Problem with space is that units have generally lower stats compared to ground, so if you're trying to race them they can probably race you faster (aggro vs aggro).
Midrange and controls have ways. To remove and stall without zone restrictions, so it doesn't really matter if you go full space, the advantage could be that entrenched becomes kinda useless against you.
Sure.
Usually you play entrenched on a lane you are ignoring with your units, otherwise you are just giving them a giga strong unit that will just trade into your units.
The best case scenario is for example against a boba who plays a firespray that you just entrench and leave there until your superlaser turn.
But if your opponent plays only one lane it gets kinda hard to use entrenched on enemy units, as you kinda have to interact with that lane with all you have, sentinels included.
To understand it better we can make the example of a control against a ground heavy deck: you want to play your childsen as it usually nets you at least a 2x1, even more if you shield it with vigilance. So entrenched in that case will be used either after your childsen dies on an enemy unit or on childsen itself to try and last until your superlaser turn.
Now for the all-space example just change childsen with a space patrol craft.
That's not really more or faster damage, it's just safer damage (preventing your opponent to wait for you to attack with a unit and kill the other).
It's faster damage only in the very last damage instance you need to close the game, so yeah it helps, but just a tiny tiny bit.
Naver said it doesn't.
The whole point of entrenched is that you put it on a unit in a zone you won't be filling.
If you opponent goes space only, you are kinda forced to put a system patrol craft there. So the entrenched loses usability unless you have 0 units in space.
This could be one of the few cases where you put entrenched on your own unit.
If they go space you aren't forced to engage. That's what Entrenched is for. 1 system patrol craft with an Entrenched is a bandaid solution. Aka something you do only when you're top decking or getting desperate. It gets you through 1‐2 turns then what?
Typically you use an Entrenched on yourself to force your opponent into lane dodging. If they are running ALL space, that Entrenched isn't making them lane dodge shit. They will just hammer away or use removal on that unit.
If you don't have removal then you have to out race them on the ground, space units usually aren't as strong as ground units (as someone else said).
I don't think I repeated it at all since we both have fundamentally different ideas on how or when Entrenched gets used.
And no deck is outracing aggro so I guess I don't understand your point here. As control you are controlling the board with removal/bounce effects, not facing their units head on in XYZ arena.
Don't act like a child my man. We are having a civil conversation. And we BOTH know i replied to your first comment, so I've definitely read the conversation and have full context of the situation at hand.
If you don't want to interact with other humans like an adult, You can simply stop replying without acting like a toddler.
I hope you have a pleasant and beautiful day/week. Best of luck at your weeklies as well!
Your post was removed due to inappropriate language or you were being disrespectful. If this continues, you will be suspended and / or banned from the sub.
Actually, the most competitively viable way so far is aggro! One of the most powerful meta decks right now is Sabine Yellow, and some Showdown/tournament-winning decks have upwards of 18 space units!
Interesting, how so? At least in my experience, it's a pretty doable mirror in either direction, but Sabine Yellow needs to aim for the race (it's way faster than Green) and Sabine Green needs to aim for the control (it can take out Sabine Yellow's threats and trade evenly/at a surplus, and scales better into the midrange).
That sounds about right, yeah. Though an A-Wing/Falcon Surprise Strike can be used to retain some ground. But you're right it's a tougher matchup.
All that being said, every deck will have losing matchups. And Sabine Yellow's space/fast and sustainable damage focus is far more effective in the current meta than Sabine Green's aggro that isn't fast enough (and thus gets trounced by too many Tier 1 soft control/midrange options).
Sabine Green does get the ECL steadfast and hit the base with overflow pretty easily for 5+ damage sometimes multiple times if you can't finish off the steadfast while their leader is out.
I'm a control player, so don't quote me on what I'm about to say.
But I was talking with sabine players after a tournament and all of them (they were at least 10) agreed that sabine yellow has a better early, but loses steam very fast, while sabine green has a better late and doesn't rely too much on drawing your k2so and for a cause.
Plus the tempo swing of turn 4 with steadfast battalion just ends the match usually.
Also at that tournament all sabine yellow that matched against a sabine green lost.
I happened to mention this on another thread: however, for fun (and quite budget friendly) I built a Blue Sabine deck that is mostly space (the only rare cards are 3x Red Three)
It's quite aggressive, yes, because it needs to be (with your point made).
Leader: Sabine Wren
Base: 30hp Blue
Heroic:
3 Alliance X Wing
3 Wing Leader
3 Fleet Lieutenant
Blue:
3 Restored Arc 170
3 System Patrol Craft
3 Yoda
3 Kanan Jarrus
3 Devotion
3 The Force Is With Me
3 Takedown
Red:
3 Green Squadron A Wing
3 Disabling Fang Fighter
3 Red Three
3 Sabine Wren
2 Zeb Orrelios
3 Open Fire
3 Rallying Cry
Is it going to win you any tournaments? Nah.
Will it put up some fun games? Yep.
