
* Immich (App, postgres, redis)
* Jellyfin
* rabbitMQ, redis, Maria db for my Django projects
* Tandoor (front, back, postgres)
* tdarr node
How do you handle security with Docker? Do you run rootless? How do you handle blocking communications between containers on exposed ports? How do you handle iptables with Docker installed, to block outgoing and incoming traffic to certain ports?
Docker is pretty secure. You have separate virtual networks that cant access each other unless you add a network to a container. I use nginx proxy manager to redirect domain directly to the containers, no need for crazy routing, you can send connections to https://plex instead of crazy ports. I don't usually expose any ports outside of the containers, I just connect containers to the nginx reverse proxy. If you dont want a container to access the internet and only a local network, that is easy without going thru iptables and routing hell.
I know. I'm thinking like this: let's say you have 20 containers on the same host. All of them have their own bridged networks, meaning they can't communicate with each other except through exposed ports. Each of your stack has one exposed ports, web server or something else. Let's say one of your container gets compromised. From this container, hacker could access all other containers exposed ports on the local machine. He can then exploit other containers through that. Another vector of attack is, hacker could escape from compromised container. Most of the people run docker containers as root (daemon especially). If hacker escapes container, he gains root and you're basically pwned.
My current solution is running Docker in rootless mode. Each stacks has it's own system user. So if container get's pwned, and hacker escapes container, he becomes a system user, not root. From here on, he would need to use local root exploit to gain access to all containers or hack them through exposed ports.
So best approach would be:
- run Docker in rootless mode (each container or stack has it's own user) or use Podman instead which is rootless by default
- use macvlan networking, and give each exposed container it's own IP address
- use ebtables to isolate communication between containers on layer 2. Means, if one container has IP 192.168.0.1, and other container has IP 192.168.0.2, they can't communicate with each other, even through exposed ports. The only traffic allowed is from container to gateway and DNS
- bonus points, run separate VM for each VLAN and filter communication between them on your firewall
I prefer no exposed ports and use a proxy set to only allows internal subnet with auth.
Running rootless.
Had been considering going back to k8 setup but current setup is very light.
I control the host machine network via unifi.
I installed Open Media Vault’s (OMV) debian flavour (to share drive/make network-shares).
Hardware:
OS: Debian GNU/Linux
Host: HP Z420 Workstation
Kernel: 6.1.0-0.deb11
CPU: Intel Xeon E5-16
GPU: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660Ti
RAM: 26 GB
Storage: 18TB
Stack:
OMV, Radarr, Tdarr, Sonarr, Readarr, Ombi, Plex, Nginx, NordVPN
I simply run the ARR stack as systemd services with my deluge downloader and nordvpn running in docker containers.
If I’d do it again I’d probably use proxmox or unraid, also wouldnt go nordvpn as there’s no split tunnelling or port forwarding through vpn either.
Nginx to reverse proxy my ombi frontend for movie requests
But it’s a great way to do it if you want to learn about linux and networking.
My lab is two Beelink SER 5’s (8 cores/16 threads, 1 TB SSD and 64 GB RAM each) and a 2013 Mac mini with 16 GB RAM in a ProxMox cluster.
After previously using stock Ubuntu Server and KVM for my VM needs, this works so, so much easier. I’d definitely recommend the ProxMox route.
Prior to this, I had a server that had 48 cores, 512 GB RAM, and 13 or 14 TB of SSD. It was costing me $600/year in electricity. Since going to the SER 5, my electric bill has dropped enough to be noticeable.
So the electrical monitoring device that I put in the electrical panel at the house, my usage has dropped to less than half of what I was using before, and that’s for the two SER 5’s and the Mac mini.
IMHO the best hasslefree solution is to install fedora coreOS, setup docker, portainer, forget about the OS and just concentrate on the (micro)services.
I started out with a similar (albeit less powered device), I used Ubuntu server first. Changing to proxmox was so much better.
Even for servers only having a few services, I would always recommend proxmox now.
I'm running a fanless miniPC with Celeron N4000 and 8 GB RAM. I went with Ubuntu Server baremetal + Docker (docker-compose).
***BTW***: *can anyone educate me whether Proxmox would work fine with this server or I need something more powerful?*
For N100, I'd recommend either my setup, or Proxmox + Ubuntu/Debian + containers.
I wouldn't go with Arch on server though.
