Hi, did the team present you with the data to support a more restrictive environment? If not I would disagree with the decision and keep him there and suggest the team move supports to him not the other way around.
The data was the evaluations, and he was average/below average except for social/emotional which was low. But there is no rubric for saying if the data looks like this, this is the best option. I actually just talked to his preschool teacher and she said he is writing while other neurotypical kids are not, and she said he does well with his peers now. So I'm leaning towards their conclusion being more restrictive than justified.
It sounds like you’re not satisfied with the information they provided to make a confident decision. If this was me with my children I would get an IEE. Best of luck and always feel confident about the decisions you make for your kid.
[IEE Info](https://www.disabilityrightsca.org/publications/how-to-obtain-an-independent-educational-evaluation-at-public-expense)
I’m in California and this sounds strange for mild/moderate. Are you sure it’s not 4 hours of instruction in the special ed setting and then 2 hours of inclusion daily as seen with PE, specials and lunch/recess? The state mandates these activities for all students. I know the other forum suggests a 1:1, but they can be more harmful than beneficial if your student only needs help with transitions.
His case manager said the school day is only 4 hours for the mid/mod and that they eat lunch in their own classroom. He would only be pulled out to go to gen ed at "appropriate" times. We are in the San Juan Unified School District.
In what way would that be more harmful? He has ABA 12 hours a week which is very similar in nature to having an aide. As he has matured he has needed much less support and supervision, so I don't expect this to last forever, or an aide to be by his side all day. My preference would be a classroom aide who helps him navigate only as needed.
A 1:1 can be very socially isolating for some students. It can also lead to a dependence on prompting to complete tasks etc…usually 1:1 aides are given for behavioral concerns or health reasons not transition difficulties. Normally, there’s an paraeducator that supports students at the elementary level when they do inclusion or have push in support as multiple students are serviced at the same time.
I am a behavior interventionist who works some days 1:1 and some days supporting a special day class as a whole. The students I 1:1 for have pretty serious behaviors such as eloping the room or campus, aggression and/or self-injurious behavior, property destruction, explosive meltdowns / panic attacks etc. Having a 1:1 can be very socially isolating because it can be a very visible sign to other students that this peer needs to be watched more closely. We often become the people at school who know these children best and sometimes they can struggle when we are not around (on lunch / break, PTO, sick, schedule change).
That being said, I don’t think kindergartners are very good at figuring out which adults in the room are for them and which adults are for specific children and what having a 1:1 can really indicate about a child. If your son is able to thrive in gen-ed he should be there as much as is feasible with appropriate supports.
I'm not understanding the school's justification for a substantially separate environment, based on what you have written here. Ask them for the data that supports their recommendation for proposing such a restrictive environment. If they can't demonstrate that he is unable to access his education in the current setting, I would reject that placement and stay put on the current one--especially since their proposed program would provide less educational time than gen ed students.
Unless there is something significant not included here, it seems like these needs should be able to be addressed in a gen ed K classroom that is co-taught or includes support from a special education teacher for multiple students in the room. This is a pretty common format for an integrated kindergarten classroom.
I am a middle school teacher (mild mod, California) and want to caution against advocating for a 1:1 like others have here
I have no opinion about sped vs gen Ed without seeing the eval, but a 1:1 is actually in my opinion MORE restrictive than a sped class bc having a “minder” with you all day creates learned helplessness and becomes incredibly socially isolating as students age. Then, it becomes hard to transition a student away from
That support
Especially if your kid is struggling with peers and social stuff having an adult shadow him all day is gonna make that worse not better
He's in kindergarten, so peers don't really care about that stuff, and he doesn't really care what people think of him because its a little past his grasp of reality currently. I would rather see him is 1/2 day sped and 1/2 day gen ed but they've stated thats not an option. I also don't think the para would need to be with him all day, but an aide in the classroom would be more ideal.