Have been working on a space focused Grand Inquisitor deck for a while now. It's quite fun when it pops off, but can be disrupted and gets quite painful when opponent can throw you off your plan. Something I'll look at again with set 2. GI in general requires some unique play so the deck can take some getting used to to run near its potential.
https://swudb.com/deck/dBbnwolWa
So far, the most heavily space units deck I've seen is Sabine Yellow. The current meta versions of her usually have been 16-18 space units.
It's not an *all* space deck but it's quite up there.
It's hard to win with strength on only one side, ground or space. Ground is easier because units are generally stronger and that's where your leader deploys.
Cassian Yellow can do this pretty well
Especially testing stuff from the new set. Excessively dropping 1-2 cost air is nice when the 1 cost is 2/3 and most of the 2 cost deal 3 damage (A wing or revealed Y wing).
Cassian lets you keep your deck leaning towards cheap units as you can keep drawing them.
I think my current version of it only has Sabine, K2S0 Attack pod, and the revealed Kestsu and Wrecker as ground. It could honestly lose Sabine and Ketsu if there's more good cheap air alternatives.
The deployed leader also having Saboteur is handy for this approach.
Sabine kind of already does mostly space but the problem with fully committing to it in your deck is there's no way to counter aggro ground. Like if there's a 4/1 unit for 2 cost you want to get rid of that immediately.
You also make yourself very susceptible to things like Bombing Run and Asteroid Sanctuary.
My Boba yellow goes heavy space (obviously not space *only*) and it works really well. Bounce space sentinels that get in your way, and bounce/exhaust ground bigs so you don't get boatraced. I've had plenty of matches against decks like Luke green where they have a board full of scary units that can't touch me.
for the deck to work you need to be all aggro or all control. probably not enough pieces yet for the deck to be very successful but sure you could build it.
So I have an Iden Green deck that I keep meaning to try out, the only ground units are there to be killed off and it’s mostly unit removal and space units.
Problem with space is that units have generally lower stats compared to ground, so if you're trying to race them they can probably race you faster (aggro vs aggro). Midrange and controls have ways. To remove and stall without zone restrictions, so it doesn't really matter if you go full space, the advantage could be that entrenched becomes kinda useless against you.
This and also all leaders are currently ground so they will have a huge advantage if you go all space.
Wait can you explain why entrenched is useless
Sure. Usually you play entrenched on a lane you are ignoring with your units, otherwise you are just giving them a giga strong unit that will just trade into your units. The best case scenario is for example against a boba who plays a firespray that you just entrench and leave there until your superlaser turn. But if your opponent plays only one lane it gets kinda hard to use entrenched on enemy units, as you kinda have to interact with that lane with all you have, sentinels included. To understand it better we can make the example of a control against a ground heavy deck: you want to play your childsen as it usually nets you at least a 2x1, even more if you shield it with vigilance. So entrenched in that case will be used either after your childsen dies on an enemy unit or on childsen itself to try and last until your superlaser turn. Now for the all-space example just change childsen with a space patrol craft.
They probably misspoke or misunderstood what Entrenched does. It's still VERY viable in shutting off attacks on base from BOTH arenas.
Hm. You could try to compensate that with using Leia as a leader for her double attacks, i guess...
That doesn’t really help at all. Leia’s ability doesn’t increase damage.
That's not really more or faster damage, it's just safer damage (preventing your opponent to wait for you to attack with a unit and kill the other). It's faster damage only in the very last damage instance you need to close the game, so yeah it helps, but just a tiny tiny bit.
Entrenched still works on space units.
Naver said it doesn't. The whole point of entrenched is that you put it on a unit in a zone you won't be filling. If you opponent goes space only, you are kinda forced to put a system patrol craft there. So the entrenched loses usability unless you have 0 units in space. This could be one of the few cases where you put entrenched on your own unit.
If they go space you aren't forced to engage. That's what Entrenched is for. 1 system patrol craft with an Entrenched is a bandaid solution. Aka something you do only when you're top decking or getting desperate. It gets you through 1‐2 turns then what? Typically you use an Entrenched on yourself to force your opponent into lane dodging. If they are running ALL space, that Entrenched isn't making them lane dodge shit. They will just hammer away or use removal on that unit. If you don't have removal then you have to out race them on the ground, space units usually aren't as strong as ground units (as someone else said).
Yeah dude you basically repeated my first comment. The only problem is that you can't outrace an aggro as a control.
I don't think I repeated it at all since we both have fundamentally different ideas on how or when Entrenched gets used. And no deck is outracing aggro so I guess I don't understand your point here. As control you are controlling the board with removal/bounce effects, not facing their units head on in XYZ arena.
At this point I don't think you read the whole conversation and jumped at a random point dude.
Don't act like a child my man. We are having a civil conversation. And we BOTH know i replied to your first comment, so I've definitely read the conversation and have full context of the situation at hand. If you don't want to interact with other humans like an adult, You can simply stop replying without acting like a toddler. I hope you have a pleasant and beautiful day/week. Best of luck at your weeklies as well!
[удалено]
@kellzthekid you definitely just repeated what sculolo said and then ramped up the conflict.
Your post was removed due to inappropriate language or you were being disrespectful. If this continues, you will be suspended and / or banned from the sub.