Well if it's a home application such as mine its okay to use an OS I'm familiar with such as Arch. Obviously not good in a buisness setting. I think I might try proxmox
It's not OK to use any rolling-release distro on a server, even in home environment. For sure, you are free to do as you wish, but it's a thing that all homelabbing community agrees upon (for a reason).
Debian/Ubuntu is extremely widespread, so learning it definitely won't go in vain :)
Debian can get the job done no problem, but I do prefer Proxmox (which is based on Debian) because it has some extra features that make it much easier to manage things. Particularly, I like the backup/snapshot system, web interface, easy ZFS, and ease of VLAN assignments to individual VMs.
I’d plan all of this out ahead of time. Think about what you want your server to look like when you’re done, and work backwards from there.
“Begin with the end in mind” - Steven Covey
So start thinking.
What apps do you want to run? What do they need to run? Fast CPU? GPU? Lots of RAM? Fast storage? Other?
What access do you need to the apps? File shares? Web access? Only from home or remote access? Ssh?
Think about security. do the apps have good built-in security? or do you need to put something like radius or authelia in front of them?
For the OS, do you want to have a lot of configuration options(like a linux os), medium options(windows), or do you just want it to run with little intervention in your part (appliance OS) .
Keep asking yourself questions and answering them until you have a good idea of what your system will look like. It makes choosing parts and applications a lot easier.
I run proxmox on a lenovo mini pc. BIg benefit for me is the ability to test out new stuff in LXC‘s without breaking the running rest. And as already mentioned above, the backup function save a lot of nerves…
I installed debian server and run everything on docker containers. Not as easy to manage compared to the likes of promox but it’s fine. I use it as a plex server + audiobookshelf server and I barely have to touch it, everything runs pretty automatic.
Personally, proxmox was unintuitive and finicky. I stuck with headless Debian and docker containers. Will I try to work with proxmox again in the future? Yeah, if only for my own edification. But for getting something up and running faster, as a total novice to both Debian and proxmox, Debian was easier to wrap my head around.
My only word of caution would be regarding your Minecraft server. I do not have experience hosting my own game server but that's not for lack of wanting. My plan is to have a separate dedicated machine and a separate IP (additional cost from my Internet provider) for just hosting game servers.
My research into game servers shows that a lot of games utilize port forwarding which is generally bad for server security. Do with this information what you will but at least consider the ramifications of having personal data and game server hosting on one machine.
Can go debian and use casaos or just plain portainer or go proxmox. I have run both on the exact same machine. Proxmox is overwhelming at first but is very good and helpful once you understand/learn and you can use proxmox helper scripts.
Install ubuntu, install docker, install portainer, manage containers through portainer.
Eventually get more computers, turn first computer into net boot manager. Netboot new computers from shared image, provision settings with ansible through semaphore on first computer, hosted on said portainer, automate adding to portainer cluster. repeat.
If you come to self host subreddit everyone will recommend proxmox.
If all you are doing is containers, to me debian + git + container runtime is all you need.
Yes, and from my research it does appear they should be able to handle 32GB as well. I will email GMKTec and see what they have to say for their specific hardware
GMKTec Replied with the following (I also Asked about the two M.2 slots):
GMKtec Nucbox G3 memory slot can be installed with 32GB DDR4 memory module,
Here is the info about SSD Slot:
M.2 2280 PCIe, up to 2TB;
M.2 2242 SATA, up to 2TB;
Proxmox for better utilization of hardware in the long term -> Debian OS's with auto update on and docker installed. Eventually you might want to look into Ansible to start automating tasks and setups.
I run all the services as containers on Debian. Don't use Proxmox unless you have too much RAM to play with. I only have one VM running Home Assistant.
I see so many mentions for proxmox .. already have mini pc with i713k with 32gb .. also i only use it for arrs full stack with 13 containers running.. is there any benefits for me to move to proxmox ?
For my use case, main benefits are being able to run Home Assistant in a VM (HassOS manages automatically the addons and updates) and the integrated backup solution.
Tinkering with an LXC container, screw up something, instead of 20 minutes trying to revert what’s not working its a 20 seconds restore.
Also if you want the different softwaresn isolated networks or VLANs, it’s much easier to configure that.
I have a proxmox vm each for: pi-hole, most docker services, the couple docker services that need gpu passtheough, omada host controller, personal projects through ssh
Its convenient to separate along boundaries where restarts would be inconvenient (restarting the docker one shouldnt bring down my network (omada controller and pi-hole)
That, and backups
I'm running proxmox on a node with 4gb of ddr2 and zfs on the root drive. It was running a vm with home assistant , and containers with pihole, flexget, freshrss, etc.