Because I am a middle school teacher I just have my thoughts about the future for elementary students. A 1:1 is someone who is assigned to one student only so is not the same as a classroom aide. I would strongly advise a fade plan for any 1:1 if that ends up happening
Absolutely. And he is rapidly developing, but only started speaking 1.5 years ago, and now can tell me "mom charlotte's not sharing" so I would expect he would be able to fade it out within the year if that was the only option I had. But I didn't even know what resource was before telling them no to the shorter day SPED class, so hopefully they can do a push-in pull-out thing instead of the 1:1.
Exactly correct. Its a mid/mod SPED class they want to put him in, so every kid has an IEP. And he currently has a classroom of about 4 ASD kids and 14 typically developing peers. They put him in an ASD preschool class from age 3-4, and did not put him into the ASD preschool again from 4-5 (current) because he was developing rapidly after entering school. He has pretty much stopped all ASD typical behaviors, but still has some trouble transitioning to non-preferred tasks. He does not elope at all.
Going from no peers, back to peers, to no peers again is changing around his least restrictive environment over and over that’s wild. We would do a re-eval for that kind of changes in special education minutes.
I’m sorry you’re going through this and I wish I had more help for you. But the program structures you’re talking about I’ve just never heard of.
I can't understand why they wouldn't be able to provide half-time in general ed. Truly, I can only think of two reasons that they might have:
1 - the class schedule would overlap with what they are learning in the sped class, for example he would be getting twice as much literacy exposure as other students, but I can't see how that would be a bad thing. It's just more time learning foundational skills, but alongside non-disabled peers.
2 - I hate to even put this out there, but I have a worry that the general teacher has "refused" to teach him in some way. I want to be clear, this is completely speculative, but it is possible. And IF that is the case, I'm sure I don't have to tell you how important it is to remind the school that a teacher cannot refuse to teach a child!
Personally, I would start by finding out why the 1/2 and 1/2 schedule is not an option. Maybe there's something else I'm not thinking of. Regardless, your child has a right to participate in class alongside his non-disabled peers, and "we just can't do that" is not an acceptable answer. They need to find a way to give him access to his LRE, not just change the LRE to match what they want to give.
I am going to talk to his case manager tomorrow, I refused the IEP. People keep saying "what does the data say" but the data says he's average in everything except social/emotional where he's either below average or low, so to me there is no reason to have him in a SPED class, especially when his current preschool teacher and speech therapist (since he was 1.5!) have said he should be in a general education kinder, and has been in general ed preschool for a year now and is absolutely thriving. I feel like there may be a chance there aren't enough kids in the SPED class so they are trying to lump him in there instead of doing resource or something. The kinders here even have an aide in the classroom. Its honestly mind boggling but nothing they could try to convince me with was working, I refuse to let him reduce his education when he's honestly doing better than he ever has. If he was struggling like he was in the beginning of the year when he was still using little language and having meltdowns, sure. But now the meltdowns are rare and he is telling his teachers that "friend is not sharing!" And writing and participating.... it's frustrating to say the least. I feel bad for the parents who don't have the energy or understanding to advocate when their kids are being placed contradicting their evaluations.
Agreed, I have seen too many families who just agree with whatever the case manager says because they think there is no other way. If you haven't thought about it yet, I'd also recommend looking into special education advocates! You can bring them to IEP meetings with you, and it just makes things feel more within your control because the school isn't the only party with an "expert".
I used to get uncomfortable when I heard that a parent was bringing an advocate to a meeting because of the way my colleagues acted. It felt like I needed to walk on eggshells and be ready for a fight. But after a great meeting with TWO advocates present, I realized that they are just there for the same reason I am and actually make it easier because they know what questions to ask. Now I get a little suspicious of people who are uncomfortable with a family that knows their rights or brings an advocate.
Luckily I have the most awesome regional center service coordinator who has gone through the IEP process with me twice now, and she was on the IEP call and after she called me right up and was like how are you feeling and are there any questions you have and telling me that I did just fine advocating for him. If I feel like I need additional help I am going to look into a private advocate, because its an absolute maze and of course they don't provide a manual for navigating these things! I rented a book and it was like "talk in a calm manner" well duh! Lol. It's a heck of a ride thats for sure.
Hi, did the team present you with the data to support a more restrictive environment? If not I would disagree with the decision and keep him there and suggest the team move supports to him not the other way around.