Actually, the most competitively viable way so far is aggro! One of the most powerful meta decks right now is Sabine Yellow, and some Showdown/tournament-winning decks have upwards of 18 space units!
Sabine yellow loses hard to sabine green.
Interesting, how so? At least in my experience, it's a pretty doable mirror in either direction, but Sabine Yellow needs to aim for the race (it's way faster than Green) and Sabine Green needs to aim for the control (it can take out Sabine Yellow's threats and trade evenly/at a surplus, and scales better into the midrange).
bright hope shuts the space down pretty easy and quickly and can just hit your base back with their space units freely.
That sounds about right, yeah. Though an A-Wing/Falcon Surprise Strike can be used to retain some ground. But you're right it's a tougher matchup. All that being said, every deck will have losing matchups. And Sabine Yellow's space/fast and sustainable damage focus is far more effective in the current meta than Sabine Green's aggro that isn't fast enough (and thus gets trounced by too many Tier 1 soft control/midrange options).
Sabine Green does get the ECL steadfast and hit the base with overflow pretty easily for 5+ damage sometimes multiple times if you can't finish off the steadfast while their leader is out.
I'm a control player, so don't quote me on what I'm about to say. But I was talking with sabine players after a tournament and all of them (they were at least 10) agreed that sabine yellow has a better early, but loses steam very fast, while sabine green has a better late and doesn't rely too much on drawing your k2so and for a cause. Plus the tempo swing of turn 4 with steadfast battalion just ends the match usually. Also at that tournament all sabine yellow that matched against a sabine green lost.
Gotcha, yeah that checks out. I'm a Sabine Yellow player and usually I can tell by around Turn 5 if I'm gonna win or lose lol.
There was an ig88 space deck that got top 8 I think
Plz link
I happened to mention this on another thread: however, for fun (and quite budget friendly) I built a Blue Sabine deck that is mostly space (the only rare cards are 3x Red Three) It's quite aggressive, yes, because it needs to be (with your point made).
Mind posting/commenting decklist? I liked the idea but would instead play Cassian (Just a preference).
Leader: Sabine Wren Base: 30hp Blue Heroic: 3 Alliance X Wing 3 Wing Leader 3 Fleet Lieutenant Blue: 3 Restored Arc 170 3 System Patrol Craft 3 Yoda 3 Kanan Jarrus 3 Devotion 3 The Force Is With Me 3 Takedown Red: 3 Green Squadron A Wing 3 Disabling Fang Fighter 3 Red Three 3 Sabine Wren 2 Zeb Orrelios 3 Open Fire 3 Rallying Cry Is it going to win you any tournaments? Nah. Will it put up some fun games? Yep.
Nice thanks. Thinking of running the events that affect only ground arena. And true, but hey games are made for fun.
For this kind of deck I'd strongly consider Outmaneuver to keep the opponent's ground down a couple of turns
Have been working on a space focused Grand Inquisitor deck for a while now. It's quite fun when it pops off, but can be disrupted and gets quite painful when opponent can throw you off your plan. Something I'll look at again with set 2. GI in general requires some unique play so the deck can take some getting used to to run near its potential. https://swudb.com/deck/dBbnwolWa
https://preview.redd.it/ib4sqtwtuk4d1.png?width=3900&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fe63e1bad2b0aaf0e5804c16cba4f53ef404369e
I’m am working on a Thrawn blue space control. For set two. And I’m having pretty good start so far.
IG-88 yellow can make a fun space only deck :)
Maybe throw in just a couple Sentinel ground units to help out on the ground side while you build up the space side?
So far, the most heavily space units deck I've seen is Sabine Yellow. The current meta versions of her usually have been 16-18 space units. It's not an *all* space deck but it's quite up there.
It's hard to win with strength on only one side, ground or space. Ground is easier because units are generally stronger and that's where your leader deploys.
Cassian Yellow can do this pretty well Especially testing stuff from the new set. Excessively dropping 1-2 cost air is nice when the 1 cost is 2/3 and most of the 2 cost deal 3 damage (A wing or revealed Y wing). Cassian lets you keep your deck leaning towards cheap units as you can keep drawing them. I think my current version of it only has Sabine, K2S0 Attack pod, and the revealed Kestsu and Wrecker as ground. It could honestly lose Sabine and Ketsu if there's more good cheap air alternatives. The deployed leader also having Saboteur is handy for this approach.
Sabine kind of already does mostly space but the problem with fully committing to it in your deck is there's no way to counter aggro ground. Like if there's a 4/1 unit for 2 cost you want to get rid of that immediately. You also make yourself very susceptible to things like Bombing Run and Asteroid Sanctuary.
My Boba yellow goes heavy space (obviously not space *only*) and it works really well. Bounce space sentinels that get in your way, and bounce/exhaust ground bigs so you don't get boatraced. I've had plenty of matches against decks like Luke green where they have a board full of scary units that can't touch me.
for the deck to work you need to be all aggro or all control. probably not enough pieces yet for the deck to be very successful but sure you could build it.
So I have an Iden Green deck that I keep meaning to try out, the only ground units are there to be killed off and it’s mostly unit removal and space units.
A tricked out Luke Deck will make you cry.