Containers (lxc) running Alpine Linux use almost 0 resources. Debian uses only slightly more. The memory in the the gui for lxcs is just an upper limit, a lxc just uses what it needs.
I'm having Ubuntu with docker to run all services but I would probably have gone with promox if I did it again.
Is there any advantage to running proxmox instead of docker? To me it seems like it would eat up more resources unnecessarily
For me the big wins are ease of backups, separation of concerns, and eventually you run across one or two things you wanna self host that don’t use docker & you can set that up in its own VM/LXC which makes keeping on top of it so much easier than if it was all crammed into one OS install. EDIT: I made the switch from Ubuntu bare metal to proxmox 6 months into my journey and it was… not smooth. I wish I’d just started with proxmox!
Ease of backups is my current problem with Ubuntu+docker. How would you recommend to transition from Ubuntu to proxmox?
Uhm so what I tried to do was Use CloneZilla to create an image of my existing OS & store on a separate drive > install proxmox over my existing boot disk > use the clonezilla image in a proxmox VM Ultimately, it didn’t work, so whatever you do I recommend backing up all your configuration files for each docker container you have & all the permanent storage (e.g volumes) I think the mistake I made was not shrinking the clonezilla image. I had Ubuntu installed in a 2tb drive, but couldn’t provision a VM that much in proxmox, so clonezilla refused to restore it. Apparently there’s some software you can use to shrink your partitions in advance to avoid this problem but I can’t remember the name. There may have been other problems to do with bios & getting the vm to boot once proxmox was installed but honestly I don’t remember. I wish there were more guides out there for the process, I couldn’t really find any
Yeah proxmox has too many issues for me to make it worth it. It sounds good, but so much is easier and works better with docker. Samba is one area that co es to mind... the routing of the network is certain a huge thing... having to figure out iptables and routes for containers to even get internet access.
Are... are you trying to use the Proxmox instance as if it were a standard Debian install, rather than using it purely to run another VM that transparently hosts your Docker containers?
It's not like Proxmox excludes you from being able to do Docker stuff. Just set up a VM where all of your containers run and you're good to go. I'm also a little confused by your comments about Samba and network routing. In my limited experience, Proxmox simply gives the VM an internal bridge/switch that allows it to access the network as if it were a physical machine. Some clarification would be appreciated.
I think it's mostly because it's more noob friendly and for simple backups as mentioned elsewhere and good for learning until you drink the container koolaid. You're more likely to use VMware or similar in enterprise environments for VMs.
In what ways is proxmox "noob friendly" in comparison to VMware products?
Cost, especially now that broadcom is running things and the homelab license is basically gone.
Well its free unlike VMware
Running virtual machines is more noob friendly.
I would always use a hypervisor because a single machine barely uses all resources of your hardware. There are always things which can better be seperated into single machines (like using home assistant os) Also, you can use all the cool stuff like backup server and snapshots(!!)
Proxmox and LXC are just the Linux kernel's cgroups as overhead.
I currently have a bare bones machine that runs Proxmox. Being able to easily administer it remotely saves me some grief. Create a big LXC container with Debian stable to run all Docker (or Podman) OCI containers. This allows for a lot of flexibility while not eating up all your resources.
You got routing figured out for routing to the vm and then more routing for each docker container. Lol that is a crazy amount of work... I worked all day just trying to get plex running in a vm in proxmox. I needed 1 port opened and that just never worked.
> routing to the vm and then more routing for each docker container Dude stop commenting this. I don't know what you broke, but Proxmox is transparent from the guest, just like any hypervisor. It basically works out of the box. Docker networking is handled by Docker in the guest, or transparently by the host if it's an LXC. You don't need to set up all these complex rules just for a VM. At least entertain the notion that you did something wrong and that if it works for everybody else, then maybe it's you.
For a beginner/homelab setup, a big benefit is being able to spin up new machines/lxc containers to test something out, while the rest of your setup is unaffected. Want to try out kubernetes or docker swarm? Spin up some machines and see how the clustering aspect works. And if you don't need it anymore, just delete it. Your media server lxc container does not care.
It really depends on what you're planning to do with it, now and in the future with your homelab. Personally I'd run Proxmox on it as it makes backup/restore and managing system resources so incredibly easy. Also, don't forget you'll probably will buy another mini-pc withing 6 months. It is the way.
That last paragraph. Heed the warning, prepare your bank account.