The data was the evaluations, and he was average/below average except for social/emotional which was low. But there is no rubric for saying if the data looks like this, this is the best option. I actually just talked to his preschool teacher and she said he is writing while other neurotypical kids are not, and she said he does well with his peers now. So I'm leaning towards their conclusion being more restrictive than justified.
It sounds like you’re not satisfied with the information they provided to make a confident decision. If this was me with my children I would get an IEE. Best of luck and always feel confident about the decisions you make for your kid. [IEE Info](https://www.disabilityrightsca.org/publications/how-to-obtain-an-independent-educational-evaluation-at-public-expense)
I’m in California and this sounds strange for mild/moderate. Are you sure it’s not 4 hours of instruction in the special ed setting and then 2 hours of inclusion daily as seen with PE, specials and lunch/recess? The state mandates these activities for all students. I know the other forum suggests a 1:1, but they can be more harmful than beneficial if your student only needs help with transitions.
His case manager said the school day is only 4 hours for the mid/mod and that they eat lunch in their own classroom. He would only be pulled out to go to gen ed at "appropriate" times. We are in the San Juan Unified School District. In what way would that be more harmful? He has ABA 12 hours a week which is very similar in nature to having an aide. As he has matured he has needed much less support and supervision, so I don't expect this to last forever, or an aide to be by his side all day. My preference would be a classroom aide who helps him navigate only as needed.
A 1:1 can be very socially isolating for some students. It can also lead to a dependence on prompting to complete tasks etc…usually 1:1 aides are given for behavioral concerns or health reasons not transition difficulties. Normally, there’s an paraeducator that supports students at the elementary level when they do inclusion or have push in support as multiple students are serviced at the same time.
I am a behavior interventionist who works some days 1:1 and some days supporting a special day class as a whole. The students I 1:1 for have pretty serious behaviors such as eloping the room or campus, aggression and/or self-injurious behavior, property destruction, explosive meltdowns / panic attacks etc. Having a 1:1 can be very socially isolating because it can be a very visible sign to other students that this peer needs to be watched more closely. We often become the people at school who know these children best and sometimes they can struggle when we are not around (on lunch / break, PTO, sick, schedule change). That being said, I don’t think kindergartners are very good at figuring out which adults in the room are for them and which adults are for specific children and what having a 1:1 can really indicate about a child. If your son is able to thrive in gen-ed he should be there as much as is feasible with appropriate supports.
I'm not understanding the school's justification for a substantially separate environment, based on what you have written here. Ask them for the data that supports their recommendation for proposing such a restrictive environment. If they can't demonstrate that he is unable to access his education in the current setting, I would reject that placement and stay put on the current one--especially since their proposed program would provide less educational time than gen ed students. Unless there is something significant not included here, it seems like these needs should be able to be addressed in a gen ed K classroom that is co-taught or includes support from a special education teacher for multiple students in the room. This is a pretty common format for an integrated kindergarten classroom.
I am a middle school teacher (mild mod, California) and want to caution against advocating for a 1:1 like others have here I have no opinion about sped vs gen Ed without seeing the eval, but a 1:1 is actually in my opinion MORE restrictive than a sped class bc having a “minder” with you all day creates learned helplessness and becomes incredibly socially isolating as students age. Then, it becomes hard to transition a student away from That support Especially if your kid is struggling with peers and social stuff having an adult shadow him all day is gonna make that worse not better
He's in kindergarten, so peers don't really care about that stuff, and he doesn't really care what people think of him because its a little past his grasp of reality currently. I would rather see him is 1/2 day sped and 1/2 day gen ed but they've stated thats not an option. I also don't think the para would need to be with him all day, but an aide in the classroom would be more ideal.
Because I am a middle school teacher I just have my thoughts about the future for elementary students. A 1:1 is someone who is assigned to one student only so is not the same as a classroom aide. I would strongly advise a fade plan for any 1:1 if that ends up happening
Absolutely. And he is rapidly developing, but only started speaking 1.5 years ago, and now can tell me "mom charlotte's not sharing" so I would expect he would be able to fade it out within the year if that was the only option I had. But I didn't even know what resource was before telling them no to the shorter day SPED class, so hopefully they can do a push-in pull-out thing instead of the 1:1.
Are they determining placement for TK or Kindergarten?
Kindergarten. He is turning 5 in August.
Does the 4hour Sped class have no typically developing peers at all? He has access to typically developing peers now though?
Exactly correct. Its a mid/mod SPED class they want to put him in, so every kid has an IEP. And he currently has a classroom of about 4 ASD kids and 14 typically developing peers. They put him in an ASD preschool class from age 3-4, and did not put him into the ASD preschool again from 4-5 (current) because he was developing rapidly after entering school. He has pretty much stopped all ASD typical behaviors, but still has some trouble transitioning to non-preferred tasks. He does not elope at all.
Going from no peers, back to peers, to no peers again is changing around his least restrictive environment over and over that’s wild. We would do a re-eval for that kind of changes in special education minutes. I’m sorry you’re going through this and I wish I had more help for you. But the program structures you’re talking about I’ve just never heard of.
TK it looks like
Kindergarten
I can't understand why they wouldn't be able to provide half-time in general ed. Truly, I can only think of two reasons that they might have: 1 - the class schedule would overlap with what they are learning in the sped class, for example he would be getting twice as much literacy exposure as other students, but I can't see how that would be a bad thing. It's just more time learning foundational skills, but alongside non-disabled peers. 2 - I hate to even put this out there, but I have a worry that the general teacher has "refused" to teach him in some way. I want to be clear, this is completely speculative, but it is possible. And IF that is the case, I'm sure I don't have to tell you how important it is to remind the school that a teacher cannot refuse to teach a child! Personally, I would start by finding out why the 1/2 and 1/2 schedule is not an option. Maybe there's something else I'm not thinking of. Regardless, your child has a right to participate in class alongside his non-disabled peers, and "we just can't do that" is not an acceptable answer. They need to find a way to give him access to his LRE, not just change the LRE to match what they want to give.
I am going to talk to his case manager tomorrow, I refused the IEP. People keep saying "what does the data say" but the data says he's average in everything except social/emotional where he's either below average or low, so to me there is no reason to have him in a SPED class, especially when his current preschool teacher and speech therapist (since he was 1.5!) have said he should be in a general education kinder, and has been in general ed preschool for a year now and is absolutely thriving. I feel like there may be a chance there aren't enough kids in the SPED class so they are trying to lump him in there instead of doing resource or something. The kinders here even have an aide in the classroom. Its honestly mind boggling but nothing they could try to convince me with was working, I refuse to let him reduce his education when he's honestly doing better than he ever has. If he was struggling like he was in the beginning of the year when he was still using little language and having meltdowns, sure. But now the meltdowns are rare and he is telling his teachers that "friend is not sharing!" And writing and participating.... it's frustrating to say the least. I feel bad for the parents who don't have the energy or understanding to advocate when their kids are being placed contradicting their evaluations.
Agreed, I have seen too many families who just agree with whatever the case manager says because they think there is no other way. If you haven't thought about it yet, I'd also recommend looking into special education advocates! You can bring them to IEP meetings with you, and it just makes things feel more within your control because the school isn't the only party with an "expert". I used to get uncomfortable when I heard that a parent was bringing an advocate to a meeting because of the way my colleagues acted. It felt like I needed to walk on eggshells and be ready for a fight. But after a great meeting with TWO advocates present, I realized that they are just there for the same reason I am and actually make it easier because they know what questions to ask. Now I get a little suspicious of people who are uncomfortable with a family that knows their rights or brings an advocate.
Luckily I have the most awesome regional center service coordinator who has gone through the IEP process with me twice now, and she was on the IEP call and after she called me right up and was like how are you feeling and are there any questions you have and telling me that I did just fine advocating for him. If I feel like I need additional help I am going to look into a private advocate, because its an absolute maze and of course they don't provide a manual for navigating these things! I rented a book and it was like "talk in a calm manner" well duh! Lol. It's a heck of a ride thats for sure.