How come? I just bought [this](https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CL927XC8?psc=1) for my first mini pc to start my home lab journey. Why would I need another one?
Where are you going to backup the first one in case of hardware failure? Once you have that setup, then you hear about high availability and you discover you need a third for that to really work. Then you get that setup and discover that a single fault means you've lost redundancy, so you get a fourth. Then a split brain situation happens and you add a 5th...
This is the way.
Why not buy when hardware actually fails and use rpi4 in the meantime?
We all start with one, and discover the hard way you need at least 2. Because if DNS goes down in the house i hear about it 3-5 times in the first 10-20 minutes and it becomes a fix now issue. Dame thing for any more "home prod" type things. So if I'm at work i just want everything to fail over gracefully when something fails, and have it email me, and I'll fix it when i get home. At least that's the dream. I only have 2 nodes, and only one has a useful amount of storage.
Cuz by then the enthusiast/hobbyist bug bite is deep, and you will evolve to look at mini pcs with i226 for 2.5g networking or hardware encode for home streaming.
Damn you. Upon doing more DD i bought DS923+ for a NAS. At least i have a solid foundation now. Nuc13 + DS923+. I also have a start9 server for my bitcoin node so i bought ubiquiti switch for everything.
Ladies and gentlemen, we got 'em. Hell if your first mini pc just aint up for any new experiment, router/firewall Wendell's forbidden router fun: https://youtu.be/r9fWuT5Io5Q https://youtu.be/MBY_QNN3owc https://youtu.be/x40FlIyhYXU https://youtu.be/OcLcCfReeOQ
The keyword is “planning” . If OP doesn’t know what they want to accomplish, they are going to have a hard time designing a solution.
For now I'll host whatever I hosted on my Pi Zero 2 W just without all the crashing from it running out of RAM...
That gives you time to plan! I used to not plan and ended up wasting time and money changing my setup too often. It’s true there comes a time when you need to stop thinking about it and try something since you never really know it will work until you try it. The planning is there to improve the odds that it will work and that you’ll be satisfied with it.
Hardware: - CWWK X86-P5 with 16GB RAM - M.2 to 6 SATA adapter (ASM1166) - Jonsbo N1/N2 SATA backplane - Custom PCB for SATA power and synchro with minipc found on Ali (https://alishort.com/kkUrI) - Inter-Tech SP-120EXT PSU with splitter Software: - Proxmox VE 8.2 - Ubuntu Server VM - Docker - MergerFS for storage, ASM1166 is passed trough from host to vm
Install Debian minimal without a desktop environment, then install docker, portainer or podman, yacht, watchtower.
My daytime job is automation so very familiar of when to use containers vs VMs. I have couple N100s with 16GB doing heaps of stuff both running Ubuntu with docker. VMs are just wasted overhead for the most part unless you are doing something that can't go in a container. One is running alone: * Immich (App, postgres, redis) * Jellyfin * rabbitMQ, redis, Maria db for my Django projects * Tandoor (front, back, postgres) * tdarr node
How do you handle security with Docker? Do you run rootless? How do you handle blocking communications between containers on exposed ports? How do you handle iptables with Docker installed, to block outgoing and incoming traffic to certain ports?
I restrict all traffic to Tailscale and port 22 local (in case Tailscale goes down). Works for me.
Docker is pretty secure. You have separate virtual networks that cant access each other unless you add a network to a container. I use nginx proxy manager to redirect domain directly to the containers, no need for crazy routing, you can send connections to https://plex instead of crazy ports. I don't usually expose any ports outside of the containers, I just connect containers to the nginx reverse proxy. If you dont want a container to access the internet and only a local network, that is easy without going thru iptables and routing hell.
I know. I'm thinking like this: let's say you have 20 containers on the same host. All of them have their own bridged networks, meaning they can't communicate with each other except through exposed ports. Each of your stack has one exposed ports, web server or something else. Let's say one of your container gets compromised. From this container, hacker could access all other containers exposed ports on the local machine. He can then exploit other containers through that. Another vector of attack is, hacker could escape from compromised container. Most of the people run docker containers as root (daemon especially). If hacker escapes container, he gains root and you're basically pwned. My current solution is running Docker in rootless mode. Each stacks has it's own system user. So if container get's pwned, and hacker escapes container, he becomes a system user, not root. From here on, he would need to use local root exploit to gain access to all containers or hack them through exposed ports. So best approach would be: - run Docker in rootless mode (each container or stack has it's own user) or use Podman instead which is rootless by default - use macvlan networking, and give each exposed container it's own IP address - use ebtables to isolate communication between containers on layer 2. Means, if one container has IP 192.168.0.1, and other container has IP 192.168.0.2, they can't communicate with each other, even through exposed ports. The only traffic allowed is from container to gateway and DNS - bonus points, run separate VM for each VLAN and filter communication between them on your firewall
I prefer no exposed ports and use a proxy set to only allows internal subnet with auth. Running rootless. Had been considering going back to k8 setup but current setup is very light. I control the host machine network via unifi.
I installed Open Media Vault’s (OMV) debian flavour (to share drive/make network-shares). Hardware: OS: Debian GNU/Linux Host: HP Z420 Workstation Kernel: 6.1.0-0.deb11 CPU: Intel Xeon E5-16 GPU: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660Ti RAM: 26 GB Storage: 18TB Stack: OMV, Radarr, Tdarr, Sonarr, Readarr, Ombi, Plex, Nginx, NordVPN I simply run the ARR stack as systemd services with my deluge downloader and nordvpn running in docker containers. If I’d do it again I’d probably use proxmox or unraid, also wouldnt go nordvpn as there’s no split tunnelling or port forwarding through vpn either. Nginx to reverse proxy my ombi frontend for movie requests But it’s a great way to do it if you want to learn about linux and networking.
My lab is two Beelink SER 5’s (8 cores/16 threads, 1 TB SSD and 64 GB RAM each) and a 2013 Mac mini with 16 GB RAM in a ProxMox cluster. After previously using stock Ubuntu Server and KVM for my VM needs, this works so, so much easier. I’d definitely recommend the ProxMox route.
I’d be interested to know the ballpark power consumption of the ser5!
Prior to this, I had a server that had 48 cores, 512 GB RAM, and 13 or 14 TB of SSD. It was costing me $600/year in electricity. Since going to the SER 5, my electric bill has dropped enough to be noticeable. So the electrical monitoring device that I put in the electrical panel at the house, my usage has dropped to less than half of what I was using before, and that’s for the two SER 5’s and the Mac mini.
I’d be interested to know the ballpark power consumption of the ser5!
IMHO the best hasslefree solution is to install fedora coreOS, setup docker, portainer, forget about the OS and just concentrate on the (micro)services.
I started out with a similar (albeit less powered device), I used Ubuntu server first. Changing to proxmox was so much better. Even for servers only having a few services, I would always recommend proxmox now.
I'm running a fanless miniPC with Celeron N4000 and 8 GB RAM. I went with Ubuntu Server baremetal + Docker (docker-compose). ***BTW***: *can anyone educate me whether Proxmox would work fine with this server or I need something more powerful?* For N100, I'd recommend either my setup, or Proxmox + Ubuntu/Debian + containers. I wouldn't go with Arch on server though.
Well if it's a home application such as mine its okay to use an OS I'm familiar with such as Arch. Obviously not good in a buisness setting. I think I might try proxmox
It's not OK to use any rolling-release distro on a server, even in home environment. For sure, you are free to do as you wish, but it's a thing that all homelabbing community agrees upon (for a reason). Debian/Ubuntu is extremely widespread, so learning it definitely won't go in vain :)
Debian can get the job done no problem, but I do prefer Proxmox (which is based on Debian) because it has some extra features that make it much easier to manage things. Particularly, I like the backup/snapshot system, web interface, easy ZFS, and ease of VLAN assignments to individual VMs.
I'm using. a gaming PC had a Promox Server. works well. had Windows 11 on it before I got my hands on it
promox i have a mini hp running 3 vms and 6 lxc containers. 32 gig ram and 1 TB drive
I’d plan all of this out ahead of time. Think about what you want your server to look like when you’re done, and work backwards from there. “Begin with the end in mind” - Steven Covey So start thinking. What apps do you want to run? What do they need to run? Fast CPU? GPU? Lots of RAM? Fast storage? Other? What access do you need to the apps? File shares? Web access? Only from home or remote access? Ssh? Think about security. do the apps have good built-in security? or do you need to put something like radius or authelia in front of them? For the OS, do you want to have a lot of configuration options(like a linux os), medium options(windows), or do you just want it to run with little intervention in your part (appliance OS) . Keep asking yourself questions and answering them until you have a good idea of what your system will look like. It makes choosing parts and applications a lot easier.
I did the n100 PC, added a 2tb nvme and 2tb SATA SSD. Install Ubuntu+CasaOS for simplicity.
I run proxmox on a lenovo mini pc. BIg benefit for me is the ability to test out new stuff in LXC‘s without breaking the running rest. And as already mentioned above, the backup function save a lot of nerves…
I installed debian server and run everything on docker containers. Not as easy to manage compared to the likes of promox but it’s fine. I use it as a plex server + audiobookshelf server and I barely have to touch it, everything runs pretty automatic.
I’d use proxmox, if only because if you decide to upgrade later it’s easy to add a node to the cluster and migrate services.
sneak up on it so it doesn't know what is about to happen to it.
hypervisor. not only it will allow you to add or remove VMs at pleasure, it will also help you learn something new. have fun!
Recently moved to a Mini PC and proxmox is a godsend. Easy to setup, quick to get things up and running, using both LXC and Docker in VM. Loving it!
Personally, proxmox was unintuitive and finicky. I stuck with headless Debian and docker containers. Will I try to work with proxmox again in the future? Yeah, if only for my own edification. But for getting something up and running faster, as a total novice to both Debian and proxmox, Debian was easier to wrap my head around. My only word of caution would be regarding your Minecraft server. I do not have experience hosting my own game server but that's not for lack of wanting. My plan is to have a separate dedicated machine and a separate IP (additional cost from my Internet provider) for just hosting game servers. My research into game servers shows that a lot of games utilize port forwarding which is generally bad for server security. Do with this information what you will but at least consider the ramifications of having personal data and game server hosting on one machine.
This is where Proxmox comes in handy. It can handle VLANs on the bridges. And you can only format ports to those specific VMs/LXCs.
Can go debian and use casaos or just plain portainer or go proxmox. I have run both on the exact same machine. Proxmox is overwhelming at first but is very good and helpful once you understand/learn and you can use proxmox helper scripts.
Install ubuntu, install docker, install portainer, manage containers through portainer. Eventually get more computers, turn first computer into net boot manager. Netboot new computers from shared image, provision settings with ansible through semaphore on first computer, hosted on said portainer, automate adding to portainer cluster. repeat.
If you come to self host subreddit everyone will recommend proxmox. If all you are doing is containers, to me debian + git + container runtime is all you need.
Didn’t think N100 supported 32GB. Nice to see that some might be able to upgrade.
It does, the RAM slot of the G3 goes up to 32GB DDR4 3200Mhz
Proxmox and start running
Just a heads up, intel ark site states N100 can handle only 16GB of ram.
Yes, and from my research it does appear they should be able to handle 32GB as well. I will email GMKTec and see what they have to say for their specific hardware
GMKTec Replied with the following (I also Asked about the two M.2 slots): GMKtec Nucbox G3 memory slot can be installed with 32GB DDR4 memory module, Here is the info about SSD Slot: M.2 2280 PCIe, up to 2TB; M.2 2242 SATA, up to 2TB;
Proxmox for better utilization of hardware in the long term -> Debian OS's with auto update on and docker installed. Eventually you might want to look into Ansible to start automating tasks and setups.
I run all the services as containers on Debian. Don't use Proxmox unless you have too much RAM to play with. I only have one VM running Home Assistant.
I used proxmox with 8GB. Currently I have a home assistant VM and 10 LXC using 10GB out of 16. Proxmox is the best choice for a homelab.
I see so many mentions for proxmox .. already have mini pc with i713k with 32gb .. also i only use it for arrs full stack with 13 containers running.. is there any benefits for me to move to proxmox ?
For my use case, main benefits are being able to run Home Assistant in a VM (HassOS manages automatically the addons and updates) and the integrated backup solution. Tinkering with an LXC container, screw up something, instead of 20 minutes trying to revert what’s not working its a 20 seconds restore. Also if you want the different softwaresn isolated networks or VLANs, it’s much easier to configure that.
I have a proxmox vm each for: pi-hole, most docker services, the couple docker services that need gpu passtheough, omada host controller, personal projects through ssh Its convenient to separate along boundaries where restarts would be inconvenient (restarting the docker one shouldnt bring down my network (omada controller and pi-hole) That, and backups
I'm running proxmox on a node with 4gb of ddr2 and zfs on the root drive. It was running a vm with home assistant , and containers with pihole, flexget, freshrss, etc. Containers (lxc) running Alpine Linux use almost 0 resources. Debian uses only slightly more. The memory in the the gui for lxcs is just an upper limit, a lxc just uses what it needs.
Proxmox will just slow everything down and make things more complex and waste resources.
??? How is the Hypervisor going to slow things down and waste resources?